I'd rather have Martin than Still.

[skintsaint]

4 minutes ago, Football Special said:

It's not just one loss, we've been rubbish in every game I've seen

 

Battered Wrexham, yeah give you the Ipswich game we were lucky to come away with a point, should have won today with a decent striker. So...yeah brittle fans.

If fans expected us to smash every team so early in the season after last year, with a bloated crap squad then I have news for you.

[Football Special]

1 minute ago, skintsaint said:

Battered Wrexham, yeah give you the Ipswich game we were lucky to come away with a point, should have won today with a decent striker. So...yeah brittle fans.

If fans expected us to smash every team so early in the season after last year, with a bloated crap squad then I have news for you.

We didn't batter Wrexham. Should have been 5-5 , we were all over the place at times and the fact their finishing was bad was a blessing 

[Osvaldorama]

3 minutes ago, skintsaint said:

Battered Wrexham, yeah give you the Ipswich game we were lucky to come away with a point, should have won today with a decent striker. So...yeah brittle fans.

If fans expected us to smash every team so early in the season after last year, with a bloated crap squad then I have news for you.

I don’t think anyone is expecting us to smash every team. 

But to lose to 10 men, at home, with our budget vs theirs is genuinely a fucking embarrassment. 
 

I know we are used to being embarrassed by this football club now, but that doesn’t mean it’s not true. 

[Badger]

I wasn’t convinced by the appointment but you can’t lay todays fiasco at Still’s door.
 

Again poor recruitment, and no strikers of note, plus several duds he’s inherited in the squad are not down to him. 

Five at the back, and playing AA up front,  is his choosing but until the close of the window I’d give him the benefit of any doubt over reasons for this. 

[SW11_Saint]

4 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Still is a big let down (so far)

very inflexible 

🙄

[Osvaldorama]

Just now, Badger said:

I wasn’t convinced by the appointment but you can’t lay todays fiasco at Still’s door.
 

Again poor recruitment, and no strikers of note, plus several duds he’s inherited in the squad are not down to him. 

Five at the back, and playing AA up front,  is his choosing but until the close of the window I’d give him the benefit of any doubt over reasons for this. 

We can lay this at his door. 

[Badger]

1 minute ago, Osvaldorama said:

We can lay this at his door. 

Yes, but I’d give him some leeway on the tactic if he believes the FBs are unable to play as he wants in a back 4.

AA is a poor selection upfront. But having seen the other donkeys in the second half you can see why he might have been tempted by AA. Just hope he doesn’t persist with it because about 28,000 people at St Mary’s today could tell him - it doesn’t work. 

[Lighthouse]

If nothing else Martin knew to stick Adams front and centre, Armstrong out wide and managed to get just shy of 40 goals from the pair of them.

It’s early days but things have got to start getting better than this pretty quickly. We’ve got DD, Archer, BBD or Stewart to play up there with Armstrong. You can argue to toss as to whether they are good enough individually but every man and his dog has always known that going for none of the above and putting AA up top alone is the stupidest option.

[Harry_SFC]

4 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

If nothing else Martin knew to stick Adams front and centre, Armstrong out wide and managed to get just shy of 40 goals from the pair of them.

It’s early days but things have got to start getting better than this pretty quickly. We’ve got DD, Archer, BBD or Stewart to play up there with him, you can argue to toss as to whether they good enough individually but every man and his dog has always known that going for none of the above and putting AA up top alone is the stupidest option.

You described the problem straight away. We don't have Adams anymore. Despite a number of critics, none of our current strikers seem to be able to offer us what he did. 

Edited 5 hours ago by Harry_SFC

[AlexLaw76]

5 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

You described the problem straight away. We don't have Adams anymore. Despite a number of critics, none of our current strikers seem to be able to offer us what he did. 

Not having Adams does should not mean we have to play 6+ defensive players (in a 3 at the back set up) with Armstrong as the lone striker

Edited 5 hours ago by AlexLaw76

[S-Clarke]

2 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

You described the problem straight away. We don't have Adams anymore. 

Compared to our last squad in the Championship, we are so far apart quality wise it's untrue. I don't know why people say we're stronger.

We had Adams, Stu Armstrong, Aribo, KWP, Brooks, Tella (for a part of August), Charly, Sullemana. I class KWP as an attacker as he was crucial in everything we did down the right side.

Compare that to our offerings now, OK Suelamana was shit, but even so it's light years behind. Somehow we've got to bring our level up to that.

[LGTL]

1 minute ago, S-Clarke said:

Compared to our last squad in the Championship, we are so far apart quality wise it's untrue. I don't know why people say we're stronger.

We had Adams, Stu Armstrong, Aribo, KWP, Brooks, Tella (for a part of August), Charly, Sullemana. I class KWP as an attacker as he was crucial in everything we did down the right side.

Compare that to our offerings now, OK Suelamana was shit, but even so it's light years behind. Somehow we've got to bring our level up to that.

Indeed. We must be one of the few clubs in history to have got promoted and somehow made our squad worse! Incredible really. 

[Harry_SFC]

2 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Not having Adams does should not mean we have to play 6+ defensive players with Armstrong as the lone striker

I do agree but just trying to add balance. The options he's got are crap. 

[S-Clarke]

1 minute ago, LGTL said:

Indeed. We must be one of the few clubs in history to have got promoted and somehow made our squad worse! Incredible really. 

It's mental really when you think about it. We used promotion to regress our squad.

Bizarre.

[Lighthouse]

4 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

You described the problem straight away. We don't have Adams anymore. Despite a number of critics, none of our current strikers seem to be able to offer us what he did. 

We have five very different strikers, four of which have proven to be very capable at this level in the past. Che Adams was not some kind of superstar that you can’t get promoted without. If Still can’t get goals out of those players then we have a serious problem because they would get a game for 90% of teams in this league.

[CSA96]

5 hours ago, benjii said:

That's all.

I spy with my little eye, something beginning with shortsighted, histrionic moron

Edited 5 hours ago by CSA96

[Harry_SFC]

Just now, Lighthouse said:

We have five very different strikers, four of which have proven to be very capable at this level in the past. Che Adams was not some kind of superstar that you can’t get promoted without. If Still can’t get goals out of those players then we have a serious problem because they would get a game for 90% of teams in this league.

Tbh I couldn't care less what they've done in the past. I've seen them play for us for long enough to say they are terrible. 

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

1 minute ago, Harry_SFC said:

You described the problem straight away. We don't have Adams anymore. 

But we do have others who can lay off the ball. I still think Archer can do Adams' job. Possibly Stewart. 

There's something about this squad that ekes mid table Championship. Matty Fernandez is arguably our stand out player but he's doing a good job of dissuading potential investors. Can't see who else there is from which we build the spine of a team - THB, Shea Charles?  

Also do hope Will Still goes to a back 4 soon. Understand his reasoning why he hasn't but he need to show he can adapt.

[Gloucester Saint]

4 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

We have five very different strikers, four of which have proven to be very capable at this level in the past. Che Adams was not some kind of superstar that you can’t get promoted without. If Still can’t get goals out of those players then we have a serious problem because they would get a game for 90% of teams in this league.

It’s the combination of them as others are saying. What we needed badly was a link up striker who could physically occupy centre backs. What we got was a £8m project with a first touch like Carlton Palmer. So take two on the hunt for that striker. And yes, it means at least one or more of BBD, AA or the others will be making way even if it’s on loan and Dragan writes off yet more money.

Edited 4 hours ago by Gloucester Saint

[AlexLaw76]

6 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

We have five very different strikers, four of which have proven to be very capable at this level in the past. Che Adams was not some kind of superstar that you can’t get promoted without. If Still can’t get goals out of those players then we have a serious problem because they would get a game for 90% of teams in this league.

Going into that season, Adams was very much wanted OUT by many, after a pretty horrible season when we were relegated. 

[Lighthouse]

7 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

We had Adams, Stu Armstrong, Aribo, KWP, Brooks, Tella (for a part of August), Charly, Sullemana. I class KWP as an attacker as he was crucial in everything we did down the right side

We have Archer, BBD, Fernandes, Robinson and Edwards. Plus Charles is clearly a much better player and Stewart is actually available for selection. They’re easily comparable in quality to the players you’ve listed.

I couldn’t say definitively which squad is better but we’re not miles apart in terms of quality in the way you suggest. Including Tella is odd, he had already left by this time two years ago. If you’re going to say that then I’ll include Dibling.

[S-Clarke]

2 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

We have Archer, BBD, Fernandes, Robinson and Edwards. Plus Charles is clearly a much better player and Stewart is actually available for selection. They’re easily comparable in quality to the players you’ve listed.

I couldn’t say definitively which squad is better but we’re not miles apart in terms of quality in the way you suggest. Including Tella is odd, he had already left by this time two years ago. If you’re going to say that then I’ll include Dibling.

Archer, BBD are much, much, much less quality than we had in that season. Stewart too.

BBD isn't really a footballer as far as I'm aware, he's not proven it yet.

I'd 110% categorically say that our squad at this stage in the last Champ season was stronger than the one we have today.

I included Tella because he'd contributed two goals before he left, two of which were match winners - so he was important, even for the small period.

Edited 4 hours ago by S-Clarke

[Lighthouse]

9 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

Tbh I couldn't care less what they've done in the past. I've seen them play for us for long enough to say they are terrible. 

Then at least play the ‘terrible’ players in a good system. Have BBD central, AA out wide and at least have something to stick to up front.

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, S-Clarke said:

Archer, BBD are much, much, much less quality than we had in that season. Stewart too.

BBD isn't really a footballer as far as I'm aware, he's not proven it yet.

I'd 110% categorically say that our squad at this stage in the last Champ season was stronger than the one we have today.

Adams, although good in our least season down, was a figure of fun until the season started. 

[S-Clarke]

Just now, AlexLaw76 said:

Adams, although good in our least season down, was a figure of fun until the season started. 

Still a better profile of player than we have available to us today though, you'd have to say.

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, S-Clarke said:

Still a better profile of player than we have available to us today though, you'd have to say.

he was good that season.

It is something like Stuart Armstrong going forward, albeit he was a bit injury prone. 

However, for all Russell martin's twattyness, he did not play Arma as a lone striker with 5 defenders. 

[Badger]

3 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Adams, although good in our least season down, was a figure of fun until the season started. 

Wolves away. Goal line miss.

Might explain it. 

[Morse]

4 hours ago, Sir Ralph said:

People losing the plot after one defeat. The guy has been successful at 4 clubs but you cant expect us to be brilliant straight off. We clearly need 2-3 good attacking players as, other than Robinson, the rest of the forwards look terrible. He needs the window to be finished and then at least give him a few weeks with any new players.

What four clubs are those, and what was the success at each? 

[Fabrice29]

1 minute ago, AlexLaw76 said:

However, for all Russell martin's twattyness, he did not play Arma as a lone striker with 5 defenders. 

In fairness, he did that in the play off final and people thought we should have played that way more.

[Lighthouse]

1 minute ago, S-Clarke said:

Still a better profile of player than we have available to us today though, you'd have to say.

Well, I for one wouldn’t. More to the point, collectively I’d definitely take the front four options we have now over him and Mara. It’s really not acceptable that none of them are scoring.

[Sir Ralph]

4 minutes ago, Morse said:

What four clubs are those, and what was the success at each? 

See his Wiki profile with regards to the Belgium clubs and what I said above about the French clubs. He hasnt won anything but his spells were seen as generally successful as I understand it. You should listen to some of the interviews / podcasts about it to make your own mind up, which is how I arrived at my own conclusions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Will_Still

Edited 4 hours ago by Sir Ralph

[Gloucester Saint]

5 hours ago, trousers said:

If you don't rate Still and would rather have Martin back, that's like saying you'd rather step in cat shit rather than dog shit. Whilst it's obviously far too early to write off Still, the more apt thread title would've been: "I'd rather have someone else than Still or Martin"... 

Dog shit generally is larger and smells worse, but agree that I’d rather not step in at all…

[Fabrice29]

We are playing a completely different way to the Championship last time. Not sure it's fair to say we are so far away in terms of quality for that season. Think most would take Fernandes and Charles over Aribo and Smallbone for example and you need to give Downs a season or two before comparing his figures to Adams. But because we're playing a completely different style then different qualities are needed. Armstrong is nullified playing this way, Adams gone and our third top scorer (Smallbone) is injured/not rated. We need to recruit for this manager.

We are absolutely desperate for players who have a drive to get into the box and be a presence. Crossing the ball to a tiny striker with tiny attacking wide players joining them is not viable. Buy a 10 and buy wide players who are a presence in the box.

Edited 4 hours ago by Fabrice29

[Coastal]

6 hours ago, benjii said:

That's all.

Agreed, for all Martin's faults he wasn't sufficiently backed by the board and was a convenient scapegoat.

This Still fella looks a turkey.

Edited 4 hours ago by Coastal

[die Mannyschaft]

1 hour ago, Football Special said:

As a fanbase I think we really have given the Sports Republic clowns an easy ride, they'd have got a lot more abuse at most clubs, however lose to Pompey and I think the gloves will be off and they'll have to develop a thick skin 

We have more chance of losing v Pompey than just even drawing. RM playing at back and risky passing, 400 to 700 passes then opposition just boot ball in box or run through entire team is just ridiculous to copy. May as well have RM back. Crosses to smallest players! Lose to Pompey and that indicates the level of the club we are at. 

[Gloucester Saint]

1 hour ago, Football Special said:

As a fanbase I think we really have given the Sports Republic clowns an easy ride, they'd have got a lot more abuse at most clubs, however lose to Pompey and I think the gloves will be off and they'll have to develop a thick skin 

It will go 2008/9 toxic and SR will have to sell and find a new main club for their group. Otherwise it will overwhelm their whole group.

The players will not enjoy playing at SMS for the rest of the season especially if somebody misses an open goal or makes a really stupid error late on.

Still knows it and that’s what he was very clear that is a must-win game. It’s a big game on national TV and the players need be 💯 up for it and want to play themselves into the first XI for it. Anyone who isn’t needs to be loaned out next week as Southampton Football Club is not for them. 

[SW11_Saint]

8 minutes ago, Coastal said:

Agreed, for all Martin's faults he wasn't sufficiently backed by the board and was a convenient scapegoat.

This Still fella looks a turkey.

The revisionism is astounding, as is writing off a young manager, with a deficient squad, after just three games. Get a grip…

[Gloucester Saint]

Just now, SW11_Saint said:

The revisionism is astounding, as is writing off a young manager, with a deficient squad, after just three games. Get a grip…

Not sure judging by the Dibling thread that he’s a Saints fan, many suspect Everton.

Although a poster in here who was on the misery side during the heyday of Adkins/Poch/Ronald stopped posting recently, so could be him under a new name.

[Toussaint]

6 hours ago, Osvaldorama said:

I’d rather have Mark Robins than either. 

We couldn’t do that, we are way too clever to employ a proven manager that knows the league. 

[S-Clarke]

1 minute ago, Toussaint said:

We couldn’t do that, we are way too clever to employ a proven manager that knows the league. 

Just to avoid re-writing history slightly, and proof that everyone needs time, when Robins first went in at Stoke he struggled. Their fans were questioning him and believed he was the wrong choice.

But people need time.

And still, it's only 3 games so who knows who will be sat where in May.

[warsash saint]

Only on Saintsweb!!!

 

[Osvaldorama]

2 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

We have Archer, BBD, Fernandes, Robinson and Edwards. Plus Charles is clearly a much better player and Stewart is actually available for selection. They’re easily comparable in quality to the players you’ve listed.

I couldn’t say definitively which squad is better but we’re not miles apart in terms of quality in the way you suggest. Including Tella is odd, he had already left by this time two years ago. If you’re going to say that then I’ll include Dibling.

I can definitively say. 

 

The previous squad was way better. We progressively get fucking worse under these helmets. 
I would trade all of our current strikers for Che - and I didn’t even rate him that highly.
But at least he could actually control a football and win the ball. Then bring others into play. All these lot do is give the ball away and miss open goals .. it’s fucking embarrassing.

To be honest, the main thing that is making me furious is the fact that the new manager is making the exact same mistakes as before. 

I honestly would prefer if he came in and played 4-4-2 with archer and downs together or something. At least it would be new. Instead it’s just more of the same fucking shite, trying to be too clever with a shit 5 at the back formation, passing it sideways, pinging crosses into no one…

PLAY TO YOUR PLAYERS’ STRENGTHS. FFS. 

Edited 2 hours ago by Osvaldorama

[Wade Garrett]

8 hours ago, benjii said:

4 matches. Zero good 90 minutes.

Idiotic line ups.

No obvious clue with the ball.

Doesn't know his best defence.

Better than that fucking fraud Martin then.

[Wade Garrett]

I hope Still is demanding what players he wants from Spors rather than just accept the absolute shite he has been given up to now.

 

[LoyalSaintSO50]

Still seems way too laid back to demand anything and hence we’re miles off it. Stoke been active and better team today whilst our new signings were 2 off the bench ffs 

7 minutes ago, Wade Garrett said:

I hope Still is demanding what players he wants from Spors rather than just accept the absolute shite he has been given up to