Pilchards Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 The last manager that the fans really took too was Nigel Pearson, do you think he would achieved what Mr Adkins has? Not trying to cause an argument, I just want people's opinion on Mr Pearson as he proved what a class manager he was at Leicester. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Bob Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I was gutted when Pearson left. I, like many, was sceptical about Adkins but he's really proved himnself over the last 4 or 5 months. In answer to your question - who knows? I suspect we had the right man for the job this season though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Pretty much everyone on here appreciates the great job Pearson did at Saints (with one obvious, tedious exception), and since he's left he's done very well with Leicester, getting a promotion from L1 and losing a play-off semi on penalties (better than they did this season under Sven), and reasonably well this season with a skint Hull who could have been in serious trouble and who are just above Leicester in the top half, 7 points off the last play-off place at the moment. In the interests of continuity, and Saints actually going two seasons in a row with the same manager for the first time since Burley (which worked well in his second season), and because he's got us promoted* of course, I'd stick with Adkins, though Pearson would be on any shortlist for Saints manager I'd have in the next few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 NP got the foxes promoted (Top) and reached playoffs the next season (5th)? Can NA emulate or better? Hull in 10th (highest possible finish 8th) could be deemed a poor season for NP NA’s old Scunny side relegated – inspite or despite him leaving? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I liked Pearson a great deal and think we would have stayed up had we kept him. He got Leicester up and they did well the season after. If Adkins gets us into a top 10 position then its about honours even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Wish Pearson had been given a chance but Adkins has been head and shoulders better for us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Very similar in style I believe, we'll never know, and I'm sure each have their own strengths and weaknesses. I think The9 echos my feelings... we have been promoted under Adkins and look forward to him taking us further, but I'll always have time and respect for Pearson and his style of management and would welcome him back should we ever have a vacancy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I liked Pearson a great deal and think we would have stayed up had we kept him. He got Leicester up and they did well the season after. If Adkins gets us into a top 10 position then its about honours even. Ditto. I also reckon he would have kept us up had the idiot Lowe not got rid of him through spite, because he had not appointed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenridge Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 (edited) Wish Pearson had been given a chance but Adkins has been head and shoulders better for us Not sure on what you base this argument, you can't use stats as they both were at the Club at very different times under very different circumstances. Well done to both, two of our best managers in recent times. Edited 6 May, 2011 by Greenridge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesaint sfc Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I really liked Pardew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Not sure on what you base this argument, you can't use stats as they both were at the Club at very different times under very different circumstances. Well done to both, two of our best managers in recent times. based on what I have seen from both managers and that Pearson was only here about 10 weeks or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxstone Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I was gutted when Pearson left. I, like many, was sceptical about Adkins but he's really proved himnself over the last 4 or 5 months. In answer to your question - who knows? I suspect we had the right man for the job this season though. Concur with this view.. Loved Pearson - A big man with a big presence and seemingly to me had all the technical, tactical and man- management skills required. But so does Nigel A.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
so22saint Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 What about Jan Portvelt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenridge Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 based on what I have seen from both managers and that Pearson was only here about 10 weeks or something So in only 10 weeks that Pearson was here you are able to determine that Adkins is head and shoulders above him? Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Not trying to cause an argument, I'm sure you're not and I sometimes struggle why people get so het up with opinions and hypothetical situations on a message board, so I wouldn't worry about offending people on here. Obviously impossible to say, but given Pearson's achievements and how he conducted himself in his time here and what he did with Leicester after (a club similar to ourselves) makes me think he would also have achieved promotion with us. As others have said, I think there are similarities with Adkins, although I would say Pearson has the experience and perhaps respect card due to his playinmg career, whilst Adkins seems to have the Wenger meticulous planning card up his sleeve. If there is a vacancy at some point in the future, then I certainly wouldn't be adverse to seeing if Pearson is interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toomer Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I thought the job might have been just a little to big for Adkins when he first arrived, but credit where credit is due he has done a cracking job this season, long may it continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hopkins Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Hated Pearson and rated Adkins before he came here. I'm awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 As others have said, I think there are similarities with Adkins, although I would say Pearson has the experience and perhaps respect card due to his playinmg career, whilst Adkins seems to have the Wenger meticulous planning card up his sleeve. This should be a top trumps-style game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 What about Jan Portvelt? Who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 This should be a top trumps-style game! I bet there already is one!!!!!! ****Football Manager Top Trumps**** Who'd be King [ock????? Mourhinho, Ferguson, Allegri, Wigley????? EDIT There is as well!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://toptrumps.wikia.com/wiki/Football_Managers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 When Nige 1 was appointed I was cautiously optimistic, and he exceeded my expectations. Shame that **** Lowe got rid of him through spite. And Nige 1 proved the Lowe-luvvies completely wrong. When Nige 2 was appointed I was cautiously optimistic, and so far he has exceeded my expectations. I think, like Strachan, his man-management skills are top notch. But most of the squad he has inherited, and I think the jury is still out whether he can be as good in the transfer market as (for example) Lawrie Mac, or (dare I say it) Pardew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I bet there already is one!!!!!! ****Football Manager Top Trumps**** Who'd be King [ock????? Mourhinho, Ferguson, Allegri, Wigley????? EDIT There is as well!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://toptrumps.wikia.com/wiki/Football_Managers That's brilliant! I can just see it! Player One: Mindgames, 95 (Adkins) Player Two: Mindgames, 0 (Poyet) Player Two: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHAPEL END CHARLIE Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I hold Nigel Pearson in the highest regard both as a man and a manager and it's fascinating to speculate what he might have achieved here given the infinitely more favorable circumstances that Nigel Adkins has benefited from. Timing is everything in life they say - in my view Pearson was exactly the right manager for this club, unfortunately he was here at exactly the worst possible time. It's all academic now of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 So in only 10 weeks that Pearson was here you are able to determine that Adkins is head and shoulders above him? Interesting. read my post more carefully. Pearson was here for 5 minutes and got something like 2 or 3 wins. We stayed up. Wish he had been given a chance but who knows how well he would have done. Adkins has evidenced 100x more management ability for us in a very effective season. Maybe Pearson could have done if he had the chance, but he didn't. Adkins has done a hell of a lot more for us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Nigel Pearson joined saints with us in 18th, 4 places and 6 points above relegation. He finished the season in 20th, 2 places and 2 points above relegation. Nigel Adkins joined saints with us in 22nd, 6 points off 7th, 8 points off 2nd. He finished the season in 2nd, at the moment 22 points clear of 7th. different times, different circumstances but Adkins looks to be the better manager for us to me. I am hopeful that he will be our best manager in last 20 years (there have been 21 in that time! Think with the poor competition he is already pretty high on the list!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Nigel Pearson joined saints with us in 18th, 4 places and 6 points above relegation. He finished the season in 20th, 2 places and 2 points above relegation. Nigel Adkins joined saints with us in 22nd, 6 points off 7th, 8 points off 2nd. He finished the season in 2nd, at the moment 22 points clear of 7th. different times, different circumstances but Adkins looks to be the better manager for us to me. I am hopeful that he will be our best manager in last 20 years (there have been 21 in that time! Think with the poor competition he is already pretty high on the list!) You shouldn't be allowed near statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 You shouldn't be allowed near statistics. Indeed. LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 just don't quite get the level that some put Pearson at. Was gutted when he left and reckon we would have done well if we had kept him for a few years but it was hardly the great escape! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHAPEL END CHARLIE Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 You shouldn't be allowed near statistics. He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts - for support rather than for illumination. ~Andrew Lang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St_Tel49 Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts - for support rather than for illumination. ~Andrew Lang Nige 1's tenure was so short as to render statistical analysis meaningless (probably!). However, what he achieved elsewhere suggests that he would have done a good job had he stayed and would probably have done a very good job with this year's team. However, Nige 2 is the man in post and he hasn't done much wrong so the discussion is largely academic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts - for support rather than for illumination. ~Andrew Lang I always liked Esar's definition of statistics: "The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures", something which seems quite fitting given NickG's continued efforts to produce facts from figures!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Nige 1's tenure was so short as to render statistical analysis meaningless (probably!). However, what he achieved elsewhere suggests that he would have done a good job had he stayed and would probably have done a very good job with this year's team. However, Nige 2 is the man in post and he hasn't done much wrong so the discussion is largely academic. I think what he did he was enough to suggest he would have done a good job here. Seems decent guy as well, and done well since - just think he was more potential rather than achiever when here. Personally think NA Better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Um - those are facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nige is a scunny fan Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 if nige was still at scunny we would still be in npc he ia very special ,well done and enjoy your special day tommorrow it will go so fast.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHAPEL END CHARLIE Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Nige 1's tenure was so short as to render statistical analysis meaningless (probably!). However, what he achieved elsewhere suggests that he would have done a good job had he stayed and would probably have done a very good job with this year's team. However, Nige 2 is the man in post and he hasn't done much wrong so the discussion is largely academic. As I'm in a argumentative mood I'd quite like to take issue with this - unfortunately (damn you!) I can't find anything here to disagree with. But by Great Shatner's ghost I will have my revenge sooner or later..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St_Tel49 Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 (edited) I always liked Esar's definition of statistics: "The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures", something which seems quite fitting given NickG's continued efforts to produce facts from figures!!! It is a nice aphorism but like most aphorisms it is bollux. Good statistical analysis allows you to make deductions from what can seem like a confusing mass of data BUT - and here is the key - it allows you assign a mathematically robust calculation of the PROBABILITY that your deduction is correct. The problem is that most people (journalists!) look at the deductions and ignore the probabilities assigned to them. Fundamentally, it is either the occasional abuse or frequent misunderstanding of statistical analysis that gives it a bad name rather than anything being inherently wrong with the methods. NB The is a 10% probability then some or all of what I have said is rubbish Edit: Actually, on rereading the quote I withdraw the bollux comment because he was possibly (or probably!) using unreliability as an alternative term to probability!! Edited 6 May, 2011 by St_Tel49 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Um - those are facts. They are figures without context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilchards Posted 6 May, 2011 Author Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I see one as a sargent major type who would scream at you to get a Job done while the other one was a softie who speaks well about the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 factual ones and ones that think would surprise some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 um - those are facts. q.e.d. !!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 I don't think they're very surprising, pretty much everyone knows Pearson's WDL record wasn't great, but it was a damn sight better than his predecessor. More relevant stats (that would probably support the majority view) of Pearson as some kind of miracle worker would compare win percentages from (say) the previous 12 months and the previous 6 matches to see how much of a turnaround was achieved compared to the overall trend. I don't think there's much doubt that Adkins took over a hugely better situation than Pearson, and if you want to deal in overly-simplistic stats, how about "Pearson led us to 20th in the Championship (40th overall in the League), Adkins has never taken Saints higher than 2nd in League One (46th)" ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stug76 Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Nigel Pearson joined saints with us in 18th, 4 places and 6 points above relegation. He finished the season in 20th, 2 places and 2 points above relegation. Nigel Adkins joined saints with us in 22nd, 6 points off 7th, 8 points off 2nd. He finished the season in 2nd, at the moment 22 points clear of 7th. different times, different circumstances....... I have never understood the fascination with Pearson. For a different set of results on the last day he would have been crucified, well a little bit anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 (edited) You shouldn't be allowed near statistics. Edited 7 May, 2011 by Dark Munster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Nigel Pearson joined saints with us in 18th, 4 places and 6 points above relegation. He finished the season in 20th, 2 places and 2 points above relegation. Nigel Adkins joined saints with us in 22nd, 6 points off 7th, 8 points off 2nd. He finished the season in 2nd, at the moment 22 points clear of 7th. different times, different circumstances but Adkins looks to be the better manager for us to me. I am hopeful that he will be our best manager in last 20 years (there have been 21 in that time! Think with the poor competition he is already pretty high on the list!) Very misleading Stats. Here are some more relevant facts for you; Nige averaged 1.23 points per game while at Saints, an average that is good enough for an upper half finish. He took over a demoralized squad that was sinking like a stone. He turned it around in a short time and made the team very hard to beat (only 3 defeats). Under his leadership Saints finished 2 places above Leicester, who got relegated with a record high number of points ever (for any division in any professional league in the world). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 (edited) I don't think they're very surprising, pretty much everyone knows Pearson's WDL record wasn't great, but it was a damn sight better than his predecessor. More relevant stats (that would probably support the majority view) of Pearson as some kind of miracle worker would compare win percentages from (say) the previous 12 months and the previous 6 matches to see how much of a turnaround was achieved compared to the overall trend I don't think there's much doubt that Adkins took over a hugely better situation than Pearson, and if you want to deal in overly-simplistic stats, how about "Pearson led us to 20th in the Championship (40th overall in the League), Adkins has never taken Saints higher than 2nd in League One (46th)" ? maybe it would be fairer to compare the 6 games before and after Pearson to show the turn around he achieved in our league form: 6 games before, 2 wins in 6, 33% 6 games after, 1 win in 6, 17% ! can't be bothered to do 12 months before but most of that was Burley who had over 40% wins. you are right, Pearson led us to 20th in CCC. But if he had carried on at same rate we would have been out of football league in about 6 years, Adkins will have us winning prem in 3 Edited 6 May, 2011 by NickG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Very misleading Stats. Here are some more relevant facts for you; Nige averaged 1.23 points per game while at Saints, an average that is good enough for an upper half finish. He took over a demoralized squad that was sinking like a stone. He turned it around in a short time and made the team very hard to beat (only 3 defeats). Under his leadership Saints finished 2 places above Leicester, who got relegated with a record high number of points ever (for any division in any professional league in the world). I make it 1.14 points per game which over season would have been bottom three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 thanks Like many things, I think you may have misinterpreted the meaning of QED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 whoosh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 6 May, 2011 Share Posted 6 May, 2011 Let's be honest here. Anyone who took over the squad we have and had 41 games and failed to get us up would be a pretty crap manager no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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