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Time for a fresh start

Baj

By Baj,
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Baj

Baj

Posted
Posted

As it has been a topic of conversation for a few weeks now, myself and steve have been talking regularly about ways to improve the forum.

 

Obviously, we have 2 main issues. The reliability of the forum and the running of the forum.

 

With regards to the former (believe it or not) we are still addressing this on a DAILY basis. Today the forum suffered no downtime at all (yes, maybe it was quieter), but we will continue to assess things after each matchday and have many different plans to keep the forum up properly.

 

Secondly, the running of the forum. We've also talked about the many different angles for improving things, taking into consideration the many complaints. We feel that perhaps a fresh approach to the moderation of the forum is required, and we want you as users to be part of that.

 

The plan is as follows:

Every 6 months, we would like users to apply to become moderators, we are interested in where they think we have gone wrong as a team over the past few years, how you would do things differently etc.

 

If you feel you would like to become a moderator, we invite you to reply to this thread with your ideas. If we feel you would make a good, unbiased moderator, we will let you know.

 

 

We of course would like to thank the current moderator team for their efforts since we started, their assistance has been completely invaluable and they are welcome to apply along with everyone else, but we felt it best to have a clean start.

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CanadaSaint

CanadaSaint

Posted
Posted

Guys, I think there's one thing you need to sort out before we go anywhere.

 

Some people are calling for tighter moderation (act more decisively to cut out the abuse, petty squabbling and trolling/goading) and some are calling for looser moderation (let people say whatever the hell they want - other than the racist etc stuff - and users will have to either grow a thicker skin or leave).

 

Which is it to be?

 

Until that's sorted we'll just head for a repeat.

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Baj

Baj

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I vote for Kardeem

 

 

Can we have a poll, who people want to be Admin man for 6 months ? It'll be like X factor, but for mods.

 

Who's got the Mod factor ?

No there specifically wont be voting due to the opportunities for people to "take the ****", if you see what I mean.

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Baj

Baj

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Guys, I think there's one thing you need to sort out before we go anywhere.

 

Some people are calling for tighter moderation (act more decisively to cut out the abuse, petty squabbling and trolling/goading) and some are calling for looser moderation (let people say whatever the hell they want - other than the racist etc stuff - and users will have to either grow a thicker skin or leave).

 

Which is it to be?

 

Until that's sorted we'll just head for a repeat.

 

Thats exactly why we want to hear other peoples opinions

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Robsk II

Robsk II

Posted
Posted

An interesting approach - is it worth (just a thought) having a general feedback poll on some of the core issues as the user base sees it? I know this isn't a democracy, but this is nothing without the users, I'm sure you'd agree. So a general feel for how the population of the board feels about certain issues - could this be a decent start, providing a modship mandate of sorts? Ie - less or more controls in terms of infractions for different things.. or just whether generally to be tight on the 'isms' etc or let 'banter' have a free-er reign etc.. Plus other questions?

 

I'd be a great mod. This is because Stu, Turkish etc hate me. Sweet.

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St Chalet

St Chalet

Posted
Posted (edited)

Probably not a bad idea to address the problem of what has happened over recent months.

 

By it's very nature the forum will always be a place for heated debate and opinion, the difference is that the virtriol has increased on an almost daily basis with a number of posters playing the man not the post.

 

I think it is probably as much a reflection of the frustrations our fans feel about the club's recent performance on the pitch as any material change in the user base here. The debate really needs to be on what the purspose of forum is, the how it is provided will naturally follow

 

I'd also like to thank St Landrew, Ponty, Arizona and any others moving on for their contribution to improving my hobby of using this forum.

 

I'd be happy to help in doing the Moderating as and when I could.

Edited by St Chalet
Sticking my hat in ring, preparing to be shot down
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stknowle

stknowle

Posted
Posted
As it has been a topic of conversation for a few weeks now, myself and steve have been talking regularly about ways to improve the forum.

 

Obviously, we have 2 main issues. The reliability of the forum and the running of the forum.

 

With regards to the former (believe it or not) we are still addressing this on a DAILY basis. Today the forum suffered no downtime at all (yes, maybe it was quieter), but we will continue to assess things after each matchday and have many different plans to keep the forum up properly.

 

Secondly, the running of the forum. We've also talked about the many different angles for improving things, taking into consideration the many complaints. We feel that perhaps a fresh approach to the moderation of the forum is required, and we want you as users to be part of that.

 

The plan is as follows:

Every 6 months, we would like users to apply to become moderators, we are interested in where they think we have gone wrong as a team over the past few years, how you would do things differently etc.

 

If you feel you would like to become a moderator, we invite you to reply to this thread with your ideas. If we feel you would make a good, unbiased moderator, we will let you know.

 

 

We of course would like to thank the current moderator team for their efforts since we started, their assistance has been completely invaluable and they are welcome to apply along with everyone else, but we felt it best to have a clean start.

 

If you want my opinion you are being way too hard on yourselves. Speaking as a regular visitor and occasional non-confrontational poster I can honestly say I have not really experienced particularly bad reliability problems (the only gripe would be that sometimes my occasional posts, which can take a while to write (let's hope this ain't one of them), disappear into cyberspace when submitted), and I have no 'moderator issues' either (perhaps those that do need to look at themselves?).

BTW I am not applying to be a moderator although I would, without doubt, make a good unbiased one :).

One final point - unless I am mistaken you lot get basically sweet F.A for running this thing (which must take not-insignificant effort), so I would be reluctant to take too much criticism from posters who do nothing but log in and criticise if I were you.

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hypochondriac

hypochondriac

Posted
Posted

I consider it extremely unlikely that I will be accepted but I would like to put myself forward for consideration. The main reasons are because I feel my views are in the minority, but the only thing I would like from this forum more is respect for someone to hold a certain view and less personal abuse. I'm on here a lot and I think I would be able to handle things fairly and be even handed. I've done some modding before and I think it would be a good idea to appoint mods with a wide range of views.

 

I accept that I am unlikely to be chosen due to being too 'controversial' (and because I have p*ssed off both Baj and Steve in the past) but I'd like to give it a try and perhaps show that I can be sensible and fair given a chance!

 

Whatever you decide, I'd like to express my thanks to all the mods, almost all of them I have never had any problems with.

 

Thanks

 

Joe

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Robsk II

Robsk II

Posted
Posted

OK - I just thought maybe a devoted poll, or even temporary sub-forum or something - with some hard statistics - might provide some interesting insights without being lost in the mire of a single hectic thread. if you're looking for wholesale change, and ideas for different ways to work, it seems to me that a tangible collective view on some things could be beneficial. Ultimately, you can't please everyone, but if everyone has the opportunity to have a voice in a consensus, surely user would be more likely to accept the way things are because of.. again.. this kind of mandate? If a majority think the rules need adjusting, for example, then it would be logical to assume that complaints will go down because most users that care either way would have had a role in shaping the system..?

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Massimo Osti

Massimo Osti

Posted
Posted

Having lurked about these forums under countless guises for a long time and witnessed Sir leg's legendary downfall etc etc etc I would suggest that above ANYTHING ELSE! any person moderating an internet forum based on the day to day adventures of a football club MUST! actually regularly go to the match???

 

Radio listeners from Gosport and internet streamers from the USA need not apply.

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lordswoodsaints

lordswoodsaints

Posted
Posted
As it has been a topic of conversation for a few weeks now, myself and steve have been talking regularly about ways to improve the forum.

 

Obviously, we have 2 main issues. The reliability of the forum and the running of the forum.

 

With regards to the former (believe it or not) we are still addressing this on a DAILY basis. Today the forum suffered no downtime at all (yes, maybe it was quieter), but we will continue to assess things after each matchday and have many different plans to keep the forum up properly.

 

Secondly, the running of the forum. We've also talked about the many different angles for improving things, taking into consideration the many complaints. We feel that perhaps a fresh approach to the moderation of the forum is required, and we want you as users to be part of that.

 

The plan is as follows:

Every 6 months, we would like users to apply to become moderators, we are interested in where they think we have gone wrong as a team over the past few years, how you would do things differently etc.

 

If you feel you would like to become a moderator, we invite you to reply to this thread with your ideas. If we feel you would make a good, unbiased moderator, we will let you know.

 

 

We of course would like to thank the current moderator team for their efforts since we started, their assistance has been completely invaluable and they are welcome to apply along with everyone else, but we felt it best to have a clean start.

Can I firstly say well done for noticing that there needs to be change.

I'm not sure what has gone wrong for this forum but it has become very sterile and bland,over moderation? Or lack of decent members? I don't know.....perhaps a bit of both.

Whoever gets the gig needs to make some brave decisions before it too late.

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stknowle

stknowle

Posted
Posted
As it has been a topic of conversation for a few weeks now, myself and steve have been talking regularly about ways to improve the forum.

 

Obviously, we have 2 main issues. The reliability of the forum and the running of the forum.

 

With regards to the former (believe it or not) we are still addressing this on a DAILY basis. Today the forum suffered no downtime at all (yes, maybe it was quieter), but we will continue to assess things after each matchday and have many different plans to keep the forum up properly.

 

Secondly, the running of the forum. We've also talked about the many different angles for improving things, taking into consideration the many complaints. We feel that perhaps a fresh approach to the moderation of the forum is required, and we want you as users to be part of that.

 

The plan is as follows:

Every 6 months, we would like users to apply to become moderators, we are interested in where they think we have gone wrong as a team over the past few years, how you would do things differently etc.

 

If you feel you would like to become a moderator, we invite you to reply to this thread with your ideas. If we feel you would make a good, unbiased moderator, we will let you know.

 

 

We of course would like to thank the current moderator team for their efforts since we started, their assistance has been completely invaluable and they are welcome to apply along with everyone else, but we felt it best to have a clean start.

 

If you want my opinion you are being way too hard on yourselves. Speaking as a regular visitor and occasional non-confrontational poster I can honestly say I have not really experienced particularly bad reliability problems (the only gripe would be that sometimes my occasional posts, which can take a while to write (let's hope this ain't one of them), disappear into cyberspace when submitted), and I have no 'moderator issues' either (perhaps those that do need to look at themselves?).

BTW I am not applying to be a moderator although I would, without doubt, make a good unbiased one :).

One final point - unless I am mistaken you lot get basically sweet F.A for running this thing (which must take not-insignificant effort), so I would be reluctant to take too much criticism from posters who do nothing but log in and criticise if I were you.

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Robsk II

Robsk II

Posted
Posted
To be honest I do think you respect the views of others and you have been on here a long time so you know the ropes. I can't remember ever having a falling out with you.

 

I guess it has been a while.. What the hell. If the team would welcome it, I'd put my hat in to the circle.

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derry

derry

Posted
Posted

Personal abuse and a lack of respect for others views should be stamped out. It is easy to hold a constructive discussion with people that are willing to disagree and argue intelligently and constructively. There are quite a few that now refuse to put arguments forward because of the abuse they receive. In the main they are much more knowledgeable, constructive and interesting than the abusers who trot out the same old rubbish.

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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

Posted
Posted

Meh, i'll throw my name in just because i've been around so long and i've seen which specific people have come along to drag this place down.

And before anyone says anything, i'm not referring to Alpine or Delldays - they're actually two of the few people on here that make the debate diverse.

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exit2

exit2

Posted
Posted
Personal abuse and a lack of respect for others views should be stamped out. It is easy to hold a constructive discussion with people that are willing to disagree and argue intelligently and constructively. There are quite a few that now refuse to put arguments forward because of the abuse they receive. In the main they are much more knowledgeable, constructive and interesting than the abusers who trot out the same old rubbish.

 

Thats one of the main reasons I have decided to stop. The board has plenty of idiots who just wish to abuse and belittle others. I suspect most of them are decent people and would never dream or have the bottle to say some of the things I have seen here face to face. It is very easy to sit behind a keyboard and screen with no one having a clue who you are. Over the years I have had many a ding dong with certain posters and when met them over a beer, and got on fine. I still say the reason the board is down at the moment is because as a team we are not doing great. I just have some very good friends that I have met from here and that is something I am thankful. I have no issues with Baj or Steve and will continue to use the board. One of the saving graces of me quitting is that now I wont get the 300 emails a month reporting posts :)

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jawillwill

jawillwill

Posted
Posted

Personally, as a completely impartial poster, I wouldn't think a fresh mod team would attract me, or anyone else for that matter to post anymore than they already do. It's a bit like saying a lot more people would go to St. Mary's on matchdays if the tannoy system was slightly changed. It doesn't really make any difference to the vast majoroty of people.

 

That said, if we're talking about making the best of a bad situation I nominate Pancake.

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Tractor_Saint

Tractor_Saint

Posted
Posted (edited)
Thats one of the main reasons I have decided to stop. The board has plenty of idiots who just wish to abuse and belittle others.

 

Hence the 'reborn mods' need to have an excellent charter and to rule with the same rod. No nonsense. As an example, if there are say nine moderators, in their secret section of the forum, if there's two or more complaints about a post the mods have to have a majority vote to decide to take action. Action should be along the lines of employment law (which is a bit lenient for internet forums tbh)

 

1. Warning about their post and reasons for the complaint (aka verbal warning)

2. Warned again on the next infringement (first written warning)

3. I think the final written warning bit should actually be 'bye bye and don't come back'

 

Obviously, at every step the accused is offered a full £5 refund and then their IP address and name is banned.

 

I've got a feeling that previous moderation has been on a 'whomever is around wields the sword' rather than a majority vote. That's what we need from Mods, people who are around at least once a day to make decisions as a team. It's a lot easier to take action on someone when you know that there's > 50% of the other mods behind you.

 

On one of the forums I mod we kinda go for the following two rules:

 

1. Moderators are always right

2. If moderators are wrong, please refer to rule 1.

 

Seems to work and we get good free speech but when push comes to shove, we can mod as we (the GROUP) feel fit. Sometimes on this forum my little children behave better so we should consider treating it like a kindergarten!

 

(other opinions may be better than mine if they get >50% of the vote :) )

Edited by Tractor_Saint
Forgot to put some humour in
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saintjay77

saintjay77

Posted
Posted (edited)

For what it's worth I think the modding on this site is better than it was on the previous site. Seems allot less bias and I have only seen people banned or infracted when they have broken the rules. I havent seen anyone complain about the rules so who ever mods next will no doubt get complained about if they mod according to the rules.

 

I haven't seen ponty about for a while but in the past he always gave his opinion in a discussion without being allmighty about being a mod. If he or the other current mods don't get back in (don't see any reason why they shouldn't) then the new mods should treat the forum like they are a standard member but help keep the rules in check.

 

Good luck to anyone who gets the chance.

Edited by saintjay77
Can't spell at the best of times and even worse after several cans of Guinness!
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Spudders

Spudders

Posted
Posted
Ohh Spudgun is another. Nice bloke in real life too so try and persuade him.

 

haha, cheers mate :) part of me thinks it'd be good to have mod power, but another part of me wouldn't like people disliking me and making me have hurty upset feelings, which will no doubt come with such power. In the same way that mods get their names changed like Baj gets called Boj, I know that people will call me spudbum and that will make me a sad panda.

 

For what it's worth, I think forum members should have a sense of humour test, that would weed out some of the gimpiods on here. That's another thing, as I mod I guess you can't call people gimpiods!

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dune

dune

Posted
Posted
We of course would like to thank the current moderator team for their efforts since we started, their assistance has been completely invaluable and they are welcome to apply along with everyone else.

 

I go away for two weeks and the whole forum implodes. I have never wanted to be a hobby bobby so I won't be applying.

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Cirensaint

Cirensaint

Posted
Posted

I have sat back and read this site for quite some time, rarely posting. It used to be a great source of information, and at times amusing. Its only very recently that the atmosphere has become like a morgue and if there is anything I can do to help it return to anywhere near its former glory then I am more than happy to throw my hat in the ring and help out.

 

Yes the place needs a fresh start, the site is over moderated. I don't know any of the posters personally (that I know of) therefore i believe I would make a very unbiased Mod. People who post need to man up and realise this is a FORUM where people are going to hide behind their keyboards, sound off, talk ****e and sometimes just mess around. Surely that is what an internet forum is all about. Everybodies opinion is as valid as the next person and sometimes people just wont agree.........aint that just the way of the world????? At the end of the day we all love the Saints thats why we all come on here.

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Saint Billy

Saint Billy

Posted
Posted

I've mentioned this before, but I think this site reflects to some extent what is happening with the club. When the club is going through the doldrums (which is more often than not) this site tends replicate the feeling.

 

Imo you can over moderate to a point where freedom of opinion gets muted, but there is a line that cannot be crossed and sometimes I think it is crossed on here without any action taken. I also think this place also lacks a bit of humour at the moment (some of the threads in the supposed Paul Allen takeover are priceless and had me busting a hernia). Its hard to introduce humour I know, we are not all Mike Osmans I know...oops, but you mods have been way too serious of late, probably due to the amount of grief you get and not much in return, but hey, thats life unfortunately.

 

As long as your prerequisite is'nt that you have had to post over 6000 times and that you attend every saints game home and away, then I would like to be considered for what it's worth.

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dune

dune

Posted
Posted

What I don't get is why all the mods have been sacked. It's a bit of a kick in the teeth no matter how you try to paint it because barring one mod (who I won't name) I really can't fault them. It's done now so that's that, but imo it would have been better (albeit needing more guts) to just sack the ones you didn't like.

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lenwilkins

lenwilkins

Posted
Posted
What I don't get is why all the mods have been sacked. It's a bit of a kick in the teeth no matter how you try to paint it because barring one mod (who I won't name) I really can't fault them. It's done now so that's that, but imo it would have been better (albeit needing more guts) to just sack the ones you didn't like.

 

Seems like a load of fuss over nothing to me - the Ugly operates very successfully with next to no moderation.

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stthrobber

stthrobber

Posted
Posted

I've never really had any major issues with the running of this board. As far as I know I've never received any infractions, but then I've not been a huge poster since the demise of the Lowe era.

 

Having modded Saintslist for many years, even before S4E ever existed, I know how unpopular you get and how unappreciated you feel. I'm not sure I would want to go through all that again, as it is a thankless task.

 

My main issues with some threads have been the way they descend into petty arguments, much of them already covered in other threads. I don't mind if people take the p1ss but I do mind when no respect is shown for the other person's view

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stknowle

stknowle

Posted
Posted
I've mentioned this before, but I think this site reflects to some extent what is happening with the club. When the club is going through the doldrums (which is more often than not) this site tends replicate the feeling.

 

Imo you can over moderate to a point where freedom of opinion gets muted, but there is a line that cannot be crossed and sometimes I think it is crossed on here without any action taken. I also think this place also lacks a bit of humour at the moment (some of the threads in the supposed Paul Allen takeover are priceless and had me busting a hernia). Its hard to introduce humour I know, we are not all Mike Osmans I know...oops, but you mods have been way too serious of late, probably due to the amount of grief you get and not much in return, but hey, thats life unfortunately.

 

As long as your prerequisite is'nt that you have had to post over 6000 times and that you attend every saints game home and away, then I would like to be considered for what it's worth.

 

LOL at Mike Osman and his 'Seriously people, just have patience it is going to happen and it will happen by the end of the week at the absolute latest' bull****. Who was he?

 

FWIW I think BenTheLegend was pure comedy gold and the day of his passing (was he banned or did he just leave? - mods please clarify) was a very sad one for this forum.

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Arizona

Arizona

Posted
Posted
What I don't get is why all the mods have been sacked. It's a bit of a kick in the teeth no matter how you try to paint it because barring one mod (who I won't name) I really can't fault them. It's done now so that's that, but imo it would have been better (albeit needing more guts) to just sack the ones you didn't like.

 

No one has been sacked. We were all offered the chance to carry on, but none of us took it.

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