doddisalegend Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Really ? so you think without the cr*p last pre-season and Pardew leaving after Rovers game instead of on June 1st, that beating Brightion to 1st place would have still been beyond us ? It was 3 pts in it at the end . Only one f**ked up game from that starting half-dozen needed to be different.... Exactly 3 pts despite the terrible pre-season which goes to prove pre-season had very little effect doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustMike Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Alps...players havent even reported back for pre-season yet but still you are moaning about a lack of transfer activity. The big difference this year is we have a good squad that will need maybe 2 or 3 quality added to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Exactly 3 pts despite the terrible pre-season which goes to prove pre-season had very little effect doesn't it? We were the best team in the league by a long way and finished 2nd. That is underachievement to my mind. EDIT : That doesnt mean I am any less chuffed about being promoted... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Alps...players havent even reported back for pre-season yet but still you are moaning about a lack of transfer activity. I dont see the relation between the two things. Are we expecting Ricky Lambert to jump ship and go and work on an oil rig in Alaska, or something ? NA and NC know who is coming back, and should have identified what they need for next season already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 The problem I have with the opposing view in this case is that there is plenty of time for our squad to be depleted still. I consider it highly unlikely that all 3 from Morgan, Lallana and AO-C will be here come Leeds kick-off. So to say we can make do for a while with what we've got is a bit previous. Especially considering our form for leaving trasnfer activity too late. Where is this form of leaving transfer activity too late? Last season we signed Ryan Dickson on 10th June, Frazer Richardson on 6th July and Danny Butterfield on 17th July? Guly then arrived on 23rd August. We then signed Richard Chaplow and Jonathan Forte in the winter window (Chaplow after an initial loan), plus Dany N'Guessan on loan. None of whom went on to establish themselves as a first team regular. Which of those signings were too late? Our pre-season last season was a shambles and the Pardew effect very de-stabilising on our early season form. But how do you manage to blame it all on our incoming transfers being made too late? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikee Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 aaaaahhh - the annual Alps in premature ejaculation thread shocker. As usual the OP makes no sense at all as we still have time to sign all of our key players before pre-season training starts, but of course Alps couldn't wait until then as there might not be anything to moan about..... it seems to be the current culture where it is easier to moan about what might happen than debate what has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericofarabia Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Our bad starts owe little to transfer activity, p!ss poor preparation etc - more to do with me being back in the UK:? I'm normally back home for the first few weeks of the season, and barely ever get to see a win - although I was at Coventry the last time we won an opening day fixture. Admittedly most of the games I manage to get to are away games, and back in The Prem days that meant the northern games like Liverpool, Everton, Man U etc so there is a bit of an excuse there tbh!! Most of the games I've seen over the last few years have been drawshome and away, but the team just dodesn't seem to get going till I leave the UK. This year will be a bit of a tester as I won't be back until Sept 6th - so if we haven't rcaked up a few wins by then, it could be a tough September!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitzhugh Fella Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Do you remember the days clubs would sign a "name" just to boost season ticket sales? When we signed Osgood the next home gate was about 10,000 up and a percentage of his fee immediately covered. Those were the days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cabrone Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Exactly 3 pts despite the terrible pre-season which goes to prove pre-season had very little effect doesn't it? It certainly did. Instead of hitting the ground running and taking control from an early stage we spent the entire season playing catchup and it wasn't until the 2nd to last game that we finally overcame our usual crap start. The difference between us (got there eventually) and Brighton (won at a canter) was our start. Anyway, what is wrong with wanting a good start for once? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 It certainly did. Instead of hitting the ground running and taking control from an early stage we spent the entire season playing catchup and it wasn't until the 2nd to last game that we finally overcame our usual crap start. The difference between us (got there eventually) and Brighton (won at a canter) was our start. Anyway, what is wrong with wanting a good start for once? Indeed, I reckon some of fans would get bored if we had a good start... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hopkins Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Do you remember the days clubs would sign a "name" just to boost season ticket sales? When we signed Osgood the next home gate was about 10,000 up and a percentage of his fee immediately covered. Those were the days! Quite glad were away from the days of signing someone because they are a "name" myself. Ticket sales will be boosted by good results. Regardless of the success of Osgood or whoever, signing a "name" doesn't equal success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 I dont see the relation between the two things. Because they don't report back for training until early July, it matters not if new players were signed two weeks ago, or in the next two weeks. Either way they aren't going to start training until July. Also you don't know that Saints haven't already signed players that will be announced in July when their contracts run out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Also you don't know that Saints haven't already signed players that will be announced in July when their contracts run out. True, but I wouldnt put money on it. Regards your first point, I still dont see that having pre-season training running is a pre-requesite for signing players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 True, but I wouldnt put money on it. Why not? What is that view based on? Regards your first point, I still dont see that having pre-season training running is a pre-requesite for signing players. My point was that it matters not if you buy a player on the 4th June or 25th of June. You gain no benefit as none of the players you sign will train together until July. It is the 17th June today, still two weeks left to sign players so that they all have a full pre-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildgoose Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 I dont see the relation between the two things. Are we expecting Ricky Lambert to jump ship and go and work on an oil rig in Alaska, or something ? NA and NC know who is coming back, and should have identified what they need for next season already. How do we know they haven't? Nothing is going to happen about the squad gelling before pre-season training begins so do we have to sign players just to stop us fans from getting frustrated??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Billy Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 (edited) Well there seems to be plenty of transfer activity elsewhere. I have to agree with Alps on this to some extent especially when there is no guarantee that we wont lose any of our current squad to bigger and better clubs. I know the club now likes to do these things behind closed doors but some message of intent would be nice to hear especially when you consider that not much of the 5 year plan is left and surely NA and NC do not believe that our current squad is equipped enough to threaten promotion. Hopefully the reason for not dipping into the market yet is not lack of funds! Edited 17 June, 2011 by Saint Billy typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 My point was that it matters not if you buy a player on the 4th June or 25th of June. You gain no benefit as none of the players you sign will train together until July. It is the 17th June today, still two weeks left to sign players so that they all have a full pre-season. How do we know they haven't? Nothing is going to happen about the squad gelling before pre-season training begins so do we have to sign players just to stop us fans from getting frustrated??? OK, so you both think "moaning" is justified if we havent signed anyone in 2 weeks time when pre-season training starts, do you ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 OK, so you both think "moaning" is justified if we havent signed anyone in 2 weeks time when pre-season training starts, do you ? Nope, I'll give you permission to moan about lack of signings in mid July. July 15th to be exact. Until then, we should just wait and see what happens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenevaSaint Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Alps we have a **** start most years, I'm sure we've signed players those seasons. Not sure why but Saints are ALWAYS slow starters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenevaSaint Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Anyway, there's not a huge amount of activity at the moment, and the way Cortese works we may well have players already lined up...do you not agree? Why shout the odds about players signing for us when the deal could be hijacked by another club. TBH, I think the skates were mad making noises about Norris as they could've looked right ****s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintBobby Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 We were the best team in the league by a long way and finished 2nd. That is underachievement to my mind. EDIT : That doesnt mean I am any less chuffed about being promoted... That's quite a staggering U turn in your analysis from what you were actually saying last season. You had a string of complaints about the team's weaknesses and predicted, endlessly, that we'd only make the play offs. What changed your mind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merrimd Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Its simple logic that so many seem to have a trouble grasping. Instead, they grasp at convoluted "what ifs" about who might later become available or impact on fees for players later, or if Uranus comes into conjunction with Michael Owen's schlong..... The bottom line is, if we have our typical pre-season, everyone will turn up at SMS for Leeds game without a clue as to who the starting XI will be, and will observe a team out-of-steam in 70mins. I think we could all have a pretty good go at naming the starting 11 right now and we would all be pretty close. Lets not kid ourselves, we DO NOT need to change half the team that finished last season like a steam train. Maybe we are not signing anyone because we just dont need too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Alps we have a **** start most years, I'm sure we've signed players those seasons. Not sure why but Saints are ALWAYS slow starters. Well, we've had different players, different managers, different stadia, different owners. The only universal constant has been the fans. And looking at the majority of the comments on here, it seems clear that the fan base doesnt regard a good start as important, and lets the club get away with low expectations at the season start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyNorthernSaints Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Please don't use quote when replying to original poster. Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 I think we could all have a pretty good go at naming the starting 11 right now and we would all be pretty close. Lets not kid ourselves, we DO NOT need to change half the team that finished last season like a steam train. Maybe we are not signing anyone because we just dont need too? I characterise that attitude as the fastest route back to League 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 That's quite a staggering U turn in your analysis from what you were actually saying last season. You had a string of complaints about the team's weaknesses and predicted, endlessly, that we'd only make the play offs. What changed your mind? Erm, results ? promotion ? having more players in the Team of the Season for L1 than Brighton ? Goal difference ? Btw, no team is perfect and is immune to improvement. Even the likes of Ferguson and Wenger would say that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Interesting to me is that Norwich City did all their business in the summer by 15th July and had three in place by 22nd June. I would expect us to have done ours by weeks 2-4 in July (whatever it is we want to do). As things stand, it seems we have at least a month or so to secure the right signings and this in no way should affect our ability to compete. 3 out of the 7 Norwich signed weren't massive regulars either through injury or being used sparingly. Crofts (44 starting apps), Surman (18), Fox (33), Ward (41), Smith (5), Ruddy (46), Jackson (21). The fact that we have a settled squad with very little going out suggests that NA feels we have very good players for the division. Only Gobern is a question mark over moving on due to contract expiry. I expect to see a few signings that will strengthen key areas and so long as those happen by the end of July then that would be fine. Incidentally, Norwich also went into the market in January when it became apparent they could be challenging for play-offs / auto. They also had 10 out pre-season too but not sure if regulars. Not time to press the panic button yet in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Author Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Interesting to me is that Norwich City did all their business in the summer by 15th July and had three in place by 22nd June. I would expect us to have done ours by weeks 2-4 in July (whatever it is we want to do). As things stand, it seems we have at least a month or so to secure the right signings and this in no way should affect our ability to compete. 3 out of the 7 Norwich signed weren't massive regulars either through injury or being used sparingly. Crofts (44 starting apps), Surman (18), Fox (33), Ward (41), Smith (5), Ruddy (46), Jackson (21). The fact that we have a settled squad with very little going out suggests that NA feels we have very good players for the division. Only Gobern is a question mark over moving on due to contract expiry. I expect to see a few signings that will strengthen key areas and so long as those happen by the end of July then that would be fine. Incidentally, Norwich also went into the market in January when it became apparent they could be challenging for play-offs / auto. They also had 10 out pre-season too but not sure if regulars. Not time to press the panic button yet in my opinion. Hell of an assumption you've made there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 July 1st is when clubs start back training after the summer break. The real hard work starting Mon July 4th. Every year despite the optimistic rubbish that comes out of Saints in my memory (57 years) we have rarely started the season with a run of wins. Every year we are still signing players either late into the pre season training or even after the season has started. The club management regularly makes statements about strengthening which rarely come to fruition. Players are brought in that strengthen the depth of the squad but rarely are they players that strengthen the team (Lambert, Fonte are exceptions). This year we need a number of that calibre preferably before pre season but definitely not long after the start of pre season to strengthen the side and blend in before the season starts. We definitely don't need more of the annual poor start whilst trying to get players in during September and play catch up. Arguably you could day the same about most clubs of our size and stature. I'm sure the intent is there, but getting the right men, at the right prices surely is not that easy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintBobby Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Well, we've had different players, different managers, different stadia, different owners. The only universal constant has been the fans. And looking at the majority of the comments on here, it seems clear that the fan base doesnt regard a good start as important, and lets the club get away with low expectations at the season start. Is there any hard evidence that: (a) Saints do always start slowly? I know we're notorious for doing badly in game 1. But this could be a statistical fluke. is it actually the case that - over the last decade or so - our league position on, say, October 1st is measurably worse than our finishing position? Possibly, but I'm not persuaded. Does anyone actually know? (b) Is it actually the case that Saints sign new players later in the transfer window than other clubs? of course, fans of all teams want to sign great players very quickly and very cheaply. But are Saints really slower off the mark than others? Do we sign players, on average, on August 1st whereas our rivals sign players on July 1st? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge_B Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Did we start last season slowly? Cos we finished it in 2nd and got promoted. If anything I hope we leave our preparations even later this time around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat from Poole Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 So much of it is about fitness in my opinion. If Adkins has them running up mountains until they puke in pre-season like Strachan used to, then I think we'll be halfway there. I've lost count of the number of opening day games I've seen Saints lose over the years when the players looked embarrassingly unfit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintBobby Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Erm, results ? promotion ? having more players in the Team of the Season for L1 than Brighton ? Goal difference ? Btw, no team is perfect and is immune to improvement. Even the likes of Ferguson and Wenger would say that. Fair play, you admit you got in wrong for most of the season. No shame in that. I predicted at the start of the season that we'd get 100 points and win the division, so I was a smidgen optimistic. Although I did keep arguing (often with you!) from about December onwards that we'd secure 2nd and get automatic promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Mockles Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 ....could it be because we leave everything, especially our f**king transfer activity, to the last minute ? Thanks to Dunc for the idea for a thread... You are consistently negative so I understand the banter with you but I am in agreement, we do tend to. It's frustrating. I am hoping to be proved wrong this time but remain quietly cynical. Also, it's the acid test for Nige. January isn't fair judgement to player pulling power but this pre-season will be the test. I am hopeful we recruit strongly and not continue soley with this young and unproven gamble but utilise the quality available and recruit both talented potential and proven players with experience like we did with Fonte, Ricky (despite no Championship time) and possibly even Butterfield and Harding. Adkins is back, players must report back soon after a well earned break so I am hoping and midly confident the ball is well in motion...surprise us all nicely with a Cork type signing and a show of intent. Time to hit the ground running if we're to build for the Premier League and if Cortese truly is serious. Our current squad has class but falls some way short of really competing with the likes of West Ham, Birmingham, Blackpoor and the like. Great fixture list. Home game Boxing Day, New Year at Brighton away, Skates on my birthday and before Xmas and Leeds at home. A great opener against similar calibre and a good test in front of our home crowd. COYS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Anyone remember the glorious start to the 1998/99 season? No? Well we lost the first five and didn't win any in the first 12. Guess when we did our transfers that summer. that's right early. David Howells came in on 14th June, Stuart Ripley 6th July, Mark Paul, 9th July, James Beattie 10th July, Mark Hughes 11th July and Skate Hiley on the 21st August. Getting players in early to forge a settled squad really helped that season didn't it. Cgheck out Norwichs signing pattern last season. Lambert signed players and brought in players on loan throughout the whole season. didn't do them any harm. Is that play off spot still hanging by a thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Shearer Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Indeed, I reckon some of fans would get bored if we had a good start... Afraid you really are something special if you actually think that Saints fans don't want a good start or would be bored with one. You'll be the first person on the match thread to slag the team off or write a game off if Saints aren't winning or are a goal down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS1980 Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 As long as most of our signings are in before the start of pre season i don't care. They need a full pre season with us and hopefully we can get off to a good start for once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Its simple logic that so many seem to have a trouble grasping. Instead, they grasp at convoluted "what ifs" about who might later become available or impact on fees for players later, or if Uranus comes into conjunction with Michael Owen's schlong..... The bottom line is, if we have our typical pre-season, everyone will turn up at SMS for Leeds game without a clue as to who the starting XI will be, and will observe a team out-of-steam in 70mins. I think most people understand the logic but what most are saying is that it is clearly not that simple or else everyone would be doing it. So far there have been 70 odd transfers according to the BBC website and the vast majority of these are freebies so maybe we are not targeting players that are free and on the decline or not good enough. 70 players over 17 days between 100+ clubs shows that very little business is done in this first month after season end so whilst it would be nice to have 3-4 £1m or so quality signings announced by mid-June its simply unrealistic. Even after sourcing players, checking availability and agreeing deals with clubs there are still personal terms and contracts to sort and these things all take time. If we have no-one in by mid-July I will be concerned that we won't be able to compete for play-offs but I have absolutely no concerns about being able to be easily in mid-table with the quality we already have at our disposal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 It certainly did. Instead of hitting the ground running and taking control from an early stage we spent the entire season playing catchup and it wasn't until the 2nd to last game that we finally overcame our usual crap start. The difference between us (got there eventually) and Brighton (won at a canter) was our start. Anyway, what is wrong with wanting a good start for once? But the result was much the same, Carlisle flew out of the traps last season had a very good first few weeks ended up mid table (though they did win a cup). There's nothing wrong with wanting a good start but all that matters at the end of the season is how many games you've won not when you won them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Mockles Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Exactly 3 pts despite the terrible pre-season which goes to prove pre-season had very little effect doesn't it? Errrrrrr, no. Apline's dead right. If Pardew had prepared, if we signed players earlier to get them established in training and IF AP had not delayed transfers and stalled signings (knowing he was leaving, for which case you could blame Pardew not Cortese), only one win would have won us the title. Highly avoidable and highly frustrating. Least Apline wants to learn from mistakes and this was certainly one. A prudent board would realise this and I hope our commitee took note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 The problem I have with the opposing view in this case is that there is plenty of time for our squad to be depleted still. I consider it highly unlikely that all 3 from Morgan, Lallana and AO-C will be here come Leeds kick-off. So to say we can make do for a while with what we've got is a bit previous. Especially considering our form for leaving trasnfer activity too late. But you can't buy players just in case someone moves on. Basically, you do a deal with someone if the money is good and you have a replacement/s available of the right quality. In previous seasons we have been in poor shape as the financial situation forced us to sell players like Walcott, Bale etc as we were skint. We had no choice to sell and not replace as we needed to do it to survive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 I dont see the relation between the two things. Are we expecting Ricky Lambert to jump ship and go and work on an oil rig in Alaska, or something ? NA and NC know who is coming back, and should have identified what they need for next season already. I fully expect this to have happened, they will have identified targets and now have to undertake the time consuming task of getting them on the bus at the right ticket price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Why not? What is that view based on? My point was that it matters not if you buy a player on the 4th June or 25th of June. You gain no benefit as none of the players you sign will train together until July. It is the 17th June today, still two weeks left to sign players so that they all have a full pre-season. And you could arguably say that they don't necessarily need to be in place until first or second warm-up game as they will have trained with their previous club (assuming a transfer rather than release on a free) so mid-July is the earliest I might be concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Errrrrrr, no. Apline's dead right. If Pardew had prepared, if we signed players earlier to get them established in training and IF AP had not delayed transfers and stalled signings (knowing he was leaving, for which case you could blame Pardew not Cortese), only one win would have won us the title. Highly avoidable and highly frustrating. Least Apline wants to learn from mistakes and this was certainly one. A prudent board would realise this and I hope our commitee took note. I've raised this point previously without it being answered; why were last season's signings made too late? Last season we signed Ryan Dickson on 10th June, Frazer Richardson on 6th July and Danny Butterfield on 17th July. Guly then arrived on 23rd August. We then signed Richard Chaplow and Jonathan Forte in the winter window (Chaplow after an initial loan), plus Dany N'Guessan on loan. None of whom went on to establish themselves as a first team regular. Our pre-season last season was, in retrospect, a shambles; and the Pardew effect as it turned out was very de-stabilising on our early season form. But how do you manage to blame our early season form on our incoming transfers being made too late? If they were too late, when should we have made those signings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Hell of an assumption you've made there... Hell of an assumption that you're making about no transfer activity considering we brought three in quite quickly last season ..... I think most people would say we have a settled and happy squad. Players under question at the moment in terms of rumour are pretty much OXO and Gobern (as he has not signed a new deal). I would call that very settled especially as we hold the cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petersfield Saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Alpine makes a logical point if one wades through the predictability of this thread. If we finalise the building of the team "sooner rather than later" it means that the whole squad can "gel" during the pre-season tour and friendlies, and therefore hit the ground running on 'day 1'. The longer you leave it the more that "gelling" time drifts into the season itself. That's simple logic. This. Agree with Alpine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Hell of an assumption you've made there... The only player we're likely to lose that we don't want to is Chamberlain. Any other outgoings will be our own choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 I've raised this point previously without it being answered; why were last season's signings made too late? Last season we signed Ryan Dickson on 10th June, Frazer Richardson on 6th July and Danny Butterfield on 17th July. Guly then arrived on 23rd August. We then signed Richard Chaplow and Jonathan Forte in the winter window (Chaplow after an initial loan), plus Dany N'Guessan on loan. None of whom went on to establish themselves as a first team regular. Our pre-season last season was, in retrospect, a shambles; and the Pardew effect as it turned out was very de-stabilising on our early season form. But how do you manage to blame our early season form on our incoming transfers being made too late? If they were too late, when should we have made those signings? Richardson didn't play and never managed to hold down a regular starting slot ,Likewise Dickson who was rapidly replaced by Harding, only Butterfield was a regular early on but alternated with Richardson towards the end and Guly failed to break into the side in the early part of the season. It can be safely said that the new players barely had any effect on the team/results in the early part of the season. However if four influential players who provided immediate impact had arrived early, that may well have been a different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brussels Saint Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 This. Agree with Alpine Essentially Alps is right in his basic point. We will be better prepared if all business we want to do is done early rather than late. My point is that the club will also know this and its not that they can't be bothered, lack the funds or focus. The key is "business we want to do". I would rather us wait for the right signing even if its in Aug, than just sign those we can do early. Every club and chairman know its better to do it early, but things they don't control prevent this. Look at even the big clubs with all their resources signing players on deadline day after the season has started. I'm sure they never plan to do it that way. Personally I don't think our usual rubbish start relates to when we sign players (maybe only a minor influence), but other factors. The biggest of these of course is that we are the Saints, its the way its done, it's been like that for years, fate controls this, accept it, embrace it, its who we are! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 June, 2011 Share Posted 17 June, 2011 Errrrrrr, no. Apline's dead right. If Pardew had prepared, if we signed players earlier to get them established in training and IF AP had not delayed transfers and stalled signings (knowing he was leaving, for which case you could blame Pardew not Cortese), only one win would have won us the title. Highly avoidable and highly frustrating. Least Apline wants to learn from mistakes and this was certainly one. A prudent board would realise this and I hope our commitee took note. Errrrr no he is not, You could just as easily blame Nigel for failing to win at Wallsall or losing to Brentford, It's the number of matches you win over a season that counts not when you win them. A poor start in itself (say losing your first four games) means squat if you go on a 24 game winning streak afterwards, same the other way we could win the first 8 games then go on a 15 gaming losing streak would that have anything to do with Pre-season? No it wouldn't. The point still holds despite a poor pre-season we came second 3pts behind the champions which just shows pre-season don't count for much IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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