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Post Office scandal


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52 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Glad to see that story being kept alive.  Absolutely should be serving time. They can further whistleblow at chance of avoiding jail and naming others. Like how they traumatised others to confess, terrified at the thought of going  to prison 

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Watched the MBvPO documentary last night, got very angry about it all. Paula Vennells is a nasty cunt, totally blinded by protecting the PO brand. The immense amount of human sufferering she caused is staggering, how she can call herself a priest just shows what a bag of sick the Church of England is.

On the other side is Alan Bates, a true hero, he the epitome of restrained anger and dog with a bone resilience.

This country is great but it lets itself down in these moments. When you consider all the big scandals and how the establishment drags it feet until the people forgot or its too late to punish people.

This should be a watershed moment for the establishment but it won't be.

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The compensation payments should not have legal costs deducted, that aspect should be covered by the personal finances of the people who are culpable. To start with they can pay back their performance related bonuses.

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After she left the PO, no doubt having been handsomely paid off, Paula Vennells became a NED on the cabinet office board and walked into the job as Chair of the Imperial College NHS Trust, appointed by another failure Dido Harding. You couldn't make it up. She resigned from both because of the heat from PO scandal put pressure on her employees.

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 Today's evidence was from a PO investigator in Northern Ireland, concentrating on one specific SPM's prosecution. The SPM had had several days where the system would not balance at end-of-day, and she had reported it, to no avail. Eventually she was hauled in and interrogated about certain of the days when these discrepencies had arisen. She had no explanation other trhan Horizon was at fault, and was told she was liable and would be taken to Court. Taking a second look through the dates presented to her, she realised that luckily on one of these days she had in fact not done the end-of-day accounts, as she had taken one of her children to hospital, and in her stead the District Manager had deputised for her, and it was he that had been unable to balance the system. This effectively showed she was not at fault, but this detail was omitted from the evidence file handed over to the PSNI, and she was taken to Court. 

 In Court the SPM managed to get the redacted evidence heard, and she was exonerated by the jury, with the Judge saying the Post Office's investigation and prosecution was a "sham". The result of this case, I think in 2006, and it's effective judgement on Horizon, was clearly known to the PO senior management, but ignored as investigations and prosecutions continued.

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16 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

After she left the PO, no doubt having been handsomely paid off, Paula Vennells became a NED on the cabinet office board and walked into the job as Chair of the Imperial College NHS Trust, appointed by another failure Dido Harding. You couldn't make it up. She resigned from both because of the heat from PO scandal put pressure on her employees.

Deserves to be in jail, and not just a short sentence, 8-10 years at least for perjury on hundreds of instances, and no probation. Although ITV let Adam Crozier off the hook in an otherwise very good drama production, he belongs in the clink too. Plenty of others at the PO but those two stand out. 

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Is it correct to assume that the Horizon system was installed in Crown Post Offices as well as Sub Post Offices?

If so, were there problems with (much bigger) end of day balances and, assuming this was the case, were there any prosecutions involving those in charge at Crown Post Offices?

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38 minutes ago, spyinthesky said:

Is it correct to assume that the Horizon system was installed in Crown Post Offices as well as Sub Post Offices?

If so, were there problems with (much bigger) end of day balances and, assuming this was the case, were there any prosecutions involving those in charge at Crown Post Offices?

Thats a very good question.

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57 minutes ago, spyinthesky said:

Is it correct to assume that the Horizon system was installed in Crown Post Offices as well as Sub Post Offices?

If so, were there problems with (much bigger) end of day balances and, assuming this was the case, were there any prosecutions involving those in charge at Crown Post Offices?

 

19 minutes ago, Sergei Gotsmanov said:

Thats a very good question.

From the Criminal Cases Review Commision website;

"After more than 900 prosecutions, around 580 sub-postmasters and Crown Office employees initiated civil proceedings against Post Office Ltd during which Post Office agreed to pay damages.  "  ( Highlighting by me ).

 

It would seem that it affected both sets of staff.

Edited by badgerx16
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A clearer case of Alzheimer's you could never see.

She says she was never contacted by Blackpool County Court regarding the prosecution of the SPM, yet the inquiry has her signed witness statement submitted to the Court. She does not remember writing or signing the Court statement, claiming this is the first time she has seen it. The evidence she submitted to the Court included "copies of all error logs detailing calls made between 10 January 2000 to 30 November 2000", but does not actually include the calls made in January and early February during installation and testing, nor any of the calls made after 30 June 2000 when not only the SPM but this area manager rang the help desk with problems due to Horizon not balancing correctly. Not only that, but in this session she claims she did not know there was a help desk, let alone that she reported balancing errors.

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19 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

A clearer case of Alzheimer's you could never see.

She says she was never contacted by Blackpool County Court regarding the prosecution of the SPM, yet the inquiry has her signed witness statement submitted to the Court. She does not remember writing or signing the Court statement, claiming this is the first time she has seen it. The evidence she submitted to the Court included "copies of all error logs detailing calls made between 10 January 2000 to 30 November 2000", but does not actually include the calls made in January and early February during installation and testing, nor any of the calls made after 30 June 2000 when not only the SPM but this area manager rang the help desk with problems due to Horizon not balancing correctly. Not only that, but in this session she claims she did not know there was a help desk, let alone that she reported balancing errors.

Indeed... either Alzheimer's or perhaps the most blatant example of perjury I think I've ever seen?!

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18 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

Surely this is something you should be celebrating?

After all, Sunak will be dumped after the next GE so Badenock will be the opposition leader - I imagine Starmer will be happy to have the most incompetent person in charge wouldn't he?

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6 minutes ago, trousers said:

What the f**k is wrong with these people....?

Is there some kind of aptitude test you have to fail before you can become part of the Post Office management team....?

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/horizon-scandal-ongoing-sub-postmasters-202022770.html

image.thumb.png.689d1c7bd9ab24da7a07aefe195e812d.png

The High Court ruled that the 2017 updated version of Horizon is. "'robust"'.

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16 minutes ago, trousers said:

ah, thats ok then.... case closed.... ;)

#robustmyarse

Although if I was a sub-postmaster now I’d be nicking loads and blame on Horizon. Although expect most have better ethics than me

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1 hour ago, trousers said:

Good to see all politicians being called out on this.... ;)

The only MP to take a major media kicking so far has been Ed Davey. What makes this particular story more pertinent is that Panorama had already broken the story a few months before her visit to Davos whereas the issue was still relatively low key when Davey was involved and this particular politician is now actively lining up her bid to be the next leader of the Conservative Party. 

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13 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

The only MP to take a major media kicking so far has been Ed Davey. What makes this particular story more pertinent is that Panorama had already broken the story a few months before her visit to Davos whereas the issue was still relatively low key when Davey was involved and this particular politician is now actively lining up her bid to be the next leader of the Conservative Party. 

Don't worry SOGgy, the next leader of the Conservative Party will be leading them in the wilderness, and certainly won't be the leader next time they get anywhere near the reins of Government.

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What's shameful is that the establishment tried to avoid getting to the truth and actively went into cover up mode to save the government and the PO from getting into shit. 

So it's no surprise that the torys instructed their client press to finger Ed Davey and Tony Blair when this first broke, to cover for the list of tory fuck ups, who are now being slowly revealed.

Thankfully there were independent minded MPs (some Tory) who kept chipping away. This illustrates the bad and the good in our system.

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One of them is lying. My money is on Kemi Badenoch. The same Kemi Badenoch who hacked into Harriet Harman’s website and somehow managed to avoid a prison sentence in 2008. The same Kemi Badenoch who is trying to position herself as the next leader of the Tory party.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/kemi-badenoch-post-office-horizon-wh-smith-government-b1140557.html

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/kemi-badenoch-henry-staunton-post-office-scandal-compensation-b1140550.html

https://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2024/02/20/might-a-party-that-thinks-badenoch-is-the-answer-to-any-question-ever-likely-to-be-fit-to-govern-again/

 

 

Edited by sadoldgit
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37 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

One of them is lying. My money is on Kemi Badenoch. The same Kemi Badenoch who hacked into Harriet Harmon’s website and somehow managed to avoid a prison sentence in 2008. The same Kemi Badenoch who is trying to position herself as the next leader of the Tory party.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/kemi-badenoch-post-office-horizon-wh-smith-government-b1140557.html

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/kemi-badenoch-henry-staunton-post-office-scandal-compensation-b1140550.html

https://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2024/02/20/might-a-party-that-thinks-badenoch-is-the-answer-to-any-question-ever-likely-to-be-fit-to-govern-again/

 

 

Surely not the same Kemi Badenoch who tells porkies about trade negotiations with Canada ?

https://news.sky.com/story/canada-contradicts-kemi-badenochs-claim-post-brexit-trade-talks-are-ongoing-13076866

 

Mind you, I did like this quote to Mr Staunton from a senior civil servant at BadEnoch's department - "politicians do not necessarily like to confront reality".

Edited by badgerx16
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1 hour ago, badgerx16 said:

Surely not the same Kemi Badenoch who tells porkies about trade negotiations with Canada ?

https://news.sky.com/story/canada-contradicts-kemi-badenochs-claim-post-brexit-trade-talks-are-ongoing-13076866

 

Mind you, I did like this quote to Mr Staunton from a senior civil servant at BadEnoch's department - "politicians do not necessarily like to confront reality".

Think she'll be gone soon, doesn't suit her to be part of the losing team at the next election so might as well blow up her current position and then come back as the anti-establishment choice after the election.

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7 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

There’s a surprise 😂

I believe Nick Griffin jumped to the same conclusion. 

You are aware that criticism of Badenoch, Patel, Kwarteng, Sunak, etc because of their performance is permissable ?

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22 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

You are aware that criticism of Badenoch, Patel, Kwarteng, Sunak, etc because of their performance is permissable ?

Course it is. But in a he says/she says situation I prefer to wait for evidence before automatically blaming the black person.
 

“My moneys on the white chap telling the truth”, so 1970’s. 

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58 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Course it is. But in a he says/she says situation I prefer to wait for evidence before automatically blaming the black person.
 

“My moneys on the white chap telling the truth”, so 1970’s. 

My money's on the lying Tory minister.

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20 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Course it is. But in a he says/she says situation I prefer to wait for evidence before automatically blaming the black person.
 

“My moneys on the white chap telling the truth”, so 1970’s. 

You would know all about the 70’s as you have been stuck there for the last 45 years. So now not only can we not criticise anyone who just happens to be Jewish, we can’t criticise anyone with a different skin colour. The irony seems lost on you being a supporter of not only dude in the wool racist Nigel Farage but “Big Dog” Johnson who has made several blatantly racist comments over the years yet you haven’t said a word about that. You are the one making the issue about skin colour. Perhaps spend less time looking for 9 pinters at your local ale house and more time thinking about what you post when you finally stagger home?

Remind me again how those trade talks are going with Canada?  Oh wait, she lied about them.

More evidence of her being economic with the truth.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/lgbt-ben-bradshaw-prime-minister-commons-canada-b1140671.html
 

Those familiar with the work of political sketch writer John Crace will know that he is concerned with the behaviour of politicians, not the colour of their skin.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/feb/19/it-must-be-exhausting-to-be-kemi-badenoch-anger-her-ever-faithful-companion

Edited by sadoldgit
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Oh dear. Her tactics don’t seem to be working. Duckie/hypo will have us believe that it is due to the colour of her skin rather than the fact that she is a nasty piece of work peddling lies and nasty politics.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/kemi-badenoch-second-last-in-voters-preference-for-next-tory-leader-poll-shows/ar-BB1iH6yy?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=e99570515bc54d29947deaaa2b3f4180&ei=11

The two resident laughing hyenas can have another chuckle but fail to realise the laugh is on them and the people they support.

 

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 23/02/2024 at 00:03, sadoldgit said:

Oh dear. Her tactics don’t seem to be working. Duckie/hypo will have us believe that it is due to the colour of her skin rather than the fact that she is a nasty piece of work peddling lies and nasty politics.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/kemi-badenoch-second-last-in-voters-preference-for-next-tory-leader-poll-shows/ar-BB1iH6yy?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=e99570515bc54d29947deaaa2b3f4180&ei=11

The two resident laughing hyenas can have another chuckle but fail to realise the laugh is on them and the people they support.

 

It's certainly not the people you claim to support given that they spectacularly failed to get anywhere near any sort of political power in decades.

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On 23/02/2024 at 00:03, sadoldgit said:

Oh dear. Her tactics don’t seem to be working. Duckie/hypo will have us believe that it is due to the colour of her skin rather than the fact that she is a nasty piece of work peddling lies and nasty politics.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/kemi-badenoch-second-last-in-voters-preference-for-next-tory-leader-poll-shows/ar-BB1iH6yy?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=e99570515bc54d29947deaaa2b3f4180&ei=11

The two resident laughing hyenas can have another chuckle but fail to realise the laugh is on them and the people they support.

 

I clicked just to check whether Mordaunt would be at the top of the list and was relieved to see she is. Even if they get wiped out at the election, the tories need at minimum a safe pair of hands in the medium-term and I think she will be one of the more sensible ones left. I imagine Ben Wallace would have been up there too, had he shown an interest in staying on. I wonder what his plans are.

Both parties seem hell-bent on demonstrating that their members are incapable of seeing the wood for the trees. You still get large numbers of labour voters who think Corbyn was a winner, and the tories spent ages mucking about with Hague and IDS when Hague should have held back from the leadership for about a decade.

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https://www.itv.com/news/2024-03-28/secret-tape-reveals-paula-vennells-was-told-about-faulty-horizon-software

No surprise Vennells knew more than she claimed, she had the power to resolve it years ago, but chose to continually lie to cover up for a rotten organisation. That's what her Church of England training taught her, the organisation is more important than the people.

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