Saints v Skates - Sunday 14th Sept 12pm

[gio1saints]

2 hours ago, goodymatt said:

I very much much doubt Will Still leaves Lens to drop down from a top Euro league to come and work in an environment where he can’t even select the formation. 

The wingers we had were:

Edozie - was leaving

Sulemana - left straight away

Dibling - knew he leaving throughout 

Fraser - redemption arc

Robinson - kid breaking through

Armstrong - inside forward

BBD - inside forward and leaving.

At the same time we had lots of CB options and full backs suited to WB roles.

It’s clear to me that Will thought, there’s lots of change, lots of uncertainty, let’s play 5 and try and edge the games during this period. He’s tried to move on from those players not expected to be here, rather than rely on them. Frustratingly it didn’t prove as successful as we all want/expect and we have dropped some points. 

Now the window is closed and we have motivated wide players. Let’s see if he changes. 

If he plays a 5 tomorrow it’s because it’s a derby and the international break means we’ve not had enough time to get everyone on the same page. Not because Rasmus is picking the formation and lineup.

At last common sense not insane conspiracy theory paranoia! 
 

Like it or hate it, with the players he had, the 3CB’s solution was what he thought gave him best chance of building a reasonable start to the season - certainly until all the transfer stuff calmed down. Anyone thinks he was TOLD to play that way by senior people and just complied like a nodding dog needs to check that their tinfoil hat hasn’t slipped off.  🤡
 

IF he persists with the system there IS a defendable argument for it tomorrow. 
 

Pkaying the cynic card here - if he plays 3cb and we draw or lose he can always revert to his supposed “favoured” approach with a back four next match and say- well that experiment has not worked. If he plays a back four though, and we draw or lose, he won’t get too many saints fans going yeah good effort but back 3 is the way to go- so he’s shafted both ways but marginally less so by continuing with a back three- certainly for start of the match and then perhaps shift it second half. 
 

Many fans want to see the four at back under the impression it’s more attacking - I thinks that’s arguable - I think four at the back is more solid defensively -but not necessarily more attacking so be careful what you wish for! 

Edited 9 hours ago by gio1saints

[die Mannyschaft]

1 minute ago, IFHP said:

Why would you “ not get away with it”?

Got told to take it off by police once on train to Fratton and once off tge bubble coach. They will confiscate next time. Got an asbo ticket once !!

[Paul_B]

21 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

At last common sense not insane conspiracy theory paranoia! 
 

Like it or hate it, with the players he had, the 3CB’s solution was what he thought gave him best chance of building a reasonable start to the season - certainly until all the transfer stuff calmed down. Anyone thinks he was TOLD to play that way by senior people and just complied like a nodding dog needs to check that their tinfoil hat hasn’t slipped off.  🤡
 

IF he persists with the system there IS a defendable argument for it tomorrow. 
 

Pkaying the cynic card here - if he plays 3cb and we draw or lose he can always revert to his supposed “favoured” approach with a back four next match and say- well that experiment has not worked. If he plays a back four though, and we draw or lose, he won’t get too many saints fans going yeah good effort but back 3 is the way to go- so he’s shafted both ways but marginally less so by continuing with a back three- certainly for start of the match and then perhaps shift it second half. 
 

Many fans want to see the four at back under the impression it’s more attacking - I thinks that’s arguable - I think four at the back is more solid defensively -but not necessarily more attacking so be careful what you wish for! 

No, a back 3 tomorrow is in no way defendable.

[gio1saints]

2 minutes ago, Paul_B said:

No, a back 3 tomorrow is in no way defendable.

So definitive like you have the answer to everything and know all details about the squad how they trained their fitness etc. You don’t. There’s plenty reasons why he might do that. I’m not in favour myself - but to say it’s indefensible is exaggeration. Unless it’s  just to you personally otherwise- yes I can see the reasons why he @ might@ keep the back three. I don’t think he will- but there’s reasons alright. 

[Graffito]

1 hour ago, Verbal said:

What have you found?

A wig.

[Charlie Wayman]

48 minutes ago, gio1saints said:

At last common sense not insane conspiracy theory paranoia! 
 

Like it or hate it, with the players he had, the 3CB’s solution was what he thought gave him best chance of building a reasonable start to the season - certainly until all the transfer stuff calmed down. Anyone thinks he was TOLD to play that way by senior people and just complied like a nodding dog needs to check that their tinfoil hat hasn’t slipped off.  🤡
 

IF he persists with the system there IS a defendable argument for it tomorrow. 
 

Pkaying the cynic card here - if he plays 3cb and we draw or lose he can always revert to his supposed “favoured” approach with a back four next match and say- well that experiment has not worked. If he plays a back four though, and we draw or lose, he won’t get too many saints fans going yeah good effort but back 3 is the way to go- so he’s shafted both ways but marginally less so by continuing with a back three- certainly for start of the match and then perhaps shift it second half. 
 

Many fans want to see the four at back under the impression it’s more attacking - I thinks that’s arguable - I think four at the back is more solid defensively -but not necessarily more attacking so be careful what you wish for! 

Still will stick with what he knows best tomorrow simply because he has not had enough time with the new players and the full squad to integrate them into a functioning collective as he likes to call it. We'll probably line up as we did last time out with five at the back and maybe the new left back in place of Manning.

One or two of the newbies will be brought on after 60 mins to see what they can do in this physical league which they won't be used to. Don't expect miracles from them.

For me likely 0-0 or 1-1, probably the latter as Shoehorn will almost certainly concede a silly goal.

[revolution saint]

For all this talk of formations, I think it'll come down to determination, passion, guts, hard work and skill.  Whatever team or formation we put out - we're better than Pompey in  every department.  Yeah, tactics play a part but the squad we have is miles better than theirs - what did we spend 48M compared to their 2M?  Everything I've seen, their fans are bricking it that they might get thrashed so let's give them that nightmare. 

[egg]

45 minutes ago, Paul_B said:

No, a back 3 tomorrow is in no way defendable.

Of course it is. We've had an international break and no opportunity to work, as a group, on a new shape. 

[EssEffCee]

1 hour ago, OldNick said:

I dont know how old you are but football nearly died in the late 70's early 80's due to crowd violence in and around the stadia. Now famillies can go with young kids and be 99% sure they will be safe, Im myself am going with my daughter and grand daughter, if there was liberal rules I doubt I would take them (even though I couldnt stop them as they are hardenedcommitted fans )

If you really believe that you can trust fans with such rivalry to mix and not have large disturbances, Iam amazed. Yes all the Pompey fans I know are sound as aa pound and you can have good banter, but when the game comes its bitter. 

Football violence now is nothing like the 70s and 80s though. Most trouble now is away from stadiums and generally easy enough to avoid if you wish to.

I didn't see any large disturbances at Fratton in 2019 and that was a midweek game. Even in 2010 I didn't see any of the issues on Brittania Road and from second hand accounts from friends it wasn't what I'd call a large scale disturbance. 

How come other police forces around the country can handle it without the bubble? It's not been done for recent Tyne Wear games in the league and they got rid of it for Blackburn Burnley too.

[EssEffCee]

30 minutes ago, Charlie Wayman said:

Still will stick with what he knows best tomorrow simply because he has not had enough time with the new players and the full squad to integrate them into a functioning collective as he likes to call it. We'll probably line up as we did last time out with five at the back and maybe the new left back in place of Manning.

One or two of the newbies will be brought on after 60 mins to see what they can do in this physical league which they won't be used to. Don't expect miracles from them.

For me likely 0-0 or 1-1, probably the latter as Shoehorn will almost certainly concede a silly goal.

I'd be disappointed if Fellows doesn't start. No reason at all that he can't come straight into the team.

[Matthew Le God]

33 minutes ago, egg said:

Of course it is. We've had an international break and no opportunity to work, as a group, on a new shape. 

Roughly two thirds of the squad were here for the full two weeks. Plus the internationals will have had 3 or 4 days training with us.

They have also switched to 4 man defenses late in games this season. So it won't be something they've only had 2 weeks working on.

Edited 8 hours ago by Matthew Le God

[lambtiss]

1 hour ago, die Mannyschaft said:

4 at back is more reliable as players don't get out of position as much or shouldn't. The problem Saints have is the slow style of play they are ground anyone. Combine very slow game plan with 3 at back or even 5 and you get the usual opposition just cut through or run un marked. 4-4-2 allows cover in front and behind the two lines of 4. Its simple and easy to speak to thd person next to you to go forward I'll cover or back, sideways. 

It maybe the new players have the pace needed for 3 of 5 at back. But we won't see this in action until they are in team. 

I don't think Saints have any idea what system to use of which player to play where and what role. Which is why teams have just found it easy to play through or long ball us.

Let's hope Saints know what their doing tomorrow. 

I think our slow buildup explains why such a high percentage of our goals have come from defenders and set pieces.

By the time we get to the opposition box the other team usually have 11 men behind the ball with no space in the box. That makes it very hard for any attacker.

This will be especially true at home in the Championship where teams will often sit back and allow a team to slip into tippy happy mode.

This is where players that can beat a man/ dribble/ break the lines of defence are going to be critical to our success. Hopefully, the new faces can bring that to our game.

[goodymatt]

23 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Roughly two thirds of the squad were here for the full two weeks. Plus the internationals will have had 3 or 4 days training with us.

It is likely that Bazunu, Manning, Azaz, and Charles will all start. The Irish lads coming back the latest (except Downs). New signing Scienza didn’t train until Tuesday and Downs wasn’t even back until Friday. 

Lots of new players in the building, huge game, you can see why a conservative approach to change might be taken. Personally I want to see a back 4, hopefully we do, but it doesn’t mean there isn’t some logic in sticking for this game.

My team would be:

Baz

Mads THB Stevo Manning 

Charles Downs

Fellows Azaz Fraser

Archer

Seems to be a popular lineup choice and it’s also what the Echo have predicted.

[OldNick]

30 minutes ago, EssEffCee said:

Football violence now is nothing like the 70s and 80s though. Most trouble now is away from stadiums and generally easy enough to avoid if you wish to.

I didn't see any large disturbances at Fratton in 2019 and that was a midweek game. Even in 2010 I didn't see any of the issues on Brittania Road and from second hand accounts from friends it wasn't what I'd call a large scale disturbance. 

How come other police forces around the country can handle it without the bubble? It's not been done for recent Tyne Wear games in the league and they got rid of it for Blackburn Burnley too.

there was a Police escort to the ground with the fans completely segregated. Ohh the Brittania road one was nothing much was it? All those who went inside for a stretch may have a different opinion.

I was at Fratton Park in 84 and there was little police presence when we were waiting for our coach near the station, fans were mixed and there was lots of scraps. Im sure if you want to test how peaceful it would be, why not hang around near the Pompey coaches on Sunday, no  doubt they give you flowers 

[LGTL]

In the latest police statement about being naughty, they insisted the bubble was a choice of both clubs rather than the police. Struggle to believe that. 

Seems pathetic that they can’t cope with a non-bubble really. Only one left in the country isn’t it?

[Turkish]

I got a feeling Damion Downs is going to score tomorrow 

[sfc4prem]

6 minutes ago, Turkish said:

I got a feeling Damion Downs is going to score tomorrow 

Be a fucking great way to score your first league goal. The noise will be electric when we score tomorrow, so if he bags one his confidence will fucking sky rocket.

[OldNick]

13 minutes ago, LGTL said:

In the latest police statement about being naughty, they insisted the bubble was a choice of both clubs rather than the police. Struggle to believe that. 

Seems pathetic that they can’t cope with a non-bubble really. Only one left in the country isn’t it?

Do they let Millwall v WHU mix, or Celtic Rangers, Brum V Newcastle

[Chris cooper]

2 hours ago, Paul_B said:

No, a back 3 tomorrow is in no way defendable.

You can take a horse to water mate but you can’t make it drink !

[Mixedkebab]

39 minutes ago, LGTL said:

In the latest police statement about being naughty, they insisted the bubble was a choice of both clubs rather than the police. Struggle to believe that. 

Seems pathetic that they can’t cope with a non-bubble really. Only one left in the country isn’t it?

Don’t they still have it for Cardiff and Swansea?

[Pamplemousse]

Looks like the weather won't be as bad as forecast. Think the rain and strong winds might come in around the second half.

[Matthew Le God]

8 minutes ago, Pamplemousse said:

Looks like the weather won't be as bad as forecast. Think the rain and strong winds might come in around the second half.

BBC say light rain and 15 mph winds for the 2nd half. So not particularly windy or wet.

 

Edited 6 hours ago by Matthew Le God

[Pamplemousse]

18 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

BBC say light rain and 15 mph winds for the 2nd half. So not particularly windy or wet.

 

Stronger winds and wetter than the start of the match though, that was the point I was making.

[egg]

1 hour ago, Matthew Le God said:

Roughly two thirds of the squad were here for the full two weeks. Plus the internationals will have had 3 or 4 days training with us.

They have also switched to 4 man defenses late in games this season. So it won't be something they've only had 2 weeks working on.

We need the likely starting team working the shape, not just those left behind. 

The point is, him playing a 3 tomorrow is not indefensible. Personally, I think it's understandable. 

[LGTL]

1 hour ago, OldNick said:

Do they let Millwall v WHU mix, or Celtic Rangers, Brum V Newcastle

No, but none of those have a bubble. I’m not advocating zero segregation. But no reason they can’t allow train travel and an escort to the ground, but they just can’t be arsed to police it. 

[bpsaint]

33 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

BBC say light rain and 15 mph winds for the 2nd half. So not particularly windy or wet.

 

The forecast has shifted a long way over the past few days, it was looking like torrential rain and 40mph wind all morning and during the game at one point.

With regards to the bubble, I could see an argument that if we end up playing each other more regularly we potentially drop it. The big gaps between our matches seems to make things a bit spicier, perhaps that’s how other clubs manage to get away with no bubble.

Edited 6 hours ago by bpsaint

[EssEffCee]

1 hour ago, OldNick said:

there was a Police escort to the ground with the fans completely segregated. Ohh the Brittania road one was nothing much was it? All those who went inside for a stretch may have a different opinion.

I was at Fratton Park in 84 and there was little police presence when we were waiting for our coach near the station, fans were mixed and there was lots of scraps. Im sure if you want to test how peaceful it would be, why not hang around near the Pompey coaches on Sunday, no  doubt they give you flowers 

Yeah even without the bubble fans will still be segregated as you say so not sure why you keep talking about fans 'mixing' as they don't regardless of whether the bubble is in place or not.

Yeah people went to jail for 2010 but that doesn't mean there was large disturbances akin to the 70s/80s. Football fans often get prison sentences for things which wouldn't get one in a different environment.

I don't want to mix with the skates at these games. But when going away I would like to be able to make my own way there and not have the whole day take as long as if I was going to an away day in Brum.

 

 

[EssEffCee]

1 hour ago, LGTL said:

In the latest police statement about being naughty, they insisted the bubble was a choice of both clubs rather than the police. Struggle to believe that. 

Seems pathetic that they can’t cope with a non-bubble really. Only one left in the country isn’t it?

Swansea Cardiff has it still. NE had it for the recent cup game with the bigger allocation but haven't for years with league games. They sacked it off for East Lancs last season too.

[Turkish]

Be interesting to see how many of our new boys start. 

[SNSUN]

Time for the never reliable Prediction wheel! Bar the Wrexham game, it has got NO results right this season.

However as this game is an anomaly and a huge game for bragging rights alone, I predict whatever the Prediction wheel predicts will come true. 

Onwards...

 

We haven't had a lot to cheer about of late by by gum the wheel MUST be right this time. Could be 2 nil, could be 6-4... just win Saints! 

[stfrancisofbenali]

5 hours ago, Paul_B said:

No, a back 3 tomorrow is in no way defendable.

Unless we win playing a back three of course. 

[goodymatt]

 

[Saint Fan CaM]

1 hour ago, goodymatt said:

 

Is it me - feels like there’s not enough fire in their bellies befitting of a home derby game of this magnitude? Even Stephens seems a bit subdued and if there’s anyone I’d expect to be hyped it would be him.

[suewhistle]

I notice West Ham banned half and half scarves today for their match with Spurs. Will they be available for tomorrow's game, I wonder?

😉

I was just reading the MBM in the newspaper for the game and although he started haven't seen any mention of Mateus Fernandes. How have the 3 ex-Saints performed?

 

[Badger]

20 minutes ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Is it me - feels like there’s not enough fire in their bellies befitting of a home derby game of this magnitude? Even Stephens seems a bit subdued and if there’s anyone I’d expect to be hyped it would be him.

That’s no bad thing in my view. I’d rather they showed it on the pitch, and talked about it afterwards. Rather than a load of fake posturing beforehand just for the media and some fans benefit. 

[Saint Fan CaM]

Just now, Badger said:

That’s no bad thing in my view. I’d rather they showed it on the pitch, and talked about it afterwards. Rather than a load of fake posturing beforehand just for the media and some fans benefit. 

Good point well made. Can’t help starting to question everything in the excitement of it all! Goodness knows how I’ll feel tomorrow morning!

[Pamplemousse]

1 hour ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Is it me - feels like there’s not enough fire in their bellies befitting of a home derby game of this magnitude? Even Stephens seems a bit subdued and if there’s anyone I’d expect to be hyped it would be him.

I don't want them too hyped up. They have a job a do and need to focus on the tactical side of things and work on the instructions the coaches give them to help us win the game.

The emotional side of things will come naturally. It will be a raucous, hostile atmosphere. If they're not up for it before, they will when the walk out the tunnel to the noise of 28,000 plus roaring them on.

Edited 1 hour ago by Pamplemousse

[ChrisPY]

1 hour ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Is it me - feels like there’s not enough fire in their bellies befitting of a home derby game of this magnitude? Even Stephens seems a bit subdued and if there’s anyone I’d expect to be hyped it would be him.

Shame they cut him reading the message from @Wade Garrett or I’m sure we’d have seen it.

[trousers]

1 hour ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

Is it me - feels like there’s not enough fire in their bellies befitting of a home derby game of this magnitude? Even Stephens seems a bit subdued and if there’s anyone I’d expect to be hyped it would be him.

 

52 minutes ago, Badger said:

That’s no bad thing in my view. I’d rather they showed it on the pitch, and talked about it afterwards. Rather than a load of fake posturing beforehand just for the media and some fans benefit. 

 

10 minutes ago, Pamplemousse said:

I don't want them too hyped up. They have a job a do and need to focus on the tactical side of things and work on the instructions the coaches give them to help us win the game.

The emotional side of things will come naturally. It will be a raucous, hostile atmosphere. If they're not up for it before, they will when the walk out the tunnel to the noise of 28,000 plus roaring them on.

Yep, agree. I've been feeling for a while now that all this whipped up hype by the club's media department could back fire on us. The best approach, in my humble opinion, would have been to treat the build up like any other game and leave all the emotion stuff until the players take to the pitch. Just feels a tad manufactured to me, but maybe that's just me being a grumpy old git 😁

Edited 1 hour ago by trousers

[goodymatt]

 

[saintant]

11 hours ago, goodymatt said:

I very much much doubt Will Still leaves Lens to drop down from a top Euro league to come and work in an environment where he can’t even select the formation. 

The wingers we had were:

Edozie - was leaving

Sulemana - left straight away

Dibling - knew he leaving throughout 

Fraser - redemption arc

Robinson - kid breaking through

Armstrong - inside forward

BBD - inside forward and leaving.

At the same time we had lots of CB options and full backs suited to WB roles.

It’s clear to me that Will thought, there’s lots of change, lots of uncertainty, let’s play 5 and try and edge the games during this period. He’s tried to move on from those players not expected to be here, rather than rely on them. Frustratingly it didn’t prove as successful as we all want/expect and we have dropped some points. 

Now the window is closed and we have motivated wide players. Let’s see if he changes. 

If he plays a 5 tomorrow it’s because it’s a derby and the international break means we’ve not had enough time to get everyone on the same page. Not because Rasmus is picking the formation and lineup.

Sorry but those are excuses not reasons he may decide to stick to 5 at the back. It has to be a back 4 after the players we brought in.

[goodymatt]

2 minutes ago, saintant said:

Sorry but those are excuses not reasons he may decide to stick to 5 at the back. It has to be a back 4 after the players we brought in.

4 would be my preference too, think we’re all aligned on that really. Just wouldn’t be a surprise if we don’t make the switch for this game IMO.

Edited 1 hour ago by goodymatt

[saintant]

9 hours ago, OldNick said:

Should we change when the players are used to a 5 at present. A massive game to change formation, a formation that has created a shed load of chances

And won us 5 points!

[Stripey McStripe Shirt]

As if I needed a reason to dislike Portsmouth more, I've just found out Jacob 'Mega-Twat' Murphy's twin plays for them.

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

9 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

They don’t look used to it, we have been very average at best.

we are playing Portsmouth, not Bayern Munich. We have better players who won’t make the bench, ffs

 

One of the most depressing games I've seen was when we lost 4-1 in the cup around 15 years ago but their squad then was miles better than us. Now our squad is technically miles better. We'll thump them.

That stated and not really the thread to say this but for some reason Pompey really aren't on my hate list. Always the victims, Liverpool yes. Leeds yes. But Portsmouth...they're just the losers down the road and let's keep it that way.  

[ChrisPY]

6 minutes ago, OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint said:

One of the most depressing games I've seen was when we lost 4-1 in the cup around 15 years ago but their squad then was miles better than us. Now our squad is technically miles better. We'll thump them.

That stated and not really the thread to say this but for some reason Pompey really aren't on my hate list. Always the victims, Liverpool yes. Leeds yes. But Portsmouth...they're just the losers down the road and let's keep it that way.  

It’s an honest mistake but they’re all a bunch of inbred cunts as well.

[Pamplemousse]

31 minutes ago, trousers said:

 

 

Yep, agree. I've been feeling for a while now that all this whipped up hype by the club's media department could back fire on us. The best approach, in my humble opinion, would have been to treat the build up like any other game and leave all the emotion stuff until the players take to the pitch. Just feels a tad manufactured to me, but maybe that's just me being a grumpy old git 😁

We'll find out tomorrow! It worked for the West Brom game tbh so hopefully we get the same outcome

[LGTL]

Seen a lot of posts online from their lot saying how they’re just coming to enjoy the day, the result is just a bonus and all the pressure is on us. Really bizarre outlook from some of their freaks. Their fans are shitting themselves, rightly or wrongly. 

[Pamplemousse]

Just shows how smalltime they are. They'll happily accept a defeat as long as they put in a decent performance "ah well, they had too much quality for us on the day"

I couldn't care less how we play. We just have to win. If it's a last minute dive to win a penalty and we don't deserve it, so what. Winning is the only thing that matters.

[LGTL]

7 minutes ago, Pamplemousse said:

Just shows how smalltime they are. They'll happily accept a defeat as long as they put in a decent performance "ah well, they had too much quality for us on the day"

I couldn't care less how we play. We just have to win. If it's a last minute dive to win a penalty and we don't deserve it, so what. Winning is the only thing that matters.

Absolutely. I still remember the last 10 minutes at Fratton in 2019. After being silent the whole game, they decided to sing for the last 10 minutes to show everyone how they're just the bestest and they didn't care about being beaten by big Southampton. Fucking freaks, I'd take two wins against them even if it meant losing every other game this season. 

Derbies aren't for everyone, and they certainly aren't for their small time support.