Wakey Wakey!

[Glasgow_Saint]

After last nights efforts its clear we're in a relegation fight - time for us all to except it.

 

There is no "lets give it time" bo11ox - this team just isnt good enough!!

 

In a few years we've fallen from the premiership to a poor CCC team

[alpine_saint]

After last nights efforts its clear we're in a relegation fight - time for us all to except it.

 

There is no "lets give it time" bo11ox - this team just isnt good enough!!

 

In a few years we've fallen from the premiership to a poor CCC team

 

Is this a piiss-take ?

 

You've spent years sneering at those of us who have been telling it like it is.

[Legod Second Coming]

After last nights efforts its clear we're in a relegation fight - time for us all to except it.

 

There is no "lets give it time" bo11ox - this team just isnt good enough!!

 

In a few years we've fallen from the premiership to a poor CCC team

 

I thought that. I thought, mm, here's us with the measure of Ipswich - both doomed...

[skintsaint]

A lot of comments yesterday saying 'we cant lose to Ipswich or we are in the ****', so we dont...and yet people still slitting their wrists over whats happening.

 

We play crap and get a draw, cant complain. Beat Barnsley and I bet people still will be moaning. I hate to see these boards if we dont win......best put the Samaritans on standby.

 

Loads of football to be played yet and im confident we will climb the table soon enough.

[davefoggy]

bring back NP. we only lost 3 with him in charge

[saints_is_the_south]

Tbf i think we realized we were in for a relegation scrap well before the Ipswich game. I'd happily take staying up this season & if at this stage somebody offered me 21st place come 5pm on the 3rd May 09 after the Forest game I'd be pleased. On one hand it's a sad thing to be saying as it's a measure of how far we have fallen but this is a new start & we are building a team with promising youngsters who given a year will be a lot better for the experience.

 

Anybody expecting anymore than survival this season would be kidding themselves.

 

A couple of experienced loans in January, coupled with keeping Pekhart til the end of the season & him banging in a few goals then we'll be fine IMO. It is also imperative that we keep Lallana for a year at least otherwise we will be in trouble.

[Ian the Red]

Why is it always doom and gloom. We have played 6 league games with only 4 points returned. Not good but there is enough positive signs from performances to suggest that we are not too far from being a half decent team. It is not only the inexperience of teh players but JP has made a couple of odd selections, 2 x 19 year olds in the cente of defence etc. Even last night we looked good at times, did not give up and kept trying to score.

 

The players need support, magnificent singing from the crowd when we were 2-1 down by the way, must have helped the players. So where were the 12k loyal supporters last night??? Th eclub and the players need your support. It is embarassing when Norwich manage 24k last night and we manage 14900!!!

[saintwarwick]

Why is it always doom and gloom. We have played 6 league games with only 4 points returned. Not good but there is enough positive signs from performances to suggest that we are not too far from being a half decent team. It is not only the inexperience of teh players but JP has made a couple of odd selections, 2 x 19 year olds in the cente of defence etc. Even last night we looked good at times, did not give up and kept trying to score.

 

The players need support, magnificent singing from the crowd when we were 2-1 down by the way, must have helped the players. So where were the 12k loyal supporters last night??? Th eclub and the players need your support. It is embarassing when Norwich manage 24k last night and we manage 14900!!!

 

It's quite simple, some are happy to slag and slate the team but cannot be bothered to watch them.

[Thedelldays]

It's quite simple, some are happy to slag and slate the team but cannot be bothered to watch them.

why is it like that..

 

do you not think 14k was a great turn out for a team that is pretty weak and were bottom of the league last night before kick off...when being bottom was the worst position in decades and 14k is not mucg less than the team top of the league..

 

I think 14k is generous and that figure out performs the team

[ottery st mary]

JP may have all the qualities of a great coach although he is coming at it late in his career.

I honestly believe he needs to be the Coach to a team Manager as I believe neither him, Wotte or any of the coaching staff are Managerial material.

Most good clubs have a Manager who manages/co-ordinates the coaching team and rarely actually coach as such.

Lawrie Mac was not a Coach and invariably was led tactically by his senior players before and during a game when things had to change.

JP was being advised by Wotton and Perry to a certain extent and would do well to have an old lag alongside him in the dug out.

 

AND NO, NO,NO, NOT LOWEY HE HAS PROVED AGAIN HE IS NOT FOOTBALL MANAGER MATERIAL.

[OldNick]

BS the performance was a lot better last night than a lot of games under any of the managers you care to mention from last season.

How many games last season would we have come back from a goal down? The concern for me was the tiredness in the last 15minutes that let Ipswich attack constantly, but we keep our nerve and the point.When we equalised I said to my daughter I'd be happy if the ref blew now and got the point.

[Glasgow_Saint]

BS the performance was a lot better last night than a lot of games under any of the managers you care to mention from last season.

How many games last season would we have come back from a goal down? The concern for me was the tiredness in the last 15minutes that let Ipswich attack constantly, but we keep our nerve and the point.When we equalised I said to my daughter I'd be happy if the ref blew now and got the point.

 

I said the same when we scored which is worrying - surely we should expect better, particularly when @ SMS?

 

I have become content with mediocre and it’s sad!

[OldNick]

I said the same when we scored which is worrying - surely we should expect better, particularly when @ SMS?

 

I have become content with mediocre and it’s sad!

but BS we have a new team new system and that is going to take time. I spoke to Rich Chorley on the way back from the game and we both agreed that this season is all about getting it to gel and then move on as the team develops next.As he rightly said it all depends on who is still here, but feom my postion I dont see any of the team likely to go quite yet.Even Lallana has a long way to develop yet to make a PL side.

[alpine_saint]

but BS we have a new team new system and that is going to take time. I spoke to Rich Chorley on the way back from the game and we both agreed that this season is all about getting it to gel and then move on as the team develops next.As he rightly said it all depends on who is still here, but feom my postion I dont see any of the team likely to go quite yet.Even Lallana has a long way to develop yet to make a PL side.

 

You're completely deluded. Arsenal took Walcott and agreed a 12m deal without him being the finished product.

[Secret Site Agent]

I said the same when we scored which is worrying - surely we should expect better, particularly when @ SMS?

 

I have become content with mediocre and it’s sad!

 

Sorry OBS, but I'm gettng mixed signals here.

 

First you are saying we are in a relegaton fight and now you are happy with a draw.

 

I think that as opposed to last year where you had the Positives, (we're going to walk this league) and the negatives, (we're going to end up relegated and in admin istration) you know have a third way, the realists, ( we are happy to stay here and build for the future as we have no choice).

 

So which camp, we going to win the championship,we're going to get relegated,or we're going to do enough to stay here?

 

Remember, and you know who you are, cogent,well though out debate only please.

[dubai_phil]

I wonder.......

 

Whether our first real chicken may be coming home to roost borne out of enthusiasm but inexperience.

 

The reserve & academy teams play 25/30 games a year. The first team 50+

 

Most of us can remember back to the days of WGS with the incredible amount of work done in the pre-season period - stories of players having to run up sand dunes until they vomitted, then doing it again and again. In that season we played hard, fast and pressing football and were probably the fittest team in the PL.

 

During THIS close season our coaching staff - did not have actual Football League experience, and as I recall from reading many of the articles we pre-season started early and it was all about pace and movement, and playing matches.

 

Now I am not a sports coach, but I seem to recall that there are some differences between stamina training and speed training. With kids suddenly playing 2 or 3 games a week, I actually wonder whether they are suddenly feeling the strain mentally and physically, did they build enough stamina training pre-season?

 

To me mental tiredness is as big a problem as inexperience. Gillett covered miles in his first few games, now Lallana is doing that = Gillett seems to have burnt out, how long can Lallana keep going.

 

I'll not judge anything yet, but trends are appearing. I wonder if only 4 changes on Saturday will be enough and whether the Rotheram game is time for some to have a rest

[Legod Second Coming]

BS the performance was a lot better last night than a lot of games under any of the managers you care to mention from last season.

How many games last season would we have come back from a goal down? The concern for me was the tiredness in the last 15minutes that let Ipswich attack constantly, but we keep our nerve and the point.When we equalised I said to my daughter I'd be happy if the ref blew now and got the point.

 

I put it down to Sunday Nick - the same team ran themselves ragged for 90 minutes with ten men - no matter how fit they are, that will take its toll.

[itchen]

I have to ask again, what is it you're suggesting we do?

 

If we were to ACCEPT we are in a relegation fight after 6 games, as fans, what is it about our behaviour that should change? Should we sulk? Lower expectations? Accept poorer results? Boo the team? Try to force out the manager/board etc?

 

I don't believe the season is set in stone after 6 games, BUT I'm all for accepting it'll be a hard season if that means people getting behind the team in the vital games such as Saturday. If you, or anyone else believes the lads are not good enough then all the more reason to support them. No-one can help not being good enough. Benali wasn't good enough, Micky Evans wasn't good enough, but you could never ask for more than you got from them. I prefer that than recent players like Idiakez, Euell, Rasiak, Skacel and so on, who blatantly could have performed better than they did.

 

So what can we do but give it time and hope they prove you wrong and show they are in fact good enough? I say give it time because I think this is the best chance we have, however grim that might appear. IMO a management change, criticising the team or another pantomine scenario against the board will only be detrimental.

 

Perhaps it is a case of being crap and trying to help the team with support, or being crap and making it a whole lot worse. I don't see what else people are meaning when they criticise people saying "give it time" after a few games. If we officially say "that's enough time now" at any point, what happens? Do we stop supporting the club? Am I missing something? I'm not having a go at you, I just really don't understand the logic in all these comments flying about.

 

Adrian, you have summed up my thoughts perfectly. Suppose I accept we're all doomed, what should I do differently and will it stop us being doomed?

 

BTW, I don't accept that we are all doomed.

[Whitey Grandad]

I wonder.......

 

Whether our first real chicken may be coming home to roost borne out of enthusiasm but inexperience.

 

The reserve & academy teams play 25/30 games a year. The first team 50+

 

Most of us can remember back to the days of WGS with the incredible amount of work done in the pre-season period - stories of players having to run up sand dunes until they vomitted, then doing it again and again. In that season we played hard, fast and pressing football and were probably the fittest team in the PL.

 

During THIS close season our coaching staff - did not have actual Football League experience, and as I recall from reading many of the articles we pre-season started early and it was all about pace and movement, and playing matches.

 

Now I am not a sports coach, but I seem to recall that there are some differences between stamina training and speed training. With kids suddenly playing 2 or 3 games a week, I actually wonder whether they are suddenly feeling the strain mentally and physically, did they build enough stamina training pre-season?

 

To me mental tiredness is as big a problem as inexperience. Gillett covered miles in his first few games, now Lallana is doing that = Gillett seems to have burnt out, how long can Lallana keep going.

 

I'll not judge anything yet, but trends are appearing. I wonder if only 4 changes on Saturday will be enough and whether the Rotheram game is time for some to have a rest

I made the comment at half time last night that I thought we were playing at 90% throttle whereas Ipswich were at 60%. It is becoming more apparent that the players cannot maintain the high tempo throughout one game, let alone 3 in a week.

[Windmill Arm 2]

After last nights efforts its clear we're in a relegation fight - time for us all to except it.

 

There is no "lets give it time" bo11ox - this team just isnt good enough!!

 

In a few years we've fallen from the premiership to a poor CCC team

 

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

This is PRICELESS!!! :rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

Do you always post for a reaction Bournemouth?

[Windmill Arm 2]

but BS we have a new team new system and that is going to take time. I spoke to Rich Chorley on the way back from the game and we both agreed that this season is all about getting it to gel and then move on as the team develops next.As he rightly said it all depends on who is still here, but feom my postion I dont see any of the team likely to go quite yet.Even Lallana has a long way to develop yet to make a PL side.

 

Gel GEL??? Where have we heard that before? Get real nick, this side will break up in the summer if not the January window, we are a selling club, Lallana, Surman, etc they will all be off to better clubs, and by better clubs I include the other 23 CCC clubs.

 

****ing Doomed :chain:

[PokingFun]

bring back NP. we only lost 3 with him in charge

 

Didn't win many either though did we?

[PokingFun]

You're completely deluded. Arsenal took Walcott and agreed a 12m deal without him being the finished product.

 

Lallana is not even in the same class as Walcott (or Bale for that matter). Walcott is playing regularly for a top 4 PL team, has scored an international hat trick and is expected to be a rising star. Lallana has skill, creativity and ability but lets not delude ourselves that he is going to be a future England International.

 

Arsenal took Walcott because they knew he was the real deal so long as he stayed fit.

 

When big teams pay that sort of money for 16 / 17 year old kids they know that barring injuries they will deliver on the biggest stages.

[mitch01]

How do people understand that it was ALWAYS going to be this way this season. You cannot sell as many players as we did and expect results to get better. I, for one, am perfectly happy with what the club is doing, though. It is the only option that they have, try to utilise the promising youth and enable them to progress and become a good Championship side for the future. We'll lose a lot, probably play quite well in most of them, but there should be some good results there too. 21st would be a great season, hopefully the wage structure we have in place now should enable us to resist offers for Lallana in January or next summer, although that may be too much to ask from Lowe.

 

What needs to be done now is to shore up the defence. Going forward I think we have enough, more than some other teams that will be down the bottom, but we need experienced fullbacks. Lloyd James is a young central midfielder, not a Championship quality right back (this smacks of Rory Delap 2004/5 season). Andrew Surman has been one of our worst players this season IMO, and he was hardly impressive last year. I really hope other teams still rate him enough in January to offer 2-3million. Perry is a decent enough player still, and the jury is still out on Lancashire since we've only seen half an hour of him. We can only assume the worst for Michael Svensson, Jack Cork may have to step up and fill the void.

[Glasgow_Saint]

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

This is PRICELESS!!! :rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

Do you always post for a reaction Bournemouth?

 

As always – WA2 makes a golden contribution to the thread!

 

Pay your £5, post more and laws of averages say that one day you’ll post something of use!

 

Don’t be a cheap “Skate” pay your £5

[Thedelldays]

Lallana is not even in the same class as Walcott (or Bale for that matter). Walcott is playing regularly for a top 4 PL team, has scored an international hat trick and is expected to be a rising star. Lallana has skill, creativity and ability but lets not delude ourselves that he is going to be a future England International.

 

Arsenal took Walcott because they knew he was the real deal so long as he stayed fit.

 

When big teams pay that sort of money for 16 / 17 year old kids they know that barring injuries they will deliver on the biggest stages.

and young theo is doing just that...tore croatia apart, set up one against blackburn and whipped in one for the equaliser last night for arsenal in the CL in the last min...all in the last week alone

 

this boy is going to be supreme by the time he is 23

[PokingFun]

and young theo is doing just that...tore croatia apart, set up one against blackburn and whipped in one for the equaliser last night for arsenal in the CL in the last min...all in the last week alone

 

this boy is going to be supreme by the time he is 23

 

Completely agree and he is under the supervision of one of the best managers in the world at developing young talent to become top class.

 

None of our youngsters are anywhere near his class when he was 16 let alone now and we all need to accept that avoidance of relegation would be a success this season in my opinion.

[sperm_john]

we arent in a relegation fight at the begining of the season, we are just at the bottom of the table, and we will climb, stop panicking

[OldNick]

You're completely deluded. Arsenal took Walcott and agreed a 12m deal without him being the finished product.

you do use the word deluded a lot.

I tell you what I will bet you £50 that Lallana will not be sold in the Jan window. The money can go to any charity you choose. I await you to take me up on it.

[dubai_phil]

you do use the word deluded a lot.

I tell you what I will bet you £50 that Lallana will not be sold in the Jan window. The money can go to any charity you choose. I await you to take me up on it.

 

I agree, he won't...

 

He'll be loaned next week with an option to buy so we can afford some defenders:-)

[OldNick]

I agree, he won't...

 

He'll be loaned next week with an option to buy so we can afford some defenders:-)

they'll be some cheap defenders in that case

[mulletsaint]

Is this a piiss-take ?

 

You've spent years sneering at those of us who have been telling it like it is.

 

I think most of us know how it is, a lot of us had hope that things could turn out better though and yes it still could.

 

"Telling it like it is" on what proof? Why should we all take your word as gospel? There'd be mass suicides by Saints fans all around the world.

 

Things can change very quickly in football. You only have to look at Cardiff in 06-07 one minute looking certs for the title, the next they were in freefall. As i said on another thread after the Derby game and the Brum cup game, those that were there were raving about the performances. Pretty quiet then weren't you? It's only 3 matches later. Yes those performances haven't been to the same level, doesn't mean we're suddenly awful either.

 

I have problems with many of your posts and not only because they always appear negative. Any good points that you may make are generally lost due to the fact that you are incredibly melodramatic, not to mention seemingly under the delusion that only you are able to see the truth of of any situation regarding Saints. I would hazard a guess that even those who claim to know a lot about what has been happening over recent seasons (but strangely only ever seem to know one sides story, ever notice that?), actually know very little given how many twists and turns have been visible to us mere mortals. If it's this messy from the outside I dread to think what has really been going on.

[up and away]

After last nights efforts its clear we're in a relegation fight - time for us all to except it.

 

There is no "lets give it time" bo11ox - this team just isnt good enough!!

 

In a few years we've fallen from the premiership to a poor CCC team

 

Anyone who watched the end of last season under Pearson could have told you that. Even with Pearson there I could see no reason why we were not going to seriously struggle this season. Only after the late pre season and the early games did I feel we may have a reasonable shout of avoiding relegation. If we can keep the important players fit and the number of games is not an over riding factor than I think we have a chance. One feeling that has definitely changed is the pleasure from watching them play, even though we have been on the wrong end most of the time.

[Legod Second Coming]

For the record our last five games have been two wins, two losses and a draw... anyone would think we have gone twenty games without a win...

[Chez]

For the record our last five games have been two wins, two losses and a draw... anyone would think we have gone twenty games without a win...

 

4 defats in 6 league games and just one win is the flip side of that stat.

 

The fact that we are playing almost to our full potential IMO and still looking miles from good enough is my concern. We lack quality in every single department.

[Micky]

4 defats in 6 league games and just one win is the flip side of that stat.

 

The fact that we are playing almost to our full potential IMO and still looking miles from good enough is my concern. We lack quality in every single department.

 

Would take slight issue with that, Kelvin has looked quality all season - thank god...!!!

[Glasgow_Saint]

you do use the word deluded a lot.

I tell you what I will bet you £50 that Lallana will not be sold in the Jan window. The money can go to any charity you choose. I await you to take me up on it.

 

Good offer - Alps could share the windfall with his buddy WA2 and they could use the £'s to actually go and watch Saints live!

[OldNick]

Good offer - Alps could share the windfall with his buddy WA2 and they could use the £'s to actually go and watch Saints live!

 

I did put charity, although as he has not been back I suspect the conviction of his words are not quite as those of his head when push comes to shove. The money would be coming to my choice of charity anyway

[derry]

It's quite simple, some are happy to slag and slate the team but cannot be bothered to watch them.

 

Really need a forum for the supporters that go to the matches. Too many knowalls on here, who wouldn't know the players if they bumped into them, but can still give lectures on the team they've never seen.

[derry]

JP may have all the qualities of a great coach although he is coming at it late in his career.

I honestly believe he needs to be the Coach to a team Manager as I believe neither him, Wotte or any of the coaching staff are Managerial material.

Most good clubs have a Manager who manages/co-ordinates the coaching team and rarely actually coach as such.

Lawrie Mac was not a Coach and invariably was led tactically by his senior players before and during a game when things had to change.

JP was being advised by Wotton and Perry to a certain extent and would do well to have an old lag alongside him in the dug out.

 

AND NO, NO,NO, NOT LOWEY HE HAS PROVED AGAIN HE IS NOT FOOTBALL MANAGER MATERIAL.

 

Lawrie was a coach at Sheff Wed, before taking to management.

[derry]

BS the performance was a lot better last night than a lot of games under any of the managers you care to mention from last season.

How many games last season would we have come back from a goal down? The concern for me was the tiredness in the last 15minutes that let Ipswich attack constantly, but we keep our nerve and the point.When we equalised I said to my daughter I'd be happy if the ref blew now and got the point.

 

I think maybe 10 men for over an hour on Sunday, Nick.

[derry]

Completely agree and he is under the supervision of one of the best managers in the world at developing young talent to become top class.

 

None of our youngsters are anywhere near his class when he was 16 let alone now and we all need to accept that avoidance of relegation would be a success this season in my opinion.

 

Don't see the point of this, Walcott is playing for England, in the Premier and Champions league, we are hoping for a finish about a third up the CCC. Of course our players don't compare.

[OldNick]

I think maybe 10 men for over an hour on Sunday, Nick.

What you do with your free time is of no interest to me Derry

[offix]

I wonder.......

 

Whether our first real chicken may be coming home to roost borne out of enthusiasm but inexperience.

 

The reserve & academy teams play 25/30 games a year. The first team 50+

 

Most of us can remember back to the days of WGS with the incredible amount of work done in the pre-season period - stories of players having to run up sand dunes until they vomitted, then doing it again and again. In that season we played hard, fast and pressing football and were probably the fittest team in the PL.

 

During THIS close season our coaching staff - did not have actual Football League experience, and as I recall from reading many of the articles we pre-season started early and it was all about pace and movement, and playing matches.

 

Now I am not a sports coach, but I seem to recall that there are some differences between stamina training and speed training. With kids suddenly playing 2 or 3 games a week, I actually wonder whether they are suddenly feeling the strain mentally and physically, did they build enough stamina training pre-season?

 

To me mental tiredness is as big a problem as inexperience. Gillett covered miles in his first few games, now Lallana is doing that = Gillett seems to have burnt out, how long can Lallana keep going.

 

I'll not judge anything yet, but trends are appearing. I wonder if only 4 changes on Saturday will be enough and whether the Rotheram game is time for some to have a rest

 

Very good observations. Fitness, as opposed to speed, seems ti be the key indeed.

[JustMike]

all things considered, i didnt think a 2-2 draw with a very good ipswich side was a bad result, especially after the qpr game.

[IFHP]

BS the performance was a lot better last night than a lot of games under any of the managers you care to mention from last season.

How many games last season would we have come back from a goal down? The concern for me was the tiredness in the last 15minutes that let Ipswich attack constantly, but we keep our nerve and the point.When we equalised I said to my daughter I'd be happy if the ref blew now and got the point.

 

To answer 1 off your points 7 times last season’s team came from a goal down to either draw or win the game.

 

Stoke City Home 1-0 down after 9 mins and won the game 3-2

Sheffield United away 1-0 down to win 2-1

Coventry away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

Crystal Palace away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

S****horpe away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

West Brom away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

Sheffield home 1-0 down to win 3-2

[OldNick]

To answer 1 off your points 7 times last season’s team came from a goal down to either draw or win the game.

 

Stoke City Home 1-0 down after 9 mins and won the game 3-2

Sheffield United away 1-0 down to win 2-1

Coventry away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

Crystal Palace away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

S****horpe away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

West Brom away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

Sheffield home 1-0 down to win 3-2

more times that I had thought.You are wrong in at least 1 of those

[Glasgow_Saint]

To answer 1 off your points 7 times last season’s team came from a goal down to either draw or win the game.

 

Stoke City Home 1-0 down after 9 mins and won the game 3-2

Sheffield United away 1-0 down to win 2-1

Coventry away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

Crystal Palace away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

S****horpe away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

West Brom away 1-0 down to draw 1-1

Sheffield home 1-0 down to win 3-2

 

Thats wrong - we went 1 up (Lallana) and then WBA equalised

[OldNick]

Thats wrong - we went 1 up (Lallana) and then WBA equalised

Ohhhhhh you ruined it I was hoping he come back and say he was wrong

[badgerx16]

Really need a forum for the supporters that go to the matches. Too many knowalls on here, who wouldn't know the players if they bumped into them, but can still give lectures on the team they've never seen.

Why not have a forum for fans that have watched on telly ? You do not have to be at SMS to watch Saints, and you can even listen to some of the matches on the radio - you might not actually see the game but you can get a bl00dy good feel for what is happening !