Israel

[whelk]

Although guess it might expose Starmer and all his fellow Nazis who hate peace

[Lord Duckhunter]

I see Greta is getting involved now, “no climate justice on occupied land”. I presume she’s impressed with Hamas’ plans to reach net zero. 

Edited 13 November, 2023 by Lord Duckhunter

[badgerx16]

7 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I see Greta is getting involved now, “no climate justice on occupied land”. I presume she’s impressed with Hamas’ plans to reach net zero. 

She has become a parody and does more harm than good wherever she turns up because she becomes the story.

[hypochondriac]

25 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

She has become a parody and does more harm than good wherever she turns up because she becomes the story.

When was she not a parody? She's largely a media invention. 

[AlexLaw76]

3 hours ago, whelk said:

Why the hell might there be a parliamentary vote on a ceasefire? Makes no difference whatsoever 

Because this is all theatre 9 months before a general election.

Words (internally, usually) is all we have left as a nation

[badgerx16]

The city-state Government of Berlin has made the slogan "From the river to the sea...." illegal.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Dear god. Some people wanted this bigot to be PM. Imagine if he was PM & his ex squeeze Abbott (jews face the same issues as Gingers) Home Secretary during this crisis.

 

He also refused to say Hamas should be removed from power. 

 

[hypochondriac]

37 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Dear god. Some people wanted this bigot to be PM. Imagine if he was PM & his ex squeeze Abbott (jews face the same issues as Gingers) Home Secretary during this crisis.

 

He also refused to say Hamas should be removed from power. 

 

And to think some well known posters on here were routinely singing his praises. No wonder there's been some question marks about their own views on Jews given who they've historically supported. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

Blatantly lying as well. After Soggys lecture on MP’s honesty on another thread, no doubt he’ll be along to condemn the lies of the man he wanted to be pm at the last election. 
 

 

Private meeting, “where’s our friend from Hamas gone”, my arse. 
 

 

 

 

 

[AlexLaw76]

Jezza is a nutter

Edited 14 November, 2023 by AlexLaw76

[Fan The Flames]

Braverman is the tory Corbyn equivalent, shame Sunak didn't have the bottle to bin her months ago.

[Weston Super Saint]

58 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

Braverman is the tory Corbyn equivalent, shame Sunak didn't have the bottle to bin her months ago.

Well, apart from the bit about being the leader of the party, absolute spitting image.

[Fan The Flames]

24 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Well, apart from the bit about being the leader of the party, absolute spitting image.

Minor detail, both from the fringes of their parties, both figureheads of intra-party groups, both holders of the great states of office, both hated by the other side, both accused of racism, both are tofu munchers.

[AlexLaw76]

1 hour ago, Fan The Flames said:

Minor detail, both from the fringes of their parties, both figureheads of intra-party groups, both holders of the great states of office, both hated by the other side, both accused of racism, both are tofu munchers.

Wasn’t one elected by the party membership?

[benjii]

 

 

 

[whelk]

1 hour ago, benjii said:

 

 

 

Isn’t the highlighter part similar to signing off cleaning the toilets? 
I may be gullible but pretty sure Israelis don’t delight in targeting hospitals but need to as that is where Hamas like to hole up.

 

 

 

[Lord Duckhunter]

14 hours ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Jezza is a nutter

anti-Semitism clearly runs in the family. 
 

 

[Fan The Flames]

2 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

anti-Semitism clearly runs in the family. 
 

His false flag call is standard behaviour for a conspiracy loon. Might not be antisemitic, but of course it could be.

[CB Fry]

Apparently Hamas and Israel have heard about the SNP Ceasefire motion in the House of Commons and agreed to stop fighting. The war is all over. Great news 👏 👍 🙌 👍👍👍

[whelk]

14 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

Apparently Hamas and Israel have heard about the SNP Ceasefire motion in the House of Commons and agreed to stop fighting. The war is all over. Great news 👏 👍 🙌 👍👍👍

 What pisses me off is Hampshire County Councillors haven’t put forward any sort of motion. Too busy making us recycle stuff to want peace. Referendum now!

[AlexLaw76]

2 hours ago, CB Fry said:

Apparently Hamas and Israel have heard about the SNP Ceasefire motion in the House of Commons and agreed to stop fighting. The war is all over. Great news 👏 👍 🙌 👍👍👍

Wait till the region gets a load of Labours (completely pointless) vote and resignations on the matter.

Edited 15 November, 2023 by AlexLaw76

[whelk]

Where do they get these Palestinian cunts doing interviews on Newsnight? 

[sadoldgit]

On 15/11/2023 at 21:37, AlexLaw76 said:

Wait till the region gets a load of Labours (completely pointless) vote and resignations on the matter.

Absolutely. It makes far more sense to say and do nothing. After all, it’s not like the protests and international pressure helped to bring about the end of apartheid in South Africa. Oh, wait…

[Turkish]

1 minute ago, sadoldgit said:

Absolutely. It makes far more sense to say and do nothing. After all, it’s not like the protests and international pressure helped to bring about the end of apartheid in South Africa. Oh, wait…

What are you doing? Apart from saving the world one post at a time on a Southampton football fans forum.

[Weston Super Saint]

28 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

Absolutely. It makes far more sense to say and do nothing. After all, it’s not like the protests and international pressure helped to bring about the end of apartheid in South Africa. Oh, wait…

Sadly, Hamas don't appear to be interested in the protests.

They could force a ceasefire tomorrow by releasing the hostages, but apparently don't want that.

What the fuck are you on about, re Apartheid? It lasted over 40 fucking years. It wasn't ended because some fuckwits in another country waved some placards around.

Edited 17 November, 2023 by Weston Super Saint

[Lord Duckhunter]

30 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

 

What the fuck are you on about, re Apartheid? It lasted over 40 fucking years. It wasn't ended because some fuckwits in another country waved some placards around.

It ended when Nelson Mandala started posted damning condemnations of  F.W. de Klerk’s Government on the Kaizer Chiefs‘ supporters forum. His constant references to the the far right & in particular Eugène Terre'Blanche, was a key moment in defeating apartheid. 

[Tamesaint]

2 hours ago, Weston Super Saint said:

 

What the fuck are you on about, re Apartheid? It I lasted over 40 fucking years. It wasn't ended because some fuckwits in another country waved some placards around.

Apartheid didn't end because de Klerk woke up one day and decided that South Africa had been doing things wrong. The boycotts of South African goods, economic sanctions and sporting isolation all inspired by *fuckwits in another cointry* was one of the major reasons that it ended. Don't underestimate the effect of international protests. 

Edited 17 November, 2023 by Tamesaint

[Weston Super Saint]

17 minutes ago, Tamesaint said:

Apartheid didn't end because de Klerk woke up one day and decided that South Africa had been doing things wrong. The boycotts of South African goods, economic sanctions and sporting isolation all inspired by *fuckwits in another cointry* was one of the major reasons that it ended. Don't underestimate the effect of international protests. 

You (deliberately) missed the "waving placards" bit

 

[Weston Super Saint]

How are we looking for this weekend on the protest front?

300,000 is the bench mark isn't it, so I guess around that for the next round of protests...

[Tamesaint]

15 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

You (deliberately) missed the "waving placards" bit

 

OK. Put that in as well if you like. I am sure that the people who boycotted South African goods, protested to their government etc went on marches waving placards. 

[Weston Super Saint]

14 minutes ago, Tamesaint said:

OK. Put that in as well if you like. I am sure that the people who boycotted South African goods, protested to their government etc went on marches waving placards. 

So, Apartheid is exactly like Israel then?

We've got placards, marches, sporting boycotts, sanctions, all being made against Israel?

Just another 40 odd years to wait for the resolution....

I figured you to be a little brighter than soggy's whataboutery, but apparently not.

[Tamesaint]

14 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

So, Apartheid is exactly like Israel then?

We've got placards, marches, sporting boycotts, sanctions, all being made against Israel?

Just another 40 odd years to wait for the resolution....

I figured you to be a little brighter than soggy's whataboutery, but apparently not.

Blimey. You have really lost it now haven't you. 

You were pouring scorn on those "fuckwits" in other countries who were protesting and waving placards. I simply pointed out that international pressure can affect countries and was a factor in apartheid's defeat. You then go on a strawman rant hurling yet more abuse at SOG and myself. At least this time there was no "fucking" from you. 

Here's a tip mate. Relax and take a bit of a rest from the forum. You need it. 

[Weston Super Saint]

30 minutes ago, Tamesaint said:

Blimey. You have really lost it now haven't you. 

You were pouring scorn on those "fuckwits" in other countries who were protesting and waving placards. I simply pointed out that international pressure can affect countries and was a factor in apartheid's defeat. You then go on a strawman rant hurling yet more abuse at SOG and myself. At least this time there was no "fucking" from you. 

Here's a tip mate. Relax and take a bit of a rest from the forum. You need it. 

You really are quite odd.  I haven't hurled any abuse at either you or soggy (yet).

I was merely answering Soggy's ridiculous claim that Apartheid and Israel have equivalence.

I guess you still consider him to be the greatest wind up merchant since the invention of the innernetz.

Fucking plank! Lost any posts today 🤣

Edited 17 November, 2023 by Weston Super Saint

[Fan The Flames]

1 hour ago, Weston Super Saint said:

You really are quite odd.  I haven't hurled any abuse at either you or soggy (yet).

I was merely answering Soggy's ridiculous claim that Apartheid and Israel have equivalence.

I guess you still consider him to be the greatest wind up merchant since the invention of the innernetz.

Fucking plank! Lost any posts today 🤣

Your the odd one, desperately following people around, particularly SOG, trying to catch them out, you are the Wile E. Coyote of the forum trying to out think Road Runner. But because your attempts are a bit shit, you always end up falling over the cliff, chased by a massive anvil. Beep beep.

[Weston Super Saint]

29 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

Your the odd one, desperately following people around, particularly SOG, trying to catch them out, you are the Wile E. Coyote of the forum trying to out think Road Runner. But because your attempts are a bit shit, you always end up falling over the cliff, chased by a massive anvil. Beep beep.

*You're

HTH.

Not one person in the history of the innernetz has ever needed to "catch SOG out". He's the own goal king (obviously as well as the greatest wind up merchant that ever lived).

[sadoldgit]

Dear Weston,

I rarely respond to your posts as you are usually on a wind up, but as you have excelled yourself today I shall make an exception.

My original point was that protests and international pressure can make a difference and cited the effect that they had in helping to end apartheid in South Africa, which they did.

So, zero “whatsboutery”, just an example to prove a point.

The situation in South Africa was completely different to that currently in Gaza and I did not say that they were similar so why are you pretending that I did and why are you going on about 40 years? If you had been paying attention you would know that the protesters  are calling for an end now to the killings on both sides which started on 7th October. So two very different sets of circumstances in which outside influence has, and possibly could again, have a meaningful effect. Get it?

You either constantly  misunderstand the points that your forum targets make or you are being deliberately obtuse. Either way you rarely make any meaningful contributions to these threads. If you aren’t interested in engaging on a level other than that of a WUM, perhaps just give it a rest for a bit and come back when and if you have something relevant to say?

[hypochondriac]

4 hours ago, Weston Super Saint said:

*You're

HTH.

Not one person in the history of the innernetz has ever needed to "catch SOG out". He's the own goal king (obviously as well as the greatest wind up merchant that ever lived).

You make great posts Weston. Keep it up, don't let the forum bullies try to hound you off the forum with their insults. 

Edited 17 November, 2023 by hypochondriac

[Lord Duckhunter]

9 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

After all, it’s not like the protests and international pressure helped to bring about the end of apartheid in South Africa. Oh, wait…

 

2 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

 

The situation in South Africa was completely different to that currently in Gaza and I did not say that they were similar 

[Tamesaint]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

You make great posts Weston. Keep it up, don't let the forum bullies try to hound you off the forum with your insults. 

 

2 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

You make great posts Weston. Keep it up, don't let the forum bullies try to hound you off the forum with your insults. 

"Your insults"???? 

Yes he does tend to insult most people. 😁😁😁

[Weston Super Saint]

13 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

Dear Weston,

I rarely respond to your posts as you are usually on a wind up, but as you have excelled yourself today I shall make an exception.

My original point was that protests and international pressure can make a difference and cited the effect that they had in helping to end apartheid in South Africa, which they did.

So, zero “whatsboutery”, just an example to prove a point.

The situation in South Africa was completely different to that currently in Gaza and I did not say that they were similar so why are you pretending that I did and why are you going on about 40 years? If you had been paying attention you would know that the protesters  are calling for an end now to the killings on both sides which started on 7th October. So two very different sets of circumstances in which outside influence has, and possibly could again, have a meaningful effect. Get it?

You either constantly  misunderstand the points that your forum targets make or you are being deliberately obtuse. Either way you rarely make any meaningful contributions to these threads. If you aren’t interested in engaging on a level other than that of a WUM, perhaps just give it a rest for a bit and come back when and if you have something relevant to say?

That's because you have me on ignore, surely?

Or is this one of those celebrated cases where you've taken me off ignore just to read my posts, completely voiding the point of the ignore button?

With regards to the 40 years, to enlighten you as you don't seem to have grasped the subject of Apartheid that you introduced to a thread about Israel (even though you state they aren't similar and there is definitely no whataboutery ), it took OVER 40 YEARS of international pressure including sanctions, boycotts and embargoes and over 6 years of political negotiations to bring about the regime change needed to end it.  I question the effectiveness of fuckwits in other countries waving placards and taking slow walks along city streets during that time as they don't appear to have had any effect :

Quote

After all, it’s not like the protests ........ helped to bring about the end of apartheid in South Africa. Oh, wait…

Likewise, I question the effectiveness of the current protests (not just for Palestine) having any influence over Israel or the US to bring about the end of the conflict.  They are clearly having zero effect on Hamas who could bring about a ceasefire by releasing the hostages but choose not to do so.

For the avoidance of any doubt (for the thickos, you know who you are  ), this is not the same as saying people shouldn't protest. 

[egg]

Jeez, we've got a forced evacuation from a hospital, kids being bombed in the apparently safe south, the only drinking water conveniently right next to the Egyptian border, and you boys are flirting about utterly irrelevant bollox. Get a grip. 

[badgerx16]

Having previously told people to move south, Israel is now telling them to leave Khan Yunis, which is the main residential area in the south. They are saying to move west, where there will hopefully be tents and a field hospital.

How far west they can go is a bit limited - the sea is just under 2 miles west of the city.

Edited 18 November, 2023 by badgerx16

[AlexLaw76]

1 hour ago, egg said:

Jeez, we've got a forced evacuation from a hospital, kids being bombed in the apparently safe south, the only drinking water conveniently right next to the Egyptian border, and you boys are flirting about utterly irrelevant bollox. Get a grip. 

Everything on this place is utterly irrelevant

[egg]

8 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

Having previously told people to move south, Israel is now telling them to leave Khan Yunis, which is the main residential area in the south. They are saying to move west, where there will hopefully be tents and a field hospital.

How far west they can go is a bit limited - the sea is just under 2 miles west of the city.

I said way up there Badger that they'd herd them south, then the south would be next. What they've done is make the south all but uninhabitable with a lack of water and overcrowding. Now it'll become unsafe. People will be pushed ever closer to Egypt (there is water at Rafah). Eventually there'll be pressure on Egypt to let people in, and nowhere safe for people to live in Gaza. It's all so utterly predictable. 

[whelk]

22 minutes ago, egg said:

I said way up there Badger that they'd herd them south, then the south would be next

Did anyone think any different? They had to start somewhere and they aren’t going to leave Hamas untouched and free to operate from the South.

[egg]

16 minutes ago, whelk said:

Did anyone think any different? They had to start somewhere and they aren’t going to leave Hamas untouched and free to operate from the South.

Yep, they did. It's what next for the people in the south. Can't go east, west or north. Only south. It's not genocide though. Definitely not. 

[sadoldgit]

15 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

You make great posts Weston. Keep it up, don't let the forum bullies try to hound you off the forum with their insults. 

A question for those who pour scorn on the peace marchers and MPs calling for an end to hostilities.

If it was Hamas killing hundreds/thousands of civilians and laying waste to areas of Israel every day since 7th October, would you still be against peace marchers and MP’s calling for an end to hostilities? Would people “waving placards” still be “fuckwits” (now that, hypochondriac, is an insult, but it seems insulting people is ok in your book if you don’t like the targets).

Another question. Assuming we all agree that Jewish Israelis have every right to live in peace and security in Israel, do you agree that Palestinian Muslims have the same rights in Gaza and the West Bank? If so, why is the murder of civilians not acceptable in one case and acceptable in another?

Despite the best efforts of some, we still live in a democracy and have the right to protest if we think that something is wrong. Over the years people have taken to the streets for all manor of causes, votes for women,the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament, the ending of apartheid, against the poll tax, in support of the miners, against the use of fossil fuel and many to support the end of various conflicts. Just because you may not agree with the cause, it doesn’t make the people taking to the streets or putting pressure on the government to change their position “fuckwits”. Yes, there will always be a few who just pitch up for a ruck, but they are a small minority.

The more people call out against the mass killing of civilians, the more pressure is put on the governments to speak out against the actions of the IDF rather than standing with them, the more the people with real power to put pressure on the Israeli government will do so. The minute Biden tells Netanyahu enough is enough, things will change and that will only happen when there is enough external pressure to force Biden to act. It has been suggested that Netanyahu has been given two more weeks with a free rein for the IDF before he will be told that is it now and back off. I’m not sure how many more innocent men, women, children and babies will be killed in that time  or how much more damage will be done to the infrastructure to Gaza which will make living there a nightmare, but I think it is pretty obvious to most people that this will only stop when the people supporting Netanyahu tell him to stop.

Of course it isn’t going to take 40 years this time (what a dumb thing to suggest and if I had done it you would have been all over me). The more pressure put on world leaders to change their position, the sooner there will be meaningful moves to stop the hostilities. One “fuckwit” waving a placard isn’t going to change a thing. Millions of “fuckwits” waving placards all around the world will make a difference. The numbers are growing daily.
 

 

[Weston Super Saint]

1 minute ago, sadoldgit said:

A question for those who pour scorn on the peace marchers and MPs calling for an end to hostilities.

If it was Hamas killing hundreds/thousands of civilians and laying waste to areas of Israel every day since 7th October, would you still be against peace marchers and MP’s calling for an end to hostilities? Would people “waving placards” still be “fuckwits” (now that, hypochondriac, is an insult, but it seems insulting people is ok in your book if you don’t like the targets).

Another question. Assuming we all agree that Jewish Israelis have every right to live in peace and security in Israel, do you agree that Palestinian Muslims have the same rights in Gaza and the West Bank? If so, why is the murder of civilians not acceptable in one case and acceptable in another?

Despite the best efforts of some, we still live in a democracy and have the right to protest if we think that something is wrong. Over the years people have taken to the streets for all manor of causes, votes for women,the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament, the ending of apartheid, against the poll tax, in support of the miners, against the use of fossil fuel and many to support the end of various conflicts. Just because you may not agree with the cause, it doesn’t make the people taking to the streets or putting pressure on the government to change their position “fuckwits”. Yes, there will always be a few who just pitch up for a ruck, but they are a small minority.

The more people call out against the mass killing of civilians, the more pressure is put on the governments to speak out against the actions of the IDF rather than standing with them, the more the people with real power to put pressure on the Israeli government will do so. The minute Biden tells Netanyahu enough is enough, things will change and that will only happen when there is enough external pressure to force Biden to act. It has been suggested that Netanyahu has been given two more weeks with a free rein for the IDF before he will be told that is it now and back off. I’m not sure how many more innocent men, women, children and babies will be killed in that time  or how much more damage will be done to the infrastructure to Gaza which will make living there a nightmare, but I think it is pretty obvious to most people that this will only stop when the people supporting Netanyahu tell him to stop.

Of course it isn’t going to take 40 years this time (what a dumb thing to suggest and if I had done it you would have been all over me). The more pressure put on world leaders to change their position, the sooner there will be meaningful moves to stop the hostilities. One “fuckwit” waving a placard isn’t going to change a thing. Millions of “fuckwits” waving placards all around the world will make a difference. The numbers are growing daily.
 

 

Bless.  Still not a clue about the history of the region.

[whelk]

23 minutes ago, egg said:

Yep, they did. It's what next for the people in the south. Can't go east, west or north. Only south. It's not genocide though. Definitely not. 

It’s genocide if you don’t know the meaning of the word

[whelk]

5 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Bless.  Still not a clue about the history of the region.

It is comical how simply he sees things. Same on terrorism thread. Completely wet  reasoning and clear he always thinks he is on the moral high ground