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Is it okay for Saints players to dive and cheat?


the stain

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This from the person who was rigidly questioning me because my opinion was different from his!!

 

Its called a message board, for opinions! I gave mine and asked yours, strike me down!! I asked (twice) what reason you thought it was that Rodriguez fell to the ground if it wasn't a dive. I didn't notice an answer, by the way.

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Its called a message board, for opinions! I gave mine and asked yours, strike me down!! I asked (twice) what reason you thought it was that Rodriguez fell to the ground if it wasn't a dive. I didn't notice an answer, by the way.

And my OPINION is that he did not dive. Why do I have to justify my OPINION to you??

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And my OPINION is that he did not dive. Why do I have to justify my OPINION to you??

 

You don't. I just thought it was a simple question to ask. If Rodriguez didn't dive, why do you think he ended up on the ground?

 

Like I said earlier, if you don't want to answer that simple question, that's fine. You don't have to justify anything to anyone. Its just a bit easier when you do, when discussing things on an internet forum so that people can see what you do think. It kind of encourages discussion, really. But never mind.

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Putting it in CAPITAL letters doesn't mean you're right. I suppose his falling over thin air was to try and win a throw in was it?

 

Photographs now showing....HE WAS PUSHED AND SHOVED TO THE GROUND...

 

yes i am right on this incident but not sure re the gk on puncheon...ALTHOUGH I THINK THE GK TAKES PUNCHEON BEFORE THE CONTACT WITH THE BALL..

 

REFEREE HALSEY GAVE A PENALTY AS WELL SO HE MAKES ME RIGHT ABOUT SOMETHING...

 

HERE ARE SOME PICTURES FOR YOU..:p:p:p:p

 

 

 

i MIGHT BE WRONG BUT THE REF IS NEVER WRONG;)

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You don't. I just thought it was a simple question to ask. If Rodriguez didn't dive, why do you think he ended up on the ground?

 

Like I said earlier, if you don't want to answer that simple question, that's fine. You don't have to justify anything to anyone. Its just a bit easier when you do, when discussing things on an internet forum so that people can see what you do think. It kind of encourages discussion, really. But never mind.

OK. You think that he dived, I think that he didn`t. Why do you think that he did?

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Photographs now showing....HE WAS PUSHED AND SHOVED TO THE GROUND...

 

yes i am right on this incident but not sure re the gk on puncheon...ALTHOUGH I THINK THE GK TAKES PUNCHEON BEFORE THE CONTACT WITH THE BALL..

 

REFEREE HALSEY GAVE A PENALTY AS WELL SO HE MAKES ME RIGHT ABOUT SOMETHING...

 

HERE ARE SOME PICTURES FOR YOU..:p:p:p:p

 

 

 

i MIGHT BE WRONG BUT THE REF IS NEVER WRONG;)

 

Lol. But you are entirely wrong, it was a dive. And I'm currently drinking to the three points it earned.

 

Ps, doing block capitals on an iPad is tediously slow so can we give it a rest?

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I think that Saints are at the top of (or very close to) the fair play league !

Unlike most managers Nigel never criticises refs when things go against him so it's surely fair that he keeps his counsel when the reverse happens ? I don't imagine that our players are coached to cheat and when incidents like this (occasionally) happen we have to put it down to experience ! I'm equally sure that Nigel will have a word with him to ensure that it does not become the norm !

There will no doubt be a negative analysis on MoTD and JRod will be castigated but this will be short lived and we will all move on to the next controversy which will be waiting just around the corner !!

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OK. You think that he dived, I think that he didn`t. Why do you think that he did?

 

I think he dived to try and make it look like he'd been fouled and to win a penalty. After he touched the ball past the defender his natural instinct was not to try to carry on, to hurdle the challenge while trying to run onto the ball. It was to swing his leg back and drop theatrically to the floor (he didn't stumble or knock himself off balance, just fell to the ground), where he remained completely prostrate for a few seconds instead of trying to get up and carry on after realising he hadn't been touched.

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Dived or not , who gives a f uck girls, it happens all the time and as it got us 3 valuable points i really don't care, who will remember that come may? jesus who pulled your tampon strings tonight? i bet there's not this much fuss when such decisions go against us, strange breed on here :rolleyes:

 

But..Rameriz got out of jail with the penalty award, his little dink towards an open goal that failed completely would have been the main topic on here if it wasn't for the pen.

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So, in your opinion, he went down to avoid the tackle/getting injured. Is that a fair assumption?

Possibly. I think that it was one of those situations that if it had happened anywhere else on the pitch wouldn`t have resulted in any decision from the ref. I think that JRod and the defender just came together and it ended up with JRod on the floor. It was the ref that ballsed up but JRod seems to be getting it in the neck as a cheater which I think is unfair. If it was a blatant dive I would condemn it straight away.

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Dived or not , who gives a f uck girls, it happens all the time and as it got us 3 valuable points i really don't care, who will remember that come may? jesus who pulled your tampon strings tonight? i bet there's not this much fuss when such decisions go against us, strange breed on here :rolleyes:

 

But..Rameriz got out of jail with the penalty award, his little dink towards an open goal that failed completely would have been the main topic on here if it wasn't for the pen.

 

Ha yeah, i noticed that as well. Terrible effort.

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Possibly. I think that it was one of those situations that if it had happened anywhere else on the pitch wouldn`t have resulted in any decision from the ref. I think that JRod and the defender just came together and it ended up with JRod on the floor. It was the ref that ballsed up but JRod seems to be getting it in the neck as a cheater which I think is unfair. If it was a blatant dive I would condemn it straight away.

 

But JRod and the defender did NOT come together.......there was about two feet of space between them. You sure you've seen the replays??

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seen it live, and all the replays. amazing, it's a foul even if theres no contact, if head left his foot in it cud have been bad, and he doesn't look for it, compared with some of the lying down rolling around I've seen this year it s nice our players dont try n con the ref.

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No you are quite right. I am wrong and my opinion counts for nothing. I have had enough of trying to justify my OPINION! Enjoy the rest of the week-end.

 

Ah come on mate. Of course you are entitled to your opinion. I am just staggered that you have come to this conclusion. I am genuinely interested to know how you have seen something so different to what I have.

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Ah come on mate. Of course you are entitled to your opinion. I am just staggered that you have come to this conclusion. I am genuinely interested to know how you have seen something so different to what I have.

"I am genuinely interested to know how you have seen something so different to what I have."

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No you are quite right. I am wrong and my opinion counts for nothing. I have had enough of trying to justify my OPINION! Enjoy the rest of the week-end.

 

With respect (and I'll leave it here as despite asking me to clarify my position, you quite clearly don't want to do the same despite being repeatedly asked); what you have done is consistently stated your opinion, but not justified it. Its your opinion and you're welcome to it; it would just have been nice to know how and why you came to that opinion. Why you felt Rodriguez came to end up on the floor (a slip? a stumble? getting out of the way? fell over?) other than a "coming together with the defender" of which there was clearly no contact.

 

Very strange, but never mind. You don't think it was a dive, that'll do.

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With respect (and I'll leave it here as despite asking me to clarify my position, you quite clearly don't want to do the same despite being repeatedly asked); what you have done is consistently stated your opinion, but not justified it. Its your opinion and you're welcome to it; it would just have been nice to know how and why you came to that opinion. Why you felt Rodriguez came to end up on the floor (a slip? a stumble? getting out of the way? fell over?) other than a "coming together with the defender" of which there was clearly no contact.

 

Very strange, but never mind. You don't think it was a dive, that'll do.

Thank you.

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Not at all surprising to see Paul Lambert complaining about the bad decision. If I was him I would be far more concerned about his centre backs putting in such rash tackles. Watching it again, whether J-Rod dived or was just pulling his foot out of the way is kind of irrelevant... The tackle from the defender was nowhere near the ball and had J-Rod not reacted to it then it would have been an absolute stonewall penalty, as he would have been in a potential goalscoring position. It's entirely possible that's why the ref gave it in fact.

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After all the replays, it still looks to me like J Rod pulled his leg away from a legbreaker. How the ref calls it is up to the ref. If J Rod had kept his foot in to avoid being accused of diving and got himself injured, would we all feel better about it?

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Having looked at it several times it is a dive, he pulls his leg away and goes down. However, he'd also knocked the ball past the defender and if he doesn't pull his leg away there will be contact and it would have been a pen. The defender isn't getting the ball, If Rodriguez doesn't pull his leg away he gets caught.

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Having looked at it several times it is a dive, he pulls his leg away and goes down. However, he'd also knocked the ball past the defender and if he doesn't pull his leg away there will be contact and it would have been a pen. The defender isn't getting the ball, If Rodriguez doesn't pull his leg away he gets caught.

 

Agreed. I can accept the argument that he saw the challenge coming and pulled his leg away as a consequence. I can't accept that moving his right leg away caused him to hit the ground in the manner that he did; from the gif above you can clearly see that both legs totally give way and he throws himself to the ground. If he genuinely pulled away his leg and lost balance, his left leg would have at least tried to stumble on. He didn't, he chose to fall to the ground and its therefore a dive.

 

No mention of the pen being given for the first challenge on MOTD.

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Agreed. I can accept the argument that he saw the challenge coming and pulled his leg away as a consequence. I can't accept that moving his right leg away caused him to hit the ground in the manner that he did; from the gif above you can clearly see that both legs totally give way and he throws himself to the ground. If he genuinely pulled away his leg and lost balance, his left leg would have at least tried to stumble on. He didn't, he chose to fall to the ground and its therefore a dive.

 

No mention of the pen given for the first challenge on MOTD.

 

That wasn't a pen either, Guzan got the ball first. It was strange, 606 said that the info they had from the ref was it was given for the 'foul' on Rodriguez. Then Halsey said it was for the 'foul' on Puncheon according to twitter.

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Having looked at it several times it is a dive, he pulls his leg away and goes down. However, he'd also knocked the ball past the defender and if he doesn't pull his leg away there will be contact and it would have been a pen. The defender isn't getting the ball, If Rodriguez doesn't pull his leg away he gets caught.

 

 

And the more I look at it the worse it could have been if he hadnt pulled away from it, the defender was flying in. I honestly cant see how Rodriguez can be criticised for that one, it had to be instinctive self-preservation imho.

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And the more I look at it the worse it could have been if he hadnt pulled away from it, the defender was flying in. I honestly cant see how Rodriguez can be criticised for that one, it had to be instinctive self-preservation imho.

 

Looking at the gif above of it (post #180) how would you answer these two questions:

 

1) After JRod has pulled his leg away, do you think he could have placed it on the ground rather than continuing to move it backwards and then falling over forwards?

2) Do you think the movement of pulling his right leg away also caused his left leg to lose all power in it and therefore be unable to make a step with that one?

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Looking at the gif above of it (post #180) how would you answer these two questions:

 

1) After JRod has pulled his leg away, do you think he could have placed it on the ground rather than continuing to move it backwards and then falling over forwards?

2) Do you think the movement of pulling his right leg away also caused his left leg to lose all power in it and therefore be unable to make a step with that one?

 

In this case the left leg doesn't matter. Merely having to take avoiding action with the right can be considered enough for a foul.

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In this case the left leg doesn't matter. Merely having to take avoiding action with the right can be considered enough for a foul.

 

I'm not talking about in the context of whether it was a penalty or not. I'm just wondering if scotty (and others) think that the action of Rodriguez moving his right leg to avoid contact was enough to make him lose all balance and send him to the floor without being able to take one more step with either foot.

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I'm not talking about in the context of whether it was a penalty or not. I'm just wondering if scotty (and others) think that the action of Rodriguez moving his right leg to avoid contact was enough to make him lose all balance and send him to the floor without being able to take one more step with either foot.

 

Fair enough. It just looked like self-preservation to me.

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And the more I look at it the worse it could have been if he hadnt pulled away from it, the defender was flying in. I honestly cant see how Rodriguez can be criticised for that one, it had to be instinctive self-preservation imho.

 

I don't understand this point of view. There was no fast sliding lunge for the ball. If that was the case then you could understand it. But they were at very slow pace and the guy just tried to get a toe poke in from a standing position. No different from nearly every tackle you see everywhere else on the pitch. Football is a contact sport...

 

It was a clear dive. His movement was not natural and there was no danger to him. If he thinks there was then he needs to quit football for his own safety. Puncheon getting taken out by the keeper was far more dangerous and that was good keeping.

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Fair enough. It just looked like self-preservation to me.

 

Indeed, there's maybe an element of that. I'm just interested to see if people think that, after initially pulling his leg away, Rodriguez really was so off balance that he was unable to plant either foot onto the turf to try to stay on his feet.

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Agreed. I can accept the argument that he saw the challenge coming and pulled his leg away as a consequence. I can't accept that moving his right leg away caused him to hit the ground in the manner that he did; from the gif above you can clearly see that both legs totally give way and he throws himself to the ground. If he genuinely pulled away his leg and lost balance, his left leg would have at least tried to stumble on. He didn't, he chose to fall to the ground and its therefore a dive.

 

No mention of the pen being given for the first challenge on MOTD.

 

Again, depends how you see it. If you look where his trailing leg is when he plays the ball, he can't jump forward out of the tackle because he's already at full stretch. The only way to move his right foot out of the way of the tackle is backwards, and given the position of his other foot (almost on tiptoe) it's no surprise he went over like a sack of potatoes.

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Again, depends how you see it. If you look where his trailing leg is when he plays the ball, he can't jump forward out of the tackle because he's already at full stretch. The only way to move his right foot out of the way of the tackle is backwards, and given the position of his other foot (almost on tiptoe) it's no surprise he went over like a sack of potatoes.

 

So you think he was so off balance that he had no chance in trying to plant either foot on the turf? Fair enough.

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