Saint86

What we need is a rock solid quality CDM who can play possession football... That is our number 1 Need. Then we need a fast powerful striker who can finish. Then Mane's replacement when he says adios. No point getting too down beat. We will be mid table this year and that is it. Boring and stable. But we build for the future and the next batch of kids to take us onwards again. If I was shopping Prem(ish) players, I'd get bolasie, Vardy/austin and a feck off propper CDM and I would spend big on both the striker and the CDM!

I blame koeman a bit today. We were comfy first half (and should have been out of site!) Second half it was clear from 50min that we had lost the centre of midfield... But as he often does, he brings on 2 wingers in like for like changes rather than addressing the gaping hole in the middle. He needs to stop doing this imho. A shame because we gave it a good go and deserved a draw. The players worked hard but with no control in the middle we just didn't retain possession and made it very hard for ourselves. Not sure why we took off tadic or mane, and no idea why we used Gaston. We have a serious issue that we never came close to replacing Morgan. Wanyama and romeu are big lumps, and claise can tackle but is a deep lying play maker. Morgan did both... Tonight we had no possession in midfield and no creativity. And it showed second half. Trust Antonio to come back and haunt us. Anyway. Signs of progress in recent matches. It is mid table this year and we all know it anyway so there is no point getting too worked up over things. Recruitment needs to be significantly improved this summer. We should have a good chunk to spend once we sell wanyama and mane and we need to really target those funds like we did in koeman's first season! Onwards and (hopefully) upwards! Now to retreat before the wrist splitters take hold!

Long is just a beast for us. Finnaly getting a chance up top with no pelle to slow us down. This is two we should place. Solid back 8, and then long, mane and tadic. Only way to play this. Rape em on the break and with good movement and passers of the ball sitting deep. Shane long I'd our best striker tbh.

Saint86 here, after proving thastnlong was more effective than tadic for creating goals (and including tadic's penalties and assistsnin that tally) I see people have reverted to quoting his price? Perhaps people should look at tadic's cost... Or say McCormack's, or say Jordan Rhodes, or marcus bent?!?!! I mean seriously guys, long is a really strong asset for us, and he also gives his all every time unlike the Italian rasiak... And if you're still not convinced to stop slating him.... Liverpool payed 11million for heskey in 2000 or 2001... That is like 25m in today's prices. Just except you are wrong about long, no one will hold it against you. And we can save this thread as a golden one and be happy

Q E ****ing D Pelle needs to be dropped. Regardless of injury.

I think tonight vindicates my comments about playing long, mane, juanmi up front (even Martina) rather than pelle. Without pelle we are dangerous, fast tempo, great movement etc.

I really think you are missing the point tbh, koeman lost Morgan, clyne and Toby. One he was great mates with, any got him to the club in the first place and was texting all summer.... Another he was told by the board would be signing a new contract, and Morgan I think he knew was gone... The whole club knew that. So the board lost clyne and got Cedric (who I do rate) and Martina (anyone rate him?) And both are currently not as good as clyne - therefore weaker. We eventually signed VVD as a replacement for Toby, I rate him a lot but Toby is the superior defender and in any case this is a like for like switch and doesn't increase our first 11... We should also be sat here with both right now and happily using Toby as CDM aka morgan! We signed JC who I think us growing into the role a lot and his awareness and passing is top top notch... But he needs this season, especially given injuries. We also lost forster, replaced him with worse... And as above, no Morgan. Opening few months, also no RB at left back. That meant that for the start of the season, we had 1 of last year's back 5 playing and that is horrendous. Nor is it the managers fault and you can't expect him to gel a team together like last year every season..... It is obvious that we are weaker at the back, and the above changes and are weaker CM with the 2midgets (davis/claise/JWP) and wanyama does not do enough (Morgan) defensively. And this should have been Toby, wanyama and claise/davis). The other issue is attack, radix and mane especially are potent outlets, but pelle is not working atm. He also frustrates me so much, I know he has a knock but vs spurs he didn't run, he ****ed and moaned when the ball to him was perfect, we were losing and he wasn't in the box, and he lost the ball all the time or played it behind his runners and stalled the attack. It is like playing with 10men with him atm with him up front. And I think the team feel like this and it is damaging the confidence going forward. I watched the last one vs spurs, and people were moaning at the whole team... Well in my view, fonts should have stopped Kane (especially if he is gonna take a card), the second goal was a foul on Bertrand (and offside) and every player on that pitched worked there socks off except pelle. Our energy levels were good, wingers good, Davis, clasie, Bertrand etc did well... And then it got to pelle and we lost momentum and/or the ball. We were losing at had long and juanmi on, and they were in the 6 yard areas winning headers late on whilst pelle was on the far corner of the 18yard area almost outside the box... From a corner flag cross... It is a joke. The team were doing everything (even had one attack where VVD and fonte were setting each other up by the D) to score... And if we had it would have been in spite of pelle. My only gripe with pelle Is that koeman will not drop him! It has to happen when he is injured or in this form. The other problems like with board/scouting/recruitment teams. We made a profit this summer and didn't strengthen one position... And people are on here blaming koeman.... How many would quit you jobs with that level of consistent undermining.

Getting fed up with the negative bed wetting rubbish our fans are coming out with over one rough patch. I don't remember a single 8-0 or 6-1 win under loch, let alone 2 in the same season. The failing this year has been by the board and the recruitment teams, we haven't replace adequately, lost Toby when he was bloody well texting koeman all summer and didn't buy a single improvement of player quality. Everyone else around us improved. But seriously all, get over yourselves. We still beat Chelsea away, we're having an okay season so far and you have to accept that this is a rebuilding season after 2 years of complete squad refreshing. What we rebuild into is up to the recruitment and scouting team and so far their track record (without koeman's) input is shocking. But the depressive rubbish our fans are spouting on here is clap trap frankly. People forget that under loch we hardly ever won a game from behind, the craps cup sides he out out, nor how bad Tottenham were last year. Even spuds fans were calling for him out this year when they lost to Newcastle. Koeman is fine for us, just hope the board back him and I wish he would give pelle a rest and play long/juanmi for the movement.

This ^

The same obvious holes in the club remain after the summer, especially given Koeman's recent comments. The Toby fiasco really is a shame as him and VVD would have seen us done and dusted at CDM and CB. A real shame and all forward momentum that we had last summer has been given a proper stalling so far this season! No back up keeper (looking forward to Gazza proving me wrong), weak defensively in central midfield, and not enough cover in central defence - All problems that many highlighted in the summer and that the club didn't address. Ah well, looking forward to a positive result against the spuds; funny old league this season.

I agree, suspend this account immediately please!

Basically, it was there to go for... and rather than investing, Les Reed got all Sweaty palms sold the best we had left and invested in players that need to develop into their replacements over a couple of years... Instead, we should have spent a bit of dosh on 2 players from last years team and gotten a top 4 birth. Chance gone for another 2 generations like as not.

Get a grip seriously mate. This is a result of the board flogging the spine of the team every season. I have zero time for people on discussing "Koeman out" style topics, utter joke and an unreal level of bedwetting.

It has already been shown that Long is more effective than Tadic... Please keep up. Away from home we need fast, mobile and attacking players. That is Mane, Long and Juanmi. We are not going there to dominate possession as palace will rip us several new ones on the counter. RoKo would never gamble on that however.

The only thing i disagree with Alpine is that we have increased squad depth. However, our first team is weaker than last year and we only have Fonte, Wanyama, Davis, Yoshi and JWP from 2 years ago who are really around the first team - as a result we have lot a lot of cohesion. That said, fans need to look at this as us building a new team. The old one took us a long way, but we sold it to maximise profits and we are currently building a new one. I agree that we need perhaps 2 quality players atm, One more CB and a very solid and dedicated box to box midfielder / CDM... Achieving that would push us back into Europe. Failure to achieve that means this year is a rebuilding year and we will look to push on again after the summer. My biggest two regrets is that the board's policy have stripped the club of any true fan heroes and that we have stopped bedding the kids as much this season, but the again, it is those under 18 that are viewed as the true prospects.

So, everytime someone slags off long we post the above stats yeah

Maybe so... since long has been deemed as the benchmark at which point we should sell players at half their purchase cost!!

So. I was a bit bored and thought I'd look up the two players (Tadic vs Long) respective stats in the premier league with Saints. Long 14/15 - 5 goals and 6 assists. (1545 minutes) Long 15/16 - 2 Goals and 0 assists. (366 minutes) Long Total - 7 goals and 6 assists. (1911 minutes) Tadic 14/15 - 4 goals and 9 assists. (2056 minutes) Tadic 15/16 - 4 goals and 3 assists. (1058 minutes) Tadic Total - 8 goals and 12 assists (3115 minutes) If you take assists as worth the same as goals then: Long has 7+6 = 13 and 1911/13 = 147 minutes per goal contribution. Tadic has 8+12 = 20 and 3115/20 = 155.75 minutes per goal contribution. So surprisingly, Long actually contributes more efficiently as an attacking outlet. Especially as he has a higher goals per minute ratio than tadic when both play as wingers, and tadic has a couple of penalties that could arguably be removed from his total with regards to contribution. I find the above amusing since some put Tadic on a completely different level to Slong in regards to his importance to the team and contribution... when actually there is very little in it and the little man probably deserves a bit more respect and acknowledgement of what he offers.

Lol, and yet successive saints managers continue to play him and he has captained england at every level he's played. Your Anti JWP agenda not stacking up with experienced football minds... a better question would be to ask what those managers know that you do not?

Tonight's result highlights exactly how the board failed this summer. We have a larger squad. But we didn't replace Morgan. We didn't strengthen the defence and we signed caulker who is frankly worse than yoshi. Clasie is invisible and our central midfield is where exactly? because it is non existent. Can you actually imagine when Mane leaves? Christ. It is also Koeman's fault now, he chose these players (granted we missed toby), and he is also trying to shoe-horn them into tactics that they simply can not manage. He is obviously ****ed off as shown by his very public moaning about the transfer business this year. He certainly won't be signing a new contract and the question is whether he will go before this. Long story short, we had a fantastic team and then we ****ed it all away. Good job to those involved! And also... where the feck is our much fabled youth academy under this current set up... they have completely regressed, most our shipped out on loan, none are developing into first team assets and the majority have regressed in that regard. Not a happy fan tonight.

Caulker at fault for the first 2 goals. We lost Toby and Morgan, then didn't strengthen the defence or replace Morgan. The result is we are just a shambles at the back and more so with fonte out. A real shame. Our central midfield just doest exist and is terrbily weak and permeable. Has been all season, but we are being torn apart by a partly second string Liverpool side, at home, and after having the lead. As stated, again this is because of caulker largely and yoshi is clearly the better choice in that regard; just pick your evils. After today's comments with koeman it is clear all is not right behind the scenes and this performance just highlights the weaknesses in the side. Hopefully we'll actually sign a Morgan replacement and a CB to challenge fonte and Virgil. We clearly have the dosh and koeman has publicly stated he wants us to spend. He looks ****ed so maybe he'll fire them up... But feck me, we are awful and have no fight in cm.

Okay, so you'd take 3 players? Sturridge, hendo and coutinhio are injured (or have been out)... I'd take stek or forster no doubt, and virgil and Fonte. I'd also take bertrand. Then I'd have one of Mane and Tadic and keep Pelle over Benteke... Its like the Klopp mania has infested everyone... They managed 2 shots on target vs Swansea, and one was a very lucky penalty... Swansea the team being tipped for a relegation battle.. This game is there for saints to win and we should be favourites. Amazed by the negativity on this forum tbh.

People are being retards with this one. Liverpool aren't that great, people are just lapping up the pressing (just as they did with saints under poch... and we finished 8th and 7th and beat it last year)... Say what you want, but they have had a lot of matches recently, are not better than us on paper, and managed only 2 shots (1 a lucky penalty) vs a very poor swansea team. If we turn up we'll beat these. People who predict a 3-0 defeat at home are just being numpties... Every pundit has slammed there performance on the weekend. On top of that, they played Sunday afternoon and have had a very short rest. We will want to do the bounce after two negative results... Saints win!

This guy has a quality pad, high up over looking the solent and st mary's.... That is some dedication and passion if he can see the statidum all day every day if he so chooses! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3336933/Southampton-defender-Cedric-Soares-home-ease-Premier-League-star-reveals-six-ambitions-friendship-Marcos-Rojo.html

No shurlock, what I say, is that the very best sides (i.e. fergie and the champions) have huge pressures to sneak wins and do it frequently, whilst at the same time they have teams that are desperate for a draw playing against them that give up any chance of a win and park the bus... it is a recipe for more common last minute attacks and they manage to break them down, that is why they are the top teams.... The bottom clubs frequently have to go all out attack and chase at the very end of games, they therefore have a higher probability of this occurring and those that fail go down. The you have the rest, who either don't have the quality and settle for draws more frequently (lower mid table) or have the quality and come upper half... these teams are often winning and dominating most games and therefore have less probability of being in a need to chase. Considering the way our seasons have gone (2nd championship) then fairly awful under Nigel for first part of that season but then picking up and outplaying teams, then dominating often under poch and koeman... is it hardly surprising that we fall in the bunch of teams that don't get late goals or points? We are not championship material, we lack that quality... does this surprise people? We often have often killed off games in advance, and when we don't teams are very solid at parking the bus in this league... we are not a top top team, we do not have the pressures of desperately needing the win so we rarely go hell for leather and risk letting in 1or2 at the back. The bottom clubs get outplayed, are desperate for wins, and they have to go for it, the ones that succeed stay up. Given the above, it really should not come as any surprise that we don't often score late on... that isn't the kind of team we are, and we haven't been for a few years. We outplay most teams, but we do not have world class quality that would make us genuine top 4 challengers.