Kingsbridge Saint Posted 1 October, 2009 Share Posted 1 October, 2009 OK so the Rovers defeat hurt - excacerbated by the nature of it in the 96th minute. So how about an objective assessment of the season so far? It's all about points, not performances, or scoring from open play etc etc so lets look at that: August 5 games 3 points = 0.6 per game September 5 games 6 points = 1.2 per game Now I know some months might throw up tougher fixtures than others, so you might prefer to use a two or three month rolling average to balance that out a bit statistically, but personally I am using this sort of measure to see if Pards has pulled us out of our nosedive and deserves support. We know that Cortese has a two year plan to get us out of L1 so I think if Pards keeps improving the above numbers and starts getting it nearer 2.0 by the end of the season we'll be safe this year and on track for promotion next season, in line with the bigger picture. So I am suggesting, lets be objective, and not call for Pardews head on the basis of the odd crap result, however frustrating. They are going to happen. And fwiw I am a pessimist on here usually aligned with Alpines view of things.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 We've all complained about the lack of width so far this season - really encouraging are the interviews on Saintsplayer, where the clips of training show that we are concentrating heavily on getting the ball wide quickly and crossing it in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 We've all complained about the lack of width so far this season - really encouraging are the interviews on Saintsplayer, where the clips of training show that we are concentrating heavily on getting the ball wide quickly and crossing it in. Oh Karp, we've become Ebbsfleet United. AP looks on here, sees what we're moaning about and then works on it Alan - mate, there are some VERY weird people on here (myself included) DON'T listen to us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick1976.4.38 Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 get some width,get murty fit and a striker to help ricki once the crosses start coming in and hey ho off we go,up the league,100% behind ap,coyr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Season so far........... CRAP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordswoodsaints Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Season so far........... CRAP I'd agree with this. You can dress it up as much as you like but it's still crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeky Monkey Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Assessment = Underwhelming and Well under expectations set Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHAPEL END CHARLIE Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 (edited) Objective assessments are easier said than done because when it comes to Southampton Football Club few if any of us on here can be truly objective - we're too close to the subject . Baring that limitation in mind lets look at the facts that can't be manipulated by interpretation : Played - 10 Won - 1 Drawn - 6 Lost - 3 We started the season in 24th place 10 points away from safety , two months later we find ourselves still rooted to the bottom of the table 10 points adrift of safety . For the life of me I can't see how/why so many on here seem to be satisfied with this level of performance . However inventively you try and twist and turn the stats , whatever excuses you care to buy into the plain fact of the matter is that we've made a pretty poor start to the season - and that my friends is the simple (and objective) truth . Edited 2 October, 2009 by CHAPEL END CHARLIE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 to date?? All I can see is that we need another 51 points or so from our remaining 36 games to just stay in the crap league.It's do-able but probably only just. We probably need to win 15 or so of those games and get 6 or 7 draws. Th margin for error has now become extremely fine.So we've won 1 out of 10 to date and that needs to change very quickly.Home draws are now no good to us at all. We need to tighten up the defence-again,because when we score 2 at home that should be enough. We need to get a proper right back in -now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 to date?? All I can see is that we need another 51 points or so from our remaining 36 games to just stay in the crap league.It's do-able but probably only just. We probably need to win 15 or so of those games and get 6 or 7 draws. Th margin for error has now become extremely fine.So we've won 1 out of 10 to date and that needs to change very quickly.Home draws are now no good to us at all. We need to tighten up the defence-again,because when we score 2 at home that should be enough. We need to get a proper right back in -now. What about the left back where all three of Bristol Rovers goals came from? As opposed to the right back where none of their goals came from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 No one can deny that being in the relegation zone after nine games is a poor start (discounting the minus points). It's not good enough and things need to improve. Are they? Yes. Fast enough? No. Will they still further? We have to wait and see. My fervent hope is that by the end of October we will be firing on all cylinders. At the moment we are misfiring. The defence looks right but then concedes three. We can't score, then we do, but the defence concedes. And our finishing is just not good enough. on Tuesday we should have won 4-3 - we missed two great chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surrey1saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Work in progress,could and need to,do a lot better.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topcat Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 A realistic assessment is that August's terrible form was caused by the Administrator and Pinnacle wasting valuable time. September's form would just keep us away from relegation IF we had not suffered the points deduction Lowe cost us through his stupidity. The one thing that cannot be faulted is that thousands of supporters have come back even though we are 1 division lower. Which proved those right who said that Lowe was costing thousands of supporters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West End Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 You cant deny it has been a bad start on the pitch after 10 games we defo should have points on the board things have to improve quickly as has been pointed out the margin for error is reducing game by game. I still have a feel good factor about our club team manager & fans the owners are fab I like the way AP goes about his business I like the players he has brought in. It seems to me we are so close to being a really good side we have played in patches very well for me our only shortcomings are in wide midfield areas & i truly believe we will sort that out & push on. How fantastic is it that a club that has suffered like us & is still bottom on minus points has the support it has been getting ? I cant be alone in thinking we are so nearly there just hope the fans keep the faith the only way is up change is the last thing we need lets keep faith with AP & his team the good times are coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 season reminds me very much of last season. Lots of pretty passing football with a lack of real cutting edge. I wonder if (like last season) we'll slowly lose our confidence, stop playing elaberate passing football, get rid of the manager and end up playing hoof ball? I hope not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningtonCrescent Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Objective assessments are easier said than done because when it comes to Southampton Football Club few if any of us on here can be truly objective - we're too close to the subject . Baring that limitation in mind lets look at the facts that can't be manipulated by interpretation : Played - 10 Won - 1 Drawn - 6 Lost - 3 We started the season in 24th place 10 points away from safety , two months later we find ourselves still rooted to the bottom of the table 10 points adrift of safety . For the life of me I can't how/why so many on here seem to be satisfied with this level of performance . However inventively you try and twist and turn the stats , whatever excuses you care to buy into the plain fact of the matter is that we've made a pretty poor start to the season - and that my friends is the simple (and objective) truth . Once again, an argument based soley on the facts whilst ignoring the circumstances leading up this season...... and I refer to last season as much to the lack of a pre-season and administration.... Yes, for any club without the preverbial "Ball and Chain" we have been lumbered with, it would be a terrible start to a season. However....... When faced with the odds we were at the start of the season, you have to set goals and then measure "success" based on that measure...... I'm sure AP and NC will have done that and i'm sure we are close to the lower end of those expectations.... but still driving to wards the next one...... For me, the aim was to get out of negative points by the end of September - we failed, but by the smallest margin. We have lost points where we should have gained them and shown significant improvement match by match....... The next goal I set in my own mind was to be out of the bottom four by Xmas. This is still very achievable and therefore any knee-jerk reaction against meeting objectives would be premature. Perhaps you'd like to set out what your own realistic aims were for Saints this season, given the situation we were in with the squad decimated by last's years folly and the pre-season shennanigans? In NC and AP's minds it will be about targets and achievements against those targets - as you may expect for any business run sensibly. People have "personal developments plans" and "objective setting" at their place of work, where measurable objectives are set along with a plan of how the employer can support these through training, investment and structure. Saints is now being run in this professional manner and I would fully expect there to be written objectives for AP as well as others to meet. These would be reviewed regularly and revisd where necessary. When AP (or others) fall short of achieving these (for whatever reason), then they would be re-written to make them realistic or the employee would be on shaky ground. I have great faith that we are no longer being run on the same basis that we suffered under with previous regimes and that the revolving door policy won't continue - AP will only be moved/removed if he fails to hit the objectives agreed with NC AND he has recieved all the employer support promised in order to hit them! Simples...... Bring on Gillingham and the next step towards our ultimate collective goal - safety from relegation and a club built strongly from the ground up to give us the next chance of promotion next season. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Saturday Boy Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 I wouldn't be overly fussed at the start we've had if we started the season like everyone else on 0 points, but the 10 point deduction is like a noose around our neck which is slowly tightening. We should put away all thoughts of aiming to finish mid-table and pushing on for promotion next season and roll our sleeves up and concentrate on the only real objective this season which is staying in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Jazzbo Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 If you look at Bournemouth last season, it actually took them quite a long time to get out of the relegation zone. I think it's likely to be the same for us. Clawing back from -10and then maintaining a position outside of the relegation zone was always going to be very difficult, especially for a club like ours that had spent the last few years in intensive care being treated by crap doctors. We're recovering, but there are going to be set backs on the way. If we can make it through this season without going down, then we only need to look to Bournemouth (as much as i hate it) to see what can be achieved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rooney Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 MorningtonCrescent's post is the most sensible I have read on this site for ages. I think this is exactly how the club is being run now and about time too. We have a professional set up at last...the rest will follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncoboy Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 It is going is the right direction and I know it takes time but my idea of success will be seeing Saints beat sides that we should be beating in a way that I dont feel nervous even when we are 2-0 up with twenty minutes to play. \Its been about five years since we had that luxury! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 AP needs a minimum return of 15 points for every 10 games played - this is the bare minimum expected. In the next 10 game AP needs to return 21 points just to bring the season average level with the bare minimum. Is he capable? Let’s wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Incongruous Monk Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Lots of sensible stuff... This is bang-on. I started this season expecting to hit zero points somewhere around the 1st October. If we get a result Saturday we'll be bang on. This season was always, always going to start slowly. The next logical place to set a target is either by position or date, Christmas being the obvious date to look at. Out of the bottom 4 by Christmas? Sounds about right. Then safe by 1st April (that may be a touch optimistic). Anyone who really believed (rather than just hoped) we'd rocket up the table at be looking at promotion was probably deluding themselves. Don't underestimate the damage the last 5 years has done. That takes a lot of undoing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 OK so the Rovers defeat hurt - excacerbated by the nature of it in the 96th minute. So how about an objective assessment of the season so far? It's all about points, not performances, or scoring from open play etc etc so lets look at that: August 5 games 3 points = 0.6 per game September 5 games 6 points = 1.2 per game Now I know some months might throw up tougher fixtures than others, so you might prefer to use a two or three month rolling average to balance that out a bit statistically, but personally I am using this sort of measure to see if Pards has pulled us out of our nosedive and deserves support. We know that Cortese has a two year plan to get us out of L1 so I think if Pards keeps improving the above numbers and starts getting it nearer 2.0 by the end of the season we'll be safe this year and on track for promotion next season, in line with the bigger picture. So I am suggesting, lets be objective, and not call for Pardews head on the basis of the odd crap result, however frustrating. They are going to happen. And fwiw I am a pessimist on here usually aligned with Alpines view of things.... can't wait til November when we are getting 4.8 points per game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 This is bang-on. I started this season expecting to hit zero points somewhere around the 1st October. Are you for real? Start of the season with all the buzz of the takeover, last seasons top scorers joins, ‘premiership manager’ recruited ect ect and you expected just 10 points from our 1st 10 games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 without our ten points deduction we would be just outside of relegation zone - clearly disappointing. The form has improved. Huge improvements in balance of side, players, management etc Not tranferred into results yet. With a bit of luck on Tuesday we would have been celebrating a very good performance,against one of the in-form sides, but we succombed to late pressure and a very good goal (well after game should have stopped!). If we keep grinding out odd results then dropping points we will struggle. If we managed to scrape 3 wins - I can see us going on to do well. The main problem seems that we have lost the winning habit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Matty Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 I couldn't make Tuesday night but an Argyle friend of mine went and he said it was like watching a premiership game. And trust me, he has no love for the Saints! IMO we are slowly getting there and the fact that 20,000 were there on a Tuesday night singing the whole game shows that the majority of fan have long memories plus realistic aims for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 The main problem seems that we have lost the winning habit. You cant lose what you never had Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Unfortunately the knee-jerk reaction of many football fans when their team is performing badly is to call for the manager to be sacked. Saints fans are far from alone in this but it was the same 'blame' approach that kindled all the old anti-Lowe stuff when changing managers didn't change the fortunes. Pardew's team is performing badly, but he is an experienced manager and with the time and resources there's no reason to think he could not hold his own with most in the Prem. But its right to criticise him. Fand and the club owners should expect him to find out what is wrong, if he doesn't already know, and put in hand whatever is needed to turn it round. The manager is limited by the wages budget, the absence of a current transfer window, and the availability of loan players, so he probably has to try to get the current team to play better, which is easier said than done. But hopefully, Cortese will keep the pressure on him to get better results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Incongruous Monk Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Are you for real? Start of the season with all the buzz of the takeover, last seasons top scorers joins, ‘premiership manager’ recruited ect ect and you expected just 10 points from our 1st 10 games? Yes I'm for real. This club had become rotten to the core. No confidence. No knowledge of how to win. Completely overhauling a club takes more than 10 games. Turning this club round is more than a seasons work. It's a massive task. Simply signing someone who scored a lot in another team is no a solution, it's a step along the path. Lambert hasn't suddenly got crap, he's not scoring because the team around him isn't there yet. It is improving. As time moves forward expectation will rise. But my expectations don't start that high, that (for me) is simply unrealistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Yes I'm for real. This club had become rotten to the core. No confidence. No knowledge of how to win. Completely overhauling a club takes more than 10 games. Turning this club round is more than a seasons work. It's a massive task. Simply signing someone who scored a lot in another team is no a solution, it's a step along the path. Lambert hasn't suddenly got crap, he's not scoring because the team around him isn't there yet. It is improving. As time moves forward expectation will rise. But my expectations don't start that high, that (for me) is simply unrealistic. I feel sorry for you if you genuinely only expected 10 points from the 1st 10 games. Below is our games so far - besides each game I have entered what I expected. Could you do the same? Just curious as to which teams you 'expected' us to lose to. My expectations were 10 games = 23 points. August 8 Millwall (H) Win 15 Huddersfield (A) Draw 18 Swindon (A) Win 22 Brentford (H) Win 29 Stockport (A) Win September 5 Colchester (H) Win 12 Charlton (A) Lose 19 Yeovil (H) Wine 26 Carlisle (A) Draw 29 Bristol Rovers (H) Win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 expect to get more points in the next 10, than the last. That will keep me going! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Incongruous Monk Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 I feel sorry for you if you genuinely only expected 10 points from the 1st 10 games. Below is our games so far - besides each game I have entered what I expected. Could you do the same? Just curious as to which teams you 'expected' us to lose to. My expectations were 10 games = 23 points. August 8 Millwall (H) Win 15 Huddersfield (A) Draw 18 Swindon (A) Win 22 Brentford (H) Win 29 Stockport (A) Win September 5 Colchester (H) Win 12 Charlton (A) Lose 19 Yeovil (H) Wine 26 Carlisle (A) Draw 29 Bristol Rovers (H) Win I'd hope for about the same but that's incredibly unrealistic. Those results would see us pretty much walking this league. We're not that good. We're in this league because we were rubbish, we then lost our best players and got slapped with a points deduction. Hitting that kind of form that quickly would be nothing short of miraculous. I'd expect to see form approaching that towards the end of this season and the start of next though. Swindon and Yeovil were probably the only opening games I'd have been confident of us winning. In the event we were lucky to get a win against Yeovil. Expectations for this season seem to have risen too high too fast. I do now though expect around 15 points from the next 10 games and 15-20 from the set after that. By the end of the season I want to see us hitting 2 points per game on average in preparation for an excellent season next year. Unfortunately, I'm now at my post limit. Any more replies tomorrow :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katalinic Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Yes I'm for real. This club had become rotten to the core. No confidence. No knowledge of how to win. Completely overhauling a club takes more than 10 games. Turning this club round is more than a seasons work. It's a massive task. Simply signing someone who scored a lot in another team is no a solution, it's a step along the path. Lambert hasn't suddenly got crap, he's not scoring because the team around him isn't there yet. It is improving. As time moves forward expectation will rise. But my expectations don't start that high, that (for me) is simply unrealistic. I agree and you also need to look at what AP inherited off the pitch. Yes he ultimately will be judged by his performance on the pitch but the guy had no coaching staff and no scouting network - people often assume all scouts do is look at potential players but their core role is looking at future opponents/tactics etc. He has had to put all of this together as well as coaching the side, bringing in players etc. It will take time but it is better to do it properly than any quick fix. The strategy this season is clearly to bring in a few loans and stay up - why bring in high waged players in what to all intents and purposes is a "dead season" - next season I would expect to see a little more money spent on Championship quality players who will be more willing to come than they would have been at the start of this season. As long as we stay up - which we will - then the first part of the longer strategy will have been completed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Fan CaM Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 We need to get high enough to beat relegation and we'll do that before the end of the season. Thats ALL we need to do this season ready for a fresh start the season after. HTH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cabrone Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Assessment So Far: Last year's safety mark was 50 points. Current form will produce 31-32 point at seasons end. Result? Relegation with 6-7 games to go. No more draws for the rest of the season? Would have to win 17 games out of 36 or 48%. 10 more draws throughout the season? We would have to win 14 out of the remaining 26 or 54%. Assuming our current draw rate is maintained? Would end up drawing 28 games. We've already lost 3. Would have to win 11 games out of the remaining 15 or 74%. Current win rate is 10%. Conclusion: SFC is underperforming. Currently on a relegation trajectory. AP must improve win rates and pronto else survival target will accelerate away from us. To use the analogy of a game of 1 day cricket...... We are the chasing team needing 50 runs and the run rate is getting steeper all the time. We need a decent partnership to blast out some quick runs else things will spiral out of control quite quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Durman Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 season reminds me very much of last season. Lots of pretty passing football with a lack of real cutting edge. I wonder if (like last season) we'll slowly lose our confidence, stop playing elaberate passing football, get rid of the manager and end up playing hoof ball? I hope not. Totally agreed. Lots of spin and no win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_stevo Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Not good enough at the moment, maybe needs some more time, maybe time won't help. Room for improvement, lots of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 (edited) Assessment So Far: Last year's safety mark was 50 points. Current form will produce 31-32 point at seasons end. Result? Relegation with 6-7 games to go. No more draws for the rest of the season? Would have to win 17 games out of 36 or 48%. 10 more draws throughout the season? We would have to win 14 out of the remaining 26 or 54%. Assuming our current draw rate is maintained? Would end up drawing 28 games. We've already lost 3. Would have to win 11 games out of the remaining 15 or 74%. Current win rate is 10%. Conclusion: SFC is underperforming. Currently on a relegation trajectory. AP must improve win rates and pronto else survival target will accelerate away from us. To use the analogy of a game of 1 day cricket...... We are the chasing team needing 50 runs and the run rate is getting steeper all the time. We need a decent partnership to blast out some quick runs else things will spiral out of control quite quickly. A very interesting post which highlights the problems at the moment Is 50 the usual amount of points to be safe? Edited 2 October, 2009 by John B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Assessment So Far: Last year's safety mark was 50 points. Current form will produce 31-32 point at seasons end. Result? Relegation with 6-7 games to go. No more draws for the rest of the season? Would have to win 17 games out of 36 or 48%. 10 more draws throughout the season? We would have to win 14 out of the remaining 26 or 54%. Assuming our current draw rate is maintained? Would end up drawing 28 games. We've already lost 3. Would have to win 11 games out of the remaining 15 or 74%. Current win rate is 10%. Conclusion: SFC is underperforming. Currently on a relegation trajectory. AP must improve win rates and pronto else survival target will accelerate away from us. To use the analogy of a game of 1 day cricket...... We are the chasing team needing 50 runs and the run rate is getting steeper all the time. We need a decent partnership to blast out some quick runs else things will spiral out of control quite quickly. Current win rate is 10% yet an alarming amount of our fans seem to think this is acceptable? Keep hearing that things are getting better - yet we just conceded 3 goals at home and there top goal scorer from the last few seasons was playing on our side??? go figure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningtonCrescent Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 My expectations were 10 games = 23 points. August 8 Millwall (H) Win 15 Huddersfield (A) Draw 18 Swindon (A) Win 22 Brentford (H) Win 29 Stockport (A) Win September 5 Colchester (H) Win 12 Charlton (A) Lose 19 Yeovil (H) Wine 26 Carlisle (A) Draw 29 Bristol Rovers (H) Win An interesting exercise, one that I didn't do before setting in my own head a target of wiping out the -10 by the end of Sept! But i'll do it now and see what it throws up.... **fingers crossed** August 8 Millwall (H) Lose (with a hope to draw) 15 Huddersfield (A) Lose (with a hope to scrape a lucky win!) 18 Swindon (A) Win 22 Brentford (H) Draw 29 Stockport (A) Win September 5 Colchester (H) Lose 12 Charlton (A) Lose 19 Yeovil (H) Wine (wine would be good, but I expected a Win!) 26 Carlisle (A) Draw 29 Bristol Rovers (H) Lose Giving a grand total of: 11 points.... with a "hope" that we might have gained a further 4, giving us 15 points. As it is, we have only closed the points gap on to teams which is very disappointing. Still 10 adrift of the two after that, meaning it has been a poor start to the season - but not unexpected. As nickh says - the next 10 games we need a higher average points tally and then we need to build from there.... Perhaps Glasgow Saint could start a new "predict the next 10 games" thread and we could see (without hindsight) how well we do against people's expectations! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wightman35 Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 In answer to the original question, posts 5 and 6 TDD and Lordswood were spot on. "So Far." There is still hope though, but I am getting very worried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horley CTFC Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 August 5 games 3 points = 0.6 per game September 5 games 6 points = 1.2 per game I've also compared our performance with Pompeys results: August 4 games 0 points = 0.0 per game/Differential +0.6 september 3 games 0 points = 0.0 per game/Differential +1.2 per game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Unfortunately the knee-jerk reaction of many football fans when their team is performing badly is to call for the manager to be sacked. Saints fans are far from alone in this but it was the same 'blame' approach that kindled all the old anti-Lowe stuff when changing managers didn't change the fortunes. Are you suggesting that the fans got it wrong with Lowe and shouldn't have blamed him? He was the architect of the instability originally, when through a mixture of circumstances we underwent a new manager pretty well every year. It was him and the PLC structure introduced after the reverse takeover that made investment into the club unlikely. It was the mindset that it was better to have more mediocre players rather than fewer but higher quality ones that produced poorer results. Ultimately the bizarre experiment imposed by him finished us off. If you wish to believe that our demise was caused by fans' blame culture, rather than inept mismanagment of the club by the board, then go ahead. Count me out, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Are you suggesting that the fans got it wrong with Lowe and shouldn't have blamed him? He was the architect of the instability originally, when through a mixture of circumstances we underwent a new manager pretty well every year. It was him and the PLC structure introduced after the reverse takeover that made investment into the club unlikely. It was the mindset that it was better to have more mediocre players rather than fewer but higher quality ones that produced poorer results. Ultimately the bizarre experiment imposed by him finished us off. If you wish to believe that our demise was caused by fans' blame culture, rather than inept mismanagment of the club by the board, then go ahead. Count me out, though. Possibly a lot of our problems in the past were caused by a financial pressures. Now we dont them the team in theory should be doing better but at the moment it is not. Will probably change for the better in the next couple of months although I thought it had when we were 2 1 on Tuesday and only seven points away from safety thinking on Saturday only four points from safety. It really is so frustrating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowllyd Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Current win rate is 10% yet an alarming amount of our fans seem to think this is acceptable? Keep hearing that things are getting better - yet we just conceded 3 goals at home and there top goal scorer from the last few seasons was playing on our side??? go figure Nobody thinks that a 10% win rate is acceptable. People are expecting it to improve, and to do so pretty dramatically. This is based on what they've seen so far this season in terms of improvement in performances and personnel. Yes, we lost on Tuesday, against a good side who played very well. Had we taken one of two excellent chances when we were 2-1 up we'd probably have won. I came away disappointed at the result, but very pleased with a lot of our play. Were you really expecting a 70% win rate over the first ten games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 What about the left back where all three of Bristol Rovers goals came from? As opposed to the right back where none of their goals came from? Sorry, I thought Harding was God nowadays so didn't dare apportion any blame to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 I feel sorry for you if you genuinely only expected 10 points from the 1st 10 games. Below is our games so far - besides each game I have entered what I expected. Could you do the same? Just curious as to which teams you 'expected' us to lose to. My expectations were 10 games = 23 points. August 8 Millwall (H) Win 15 Huddersfield (A) Draw 18 Swindon (A) Win 22 Brentford (H) Win 29 Stockport (A) Win September 5 Colchester (H) Win 12 Charlton (A) Lose 19 Yeovil (H) Wine 26 Carlisle (A) Draw 29 Bristol Rovers (H) Win Tbh I need a drink more frequently than that these days... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHAPEL END CHARLIE Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Once again, an argument based soley on the facts whilst ignoring the circumstances leading up this season...... and I refer to last season as much to the lack of a pre-season and administration.... Yes, for any club without the preverbial "Ball and Chain" we have been lumbered with, it would be a terrible start to a season. However....... When faced with the odds we were at the start of the season, you have to set goals and then measure "success" based on that measure...... I'm sure AP and NC will have done that and i'm sure we are close to the lower end of those expectations.... but still driving to wards the next one...... For me, the aim was to get out of negative points by the end of September - we failed, but by the smallest margin. We have lost points where we should have gained them and shown significant improvement match by match....... The next goal I set in my own mind was to be out of the bottom four by Xmas. This is still very achievable and therefore any knee-jerk reaction against meeting objectives would be premature. Perhaps you'd like to set out what your own realistic aims were for Saints this season, given the situation we were in with the squad decimated by last's years folly and the pre-season shennanigans........ The above is a true collectors piece , I've seldom before seen the employment of perfectly valid facts used as a basis for criticism . The context for our underachievement this season is well know and needs no repetition here but irrespective of our handicapped pre season preparations and last seasons disaster the brutal truth is that a long list of excuses will count for precious little next May . To answer your question at the start of the season I regarded us as fundamentally a mid-table side with an outside chance of a play-off place if we got a good start - how embarrassingly wrong I was in hindsight I'm sure we can both agree . Mea culpa . My ambitions for this season have now be forced to undergo an emergency reassessment , if you offered me 20th place right now I'd take that in a New York minute to be frank and regard it as some sort of success . However based on what I've seen so far even that mediocre target seems like a 'big ask' at this time I'm sorry to say . I'm far from confident our management , players or fans have yet grasped the scale of the task in front of them or even truly comprehend that they're in a battle yet , wake up and smell the coffee as they say because (if I may mix my metaphors) we're in it up to our necks . There's far too much of the 'We are to good to go down' about this forum lately - I can assure anyone reading this that is not necessarily true . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalek2003 Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 Are you suggesting that the fans got it wrong with Lowe and shouldn't have blamed him? He was the architect of the instability originally, when through a mixture of circumstances we underwent a new manager pretty well every year. It was him and the PLC structure introduced after the reverse takeover that made investment into the club unlikely. It was the mindset that it was better to have more mediocre players rather than fewer but higher quality ones that produced poorer results. Ultimately the bizarre experiment imposed by him finished us off. If you wish to believe that our demise was caused by fans' blame culture, rather than inept mismanagment of the club by the board, then go ahead. Count me out, though. The origins of our decline was when the club appointed a League 1 manager instead of a tried and trusted ex saints and England manager in the Spring of 2004. We appointed a kite flyer to pilot a fighter plane, This was the choice of the vocal few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Will Posted 2 October, 2009 Share Posted 2 October, 2009 The origins of our decline was when the club appointed a League 1 manager instead of a tried and trusted ex saints and England manager in the Spring of 2004. We appointed a kite flyer to pilot a fighter plane, This was the choice of the vocal few. There's a difference between an opinion and an obsession. I'm concerned that you have a very unhealthy obsession with Hoddle. Actually I'm concerned for Hoddle....! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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