The Starmer Years - Can The New Broom Sweep Clean?

[sadoldgit]

Whatever you thought about your County Councils before, most of them now are going to be run by people who haven’t got any experience in running a CC. We have been laughing at the mess Trump is making of the US. Buckle up.

[Gloucester Saint]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

If they try to copy reform policies and actions it's not going to do anything because if you want those policies you're not going to go with Labour to get them. Similarly many are going to be repulsed if they go closer again to Corbyn type policies. I'm genuinely not sure what Labour can do short of war with Russia maybe or some other sort of grand unifying narrative that resonates somehow. 

I don’t think they need to go that far, a simple one would be re-nationalising the very worst railway franchises earlier. Consistent public support 65% and above for that. A much better trade deal and going back into the Single Market would turbo boost the economy and public support for that has grown strongly since the abject failure of Brexit. Not point competing with Farage on Brexit and actually more than 50% of the country hates it becuase it has failed abysmally. Hang it around his neck as a millstone. Movement of people but my sense is that if those people are white/European it’s ok (witness the lasting support for Ukraine). 

Some moderation on PIP, it has to be tackled but the severity in one go is alienating their core supporters from the outside looking in.

Ok, some of the Red Wall seats will hate it but they aren’t reliable seats any longer for the main parties and Reform won’t have any more luck turning them around at local level. The Tories tried bribing them with the levelling up agenda and they bit them. Some of those seats will keep changing hands until the boomers pass away and a new generation can re-shape what innovative post-industrial areas can really be. Labour should target some of those seats showing younger energy with creative industries start-up funding to get that generation up and running. 

Edited Friday at 22:29 by Gloucester Saint

[Gloucester Saint]

This is well worth a watch about how the main two parties can tackle Reform. The Lib Dem’s are the most distinct and carry on doing what we’re doing. I concur that tacking to the right to take on Reform ain’t working for the Tories or Labour, and there’s only 5% vote loss to Reform for Labour. The Oxford scholar is right to say that there’s more risk of ex-Corbyn supporters going to Reform to attack big business and Neo-liberalism, which Labour is continuing.

What makes Reform dangerous for them is that there’s 80-odd seats where Reform is second because they’ve cleaned the Tories out and Lib Dem vote is holding up. Tactical voting is crucial to contain Farage. The Tories rebounding would help but Kemi has stop talking about transgender all of the time. We’ve had the Supreme Court judgement now - move on and put pressure on Reeves about the economy. Do your job as leader of opposition and put your own hobbies to one side about ‘woke’ etc away. If older working people in their 50s and 60s want anti-woke (she’s already got the over-70s sewn up and the average Tory voter age is 70) they’ll go to Reform, not the Tories post-Cameron, May and Boris.

As the thread’s on Labour, Peston hits the nail on the head in his summing up. If Starmer wants a 10 year mandate, work with the Lib Dem’s, and the Greens becuase there is a natural FPTP majority there and a Remain majority. Daniel Finkenstein the Conservative and ex-SDP pundit has said this numerous times too. 

 

 

Edited Friday at 23:08 by Gloucester Saint

[AlexLaw76]

Some are not dealing with this very well

 

[badgerx16]

8 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

Whatever you thought about your County Councils before, most of them now are going to be run by people who haven’t got any experience in running a CC. We have been laughing at the mess Trump is making of the US. Buckle up.

Not sure that is true. Most of those in Lancashire are former Tory councillors. Mind you, they are talking about wanting to hold a local referendum on replacing Council Tax.

Edited Saturday at 07:17 by badgerx16

[skintsaint]

1 hour ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Some are not dealing with this very well

 

Why did the nurses just not get a visa...its not hard to do and had plenty of time to get one. Definately easier and cheaper than moving country 😅

[Smirking_Saint]

The main problem is that for many in the country, they are on the breadline or worse, caused by austerity, horrific Tory policy and global downturns

Labour always was the party of the working class, but not now, they’ve tried to push further into identity politics and the like, or atleast thats how its seen. The right have been able to weaponise these narratives and convinced people that the reason they’re struggling is those brown people on boats, and its a convincing narrative

If the left want an opportunity to drag voters back they have to listen to the majority, they have to engage in the basement politics that reform are happy to operate in… otherwise we’re headed for a reform majority in 3 years

TBH Labour has utterly failed, I don’t really know what they represent. I was hoping they would be more centrist, but they’re basically just Tories with pillows on their hands, Im at a loss to understand their messaging… attacking farmers, disabilities and yet leaving issues like the super rich and immigration

Social media has changed politics forever unfortunately. There’s no way we need Trump or Darren fucking Grimes anywhere near elected positions, abd Id say the same for aby left leaning counterparts

Honestly at this point just try your best to get your ducks in a row as the worlds just going to get worse

[Gloucester Saint]

9 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

Whatever you thought about your County Councils before, most of them now are going to be run by people who haven’t got any experience in running a CC. We have been laughing at the mess Trump is making of the US. Buckle up.

As Badger said, most of them are Tory cast-offs who split from their party during the May/Boris years, and Sunak/Badenoch are or were the final straw. That’s certainly true of where my folks live but the ones elected were very difficult people in their local Tory party, they won’t magically become well disciplined and organised beyond an election campaign because the rosette is a lighter blue. You’ve only got to look at the recent councillor resignations in Reform with stinging criticism of Farage and the Lowe bust-up.

[Gloucester Saint]

38 minutes ago, Smirking_Saint said:

The main problem is that for many in the country, they are on the breadline or worse, caused by austerity, horrific Tory policy and global downturns

Labour always was the party of the working class, but not now, they’ve tried to push further into identity politics and the like, or atleast thats how its seen. The right have been able to weaponise these narratives and convinced people that the reason they’re struggling is those brown people on boats, and its a convincing narrative

If the left want an opportunity to drag voters back they have to listen to the majority, they have to engage in the basement politics that reform are happy to operate in… otherwise we’re headed for a reform majority in 3 years

TBH Labour has utterly failed, I don’t really know what they represent. I was hoping they would be more centrist, but they’re basically just Tories with pillows on their hands, Im at a loss to understand their messaging… attacking farmers, disabilities and yet leaving issues like the super rich and immigration

Social media has changed politics forever unfortunately. There’s no way we need Trump or Darren fucking Grimes anywhere near elected positions, abd Id say the same for aby left leaning counterparts

Honestly at this point just try your best to get your ducks in a row as the worlds just going to get worse

I totally share your concerns as a Lib Dem voter and your frustration at the direction the world is going in with the rule of law and science going out of the window with these populist morons.

I agree with 95% of your post but I take slight issue that trying to fight Reform on its own ground is a good strategy for Lab-Lib-Green. Those parties have a natural majority. Let’s use it. The Tories over the last decade have fought Reform on their battlegrounds and look at them now, their organisation in seats defended this week was 10% of what it was.

Protect the core of the country and let the Red Wall areas go pop. Starmer’s direction is a mystery to me as well. Brexit is a fucking disaster beyond argument - why are they sticking with it, get back in the Single Market and have 6% more of the pie to do Labour things with. Renationalise railways, get health waiting lists down further, train more dentists. It’s not as if being out of the EU has made the borders any more secure - far less so actually - and the freedom of movement is mainly white which might turn the volume down on the tabloids.

A final point of hope - every time UKIP and Reform have won positions of responsibility, it’s fallen apart quicker than Saints in a 1-0 lead. Just look at Thanet, just this year in Derbyshire https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0lz8xn8zd8o and the Lowe bust-up. At scale, the people they’ve elected are Tory cast-offs who were the awkward squad. They won’t magically improve under a light blue rosette.

Edited Saturday at 08:11 by Gloucester Saint

[LuckyNumber7]

11 hours ago, Gloucester Saint said:

I don’t think they need to go that far, a simple one would be re-nationalising the very worst railway franchises earlier. Consistent public support 65% and above for that. A much better trade deal and going back into the Single Market would turbo boost the economy and public support for that has grown strongly since the abject failure of Brexit. Not point competing with Farage on Brexit and actually more than 50% of the country hates it becuase it has failed abysmally. Hang it around his neck as a millstone. Movement of people but my sense is that if those people are white/European it’s ok (witness the lasting support for Ukraine). 

Some moderation on PIP, it has to be tackled but the severity in one go is alienating their core supporters from the outside looking in.

Ok, some of the Red Wall seats will hate it but they aren’t reliable seats any longer for the main parties and Reform won’t have any more luck turning them around at local level. The Tories tried bribing them with the levelling up agenda and they bit them. Some of those seats will keep changing hands until the boomers pass away and a new generation can re-shape what innovative post-industrial areas can really be. Labour should target some of those seats showing younger energy with creative industries start-up funding to get that generation up and running. 

That's just not true. That's exactly why Brexit happened, because of the huge numbers of Poles, Romanians etc coming into the country at will. Nothing to do with 'brown people'. Unfortunately it was shutting the stable door after the horse had bolted. The fact that immigration has continued to rise since isn't a failure of Brexit itself but of the governments since, and is why Reform are now getting so much support. We are an island nation, it really shouldn't be difficult to control who/how many come into this country.

There's also plenty of people who don't agree with the ongoing support for Ukraine.

Edited Saturday at 09:52 by LuckyNumber7

[whelk]

5 minutes ago, LuckyNumber7 said:

There's also plenty of people who don't agree with the ongoing support for Ukraine

Yeah cunts

[whelk]

2 hours ago, Smirking_Saint said:

The main problem is that for many in the country, they are on the breadline or worse, caused by austerity, horrific Tory policy and global downturns

Labour always was the party of the working class, but not now, they’ve tried to push further into identity politics and the like, or atleast thats how its seen. The right have been able to weaponise these narratives and convinced people that the reason they’re struggling is those brown people on boats, and its a convincing narrative

If the left want an opportunity to drag voters back they have to listen to the majority, they have to engage in the basement politics that reform are happy to operate in… otherwise we’re headed for a reform majority in 3 years

TBH Labour has utterly failed, I don’t really know what they represent. I was hoping they would be more centrist, but they’re basically just Tories with pillows on their hands, Im at a loss to understand their messaging… attacking farmers, disabilities and yet leaving issues like the super rich and immigration

Social media has changed politics forever unfortunately. There’s no way we need Trump or Darren fucking Grimes anywhere near elected positions, abd Id say the same for aby left leaning counterparts

Honestly at this point just try your best to get your ducks in a row as the worlds just going to get worse

Agree with a lot of that although they are not attacking disabilities more trying to get a grip on an unsustainable worsening situation where people declare shit and get a handout. We should not have over a million more people with disabilities over last 5 years.

No one knows what Labour stand for and their fear of going after the wealthy just leaves them impotent and no one happy which ain’t a recipe for electoral success. Be fucking bold even if I don’t agree at least try to be different.

Edited Saturday at 10:02 by whelk

[Gloucester Saint]

10 minutes ago, LuckyNumber7 said:

That's just not true. That's exactly why Brexit happened, because of the huge numbers of Poles, Romanians etc coming into the country at will. Nothing to do with 'brown people'. Unfortunately it was shutting the stable door after the horse had bolted. The fact that immigration has continued to rise since isn't a failure of Brexit itself but of the governments since, and is why Reform are now getting so much support. We are an island nation, it really shouldn't be difficult to control who/how many come into this country.

There's also plenty of people who don't agree with the ongoing support for Ukraine.

And they were doing the jobs young Brits didn’t want to when the vacancies were there (and still are) - social care, nursing - and an important arm in construction/trades, which is why it’s such a struggle to get houses built now and the drop in quality. We have an ageing population which is living longer with multiple conditions and it needs some focused balancing out.

Also, a huge driver behind Brexit was deprived English communities getting decimated by first the financial crisis and then the severe austerity to their services following it. It is no accident that the anger about A8 nation migration (Straw did cock up there btw) accelerated into support and victories for UKIP and the BNP during and immediately after the financial crisis of 07/08. Until then, it wasn’t in the top 20 issues of most public polls and key issues. Stalling and falling living standards have spread to most of us and widened during the pandemic as the super wealthy really pulled away.

Where I’ll meet you in the middle is on asylum. Not student and dependents, that’s Braverman bullshit, or NHS dentists from Poland who train, help for a few years and go home, but young lads turning up on boats. However, the solution is not hard Brexits and turning tail, it’s solved by working with the French, Germans, Belgians and Dutch on shared solutions and shared costs. That will free up money for public services and grow the economy on our doorstep.

[Gloucester Saint]

21 minutes ago, whelk said:

Agree with a lot of that although they are not attacking disabilities more trying to get a grip on an unsustainable worsening situation where people declare shit and get a handout. We should not have over a million more people with disabilities over last 5 years.

No one knows what Labour stand for and their fear of going after the wealthy just leaves them impotent and no one happy which ain’t a recipe for electoral success. Be fucking bold even if I don’t agree at least try to be different.

Oh I don’t know, I think Farage was using the ADHD assessment costs to bundle genuine neurodiversity with mental health as anti-woke banner to stir up the worst of his base. Trump has done exactly the same over there. Those issues should never be conflated without proper evidence. 

Yes, the welfare bill has to be addressed. It is far too high. But there are multiple ways to do that in tandem with sanctions so young people get a good taste of the workplace with small/no cost reasonable adjustments or technical training and want more. And Farage, Badenoch and Kendall waging a culture war or wanting to abolish the Equality Act (Farage) is not going to transform neurodiverse employment rates, modernised practices which enable people to shine will do that.

Edited Saturday at 10:25 by Gloucester Saint

[sadoldgit]

19 minutes ago, LuckyNumber7 said:

That's just not true. That's exactly why Brexit happened, because of the huge numbers of Poles, Romanians etc coming into the country at will. Nothing to do with 'brown people'. Unfortunately it was shutting the stable door after the horse had bolted. The fact that immigration has continued to rise since isn't a failure of Brexit itself but of the governments since, and is why Reform are now getting so much support. We are an island nation, it really shouldn't be difficult to control who/how many come into this country.

There's also plenty of people who don't agree with the ongoing support for Ukraine.

Not sure about that. One canvasser on the radio yesterday said that people on the doorstep were openly saying that “we are letting too many brown people into the country.” Also, although the “small boat people” are a small percentage of immigrants arriving here, they are the ones being weaponised and the ones most people think of. Why? Because they are brown (and “men of fighting age” according to the Faragists).

What Trump and Farage and others like them have done is given people permission to be openly racist. This “war on woke” speaks volumes. It isn’t a war on woke at all. It is an excuse to spout openly far right rhetoric. All this crap about “free speech”. It hasn’t gone unnoticed that to these people “free speech” means the freedom to spew openly abhorrent shit as widely as possibly. Speak against and you, yourself, will find your own “freedom of speech” taken away.

What happened yesterday was no surprise after the way the USA has descended in the pit after Trump's election. We do have a chance to turn things around before the next GE but as has been said, Starmer has to grow a pair and grasp the nettles that he has been avoiding thus far.

[whelk]

12 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Oh I don’t know, I think Farage was using the ADHD assessment costs to bundle genuine neurodiversity with mental health as anti-woke banner to stir up the worst of his base. Trump has done exactly the same over there. Those issues should never be conflated without proper evidence. 

Yes, the welfare bill has to be addressed. It is far too high. But there are multiple ways to do that in tandem with sanctions so young people get a good taste of the workplace with small/no cost reasonable adjustments or technical training and want more. And Farage, Badenoch and Kendall waging a culture war or wanting to abolish the Equality Act (Farage) is not going to transform neurodiverse employment rates, modernised practices which enable people to shine will do that.

My ‘they’ was referring to Labour

[whelk]

The irony is that Brexit has led to increase in less desirable immigrants (in the eyes of Reform) at expense of Eastern Europeans. 
 

So easy for the rhetoric to be stop immigration and something needs to be done but grifters in Reform is not the answer 

[hypochondriac]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

The irony is that Brexit has led to increase in less desirable immigrants (in the eyes of Reform) at expense of Eastern Europeans. 
 

So easy for the rhetoric to be stop immigration and something needs to be done but grifters in Reform is not the answer 

It's crap policies post brexit that have led to that not brexit directly. 

[rallyboy]

The Brexit vote didn't open our borders but has played a significant role in our inability to remove uninvited visitors.

It's as if some voters didn't understand what they were voting for.

[Gloucester Saint]

1 hour ago, rallyboy said:

The Brexit vote didn't open our borders but has played a significant role in our inability to remove uninvited visitors.

It's as if some voters didn't understand what they were voting for.

And not just Leavers, true of Remainers as well.

The whole thing was far too complex to be decided in/out which is why no-one has got what they thought they were going to out of it.

[Whitey Grandad]

46 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

And not just Leavers, true of Remainers as well.

The whole thing was far too complex to be decided in/out which is why no-one has got what they thought they were going to out of it.

There was a debate to be had but it wasn’t had. An in/out referendum was not the way to settle anything.

[benjii]

20 hours ago, whelk said:

The irony is that Brexit has led to increase in less desirable immigrants (in the eyes of Reform) at expense of Eastern Europeans. 
 

So easy for the rhetoric to be stop immigration and something needs to be done but grifters in Reform is not the answer 

And, of course, a lot of it stoked / funded / fomented by Farage's pals in Russia.

[Smirking_Saint]

9 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

There was a debate to be had but it wasn’t had. An in/out referendum was not the way to settle anything.

The left do what they always do unfortunately (and I say this as a guy thats proudly left leaning) and assume that good morals will win the day… well.. since the rise in social media and the burgeoning partisan trends within it, good morals simply don’t win.. its whoever shouts loudest, and unfortunately Musk is amplifying right wing propagandists

i saw someone say before, in reference to social media politics and the rise in misinformation… its easier to throw a hand grenade than put out a fire, and the right are throwing a ton of hand grenades

[Smirking_Saint]

On 03/05/2025 at 09:03, Gloucester Saint said:

I totally share your concerns as a Lib Dem voter and your frustration at the direction the world is going in with the rule of law and science going out of the window with these populist morons.

I agree with 95% of your post but I take slight issue that trying to fight Reform on its own ground is a good strategy for Lab-Lib-Green. Those parties have a natural majority. Let’s use it. The Tories over the last decade have fought Reform on their battlegrounds and look at them now, their organisation in seats defended this week was 10% of what it was.

Protect the core of the country and let the Red Wall areas go pop. Starmer’s direction is a mystery to me as well. Brexit is a fucking disaster beyond argument - why are they sticking with it, get back in the Single Market and have 6% more of the pie to do Labour things with. Renationalise railways, get health waiting lists down further, train more dentists. It’s not as if being out of the EU has made the borders any more secure - far less so actually - and the freedom of movement is mainly white which might turn the volume down on the tabloids.

A final point of hope - every time UKIP and Reform have won positions of responsibility, it’s fallen apart quicker than Saints in a 1-0 lead. Just look at Thanet, just this year in Derbyshire https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0lz8xn8zd8o and the Lowe bust-up. At scale, the people they’ve elected are Tory cast-offs who were the awkward squad. They won’t magically improve under a light blue rosette.

I guess they can’t really tackle the brexit issue, because they aren’t tackling any of the concerns from centrists, right floating voters at all

I agree it has to be addressed, it was and continues to be economic suicide, made worse by impending US isolationism, but it’ll just be another easy narrative for the right to use

Labour were correct to tackle the big issues early… but my god, winter fuel, farmers taxes, failing to address Southport effectively and now disability allowances, as well as just letting the immigration conversation fester…. Farage has never had it so easy to push his interests 

[Lord Duckhunter]

Looks like it’s starting to dawn on some Labour MP’s, even if the pinkos on here are in denial. 
 

One said the Government has made unnecessary choices that have cost the party at the ballot box. the party needs a 'change of plan' rather than a 'plan for change'.

Another added. “The idea that the public have given us such a kicking because they think we're not going fast enough and they want more of the same, it's just nonsense,”

Jo White, the chair of the Red Wall group of Labour MPs, urged Sir Keir to show leadership and stop 'pussyfooting around' with immigration. Before saying, the Government's decision to strip more than ten million pensioners of their winter fuel payments had become 'our poll tax problem'.

 

Dan Carden, the MP for Liverpool Walton, said: 'People have had enough, It was the working class that turned its back on Labour last Thursday”.
Funny that,  because I read on here that it’s just rich “boomers “ voting reform 😂. 
 

 

 

 

 

[whelk]

6 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Looks like it’s starting to dawn on some Labour MP’s, even if the pinkos on here are in denial. 
 

One said the Government has made unnecessary choices that have cost the party at the ballot box. the party needs a 'change of plan' rather than a 'plan for change'.

Another added. “The idea that the public have given us such a kicking because they think we're not going fast enough and they want more of the same, it's just nonsense,”

Jo White, the chair of the Red Wall group of Labour MPs, urged Sir Keir to show leadership and stop 'pussyfooting around' with immigration. Before saying, the Government's decision to strip more than ten million pensioners of their winter fuel payments had become 'our poll tax problem'.

 

Dan Carden, the MP for Liverpool Walton, said: 'People have had enough, It was the working class that turned its back on Labour last Thursday”.
Funny that,  because I read on here that it’s just rich “boomers “ voting reform 😂. 
 

 

 

 

 

Be careful having such an erection at your age

[LuckyNumber7]

On 5/3/2025 at 11:16 AM, Gloucester Saint said:

And they were doing the jobs young Brits didn’t want to when the vacancies were there (and still are) - social care, nursing - and an important arm in construction/trades, which is why it’s such a struggle to get houses built now and the drop in quality. We have an ageing population which is living longer with multiple conditions and it needs some focused balancing out.

 

Oh, absolutely some of them do important jobs that we need, such as NHS and construction, and there should always be room for letting in the people that we need, regardless of where they come from. But let's not pretend there aren't also loads that came over doing non essential jobs too that we simply don't need, and they just add to the strain on our infrastructure.

On 5/3/2025 at 11:22 AM, sadoldgit said:

Not sure about that. One canvasser on the radio yesterday said that people on the doorstep were openly saying that “we are letting too many brown people into the country.” Also, although the “small boat people” are a small percentage of immigrants arriving here, they are the ones being weaponised and the ones most people think of. Why? Because they are brown (and “men of fighting age” according to the Faragists).

What Trump and Farage and others like them have done is given people permission to be openly racist. This “war on woke” speaks volumes. It isn’t a war on woke at all. It is an excuse to spout openly far right rhetoric. All this crap about “free speech”. It hasn’t gone unnoticed that to these people “free speech” means the freedom to spew openly abhorrent shit as widely as possibly. Speak against and you, yourself, will find your own “freedom of speech” taken away.

What happened yesterday was no surprise after the way the USA has descended in the pit after Trump's election. We do have a chance to turn things around before the next GE but as has been said, Starmer has to grow a pair and grasp the nettles that he has been avoiding thus far.

Lol. Just keep screaming 'racist' at anyone who voices concern at who we are letting in to our society. One day you'll realise it doesn't wash.

23 hours ago, whelk said:

The irony is that Brexit has led to increase in less desirable immigrants (in the eyes of Reform) at expense of Eastern Europeans. 
 

So easy for the rhetoric to be stop immigration and something needs to be done but grifters in Reform is not the answer 

Maybe, maybe not, but Lib/Lab/Con have shown they aren't the answer either... 

[sadoldgit]

10 minutes ago, LuckyNumber7 said:

Oh, absolutely some of them do important jobs that we need, such as NHS and construction, and there should always be room for letting in the people that we need, regardless of where they come from. But let's not pretend there aren't also loads that came over doing non essential jobs too that we simply don't need, and they just add to the strain on our infrastructure.

Lol. Just keep screaming 'racist' at anyone who voices concern at who we are letting in to our society. One day you'll realise it doesn't wash.

Maybe, maybe not, but Lib/Lab/Con have shown they aren't the answer either... 

Plenty of people have concerns about “who we are letting in to our society” as you put it. It doesn’t make them racist. Saying that people who are clearly racist are not racist doesn’t make them non-racist.

You do know that you are in more danger from people already in our society and well defined as indigenous than those we are “letting in to our society, don’t you?

Lol.

[AlexLaw76]

I hear a terrorist plot involving Iranian nationals here in the UK has been foiled

obviously, I assume those arrested will be deported in very quick time. Unless of course they declare their love for dildos or gay porn or booze, then we could not be so heartless and send them back to Iran, or whatever backwards shithole they are from.

Edited Sunday at 11:11 by AlexLaw76

[Gloucester Saint]

23 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

I hear a terrorist plot involving Iranian nationals here in the UK has been foiled

obviously, I assume those arrested will be deported in very quick time. Unless of course they declare their love for dildos or gay porn or booze, then we could not be so heartless and send them back to Iran, or whatever backwards shithole they are from.

Maybe they are more the fish finger type?

[AlexLaw76]

9 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Maybe they are more the fish finger type?

😂

[LuckyNumber7]

38 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

Plenty of people have concerns about “who we are letting in to our society” as you put it. It doesn’t make them racist. Saying that people who are clearly racist are not racist doesn’t make them non-racist.

You do know that you are in more danger from people already in our society and well defined as indigenous than those we are “letting in to our society, don’t you?

Lol.

Yes, there are dangerous 'indigenous' people here too. And? Does that mean we should just let in whoever wants to come here from elsewhere?

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

 

You do know that you are in more danger from people already in our society and well defined as indigenous than those we are “letting in to our society, don’t you?

 

Source?

[hypochondriac]

1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

Plenty of people have concerns about “who we are letting in to our society” as you put it. It doesn’t make them racist. Saying that people who are clearly racist are not racist doesn’t make them non-racist.

You do know that you are in more danger from people already in our society and well defined as indigenous than those we are “letting in to our society, don’t you?

Lol.

On a per capita basis? And if we pretend that what you say is true, why would you want more threat in the country to exacerbate an existing problem? 

[Whitey Grandad]

5 hours ago, Smirking_Saint said:

The left do what they always do unfortunately (and I say this as a guy thats proudly left leaning) and assume that good morals will win the day… well.. since the rise in social media and the burgeoning partisan trends within it, good morals simply don’t win.. its whoever shouts loudest, and unfortunately Musk is amplifying right wing propagandists

i saw someone say before, in reference to social media politics and the rise in misinformation… its easier to throw a hand grenade than put out a fire, and the right are throwing a ton of hand grenades

Indeed. “If it ain’t broke…” It’s far easier to destroy than it is to create.

[whelk]

5 hours ago, Smirking_Saint said:

in reference to social media politics and the rise in misinformation… its easier to throw a hand grenade than put out a fire, and the right are throwing a ton of hand grenades

Read the Sarah Wynn-Williams book recently. Facebook are responsible for spreading so much misinformation in elections across the globe, and could even do something about it but deliberately don’t.

[Wiggles31]

4 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

I hear a terrorist plot involving Iranian nationals here in the UK has been foiled

obviously, I assume those arrested will be deported in very quick time. Unless of course they declare their love for dildos or gay porn or booze, then we could not be so heartless and send them back to Iran, or whatever backwards shithole they are from.

Deported via airbus at 35,000 feet minus parachutes. Allah Akbar mutha fuckers. 

[Smirking_Saint]

FWIW… I think Ive of sacked Lucy Powell

Labour just keep giving Reform/Tories too much ammo

Edited Monday at 22:42 by Smirking_Saint

[Baird of the land]

Curious if Labour are going to run scared from all their economic principles. 

[whelk]

Labour can sure get a trade deal done. Unlike the empty bluster from the lot before. Good to see the India deal

[badgerx16]

6 minutes ago, whelk said:

Labour can sure get a trade deal done. Unlike the empty bluster from the lot before. Good to see the India deal

Oh come on, the Tories signed a deal with Leichtenstein.

[rallyboy]

12 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

Oh come on, the Tories signed a deal with Leichtenstein.

For two paintings.

[Gloucester Saint]

The true state of what the Tories left behind on asylum. Their donors made £383m profit from asylum accommodation whilst Braverman stopped processing cases https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2720n2kkjo

And to think the Rwanda cost would have come on top.