Staplewood

I gather work on redeveloping Staplewood has started in earnest with the contractors being the same company who oversaw the development of Chelsea's state of the art facility at Cobham. Apparently the spec for Staplewood is even greater than what was built for Chelsea which suggests Nicola Cortese is here for the duration and is prepared to make a significant investment off the pitch. Good News!

Quality. As I said on another thread yesterday Cortese is also planning a big overhaul of the corporate sections should we get promoted. We really are going to have some of the best facilities going soon.

I gather work on redeveloping Staplewood has started in earnest with the contractors being the same company who oversaw the development of Chelsea's state of the art facility at Cobham. Apparently the spec for Staplewood is even greater than what was built for Chelsea which suggests Nicola Cortese is here for the duration and is prepared to make a significant investment off the pitch. Good News!

Sorry, but was it ever in doubt he was here for the 'duration'? Is this not what he has always said?

I know the media team are drafting plans for better coverage and operations next season. It's all go.

Quality. As I said on another thread yesterday Cortese is also planning a big overhaul of the corporate sections should we get promoted. We really are going to have some of the best facilities going soon.

Hope he makes all those who deserted the Club when all Income was needed pay a high price for stabbing us in the back

I gather work on redeveloping Staplewood has started in earnest with the contractors being the same company who oversaw the development of Chelsea's state of the art facility at Cobham. Apparently the spec for Staplewood is even greater than what was built for Chelsea which suggests Nicola Cortese is here for the duration and is prepared to make a significant investment off the pitch. Good News!

Main construction work started last month and announced on OS on 16th February...

http://www.saintsfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10280~2613018,00.html

Sorry, but was it ever in doubt he was here for the 'duration'? Is this not what he has always said?

What someone says and what transpires is not always the same thing. Circumstances change and this sort of thing is good evidence to suggest that any commitment is a long term one. It's pretty sad that you can't just accept good news like this in the spirit it was clearly intended.

That training grounds looks better than Nottarf Crap

That training grounds looks better than Nottarf Crap

Which reminds me. As far as I recall, they don't have their own training ground. Oops.

That training grounds looks better than Nottarf Crap

You mean in the sense that Angelina Jolie looks better than Kathy Burke?

I gather work on redeveloping Staplewood has started in earnest with the contractors being the same company who oversaw the development of Chelsea's state of the art facility at Cobham. Apparently the spec for Staplewood is even greater than what was built for Chelsea which suggests Nicola Cortese is here for the duration and is prepared to make a significant investment off the pitch. Good News!

Good to hear, exciting future ahead under NC and the Liebherr estate!

Similar to QPR last summer we could be sold after promotion? The club would be at its most valuble, NC may or may not stay under the new owners - he could move on with an even better reputation, The liebherr would see a decent return on investment....... Everyones happy

As fans we can never be 100% of an owners intentions, but since the beginning Liebherr was rung all the right bells, that has filled me with confidence. Cortese is investing so much into the long term future of the club, I just can't see it as a splash and dash. If you wanted to maximise profits from a sell on, there are many unneccessary costs that could be shed. Things as minor as the new ticketing systems just highlights good is not enough, it's got to be up there with the best for the job. The Academy underlines this attitude, even though we ae not even a Premier club as yet.

Corteses drive is relentless and can be *****ly to some, but seems to have realised that the team does all the talking for him and he just gets on with his job. I doubt many of us would enjoy working for him, so driven and hard working and expecting the same from his staff. I am gobsmacked at just how well Cortese has got this club running, with everything and everyone pulling in the right direction. We can say this is not all down to Cortese and that Adkins, Wilkins, Reid have played their part, but Cortese has put the peices together and allowed them the space and freedom to be a success.

You only have to look at the removal of Pardew and his subsequent success at Newcastle. Normally that would indicate a failure on a chairmans part having to risk that season upon what he felt required to be done. But Adkins appointment has been a master stroke that there are very few who would want to swap Adkins for Pardew now, even with his success at Newcastle.

I am not completely sure how Cortese has achieved what he has so far, but he certainly knows what he is doing. I look back when he increased Adkins contract to 5 years after just a couple of months in the job, when we had not even seen anywhere near the best from Adkins. How Cortese had that figured at that stage just makes his judgement look that much better.

You mean in the sense that Angelina Jolie looks better than Kathy Burke?

Jeez! If Kathy Burke were to hear that you compated her to nottarf she'd stop 'havin' a fag' and come round and punch your lights out!

Mansel park looks better than that ****hole to be fair

Similar to QPR last summer we could be sold after promotion? The club would be at its most valuble, NC may or may not stay under the new owners - he could move on with an even better reputation, The liebherr would see a decent return on investment....... Everyones happy

Similar to QPR last summer we could be sold after promotion? The club would be at its most valuble, NC may or may not stay under the new owners - he could move on with an even better reputation, The liebherr would see a decent return on investment....... Everyones happy

Please please please do NOT compare us with. QPR. **** club, dodgy owners, pushed the prices up. Treated managers like ****. Deserve what's coming to them. Did you not see BBC prog 'the four year plan'?

The firm I work for has today sent a quote for the new irrigation system. Fingers crossed we get it. I saw a large brown envelope with the name A. Gray on it ready for the post van

I will take a few pics of Cobham when I'm up there on Monday so you can see what the buildings look like as the artists impression doesnt do it justice.

I will take a few pics of Cobham when I'm up there on Monday so you can see what the buildings look like as the artists impression doesnt do it justice.

A tour of Cobham Training Ground with Graeme Le Saux...

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2xx87_chelsea-training-centre-in-cobham_sport

Staplewood is having many of the same features and as the opening post of this thread states, it is possibly to a higher spec.

The spec for Staplewood is even greater than what was built for Chelsea!

Cortese/Liebherr's aren't building Staplewood and the academy to merely be a mid table or bottom half Premier League team, if that were the case they wouldn't be spending as much on this as they are. Cortese resubmitted plans after Liebherr's death that were 3 times that of the original training ground development. This is costing a lot of money. They really want to compete at a high level in the Premier League! The club and some of the fans need a change of mindset, they have big ambitions for the club for the first time in its 126 year history and the resources to match those ambitions it seems.

Hopefully it is finally dawning on the Cortese bashers, who desperately take every perceived 'opportunity' to have pitiful swipes, what an amazing job he is doing in rebuilding our club!

I would have been grateful to see a road back to where we fell from but I genuinely feel this isn't going to be enough for Cortese.

The man is on a mission, may God bless his chairmanship for many more healthy years yet to come...

A tour of Cobham Training Ground with Graeme Le Saux...

 

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2xx87_chelsea-training-centre-in-cobham_sport

 

Staplewood is having many of the same features and as the opening post of this thread states, it is possibly to a higher spec.

 

 

 

Cortese/Liebherr's aren't building Staplewood and the academy to merely be a mid table or bottom half Premier League team, if that were the case they wouldn't be spending as much on this as they are. Cortese resubmitted plans after Liebherr's death that were 3 times that of the original training ground development. This is costing a lot of money. They really want to compete at a high level in the Premier League! The club and some of the fans need a change of mindset, they have big ambitions for the club for the first time in its 126 year history and the resources to match those ambitions it seems.

Think I've asked you this before and not got an answer - how much do you think we'd need to spend on the first team squad, over lets say the next 2 years, in order to regularly compete in the top 5 of the Prem & regularly qualify for Europe.

Well it is a daft question, so that is probably why I haven't answered it before.

Why have you put a 2 year limit on it?

Why "top 5"?

Why do you think can you only be successful if you spend huge amounts on transfer fees?

Well it is a daft question, so that is probably why I haven't answered it before.

 

Why have you put a 2 year limit on it?

Why "top 5"?

Why do you think can you only be successful if you spend huge amounts on transfer fees?

I'll take that as a 'don't know' then. 2 years/top 5 were just picked by me off the top of my head as rough parameters of what this plan for success you might be referring to, but please feel free to change them accordingly to what you think might be a closer range. I never said you could only be successful by spending huge amounts.

It's a bull**** question, how could he possibly know how many top players will be home grown any how many will be paid for?

It's a bull**** question, how could he possibly know how many top players will be home grown any how many will be paid for?

Ok for the VERY hard of thinking, such as yourself, of course no-one would 'know'. What do you think a club would reasonably anticipate to spend on its playing squad to achieve such goals? Can make reasonable assumptions based on players coming through the ranks, etc, as with any estimate.

Look how little newly promoted Swansea have spent. Their first XI that beat Man City cost £7m and they are 8th in the Premier League in late March, a mere 3 points behind Dalglish's Liverpool with King Kenny having spent £140m on fees since his return. Good management, strong infrastructure and careful spending can go a long way.

Saints have a richer backer than Swansea, larger fanbase, larger stadium, better infrastructure at training ground and one of the best academies in the country. Cortese and the Liebherr's are putting everything in place that will allow it to compete at a high level, something it has never been able to do before in its 126 year history. As I said earlier, some Saints supporters are going to need a change in mindset in the coming years (you being a prime example). Even under Rupert Lowe and his lack of investment, Saints were able to finish 8th and reach a major cup final in 2003. Compare Liebherr/Cortese and what they have done already with the lack of investment from Rupert Lowe.

Look how little newly promoted Swansea have spent. Their first XI that beat Man City cost £7m and they are 8th in the Premier League in late March, a mere 3 points behind Dalglish's Liverpool with King Kenny having spent £140m on fees since his return. Good management, strong infrastructure and careful spending can go a long way.

 

Saints have a richer backer than Swansea, larger fanbase, larger stadium, better infrastructure at training ground and one of the best academies in the country. Cortese and the Liebherr's are putting everything in place that will allow it to compete at a high level, something it has never been able to do before in its 126 year history. As I said earlier, some Saints supporters are going to need a change in mindset in the coming years (you being a prime example). Even under Rupert Lowe and his lack of investment, Saints were able to finish 8th and reach a major cup final in 2003. Compare Liebherr/Cortese and what they have done already with the lack of investment from Rupert Lowe.

However, none of us really know how far NC and the Liebherr's are going to be prepared to fund serious spending on the playing squad. Of course we'll buy quality, but I think you'll find that with some of the hopes you've got in your head, you'll be sorely disappointed.

You always get occasional freak results in football and the odd anomaly in the league table, but what you are suggesting in your earlier post is Saints regularly competing towards the top end of the table "not in mid-table". There has been no instance in the last 20 years of a team competing regularly towards the top without spending big. That's not really going to change. I've got no doubt NC is ambitious. I've got no doubt that our Staplewood plans are impressive and will have a significantly positive impact on the club going forward.

 

However, none of us really know how far NC and the Liebherr's are going to be prepared to fund serious spending on the playing squad. Of course we'll buy quality, but I think you'll find that with some of the hopes you've got in your head, you'll be sorely disappointed.

So you don't know either. You think he'll be disappointed, he thinks you'll be surprised.

As I see it we either go the Chelsea route or Arsenal route from about 10-15 years ago. Chelsea brought in free transfers, big names but paid decent wages to attract then. Before then they were pretty crap but Vialli, Gullit et all got a cup win or two and then Ambramovich took over and the rest is history. Arsenal brought in younger European players all about 20-24 years of age for lower wages but a bit more of an initial transfer fee. Think they got lucky a few times (Viera for example) and they turned into world class players. This is probably our transfer strategy if and when we get into the top flight to be honest. Major difference though is that they had that backline of Seaman, Keown, Adams, Winterburn and Dixon which helped a lot

The other alternative is to be like Villa, Everton etc and buy rejects off the top teams, find the odd decent talent before they get sold for big bucks and constantly battle for midtable and the occasional cup win.

As fans we can never be 100% of an owners intentions, but since the beginning Liebherr was rung all the right bells, that has filled me with confidence. Cortese is investing so much into the long term future of the club, I just can't see it as a splash and dash. If you wanted to maximise profits from a sell on, there are many unneccessary costs that could be shed. Things as minor as the new ticketing systems just highlights good is not enough, it's got to be up there with the best for the job. The Academy underlines this attitude, even though we ae not even a Premier club as yet.

 

Corteses drive is relentless and can be *****ly to some, but seems to have realised that the team does all the talking for him and he just gets on with his job. I doubt many of us would enjoy working for him, so driven and hard working and expecting the same from his staff. I am gobsmacked at just how well Cortese has got this club running, with everything and everyone pulling in the right direction. We can say this is not all down to Cortese and that Adkins, Wilkins, Reid have played their part, but Cortese has put the peices together and allowed them the space and freedom to be a success.

 

You only have to look at the removal of Pardew and his subsequent success at Newcastle. Normally that would indicate a failure on a chairmans part having to risk that season upon what he felt required to be done. But Adkins appointment has been a master stroke that there are very few who would want to swap Adkins for Pardew now, even with his success at Newcastle.

 

I am not completely sure how Cortese has achieved what he has so far, but he certainly knows what he is doing. I look back when he increased Adkins contract to 5 years after just a couple of months in the job, when we had not even seen anywhere near the best from Adkins. How Cortese had that figured at that stage just makes his judgement look that much better.

Answered in BOLD.

All good business men (and lets make no mistake NC is right up there) have a drive that goes beyond the every day. He was trusted by ML - that trust doesn't come from being "friends" it comes out of the fact that NC is very good at what he does and therefore had built their relationship on respect. Never accepting second best will be one of his attributes (and that will be in all aspects from the people around him to the kitting out of the training ground) - some can deal with that some can't. Another will be to make decisions on all the information he can gather at the time although at the end of the day the decision is his alone and he will live or die based on those decisions. I for one hope he stays for a long time.

Anyway thanks for the update FF - great to see that NC doesn't just want us to have a good training facility he wants the best there is.

So when is the completion date?

Bugger Staplewood , whats the catering like ?

Hopefully it is finally dawning on the Cortese bashers, who desperately take every perceived 'opportunity' to have pitiful swipes, what an amazing job he is doing in rebuilding our club!

 

I would have been grateful to see a road back to where we fell from but I genuinely feel this isn't going to be enough for Cortese.

 

The man is on a mission, may God bless his chairmanship for many more healthy years yet to come...

Well said.

So you don't know either. You think he'll be disappointed, he thinks you'll be surprised.

Ok for the VERY hard of thinking, such as yourself, of course no-one would 'know'. What do you think a club would reasonably anticipate to spend on its playing squad to achieve such goals? Can make reasonable assumptions based on players coming through the ranks, etc, as with any estimate.

We will spend what the Chairman knows we can afford. The five year plan was to get back to the PL. NC will have formulated a plan, with the relevant people, to implement when we get there. Constantly high attendances will be one of the criteria for any expansion in any form BUT there will be (IMHO) money available to improve/strengthen the team so that we can push on and stabilise ourselves in the PL.

We will spend what the Chairman knows we can afford. The five year plan was to get back to the PL. NC will have formulated a plan, with the relevant people, to implement when we get there. Constantly high attendances will be one of the criteria for any expansion in any form BUT there will be (IMHO) money available to improve/strengthen the team so that we can push on and stabilise ourselves in the PL.

You always get occasional freak results in football and the odd anomaly in the league table, but what you are suggesting in your earlier post is Saints regularly competing towards the top end of the table "not in mid-table". There has been no instance in the last 20 years of a team competing regularly towards the top without spending big. That's not really going to change. I've got no doubt NC is ambitious. I've got no doubt that our Staplewood plans are impressive and will have a significantly positive impact on the club going forward.

 

However, none of us really know how far NC and the Liebherr's are going to be prepared to fund serious spending on the playing squad. Of course we'll buy quality, but I think you'll find that with some of the hopes you've got in your head, you'll be sorely disappointed.

I'm not making a case for or against how we'll do in the PL. But, you are missing one important part of the equation. Rule changes already in place (with hints of more to come) regarding club finances and numbers of foreigners mean spending patterns/ability won't necessarily be the same in the future as they have been for the last 20 years. The playing field will become slightly more level than it has been in recent times.

I'm not making a case for or against how we'll do in the PL. But, you are missing one important part of the equation. Rule changes already in place (with hints of more to come) regarding club finances and numbers of foreigners mean spending patterns/ability won't necessarily be the same in the future as they have been for the last 20 years. The playing field will become slightly more level than it has been in recent times.

You always get occasional freak results in football and the odd anomaly in the league table, but what you are suggesting in your earlier post is Saints regularly competing towards the top end of the table "not in mid-table". There has been no instance in the last 20 years of a team competing regularly towards the top without spending big. That's not really going to change. I've got no doubt NC is ambitious. I've got no doubt that our Staplewood plans are impressive and will have a significantly positive impact on the club going forward.

 

However, none of us really know how far NC and the Liebherr's are going to be prepared to fund serious spending on the playing squad. Of course we'll buy quality, but I think you'll find that with some of the hopes you've got in your head, you'll be sorely disappointed.

I can find little fault with that point of view with recent history backing that up. My estimate is that we would need something like £20M from Cortese to bolster the playing squad, just to ensure we became a mid table team. And stil using the Premier income to improve the squad further. Swansea have been really special in their performances and outlay, something that will not necessarily carry over to other teams. Our big difficulty will be in spending that money wisely where it looks most targets will come from abroad. I know we have done some steps towards international scouts but are competing in a very competitive market, lacking the experience at this level. Our first season could be very difficult.

Where I feel you may be underestimating our prospects is down to the way the club is working. As well oiled machines go, it's difficult to look at any other club that have got so much right as Saints have in their progress. There's been very little luck, just a lot of hard work and excellent decisions. That's why I feel even with the reasonably expected budget you mention, that we will be punching far greater than our weight. I also expect that youth players will be fast tracked into the first team, even though this means sacrificing early results to do so. Many very successful business men have come into football and made a pigs ear of it. Somehow Cortese has got all the important bits right. He had no right to get so lucky but the harder he seems to work the luckier he gets. I believe we have someone special for a chairman, someone who can get us punching well above our weight.

He thinks we're going to compete at the top of the table without serious spending on the first team squad. There is no precedent for that happening in the last 20 years of English football. Its fairly straight forward to understand.

Having some of the best facilities in the country, one of the best Academy's and (most importantly) visionary leadership both on and off the pitch will help.

Hopefully , in future we won't see the Walcott's, Bale's and Alex OC's ...disappearing off to the London "elite " but our newer talent will stay in the club.

It isn't a foregone conclusion that despite Liebherr money, we'll spent £10-20 million on every new player.¨That sort of money can go to better salaries instead of fees.

He thinks we're going to compete at the top of the table without serious spending on the first team squad. There is no precedent for that happening in the last 20 years of English football. Its fairly straight forward to understand.

Really? It seems to me that he was explaining how well we'd done before (8th) with little first team investment, so imagine how well we could do if we invested more than in the Lowe years. The Swansea example, in my mind, was to strengthen the point that a certain level is possible without significant buys for the first team, so with them why not hope to do better than a team like Swansea are currently?

You're right that it's straightforward to understand that without spending on the first team squad you have no hope of success, but that isn't the point that's really being debated. If anything, the Staplewood upgrade shows how willing the regime is to spend where necessary. So why wouldn't the first team come under that category?

Really? It seems to me that he was explaining how well we'd done before (8th) with little first team investment, so imagine how well we could do if we invested more than in the Lowe years. The Swansea example, in my mind, was to strengthen the point that a certain level is possible without significant buys for the first team, so with them why not hope to do better than a team like Swansea are currently?

 

You're right that it's straightforward to understand that without spending on the first team squad you have no hope of success, but that isn't the point that's really being debated. If anything, the Staplewood upgrade shows how willing the regime is to spend where necessary. So why wouldn't the first team come under that category?

The usual boll*cks from our excitable morons on here.

"oh look at Swansea" yes, they've done well. For 3/4s of one season. Lets see if they are still in the top half of the table in 5 years time without spending a large amount of money on improving the squad. Lets see if they are still in the top half when their best players get their head turned by offers of silly money elsewhere or their manager gets poached by a bigger club.

"we dont need to spend big to be a top club, we've got a great training ground and an amazing academy" Only one team in the last 20 years has produced and retained enough home grown players to be a top half of the table for any lengthy period. Who was this team? Manchester United. One of the biggest clubs in the world. They also added top top players to complement them. For other clubs in Saints bracket and a little bigger what happened when Newcastle brought through Andy Carroll, Sunderland brought through Jordan Henderson, Aston VIlla brought through Gareth Barry and Ashley Young, West Ham brought through Joe Cole, Frank Lampard & Rio Ferdiand? They couldn't get out of St James Park, the SOL, Villa & Upton Park quick enough when a bigger club playing more money came calling.

"oh but the new laws are coming in, it's all going to be fair" - Yes, clubs can only spend what comes in. Which means the biggest clubs with the biggest incomes can spend more. Yes, they cant spend more than they earn, but a club in the champions league playing in a 60,000 seater stadium and winning trophies will have more income and be able to spend more than a club in midtable playing in a 32,000 stadium winning nothing. How does this help Saints become a top 6 team exactly?

I know this does fit well with a lot of some of your beliefs that we are on an unstoppable march to the champions league and doing it with a load of academy players all here because they share the chairmans vision and like all of us believe he is the greatest man who ever lived. The reality is somewhat different. NO club since the Premier league was invented has competed regularly in the top 6 without spending a f*ck lot of money on players and wages and that aint going to change any time soon. Some of you dreamers need a dose of reality.

NO club since the Premier league was invented has competed regularly in the top 6 without spending a f*ck lot of money on players and wages and that aint going to change any time soon. Some of you dreamers need a dose of reality.

Aston Villa

2009/10 6th

2008/09 6th

2007/08 6th

They didn't spend a huge amount considering the TV income and other Premier League revenue streams they got. Good management from O'Neil and sound infrastructure took them a long way.

Aston Villa average attendance in 2011/12 = 34,137 which is barely more than Saints had at St Mary's between 2001 and 2005 for mid table finishes in a 32k stadium.

Aston Villa

 

2009/10 6th

2008/09 6th

2007/08 6th

 

They didn't spend a huge amount considering the TV income and other Premier League revenue streams they got. Good management from O'Neil and sound infrastructure took them a long way.

 

Aston Villa average attendance in 2011/12 = 34,137 which is barely more than Saints had at St Mary's between 2001 and 2005 for mid table finishes in a 32k stadium.

AV are £55m in debt!! Season 08/9 they spent £48M on 9 players

AV are £55m in debt!!

Saints have an owner whose family business philosophy is not to accrue any external debt, have ambitions of upper Premier League finishes and have a net worth far beyond that of Randy Lerner as resources to meet those ambitions. I wouldn't dimiss Saints in the top 6 quite as quickly as Turkish and Sour Mash do. Even Bolton finished in the top 6 as recently as 2005.

Saints have an owner whose family business philosophy is not to accrue any debt, ambitions of Champions League football and have a net worth far beyond that of Randy Lerner.

You have diverted!!? You said AV didnt spend much but finished 6th..... They did spend, they spent big - £48m (08/9) and £38m (09/10) another £32m year after

You have diverted!!? You said AV didnt spend much but finished 6th..... They did spend, they spent big - £48m (08/9) and £38m (09/10) another £32m year after

That isn't that big really compared against clubs they were competing against at the top when you consider the income from merely being in the Premier League.