melmacian_saint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I hope that today we have finally busted the myths surrounding these players who "do a job" and "are good cover". Fox made a mess of his 100 attempts to cross the ball today and in the end just lunged in recklessly on the fullback when he had got the ball about an hour before, fluffed easy long passes and also decided to bring the M3 into the left side of the pitch as Fortune, Lukaku and/or Morison kept flying in. As for the new giant Cannavaro he just decided to pretty much miss or fluff every single challenge he made for the ball, even the aerial ones where he is regarded as an expert, made a couple of pointless lunges much to the mentioned Lukaku and Long's joy (who just dribbled past him), told Fortune where and how to turn in order to be able to let Lukaku through on goal and to top it off a home special of forgetting about his man by not having a clue of Long's position and also being slower than a tortoise to attempt an interception or even try to put some pressure on the irishman. They both ARE NOT adequate for a Premier League SQUAD. Enough of this talk of "ok as substitutes", they are as poor as you can find in this league and the fact that we have had to rely on them for tactical/squad selection reasons has cost us goals, points and more importantly progression as a team. Proof of this is that in a game where all the team was poor, they stood out as abysmal. When the team was flying just a couple of weeks ago, they were still the worst performers. I honestly hope Cortese and Pochettino think along the same lines and on the 20th of May these two liabilities are on the first flight out of Eastleigh to whoever they can find that wants them. And I hope they are very thankful to Southampton FC for the rest of their careers for having had a chance to have a run of games in the starting 11 of a Premier League side when their quality isn't even worthy of a squad number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Hooiveld was especially poor today. Fox, well the best thing he did was get sent off. Forren must really be out of shape if he can't get a game at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 (edited) We all know and accept Fox is poor bit Hooiveld really is just as bad. Morgan and JRod both were laying into him at times today, he was so dozy and although seemingly a nice guy is the lond of CB that gets teams relegated. Edited 27 April, 2013 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rshephard3 Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Hooiveld was especially poor today. Fox, well the best thing he did was get sent off. Forren must really be out of shape if he can't get a game at the moment. Something else must be up with this Forren situation. Can't take the guy this long to get fit and he's been playing reserve games. What are we doing, getting him fit ready to sit on a beach all summer?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Something else must be up with this Forren situation. Can't take the guy this long to get fit and he's been playing reserve games. What are we doing, getting him fit ready to sit on a beach all summer?! Apparently. Although don't question it too much on here; despite him playing for his country its unrealistic to expect him to come in and play for us this season. Next season is what its all about. I guess he must be sitting on the bench to gain some experience or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doggface Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Totally agree which is sad as both have done a job for us but we need better if we really want don't want relegation worries next season. I would go with Clyne, Yoshida, Fonte, Richardson next week but still not that confident. Just look at the goals against column. Tells us where we need to spend. New lb and at least on cb needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Diamond Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 At one point Fox made a pass that, judging by the way his body was moving and the speed he was going at, he was never going to complete. Sure enough, he made a total f*cking meal of it. What's that about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I can't argue with any of this. It makes depressing reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpsaint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I can't fathom why Hooiveld has been starting so many games whilst Fonte is left on the bench, there's no question it should be the other way around. Find it hilarious that Jos had the front to come out the other week and complain that he was being made the scapegoat, then continue to play like turd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggles31 Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Both dreadful players in this league who hopefully can be part of that 15 depart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoobysaint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Totally agree with the OP. Jos is a very one dimensional cb who is merely ok in the air. He lacks pace but also seems to lack the ability to read a game and a situation, always having to react and frequently lunging and fouling. He is as much of a liability going forward as his distrubution is simply dreadful. Enough has already been said of Fox and his inadequacies so no need to harp on, he simply isnt up to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katalinic Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 If we truly want to push on to the next level then we need to address the defensive situation in the summer - none of our centre backs are top class and beyond Shaw and Clyne we lack any sort of cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulletsaint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Something else must be up with this Forren situation. Can't take the guy this long to get fit and he's been playing reserve games. What are we doing, getting him fit ready to sit on a beach all summer?! Too easy to see demons when there probably aren't any. We've been in good form with Jos in the side, so I'd imagine that recently it's more about not wanting to throw someone who's yet to play in our back four and tempt fate. Defences are as much about partnerships and throwing Forren in would almost be starting again. Maybe if we find ourselves four up at some point in the next three games he might get a run out. If not I think he'll only get game time at LB or if someone else gets injured. I'd imagine Fonte would get called up first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainchris Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Totally agree which is sad as both have done a job for us but we need better if we really want don't want relegation worries next season. I would go with Clyne, Yoshida, Fonte, Richardson next week but still not that confident. Just look at the goals against column. Tells us where we need to spend. New lb and at least on cb needed. They have not 'done a job for us' well Fox hasn't in any single game - and I mean not one ! Those who say he had have not looked closely enough at his game and have confused our results with his performances which are dire! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Get rid of them both. Decent in the championship. Liabilities in the Premier League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rshephard3 Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Too easy to see demons when there probably aren't any. We've been in good form with Jos in the side, so I'd imagine that recently it's more about not wanting to throw someone who's yet to play in our back four and tempt fate. Defences are as much about partnerships and throwing Forren in would almost be starting again. Maybe if we find ourselves four up at some point in the next three games he might get a run out. If not I think he'll only get game time at LB or if someone else gets injured. I'd imagine Fonte would get called up first. Totally take the point about partnerships, unless we sign someone who is head and shoulders better than we have. In spending over £4 million on a Norwegian international centre back I kind of assumed he'd be better than Jos, Jose or Maya. Partnerships have to start somewhere and a friendly in pre season against Eastleigh isn't going to do it. Just seems to me we have a guy with almost certainly more ability than our current crop who is at best on the bench. Even Mayuka got a run out today and god knows, he looks clueless in the tiny snippets we've seen of him. On a positive note, Newcastle got whacked for 6. We're ok already with our points total IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Majestic Channon Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Yoshida scares me on the ball too though, just can't stand the laid back mr nice .He seems to make at least one potentially disasterous blooper a match . Not good enough imo sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Let's face three quarters of our starting defence today are useless. Yoshida isn't good enough either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 (edited) At last, after 8 months and being hammered people are seeing that we have **** defenders and the questions have to be pointed at the board for not buying correctly and the manger for persistng with such ****e when we have others, Forren oh hold up.......................... Edited 27 April, 2013 by Barry Sanchez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggles31 Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Yoshida needs to play alongside an aggressive and commanding CB. Ala the Claus/Svensson partnership. Not a useless bog standard Championship player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Majestic Channon Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Let's face three quarters of our starting defence today are useless. Yoshida isn't good enough either. Yes I love Clyne to the point of becoming a donut puncher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 At last, after 8 months and being hammered people are seeing that we have **** defenders and the question shave to be pointed at the board for not buting correctly and the mager for persiting with such ****e when we have others, Forren oh hold up.......................... When have people not seen we have **** defenders? Even they do they are incredibly deluded. Imagine if Clyne and Shaw got injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 At last, after 8 months and being hammered people are seeing that we have **** defenders and the question shave to be pointed at the board for not buting correctly and the mager for persiting with such ****e when we have others, Forren oh hold up.......................... To be fair I think a few saintsweb clapper myths were exposed today. hoolvield is a premier league defender This squad with no additions is good enough to finish 6th We have a top half squad MP is a tactical genius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Majestic Channon Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Well almost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingwing Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Fox = **** Jos utter **** It's embarrassing to say but we are better than them at their worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 LOL, first drubbing in months and everyone in the team isn't good enough. If Fonte had played, he wouldn't have been good enough. If Forren had played, he'd have been a waste of money. Sure, Fox was dogsh1t today, I agree. But Hooiveld, for all his limitations, hasn't been that bad - well, he can't have been, he's predominantly featured in three of the most important wins of the season - and I don't think he's any great shakes, too. Now I'm reading player after player after player needs to be shipped out, just because of this bad day. Christ, what fickle fans we've become. Didn't take long, did it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Sorry for the horrendous typos there, ****ing Champagne and fancy living.................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 To be fair I think a few saintsweb clapper myths were exposed today. hoolvield is a premier league defender This squad with no additions is good enough to finish 6th We have a top half squad MP is a tactical genius Amen to that. WBA are now 9 points (plus a game in hand) ahead of us. It shows how far we have to go just to get to 8th place, never mind all this heady talk of a European place. We were outplayed in every single department today, and as sh*t as we were WBA were thoroughly excellent and we had absolutely nothing to combat them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 LOL, first drubbing in months and everyone in the team isn't good enough. If Fonte had played, he wouldn't have been good enough. If Forren had played, he'd have been a waste of money. Sure, Fox was dogsh1t today, I agree. But Hooiveld, for all his limitations, hasn't been that bad - well, he can't have been, he's predominantly featured in three of the most important wins of the season - and I don't think he's any great shakes, too. Now I'm reading player after player after player needs to be shipped out, just because of this bad day. Christ, what fickle fans we've become. Didn't take long, did it. "Player after player after player"?? Who else aside from Hooiveld and Fox is attracting masses of comments that they need to be shipped out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Fox and Jos were utter garbage today. But Lambert was just as bad, and at least the other 2 looked bothered about being crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaptopSaint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I think today was a blessing in disguise. Because it reminded the manager and the chairman that we need to buy some better defenders in the summer to make progress. MP was an international CB, so he can see that I'm sure. The boys look really tired too - long hard season taking its toll. And bad as it was today, we've come a hell of a long way since the last time West Brom made us look stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 We shouldn't be any more tired than WBA. Lame excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish fingers Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 That's the last we'll see of Fox. He'll be gone in the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Diamond Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 LOL, first drubbing in months and everyone in the team isn't good enough. Definitely an element of that, however I think some players' shortcomings have been highlighted across the campaign, and to avoid another relegation battle some serious investment needs to be made. Its well documented that our style of play demands more of each member of our squad too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 (edited) "Player after player after player"?? Who else aside from Hooiveld and Fox is attracting masses of comments that they need to be shipped out? I'll clarify - not just today, but over the season; Ramirez, he's the latest one to cop a load of flak recently. Despite being an immensely talented footballer, he's been a bit underwhelming yet instead of backing him, we throw the towel in because he's not been Messi-like in his first season. Nah, let's run him down instead. That'll work. Fox, see today and almost every game he's played, rightly or wrongly. Hooiveld, probably 2/3's of games has been questioned, rightly or wrongly. (S) Davis at the beginning of the season. He's now won favour, but I'm sure if his form dipped he'll be mentioned again. Fonte wasn't good enough earlier this year - now he is as Hooiveld's now not good enough. Forren's been a waste of money apparently. So has Mayuka. Yoshida was another who got a lot of stick earlier in the season, now he's deemed OK. No doubt if we take another smashing next weekend his ability will be questioned - despite, like Hooiveld, being a fairly solid performer. Boruc wasn't good enough/too fat/mental/old and would be a liability. Rodriguez wasn't good enough either for a while. Now he has England potential. I'm sure I've missed some but the truth of the matter is that pretty much all of those players above have contributed massively to our rise towards midtable. Edited 27 April, 2013 by Crab Lungs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gr00031 Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Don't really understand why Fonte isn't in the starting 11 over hooiveld... He's too slow and looks out of place at this level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saints_is_the_south Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Seem to remember Hooiveld having very good games against Liverpool and Man City, but never mind that as it doesn't suit the agenda of this thread. I agree Fox is clearly not good enough at this level, and whilst Jos had a bad game today he has proved on other occasions this season that he is good enough for this league, and he is what you call 'adequate' cover. Cover is exactly what he should be though, if we do want to push on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Don't really understand why Fonte isn't in the starting 11 over hooiveld... He's too slow and looks out of place at this level I totally agree with that, btw (see my comments about Hooiveld after the Villa away game) but I still reckon we're way too quick to go from "good player" to "not good enough ffs"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebel Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I think the problem is Fox brings out the worst in Hooiveld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I think the problem is Fox brings out the worst in Hooiveld 100% agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I think today was a blessing in disguise. Because it reminded the manager and the chairman that we need to buy some better defenders in the summer to make progress. MP was an international CB, so he can see that I'm sure. The boys look really tired too - long hard season taking its toll. And bad as it was today, we've come a hell of a long way since the last time West Brom made us look stupid. Sure, its been such a long hard season, 35 games. Some people are mental. We played over 50 last season, this is just the lamest excuse there possibly can be. Lots of teams in the PL have played a lot more than 35 games. Long hard season my arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I hope that today we have finally busted the myths surrounding these players who "do a job" and "are good cover". Fox made a mess of his 100 attempts to cross the ball today and in the end just lunged in recklessly on the fullback when he had got the ball about an hour before, fluffed easy long passes and also decided to bring the M3 into the left side of the pitch as Fortune, Lukaku and/or Morison kept flying in. As for the new giant Cannavaro he just decided to pretty much miss or fluff every single challenge he made for the ball, even the aerial ones where he is regarded as an expert, made a couple of pointless lunges much to the mentioned Lukaku and Long's joy (who just dribbled past him), told Fortune where and how to turn in order to be able to let Lukaku through on goal and to top it off a home special of forgetting about his man by not having a clue of Long's position and also being slower than a tortoise to attempt an interception or even try to put some pressure on the irishman. They both ARE NOT adequate for a Premier League SQUAD. Enough of this talk of "ok as substitutes", they are as poor as you can find in this league and the fact that we have had to rely on them for tactical/squad selection reasons has cost us goals, points and more importantly progression as a team. Proof of this is that in a game where all the team was poor, they stood out as abysmal. When the team was flying just a couple of weeks ago, they were still the worst performers. I honestly hope Cortese and Pochettino think along the same lines and on the 20th of May these two liabilities are on the first flight out of Eastleigh to whoever they can find that wants them. And I hope they are very thankful to Southampton FC for the rest of their careers for having had a chance to have a run of games in the starting 11 of a Premier League side when their quality isn't even worthy of a squad number. Agree with most of this, and you even forgot (or didn't see) his blatant deliberate hand ball in the first half, still our debutant ref didn't spot it either, so you're not alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouldy Coat Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Fox, hoofvelt and yoshida are all sh1t, always have been in my book. Get rid and let's def bring in 2 commanding centre backs in the summer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 Fonte is Premier League quality. Hooiveld is not. We all know about Fox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100% Saint Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 IMO Fox shouldn't be playing just swap Clyne to left and put Maya right and then put Fonte in for him if Shaw's not fit or give the U21 Targett a go if i'm not mistake. Also when everyone is fit instead of playing Hooiveld (Bog standard Championship) Fonte who is capable of the Premiership and was our captain when Adam was out. Not to sure about today but please improve alot on that for next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alain Perrin Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 To be honest better rid of the lot. Lambert didn't score today so off him too.... Or is that too kneejerk?Fox, hoofvelt and yoshida are all sh1t, always have been in my book. Get rid and let's def bring in 2 commanding centre backs in the summer Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_276 using Board Express Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I wish I had an RM-821_eu_euro1_276. And don't get me started about how good Board Express is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St_Tel49 Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 We were cr@p today. Most of the time we are not cr@p. To quote a famous recent manager - blue line - move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmacian_saint Posted 27 April, 2013 Author Share Posted 27 April, 2013 I very much dislike this usual Fonte-Hooiveld in the same bag situation. Fonte was not playing badly when he got injured, and did not have Boruc behind him and yet Yoshi and him were having really good displays. In fact, if it wasn't for keeper mistakes we would've probably got something more out of good defensive displays such as Fulham away or Norwich or Swansea at home. Hooiveld however has seen the team at their best and yet has looked out of place. Sure, when we scored three those mistakes went unnoticed, but they were still happening! Suarez would've probably scored from that pathetic trip. Even against Chelsea he had several positional hesitances that would've got punished in most games (and in fact did with Terry's goal). Fonte showed that not only he was of PL standard, he was also a good captain, perhaps even better than Lallana. And it's funny people say he was to blame at the beginning of the season, when in fact the goal v. Wigan came because Hooiveld decided to play cone as the pass to Di Santo went less than inches past him, forcing Fonte to come and cover a player who was in fact being watched out by Jos himself!! Same with the Van Persie 3-2 goal, Hooiveld had been marking him all game and in that last corner decided against any tactical decision not too, so Fonte went to try to challenge a header that wasn't his. I honestly think people have been very unfair with Fonte and to an extent Yoshida and all to bury their heads in the sand about Hooiveld. He is the weakest link, it's no coincidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theyin Posted 27 April, 2013 Share Posted 27 April, 2013 We went out of both cups early, these men are looked after by sports scientists who let the gaffer know what levels of excercise each player requires, they are young and are effectively running at full pace for 50 minutes per week. Tired, I ask you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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