Chez Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Wotte mentioned that the club is already in negotiations with players at the club who's contracts are up at the end of the season. He states that final decisions will be based on what league we are in. Just wondered if the league we are in effected peoples perception as to which players we should try to retain - which will depend on them wanting to sign and us beign able to afford them. Kelvin Davis seems a no brainer but what about the others? Poke Perry Svensson BWP Stern John Euell Jamie Hatch Lloyd James Jake Thomson Ryan Smith Jack Boyle Joseph Mills Jeffrey Imudia Andrej Pernecky Jamie White Michael Byrne And will we be able to sign Saeijs on a permanent deal? What's more are we looking to sign oput opf contract players fromother clubs because now is the time to start talking to them of we haven't already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Officially, I don't think clubs are allowed to talk to players whose contracts are expiring domestically, but can sign pre-contract agreements with players contracted to foreign clubs with up to 6 months remaining on their contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Bones Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Kelvin Davis - Love to keep him - But if we go down - He's gone. Poke - Yup - Bart will go also Perry. Yes if Div 1, no if CCC Svensson - coach only BWP - Unsure. keep if he is cheap Stern John - Seems on his way out - no doubt on big wages too Euell - Wage is the issue again, otherwise keep -------------------------------------- Jamie Hatch Lloyd James Jake Thomson Ryan Smith Jack Boyle Joseph Mills Jeffrey Imudia Andrej Pernecky Jamie White Michael Byrne Keep all regardless - Wage permitting. All still young and a chance to become the next big thing. And will we be able to sign Saeijs on a permanent deal? I thought he is as good as signed for next year if we survive, and then for another year if he plays 20 games + Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 (edited) Kelvin Davis - Love to keep him - But if we go down - He's gone. Poke - Yup - Bart will go also Perry. Yes if Div 1, no if CCC Svensson - coach only BWP - Unsure. keep if he is cheap Stern John - Seems on his way out - no doubt on big wages too Euell - Wage is the issue again, otherwise keep -------------------------------------- And will we be able to sign Saeijs on a permanent deal? I thought he is as good as signed for next year if we survive, and then for another year if he plays 20 games + Lots of " IF's " of course, but if Saeijs stays, so too can Perry, ..and no-one has suggested that Svensson will not play again. Just because he's become a coach, it doesn't mean he's thrown away his boots - if he's fit by next season - what a back line that would be - in either league.! Edited 25 March, 2009 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Keep: Chris Perry Jamie Hatch Lloyd James - Long term contract Jake Thomson Jack Boyle Joseph Mills - Long term contract Jeffrey Imudia Andrej Pernecky Jamie White Michael Byrne Keep on reduced terms: Kelvin Davis Jason Euell Definatly get rid: Poke Svensson - maybe a coaching contract. BWP Stern John Ryan Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Keep: Chris Perry Jamie Hatch Lloyd James - Long term contract Jake Thomson Jack Boyle Joseph Mills - Long term contract Jeffrey Imudia Andrej Pernecky Jamie White Michael Byrne Keep on reduced terms: Kelvin Davis Jason Euell Definatly get rid: Poke Svensson - maybe a coaching contract. BWP Stern John Ryan Smith Do you really think that Kelvin would accept significantly reduced terms then? He likes it here but I don't think he's a registred charity yet. Euell ? they'd need to be really reduced, 14K week is silly money.Will get offered about 4K I expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottery st mary Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 We should get rid of all the mascots. They don't appear to have given anything to the side. Who signed them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Do you really think that Kelvin would accept significantly reduced terms then? He likes it here but I don't think he's a registred charity yet. Euell ? they'd need to be really reduced, 14K week is silly money.Will get offered about 4K I expect. I'm not saying they'd accept but I think they at least deserve a contract. Offer Kelvin 2-3 years on 5k and Euell a 1 year deal for about the same. If they both want to leave it's not a massive problem, Bart could come in for Davis and i'm sure we can find a better striker than Euell on the cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanh Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 If we stay in this league I hope that the club can keep the decent performers on an affordable salary, keep the youngsters with potential and get rid of the players who have shown that they aren't up to it. From your list I would say they split up as follows: Keep on affordable salary Kelvin Davis BWP Poke Perry Lloyd James Youngsters who still have promise Jamie Hatch Jake Thomson Jack Boyle Joseph Mills Jeffrey Imudia Andrej Pernecky Jamie White Michael Byrne Release Stern John Euell Ryan Smith Svensson - Surely he'll retire as a player at the end of the season Surely we'll also have to move on Skacel and Rasiak to anyone who will pay their wages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 If we stay in this league I hope that the club can keep the decent performers on an affordable salary, keep the youngsters with potential and get rid of the players who have shown that they aren't up to it. From your list I would say they split up as follows: Keep on affordable salary Kelvin Davis BWP Poke Perry Lloyd James Youngsters who still have promise Jamie Hatch Jake Thomson Jack Boyle Joseph Mills Jeffrey Imudia Andrej Pernecky Jamie White Michael Byrne Release Stern John Euell Ryan Smith Svensson - Surely he'll retire as a player at the end of the season Surely we'll also have to move on Skacel and Rasiak to anyone who will pay their wages Exactly, that's why Skacel, Euell and Saga are still here. Still our gain is the other teams' loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Keep on affordable salary BWP Why? He can't shoot, he's thick as ****, has an attitude problem, can't play out wide, doesn't work hard, doesn't score enough, doesn't assist and just generally doesn't look like a footballer. I'll be so happy when we **** him off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doughnutman Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Wotte mentioned that the club is already in negotiations with players at the club who's contracts are up at the end of the season. He states that final decisions will be based on what league we are in. Just wondered if the league we are in effected peoples perception as to which players we should try to retain - which will depend on them wanting to sign and us beign able to afford them. Kelvin Davis Must keep!!! IMO whatever the cost Poke Let go, doesnt look like he'll ever make it at this level Perrykeep Svenssonkeep BWPlet go, unless on very reduced contract Stern Johnwould like to see kept but doubt it will happen Euelllike to keep but would depend on his contract being reduced methinks Jamie Hatchkeep Lloyd Jamesanother player we must keep hold of Jake Thomsonkeep Ryan Smithlet go, a poor player and waste of money on showings so far Jack Boyle sounds very promising, keep Joseph Millskeep, though i do worry that he hasn't been recalled back to saints when the fringe players are being asked to step up and he appears to be one of our best fringe players Jeffrey Imudiakeep Andrej Perneckyheard good things about him so keep, better than poke ihmo Jamie White keep, will eventually be a very good player Michael Byrnedont know much about him but give him another year i think Saeijs- an absolute must keep! also wastnt liptak signed on a loan similar to that of saeijs and that the transfer will be made permanent if we stay up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Kelvin Davis - No. Just kidding, but surely he will have better offers. Poke - Only if one of the other 3 leaves Perry - Will be just that little bit too old IMO. Coaching role? Svensson - Not as a player. BWP - Only if he is willing to take a massive wage cut, i.e. £10k down to £3k Stern John - No. Euell - No. Sorry, one 3 game patch of form a season doesn't make up for being a carthorse the rest of the time. Jamie Hatch - Haven't seen much, but is young and cheap, so I guess so. Lloyd James - Yes, but play him in midfield and get a proper RB FFS! Jake Thomson - Yep Ryan Smith - Can p*ss off. Jack Boyle - Never seen him Joseph Mills - Will be needed when Skacel leaves Jeffrey Imudia - Looked really useful when I saw him in the resies. Can he play RB? Andrej Pernecky - Yep Jamie White - Yep, but loan him out again. Michael Byrne - Yes, also in need of loanage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minsk Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Of course, everything depends on what league we will be playing in next year. But I would call it like this: Kelvin Davis - would love to keep him no matter what, but I am pretty sure he will be gone if we go down Poke - let go Perry - keep, no matter which league we are in Svensson - would not keep as a player BWP - keep, but only if he will accept much lower wages Stern John - he is gone already Euell - let go (unless he also agrees to MUCH lower wages) Jamie Hatch - keep (we need a reserve team) Lloyd James - definitely keep, but please sign a RB and play him in midfield Jake Thomson - definitely keep, we will regret it if we don't Ryan Smith - let go Jack Boyle - possibly keep Joseph Mills - definitely keep (especially if Skacel goes elswhere) Jeffrey Imudia - keep Andrej Pernecky - keep (if we go down would be 3rd choice 'keeper) Jamie White - definitely keep Michael Byrne - keep And will we be able to sign Saeijs on a permanent deal? Saeijs will sign permanently for us if we stay up. He will go back if we go down. As for the other loanees (Gasmi and Liptak) I would not want to retain either of these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 (edited) Perry - Will be just that little bit too old IMO. Coaching role? BWP - Only if he is willing to take a massive wage cut, i.e. £10k down to £3k Jeffrey Imudia - Looked really useful when I saw him in the resies. Can he play RB? Don't see anything to suggest Perry is too old to carry on, he's been one of out most consistent performers this season. Even if next year he's not first choice centre back there should be room for him in the squad, as we've seen over the last 4 seasons a decent CCC centre back is hard to find. 3k is still 3k too much. Imudia can play RB, doesn't look ready for first team from what i've seen. Edited 25 March, 2009 by Andy_Porter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 25 March, 2009 Share Posted 25 March, 2009 Officially, I don't think clubs are allowed to talk to players whose contracts are expiring domestically, but can sign pre-contract agreements with players contracted to foreign clubs with up to 6 months remaining on their contracts. How do you know all this stuff Steve? You should get out more you know lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Block 5 Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Everyone has said they want Ryan Smith to go. In light of Wotte's praise after his reserves performance yesterday, do you still feel the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 There is no way Kelvin Davis will play in League 1 and there's not much chance he'll take reduced wages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lets B Avenue Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Everyone has said they want Ryan Smith to go. In light of Wotte's praise after his reserves performance yesterday, do you still feel the same? Yes. Maybe reserve team is his level (after all thats where Millwall were playing him). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Can anyone remember where Davis said that he turned his phone off last summer? Can't find it on the OS, starting to think I imagined it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 26 March, 2009 Author Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Everyone has said they want Ryan Smith to go. In light of Wotte's praise after his reserves performance yesterday, do you still feel the same? Yes. Do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanh Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Why? He can't shoot, he's thick as ****, has an attitude problem, can't play out wide, doesn't work hard, doesn't score enough, doesn't assist and just generally doesn't look like a footballer. I'll be so happy when we **** him off. Fair enough, this forum is all about opinions. I reckon there is something in BWP that hasn't quite been realised yet. Perhaps he hasn't found the ideal strike partner, or the right system of play yet but given who else is going to be leaving I'd keep him. I would only keep him on reduced terms anyway and if we go down I think he'll find another club in the CCC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Kelvin Davis seems a no brainer, but will leave when we relegate. Poke - No. Not good enough. Perry - Yes, simply MUST retain Perry. Svensson - No. Injured and finished. BWP - No. Not good enough for League 1 or CCC. Stern John - Yes, still afew years left in him - but will want to leave anyway when we relegate due to his treatment this season after keeping us up last. Euell - Yes, but will want to leave when we relegate due to his management this season. Jamie Hatch - No. Not good enough for League 1. Lloyd James - No. Not good enough for League 1. Jake Thomson - No. Not good enough for League 1. Ryan Smith - No. Not good enough for League 1. Jack Boyle - No. Not good enough for League 1. Joseph Mills - No. Not good enough for League 1. Jeffrey Imudia - No. Not good enough for League 1. Andrej Pernecky - No. Not good enough for League 1. Jamie White - Yes clear potential. Michael Byrne - No. Not good enough for League 1. Saeijs - Definite. Must sign. Dyer - MUST sign, but again will want to leave after the way he's been managed this season. Oh dear doesnt look good this youth experiment does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 You're being very, very harsh there Robbie. Mills, Thomson, Hatch, James, Pernecky, Byrne, Imudia - all are very young still and most we've hardly seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Robbie is being very very harsh there. For a start, Joseph Mills is doing a good job in league one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krissyboy31 Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 You're being very, very harsh there Robbie. Mills, Thomson, Hatch, James, Pernecky, Byrne, Imudia - all are very young still and most we've hardly seen. I agree with that but I think unless he can become No 3 GK (i.e. lose 2 of Davis, Bart, Forecast or Poke), I'd release Pernecky because he won't get a game for the Ressies or the U18's next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigchrisy Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Kelvin Davis: Love to see him stay but if we go down no chance Perry I think he will stay either way Svensson Coaching BWP He will go either way Stern John No chance Euell Maybe if we stay up Jamie Hatch Proably Lloyd James Yes either way Jake Thomson Proably Ryan Smith I hope not Jack Boyle Proably Joseph Mills Proably Jeffrey Imudia Proably Andrej Pernecky Proably Jamie White Proably Michael Proably Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Kelvin Davis - Keep whatever division but expect him to go to a CCC club. Poke - Better than Forecast but that doesn't say much! Keep if other GK go only if we go down. Perry - Keep. Svensson - Keep as coach. BWP - Attitude and application stinks, get rid. Stern John - No, too expensive and getting on for a striker. Euell - Keep at much reduced wages, so will therefore go with no transfer fee to pay. Jamie Hatch - Keep if we go down. Lloyd James - Keep, getting to be a good player. Jake Thomson - Keep. Ryan Smith - No. Jack Boyle - Keep. Joseph Mills - Keep, if we stay in CCC prefer him to Molyneux. Jeffrey Imudia - Keep. Andrej Pernecky - Keep. Jamie White - Keep. Michael Byrne - keep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Fair enough, this forum is all about opinions. I reckon there is something in BWP that hasn't quite been realised yet. Perhaps he hasn't found the ideal strike partner, or the right system of play yet but given who else is going to be leaving I'd keep him. I would only keep him on reduced terms anyway and if we go down I think he'll find another club in the CCC. He has a bit of ability but a bad attitude & absolutely no brains. He wil wish he had saved his cash from this contract because the next one will be with Rochdale or Macclesfield. Has anyone ever promised so much and delivered so little for us? He's 24 and had three years here & yet he is still the perennial nearly man. What would be the point of giving him more time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 What is more worrying is Skacel, Saganowski & Rasiak all still have another year to go on their mega-contracts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ribbo Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 I dont see the point in getting rid of anyone under 21-22 to be honest, they'll be on peanuts and unless the position they play in is overloaded with players they'll be needed. We need to remember that some of the players we started at the start of the season at at a max of 30games into a professional career, you cant write the likes of white, paterson, olly, gobern, ilmudia, mclaggon etc off because they're only 10 games max in!! i hope Ryan Smith, turns out to be a good player, but he needs to be nurtured and not tortured, we play a role in that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 You're being very, very harsh there Robbie. Mills, Thomson, Hatch, James, Pernecky, Byrne, Imudia - all are very young still and most we've hardly seen. OK - I admit it. I didnt take into account potential. You're quite correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Robbie is being very very harsh there. For a start, Joseph Mills is doing a good job in league one Good point - see above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 What is more worrying is Skacel, Saganowski & Rasiak all still have another year to go on their mega-contracts Hardly mega contracts. Only by our standards where the average wages is a shilling and thrupence. The problem with those players is we had too many of them. Last season it was those 3 plus Vignal, John, Euell, BWP, Davis, Davies, Idiakez, Viafara, Lundekvam and Powell all on £10k a week plus. There was also Ostlund, Wright and Safri who would be there or there abouts and loans like Dailly, who was rumoured to be on £20k during his time here. That must be close to £5,000,000 a year of the wage bill. We really need to be finding room on the wage bill for Saga and Rasiak if we stay up (Skacel is off regardless). Without them our wages must be comparable to your average Blue Square South team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benj540 Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Kelvin Davis - Keep, if we can get him on slightly lower wages Poke - Keep, give him a chance, he will be cheaper than others Perry - Keep, even his he can only manage 1 game a week his experience is needed Svensson - Can't see him playing again, reduce wages and sign as coach BWP - Hard to choose, could be a job in league one but could we afford his wages, in CCC I would say let him go, if we can get a decent replacement Stern John - Let him go Euell - Let him go, unless he will sign for around 50% of his current salary Jamie Hatch - Give him a chance to prove himself, cheaper than signing another right back, as we will need cover Lloyd James - Try and secure him for a long term Jake Thomson - Maybe give him a year to see if he can make a break through Ryan Smith - Let him go, really is a waste Jack Boyle - Do not know anything about this chap Joseph Mills - Sign on long term Jeffrey Imudia - Same as Hatch Andrej Pernecky - Let him go Jamie White - Keep him on, showed promise before his injury Michael Byrne - Don't know enough about this guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 26 March, 2009 Author Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Hardly mega contracts. Only by our standards where the average wages is a shilling and thrupence. yeah, how dare anyone suggest your beloved Skacel is overpaid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 yeah, how dare anyone suggest your beloved Skacel is overpaid. Grow up. Yes he is, as are Saga, Rasiak, BWP, Rooney, Ballack, Sol Campbell, Ashley Cole, Kieron Dyer... you get the idea. My point is having 3 players on £10k a week isn't going to bankrupt us when the rest of the squad is getting paid squat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 26 March, 2009 Author Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Grow up. Yes he is, as are Saga, Rasiak, BWP, Rooney, Ballack, Sol Campbell, Ashley Cole, Kieron Dyer... you get the idea. My point is having 3 players on £10k a week isn't going to bankrupt us when the rest of the squad is getting paid squat. Euell, Skacel, Rasiak, John, BWP, Thomas, Davis, Perry, Saga and maybe Surman are all on a fair whack I should imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 26 March, 2009 Share Posted 26 March, 2009 Euell, Skacel, Rasiak, John, BWP, Thomas, Davis, Perry, Saga and maybe Surman are all on a fair whack I should imagine. I thought we were on about next season? Euell, John, Davis and BWP are out of contract at the end of the season. They wont be staying unless they take a considerable wage cut. Perry was a free from cash strapped Luton, can't see him being on high wages and if he is, like the others, he'd have to take a pay cut next season to stay. We knew we were in debt when we gave Surman the contract extension, so we wouldn't have broken the bank on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 I thought we were on about next season? Euell, John, Davis and BWP are out of contract at the end of the season. They wont be staying unless they take a considerable wage cut. Perry was a free from cash strapped Luton, can't see him being on high wages and if he is, like the others, he'd have to take a pay cut next season to stay. We knew we were in debt when we gave Surman the contract extension, so we wouldn't have broken the bank on that one. Thomas is another one with a year to go (I believe) on a big wage, too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 27 March, 2009 Author Share Posted 27 March, 2009 (edited) I thought we were on about next season? Euell, John, Davis and BWP are out of contract at the end of the season. They wont be staying unless they take a considerable wage cut. Perry was a free from cash strapped Luton, can't see him being on high wages and if he is, like the others, he'd have to take a pay cut next season to stay. We knew we were in debt when we gave Surman the contract extension, so we wouldn't have broken the bank on that one. You were talking about £5M being shaved off last season wage bill and therefore I was pointing out that despite this there were still quite a few big earners still at the club this season. As for next season we get Rasiak back and if we go down we lose a shed load of gate revenue not to mention miss out on the limited, but still significant, TV money. That is going to dictate whether we can sign Davis, Saeijs, Euell etc on new deals. Looking at what happened last summer, Lowe let every out of contract player on a decent wage go apart from the much needed Perry. Surely he can't do the same this summer (after it was proved experienced pros with quality are needed to win games), but hands may be tied financially. In other words unless Euell, BWP and Davis take cuts we will have to wave them goodbye. For the record I'd let Smith go and I think BWP needs a change of scene (for his sake) even though I think he has ability and the pace we need up front. I'm not a big Perry fan and if Thomas is back then maybe he could be let go (so long as Saeijs signs) and I've backed Euell and Davis since day 1 - but if all left it would not be hard to know why - money. BTW I thought Surman had just got England U21 caps under his belt before signing a new deal. Make no mistake he will have been given a very decent wage to keep him here, perhaps in line with the other top earners at the club. Edited 27 March, 2009 by Chez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norwaysaint Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 Joseph Mills - No. Not good enough for League 1. Yeah, they don't rate him at the league one club he's with now (in play-off position). Three separate threads say different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norwaysaint Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 Even if I ****ed up the second link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krissyboy31 Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 Yeah, they don't rate him at the league one club he's with now (in play-off position). Three separate threads say different. I agree completely. Some of our youngsters are NOT good enough but Fish Mills certainly is and will be a cracking player for us in the future (if we can keep hold of him). His problem, like some of the others, was the sink or swim (forgive the pun) policy of the "Revolutionary Coaching System" of throwing in youngsters regardless of whether they were ready or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 Reducing costs is obviously important, but in the short term over the summer that will not help us out at all OK doing some really rough maths from some of the numbers bandied on here We owe the bank something like 4mil which they want back We will owe over 1 mil interest on the stadium loan which they will want Dumping out of contract players for free stops us paying wages but where is the CASH coming from to pay the rest over the summer. Rod Stewart's gig and our kick-about won't keep the club going all through Seems nobody wants to renew their season tickets (apparently) but let's say we get 4,000 at 350 quid average each gives 1.4 mil Now, the ST's cover the Stadium but don't give much to keep things running when there is no income in the close season and we still have to pay wages. So we look at the out of contract players and wonder who has some value as obviously we will have to sell. Nobody seems to buy players at the start of the transfer window so we may have to ask Aviva to wait for their cash and use some of the ST money to keep going. On that basis I would expect that KD would get a contract - as if we own him and his salary is sensible, we could get 750k at least for him and maybe more. I would hate to lose him, but he may be asked to help us keep going one more time... What chances of getting money for Saga/Rasiak/Skacel?? hmmm What would we get for Surman/Lallana? Maybe 500k for Dyer? Seems a struggle to get to 4 mil.... But it could still mean that maybe we WOULD renew one or two contracts simply to be able to get a fee for them later in the summer, dangerous game but even if we get through to May, the bank are still going to want to see that overdraft reduced. IMHO there is a lot of haggling going on behind the scenes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 I think Surman and Lallana will go in the summer personally. I'd accept that if it means we can keep Saga, bring back Dyer and sign a strong tackler in central midfield. Holmes can replace Surman on the left IMO. Would make for a strong 442 with Dyer and Holmes on the wings. All if we stay up of course. Think Schneiderlin could flourish next to a ball winner. Well, at the very leat they can keep each other company in the physio room. Who do we play on the pitch though? If Surman, Skacel and Lallana leave, we really will be struggling for creativity, and we're hardly Brazil at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 You were talking about £5M being shaved off last season wage bill and therefore I was pointing out that despite this there were still quite a few big earners still at the club this season. As for next season we get Rasiak back and if we go down we lose a shed load of gate revenue not to mention miss out on the limited, but still significant, TV money. That is going to dictate whether we can sign Davis, Saeijs, Euell etc on new deals. Looking at what happened last summer, Lowe let every out of contract player on a decent wage go apart from the much needed Perry. Surely he can't do the same this summer (after it was proved experienced pros with quality are needed to win games), but hands may be tied financially. In other words unless Euell, BWP and Davis take cuts we will have to wave them goodbye. For the record I'd let Smith go and I think BWP needs a change of scene (for his sake) even though I think he has ability and the pace we need up front. I'm not a big Perry fan and if Thomas is back then maybe he could be let go (so long as Saeijs signs) and I've backed Euell and Davis since day 1 - but if all left it would not be hard to know why - money. BTW I thought Surman had just got England U21 caps under his belt before signing a new deal. Make no mistake he will have been given a very decent wage to keep him here, perhaps in line with the other top earners at the club. Ok, I feel I should clarify RE: the wage thing. I was refering to the players who left at the end of last season, who's wages were crippling the club, compared to who will be left on large contracts come the end of this season. Surman, that's a fair point. Also I'm guesing Dyer is on fair whack as we got rid of him a couple of weeks after he signed a new contract. Personally I'd like to keep Surman, but Dyer is far to inconsistent to justify that wage. I agree with your second and third paragraphs. If we go down we may have to lose Rasiak and/or Saga to soften the impact of the reduced income. There is no way we should consider keeping BWP or Euell on the wages they're on. I've said this before, but if it's a choice between Rasiak and Euell, Rasiak every time. 3-5 good games a year from Euell just isn't enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 Well, at the very leat they can keep each other company in the physio room. Who do we play on the pitch though? If Surman, Skacel and Lallana leave, we really will be struggling for creativity, and we're hardly Brazil at the moment. I'd happily see them all leave, they all keep the ball well but none of them are what i'd call creative. Maybe we don't have the right strikers or are using the players in the wrong way but those three never beat a man and never get into good crossing positions. Maybe a bit unfair on Skacel since he's playing out of position but Lloyd James has at least been as good as Skacel since Christmas and he's still learning the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 27 March, 2009 Share Posted 27 March, 2009 Didn't say Skacel to leave. And has Lallana created that much? Definitely not recently. I think with Dyer would create more, and Holmes if/when fit. Would love to keep them all, but seems unlikely doesn't it? I mean Surman Gillet Lallana Dyer would be a good midfield. A good young English midfield. Wasn't that the original plan?! I don't want Skacel to leave either, but he's handed in a transfer request and I can't see Lowe going overboard trying to convince him to stay. Lallana and Surman have both been ineffective of late, Lallana especially, but I feel both have the potential to be very good players if they get their collective a*ses in gear. Dyer is inconsistent and Holmes is always injured. I don't think there will be many games when both are playing and playing well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 27 March, 2009 Author Share Posted 27 March, 2009 I think Surman and Lallana will go in the summer personally. I'd accept that if it means we can keep Saga, bring back Dyer and sign a strong tackler in central midfield. Holmes can replace Surman on the left IMO. Would make for a strong 442 with Dyer and Holmes on the wings. All if we stay up of course. Think Schneiderlin could flourish next to a ball winner. I'd much prefer we let Holmes go than Surman. Holmes is rubbish, he lacks pace, an engine, doesn;t tackle, doesn't track back. Surman, despite some poor recent showing has had a very good season IMO and is progressing nicely. Can't make my mind up about Dyer. He's still young and very pacey but I have seen him for Swansea and he hasn't been that different to what we have seen him do here. Lots of dribbles that end up with him running straight into fullbacks and losing it. He's also very similar to McClaggon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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