Lincoln 1-1 Saints - Match Thread

[Lord Duckhunter]

We got what we deserved today. 
 

It wasn’t just about the subs, as bad as they were. We had a 20 min spell before any were made where we should have put the game to bed. We were so wasteful on the ball, so careless. Azaz, Matski, larin, Bree, just making the wrong choices or giving it away needlessly. We had 2 or 3 transitions, where we just didn’t show enough positivity or desire to get a second goal. That’s what cost us, before the drop off in quality occurred. 

Apart from Millwall, it’s be a real lackadaisical start to the season. Last seasons run, when we turned up and just rolled over sides, is gone, its history. We need to roll up our sleeves, do the basics and work as hard as other sides, we’re not doing that and we’re underperforming. Instead of turning up to right a wrong, we’re turning up like billy big bollocks just going to out play everyone. 

That’s 2 points dropped, plus 1 at Watford when you’re on  a minus 4 start, you just can’t afford that. 

Edited 2 hours ago by Lord Duckhunter

[OneMrsWallace]

I just don't understand what Tonda is sending them out to do. Millwall aside we've looked clueless in the other games. Unless we can get back to the brave football we saw in the second half of last season, we will struggle for top 8. So disappointing. 

[Mboto Gorge]

8 minutes ago, Mr X said:

Remember we were promised exciting attacking off your seat football this season.... Guess they meant from our opponents! 

Almost as if that was purely spun out to ensure the fans were kept onside to still renew their season tickets isn’t it?

[sfc4prem]

1 minute ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

That’s 2 points dropped, plus 1 at Watford when you’re on  a minus 4 start, you just can’t afford that. 

This is the thing. We've got no buffer really. No leeway. We can't afford performances like this.

[The very right reverend]

Mubama, Dobbin and Edozie are utter shite, we're lightweight and weak in midfield and the defence is consistent at least as they've been crap for 3 years.

[Baird of the land]

2 minutes ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Of course it wasn’t just Stephens and yes Wood got taken for a mug. The point was that Eckherts decisions for this game were terrible, starting with the first 11 and ending with the sub choices.

I’d say spors decisions for the season are looking terrible. Not replacing Charles, Stewart and likely Thb properly and prioritising a player the manager only turned to in the 80th minute.

[BARCELONASAINT]

just very angry right now how we were so in control of that game and then on 75 minutes we decided to sit back and invite them onto us. It was utterly suicidal and inevitable that they would score. We cannot compete with physical sides.

[tdmickey3]

3 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

We got what we deserved today. 
 

It wasn’t just about the subs, as bad as they were. We had a 20 min spell before any were made where we should have put the game to bed. We were so wasteful on the ball, so careless. Azaz, Matski, larin, Bree, just making the wrong choices or giving it away needlessly. We had 2 or 3 transitions, where we just didn’t show enough positivity or desire to get a second goal. That’s what cost us, before the drop off in quality occurred. 

Apart from Millwall, it’s be a real lackadaisical start to the season. Last seasons run, when we turned up and just rolled over sides, is gone, its history. We need to roll up our sleeves, do the basics and work as hard as other sides, we’re not doing that and we’re underperforming. Instead of turning up to right a wrong, we’re turning up like billy big bollocks just going to out play everyone. 

That’s 2 points dropped, plus 1 at Watford when you’re on  a minus 4 start, you just can’t afford that. 

Spot on 

[bugenhagen]

6 minutes ago, Pilchards said:

Makes me laugh that we make substitutions to save them for the next game.

How about we win this one first and fucking worry about the next one when it comes round?

Is Tonda missing his right hand man as the coaching team used to nail the subs last season.

Where is Eric Black? 😉

But seriously, the game management was annoying last season too - it's just that the players coming on now is not bringing anything to the game this time, when the subs made us better, or closer to equal last season.

[davefizzy14]

Very dissappointing. We were in control and one up. We should have won today. A point is a point.

[Winnersaint]

Just now, BARCELONASAINT said:

just very angry right now how we were so in control of that game and then on 75 minutes we decided to sit back and invite them onto us. It was utterly suicidal and inevitable that they would score. We cannot compete with physical sides.

True. Preston, Hull, Blackburn, Oxford etc last season spring to mind.

[Patrick Bateman]

4 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

We got what we deserved today. 
 

It wasn’t just about the subs, as bad as they were. We had a 20 min spell before any were made where we should have put the game to bed. We were so wasteful on the ball, so careless. Azaz, Matski, larin, Bree, just making the wrong choices or giving it away needlessly. We had 2 or 3 transitions, where we just didn’t show enough positivity or desire to get a second goal. That’s what cost us, before the drop off in quality occurred. 

Apart from Millwall, it’s be a real lackadaisical start to the season. Last seasons run, when we turned up and just rolled over sides, is gone, its history. We need to roll up our sleeves, do the basics and work as hard as other sides, we’re not doing that and we’re underperforming. Instead of turning up to right a wrong, we’re turning up like billy big bollocks just going to out play everyone. 

That’s 2 points dropped, plus 1 at Watford when you’re on  a minus 4 start, you just can’t afford that. 

Can't argue with any of this. It's been mostly trash so far. Still want to see what this team looks like with Jander back in the side and I want to see Scienza take his man on more and not fall over constantly. 

[ButtikonSaint]

Back down to reality... 
Not a defeat but feels like it.
Poor day in the office from all incl.  bench and staff - nothing much inspiring apart from that bullet from our other Brazilian. 
Let's hope for a better show on Tuesday
 

[Patches O Houlihan]

15 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Wood was absolutely pathetic for their goal. 6ft fucking 4, yet another one where it’s dropped over his head and he’s hardly jumped. If that was Stephen’s you’d be moaning  like fuck. That’s the 2nd  pathetic flat footed jump has cost us goals this season. 

Wood comes on 84th minute. Goal goes in 87th minute. He isn't up to speed with the game.

It is symptomatic of the retreat tactic. If he starts the game he's up to speed. If he comes on for Stephens the team hasn't been told to retreat by the manager and the ball stays up the pitch so he most likely has time to adjust.

I literally called the guy 'Donk' before the game I'm not a Wood fan boy.

But this was on Tonda (and the recruitment) not Wood for me.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Just now, BARCELONASAINT said:

We cannot compete with physical sides.

Course we can. You have to want to though. Working hard & standing up to the physical battle is a skill, sadly some of our “stars” don’t possess it. They’d rather fall over and hope a foul is given, then stand up and compete. 

[Patrick Bateman]

3 minutes ago, The very right reverend said:

Mubama, Dobbin and Edozie are utter shite, we're lightweight and weak in midfield and the defence is consistent at least as they've been crap for 3 years.

Mubama still benefit of doubt as he got fuck all service. Edozie is like a worse version of Fabrice Fernandes running round in circles and did Dobbin touch the ball apart from the soft shot? Sigh.

[tdmickey3]

We will make play offs in 6th or 7th and miss out.

And will bumble around mid table for the foreseeable 

[James]

1 minute ago, tdmickey3 said:

Spot on 

Agreed. We’ve thrown away points already this season and given -4 we’ve made it really tough for ourselves already.

Our business this summer, post Peretz, Bree and Larin signing up, is bizarre.
 

Dobbin looks poor and a waste of resources, Schlotty looks fine but clearly the kind of player with a howler in him, Mubama looks really bad so far, JWP returns to much fanfare but I feel like I’ve gone back in time 5 years, all he does is 5 yard sideways passes…

[Gloucester Saint]

1 minute ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Mubama still benefit of doubt as he got fuck all service. Edozie is like a worse version of Fabrice Fernandes running round in circles and did Dobbin touch the ball apart from the soft shot? Sigh.

£9m for Dobbin, when we’re at least one main striker short and relying on a 20 year old loan CB. 

[sfc4prem]

Just now, tdmickey3 said:

And will bumble around mid table for the foreseeable 

You reckon we'll morph into another Stoke or Blackburn type club?

Fuck that, what a woeful existence. No wonder their attendances are shite.

[Football Special]

12 minutes ago, Dman said:

Will salt? 

Perhaps knowing how the opposition are setting up, does make a difference. 

Dont be a mug, we spied on Oxford and lost.  Clearly 2nd half of last season we had a better team, THB at the back with Jander in the middle and a fit Stewart up front. All those players would significantly improve that team today 

Edited 1 hour ago by Football Special

[Baird of the land]

1 minute ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

Wood comes on 84th minute. Goal goes in 87th minute. He isn't up to speed with the game.

It is symptomatic of the retreat tactic. If he starts the game he's up to speed. If he comes on for Stephens the team hasn't been told to retreat by the manager and the ball stays up the pitch so he most likely has time to adjust.

I literally called the guy 'Donk' before the game I'm not a Wood fan boy.

But this was on Tonda (and the recruitment) not Wood for me.

The problem is the midfield and attack had already surrendered the momentum. Not sure a straight swap would have worked any better. I’d have marginally preferred a third crab in cm, which is saying something given how much I dislike our cm.

[OneMrsWallace]

3 minutes ago, Winnersaint said:

True. Preston, Hull, Blackburn, Oxford etc last season spring to mind.

Felt like Oxford away last season. Main difference was we scored a worldy today to get a point. TE not learning it seems.  

[tdmickey3]

Just now, sfc4prem said:

You reckon we'll morph into another Stoke or Blackburn type club?

Fuck that, what a woeful existence. No wonder their attendances are shite.

Yep 

This season is last chance saloon and its looking like the last order bell has rung

[Mboto Gorge]

1 minute ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Mubama still benefit of doubt as he got fuck all service. Edozie is like a worse version of Fabrice Fernandes running round in circles and did Dobbin touch the ball apart from the soft shot? Sigh.

Prime, vintage Edozie was when he had the ball in our half and couldn’t make his mind up whether to pass it right or left so just pirouetted into midfield traffic just outside our box , lost the ball and been luckily got given a free kick for a non existent foul. There’s a reason he has been been here for 4 years and only played for about 25% of that time, and that’s because he’s shit,

[Patches O Houlihan]

2 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Course we can. You have to want to though. Working hard & standing up to the physical battle is a skill, sadly some of our “stars” don’t possess it. They’d rather fall over and hope a foul is given, then stand up and compete. 

Downes and Matsuki do. That's why I was so pissed off when I saw Woof getting prepped to come on because I knew we would be taking the only remaining effective practical hardworking forward off, which would mean we would get pinned back.

I'm off to kick the cat and bloody my knuckles in the garage.

[James]

2 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Mubama still benefit of doubt as he got fuck all service. Edozie is like a worse version of Fabrice Fernandes running round in circles and did Dobbin touch the ball apart from the soft shot? Sigh.

I don’t really get the argument he’s had no service. The ball was played into him multiple times and he was either knocked off the ball or gave it away. Strikers can’t expect to be presented with gilt edged chances every week…

Larin had no service either but was significantly more effective despite a poor game. As soon as Mubama came on we had zip going forward as he can’t hold It up. 

[Dman]

1 minute ago, Football Special said:

Dont be a mug. Clearly 2nd half of last season we had a better team, THB at the back with Jander in the middle and a fit Stewart up front. All those players would significantly improve that team today 

It was said in jest, but there has to be a reason why last season we started games blisteringly quick. This season, we’ve been absolutely horrendous the first 15/20. 

[Mboto Gorge]

2 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

£9m for Dobbin, when we’re at least one main striker short and relying on a 20 year old loan CB. 

This lot will never learn. One half decent window last summer in amongst half a dozen plus genuinely shocking ones. The recruitment as a whole under this ownership has been the worst at this club in its history by a country mile. They aren’t suddenly going to get it right. Money continues to be wasted heavily on players that aren’t a priority 

[O_Lord_Marian]

9 minutes ago, Winnersaint said:

 I mean yeah, little Lincoln, no right to be on the same pitch as us.

Glad we are in agreement, cheers.

[vectraman]

It is Tonda’s weird going to 5 at the back by bringing on a 3rd CB that he does thinking it’ll shore the defence up. It doesn’t work, never does work, and he should know by now it doesn’t work.

If you want to tighten up bring an extra defensive midfielder on instead. Bragg on instead of Edozie, make it difficult for the opposition to get space. 
 

Very poor in game choices by Tonda today. 

[Patches O Houlihan]

1 minute ago, Baird of the land said:

The problem is the midfield and attack had already surrendered the momentum. Not sure a straight swap would have worked any better. I’d have marginally preferred a third crab in cm, which is saying something given how much I dislike our cm.

The problem is not Downes and JWP. The problem is that the hard working effective players ahead of them being swapped for players who aren't. 

As I said last week if the players ahead of you are stood in the wrong place so a defender is blocking the pass then you are forced into sideways passing.

This was JWPs pass map just before half time. Bearing in mind how deep Lincoln were defending during the first half this is not the crab football that you go on about - unless you think we should just aimlessly boot it into a packed box and hope for lucky breaks?

[Baird of the land]

1 minute ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

The problem is not Downes and JWP. The problem is that the hard working effective players ahead of them being swapped for players who aren't. 

As I said last week if the players ahead of you are stood in the wrong place so a defender is blocking the pass then you are forced into sideways passing.

This was JWPs pass map just before half time. Bearing in mind how deep Lincoln were defending during the first half this is not the crab football that you go on about - unless you think we should just aimlessly boot it into a packed box and hope for lucky breaks?

Or maybe sign a cm who can run with the ball like the one we lost. That opens up space for players in front.

Edited 1 hour ago by Baird of the land

[kitch]

That was pretty abject, it has to be said.

Such is the narrative* that Stephens MUST be involved, when it becomes obvious the oppo are becoming a threat (and anyone with eyes knows our defence with Stephens in it is shaky) and a decision is made to introduce a new CB, it cannot be instead of Stephens, so we are then forced into a back 5, which we all know is hopless. It also means there are fewer attacking options should we manage to scramble the ball away. Doubly so when your attacking options are Mubama, Edozie and Dobbin - all pretty ineffective players and clearly a level below the ones they replaced.

It's been a pretty lethargic start to the season, all things considered. Millwall aside, we've not looked like one of the top level teams. I personally think we're weaker as a squad than we were last season, too. Peretz's dip in form needs to be studied, and we're one long-term injury from Larin away from struggling to reach 8th place IMO. Midfield looks classy, agreed, but not creative. Azaz can't do everything, and on the days where it's not working for Larin, there's no Stewart plan B.

Sorry, I'm all bummed out after that one. Lack of any kind of spark, one wonder-goal aside.

 

* no idea what the actual word I need here is, but it's along those lines

[Eire Saint]

JWP and Downes were okay. Poor performances all round otherwise. They could've been 2 up in the first 20, wasted some easy chances. Don't think Matsuki is good enough for the starting 11, plenty of enthusiasm, but gives the ball away far too much. Apart from one or two glimpses, Scienza has been a passenger. Azaz trying things but didn't have the quality around him. Subs were awful. Mubama in particular. Really poor, zero first touch, petulant, and lazy tracking for their goal. Serious work needed on the training pitch. 

[Mboto Gorge]

The irony is, the guy who got their equaliser would be an ideal replacement for Larin towards the end of games and only cost 4m. It’s blatantly obvious these players are out there, yet we spend 9m on a player who can’t get in the side and looks like he won’t do any time soon.

[James]

1 minute ago, Mboto Gorge said:

The irony is, the guy who got their equaliser would be an ideal replacement for Larin towards the end of games and only cost 4m. It’s blatantly obvious these players are out there, yet we spend 9m on a player who can’t get in the side and looks like he won’t do any time soon.

We just default to signing players from City.

[LegalEagle]

5 minutes ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

The problem is not Downes and JWP. The problem is that the hard working effective players ahead of them being swapped for players who aren't. 

As I said last week if the players ahead of you are stood in the wrong place so a defender is blocking the pass then you are forced into sideways passing.

This was JWPs pass map just before half time. Bearing in mind how deep Lincoln were defending during the first half this is not the crab football that you go on about - unless you think we should just aimlessly boot it into a packed box and hope for lucky breaks?

I think JWP was arguably our best player today. Not saying an awful lot but he wasn’t crap.

[Chez]

41 minutes ago, Mboto Gorge said:

Almost as if that was purely spun out to ensure the fans were kept onside to still renew their season tickets isn’t it?

Who actually buys a season ticket because of a few rallying comments during the summer? No one. So stop taking twaddle.

Edited 1 hour ago by Chez

[James]

Just now, LegalEagle said:

I think JWP was arguably our best player today. Not saying an awful lot but he wasn’t crap.

He wasn’t crap but he didn’t exactly do anything did he? He just shuffled it 5 yards sideways over and over again…

[Disco Stu]

1 hour ago, Disco Stu said:

"Match winner" Shut up you prick.

Commentator tempting fate the bastard.

[Paul_B]

We are really fucking poor

[Football Special]

10 minutes ago, Mboto Gorge said:

This lot will never learn. One half decent window last summer in amongst half a dozen plus genuinely shocking ones. The recruitment as a whole under this ownership has been the worst at this club in its history by a country mile. They aren’t suddenly going to get it right. Money continues to be wasted heavily on players that aren’t a priority 

That was a huge % of our transfer budget on Dobbin,  not ideal when he doesn't look like he'll contribute much 

Larin and Sceinza off on 60 mins as we're panicking on whether they can play two more tough games this coming week 

[BarberSaint]

33 minutes ago, jrobsbigshorts said:

Edozie shouldn't get minutes for having a tantrum on Instagram, should of been Dobbin

I was positive about the window til today, Mubama looks way off it , surely we could of got a deal done with Stewart 

Would be a good argument

 

...if Dobbin had demonstrated he was any good at football. But he hasn't.

[die Mannyschaft]

Watching in bar. Saints are very poor, very bad

[die Mannyschaft]

1 minute ago, Paul_B said:

We are really fucking poor

What has happened its on Paper a better squad.  

[Mboto Gorge]

1 minute ago, Chez said:

Who actually buys a season ticket because on a few rallying comments during the summer? No one. So stop taking twaddle.

So the owner , who rarely speaks if ever publically, has stated that the club owe the fans big time and are determined to get the team to be proud of for the coming season,’and you don’t believe that would’ve encouraged a large number of fans to renew? Ok then. Wasn’t just a run of the mill “rallying cry” that we see from a wheeled out member of the playing squad after a defeat was it. Bizarre take from you that it’s inconceivable. 

[Patches O Houlihan]

1 minute ago, James said:

He wasn’t crap but he didn’t exactly do anything did he? He just shuffled it 5 yards sideways over and over again…

JWP actually carried the ball forwards a number of times - 3 or 4 at least. I knew at some point Baird of the Land would make the lazy crab reference so I watched him in particular today. 

Yes he isn't barging players out of the way like Charles would - but he is tracking back and making tackles that Charles wouldn't, and is all ways 'in' the game rather than letting it pass him by. I think they are about equal as far as ability to shoot from the edge of the area or arriving late in the box to score is concerned.

[Saint Pete]

32 minutes ago, Cuddles said:

Win your home games, draw your away games.

Going 3 at the back was suicidal though, we know it doesn't work for us. 

We'll never know, but I suspect we would have conceded anyway. After a decent spell earlier in the half when we looked like we had more control, Lincoln were already pushing again and creating chances before that sub. The real problem is the lack of defensive qualities of both Wood and Stephens, we are always likely to concede when pressured if one of them are on the pitch. We can only hope that Abbott comes good once has has settled in and can take over as partner for Schlott. 

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

28 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

We got what we deserved today. 
 

It wasn’t just about the subs, as bad as they were. We had a 20 min spell before any were made where we should have put the game to bed. We were so wasteful on the ball, so careless. Azaz, Matski, larin, Bree, just making the wrong choices or giving it away needlessly. We had 2 or 3 transitions, where we just didn’t show enough positivity or desire to get a second goal. That’s what cost us, before the drop off in quality occurred. 

Apart from Millwall, it’s be a real lackadaisical start to the season. Last seasons run, when we turned up and just rolled over sides, is gone, its history. We need to roll up our sleeves, do the basics and work as hard as other sides, we’re not doing that and we’re underperforming. Instead of turning up to right a wrong, we’re turning up like billy big bollocks just going to out play everyone. 

That’s 2 points dropped, plus 1 at Watford when you’re on  a minus 4 start, you just can’t afford that. 

Agree with all of this and at the moment everything feels flat.

Yes, when Dobbin and Mubama came on, we never looked like scoring but Lincoln had the better chances in the game. They wanted it more and for us to try and see out the last 20 minutes when we were clearly on top was criminal. Scienza's double post shot was the defining moment in the game, but our players need a lesson in positivity.