Why Lowe is probably an idiot.

[Legod Third Coming]

The sacking of Tony Adams after losing to the league leaders and at the END of the transfer window during which he has been allowed to sign players and complete contracts on existing players, demonstrates once again that the vast majority of football chairmen are inept.

 

That our own falls into this catergory should not really surprise us, should it?

 

It would be more surprising if he weren't an idiot, in my view.

 

Which raises a question that has always bugged me:

 

Why do normally proficient business-people throw all good practice and common sense out of the window when it comes to football?

[Frank's cousin]

The sacking of Tony Adams after losing to the league leaders and at the END of the transfer window during which he has been allowed to sign players and complete contracts on existing players, demonstrates once again that the vast majority of football chairmen are inept.

 

That our own falls into this catergory should not really surprise us, should it?

 

It would be more surprising if he weren't an idiot, in my view.

 

Which raises a question that has always bugged me:

 

Why do normally proficient business-people throw all good practice and common sense out of the window when it comes to football?

 

 

The only reason these guys enter the frey is either 'lifelong fan' or pure ego... both of which do not make for rational behaviour - entering football is never going to make you money, unless its possible to aset strip, or take a crap side in the lower leagues, invest say 20 mil, get them to teh prem, survive one seaosn and sell for 100 mil, which in these climes is not the easiest route to making money,... so the sensible ones stay well away, unless billionnaires able to throw away money... The ego is driven by te percived 'glamour' of being involved in such a media driven spectable... so why come back and get so much abuse when things are not so great? Can only be the madness of ego, desperate to put things right? Lowe is not poor by any stretch, but I doubt he can afford to really write off 800K in shares... but is it worth the flak?

[Gingeletiss]

The sacking of Tony Adams after losing to the league leaders and at the END of the transfer window during which he has been allowed to sign players and complete contracts on existing players, demonstrates once again that the vast majority of football chairmen are inept.

 

That our own falls into this catergory should not really surprise us, should it?

 

It would be more surprising if he weren't an idiot, in my view.

 

Which raises a question that has always bugged me:

 

Why do normally proficient business-people throw all good practice and common sense out of the window when it comes to football?

 

Lucky he's not Scottish, and has both his eye's..........;)

 

But regards to P*rtsm**th, you are right, it's a stupid decision, at a stupid time.

[saintbletch]

The sacking of Tony Adams after losing to the league leaders and at the END of the transfer window during which he has been allowed to sign players and complete contracts on existing players, demonstrates once again that the vast majority of football chairmen are inept.

 

That our own falls into this catergory should not really surprise us, should it?

 

It would be more surprising if he weren't an idiot, in my view.

 

Which raises a question that has always bugged me:

 

Why do normally proficient business-people throw all good practice and common sense out of the window when it comes to football?

 

...because the "customer" does not obey "normal" market behaviour in football?

 

Because by having a slightly sub-standard product for any length of time in the football business can cost you £50M+ and perhaps your long-term viability?

 

The stakes are higher and the time-scales are collapsed.

 

"Normal" customers typically stop using a product if they no longer get value from it. This doesn't happen in football.

 

If Virgin were to **** up, their customers would fly BA. In football the customer stays "loyal" but works from within to change things. It would be like 300+ people boarding a Virgin plane purely to abuse the staff, the pilot and the Chairmen (sic) - who don't even bother to fly Virgin themselves these days.

 

This pressure is different from managing the expectations of shareholders perhaps once a quarter and then at an AGM. A change brings a relief from these pressures.

[LostBoys]

I can only compare Mr Mandaric and his interview over the weekend. He has had his problems in his business but has pumped the £15m into Leicester they lost when being relegated last year.

[Frank's cousin]

...because the "customer" does not obey "normal" market behaviour in football?

 

Because by having a slightly sub-standard product for any length of time in the football business can cost you £50M+ and perhaps your long-term viability?

 

The stakes are higher and the time-scales are collapsed.

 

"Normal" customers typically stop using a product if they no longer get value from it. This doesn't happen in football.

 

If Virgin were to **** up, their customers would fly BA. In football the customer stays "loyal" but works from within to change things. It would be like 300+ people boarding a Virgin plane purely to abuse the staff, the pilot and the Chairmen (sic) - who don't even bother to fly Virgin themselves these days.

 

This pressure is different from managing the expectations of shareholders perhaps once a quarter and then at an AGM. A change brings a relief from these pressures.

 

Thats very true, and there is also a tendency ion the higher leagues, certainly th prem where demand often outstrips supply for fans/customers to be taken for granted, afterall they are not the source of teh greatest revenue stream which is sky... that changes though as you go down the leagues where all of a sudden the gates become teh single largest source of revenue and greater care should be taken to ensure its maintatined... its not just about results as there are plnty of clubs that have poor results yet maintain the gate...loyalty in football is afterall one of its naive charms.... but our situation is contributed by lack of home form AND the feeling of hopelessness and distain directed at the board... much of it justified, some of it not... and its the fact that many also fiocus on teh elements that are NOT justified that keeps the likes of Lowe in there fighting. I believe he thinks that the areas where he ha made mistakes, are just that, mistakes taht can happen to anyone in sport or football, and so is unrepentent... on the other hand those criticisms that are viocally rammed home and the way in which its often done, are often those unsubstantiated, he simply shruggs off as idiocy and thus the very valid criticisms become lost amongst what lowe considers the rants of the lunatic fringe... = does not listen in his stubborn arrogance.

 

Its a worthwhile question... will fans look at this objectively and try and understand the 'enemy' before launching an attack at the weakness - the way to really win, or continue to dilute the very real message with the rumours, gossip and prejudice shouted loudest?

Edited 9 February, 2009 by Frank's cousin

[Wade Garrett]

The only reason these guys enter the frey is either 'lifelong fan' or pure ego... both of which do not make for rational behaviour - entering football is never going to make you money' date=' unless its possible to aset strip, or take a crap side in the lower leagues, invest say 20 mil, get them to teh prem, survive one seaosn and sell for 100 mil, which in these climes is not the easiest route to making money,... so the sensible ones stay well away, unless billionnaires able to throw away money... The ego is driven by te percived 'glamour' of being involved in such a media driven spectable... so why come back and get so much abuse when things are not so great? Can only be the madness of ego, desperate to put things right? Lowe is not poor by any stretch, but I doubt he can afford to really write off 800K in shares... but is it worth the flak?[/quote']

 

I am sure that is the case for a fair few, but hardly fair to tar them all with the same brush. There are some decent people about.

 

As for Lowe, surely he can see that he's having a negative effect on the club now. You'd think he would go voluntarily.

[krissyboy31]

Lucky he's not Scottish, and has both his eye's..........;)

 

But regards to P*rtsm**th, you are right, it's a stupid decision, at a stupid time.

 

Especially as they were going to sue a national newspaper who dared to suggest this was going to happen!!

[SaintRichmond]

I am sure that is the case for a fair few, but hardly fair to tar them all with the same brush. There are some decent people about.

 

As for Lowe, surely he can see that he's having a negative effect on the club now. You'd think he would go voluntarily.

 

 

 

That really is VERY funny .........

 

Lowe will NEVER go voluntarily, he is in NO WAY answerable to his "Customers" ( ie US )........ so, unless a Miracle happens ( If any of the Major Shareholders look between their legs and discover that they DO have balls ) ...... Saints will sink even lower and lower

 

Incidently, I did post at the time of his earlier removal as Chairman, that as long as he still had shares, he WOULD be back. At the time I was shouted down on here, but, ..... just look at him now

 

Perhaps the PLC Shareholders think that they will get a better dividend return once we are in Division One ???

Edited 9 February, 2009 by SaintRichmond

[Ken Tone]

The only reason these guys enter the frey is either 'lifelong fan' or pure ego... both of which do not make for rational behaviour - entering football is never going to make you money' date=' unless its possible to aset strip, or take a crap side in the lower leagues, invest say 20 mil, get them to teh prem, survive one seaosn and sell for 100 mil, which in these climes is not the easiest route to making money,... so the sensible ones stay well away, unless billionnaires able to throw away money... The ego is driven by te percived 'glamour' of being involved in such a media driven spectable... so why come back and get so much abuse when things are not so great? Can only be the madness of ego, desperate to put things right? Lowe is not poor by any stretch, but I doubt he can afford to really write off 800K in shares... but is it worth the flak?[/quote']

 

 

Spot on. The quickest way to make a £million in football is to invest £10 million and wait. Every football chariman is either nuts or nasty! Some are both.

 

K.

[Saint in Paradise]

 

Incidently, I did post at the time of his earlier removal as Chairman, that as long as he still had shares, he WOULD be back.

 

I thought I remembered someone posting that but could not remember who

[Frank's cousin]

I am sure that is the case for a fair few, but hardly fair to tar them all with the same brush. There are some decent people about.

 

As for Lowe, surely he can see that he's having a negative effect on the club now. You'd think he would go voluntarily.

 

Uhm, the problem with Lowe is that he probably feels he is being unjustly treated....no hear me out... I think he probably believes that teh mistakes he has made, are genuine erors that happen to many in sport..especilaly in football where thngs such as players and managers can leave on a whim and leave plans in tatters etc just when corners have been turned... I beliee he thinks that his ideas that have failed to date were designed to address this and that teh failures have been mainly teh result of teh old school values refusing to accept new ideas - so he has isolated himself from these criticisms.... secondly and perhaps more importantly, these criticisma have becomelost/diluted in Lowes circle by many attacks that he believes are unjustified... the speculation, gossip and rumour stuff that is made so very vocal by as he believs is the 'lunatic fringe'. I can see how this may have occurred because of the very vocal element have been naysaying ever since he arrived, and even when we had moderate success....I honsetly believe he feels that he is the victim here and thats multiplied by hi innate stubborness...

[Danbert]

Lucky he's not Scottish, and has both his eye's..........;)

 

But regards to P*rtsm**th, you are right, it's a stupid decision, at a stupid time.

 

I disagree - it's the right decision at the wrong time. They should have sacked him before now IMHO.

[Saint Fan CaM]

Uhm' date=' the problem with Lowe is that he probably feels he is being unjustly treated....no hear me out... I think he probably believes that teh mistakes he has made, are genuine erors that happen to many in sport..especilaly in football where thngs such as players and managers can leave on a whim and leave plans in tatters etc just when corners have been turned... I beliee he thinks that his ideas that have failed to date were designed to address this and that teh failures have been mainly teh result of teh old school values refusing to accept new ideas - so he has isolated himself from these criticisms.... secondly and perhaps more importantly, these criticisma have becomelost/diluted in Lowes circle by many attacks that he believes are unjustified... the speculation, gossip and rumour stuff that is made so very vocal by as he believs is the 'lunatic fringe'. I can see how this may have occurred because of the very vocal element have been naysaying ever since he arrived, and even when we had moderate success....I honsetly believe he feels that he is the victim here and thats multiplied by hi innate stubborness...[/quote']

 

 

Simple question. Do you think Agent Lowe believes that had he taken different decisions regarding his managerial choices over the last 5 years, we might not be in the CCC with the real prospect of another relegation to L1???

 

Because let's face it, if he had backed Strachan with the right level of investment we would not be having this discussion right? The fan-base would be silenced simply by success. What we ACTUALLY have is a situation where Lowe has been proved time and time again to be wrong. Just how many times does a guy need to fail before he realises that it is HE that is wrong? If he thinks HE is the victim, I would suggest he needs to find counselling - and fast!

[Frank's cousin]

Simple question. Do you think Agent Lowe believes that had he taken different decisions regarding his managerial choices over the last 5 years, we might not be in the CCC with the real prospect of another relegation to L1???

 

Because let's face it, if he had backed Strachan with the right level of investment we would not be having this discussion right? The fan-base would be silenced simply by success. What we ACTUALLY have is a situation where Lowe has been proved time and time again to be wrong. Just how many times does a guy need to fail before he realises that it is HE that is wrong? If he thinks HE is the victim, I would suggest he needs to find counselling - and fast!

 

1. I dont know what Lowe believes but suspect hes not as stupid as we make out and that would mean YES he probably does know that had he made different deciosn we mioght not be where we are now - although he would argue he was not allowed to reappoint Hoddle which was his choice... but that ones been done to death.

 

2. Strach - again the whole 'support' thing has been done to death as well because its been argued countless times that we did not have the money and it would have meant borrowing some 15 mil more if Bridge had not been sold... I would stick my neck out and say that Lowe would have loved Strachan to stay, but we simply did not have the revenues or resources to support Stachans needs, is thatso wrong? Depends on whether you believe its fine or not to borrow huge amounts to 'support' a manager or not - for me that risk would have been too great.

 

3. Councelling? probably does! ;-) I was not saying he is right to behave as he is, but trying to present how he might see it.... he has had abuse from some quarters since he came and even when we were at Cardiff, he thinks teh fans demands for spending (eg teh Strachan support issue) as unrealistic which he equates to fans not understanding the financials - which is reinforced by the very vocal abuse. I think he believes that part of the failures were because they were never given a chance from the outset - too much media pressure, on fans which ceratin vocal fans fed on and spread discontent - so again in his eyes it reinforces his views that fans are ignorant of the ways of the chairman. This all means that he loses touch with the fact that he has made genuine errors that he should be criticised for, because they are lost in the vocal abuse that goes beyond the footballing errors - the continued Strachan thing being one of them.

 

I do think that if fans want to be taken seriously with him, and to be appreciated as knowledgeable and rational, then we have to regain the moral highground, we have to drop the hysteria and crap shouted loudly which IS based on illinformed nonsense to clear the ground for sensible debate and criticism where it is justified... do that and he has nothing to hide behind.. while we continue as we are we will be ignored and at worse ridiculed.

[miserableoldgit]

1. I dont know what Lowe believes but suspect hes not as stupid as we make out and that would mean YES he probably does know that had he made different deciosn we mioght not be where we are now - although he would argue he was not allowed to reappoint Hoddle which was his choice... but that ones been done to death.

 

2. Strach - again the whole 'support' thing has been done to death as well because its been argued countless times that we did not have the money and it would have meant borrowing some 15 mil more if Bridge had not been sold... I would stick my neck out and say that Lowe would have loved Strachan to stay, but we simply did not have the revenues or resources to support Stachans needs, is thatso wrong? Depends on whether you believe its fine or not to borrow huge amounts to 'support' a manager or not - for me that risk would have been too great.

 

3. Councelling? probably does! ;-) I was not saying he is right to behave as he is, but trying to present how he might see it.... he has had abuse from some quarters since he came and even when we were at Cardiff, he thinks teh fans demands for spending (eg teh Strachan support issue) as unrealistic which he equates to fans not understanding the financials - which is reinforced by the very vocal abuse. I think he believes that part of the failures were because they were never given a chance from the outset - too much media pressure, on fans which ceratin vocal fans fed on and spread discontent - so again in his eyes it reinforces his views that fans are ignorant of the ways of the chairman. This all means that he loses touch with the fact that he has made genuine errors that he should be criticised for, because they are lost in the vocal abuse that goes beyond the footballing errors - the continued Strachan thing being one of them.

 

I do think that if fans want to be taken seriously with him, and to be appreciated as knowledgeable and rational, then we have to regain the moral highground, we have to drop the hysteria and crap shouted loudly which IS based on illinformed nonsense to clear the ground for sensible debate and criticism where it is justified... do that and he has nothing to hide behind.. while we continue as we are we will be ignored and at worse ridiculed.

 

2) If it had kept us in the Prem and made us competitive surely it would have been worth a punt? Its the way that football works. Are you saying that things would have been worse than they are now?

3) Sensible debate with who?? The whole problem is that, as ordinary fans, we feel (and are to a degree) helpless to do anything to influence what is happening at the club that we all love. We have people in charge who do not appear to want contact with its "customers" There is no "Customer Care Department" that we can contact to complain about "the product". The fans have only really turned since the Donny game. Prior to that there would have been plenty of opportunities for "Sensible debate", but when you have a "Dictator" who is allegedly only at the club 2 days a week, a Chairman of the Football Club who doesn`t even go to the AGM, what choice do you have? I may have misread your post Frank, but to me it did come across that most of the problems are down to the fans (again).

[Wes Tender]

I thought I remembered someone posting that but could not remember who

 

It was Art. He prophesied this and stated rather darkly at the time that as long as Lowe had shares he would always be a sword of Demacles hanging over us.

 

How right he was.

[Rod Le Shearer]

I can only compare Mr Mandaric and his interview over the weekend. He has had his problems in his business but has pumped the £15m into Leicester they lost when being relegated last year.

 

somehow I dont think you`ll lose £ 15 mill when relegated from CCC to League 1 !

the main source of income in both those divisions are from matchdays,there`s only a relative small difference in income from TV,sponsors etc. (compared with the gap from the PL to the CCC)

[Deppo]

Probably?

[Frank's cousin]

I may have misread your post Frank, but to me it did come across that most of the problems are down to the fans (again).

 

Hi MOG

 

You have a little bit - the thing is no matter how justified we may feel in our aproach if its not working is it not worth trying a different tack? Lowes sees fans as illinformed and lacking teh knowledge - in part becaue of his arrogance and in part because of that minoroity that have always slagged him irrespective of the truth in tehir accustaions, or whether there was any logic in the deciosns made - they did kinda ruin it for everyone else in a way because Lowe refuses to now listen to any of us. Not saying its right, but if we took back teh moral highground maybe we would get somewhere.... not going to happen whilst we simply shout and screem or fight each other on the terraces is it? would you take some of those seriously?

[SoccerMom]

You know, I've been dealing with narcissists for years now (was married to/had a kid with one, then worked for one), and one of the most mind-blowingly frustrating aspects of having to deal with them is that they can - at the blink of an eye - rewrite history so that it supports their world view. They would literally swear blue was green, and believe it completely, if that suited the story they wanted to tell.

 

This behaviour can make you think you are going crazy, and will lead you to argue continually with them about "the truth" until you realise what's going on. If they have changed history and you disagree with them about something, it's an argument you can never win. I have learned not to argue with my ex about anything he says, even if I have written proof that he's got it wrong - it's pointless and it just leaves me feeling frustrated as hell. He is completely incapable of seeing things any other way than the way he has constructed.

 

So, sadly, IMHO trying to regain the moral high ground and present reasoned arguments is p*ssing in the wind.

 

Knowing this doesn't get anyone any further, but it does save a lot of frustration.

[Deppo]

I'll go out with you.

[Wopper]

Leon Crouch will get Lowe out its just a matter of time.

[Fuengirola Saint]

Uhm' date=' the problem with Lowe is that he probably feels he is being unjustly treated....no hear me out... I think he probably believes that teh mistakes he has made, are genuine erors that happen to many in sport..especilaly in football where thngs such as players and managers can leave on a whim and leave plans in tatters etc just when corners have been turned... I beliee he thinks that his ideas that have failed to date were designed to address this and that teh failures have been mainly teh result of teh old school values refusing to accept new ideas - so he has isolated himself from these criticisms.... secondly and perhaps more importantly, these criticisma have becomelost/diluted in Lowes circle by many attacks that he believes are unjustified... the speculation, gossip and rumour stuff that is made so very vocal by as he believs is the 'lunatic fringe'. I can see how this may have occurred because of the very vocal element have been naysaying ever since he arrived, and even when we had moderate success....I honsetly believe he feels that he is the victim here and thats multiplied by hi innate stubborness...[/quote']

 

Sorry i don't mean to be pedantic but why do you and not only you, write (teh) for the word (the)?

[Frank's cousin]

Sorry i don't mean to be pedantic but why do you and not only you, write (teh) for the word (the)?

 

trying to type fast with two fingers and no time for a spell check... must get some work done in between posting!

[Topcat]

The average success rate in business of selecting top management (CEOs) is reckoned to be 1 in 2. Lowe has made at least 12 appointments and 3 wandered off of their own volition. Of the 3 only 1 WGS was a success.

 

So of the 12, we can only count WGS as a success and 2 (HR and GB) could be excluded from a judgment. That leaves 9 that were canned. 9 failures and 1 success is an appalling record and one that would bankrupt most enterprises if the slot was a CEO.

[eelpie]

The sacking of Tony Adams after losing to the league leaders and at the END of the transfer window during which he has been allowed to sign players and complete contracts on existing players, demonstrates once again that the vast majority of football chairmen are inept.

 

That our own falls into this catergory should not really surprise us, should it?

 

It would be more surprising if he weren't an idiot, in my view.

 

Which raises a question that has always bugged me:

 

Why do normally proficient business-people throw all good practice and common sense out of the window when it comes to football?

 

Will the Portsmouth Board be idiots if they are not relegated?

It does look as though they will be appointing an experienced manager. At least they are learning by their mistake of appointing from within (I say enviously)

[EastleighSoulBoy]

...

 

"Normal" customers typically stop using a product if they no longer get value from it. This doesn't happen in football.

 

 

I seeeeeeeeeee, errr, what's happening with Saints then?

[EastleighSoulBoy]

Sorry i don't mean to be pedantic but why do you and not only you, write (teh) for the word (the)?

 

it's teh innernetz way ov spellingz.

[Legod Third Coming]

Will the Portsmouth Board be idiots if they are not relegated?

It does look as though they will be appointing an experienced manager. At least they are learning by their mistake of appointing from within (I say enviously)

 

If they stay up it was still an idiotic decision because of the timing.

 

What did they learn in a game against the league leaders when they backed the manager in two previous weeks during which an alternative manager might have had the opportunity to reshape the team as needed (and by the way in which they performed far worse than on Saturday)?

 

I understand the demands in football are high and the necessity to survive in the top league is beyond most 'normal' business survival models.

 

But, there is so rarely a strategy or plan in place which a board sticks to with any conviction.

 

Even our strategy under Lowe has gone totally out of the water in recent weeks despite his lauding it to the hilt.

 

And the boards go on unreproached.

 

Nowhere else would this level of incompetence be accepted, why football?

[mack rill]

I disagree - it's the right decision at the wrong time. They should have sacked him before now IMHO.

 

Exactly! in fact at least 4 to 6 games ago, Most of the fan base were happy with the appointment of TA But a few points out of 24 means Your F*cked. If PFC wanted Any chance of surviving he had to go.

 

Is Lowe an idiot,,,,,,,,,looking at it as a fan YES

But Lowe is not a football fan hes a shear holder who bought his stake cheaply, And for the last 10 to 12 years has been paid a big wedge every year for being your chairman plus the divee shear holders were getting when you were in the prem whatever happens in your future i think you can safely say Lowe has screwed you. And had his money back 30 fold.

[saintbletch]

I seeeeeeeeeee, errr, what's happening with Saints then?

 

I take your point but I guess it depends on how empty that pint glass of yours is ESB.

 

I would say that despite being treated appallingly, falling one division and likely to fall another, paying significant amounts of money to watch largely unknown players coached by inexperienced foreign coaches and watching their club ripped apart by a board wracked with division and rancour; 13,000 or so "customers" still regularly turn up each week.

 

To me that makes football a special case where the "company", "customer" relationship is different from "normal" commerce.

[Saint Fan CaM]

Hi MOG

 

You have a little bit - the thing is no matter how justified we may feel in our aproach if its not working is it not worth trying a different tack? Lowes sees fans as illinformed and lacking teh knowledge - in part becaue of his arrogance and in part because of that minoroity that have always slagged him irrespective of the truth in tehir accustaions, or whether there was any logic in the deciosns made - they did kinda ruin it for everyone else in a way because Lowe refuses to now listen to any of us. Not saying its right, but if we took back teh moral highground maybe we would get somewhere.... not going to happen whilst we simply shout and screem or fight each other on the terraces is it? would you take some of those seriously?

 

 

Frank - see what you have written there (highlighted)? Why do you think this concept is something only the supporters should adopt? Do you not think that Lowe has had his chance to change tack? In fact, he's had plenty of chances - 11 if I'm not mistaken - and still he gets it wrong.

 

I do not suscribe to the notion that all supporters are brain dead morons who don't understand the why's and wherefor's relating to the demise of SFC (and its not because Lowe is a 'toff' - its because his policies and strategies are rubbish). Yes there is a small minority that are idiotic thugs who can't control themselves on matchday, but it is a very small minority. Most supporters I think are very clear about what's going on and many have already turned their backs on the club and walked away.

 

While Chairman of SLH, Lowe has had a corporate duty to ensure the best results for the business. This (like any other business) means that there are times when it is essential to invest to improve results and protect market standing. Lowe utterly failed to do this. He did not have to borrow huge amounts of money - in fact if he had the best interests of the company at heart he could have sold the club at the point its value was greatest to someone who would have put more money in. But NO - he chose to rule the roost - to maintain his little money stream. AND THAT my friend is the essence of his failure - he has chosen to feather his own nest (because he's a shareholder) in favour of proper corporate governance. How he's managed to get away with it for so long is a question I would like answered.

[Frank's cousin]

Frank - see what you have written there (highlighted)? Why do you think this concept is something only the supporters should adopt? Do you not think that Lowe has had his chance to change tack? In fact, he's had plenty of chances - 11 if I'm not mistaken - and still he gets it wrong.

 

I do not suscribe to the notion that all supporters are brain dead morons who don't understand the why's and wherefor's relating to the demise of SFC (and its not because Lowe is a 'toff' - its because his policies and strategies are rubbish). Yes there is a small minority that are idiotic thugs who can't control themselves on matchday, but it is a very small minority. Most supporters I think are very clear about what's going on and many have already turned their backs on the club and walked away.

 

While Chairman of SLH, Lowe has had a corporate duty to ensure the best results for the business. This (like any other business) means that there are times when it is essential to invest to improve results and protect market standing. Lowe utterly failed to do this. He did not have to borrow huge amounts of money - in fact if he had the best interests of the company at heart he could have sold the club at the point its value was greatest to someone who would have put more money in. But NO - he chose to rule the roost - to maintain his little money stream. AND THAT my friend is the essence of his failure - he has chosen to feather his own nest (because he's a shareholder) in favour of proper corporate governance. How he's managed to get away with it for so long is a question I would like answered.

 

YOu make two good points there, the first re the supporters - you are right, it is only a smalll minority but its this small mionority that lowe seems to have used to form his opinion of us - because they have been very vocal in their condemnation from the begininig.

 

The proper corporate governance issue is though difficult to define... because as fans we see this as success on the pitch first and foremost - lets be honest for a majority, what it costs to achieve that and where the money is likely to come from is second to this... if thought about at all.

 

In legal terms its just about the business and generating sufficient revenues during good time sto yield a small dividend... something alien to fans, but part of that governance you mention... and from that perspectiove Lowe did what he was meant to do.... We were done for in relegation, and whilst its ceratinly true that FOOTBALLING decisions made by lowe greatly contributed to this, it is something that is very difficult to plan for, yet can happen to any club - this year will see more of the mighty fall - Lowe would also argue that the 50% clause was also wise planning - again alien to fans who see this as lacking ambition.

 

I do think there was then an element of panic and with the board chnages Wilde, Crouch etc this was compounded - no one really kenw the right direction to take after 27 years in the top flight and running a buisness with a 50mil + turnover to suddenly find ourselves in this financial mess has really thrown them all - I dont think any of the contenders wanted this and all probably did what they thought was best to improve things, but alll also seem unable to stop the financial rot.

 

Why has he got away with it? Simple because at the moment he has the support of 46% of the shareholders who must see something in it or why else sit by and watch teh shareprice tumble.

 

If anything the question we should be askingis wy do you support Lowe, to wilde, and Lowes share supporting colleagues.

 

I susupect they believe he is the best one to rescue the finace side with football coming second. For me the issue with Lowe is that most fans would not give a flying feck about his remuneration or his running of the finances if we were successful on the pitch - its when in our view his decisons financially directly impact the playing side that we become angry that he fails to grasp it - eg investmnet in the side, or manager selection. That is fair enough, but are we prepared to listen to the reasons, or do we believe its all bull?

 

For teh answer lies somewhere in between - its not as black and white as 3 or 0 points because I have never advocated simply doing what other clubs do.... spend what they dont ahve just to stand still... so Naturally i am supportive and have always been of the more prudent approach, as difficult as it is when seeing a side you love struggle because everyone else has spent money to improve and we begin to lag behind... thats really why i have been often considered a 'luvvie' when in reality I woukld support Wilde, Crouch or anyone who had that 'stabilty' in mind. As I have said many times for me its about the strategy, notthe person behind it.

 

On the footballing side its without doubt that Lowe has made huge errors that make the situation worse and its about time he listened for the love of god to some wiser ears if he does not want to lose what fans remain attending games - and he needs to distance himself from the 'chairman role' if ever the clubs fans are to be reunited behind a common cause.

 

Many will argue strongly that you cant seperate the two as the football is the core buisness, and I can see where they are coming from, but in the current situation, with the pressure from the banks the only priority at present is aviding administration, then avoiding relegation. If 46% of shareholders think LOwe is the man to do this, then there is not alot fans can do about it at present and I do feel that Crouch and MC for example are not helping with their public debates - Yes I know Lowe and Wilde did teh same, and they were out of order in doing so, but does that make Crouch and MC right in simply doing same?

[Frank's cousin]

No responders?

[miserableoldgit]

YOu make two good points there, the first re the supporters - you are right, it is only a smalll minority but its this small mionority that lowe seems to have used to form his opinion of us - because they have been very vocal in their condemnation from the begininig.

 

The proper corporate governance issue is though difficult to define... because as fans we see this as success on the pitch first and foremost - lets be honest for a majority, what it costs to achieve that and where the money is likely to come from is second to this... if thought about at all.

 

In legal terms its just about the business and generating sufficient revenues during good time sto yield a small dividend... something alien to fans, but part of that governance you mention... and from that perspectiove Lowe did what he was meant to do.... We were done for in relegation, and whilst its ceratinly true that FOOTBALLING decisions made by lowe greatly contributed to this, it is something that is very difficult to plan for, yet can happen to any club - this year will see more of the mighty fall - Lowe would also argue that the 50% clause was also wise planning - again alien to fans who see this as lacking ambition.

 

I do think there was then an element of panic and with the board chnages Wilde, Crouch etc this was compounded - no one really kenw the right direction to take after 27 years in the top flight and running a buisness with a 50mil + turnover to suddenly find ourselves in this financial mess has really thrown them all - I dont think any of the contenders wanted this and all probably did what they thought was best to improve things, but alll also seem unable to stop the financial rot.

 

Why has he got away with it? Simple because at the moment he has the support of 46% of the shareholders who must see something in it or why else sit by and watch teh shareprice tumble.

 

If anything the question we should be askingis wy do you support Lowe, to wilde, and Lowes share supporting colleagues.

 

I susupect they believe he is the best one to rescue the finace side with football coming second. For me the issue with Lowe is that most fans would not give a flying feck about his remuneration or his running of the finances if we were successful on the pitch - its when in our view his decisons financially directly impact the playing side that we become angry that he fails to grasp it - eg investmnet in the side, or manager selection. That is fair enough, but are we prepared to listen to the reasons, or do we believe its all bull?

 

For teh answer lies somewhere in between - its not as black and white as 3 or 0 points because I have never advocated simply doing what other clubs do.... spend what they dont ahve just to stand still... so Naturally i am supportive and have always been of the more prudent approach, as difficult as it is when seeing a side you love struggle because everyone else has spent money to improve and we begin to lag behind... thats really why i have been often considered a 'luvvie' when in reality I woukld support Wilde, Crouch or anyone who had that 'stabilty' in mind. As I have said many times for me its about the strategy, notthe person behind it.

 

On the footballing side its without doubt that Lowe has made huge errors that make the situation worse and its about time he listened for the love of god to some wiser ears if he does not want to lose what fans remain attending games - and he needs to distance himself from the 'chairman role' if ever the clubs fans are to be reunited behind a common cause.

 

Many will argue strongly that you cant seperate the two as the football is the core buisness, and I can see where they are coming from, but in the current situation, with the pressure from the banks the only priority at present is aviding administration, then avoiding relegation. If 46% of shareholders think LOwe is the man to do this, then there is not alot fans can do about it at present and I do feel that Crouch and MC for example are not helping with their public debates - Yes I know Lowe and Wilde did teh same, and they were out of order in doing so, but does that make Crouch and MC right in simply doing same?

 

For many years Southampton Football Club was one of the best run clubs (financially) in the country. How many people moaned that our biggest transfer outlay was 4M for Delap when other clubs were spending a lot more? E.G. I remember Wimbledon paying 8M for somebody (Hartson?) and look where they are now. It was relegation from the "Financial Promised-Land" and the scurry to try and get back that has caused the problem. As I said on another thread, if Mr Lowe confined himself to the financial side, allowing real football people to deal with the "product", things could have been so different. There is not a lot fans can do about a club that is run in a dictatorial manner by someone with a minor share-holding but we all feel that we must do something - whatever is in our power to do (boycott, non- renewal of ST`s, prostest, march) and some times all anyone can do is stand up and say something. Crouch and MC have been very quiet (publically) since Lowe came back, but obviously, as fans, like us they have had enough. Who can blame them for that?