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Pompey Takeover Saga

Fitzhugh Fella

By Fitzhugh Fella,
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TopGun

TopGun

Posted
Posted
The actual rules defining the parachute payments, no fixed amounts but percentages of 'shares' :

 

http://www.premierleague.com/content/dam/premierleague/site-content/News/publications/handbooks/premier-league-handbook-2012-2013.pdf

 

D.27.

Subject to Rules D.28, D.29, E.21, E.30 and E.34, each Relegated Club shall receive

the following fees:

D.27.1. in the first Season after being relegated, a sum equivalent to 55% of 1

share of each of the Basic Award Fund, Overseas Broadcasting Money and

Title Sponsorship Money;

D.27.2. in the second Season after being relegated, a sum equivalent to 45%

of 1 share of each of the Basic Award Fund, Overseas Broadcasting Money

and Title Sponsorship Money; and

D.27.3. in each of the third and fourth Seasons after being relegated, a sum

equivalent to 25% of 1 share of each of the Basic Award Fund, Overseas

Broadcasting Money and Title Sponsorship Money.

 

That's very useful info Badger.

 

So they had two Championship seasons, this season in L1 and next season in L2 for PPs.

 

The amount has presumably gone up for the last payments for next season because the PL has negotiated larger sums of TV rights money and Portsmouth benefit to the tune of £4m. That's a very lucky break for them although it just goes to pay off debts so doesn't help them next season if they make it that far.

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PhilippineSaint

PhilippineSaint

Posted
Posted

 

 

He said: ‘I think people can see there is a quick pathway from the Academy to the first team at this club at the moment.

 

Not surprised there as you will only get a month contract and if you do play and get booked / sent off your not going to get paid anyhow.

 

 

So why aren't they playing the youngsters then ?

 

 

 

Oh I forgot because they need to be competitive which means the youngsters are no bloody good which says a lot for Awford's methods

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anothersaintinsouthsea

anothersaintinsouthsea

Posted
Posted
For a club that has done everything possible to get rid of youngsters (who have turned out be be quite good) in order to allow them to buy/loan older players (who have then turnout to be sh it) that is beyond ridiculous.

 

Equally stupid is the way he tries to make out that it is only recently that their youth system has been a shambles. Even when they had loads of money we were taking their young players. Ox and JWP being the obvious higher profile examples.

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted

d487b4eb4af5089374162c086c1db171_normal.jpegMicah Hall ‏@blueballoo2000

Had Portsmouth City Council fallen for David Dicks dirty trick yesterday then today PKF would be liquidating Pompey.

 

pompey_normal.jpgAndyMac ‏@beiderbecks

@blueballoo2000 Frightening when you put it like that. #PuP

 

d487b4eb4af5089374162c086c1db171_normal.jpegMicah Hall ‏@blueballoo2000

@beiderbecks frightening but inescapable. Yesterday the Harris people came within an inch of having us liquidated.

 

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qwertySFC

qwertySFC

Posted
Posted (edited)

Category 1 academies will have high contact time with young players, require a minimum of 18 full-time staff and an operational budget of £2.5 M

 

Think we can mange that

 

Mind you - I wonder how much of the transfer fees , wages. image rights offered by the fishey few could have gone into academy development ?

Edited by qwertySFC
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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted
Category 1 academies will have high contact time with young players, require a minimum of 18 full-time staff and an operational budget of £2.5 M

 

Think we can mange that

 

Mind you - I wonder how much of the transfer fees , wages. image rights offered by the fishey few could have gone into academy development ?

 

From the sales of Walcott, Bale and the OX, our academy has funded itself for about 14 years.

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qwertySFC

qwertySFC

Posted
Posted (edited)

Andy Awfull says how bad it is that poor ole Pompy can't compete with other academies - but has re-assured potential parents of young starlets that they just need to bear with them during this difficult period - so locally the options will be

 

Staplewood

 

or......................

 

Just as a side note - the architects for staplewood are also involved with ;...............

 

AFL in conjunction with Foster & Partners are to be appointed to develop the refurbishment and extension of Camp Nou. AFL will be employed as stadium design advisors to Foster & Partners. The scheme involves increasing the capacity by 8000 seats to 106,000 total, also forming new corporate facilities and players facilities and the upgrade of all public concourses. The project also includes the construction of a new roof to the whole of the stadium and the re-cladding to the exterior.

Edited by qwertySFC
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pedg

pedg

Posted
Posted
d487b4eb4af5089374162c086c1db171_normal.jpegMicah Hall ‏@blueballoo2000

@beiderbecks frightening but inescapable. Yesterday the Harris people came within an inch of having us liquidated.

 

 

I can see how they may have come within an inch of getting the loan refused but unless you are head deep in "Trust or Bust" I can't see how that would immediately lead to liquidation. As I see it if the PDT were forced to pull out then the FL would very quickly have to accept the Harris bid and given its seal of approval by everyone else it should easily happen before the deadline.

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rallyboy

rallyboy

Posted
Posted

PS. Hey Harry, we've got millions of pounds washing through the club, how about we set up a top academy?

HR. Why, we're not down to the bare bones are we?

PS. No, we're in pole position to build a future, you can scout the best talent for miles around, we can poach all the players from little Saints and plucky Brighton, those two losers are screwed bigtime!...

HR. Sounds boring.

PS. Not at all, it's a challenge, and you will be seen as the messiah who created a new era - it could even lead to the England job...a knighthood...

HR. Well Pete me old mucker, that all sounds cushty for sure, but what's in it for Rosie?

PS. Rosie?

HR. Rosie Lee - me!

PS. The chance to make history, to build a club from the academy up, a new ground, a new era, they might name a stand after you...

HR. Any cash?

PS. Well you'll be VERY well paid, plus your image rights, and the boss will buy something random off you in Monaco for £200K, but more importantly your CV and coaching reputation would look amazing when you go to the inevitable England interview.

HR. England?...That must be well paid...it might be better than playing the computer game on the sofa...

PS. Yes, you can make your mark on the national game like your old muckers Bobby Moore and Geoff Hurst did...think of the legacy...

HR. Tell you what Pete, that's terrific, and let's just hold that whole academy thought for the moment, because I've got another idea...

PS. Set up several academy bases, maybe strike a deal with a big European club, a network of coaching excellence?

HR. Sort of - how about we just trade as many players as possible, dozens of them at a time, quantity over quality, get a lorry to move them, pay ridiculous wages, and put ourselves on win bonuses, and a cut of all deals, plus add-ons?

PS. And plough the profits back into club development and build a world class academy?

HR. No! Are you aving a larf mush? Forget the academy thing, it's a crazy idea!

PS. So you'd rather chuck millions down a black hole, wreck your own career prospects and line our pockets before investing in the future?

HR. Yep.

PS. I'm in.

 

 

And so it came to pass that the club that took the decision to buy an FA Cup and pay for prossies instead of wisely investing money gathered from the maiming of children, theft from pensioners and local charities, did moan about their bad luck when the blatantly predictable happened.

And football did feel sorry for them.

Not.

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SaintRichmond

SaintRichmond

Posted
Posted

Amidst all this turmoil, never forget Chinny ..... " I am secured, I will get my money back "" .... what was the amount ?? £12 M ++

 

 

Chinny is no mug, his legal staff MUST have been 100% convinced that he WOULD get his money back

 

Unless of course there is another hidden agenda, ie another unafficial admin .... where HE gets offered 2p in the pound ??

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Highfield Saint

Highfield Saint

Posted
Posted
Taking it purely on that face value it may loo as if it adds up, but...............

 

What about ongoing running costs? They have very little income yet have to fund wages, pay bills, tax, etc, until the start of the next season - 5 months. How are they going to manage to do that? Oh yes, forgot, silly me, this is PFC we are talking about - they don't pay bills, tax, etc..........

 

Edit - oh, and the 2m floating charge? PKF fees? Legal fees? Kanu case? etc?

 

They still have the original PP's plus season ticket sales and further pledges that may come in as people see that they are "saved". PKF will do a deal and other payments can be deferred or negotiated.

 

They will be undercalpitalised but this could work - at least until the next time.

 

Just being devil's advocate here...

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Ken Tone

Ken Tone

Posted
Posted
They still have the original PP's plus season ticket sales and further pledges that may come in as people see that they are "saved". PKF will do a deal and other payments can be deferred or negotiated.

 

They will be undercalpitalised but this could work - at least until the next time.

 

Just being devil's advocate here...

 

The trust often push this line that more pledges will be add and honoured once (if) they are safe, but surely human nature is such that once they are safe, no one will feel the need to give any more? Why should Mr Average PFC fan, give £1000 if his club is secure anyway?

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
PS. Hey Harry, we've got millions of pounds washing through the club, how about we set up a top academy?

HR. Why, we're not down to the bare bones are we?

PS. No, we're in pole position to build a future, you can scout the best talent for miles around, we can poach all the players from little Saints and plucky Brighton, those two losers are screwed bigtime!...

HR. Sounds boring.

PS. Not at all, it's a challenge, and you will be seen as the messiah who created a new era - it could even lead to the England job...a knighthood...

HR. Well Pete me old mucker, that all sounds cushty for sure, but what's in it for Rosie?

PS. Rosie?

HR. Rosie Lee - me!

PS. The chance to make history, to build a club from the academy up, a new ground, a new era, they might name a stand after you...

HR. Any cash?

PS. Well you'll be VERY well paid, plus your image rights, and the boss will buy something random off you in Monaco for £200K, but more importantly your CV and coaching reputation would look amazing when you go to the inevitable England interview.

HR. England?...That must be well paid...it might be better than playing the computer game on the sofa...

PS. Yes, you can make your mark on the national game like your old muckers Bobby Moore and Geoff Hurst did...think of the legacy...

HR. Tell you what Pete, that's terrific, and let's just hold that whole academy thought for the moment, because I've got another idea...

PS. Set up several academy bases, maybe strike a deal with a big European club, a network of coaching excellence?

HR. Sort of - how about we just trade as many players as possible, dozens of them at a time, quantity over quality, get a lorry to move them, pay ridiculous wages, and put ourselves on win bonuses, and a cut of all deals, plus add-ons?

PS. And plough the profits back into club development and build a world class academy?

HR. No! Are you aving a larf mush? Forget the academy thing, it's a crazy idea!

PS. So you'd rather chuck millions down a black hole, wreck your own career prospects and line our pockets before investing in the future?

HR. Yep.

PS. I'm in.

 

 

And so it came to pass that the club that took the decision to buy an FA Cup and pay for prossies instead of wisely investing money gathered from the maiming of children, theft from pensioners and local charities, did moan about their bad luck when the blatantly predictable happened.

And football did feel sorry for them.

Not.

 

:lol:

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EastleighSoulBoy

EastleighSoulBoy

Posted
Posted
They still have the original PP's plus season ticket sales and further pledges that may come in as people see that they are "saved". PKF will do a deal and other payments can be deferred or negotiated.

 

They will be undercalpitalised but this could work - at least until the next time.

 

Just being devil's advocate here...

 

So further opportunities abound for nutjobbery and hilarity.

 

Excellent! :lol:

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PhilippineSaint

PhilippineSaint

Posted
Posted
@NabilHassan79: BREAKING: Property developer working with PST - Stuart Robinson - has completed deal & bought Gaydamak's land around Fratton Park. #pompey

 

So Robinson now has the upper hand when it comes to negotiations on the access roads to Fatpipe Meadows and if they can build slightly more than 80 houses around the perimeter of KNA

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andysstuff

andysstuff

Posted
Posted
@NabilHassan79: BREAKING: Property developer working with PST - Stuart Robinson - has completed deal & bought Gaydamak's land around Fratton Park. #pompey

 

Odd thing to do before the Fatpipes has been formally 'valued' by the court. Would have thought it now has some extra value as a ransom strip now.

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anothersaintinsouthsea

anothersaintinsouthsea

Posted
Posted
The trust often push this line that more pledges will be add and honoured once (if) they are safe, but surely human nature is such that once they are safe, no one will feel the need to give any more? Why should Mr Average PFC fan, give £1000 if his club is secure anyway?

 

Exactly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_rider_problem

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Doctoroncall

Doctoroncall

Posted
Posted
The trust often push this line that more pledges will be add and honoured once (if) they are safe, but surely human nature is such that once they are safe, no one will feel the need to give any more? Why should Mr Average PFC fan, give £1000 if his club is secure anyway?

 

That's why they'll make up something else like 'help succeed in lg2' we need your pledges converted.

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted

A good time to dust off this blog perhaps?

 

http://lucymcarmichael.blog.com/2012/11/13/does-the-hope-of-portsmouth-fans-rest-on-a-supreme-tower-of-avoidance/

 

Alongside the money raised from the fans will be funding from what The Supporters Trust have labelled High Net Worth Individuals. Believed to be over ten in number the main focus in the media has surrounded Mr Iain McInnes the Chairman-elect of Portsmouth FC if you will, Mr Stuart Robinson a Property Developer, Mr John Kirk and Mr Christopher Moth who work together in Financial Investment, Mr Ken Terry a Venture Capitalist and Mr John Partridge another Property Developer.

Possibly the key figure in the group and the key to taking over the financially stricken club isn’t Mr McInnes but the property developer Mr Robinson who is looking to buy Portsmouth’s ground Fratton Park on behalf of the Trust. Mr Robinson’s past financial dealings come with a large cautionary tale attached which fans of the club should be wary of indeed.Mr Robinson is listed as holding 31 Directorships in total; 15 open, 11 retired and 5 closed.

 

The Directorship held with Tower Mcashback 1 LLP in which Mr Robinson’s Directorship is listed as being that of an LLP Member. The Tower Mcashback scheme saw a legal case taken up on behalf of the HMRC in regards to a tax avoidance scheme. Last year an appeal was heard by the Supreme Court in which the case was settled in favour of the HMRC. The case centres around four LLPs which were set up to benefit from first year capital allowance in regards to tax relief.

 

The LLPs paid for a software which price was noted as extremely high and the price to be paid back implied the total value of the Mcashback Software was going to be in the region of one billion pounds.LLP1 and 2 wrote off £35 million of expenditure in 2008 showing minimal income (less than £4,000). Their net assets at that point were £1.5 million after recording losses of £14.6 million. The accounts notes detailed raised invoices for software sales of £110 million, but £94 million has been placed in a separate bank account and may be written off at the end of ten years. No asset had been recognised in respect of the contingent proceeds and the company shows no signs of becoming a billion pound software company.

Paying closer attention to Mr Robinson’s business interests in which he holds Directorships, the book value’s of the companies based on 2011 Accounting figures make interesting reading also. Stay Calm Marine LLP has the largest of all shown net assets of any group with the figure reported at £271.020. What really shows up are the net assets for remaining companies which are shown as minus figures and are listed below for reference;

X Properties LLP -£391,710

Mount Developments (Hampshire) Ltd -£4,787,354

Carlton Properties (Wokingham) Ltd -£1,342,730

Hackberry Developments -£112,967

Eton House Estate Ltd -£469,995

In all the total figure of net assets for companies with Mr Robinson as listed having Directorships with that have negative asset’s is -£7,645,608. Those showing a figure in the positive accumulated to a little over £321,000 in comparison. The figure set down for the Trust to buy Fratton Park from Portpin which hold a debenture over the ground is I believe to be £2.5 million

Mr Robinson is alleged to have close links to the two English businessmen caught up in the gigantic Winchester Commodities Copper Scam; Mr Ashley Levett and Mr Charles Vincent more commonly known as ‘Copper Fingers.’ Whilst Mr Levett and Mr Vincent were both cleared of any wrong doing Mr Levett has had previous dealings in sports finance and was owner of Richmond RFC who he had placed into administration.

 

Portsmouth fans will be hoping that no financial assistance is being sort from such alleged associations I’m sure.Mr Moth and Mr Kirk it appears bring experience from both sides of the Atlantic in investment. They hold Directorships in the UK and are listed as being employed in roles within the field in large US firms. In 2010 both individuals were listed as Directors of the MIP Holdings Ltd, MIP Group Ltd and Mondrian Holdings Ltd where moves for Voluntary Dissolution have been requested and no audited accounts have been shown for a period of 23 months or more.

 

In 2010 before the move for Voluntary Dissolution MIP Holdings was reported to have net assets of £94,301,243; MIP Group Ltd £108,874,044 and Mondrian Holdings Ltd a further £121,424,987. The companies are listed as subsidiary groups of Atlantic Value Investment Partnership LP who are based in the tax haven of the Caymen Islands. It would be interesting to find out the reasons why with such large reported net assets in each group, moves were made to have the companies dissolved from trading.

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rallyboy

rallyboy

Posted
Posted

I'm still curious to establish the detail of this life-saving £4M, an amount that slid quietly into the projections under the cover of darkness.

 

If it is a PP bonus then surely they'd have shouted loud about that when it happened? - funding boost success for brave Trust etc.

 

Or are they worried that Chinny didn't know about it?...

Perhaps they thought that all of those businesses that have been shafted might say, 'tell you what, as you have just been given £4M out of the blue, and seeing as you were fully funded prior to that, how about as an act of goodwill to demonstrate that you have changed your spots, you divide this extra cash between the creditors and actually PAY SOME FRICKING DEBTS'.

 

Or maybe they thought that the football creditors would claim it if they knew?

After all, the PPs were designed as a free gift to cover wages when relegated, so it would be nice to pay those wages rather than what they did yesterday which was delay passing on this gift for even longer.

 

Either way it is a payoff from the era of those nasty criminals who started to mismanage straight after the final whistle on cup final day, so no doubt the Trust will decline the windfall as it was earned by the people they want driven out of the club.

 

What's that? Drive the criminals out, let them take their debt and crimes with them, but you'd like to keep the cup, and the PPs? Yeah, that works. :?

 

 

 

Though that little present from the big clubs could wipe a lot of historic debt....but only if the new owner really wanted to shrug off the criminality of recent history.

I suspect they'll spend it on shiny stuff instead.

 

Looks like Saints and the rest of the Premier League has once again baled them out and given them money to clear debt - and they'll keep it, again.

No need for a thank you.

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
Another confused observer here. :? Why are we talking about PPs and in particular the extra £4m as part of the purchase funding to buy the club. Surely this money belongs to the club in administration and not to the prospective buyer.

 

Indeed. As someone pointed out a couple of weeks ago, the Trust using the PPs to buy Pompey is like you or I buying Microsoft with $1 and paying the rest to ourselves once we've got our hands on the company bank account.

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Guan 2.0

Guan 2.0

Posted
Posted
Another confused observer here. :? Why are we talking about PPs and in particular the extra £4m as part of the purchase funding to buy the club. Surely this money belongs to the club in administration and not to the prospective buyer.

 

Indeed. As someone pointed out a couple of weeks ago, the Trust using the PPs to buy Pompey is like you or I buying Microsoft with $1 and paying the rest to ourselves once we've got our hands on the company bank account.

 

Maybe some better connected peeps should club contact the aforementioned tax groups, oppo councillors from yesterday, Hassan, etc with such concerns?

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Winchester Red

Winchester Red

Posted
Posted (edited)

I don't think the PDT are using the extra £4m, or in fact any of the parachute payments, to buy the club. They're using the money in the club (inc the £4m) to pay the debts 'of the club'.

 

It's a case of distinguishing between the money to buy the assets of the club (pledges, pcc loan, hnw loans, etc) and the money to pay the debts (parachute payments and f*ck all else)

 

They could borrow money secured against the assets of the club to buy it like you would use a mortgage to buy a house (Manure), but they can't use the assets of the club or cash within the bank account of the club (that don't belong to them) to buy the club. It's a fine balance but I guess it's confusing for some because all the +'s and all the -'s keep getting lumped together by people

 

They can use some of their money to pay the debt, but they can't use the clubs money to buy the club

 

Or am I wrong?

Edited by Winchester Red
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saint si

saint si

Posted
Posted
Indeed. As someone pointed out a couple of weeks ago, the Trust using the PPs to buy Pompey is like you or I buying Microsoft with $1 and paying the rest to ourselves once we've got our hands on the company bank account.

 

Yes, it would be a leveraged buyout.

 

Difference is Microsoft actually has a viable business plan beyond the next 6 months ...

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