buctootim Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Why so pedantic? My point was it could have been which is borne out in the article. Lighten up mate, it is New Year's Eve! Its not pedantry its reality. There was no way the language was ever going to be German, which makes your one page meandering space filler even odder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Its not pedantry its reality. There was no way the language was ever going to be German, which makes your one page meandering space filler even odder. Are you and Sour Mash one in the same person? In fact I think both of you are C B Fry. Read the article again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 I don't know if there is any truth in the rumour that George W Bush did not have a passport at the time he was elected as President but if so I find it more than worrying that the man with his finger on the button hadn't been out of his own back yard. You don't know if there is any truth in the rumour, but you find it worrying anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 You don't know if there is any truth in the rumour, but you find it worrying anyway. Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Read the article again. I dont need to. Its from the What if series of opinion pieces in Prospect magazine. Other pieces are 'What if the WW1 never happened' and 'What if Henry Viii had been granted a divorce' - ie they are entirely speculation about what would have happened under entirely different circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 What if this forum didn't exist? You would have to go out and find people to p*ss off instead of staying in the warm and doing it. What if we had won the American War of Independence? What if my auntie had balls? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Its not pedantry its reality. There was no way the language was ever going to be German, which makes your one page meandering space filler even odder. In the 1830s, a story began to circulate in the US press that German had almost became the official language of the newly founded US—the motion apparently defeated by only one vote. Actually, to this day, America does not have an official language—not even English. The story— now known as the Muehlenberg legend—was mostly fabrication, but it did have a kernel of truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Things like this don't happen here. We don't have licenses to carry concealed guns in supermarkets. Perhaps you should ask Andy Murray or any of the kids from Dunblane murdered by the gun-obsessed paedophile that shot up their school. . Or Derrick Bird, or Raoul Moat, or the people involved in the Monkseaton/Hungerford massacres in the 1980s. It was only after Dunblane (1996) that the gun laws were significantly tightened up over here. Part of it is a cultural issue but an incident like this could easily happen over here. All it needs is a careless gun owner and a curious kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Guns are cool, and most Yanks are just f*cking thick, that's the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 This makes the opposite point to the one you think it does. As a direct result of Dunblane, there is now a ban on handguns in the UK. What people are calling for is the US to do the same. Speaking statistically, this might be useful: UK firearms deaths per 100,000 people is 0.25 US firearms deaths per 100,000 people is 10.30 .... that's FORTY-ONE times the UK figure Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate It doesn't actually, if you read the rrest of my comment aboutt how we interpret the law....also how we respond to such events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 It doesn't actually, if you read the rrest of my comment aboutt how we interpret the law....also how we respond to such events. Guns are illegal in the UK, hence the lesser amount of gun crime. I'm not sure how that can be interpreted wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 This is the thing that ****es me most off when it comes to clichés about Americans. English people making out we are so much more sophisticated than yanks because of the passport numbers.A passport many only use to go to turkey, Costa del sol , Majorca or another holiday resort . How many Brits would have a passport if they didn't need one to travel to Europe , particularly at £90 odd a go. Nail on head. America has everything that the majority would ever need. The majority of Brits have passports so they get drunk cheaply in the sun. I'm sure the majority of Spanish Greek and Turks who don't rely on tourism would be very happy not to see a Brit again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stug76 Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Or Derrick Bird, or Raoul Moat, or the people involved in the Monkseaton/Hungerford massacres in the 1980s. It was only after Dunblane (1996) that the gun laws were significantly tightened up over here. Part of it is a cultural issue but an incident like this could easily happen over here. All it needs is a careless gun owner and a curious kid. What a load of rubbish. I'm prepared to believe that there has not been a single incidence of a mother pushing a toddler around a supermarket whilst hanging an open bag with a handgun in it for the last 20 years if ever. I just don't believe that it could happen. Anyone who owns a gun in this country is either legit and its locked up safely at a gun club or the intention is criminal in which case they are hardley likely to be carrying it around whilst doing the weekly shop! Gun crime does happen, of course it does but this sort of accident doesn't. It certainly couldn't easily happen as you suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Nail on head. America has everything that the majority would ever need. The majority of Brits have passports so they get drunk cheaply in the sun. I'm sure the majority of Spanish Greek and Turks who don't rely on tourism would be very happy not to see a Brit again I have had a couple of holidays in Turkey and have kept in touch with many of the Turks I met and they would love to have us back. Not all of the Brits who go abroad get drunk and make ar*ses of themselves. What North America doesn't have is any history worth talking about going back more than a couple of hundred years which is why some of them venture to Europe etc for some older culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whelk Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Nail on head. America has everything that the majority would ever need. The majority of Brits have passports so they get drunk cheaply in the sun. I'm sure the majority of Spanish Greek and Turks who don't rely on tourism would be very happy not to see a Brit again Europe is vastly richer in terms of cultural experience. America has everything? You like your shopping malls more than a cathedral visit I guess. Have travelled round both so no natural bias but give me Florence and Seville over Baltimore and Houston. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Europe is vastly richer in terms of cultural experience. America has everything? You like your shopping malls more than a cathedral visit I guess. Have travelled round both so no natural bias but give me Florence and Seville over Baltimore and Houston. I've always found USofA a cultural graveyard. Millions of Brits take weekenders to places like Florence for the culture, not a piiss up, same as millions of people travel to London from Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Guns are illegal in the UK, hence the lesser amount of gun crime. I'm not sure how that can be interpreted wrong? You should see the inside of my son's gun cabinet if you think that's true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted 31 December, 2014 Share Posted 31 December, 2014 Anyway, we all have the right to bare arms in this country - it's just that in this weather I prefer long sleeves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 You should see the inside of my son's gun cabinet if you think that's true. It isn't true, only certain types of guns are illegal. Which was my point, the politicians have reacted (generally with public blessing) and changed the law as and when required. The English Bill of rights stated that we, as Englishmen, were allowed to bare arms as and when needed, whilst adhering to the laws of the day....so does America's version but they tend to ignore the last part....As I say, interpretation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Guns are illegal in the UK, hence the lesser amount of gun crime. I'm not sure how that can be interpreted wrong? Absolute rubbish. It is completely legal to own certain types of guns (e.g. shotguns) as long as they are stored in a secure gun cabinet, which can be at home or even a place of work. Most handguns are now banned, but that was only as a result of Dunblane in '96. Derrick Bird killed 12 and injured 11 in the Cumbria shootings just 5 years ago and his rifle was legally owned. What a load of rubbish. I'm prepared to believe that there has not been a single incidence of a mother pushing a toddler around a supermarket whilst hanging an open bag with a handgun in it for the last 20 years if ever. That doesn't mean it can't. More unlikely yes, as I've said there is a difference in culture and a bigger population which makes the chances of it happening over there higher. I just don't believe that it could happen. Gun crime does happen, of course it does but this sort of accident doesn't. It certainly couldn't easily happen as you suggest. Try telling to any of the guys I did some work with after retiring a few years ago. After initially moving from one premises to another around 40-50 boxes were left on the floor, waiting to be sorted out. The boss had a 2 year old who was brought in by the grandparents and was left to crawl over and around the boxes. 10 minutes later I moved one of the boxes he'd been leaning over and discovered it contained one of the boss' (legally owned) shotguns that he kept in a cabinet at the old office. The shotgun was loaded and the boss still tried to make out he hadn't done anything wrong. That kid could have fatally injured anyone in that room. All it takes is a careless gun owner and an inquistive kid. It could easily happen over here (albeit less likely, granted) and the classic US gun owner stereotype doesn't necessarily make anyone over here more intelligent. Does the apparently innocent premise of the weekly shop make any difference? Anyone who owns a gun in this country. . . . 1) can legally store a gun at their house or place of work (providing it's licenced and they have a secured gun cabinet) 2) can be careless 3) can get distracted 4) doesn't mean they have a lot of intelligence You'd be amazed where myself and colleagues have confiscated guns over the years in this country, and the people we've confiscated them from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) Can I really buy a shotgun, jackfrost? I thought you had to be farmer or something? Edit: I would only use it in instance of zombie uprising, and to post pictures of myself on snapchat looking badass Edited 1 January, 2015 by Bearsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 and most Yanks are just f*cking thick, that's the problem. LOL , I love an ignorant statement calling others thick. " Most" LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Can I really buy a shotgun, jackfrost? I thought you had to be farmer or something? Edit: I would only use it in instance of zombie uprising, and to post pictures of myself on snapchat looking badass http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/shooting/start-shooting/buying-your-first-gun-2-32354 You've got a choice of nearly 1300 shotguns from the link at the bottom of the page. LOL , I love an ignorant statement calling others thick. " Most" LOL. I just love how people claim an incident like this could never happen over here, then resort immediately to the classic American stereotype whilst demonstrating they don't know the first thing about UK gun laws. Nationality is irrelevant. All it takes is one careless gun owner and one curious child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 One of the big problems we face is religious extremism and fundamentalism. A Christian extremist can be just as dangerous as any other and there are an awful lot of them in the States. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/shooting/start-shooting/buying-your-first-gun-2-32354 You've got a choice of nearly 1300 shotguns from the link at the bottom of the page. I just love how people claim an incident like this could never happen over here, then resort immediately to the classic American stereotype whilst demonstrating they don't know the first thing about UK gun laws. Nationality is irrelevant. All it takes is one careless gun owner and one curious child. Incidents with handguns or assault rifles are very, very rare in the UK. Can we say the same of the States? No. If you'd care to produce any incidents in the last, say 50 years, of a UK child killing another child by accident with a handgun/assault rifles or killing a parent by accident then I'd love to see them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/shooting/start-shooting/buying-your-first-gun-2-32354 You've got a choice of nearly 1300 shotguns from the link at the bottom of the page. I just love how people claim an incident like this could never happen over here, then resort immediately to the classic American stereotype whilst demonstrating they don't know the first thing about UK gun laws. Nationality is irrelevant. All it takes is one careless gun owner and one curious child. The USA has about 10.3 gun-related deaths per 100k of population per annum. That's over 40 times as many firearm deaths than the UK, which has about 0.25. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate It is utterly absurd to suggest that levels of gun ownership or availability are similar, and even more absurd to imply that it makes no difference to the death rate. The murder rate per 100k in the Americas is 16.3, compared to 3 in Europe. Someone in America is more than 5 times as likely to be murdered than their European counterpart. Edited 1 January, 2015 by scotty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Absolute rubbish. It is completely legal to own certain types of guns (e.g. shotguns) as long as they are stored in a secure gun cabinet, which can be at home or even a place of work. Most handguns are now banned, but that was only as a result of Dunblane in '96. Derrick Bird killed 12 and injured 11 in the Cumbria shootings just 5 years ago and his rifle was legally owned. That doesn't mean it can't. More unlikely yes, as I've said there is a difference in culture and a bigger population which makes the chances of it happening over there higher. Try telling to any of the guys I did some work with after retiring a few years ago. After initially moving from one premises to another around 40-50 boxes were left on the floor, waiting to be sorted out. The boss had a 2 year old who was brought in by the grandparents and was left to crawl over and around the boxes. 10 minutes later I moved one of the boxes he'd been leaning over and discovered it contained one of the boss' (legally owned) shotguns that he kept in a cabinet at the old office. The shotgun was loaded and the boss still tried to make out he hadn't done anything wrong. That kid could have fatally injured anyone in that room. All it takes is a careless gun owner and an inquistive kid. It could easily happen over here (albeit less likely, granted) and the classic US gun owner stereotype doesn't necessarily make anyone over here more intelligent. Does the apparently innocent premise of the weekly shop make any difference? 1) can legally store a gun at their house or place of work (providing it's licenced and they have a secured gun cabinet) 2) can be careless 3) can get distracted 4) doesn't mean they have a lot of intelligence You'd be amazed where myself and colleagues have confiscated guns over the years in this country, and the people we've confiscated them from. You seriously think our gun control laws are any way similar to the yanks? Firearms control in the UK is among of the toughest in the world. I do wonder what sort of weirdos post on these websites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlakeySFC Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) I detest the US and everything it stands for. It is essentially a police state where the citizens are controlled by Propaganda. Massive inequality, and everyone's armed. Edited 1 January, 2015 by BlakeySFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 I detest the US and everything it stands for. It is essentially a police state where the citizens are controlled by Propaganda. Massive inequality, and everyone's armed. The firearm situation in the USA is deplorable, by almost any standard. I also detest their global political and military activity, not to mention their approach to health and welfare. But as far as guns go, that genie is well and truly out of the bottle. Even if they could be persuaded that an armed civilian population might not be such a great idea after all, there are so many guns already in circulation that it would take decades for a change in the law to have any meaningful effect. It would simply become a re-run of Prohibition, and probably about as successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 You seriously think our gun control laws are any way similar to the yanks? Firearms control in the UK is among of the toughest in the world. I do wonder what sort of weirdos post on these websites. I don't think....I know. Also, if you want a firearm in the UK you can get one. Let's not stereotype Citizens of the United States either. Most are law-abiding citizens who are just like you or I. You have to take into account their history, the dymanics of the beautiful wide and open spaces in the country they live (which, whilst being one of the most beautiful on earth, because it is so spread thin, a citizen needs to protect their property.) This just goes way back and is beyond what appears to be a lot of poster's understanding or the scope of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 I don't think....I know. Also, if you want a firearm in the UK you can get one. Let's not stereotype Citizens of the United States either. Most are law-abiding citizens who are just like you or I. You have to take into account their history, the dymanics of the beautiful wide and open spaces in the country they live (which, whilst being one of the most beautiful on earth, because it is so spread thin, a citizen needs to protect their property.) This just goes way back and is beyond what appears to be a lot of poster's understanding or the scope of this thread. In the US if you want a firearm you can get one from Wal-Mart. In the UK if you want a firearm you can get one from Asda. Except of course, you can't. You and Jack Frost are doing a cracking job of maintaining this forum's high standards of fu cking idiocy in 2015. Well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 I don't think....I know. Also, if you want a firearm in the UK you can get one. Let's not stereotype Citizens of the United States either. Most are law-abiding citizens who are just like you or I. You have to take into account their history, the dymanics of the beautiful wide and open spaces in the country they live (which, whilst being one of the most beautiful on earth, because it is so spread thin, a citizen needs to protect their property.) This just goes way back and is beyond what appears to be a lot of poster's understanding or the scope of this thread. I'm sure if I waltz down to Asda or Sainbury's tomorrow with my driving licence I'll be able to pick up a Beretta 9mm or even better a Glock. I might, however, upgrade to an assault rifle, they are in the isle next to the beans I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 VFTT and CBFRY do have similar posting styles. The percentage of Americans who can be called thick are probably the same as any other country. I do agree that the amount of freely available weapons in the US must increase the chances of these killers doing something terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 I don't think....I know. Also, if you want a firearm in the UK you can get one. Let's not stereotype Citizens of the United States either. Most are law-abiding citizens who are just like you or I. You have to take into account their history, the dymanics of the beautiful wide and open spaces in the country they live (which, whilst being one of the most beautiful on earth, because it is so spread thin, a citizen needs to protect their property.) This just goes way back and is beyond what appears to be a lot of poster's understanding or the scope of this thread. If you really want a firearm anywhere in the World I'm sure you can get them somewhere, that doesn't stop the UK's laws being massively different to the Us though. Even the basic principle is different in that in the UK owning a firearm is a privilege not a right. If I found out someone was having it off with my Mrs, in the US I could pop down the shop and be round their house in a hour's time with an assult rifle, a couple of pistols as back up and a bag full of ammo. In the UK if I wanted ANY firearm I would have to be assessed by the licensing authority, the police, as not posing a threat to public safety and be a fit person to own it and demonstrate to the licensing authority that I require a firearm on a regular, legitimate basis for work, sport or leisure - which I couldn't. I don't know anyone on in the black market so I would have to rock up at the guy's house with an air rifle and try to aim at his eye to cause any serious damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) If you really want a firearm anywhere in the World I'm sure you can get them somewhere, that doesn't stop the UK's laws being massively different to the Us though. Even the basic principle is different in that in the UK owning a firearm is a privilege not a right. If I found out someone was having it off with my Mrs, in the US I could pop down the shop and be round their house in a hour's time with an assult rifle, a couple of pistols as back up and a bag full of ammo. In the UK if I wanted ANY firearm I would have to be assessed by the licensing authority, the police, as not posing a threat to public safety and be a fit person to own it and demonstrate to the licensing authority that I require a firearm on a regular, legitimate basis for work, sport or leisure - which I couldn't. I don't know anyone on in the black market so I would have to rock up at the guy's house with an air rifle and try to aim at his eye to cause any serious damage. That was generally my point (without being insulted by VFTT or CB Fry there). The fact is, most people (even if they don't know they are) are only a few contacts away from someone who knows how to get their hands on any type of gun you want and if you don't believe that you either do not know the world you are in today or are living in cloud cuckoo land. I think a good example of our "effective regulation" in this country would probably be that of paedophile groups....who in, for example, GCHQ tracks and regulates their movements? mostly, no-one, they get reports from external agencies....now, if they, on their own, are that ineffective at handling this, how effective do you think they are at the gun black market? Edited 1 January, 2015 by Hockey_saint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) That was generally my point (without being insulted by VFTT or CB Fry there). The fact is, most people (even if they don't know they are) are only a few contacts away from someone who knows how to get their hands on any type of gun you want and if you don't believe that you either do not know the world you are in today or are living in cloud cuckoo land. How could I gat an assult rifle then? You're being insulted because you are talking nonsense. The laws in the UK are massively different and make US style massacres much much less likely. One reason why americans are thought of as thick is because they make similar arguments that you do. Edited 1 January, 2015 by aintforever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) How could I gat an assult rifle then? You're being insulted because you are talking nonsense. The laws in the UK are massively different and make US style massacres much much less likely. One reason why americans are thought of as thick is because they make similar arguments that you do. What "similar arguments"? (it's American's by the way)....OOOHHH you mean ones like "I could get a gun and bust a cap in yo' ass blud", no, that would idiotic and again, you clearly have no understanding of the internet or how these things work. How do you think gangs get hold of their guns? do you think they walk into a shop and say "oooh hello siiirrr....I'll have that lovely item there please?" no. There are protocols to these things and these transactions and this country is small enough, once you've done some routing around to get your hands on one and don't play the fool and try to suggest otherwise or suggest I am in some way talking nonsense because I am not. Not to be brazen or boastful, but I bet I...and you, know someone who knows someone who can get you the assault rifle you desire...Simple numbers. Edited 1 January, 2015 by Hockey_saint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Not too sure what hockey is on. I have never ever seen a gun on sale in the UK. Maybe they are somewhere but not really accessible The states... That is a whole different arguement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Not too sure what hockey is on. I have never ever seen a gun on sale in the UK. Maybe they are somewhere but not really accessible The states... That is a whole different arguement I am NOT on anything, just because you haven't got one or think you don't know people who could, doesn't mean you could not. Besides, can we try to stop generalising "the states" or"americans" (SIC) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 I am NOT on anything, just because you haven't got one or think you don't know people who could, doesn't mean you could not. Besides, can try to stop generalising "the states" or"americans" (SIC) I can do what I like. Cheers though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 I can do what I like. Cheers though. Then so can I without being accused of being on anything. It's a complex situation where answers like "because they have poor gun control (which isn't true, it varies from state to state...and the mindset of each person varies from...well, person to person) they shoot people up more than we do" are not really helpful or show how small-minded the person who says it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 What "similar arguments"? (it's American's by the way)....OOOHHH you mean ones like "I could get a gun and bust a cap in yo' ass blud", no, that would idiotic and again, you clearly have no understanding of the internet or how these things work. How do you think gangs get hold of their guns? do you think they walk into a shop and say "oooh hello siiirrr....I'll have that lovely item there please?" no. There are protocols to these things and these transactions and this country is small enough, once you've done some routing around to get your hands on one and don't play the fool and try to suggest otherwise or suggest I am in some way talking nonsense because I am not. Not to be brazen or boastful, but I bet I...and you, know someone who knows someone who can get you the assault rifle you desire...Simple numbers. Where would you get my assult rifle from then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Then so can I without being accused of being on anything. It's a complex situation where answers like "because they have poor gun control (which isn't true, it varies from state to state...and the mindset of each person varies from...well, person to person) they shoot people up more than we do" are not really helpful or show how small-minded the person who says it is. Are you saying there aren't more deaths caused by "shootings" in the USA compared to the UK? What isn't helpful is your avoidance of simple facts and unarguable statistics and getting yourself bogged down by persevering with this charade that it is as easy to get hold of a gun in the UK as it is in the US. I wouldn't chuck round accusations of small-mindedness when you are so keen to avoid anything that resembles reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Lion Tamer Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) Then so can I without being accused of being on anything. It's a complex situation where answers like "because they have poor gun control (which isn't true, it varies from state to state...and the mindset of each person varies from...well, person to person) they shoot people up more than we do" are not really helpful or show how small-minded the person who says it is. Seriously dude, your argument makes no sense. Regardless of whether it is possible to get a gun here, it is clearly much easier in the US. You must admit that right? They're available in supermarkets without stringent background checks. Sure it's possible to get hold of a gun here if you really want to. But the amount of work involved will inevitably put plenty of people off, and it also means that people can't rush out and get one in a rage because they've had a bad day at the office or whatever. By contrast, if you have them in supermarkets like in the US, you're advertising the idea of buying a gun to people who may never have even considered it otherwise. The other thing about the US is it's easier to get hold of rapid fire machine gun style guns, which means that if someone does flip out, they can kill more people before they are stopped Edited 1 January, 2015 by Ex Lion Tamer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarniaSaint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Yet another pathetic thread by people who have no idea what its like to live in North America........but stereotype based on crap they read in the british media LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Yet another pathetic thread by people who have no idea what its like to live in North America........but stereotype based on crap they read in the british media LOL Succinct and I can't totally disagree with that. What I will say is that there are posters on this thread who either live or regularly go to the states so some of their responses, for me, are puzzling. The statistical arguement. Well, again, that takes into NO account whatsoever other variables that we do not have here (a huge history of slavery for example), ethnic tensions, the gap between rich and poor....these statistics take none of that into account. Me? I've been in supermarkets in most continental states and I can tell you without hesitance that I could not pick up a gun at every store I went to (if I was a citizen....most have laws preventing foreigners from buying them) but again, that would depend from state to state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Succinct and I can't totally disagree with that. What I will say is that there are posters on this thread who either live or regularly go to the states so some of their responses, for me, are puzzling. The statistical arguement. Well, again, that takes into NO account whatsoever other variables that we do not have here (a huge history of slavery for example), ethnic tensions, the gap between rich and poor....these statistics take none of that into account. Me? I've been in supermarkets in most continental states and I can tell you without hesitance that I could not pick up a gun at every store I went to (if I was a citizen....most have laws preventing foreigners from buying them) but again, that would depend from state to state. So now its slavery to blame for the fairly regular shootings in US schools by loons? It's slavery that explains the higher number of gunshot deaths in the US vs the UK? Slavery. Okay then. There are far more guns and far far more deaths from people being shot in the US than there is in the UK. The statistics are not an "argument" they are just facts. More guns, and availability of guns is a f uck of a bigger factor than slavery. The chances of being shot dead in the UK is miniscule compared to the US. The fact you can't even accept that without desperately scrabbling around for factors (population! slavery!) shows how pathetically small minded you are. Accept facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Succinct and I can't totally disagree with that. What I will say is that there are posters on this thread who either live or regularly go to the states so some of their responses, for me, are puzzling. The statistical arguement. Well, again, that takes into NO account whatsoever other variables that we do not have here (a huge history of slavery for example), ethnic tensions, the gap between rich and poor....these statistics take none of that into account. Me? I've been in supermarkets in most continental states and I can tell you without hesitance that I could not pick up a gun at every store I went to (if I was a citizen....most have laws preventing foreigners from buying them) but again, that would depend from state to state. No that one of the dumbest explanations I've ever read as to why there are more gun deaths in the US than the UK. You've made yourself look a prize pillock on this thread. You'll pretend otherwise but it's there for all to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Lion Tamer Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 Succinct and I can't totally disagree with that. What I will say is that there are posters on this thread who either live or regularly go to the states so some of their responses, for me, are puzzling. The statistical arguement. Well, again, that takes into NO account whatsoever other variables that we do not have here (a huge history of slavery for example), ethnic tensions, the gap between rich and poor....these statistics take none of that into account. Me? I've been in supermarkets in most continental states and I can tell you without hesitance that I could not pick up a gun at every store I went to (if I was a citizen....most have laws preventing foreigners from buying them) but again, that would depend from state to state. No one has said you can get them in every shop, that is a straw man argument Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 1 January, 2015 Share Posted 1 January, 2015 (edited) So now its slavery to blame for the fairly regular shootings in US schools by loons? It's slavery that explains the higher number of gunshot deaths in the US vs the UK? Slavery. Okay then. There are far more guns and far far more deaths from people being shot in the US than there is in the UK. The statistics are not an "argument" they are just facts. More guns, and availability of guns is a f uck of a bigger factor than slavery. The chances of being shot dead in the UK is miniscule compared to the US. The fact you can't even accept that without desperately scrabbling around for factors (population! slavery!) shows how pathetically small minded you are. Accept facts. I dunno CB Fry, a thing you often hear said is that Canada has same profusion of firearms, but nowhere near the same level of gun deaths. If as I suspect hockey saint is trying to point finger at gang & drug cultures, he might have a point. Not that I particularly care too much bout who wins arguments, i just wish bros would stop shooting bros! Edit: Or at least wait for zombie uprising! Edited 1 January, 2015 by Bearsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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