Leo Scienza

[Midfield_General]

6 minutes ago, CSA96 said:

The only thing I’d say is that he didn’t really help Manning out much and Manning wasn’t having a good game, perhaps as a result of a lack of support. WS pushed Fellows over to the left who, based on selection this season, is someone he sees as having a higher defensive work rate 

Thanks. Wasn't Scienza playing in the middle though? If the left hand side was the problem, surely that should have been on Fraser (who stayed on the pitch for another 20 odd minutes after Scienza went off) to track back more, as that was his side. How is it Scienza's problem if he's playing at 10? 

[saintant]

1 hour ago, S-Clarke said:

He wasn't afraid to have some punt shots either, just take a chance every now and then - you never know. Dribbles around the pitch well, same as Fellows.

Surely it has to be Fellows right, Leo left, Azaz in the middle? That should be potent creatively at this level, but it all boils down to who the heck puts the ball into the net in the 6 yard box. We have zilch.

Sounds very good in theory but what formation are you suggesting they play in and who plays up front? I think this is Will Still's problem - who plays where and in what formation. If he can get that right we will start to see more wins although the injury to Stewart has come at the worst possible time unless it was a minor twinge and he came off as a precaution.

[saintant]

1 hour ago, trousers said:

 

Matsuki is another case in point. Whenever he's played for us (which isn't much, granted) his first thought is to gain ground in the opponents half and shoot on instinct from outside the box. Why do we put these players with a natural positive attitude back in their box rather than embrace them on the field?  He scores a screamer in the cup then never to be seen again. Bizarre.

Yes, it's baffling that he's never even used as a sub to at least give him a chance to show what he can do.

[CSA96]

15 minutes ago, Midfield_General said:

Thanks. Wasn't Scienza playing in the middle though? If the left hand side was the problem, surely that should have been on Fraser (who stayed on the pitch for another 20 odd minutes after Scienza went off) to track back more, as that was his side. How is it Scienza's problem if he's playing at 10? 

He wasn't playing as a 10, we were playing a 3-4-2-1 with Arma up top and Fellows and Scienza as the two just off him to either side. Fellows was tracking back to help Fraser on the right side but Manning was looking very exposed on the left

[Midfield_General]

3 minutes ago, CSA96 said:

He wasn't playing as a 10, we were playing a 3-4-2-1 with Arma up top and Fellows and Scienza as the two just off him to either side. Fellows was tracking back to help Fraser on the right side but Manning was looking very exposed on the left

Gotcha. My stream was so bad I just had a load of random yellow splodges most of the time, so I appreciate the detail, thanks. 

[S-Clarke]

2 hours ago, saintant said:

Sounds very good in theory but what formation are you suggesting they play in and who plays up front? I think this is Will Still's problem - who plays where and in what formation. If he can get that right we will start to see more wins although the injury to Stewart has come at the worst possible time unless it was a minor twinge and he came off as a precaution.

Up front is the conundrum, the more I look at the squad the more horrendous it looks. Not in terms of 'quality', but the balance of it is all over the shop.

You can't pick a balanced side.

But I'll give it a go.

McCarthy

Mads - Wood - Quarshie - Jelert

         Charles   Jander

 Fellows          Azaz         Leo

                Armstrong

The obvious issue is there's no focal point to play off and Armstrong can't play through the middle really, but neither can Archer and our only other focal point is Downs and let's not go there. What a total mess we've made of that central position, it's almost made every other signing null and void.

[saintant]

48 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Up front is the conundrum, the more I look at the squad the more horrendous it looks. Not in terms of 'quality', but the balance of it is all over the shop.

You can't pick a balanced side.

But I'll give it a go.

McCarthy

Mads - Wood - Quarshie - Jelert

         Charles   Jander

 Fellows          Azaz         Leo

                Armstrong

The obvious issue is there's no focal point to play off and Armstrong can't play through the middle really, but neither can Archer and our only other focal point is Downs and let's not go there. What a total mess we've made of that central position, it's almost made every other signing null and void.

I thought you'd struggle but full marks for trying. You admit and everyone knows AA up front through the middle doesn't work. Whichever way you cut it SR and Spors fucked up by signing Downs instead of an experienced centre forward with a bit of strength and nous. Still is snookered I'm afraid.

[hypochondriac]

7 minutes ago, saintant said:

I thought you'd struggle but full marks for trying. You admit and everyone knows AA up front through the middle doesn't work. Whichever way you cut it SR and Spors fucked up by signing Downs instead of an experienced centre forward with a bit of strength and nous. Still is snookered I'm afraid.

I agree. I'm not sure what formation to play up front without Stewart. I'm not sure that aspect is entirely Still's fault.

[Tommy Mulgrew]

4 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

The obvious issue is there's no focal point to play off and Armstrong can't play through the middle really, but neither can Archer and our only other focal point is Downs and let's not go there. What a total mess we've made of that central position, it's almost made every other signing null and void.

Agreed.  But we have plenty of wildcards we could try: Aribo, Quarshie, THB and Stephens to name but four.  I assume that none of the under21s is ready to step up yet.  Prepare to be astounded at our forthcoming ingenious solution!

[HnycS]

1 hour ago, Tommy Mulgrew said:

Agreed.  But we have plenty of wildcards we could try: Aribo, Quarshie, THB and Stephens to name but four.  I assume that none of the under21s is ready to step up yet.  Prepare to be astounded at our forthcoming ingenious solution!

No the correct answer is we have to play without a recognized CF, given the players we have Archer (MAYBE even Downs) will score plenty alongside Arma if they get the correct service. Slinging high balls from defence and the wings is not at all useful to those forwards. Play it on the ground as they make runs, they can and will score.

[benjii]

7 hours ago, HnycS said:

No the correct answer is we have to play without a recognized CF, given the players we have Archer (MAYBE even Downs) will score plenty alongside Arma if they get the correct service. Slinging high balls from defence and the wings is not at all useful to those forwards. Play it on the ground as they make runs, they can and will score.

Correct.

We still have an embarrassment of riches, but inept management.

Edited Monday at 05:11 by benjii

[hypochondriac]

Without Stewart I think we need to play something like 

McCarthy 

Jelert Edwards/Wood Quarshire Manning 

Jander Charles

Fellows Scienza

Armstrong Archer 

I'm not sure there's space for Azaz. 

Edited Monday at 14:05 by hypochondriac

[CheshireSaint]

7 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

Without Stewart I think we need to play something like 

McCarthy 

Jelert Edwards Quarshire Manning 

Jander Charles

Fellows Scienza

Armstrong Archer 

I'm not sure there's space for Azaz. 

Unless Azaz goes up front. Scored 17 goals last season so knows where the net is. Might be worth a gamble.

[Saint_clark]

20 hours ago, saintant said:

Yes, it's baffling that he's never even used as a sub to at least give him a chance to show what he can do.

I'd forgotten all about Matsuki, has he even got on the pitch since he scored that screamer?

[benjii]

1 hour ago, Saint_clark said:

I'd forgotten all about Matsuki, has he even got on the pitch since he scored that screamer?

Ten/fifteen minutes at Watford, I think?

[benjii]

2 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

Without Stewart I think we need to play something like 

McCarthy 

Jelert Edwards Quarshire Manning 

Jander Charles

Fellows Scienza

Armstrong Archer 

I'm not sure there's space for Azaz. 

Agreed, although with Manning's lack of active defending, I think we need Armstrong or Fraser in front of him to protect him. Unless Jelert can play left, then Mads could play right.

[hypochondriac]

54 minutes ago, benjii said:

Agreed, although with Manning's lack of active defending, I think we need Armstrong or Fraser in front of him to protect him. Unless Jelert can play left, then Mads could play right.

Don't get me wrong I would much rather drop manning I just don't think we will.

[saintant]

54 minutes ago, benjii said:

Agreed, although with Manning's lack of active defending, I think we need Armstrong or Fraser in front of him to protect him. Unless Jelert can play left, then Mads could play right.

I think when we signed Jelert it was said he can play on either side of the pitch.

[benjii]

53 minutes ago, saintant said:

I think when we signed Jelert it was said he can play on either side of the pitch.

Inshallah, brother. 

[Dman]

1 hour ago, saintant said:

I think when we signed Jelert it was said he can play on either side of the pitch.

We seem reluctant to play him on either. Very strange. 

[Dman]

4 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

Without Stewart I think we need to play something like 

McCarthy 

Jelert Edwards Quarshire Manning 

Jander Charles

Fellows Scienza

Armstrong Archer 

I'm not sure there's space for Azaz. 

McCarthy 

Jelert THB Wood Manning or Wellington (when fit)

Jander Charles 

Fellows Azaz Scienza 

Armstronf / Archer 

 

would be my go to. On current form, Armstrong has to start. I don't like him through the middle but I also think Fellows and Scienza also need to start. 

we need to find a way to get the ball into the 3 behind them more often, so that we can play through balls rather than expecting him to hold the cball up. 

[Chez]

16 hours ago, Tommy Mulgrew said:

Agreed.  But we have plenty of wildcards we could try: Aribo, Quarshie, THB and Stephens to name but four.  

You are seriously suggesting we give Quarshie a run out at centre forward?

[leesaint88]

27 minutes ago, Dman said:

We seem reluctant to play him on either. Very strange. 

Everton pulled out of signing him earlier in the summer due to his injury record. I wonder if there is something there...

[saintant]

23 minutes ago, leesaint88 said:

Everton pulled out of signing him earlier in the summer due to his injury record. I wonder if there is something there...

He's never been mentioned as one of those injured at any press conferences as far as I recall.

[Dman]

1 minute ago, saintant said:

He's never been mentioned as one of those injured at any press conferences as far as I recall.

He's not injured. He played against Liverpool and has been in the past few squads. 

Just not fancied. 

[saintant]

Just now, Dman said:

He's not injured. He played against Liverpool and has been in the past few squads. 

Just not fancied. 

Strange because most fans seemed to think he played very well against Liverpool - higher level opposition than Championship so you'd like to think he'd easily cope in our games.

[hypochondriac]

1 hour ago, Dman said:

McCarthy 

Jelert THB Wood Manning or Wellington (when fit)

Jander Charles 

Fellows Azaz Scienza 

Armstronf / Archer 

 

would be my go to. On current form, Armstrong has to start. I don't like him through the middle but I also think Fellows and Scienza also need to start. 

we need to find a way to get the ball into the 3 behind them more often, so that we can play through balls rather than expecting him to hold the cball up. 

But we know that Armstrong and Archer don't really work up top on their own.

[bugenhagen]

4 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

But we know that Armstrong and Archer don't really work up top on their own.

I think this is where a good manager shows his worth. Play the hand you are dealt.
There is a way to play with smaller forwards, and not the target man up front. With what Still has available until January, he has to make something work with either Archer and/or Armstrong up top. 

[hypochondriac]

2 minutes ago, bugenhagen said:

I think this is where a good manager shows his worth. Play the hand you are dealt.
There is a way to play with smaller forwards, and not the target man up front. With what Still has available until January, he has to make something work with either Archer and/or Armstrong up top. 

I agree that's basically our major problem. I personally can't believe there isn't a way we could play that gets the best out of Archer and it probably involves Armstrong coming in from the right.

Edited Monday at 14:13 by hypochondriac

[Dman]

13 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

But we know that Armstrong and Archer don't really work up top on their own.

In the current system, correct. If we can somehow find a way to get the ball into the feet of Scienza, Azaz, Fellows - that gives us an opportunity for players like Archer or Armstrong to play on the shoulder. 

[saintant]

Play Scienza on the right and get him cutting in and shooting with his stronger left foot or hitting the byline and cutting back low crosses - do the same with Tom Fellows on the left. These two would then start scoring goals and causing more chaos from which AA would benefit through the centre. It is pointless hitting high crosses if we don't have a big centre forward so we have to try something different. Play Scienza and Fellows either side of Azaz who can pull the strings with his passing and can also score in a 4231 set up;

Macca

Mads Wood Quarshie Jelert

Charles Jander

Scienza Azaz Fellows

Arma

Edited Monday at 19:02 by saintant

[Tommy Mulgrew]

6 hours ago, Chez said:

You are seriously suggesting we give Quarshie a run out at centre forward?

No.  If you read the next sentence in my earlier post you will see that it ends with an exclamation mark.  Perhaps I should have used an emoji.  Still is known as an adaptable manager, fitting in with the players he has available to him, but we have not seen much success from his adaptability so far.  He could adjust our style of play to suit Archer or Armstrong (or both) but if he does not and wants to continue with a bruiser of a CF to get his head to crosses coming from our wingers or wing-backs the players I listed are those we have who are well over 6’.  We don’t yet know what he will do.  Fact is often stranger than fiction.  We might be surprised by his choices of a central attacker in our next few matches if Stewart is unavailable.  I don’t mind what he does as long as it gets us several wins.