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MoPe, what should the board do?  

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  1. 1. MoPe, what should the board do?



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Absolute rubbish. The players are good enough, they just lack motivation, direction and any sort of tactics. List me all the players you would rather have from West Brom, Stoke, Newcastle, Huddersfield etc we are going down with this clown so why not change it now and give us half a chance. Nothing to lose

 

Lukasz Fabianski, Lewis Dunk, Xherdan Shaqiri, Glenn Murray, Tammy Abraham, Jordan Ayew, Jamaal Lascelles, Alfie Mawson, Ben Mee, Abdoulaye Doucouré, Aaron Mooy, Matt Ritchie, Pascal Groß, Wilfired Zaha etc. With the exception of Charlie Austin when he's fit, I don't think any rival club or even some Championship clubs would want to swap their central defensive and striking options for ours.

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Lukasz Fabianski, Lewis Dunk, Xherdan Shaqiri, Glenn Murray, Tammy Abraham, Jordan Ayew, Jamaal Lascelles, Alfie Mawson, Ben Mee, Abdoulaye Doucouré, Aaron Mooy, Matt Ritchie, Pascal Groß, Wilfired Zaha etc. With the exception of Charlie Austin when he's fit, I don't think any rival club or even some Championship clubs would want to swap their central defensive and striking options for ours.

 

Not sure your point here...Abraham has scored what 4 goals? How many has Murray scored? They are no better than our strikers?

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Not sure your point here...Abraham has scored what 4 goals? How many has Murray scored? They are no better than our strikers?

 

So far thi season, Murray has scored 10 and Abraham has scored 7 so, yes, they are better than our strikers, with the exception of Charlie Austin when he's fit. What is your point, by the way?

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So far thi season, Murray has scored 10 and Abraham has scored 7 so, yes, they are better than our strikers, with the exception of Charlie Austin when he's fit. What is your point, by the way?

 

Not in the league they haven't...Abraham has 4 and Murray has 8...Abrham may score in a cup game they win 8-1 but his return in the league is pretty poor.

My point is they are all much of a muchness...there isn't a lot in the squads...look at Swansea...rubbish, dead and buried but now on an amazing run..same squad, same players..the only difference is the manager.

Our squad is no worse than any of those in the bottom 10.

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Our strikers are actually very decent. It's the goon that plays them isolated in a stubborn 1 up front formation every single sodding week that is the problem.

 

 

Shane long has missed hatful's of good chances over the last two seasons. Tadic, JWP, Gabbi, Hoj, Redmond and Boufal are all guilty of being wasteful in front of goal

 

The one up front is an arguement about creating chances and could we create more and that's down to the manager.

 

What isn't down to the manager is finishing the chances we do create (and despite the popular myth we do create chances) and that is down to poor players.

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100% in favour of replacing pellegringo but the harsh reality we all have to accept is they really really have left it way too late, can't see anyone wanting to come here under huge pressure to keep us up & thinking they have the time available now to change things around, the words "doomed" & "inevitable" spring to mind

 

The players like him for obvious reasons he doesn't work them too hard & is clearly a easy going man that is very easy to manipulate. Reed himself knows that only too well.

 

If I could get paid 60k a week for a bit of gentle jogging & a coffee & chat with the manager or an intense training program that takes me to the verge of death, I know which one id choose!

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

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Shane long has missed hatful's of good chances over the last two seasons. Tadic, JWP, Gabbi, Hoj, Redmond and Boufal are all guilty of being wasteful in front of goal

 

The one up front is an arguement about creating chances and could we create more and that's down to the manager.

 

What isn't down to the manager is finishing the chances we do create (and despite the popular myth we do create chances) and that is down to poor players.

 

One up front is asking a hell of a lot of the striker. That’s why it’s such a bad idea.

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One up front is asking a hell of a lot of the striker. That’s why it’s such a bad idea.

 

 

Yes but it's two different arguments

 

A) is can the manager set us up/play a different way to create more chances to score?

 

The answer is clearly yes

 

B) Would we score more if we had players that were better at converting the chances we do create?

 

The answer is again yes

 

It's not a one ir the other we have a manager combined with poor attacking players a perfect recipe for relegation ( doubly so when you add a pinch of under performing defence)

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Yes but it's two different arguments

 

A) is can the manager set us up/play a different way to create more chances to score?

 

The answer is clearly yes

 

B) Would we score more if we had players that were better at converting the chances we do create?

 

The answer is again yes

 

It's not a one ir the other we have a manager combined with poor attacking players a perfect recipe for relegation ( doubly so when you add a pinch of under performing defence)

 

True, but having two front would be more than twice as effective giving the options for a one-two or conversion of a rebound. It also gives the defenders much bigger problems.

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I can see what both of you are saying here about whether it is the quality of the strikers or the manager that is the issue. The truth is, of course, that it is to some degree both. Quality strikers are hard to come by and/or often expensive, so it is hard to acquire the highest quality strikers; and we can all see the weaknesses in the strikers that we have: Austin is a great goal poacher but lacks pace; Long works hard and has pace but often lacks that killer instinct in front of goal; Gabbiadini brings some flare and variety to the attack but is inconsistent; Redmond can dribble past players but his shooting is woeful... and so on...

 

The facts of the matter, however, are that all of our squad used to get a lot more goals than they now do, including the strikers. That, therefore, brings into focus the questions about how well they are being coached and whether they are being given the right tactical instructions. Back before Christmas there was a big issue around Redmond and Guardiola and the long and short of that was that Guardiola was criticising Redmond for not playing to his strengths, but Redmond asserted that he was doing what he had been asked to do by Pellegrino. I suspect you could find similar stories throughout the squad with players trying to maintain unity and backing the coach by doing what he asks, but finding themselves frustrated because those approaches are not delivering the success they could achieve if they played to a different set of instructions.

 

A change of manager may not suddenly turn some of our players into world beaters, but it may enable them to play to their strengths instead of playing to a coaching dogma set by Pellegrinio which clearly is not working.

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I can see what both of you are saying here about whether it is the quality of the strikers or the manager that is the issue. The truth is, of course, that it is to some degree both. Quality strikers are hard to come by and/or often expensive, so it is hard to acquire the highest quality strikers; and we can all see the weaknesses in the strikers that we have: Austin is a great goal poacher but lacks pace; Long works hard and has pace but often lacks that killer instinct in front of goal; Gabbiadini brings some flare and variety to the attack but is inconsistent; Redmond can dribble past players but his shooting is woeful... and so on...

 

 

 

 

 

The facts of the matter, however, are that all of our squad used to get a lot more goals than they now do, including the strikers. That, therefore, brings into focus the questions about how well they are being coached and whether they are being given the right tactical instructions. Back before Christmas there was a big issue around Redmond and Guardiola and the long and short of that was that Guardiola was criticising Redmond for not playing to his strengths, but Redmond asserted that he was doing what he had been asked to do by Pellegrino. I suspect you could find similar stories throughout the squad with players trying to maintain unity and backing the coach by doing what he asks, but finding themselves frustrated because those approaches are not delivering the success they could achieve if they played to a different set of instructions.

 

 

 

 

 

A change of manager may not suddenly turn some of our players into world beaters, but it may enable them to play to their strengths instead of playing to a coaching dogma set by Pellegrinio which clearly is not working.

 

 

 

I'm not arguing with you the manager is crap and should be getting more out of the squad..... however when this squad "used to get a lot more goals" was when we had the likes of Mane and Pelle and before that Lambert and a pre injury Jrod.

 

 

 

One of the clubs biggest failing has been the mistake of thinking an injury prone Austin, Shane Long, and a post injury Jrod (or Gabbi) was a good enough strike force for the PL.

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I'm not arguing with you the manager is crap and should be getting more out of the squad..... however when this squad "used to get a lot more goals" was when we had the likes of Mane and Pelle and before that Lambert and a pre injury Jrod.

 

 

 

One of the clubs biggest failing has been the mistake of thinking an injury prone Austin, Shane Long, and a post injury Jrod (or Gabbi) was a good enough strike force for the PL.

This, this indeed. And it's so bloody obvious to most of us, why the **** can't/couldn't Reed and co. see it too? And this blindness by those idiots goes back 4 windows (ever since Pelle and Mane left). And don't get me started on the goalkeeping situation.

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Do you ever watch any games of football, ever? Clearly not. Or, if you do, you don't actually pay any attention as to how football is played.

 

Don’t be such a snot. I’m willing to bet that I’ve played a lot more games than you, watched a lot more games than you, refereed a lot more games than you.

 

So, my opinion is different to yours. If you have a different one then put up some arguments to support it.

 

Ad hominem arguments have no place here.

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This, this indeed. And it's so bloody obvious to most of us, why the **** can't/couldn't Reed and co. see it too? And this blindness by those idiots goes back 4 windows (ever since Pelle and Mane left). And don't get me started on the goalkeeping situation.
the club has been playing fans for years,roll the majority of fans on the tummy and they come back for more. KL and Reed were untouchable and it was heresy if you said anything negative about them, 2 years on and slowly the penny is dropping for fans.

Reed wrote a coaching manual, no doubt our club was the laboratory for his idea, now we are seeing the results of his work.

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the club has been playing fans for years,roll the majority of fans on the tummy and they come back for more.

 

You're back to this old routine are you?

 

Of course you've never explained what your point is, or given any examples of a comparable football club that isn't "playing the fans".

Edited by CB Fry
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You're back to this old routine are you?

 

Of course you've never explained what your point is, or given any examples of a comparable football club that isn't "playing the fans".

 

The thing that REALLY ****ed me off and made me decide enough was enough and not to renew our season tickets was renewal fee being the same for new buys or people who have had them for decade's. It may sound stupid to some but after the poor football we saw at home I felt it was two fingers to those loyal fans who were there thru the crap times!

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You're back to this old routine are you?

 

Of course you've never explained what your point is, or given any examples of a comparable football club that isn't "playing the fans".

 

Give it a rest. If anyone is back to their 'old routine' it is you. Always quick to criticise but intolerant if anyone dare challenge your own views.

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The thing that REALLY ****ed me off and made me decide enough was enough and not to renew our season tickets was renewal fee being the same for new buys or people who have had them for decade's. It may sound stupid to some but after the poor football we saw at home I felt it was two fingers to those loyal fans who were there thru the crap times!

 

Fair enough, that's a customer service/loyalty issue then which isn't Les Reed's remit.

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The thing that REALLY ****ed me off and made me decide enough was enough and not to renew our season tickets was renewal fee being the same for new buys or people who have had them for decade's. It may sound stupid to some but after the poor football we saw at home I felt it was two fingers to those loyal fans who were there thru the crap times!

 

That is how taxation works! The club may want a certain amount of guaranteed income from ticket sales using algorithms built on seat sales data accumulated over the years. If they reduce prices for some they have to up prices for others to reach the same target income. So as you expect to be rewarded for long service any new ST recruits the Club hopes to attract inevitably will be asked to pay the highest prices. Now just imagine you are a new ST applicant. You'll soon notice that all other ST ticket prices are lower than what you are being asked to pay...

 

Whereas we live in a world where newcomers (to energy deals or anything else) are attracted by lower prices than currently being applied to the majority of customers.

 

Hmm, that doesn't sound like a very good deal.

 

Even as a senior I get no discounts but I have a choice. If it helps keep prices down so that a few more less lucky folk get the chance to squeeze themselves in on a Saturday afternoon then so much the better.

 

It is not possible to be all things to all people despite what the me-first people want

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That is how taxation works! The club may want a certain amount of guaranteed income from ticket sales using algorithms built on seat sales data accumulated over the years. If they reduce prices for some they have to up prices for others to reach the same target income. So as you expect to be rewarded for long service any new ST recruits the Club hopes to attract inevitably will be asked to pay the highest prices. Now just imagine you are a new ST applicant. You'll soon notice that all other ST ticket prices are lower than what you are being asked to pay...

 

Whereas we live in a world where newcomers (to energy deals or anything else) are attracted by lower prices than currently being applied to the majority of customers.

 

Hmm, that doesn't sound like a very good deal.

 

Even as a senior I get no discounts but I have a choice. If it helps keep prices down so that a few more less lucky folk get the chance to squeeze themselves in on a Saturday afternoon then so much the better.

 

It is not possible to be all things to all people despite what the me-first people want

 

Then why change it after years of it being like that , especially after our worst season at home that I can remember! ? Also with 100''s of millions of pounds rolling in from TV money why should their "target income" be my problem ?

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Murray is dog****. He's scored a few because there's a lot of poor sides this season. Saints being woefully mismanaged doesn't make players suddenly useless. It's one season. This black and white X has scored Y so is better is utter crap.

 

So what does that make our strikers who can't score against these poor sides then?

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