Matthew Le God Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Yes, we're aiming to sell for more than we spend I think, probably to pay off debts and the training centre. We shall see exactly who is being led up the garden path come August. You are jumping to conclusions if you think selling players to Man Utd and Liverpool for large amounts of money equals an "asset strip" or "firesale". I'm not sure you understand what they both mean. If Shaw and Lallana played for Stoke, Newcastle, Aston Villa, West Ham etc and Man Utd and Liverpool offered them £55m they would ALL sell them. The training ground development was revealed in League 1 and construction started in the Championship, the club will have funding plans for it a long time ago which didn't require players sales. When they announced it in 2010 they had no idea they would sell Shaw and Lallana for such huge amounts in 2014. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 I've never used the term fire sale myself, probably not even asset stripping. All I can see is that we're selling major players for major sums and making relatively low offers for unknowns from Holland. I think we're likely to find ourselves in shîte street in August, that thought does not please me in any way shape or form. What the hell is wrong with making low offers? Why do we have to pay big bucks, does that guarantee quality? Should we only be positive if we are trying to sign £15m+ players? How have Osvaldo and Gaston worked out? Lovren was about the same price as Tadic, from the ever-so-highly-rated french league and seems to have done ok. Take a deep breath and try to relax, at least until you have seen some of the players we end up signing. If we get decent quality and still have money in reserve, i will be delighted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 What the hell is wrong with making low offers? Why do we have to pay big bucks, does that guarantee quality? Should we only be positive if we are trying to sign £15m+ players? How have Osvaldo and Gaston worked out? Lovren was about the same price as Tadic, from the ever-so-highly-rated french league and seems to have done ok. Take a deep breath and try to relax, at least until you have seen some of the players we end up signing. If we get decent quality and still have money in reserve, i will be delighted This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 I'm not saying its rosy. I'm not saying we'll be better than last season. I don't think we will. I'm being realistic. Look up what a fire sale is. The term has been thrown around a lot on here, it's not what is happening. Harsh on Koeman, unemployed because he left a job he had done very well at and was mostly appreciated by the fans. Anyway, remind me how the last unemployed manager we hired went? C'mon man, it's not all so bad. Your wasting your breath (typing hand) W/C always sees the worst case scenario when it comes to saints. I think you're right though we probably won't do as well as last year and we may take time to gel the team a bit but I still think we will do OK next season even if we lose Morgan a midfield of Davis, Cork and Victor backed up by JWP, Gaston and Reed is still a pretty decent PL midfield I reckon. Defence clearly needs some replacements but Boruc, Fonte, Yoshida, Chambers and Clyne are all acceptable to good PL players. Attack needs strengthening big time but people expecting marquee, 20 goal a season, proven PL strikers are going to be right out of luck. We need to cast our net a bit and hope we pick up a rough diamond that turns out good and that some of the strikers we already have can come good. We might not be hitting the heady heights of 8th next season but I can still see us having a team good enough to avoid relegation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holepuncture Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 As I say we shall see, no point in anticipating one way or the other. ... I see us in August with a vastly diminished side and probably some mediocre performances from it. You see all rosy in the garden. As for Koeman who cares, an unemployed manager who may or not do well for us. We shall soon find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 You are jumping to conclusions if you think selling players to Man Utd and Liverpool for large amounts of money equals an "asset strip" or "firesale". I'm not sure you understand what they both mean. If Shaw and Lallana played for Stoke, Newcastle, Aston Villa, West Ham etc and Man Utd and Liverpool offered them £55m they would ALL sell them. The training ground development was revealed in League 1 and construction started in the Championship, the club will have funding plans for it a long time ago which didn't require players sales. When they announced it in 2010 they had no idea they would sell Shaw and Lallana for such huge amounts in 2014. 18 months ago we were bigger than Everton, now we're only the same level as Stoke. *sighs* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Windows is right, we will have a weaker squad come August with far less spent on players in than than what is received. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Windows is right, we will have a weaker squad come August with far less spent on players in than than what is received. I'm starting to think the same tbh judging by the quality of player were apparently after Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 I think we may well have a stronger more balanced squad. Also with young players like Clyne, Wanyama, Chambers, JWP, JayRod we may find one or two really push up a level next season. If, for example we lose Shaw, Lallana and Lambert Buy Tadic, Pelle, Ings, the Celtic CB and LB playing in France - we maybe in profit but with better squad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Windows is right, we will have a weaker squad come August with far less spent on players in than than what is received. We could end up with a stronger squad come August and a decent amount of money in the bank. It is not what you spend but who you spend it on. Instead of predicting doom and gloom, why not wait and see what happens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 I've never used the term fire sale myself, probably not even asset stripping. All I can see is that we're selling major players for major sums and making relatively low offers for unknowns from Holland. I think we're likely to find ourselves in shîte street in August, that thought does not please me in any way shape or form. FWIW I totally agree. There's too many people on here with their heads in the clouds. Whilst I admire their optimism I do think a lot of people are unrealistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 We could end up with a stronger squad come August and a decent amount of money in the bank. It is not what you spend but who you spend it on. Instead of predicting doom and gloom, why not wait and see what happens? Ummm, because it makes a forum pretty redundant otherwise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Unknowns from Holland.....one of the best goalscorers in the league and a Serbian national that is the player that creates the most in the league, by far... unknown to who? The common fan, or to the clubs around europe (including us)...?? At least average championship players would be unknowns.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Block34 Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Ummm, because it makes a forum pretty redundant otherwise? And let's face it, all you do is mealy-mouthed, depressive, antagonistic, crap with not a good word to say about anything so it would make you redundant as well. Not one piece of constructive argument have you bothered to put on these pages. Only happiest when you're moaning eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 FWIW I totally agree. There's too many people on here with their heads in the clouds. Whilst I admire their optimism I do think a lot of people are unrealistic. Yeah, man. Heads in the clouds and unrealistic people. Bring back the days when we were, like, going to totally be in the Champions league and stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Windows is right, we will have a weaker squad come August with far less spent on players in than than what is received. Of course we'll have a weaker squad, we won't have as good a season next year - that's pretty much a given, but I've accepted that. It's a change of guard, there's nothing we can do about it, the club are getting the best deals they can for the players who want out - so we have to get behind the replacements, who aren't bad quality really are they? But obviously we're not going to replace Shaw with another £30m left back, or Lallana with another £25m AMC - so quality wise, we probably will be weaker down the spine. But we may well have a stronger squad for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Of course we'll have a weaker squad, we won't have as good a season next year - that's pretty much a given, but I've accepted that. It's a change of guard, there's nothing we can do about it, the club are getting the best deals they can for the players who want out - so we have to get behind the replacements, who aren't bad quality really are they? But obviously we're not going to replace Shaw with another £30m left back, or Lallana with another £25m AMC - so quality wise, we probably will be weaker down the spine. But we may well have a stronger squad for it. Why not spend 25mill on a Lallana replacement though? We've raised £60m on player sales ffs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Why not spend 25mill on a Lallana replacement though? We've raised £60m on player sales ffs Because we're Southampton and that simply will never happen, unless we're owned by a zillionaire who wants to bankroll us - which we aren't. The money from the sales will be reinvested to make the squad stronger, it won't be used on single player purchases in one go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Because we're Southampton and that simply will never happen, unless we're owned by a zillionaire who wants to bankroll us - which we aren't. The money from the sales will be reinvested to make the squad stronger, it won't be used on single player purchases in one go. Right but 60mill minus 25mill = 35mill for squad strengthening. Again we've just raised 60mill, we don't need bankrolling to sped 25 on one player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Why not spend 25mill on a Lallana replacement though? We've raised £60m on player sales ffs Wages would also play a part me thinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Why not spend 25mill on a Lallana replacement though? We've raised £60m on player sales ffs Because that would be retarded. Lallana was the second highest ever fee paid by a club as big as Liverpool, why on earth would we want to spend that kind of money? We won't and I for one am delighted by that fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Right but 60mill minus 25mill = 35mill for squad strengthening. Again we've just raised 60mill, we don't need bankrolling to sped 25 on one player As mentioned above, you're forgetting that the budget is the whole thing. Not just the players transfer fee. Wages, signing on fee's, bonuses, agent fee's - it all adds up. So a £25m signing in transfer fee, may actually end up costing 30-40 when you add on the extra's on top including the wages over a long period of time. I don't think we're set up or big enough to make a £25m signing at this moment in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Because that would be retarded. Lallana was the second highest ever fee paid by a club as big as Liverpool, why on earth would we want to spend that kind of money? We won't and I for one am delighted by that fact. To get the highest quality starting 11 possible, to enable us to have the highest points total possible. That is after all the whole idea of a football club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Why not spend 25mill on a Lallana replacement though? We've raised £60m on player sales ffs If someone is deemed to be a £25m player they (and their agent) want wages to match. A £25m player will be looking for getting on towards £100k p/w. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 To get the highest quality starting 11 possible, to enable us to have the highest points total possible. That is after all the whole idea of a football club Oh well, we won't be doing it and that's absolutely fine by me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncanRG Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Even if we can/could afford to spend £25m on a single player, players who are worth that kind of money wouldn't want to come here. Otherwise we could go and spend the whole £60m on Eden Hazard or Yaya Toure, couldn't we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 To get the highest quality starting 11 possible, to enable us to have the highest points total possible. That is after all the whole idea of a football club And end up like hat lot down the road - so glad your not in charge at SFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 To get the highest quality starting 11 possible, to enable us to have the highest points total possible. That is after all the whole idea of a football club And no concern regarding finances you mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 If someone is deemed to be a £25m player they (and their agent) want wages to match. A £25m player will be looking for getting on towards £100k p/w. Yep, but if you want to be a top half club you have to bite the bullet on wages or you'll never be able to get or keep hold of top players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 To get the highest quality starting 11 possible, to enable us to have the highest points total possible. That is after all the whole idea of a football club That sounds like the QPR blueprint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 That sounds like the QPR blueprint. ....apparently the whole idea of a football club. Please god can we sign Chris Samba. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratio_decidendi Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 That sounds like the QPR blueprint. Or, to play devil's advocate, the blueprint of Chelsea and Man City. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Or, to play devil's advocate, the blueprint of Chelsea and Man City. Yes, but they're owned by billionaires who are bankrolling the club. We're owned by a billionaire estate, but they're not going to bankroll the club. We're a self sustaining top half at best PL club, and until people get their heads around that fact then they will forever be underwhelmed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Even if we can/could afford to spend £25m on a single player, players who are worth that kind of money wouldn't want to come here. Otherwise we could go and spend the whole £60m on Eden Hazard or Yaya Toure, couldn't we? How do you think we got Ramirez? We threw money at him. Of course we'd have to do the same with any good player to get them to come Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Or, to play devil's advocate, the blueprint of Chelsea and Man City. Don't remember them funding their league and cup successes through the revenues of players they'd sold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Yep, but if you want to be a top half club you have to bite the bullet on wages or you'll never be able to get or keep hold of top players Even if we offered Lallana and Shaw £100k p/w they wouldn't stay. They are reported to be on those kinds of salaries at Liverpool and Man Utd, plus they have a significantly better chance of getting European football at those clubs. Saints came 8th last season without needing to pay players £100k p/w, we can do so again next season if recruitment is done well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 That sounds like the QPR blueprint. I was unaware they sold 60mill of players. Reinvesting all money received should be an absolute bare minimum to improve and isn't a huge ask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalek2003 Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 We could end up with a stronger squad come August and a decent amount of money in the bank. It is not what you spend but who you spend it on. Instead of predicting doom and gloom, why not wait and see what happens? Whats the point of making predictions if all you do is wait and see what happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 I was unaware they sold 60mill of players. Reinvesting all money received should be an absolute bare minimum to improve and isn't a huge ask But we're not going to do that as we have debts to service. Thinking that we're about to spend 60-80m on new signings is ill-advised as you're just setting yourself up for disappointment. I can see a max of £50m being spent, and that's an absolute max - probably not even that much to be honest. The rest will pay off the training facilities and previous transfer funds, and will probably go back into a pot to enable squad strengthening in additional windows down the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Even if we can/could afford to spend £25m on a single player, players who are worth that kind of money wouldn't want to come here. Otherwise we could go and spend the whole £60m on Eden Hazard or Yaya Toure, couldn't we? I think that's the problem some saints fans just don't get. They can't understand why our best players want to leave us for bigger clubs and they can't understand why we aren't replacing our best players with even better players it's like the last 20 years of the PL have passed them by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 How do you think we got Ramirez? We threw money at him. Of course we'd have to do the same with any good player to get them to come Hence my point above (not answered). Your assumption is that spending big guarantees quality and spending less guarantees average players only. Osvaldo, Gaston, Lovren and Clyne are proof that this is tosh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratio_decidendi Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Yes, but they're owned by billionaires who are bankrolling the club. We're owned by a billionaire estate, but they're not going to bankroll the club. We're a self sustaining top half at best PL club, and until people get their heads around that fact then they will forever be underwhelmed. I know. It is genuinely one of the most frustrating things to see people suggest Southampton can compete on a financial level with these teams. Attempting to do so would be unsustainable and counter to our current business model. In my opinion, a club is a business and success can be defined in a way that doesn't include winning Premier League titles (though it would certainly be nice!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Whats the point of making predictions if all you do is wait and see what happens. Whats the point of making predictions if all you do is predict the same, despite the situation?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 I think that's the problem some saints fans just don't get. They can't understand why our best players want to leave us for bigger clubs and they can't understand why we aren't replacing our best players with even better players it's like the last 20 years of the PL have passed them by. Apparently Kroos is available for £25m, we should bid for him. He'll come for sure. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncanRG Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 How do you think we got Ramirez? We threw money at him. Of course we'd have to do the same with any good player to get them to come Yes, but Ramirez cost £12m. Those are the players we can afford and attract. We cannot afford or attract players worth double that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Gaston isn't a good example really. He was a player in a club at the same level, or slightly below us in stature and size. He wasn't on a big contract, and didn't demand a huge transfer fee. Our model is to buy young, up and coming talents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Gaston isn't a good example really. He was a player in a club at the same level, or slightly below us in stature and size. He wasn't on a big contract, and didn't demand a huge transfer fee. Our model is to buy young, up and coming talents. Someone gonna throw a certain strikers name on this one soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOTONS EAST SIDE Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 We are all assuming Pelle will be poor, along with Tadic. But the same can be said for Bony as well. But he didn't turn out too bad, did he. Lets trust in RK, as i'm sure if he didn't think Pelle or Tadic could cut the mustard in the PL, he would not of bothered bidding for them. I'll be more interested in who else he wants to sign. Be it CB,LB or GK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratio_decidendi Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Gaston isn't a good example really. He was a player in a club at the same level, or slightly below us in stature and size. He wasn't on a big contract, and didn't demand a huge transfer fee. Our model is to buy young, up and coming talents. As well as develop academy products, and then flip both onto 'stronger' teams for a profit. That profit gets invested into the club, we sustain a decent PL position, and everyone's happy (except those who act under the deluded belief that anyone can win the PL and winning it is every club's priority) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 2 July, 2014 Share Posted 2 July, 2014 Someone gonna throw a certain strikers name on this one soon Would be thrown straight back at them... A player at a club who are obviously above us, but a club who want the player transferred - so makes it a hell of a lot easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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