Cost of seeing saints win the league

[Thedelldays]

come on..we are favourites to win the league..we all want that to happen..

 

we were all sure it will be "fun" next season...we all want the club to sign players good enough for the upper half of the CCC..we all want lallana, lambert etc to stay

 

this all costs big monet for league 1..as well as NOT going into any debt

 

the £3 booking fee and the club wanting season tickets in early is the price to pay

 

surely, worth the cost to see saints win the league...when was the last time that happened at any level..?

[Saint_Jonny]

If we get back in the prem someday we'll have to pay prem prices. So ill be making the most of the current prices while they last! Still an ok price even with the booking fee.

[scott_saints]

I'd pay my years wages for a season ticket if we were guaranteed to win the league.

[Danny]

What we really need is another thread on exactly the same thing.

[JibMcdo]

What we really need is another thread on exactly the same thing.

 

Danny, you should know he likes the attention.

[Scummer]

What we really need is another thread on exactly the same thing.

 

Be fair, it's been a whole two days since he started the thread 'New training ground/players v cheapo ST in installments'.

[stevegrant]

this all costs big monet for league 1..as well as NOT going into any debt

The club will almost certainly make a profit this season despite having spent the best part of £3m in transfer fees - astronomical by this division's standards.

[Thedelldays]

What we really need is another thread on exactly the same thing.

yes..the other 4 threads need not exist..this is the best one

 

as for wanting attention...how many stroppy emails have I sent the club...NONE

 

 

I would suggest more people on here are far more hysterical and upity than me..

 

move on or put me on ignore...ta

[benjii]

What we really need is another thread on exactly the same thing.

 

says Echo-boy (presumably penning the next story courtesy of this 'ere site).

[Danny]

says Echo-boy (presumably penning the next story courtesy of this 'ere site).

 

Oh noes! I have a job so can't have an opinion. Good one.

[Thedelldays]

Oh noes! I have a job so can't have an opinion. Good one.

echo boy..?

are you that reporter..?

 

and you have the cheeck to cakll me an attention seeker...have read much of the crap you lot write..lol

[Danny]

echo boy..?

are you that reporter..?

 

I'm a journalist. Whether or not that makes me THAT reporter is something else altogether.

[benjii]

Oh noes! I have a job so can't have an opinion. Good one.

 

Ignoring your silly response which takes affront at something I didn't even suggest....

 

We all know this is now your best source of material (vis Senior Sports Reporter Gordon Simpsons' reference to emails "reportedly from the ticket office") so I suggest you don't go about insulting other posters who provide you with the ability to do your job.

[Matthew Le God]

What we really need is another thread on exactly the same thing.

 

27th May - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8187932.Saints_in_line_for_cash_boost_from_defender_s_move/

 

1st June - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8195071.Van_Damme_deal_nets_Saints_a_cash_boost/

 

2nd June - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8196109.Wolves_signing_means_cash_for_Saints/

 

If I visited your office would I learn how to rehash "news" three times?

Edited 3 June, 2010 by Matthew Le God

[Thedelldays]

I'm a journalist. Whether or not that makes me THAT reporter is something else altogether.

still, rather ironic to call me an attention seeker with some of the utter turd you lot churn out time and time again...

 

I used to be an avid reader of the echo either onlnine or in paper form when home..cant remember the last time I even bothered

 

still, you get paid for it I guess

[benjii]

27th May - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8187932.Saints_in_line_for_cash_boost_from_defender_s_move/

 

1st June - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8195071.Van_Damme_deal_nets_Saints_a_cash_boost/

 

2nd June - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8196109.Wolves_signing_means_cash_for_Saints/

 

Thanks - someone intelligent enough to see the point I was actually making...

[Danny]

Ignoring your silly response which takes affront at something I didn't even suggest....

 

We all know this is now your best source of material (vis Senior Sports Reporter Gordon Simpsons' reference to emails "reportedly from the ticket office") so I suggest you don't go about insulting other posters who provide you with the ability to do your job.

 

Please, show me the insult I've thrown at anyone on this thread.

[Tamesaint]

come on..we are favourites to win the league..we all want that to happen..

 

we were all sure it will be "fun" next season...we all want the club to sign players good enough for the upper half of the CCC..we all want lallana, lambert etc to stay

 

this all costs big monet for league 1..as well as NOT going into any debt

 

the £3 booking fee and the club wanting season tickets in early is the price to pay

 

surely, worth the cost to see saints win the league...when was the last time that happened at any level..?

 

+1.

[Matthew Le God]

We all know this is now your best source of material (vis Senior Sports Reporter Gordon Simpsons' reference to emails "reportedly from the ticket office") so I suggest you don't go about insulting other posters who provide you with the ability to do your job.

 

I don't understand why it "seems" Gordon Simpson didn't contact the ticket office himself. Instead he says fans are reported to have had a reply from the ticket office.

[Danny]

27th May - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8187932.Saints_in_line_for_cash_boost_from_defender_s_move/

 

1st June - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8195071.Van_Damme_deal_nets_Saints_a_cash_boost/

 

2nd June - http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8196109.Wolves_signing_means_cash_for_Saints/

 

If I visited your office would I learn how to rehash "news" three times?

 

1. Something is expected to happen.

2. Something has happened.

3. Someone took the paper version of a (minor) story and uploaded without noticing the previous day's story on the website. Hardly a crime.

 

Look, I'm aware you have a problem with me by virtue of who my employer is. I notice you've begun to comment on the Echo site though, so obviously you like it enough to use it every day.

 

What remains though is that everywhere I look on this site today, all I can see is "you've got to pay for success" and people being pontificated at about credit cards and what have you. Apparently though, my job means I'm not allowed to have opinions on my personal interests.

[Thedelldays]

1. Something is expected to happen.

2. Something has happened.

3. Someone took the paper version of a (minor) story and uploaded without noticing the previous day's story on the website. Hardly a crime.

 

Look, I'm aware you have a problem with me by virtue of who my employer is. I notice you've begun to comment on the Echo site though, so obviously you like it enough to use it every day.

 

What remains though is that everywhere I look on this site today, all I can see is "you've got to pay for success" and people being pontificated at about credit cards and what have you. Apparently though, my job means I'm not allowed to have opinions on my personal interests.

 

 

as opposed being told pardew is leaving etc...?

 

so, you are allowed an opinion but others are not..?

[Alejam]

Last season i watched Oxford at home, only the once mind. They were charging £18.

 

With my ST i will be paying £17 per game. I believe that to be good value, as there should be loads of goals and wins to look forward to.

 

COYR

[Danny]

as opposed being told pardew is leaving etc...?

 

so, you are allowed an opinion but others are not..?

 

Where have I said you can't have an opinion? We're well aware of your opinion. We've been told what your opinion is many times in the last few days. I don't understand the need to start again with the exact same thing when the other debates are still going.

 

Still, at least this thread has gone on enough of a tangent to warrant being something else now!

[stevegrant]

so, you are allowed an opinion but others are not..?

When was that ever said?

[Thedelldays]

Where have I said you can't have an opinion? We're well aware of your opinion. We've been told what your opinion is many times in the last few days. I don't understand the need to start again with the exact same thing when the other debates are still going.

 

Still, at least this thread has gone on enough of a tangent to warrant being something else now!

 

whyt cant I start this thread..? if the mods dont like it, they will delete it/lock it..

 

who the hell are you to say other wise..?

 

infact, fuk it, delete it...yee of wisdom from the daily echo of all places has spoken

 

I did ask a while ago to reduce me to a regitered user but that did not happen..until then, I have the ability to start threads..

 

maybe I enjoy using this place whilst I am not away and out of the country...is that ok with you..?

[benjii]

Please, show me the insult I've thrown at anyone on this thread.

 

Your first comment clearly contained an implied insult. By saying the thread was pointless you are implying that the poster was being, in some sense, pointless. That is slightly insulting.

 

I'm not saying that you should not hold an opinion by virtue of doing a bit of work for a newspaper. Given, however, that you were silly enough to "out" yourself on here you can expect to take some flack when the implied insult in your comment can easily be levelled at the organisation you write for, and further that it smacks of hypocrisy somewhat to bite the hand that apparently feeds; if people thought for hours on end about the relative merits of starting every thread there would be a less vibrant discussion on here, fewer rumours and fewer "emails apparently from the ticket office".

[beancounter saint]

The club will almost certainly make a profit this season despite having spent the best part of £3m in transfer fees - astronomical by this division's standards.

 

Is this based on insider knowledge or just speculation? I would be surprised if it is the case as the wage bill must be towards the very top end of the division and, as you say, the transfer fees paid were much higher than any others I can think of.

 

Whilst the attendances have been good, ticket prices are not that far above the average for the division and quite a sizeable proportion of the tickets included in the attendance figures are either at reduced rate or given away (Under 8s).

 

Coupled with the fact that running at a loss is pretty much the norm anyway in the division, it makes me expect a loss here too.

 

Happy to be proved wrong though, I guess we will find out in due course!

[benjii]

Is this based on insider knowledge or just speculation? I would be surprised if it is the case as the wage bill must be towards the very top end of the division and, as you say, the transfer fees paid were much higher than any others I can think of.

 

Whilst the attendances have been good, ticket prices are not that far above the average for the division and quite a sizeable proportion of the tickets included in the attendance figures are either at reduced rate or given away (Under 8s).

 

Coupled with the fact that running at a loss is pretty much the norm anyway in the division, it makes me expect a loss here too.

 

Happy to be proved wrong though, I guess we will find out in due course!

 

Agreed. I can't really see how cashflow can be positive. It may be that the books look in good order though due to equity injections from the lovely Herr Liebherr.

[stmusicdude]

come on..we are favourites to win the league..we all want that to happen..

 

we were all sure it will be "fun" next season...we all want the club to sign players good enough for the upper half of the CCC..we all want lallana, lambert etc to stay

 

this all costs big monet for league 1..as well as NOT going into any debt

 

the £3 booking fee and the club wanting season tickets in early is the price to pay

 

surely, worth the cost to see saints win the league...when was the last time that happened at any level..?

I understand all that, as many do so IF this was the case & it's just about wanting early fees .. why remove the half season ticket which would of allowed those who had been thrown into limbo to at least "a chance" to buy some time after the sunden removal of the instalment plan with 30 days notice to get a renewal ..

 

Most are NOT worried to much about the actual increase!

[Danny]

Your first comment clearly contained an implied insult. By saying the thread was pointless you are implying that the poster was being, in some sense, pointless. That is slightly insulting.

 

I'm not saying that you should not hold an opinion by virtue of doing a bit of work for a newspaper. Given, however, that you were silly enough to "out" yourself on here you can expect to take some flack when the implied insult in your comment can easily be levelled at the organisation you write for, and further that it smacks of hypocrisy somewhat to bite the hand that apparently feeds; if people thought for hours on end about the relatiev merits of starting every thread there would be a less vibrant discussion on here, fewer rumours and fewer "emails apparently from the ticket office".

 

I never 'came out' on here as a journalist. A few posters figured it out following a web chat with Adam Leitch that I was running, after they recognised my name from the old SaintsForever, and as such it is now relatively common knowledge. I'm not overly thrilled about it, but there's not a lot I can do about it now, so there's not much point in me denying it.

 

It does however mean that I can't say ANYTHING about Saints/this forum without someone having a pop about who I work for. Some people seem to think I am the embodiment of the Daily Echo, rather than a Saints fan who works there.

 

Obviously I'm not the only person who doesn't think we need to have this thread as the points it begins on are being debated at length on other, active threads - just look at some of the comments following my initial one. TDD is allowed to start the thread just as much as I'm allowed to say I don't see the point. If that is an insult, well, I'm flabbergasted.

[Thedelldays]

well, debate the point or leave alone

 

thanks

[Andy_Porter]

I plan on seeing us win the league at the 23 different away grounds. Not sure how often i'll bother going to St Marys, especially on the boring Tuesday nights when there isn't much chance for a drink before.

 

I think the worst thing Cortese is done is ruin the good rapor he had built up with the fans.

[Liquidshokk]

I think the worst thing Cortese is done is ruin the good rapor he had built up with the fans.

 

+1

 

Shame

[benjii]

I never 'came out' on here as a journalist. A few posters figured it out following a web chat with Adam Leitch that I was running, after they recognised my name from the old SaintsForever, and as such it is now relatively common knowledge. I'm not overly thrilled about it, but there's not a lot I can do about it now, so there's not much point in me denying it.

 

It does however mean that I can't say ANYTHING about Saints/this forum without someone having a pop about who I work for. Some people seem to think I am the embodiment of the Daily Echo, rather than a Saints fan who works there.

 

Obviously I'm not the only person who doesn't think we need to have this thread as the points it begins on are being debated at length on other, active threads - just look at some of the comments following my initial one. TDD is allowed to start the thread just as much as I'm allowed to say I don't see the point. If that is an insult, well, I'm flabbergasted.

 

Fair enough, but you do come across as "the voice of The Echo" to many, I suspect, even if that is inadvertent.

[Gemmel]

come on..we are favourites to win the league..we all want that to happen..

 

we were all sure it will be "fun" next season...we all want the club to sign players good enough for the upper half of the CCC..we all want lallana, lambert etc to stay

 

this all costs big monet for league 1..as well as NOT going into any debt

 

the £3 booking fee and the club wanting season tickets in early is the price to pay

 

surely, worth the cost to see saints win the league...when was the last time that happened at any level..?

 

I think you are missing the point. My belief is that they would rather have weekly paying customers than money upfront in the basis that cashflow isnt an lssue and weekly purchases could add another 3 million into the kitty for watching the same games.

[Danny]

Fair enough, but you do come across as "the voice of The Echo" to many, I suspect, even if that is inadvertent.

 

I've tried to be helpful and explain certain things (eg how stories come about, the reasons why things may take a few days to make it into print, the reality behind certain perceptions etc.), where appropriate, but that seems to have backfired spectacularly, I'm sorry to say.

[stevegrant]

Is this based on insider knowledge or just speculation? I would be surprised if it is the case as the wage bill must be towards the very top end of the division and, as you say, the transfer fees paid were much higher than any others I can think of.

 

Whilst the attendances have been good, ticket prices are not that far above the average for the division and quite a sizeable proportion of the tickets included in the attendance figures are either at reduced rate or given away (Under 8s).

 

Coupled with the fact that running at a loss is pretty much the norm anyway in the division, it makes me expect a loss here too.

 

Happy to be proved wrong though, I guess we will find out in due course!

No real insider knowledge, just fag-packet maths really.

 

Last year, with crap attendances and general bad feeling, we still had revenues of about £13m. The wage bill was obviously trimmed substantially in the summer with players retiring and out of contract, and then Rasiak was sold in August (his wages were probably on a par with Lambert and Hammond combined). I'd estimate our wage bill is somewhere in the region of £8m-9m... massive for League One, but arguably we have a Championship squad. We've made a net loss of about £2.5m in transfers, but attendances are much higher (nearly 80,000 extra tickets sold just in league games, plus a few well-attended cup games thrown in as well) and then the JPT revenue. I'd estimate revenues to be around the £16m mark.

 

Of course, we are now not having to frantically pay off an overdraft with a crippling interest rate, nor are we having to pay £2-3m a year on the stadium mortgage.

 

I'd guess at a profit of about £1m once tax has been taken into account.

[stevegrant]

well, debate the point or leave alone

 

thanks

From an impartial administrator's point of view, it would be nice if you'd practice what you preach.

[hells]

People have a problem with the Echo ok but this poster came on here as a Saints supporter and made a comment and has been lambasted for daring to make that comment (I have seen more outrageously vitriolic, personal comments on here) and then for daring to be a journalist at the Echo!! No need for a witch hunt.

[beancounter saint]

No real insider knowledge, just fag-packet maths really.

 

Last year, with crap attendances and general bad feeling, we still had revenues of about £13m. The wage bill was obviously trimmed substantially in the summer with players retiring and out of contract, and then Rasiak was sold in August (his wages were probably on a par with Lambert and Hammond combined). I'd estimate our wage bill is somewhere in the region of £8m-9m... massive for League One, but arguably we have a Championship squad. We've made a net loss of about £2.5m in transfers, but attendances are much higher (nearly 80,000 extra tickets sold just in league games, plus a few well-attended cup games thrown in as well) and then the JPT revenue. I'd estimate revenues to be around the £16m mark.

 

Of course, we are now not having to frantically pay off an overdraft with a crippling interest rate, nor are we having to pay £2-3m a year on the stadium mortgage.

 

I'd guess at a profit of about £1m once tax has been taken into account.

 

I hope you're right.

 

I like your logic in terms of comparisons to previous year though I'm surprised Saints managed £13m in revenues to begin with. Though I haven't looked at the accounts so may be talking a load of old cobblers, I assumed that the bulk of the revenue now comes from tickets. £13m, or the majority of it, adds up to an awful lot of tickets over the year even you take, say, an average of £300 per person per season which is probably optimistic once you take account VAT and reduced rate tickets (mitigated by higher rates for non-STs).

[Scummer]

People have a problem with the Echo ok but this poster came on here as a Saints supporter and made a comment and has been lambasted for daring to make that comment (I have seen more outrageously vitriolic, personal comments on here) and then for daring to be a journalist at the Echo!! No need for a witch hunt.

 

Well said. Especially as he's been on this site (and it's predecessors) for many years, since long before he worked for the Echo.

 

Christ, he used to work for the Portsmouth News, have a go at him for that if you're going to give him grief.

[Liquidshokk]

People have a problem with the Echo ok but this poster came on here as a Saints supporter and made a comment and has been lambasted for daring to make that comment (I have seen more outrageously vitriolic, personal comments on here) and then for daring to be a journalist at the Echo!! No need for a witch hunt.

 

Well said. Especially as he's been on this site (and it's predecessors) for many years, since long before he worked for the Echo.

 

Christ, he used to work for the Portsmouth News, have a go at him for that if you're going to give him grief.

 

Absof*ckinlutely this.

[stmusicdude]

whyt cant I start this thread..? if the mods dont like it, they will delete it/lock it..

 

who the hell are you to say other wise..?

 

infact, fuk it, delete it...yee of wisdom from the daily echo of all places has spoken

 

I did ask a while ago to reduce me to a regitered user but that did not happen..until then, I have the ability to start threads..

 

maybe I enjoy using this place whilst I am not away and out of the country...is that ok with you..?

TDD no one has a problem with you or the thread

[COMEONYOUREDS]

jesus chill the f*ck out man

 

this thread is pretty much the same as your other one btw

[VectisSaint]

surely, worth the cost to see saints win the league...when was the last time that happened at any level..?

There are some things money can't buy. For everything else, there's MasterCard (or any other 0% Credit Card)

 

1960 in answer to your question...

[niceandfriendly]

It seems that you can no longer discuss things on this forum without having someone moan or ***** at you for starting a thread which may or may not have been covered before. Even the administrator is joining in - such a shame.

 

To the point that TDD was making, I actually agree. I think way too many fans expect something for nothing and can't wait to criticise Cortese or the club at any opportunity. We're going to be spending a lot of money or transfers, wages, quality sponsorless shirts (it seems), our own catering, new training ground - all things which us the fans are pleased about. Yet as soon as it costs us anything we don't want to know.

 

Yes, Markus is a rich man but he's trying to run this club as a business, meaning no debt. If this means charging a 3 pound booking fee or getting rid of the payment plan because people have abused the system in the past (I don't believe the "it costs too much" excuse), then so be it.

 

Totally agree with the OP on this.

[SaintRichmond]

I think you are missing the point. My belief is that they would rather have weekly paying customers than money upfront in the basis that cashflow isnt an lssue and weekly purchases could add another 3 million into the kitty for watching the same games.

 

Correct !!!!!!!

 

The best example YET that Cortese is running the Club as a BUSINESS

 

His error though is to ignore the very Fans that Supported SFC in the rebirth of the Club

 

He has NOT taken, or given ANY thought to how HIS Supporters can or could accept his DOCTRINE

 

Goodbye to Saints, the FAMILY Club:D

[SB]

Completely agree Delldays.

 

It’s been cringe worthy reading some of the posts over the past few days, you can’t have success and dirty cheap tickets with every extra penny being put in by the owners E.g booking fee..

And for those moaning about the way the session tickets have been structured I.e none instalments.. then yes the club made a mistake about not letting the fans know earlier so they could put money aside each week, however there is nothing that can be done now.

I just hope Markus hasn’t read some of these threads

 

All IMO of course

[Wiltshire Saint]

TDD no one has a problem with you or the thread

 

 

I do. If I can borrow an expression, I think he's a ****le. I don't care much for some of his other usernames either.

[The Kraken]

come on..we are favourites to win the league..we all want that to happen..

 

we were all sure it will be "fun" next season...we all want the club to sign players good enough for the upper half of the CCC..we all want lallana, lambert etc to stay

 

this all costs big monet for league 1..as well as NOT going into any debt

 

the £3 booking fee and the club wanting season tickets in early is the price to pay

 

surely, worth the cost to see saints win the league...when was the last time that happened at any level..?

 

Despite this being another "look at me" thread, I'll respond to try and keep the topic on subject.....

 

You seem to be choosing to ignore the real bone of contention with the majority of fans on here. The lack of payment instalment scheme and booking fee have all had a negative reception for sure, but by far and aware the worst thing is the manner in which the club have gone about it. No notice for the scrapping of the payment scheme until hours before the season tickets go on sale. If we had had this news 2 or 3 months ago then pretty much everyone who wanted to would have been able to save up and pay up front for a season ticket.

 

Also, you would do well to read Steve Grant's fag packet maths example in this very thread of how, rather than running at a loss as you seem to believe, there are others who believe we are actually currently turning a profit. So the monetary argument you put forward may not be as substantial as you actually think it is.

 

The abuse "Danny" seems to be getting is also unfair; it is the paper's job to reflect the views of the fans and they have done that. Rather than shoot the messenger, why not actually try to understand the message? Today's Echo headline is "Saints are one of only two League One clubs without a payment plan". The question, surely, has to be "WHY?". Why is our way of operating so much better than 22 of 24 other league clubs? Are all the other clubs in the division so lacking in business sense that they just happily continue with these silly schemes whereas we're the really clever ones? Or is it that they recognise, while it perhaps does incur a bit more effort on the club's behalf, that it is a way for the club to help out the most needing of fans and provide a way for as many fans to feel a part of the club as possible.

 

The club is on a bit of a downward spiral as far as PR is concerned in thepast few days, and without actually coming out and clarifying their decisions it sadly gives the impression that they couldn't care less either.