Dog Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Which is the best one to buy? Only want Fifa 2011 And want to play online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Xbox. Easier to spell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 (edited) The PS3 has free online play. Saves you about 30 quid a year. I have an Xbox 360 though. Love it. Edited 22 December, 2010 by Colinjb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dog Posted 22 December, 2010 Author Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesaint sfc Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 xbox - everything is cheaper. Except you have to pay to play online, but it's much more fun. The extra you pay is easily saved when you're often buying games for £10-15 less. The new xbox is dead cheap too. And it's tiny. (awww bless) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintscottofthenortham Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Xbox 360. [video=youtube;d-ZmHLeDcMo] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 My elder son has a PS3, wired to a 42 inch HD flat screen and a pioneer sound system - pretty awsome for most game play. My younger son has an xbox 360 (old style (fat) and quite noisy) wired to a small Bush portable TV - still playable, but nowhere near the PS3 setup. (Santa has a bigger screen for him - so will soon be HD(sssshhhhh...!)). I originally thought that the PS3 was miles better, but am not convinced now, and given the fact that the xbox360 was somewhat cheaper - am very happy with it's functionality and performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulSaint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Buy a PS3 if you have an HD telly & watch films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 PS3. only for the fact it has a built in blue ray player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintscottofthenortham Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Buy a PS3 if you have an HD telly & watch films. Or buy a Blu-Ray player if you want to watch HD films. I made the fateful mistake of buying a PS3 for that very reason Paul. 3 months later, once I realised everything on the PS3 is bumped up by 30 f*****g % to make up for the fact that the internet service they provide is free. While we are on the subject, the PS3's version of Live is SH*T. I sold it all and got myself an Xbox 360 Elite and havn't looked back since. There is a good reason over 20 MILLION people are happy to pay £30/£40 a year for Xbox Live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimond Geezer Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 My elder son has a PS3, wired to a 42 inch HD flat screen and a pioneer sound system - pretty awsome for most game play. My younger son has an xbox 360 (old style (fat) and quite noisy) wired to a small Bush portable TV - still playable, but nowhere near the PS3 setup. (Santa has a bigger screen for him - so will soon be HD(sssshhhhh...!)). I originally thought that the PS3 was miles better, but am not convinced now, and given the fact that the xbox360 was somewhat cheaper - am very happy with it's functionality and performance. You've just described my Mrs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_stevo Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Get a PS3. More than just an excellent gaming machine, it has a top of the range Blu-Ray player, On demand TV built in and i have never had a problem using the online service. 70% of people who own a xBox deep down want a PS3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holepuncture Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Get a PS3. More than just an excellent gaming machine, it has a top of the range Blu-Ray player, On demand TV built in and i have never had a problem using the online service. 70% of people who own a xBox deep down want a PS3 I would go with that! I went with the PS3 from the off. I also picked up an Xbox with a phone contract upgrade. In my opinion, the PS3 leaves it for dead. The Xbox is inferior in every way other than one thing, gaming, which is the same. I like the Xbox pad, but the PS3 one is what i see as the standard definition of a controller. you can do so much with the PS3, and it keeps getting better and better. I see the Xbox as more of a kids console. The PS3 is an entertainment suite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Everyone i know that has both prefers the ps3. Enough said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Xbox360 gets my vote too. Online play is loads better and you can usually get deals on the years subscription taking it down to £20 for a year sometimes. People I know with a ps3 say it's better than the Xbox but I don't know many with a ps3 compared to people I know with an Xbox. The blue ray option is only a benefit to people who are going to buy blue ray dvd's. And if your going to go for a decent collection of them you would be better off getting a stand alone blue ray player with all the trimmings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Everyone i know that has both prefers the ps3. Enough said Everyone I know with both have got more more money than sense Enough said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I don't really get the whole 'xbox is better online arguement' They both provide an online service and shop. All you do is log in, set up the game and join people playing online ?? Explain to me exactly how it is £40 a year better ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Everyone I know with both have got more more money than sense Enough said. This is true Though i nearly bought an xbox the other day just for Halo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 There is a good reason over 20 MILLION people are happy to pay £30/£40 a year for Xbox Live. Yeah, it's called down syndrome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clapham Saint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 You've just described my Mrs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 why on earth do people have both consoles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I would go with that! I went with the PS3 from the off. I also picked up an Xbox with a phone contract upgrade. In my opinion, the PS3 leaves it for dead. The Xbox is inferior in every way other than one thing, gaming, which is the same. I like the Xbox pad, but the PS3 one is what i see as the standard definition of a controller. you can do so much with the PS3, and it keeps getting better and better. I see the Xbox as more of a kids console. The PS3 is an entertainment suite. Hardware wise the only thing better in a ps3 is the blueray player. The software and lay out of the ps3 probably make it more user friendly for more than just games. Other than blueray I haven't seen the ps3 do anything the Xbox can't. Xbox and ps are always trying to out do each other yet when ps released the ps3 Xbox replied with the same Xbox 360 with built in wifi and a quieter fan. Xbox konnect seems better than the ps and wii motion tech too. Op just wants to play FIFA online though so doesn't sound like all the other options for each system is anything being thought about. I still prefer the online play on the Xbox by a country mile so would still get my vote for the op. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 This is true Though i nearly bought an xbox the other day just for Halo I'm not a halo fan myself. Ghost recon and FIFA are my fav's. Making do with COD till GR comes back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesaint sfc Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Saint Stevo said the PS3 is better. Yet another reason to get an xbox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draino76 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I have a PS3, an Xbox 360 and now a Wii. I shall be opening the envelope with the results after the break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I've got all three consoles. The 360 is the one I use the most by a country mile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey-deacons-left-nut Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 It really depends on what you're after. If it's mainly for games, the 360 is undoubtedly the one to go for. It's cheaper. The multi format games are technically better on the xbox. Although the average man on the street would be hard pushed to tell the difference. things like (slightly) improved frame rate and less tearing, as well as full screen AA givethe 360 the edge (although the ps3 is more powerfull on paper in reality the way the 360 is designed i.e it's memory distribution makes it far more efficient and adaptable) Online for games is a smoother experience. It's still peer to peer gaming (with the odd game having dedicated servers) but the fact that you have to pay to play means it's far easier to ban cheaters/griefers etc. You just have to put up with anoying 12 year old yanks. The joypad is far superior on the 360 (except for the diabolical d pad!) The PS3, however is an excelent media station, although the 360 also offers this functionality it's so much easier on the ps3, the internal HD and the ability to upgrade it yourself comes in handy. I have both and to be honest don't really play game so either of them anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I don't really get the whole 'xbox is better online arguement' They both provide an online service and shop. All you do is log in, set up the game and join people playing online ?? Explain to me exactly how it is £40 a year better ?? Only time I have seen the online on both systems was for black ops. PS: Sat in a silent lobby with no voice chat unless you have a headset was odd. No option for voice through the tv. Played a couple of games and despite the usual COD lag probs, looked like a COD God even though it was my first time on the PS controller. My mate wasn't amused that he got owned by an Xbox user. Same mate came round to mine and played COD on my Xbox and had trouble getting used to the controller, trouble with lag, was tired, had too much to drink and a load of other poor excuses. And generally got owned by everyone. Said the game play online was much faster on the Xbox and the players were generally much better. He still claimed ps3 was better but think he thought more if the Xbox after that then before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesaint sfc Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 xbox is better. There is really no argument. If you're looking at buying a GAMES console, and are not looking at playing games then there are far greater things available than the Xbox or the PS3. For playing games, for the reasons everyone has stated above - the xbox is better. Even if you're daft and think the PS3 is better, you'll only think it is slightly better. If you're working on that mentality then it is slightly better, but way cheaper for the console and all the games. Notice Xbox has come up with Kinect to open up a new market? What has PS3 come up with? I love Sony - but I'm sorry, they'll never keep up with Microsoft. The only edge they had on them before was experience in consoles. Microsoft has now superseded them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenevaSaint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 In my opinion, the PS3 leaves it for dead. The Xbox is inferior in every way other than one thing, gaming, which is the same. Which is all the OP ask for gaming, xbox based on price for that reason surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 If you're a youngster and just want gaming then an xbox fits the bill. If you're an adult and want your console to do more then PS3. I play both online on a regualr basis and the difference between them is the price of xbox gold and anyone who tells you otherwise is talking out of the @rse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 It really depends on how much money you want to spend. If you want to watch films and intend to buy Blu-Ray's then buying a PS3 just for that is no longer the cheapest route. Blu-Ray players have dropped in price a lot and continue to drop. Like for example you can get this one for £49.99 at Tesco http://direct.tesco.com/q/R.208-6218.aspx. They are all the same in terms of viewing. If you got the new 360 for £149.99 (which has Wi-Fi included) and that Blu Ray player it is still £50-£100 cheaper then the cheapest PS3. PS3 has free online but that doesn't mean it is good. Anyone who bought Black Ops recently will tell you just how bad the online has been. But it really depends how much you plan on using it. If it is just now and then it is better then having to pay an additional £5 a month just to use Xbox live. However if you are interested in just the games then in my opinion the PS3 has the better line up of exclusives. Uncharted 2 is up there with the greatest games of all time. That is not saying the 360 doesn't have good games it just means that the PS3 exclusives tend to be pretty good and stay exclusive where as 360 exclusive games have a habbit of being just a timed exclusive. But if your someone who intends to buy a lot of multi-platform games then 360 wins hands down. A lot of PS3 games are ports of the 360 version. Games such as Red Dead Redemption and Fifa are made with the 360 as the lead platform then ported over to PS3. So it really can be hit and miss with some multi-platform games on PS3. The other thing to consider is the extras to the consoles. By this i mean the internet movie and music type things. On PS3 you have LoveFilm which means you can stream films from their service to your tv if you have a subscription with them. However these movies are not in HD and the list is pretty dire. There are no new films on there. 360 on the other hand has Sky Player. So if you have a Sky subscription you can watch on demand pretty much anything. From new films to Documentaries. You can also watch ESPN which has football and american sports if your into that. You can also watch live tv on it but i not tried that. It really all boils down to what you want to use it for and how much you want to spend. If you have a mrs then getting the 360 with Kinect and Dance Central will win her over. But you can't go wrong with either of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I have a PS3...why do people have both...have I missed something..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Only time I have seen the online on both systems was for black ops. PS: Sat in a silent lobby with no voice chat unless you have a headset was odd. No option for voice through the tv. Played a couple of games and despite the usual COD lag probs, looked like a COD God even though it was my first time on the PS controller. My mate wasn't amused that he got owned by an Xbox user. Same mate came round to mine and played COD on my Xbox and had trouble getting used to the controller, trouble with lag, was tired, had too much to drink and a load of other poor excuses. And generally got owned by everyone. Said the game play online was much faster on the Xbox and the players were generally much better. He still claimed ps3 was better but think he thought more if the Xbox after that then before. ??? I don't have a headset and i still hear everyone talking, its whether or not you want to buy a bluetooth headset and chat back is up to you. If all you pay for is a better quality of gamer (which i completely refute BTW) then is it really worth it ?? I personally don't see any difference in online gameplay at all, other than the fact that you have to pay for one of them. Personally weighing everything all up the PS3 is the more powerful overall product and has more to it than just a gaming console, it is pretty much a media server that is also an incredibly powerful games console as well. You also don't have to pay for any extras, something that you will need to in time. Equally there is the Blu ray arguement, you could buy an xbox AND a bespoke blu ray player but thats just farking madness, why would you ? The Xbox kinect is a nifty bit of kit but TBF i got taken in by the whole Wii experience and have hardly ever played it so i can't see this being any different. Basically, all round PS3 is the winner, the 'cheaper' arguement is a little bit baseless as well as to get the top of the range xbox (which still lacks the blu ray drive but is just about on par in regards performance) it will set you back around £200, then you need to pay for the online etc etc and it is the same price, Microsoft have just marketed it well. Plus the controller is like handling a space station on the xbox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I have a PS3...why do people have both...have I missed something..? Some games are single console. Basically no, the guys i know that have both are still living with mum and dad and have mates that have either an xbox or ps3 so have both so they can play both. Waste of cash IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 I have a PS3...why do people have both...have I missed something..? The reason i have both is because you get best of both worlds. There are a lot of games that are only available on one of the consoles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 The reason i have both is because you get best of both worlds. There are a lot of games that are only available on one of the consoles. ah I see..Im not an avid gamer really..play it now and then when off work my mate had an XBOX 360.. and cant tell the difference at all... cant see how anyone can say one is better when it comes to games..? but then, im not an avid gamer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 ah I see..Im not an avid gamer really..play it now and then when off work my mate had an XBOX 360.. and cant tell the difference at all... cant see how anyone can say one is better when it comes to games..? but then, im not an avid gamer In terms of games and how games look and play they are the same. Some people will try and claim one looks better then the other and one has better performance then the other but is just fanboyism really. Some games run better on one, and some run better on the other. 99% of the time that is down to the developers and how good they are with the hardware. Some get it spot on and some don't. Like take Rockstar for example. They get their games running great on 360 but for some reason just can't emulate it on the PS3. That isn't because the PS3 can't handle it, it is because Rockstar just can't get to grips with the hardware in the same way they can the 360. Multi-platform games tend to use the 360 as the lead platform because it is the console that has sold the most in the world and has a far higher sell rate in US. Most software sales come from the US so they try and maximise that market. But 9 times out of 10 both games will look identical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 It really depends on how much money you want to spend. If you want to watch films and intend to buy Blu-Ray's then buying a PS3 just for that is no longer the cheapest route. Blu-Ray players have dropped in price a lot and continue to drop. Like for example you can get this one for £49.99 at Tesco http://direct.tesco.com/q/R.208-6218.aspx. They are all the same in terms of viewing. If you got the new 360 for £149.99 (which has Wi-Fi included) and that Blu Ray player it is still £50-£100 cheaper then the cheapest PS3. PS3 has free online but that doesn't mean it is good. Anyone who bought Black Ops recently will tell you just how bad the online has been. But it really depends how much you plan on using it. If it is just now and then it is better then having to pay an additional £5 a month just to use Xbox live. However if you are interested in just the games then in my opinion the PS3 has the better line up of exclusives. Uncharted 2 is up there with the greatest games of all time. That is not saying the 360 doesn't have good games it just means that the PS3 exclusives tend to be pretty good and stay exclusive where as 360 exclusive games have a habbit of being just a timed exclusive. But if your someone who intends to buy a lot of multi-platform games then 360 wins hands down. A lot of PS3 games are ports of the 360 version. Games such as Red Dead Redemption and Fifa are made with the 360 as the lead platform then ported over to PS3. So it really can be hit and miss with some multi-platform games on PS3. The other thing to consider is the extras to the consoles. By this i mean the internet movie and music type things. On PS3 you have LoveFilm which means you can stream films from their service to your tv if you have a subscription with them. However these movies are not in HD and the list is pretty dire. There are no new films on there. 360 on the other hand has Sky Player. So if you have a Sky subscription you can watch on demand pretty much anything. From new films to Documentaries. You can also watch ESPN which has football and american sports if your into that. You can also watch live tv on it but i not tried that. It really all boils down to what you want to use it for and how much you want to spend. If you have a mrs then getting the 360 with Kinect and Dance Central will win her over. But you can't go wrong with either of them. That's the best review of each so far IMO. Black ops problems have not been limited to just the PS3 though as staying in games in party's on the Xbox was a farking nightmare at the beginning. Live tv on the Xbox works well too. It's been offered free up until December but I think you need the multiroom package on sky (an extra £10 a month) to get it in the future. I use it to watch movies and series in bed when ever I want as I don't always sky plus everything. Not sure if the mulitroom package will get many subscribers to keep live tv so can see it becoming a free service in the future anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Just had a quick look online for the techy differences and the PS3 comes out on top but not by much so both systems are pretty much comparable. When the PS3 came out I half expected Xbox to follow up with a new console to beat the PS3 followed by a new console soon after from Playstation and so it would continue like it has in the past. Xbox didn't see the PS3 as that much of a competition as they just jazzed up there current system a bit. http://uk.gear.ign.com/articles/111/1116182p1.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey-deacons-left-nut Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 http://uk.gear.ign.com/articles/111/1116182p1.html You can ignore that link, it's so wrong it's unbelievable.. all they seem to have done is take the figures provided by each company and directly compare them. The problem is that both devices are radically different in the way they work, so comparing say the ram speed between the two is utterly pointless as they use the ram in different ways. If you want to get a true idea of the differences and technical merits, you should check out the faceoff roundups on Eurogamer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffo Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Ps3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedAndWhite91 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Ps3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_bert Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 Get a PS3. You can get involved in SWF FIFA tournements that die a death really easy that way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 22 December, 2010 Share Posted 22 December, 2010 You can ignore that link, it's so wrong it's unbelievable.. all they seem to have done is take the figures provided by each company and directly compare them. The problem is that both devices are radically different in the way they work, so comparing say the ram speed between the two is utterly pointless as they use the ram in different ways. If you want to get a true idea of the differences and technical merits, you should check out the faceoff roundups on Eurogamer. To be fair, that link starts off by saying it's only comparing the hardware in it's basic form and when ever possible it mentions how the hardware is used differently on each. I only looked cause the PS3 is newer and you would think hardware would have been much further ahead. Although it tops the Xbox it's not by much. The main differences to the normal user have been explained by most on here I still vote Xbox though. Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 23 December, 2010 Share Posted 23 December, 2010 To be fair, that link starts off by saying it's only comparing the hardware in it's basic form and when ever possible it mentions how the hardware is used differently on each. I only looked cause the PS3 is newer and you would think hardware would have been much further ahead. Although it tops the Xbox it's not by much. The main differences to the normal user have been explained by most on here I still vote Xbox though. Lol Its not really older TBF, the ps3 has hardly changed where as the xbox has been largely updated in order to keep up with the ps3. Are you telling me that the one they are comparing is the same xbox that was released first time over ?? Without HD, without wireless etc etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jones91 Posted 23 December, 2010 Share Posted 23 December, 2010 I've got all 3. Xbox is the best by far, notonly with better games and online service, you get sky player and windows media centre with it. Plus on the ps3 you have to buy a head set to talk to any of your friends... The xbox is quieter if you install the games on the harddrive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 23 December, 2010 Share Posted 23 December, 2010 Its not really older TBF, the ps3 has hardly changed where as the xbox has been largely updated in order to keep up with the ps3. Are you telling me that the one they are comparing is the same xbox that was released first time over ?? Without HD, without wireless etc etc That comparison says at the start that it's only comparing the latest models for each. PS have updated there's a few times too so it's difficult to compare each model but essentially the PS3 and xbox360 are the current models. Xbox brought out the 360 before the PS3 came out. I expected Xbox to come out with a completely new console to compete. But they have only just upgraded the 360 so must think there are a few more years left with fair competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 23 December, 2010 Share Posted 23 December, 2010 its got me wanting to trade my PS3 in for an Xbox now...just to see if there is any difference lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 23 December, 2010 Share Posted 23 December, 2010 That comparison says at the start that it's only comparing the latest models for each. PS have updated there's a few times too so it's difficult to compare each model but essentially the PS3 and xbox360 are the current models. Xbox brought out the 360 before the PS3 came out. I expected Xbox to come out with a completely new console to compete. But they have only just upgraded the 360 so must think there are a few more years left with fair competition. The Ps3 hasn't really been upgraded too much though, only really the HD in reality where as the Xbox has had new memory, video card etc etc in order to compete with it. In regards to Microsoft releasing a new system, i thought this too, but then in reality they would lose so many customers if they sh*t on everyone like that, i mean i would be livid if i had shelled out £250 for a top model xbox with all the little extras Microsoft doesn't tell you all about and then they went and released a new system. I reckon we may be looking at perhaps a Ps4 and xbox whatever in around 2013. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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