Damion Downs (Rumour)

[Nolan]

8 minutes ago, coalman said:

How did this turn into a rumour overnight. Has MLG un-scooped himself?

It is not a rumour.

 

[Weston Super Saint]

1 minute ago, coalman said:

We do seem to have managed the incredible feat of making our striking options worse every transfer window for several years now 😢

Despite acknowledging the number one priority is to get a proven goalscorer in!

[trousers]

Given our financial clout in the championship, our aim this summer should be to ensure that our strike force is amongst the best in the division, if not the best. If, when the transfer window ends, we're not in that position, then our transfer policy will have failed. In the immortal words of Huey Lewis: "It's as simple as that".

As always, time will tell.

Edited 6 hours ago by trousers

[Fabrice29]

15 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I'm not confident we won't sell at least Armstrong but possibly Archer as well. If we do then that removed those options so fingers crossed we will get experience in at that point. 

We should be selling Armstrong and BBD at least. If Archer goes too we’d have to replace yes. Idea that it has to be experienced seems daft to me, especially considering we signed plenty of that last summer and it rarely worked/works but that can be a debate for when it comes to it.

[Nolan]

11 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Despite acknowledging the number one priority is to get a proven goalscorer in!

	Played	Goals	Assists
Cameron Archer	40	18	7
Adam Armstrong	248	80	33
Ben Brereton	230	57	23

 

That's solely in the Championship. we have proven Championship strikers. What we dont have is a tall striker who positions himself well in the box. and Downs is 3inches taller than Diaz.

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, Fabrice29 said:

We should be selling Armstrong and BBD at least. If Archer goes too we’d have to replace yes. Idea that it has to be experienced seems daft to me, especially considering we signed plenty of that last summer and it rarely worked/works but that can be a debate for when it comes to it.

It doesn't have to be but my preference would be for an attacking signing with a track record of performance in the championship. We didn't buy anyone last season with much success in the prem in our system. 

[Fabrice29]

6 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

It doesn't have to be but my preference would be for an attacking signing with a track record of performance in the championship. We didn't buy anyone last season with much success in the prem in our system. 

We signed a whole bunch of players with PL experience. Cornet, Fraser, Ramsdale, Taylor, BBD, Archer and Lallana. They all have PL track records. Including quite a lot of relegations btw but individually they have produced in the PL. That’s why calling for track records on its own is daft imo. It doesn’t actually get you anything in the long run. But if track records of the Championship is what you want then I’d point you in the direction of our squad already tbh. But it’s not a shiny new signing so it doesn’t count I suppose. 

Edited 6 hours ago by Fabrice29

[hypochondriac]

15 minutes ago, trousers said:

Given our financial clout in the championship, our aim this summer should be to ensure that our strike force is amongst the best in the division, if not the best. If, when the transfer window ends, we're not in that position, then our transfer policy will have failed. In the immortal words of Huey Lewis: "It's as simple as that".

As always, time will tell.

Exactly this. This signing could be a really good one but it really depends who else we get in attack. The suspicion would be that this is our main striker signing and if that is the case then most analysis seems to suggest he is a promising youngster with potential. That being the case, I'm not sure about it. 

[hypochondriac]

2 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

We signed a whole bunch of players with PL experience. Cornet, Fraser, Ramsdale, Taylor, BBD, Archer and Lallana. They all have PL track records. Including quite a lot of relegations btw but individually they have produced in the PL. That’s why calling for track records on its own is daft imo. It doesn’t actually get you anything in the long run. But if track records of the Championship is what you want then I’d point you in the direction of our squad already tbh. But it’s not a shiny new signing so it doesn’t count I suppose. 

I didn't say experience, I said a track record of performance. Ramsdale did and he was decent. The likes of THB and Downes both had recent records in the championship of performing well and were two of our best players last time out. I'd like to see us supplement those players - assuming we don't sell them - with players of similar recent championship performance in attacking areas in order to refresh some of the lineup we currently have (and my feeling is that Archer will move on alongside maybe bbd and Armstrong). You are free to disagree but it doesn't make my opinion wrong. 

[Nolan]

Admittedly CHATGPT is limited to what information has gone in, as to what will come out. But from the information and stats that it has:

🧩 How Damion Downs Stands Out

🧱 1. Physical Profile + Coordination

• Tallest of the group at 192 cm, stronger aerial presence than Brereton or Archer, but more mobile than Stewart.

• Offers a true target-man presence but with better mobility and coordination than your typical big No. 9.

---

⚙️ 2. Modern Pressing Striker Potential

• Will Still wants pressing forwards. Downs comes from a Bundesliga system where pressing is embedded from youth levels.

• Unlike Stewart (slow) or Archer (not physically dominant), Downs can press, occupy defenders, and be the out-ball under pressure.

---

🔄 3. Link-Up and Hold-Up Mix

• Unlike Armstrong (who spins in behind) or Brereton Díaz (who cuts in from wide), Downs is comfortable:

  • Receiving with back to goal

  • Playing one-touch layoffs

  • Bringing midfielders into play

---

🎯 4. Ceiling and Tactical Versatility

• At only 20, Downs could be developed into a complete forward:

  • A pressing spearhead ✅

  • A crossing target ✅

  • A hold-up pivot ✅

  • A transitional release valve ✅

Southampton doesn’t currently have a striker who combines all of those qualities in one.

---

🔚 Summary: Why Downs Adds a Unique Dimension

• Armstrong is a poacher.

• Stewart is a classic big man.

• Archer is a mobile finisher.

• Brereton Díaz is a wide forward with power.

🆕 Downs offers something different:

A tall, tactically smart, press-capable striker who can grow into a complete No. 9—a profile Will Still hasn’t had yet.

[austsaint]

18 minutes ago, trousers said:

Given our financial clout in the championship, our aim this summer should be to ensure that our strike force is amongst the best in the division, if not the best. If, when the transfer window ends, we're not in that position, then our transfer policy will have failed. In the immortal words of Huey Lewis: "It's as simple as that".

As always, time will tell.

You’re right.  I see the argument for only one of Archer or Armstrong, although I’d be happy to keep both.   If it’s one or the other, I choose Archer; with the right supply ( not the likes of Will Smallbone) he can have an outstanding season.   Stewart may be handy if he stays fit, but that can’t be relied upon.   Despite BBD’s record in the Championship he’s got an awful record with us and I’d be happy to see him go.   That leaves the possibility of Downs  as the up and coming central striker and the need for one other…..and it has to be a “star quality” signing at Championship level.      We need a star factor strike force to achieve what’s needed and wanted.  Automatic return to PL.

[hypochondriac]

24 minutes ago, Nolan said:

Admittedly CHATGPT is limited to what information has gone in, as to what will come out. But from the information and stats that it has:

🧩 How Damion Downs Stands Out

🧱 1. Physical Profile + Coordination

• Tallest of the group at 192 cm, stronger aerial presence than Brereton or Archer, but more mobile than Stewart.

• Offers a true target-man presence but with better mobility and coordination than your typical big No. 9.

---

⚙️ 2. Modern Pressing Striker Potential

• Will Still wants pressing forwards. Downs comes from a Bundesliga system where pressing is embedded from youth levels.

• Unlike Stewart (slow) or Archer (not physically dominant), Downs can press, occupy defenders, and be the out-ball under pressure.

---

🔄 3. Link-Up and Hold-Up Mix

• Unlike Armstrong (who spins in behind) or Brereton Díaz (who cuts in from wide), Downs is comfortable:

  • Receiving with back to goal

  • Playing one-touch layoffs

  • Bringing midfielders into play

---

🎯 4. Ceiling and Tactical Versatility

• At only 20, Downs could be developed into a complete forward:

  • A pressing spearhead ✅

  • A crossing target ✅

  • A hold-up pivot ✅

  • A transitional release valve ✅

Southampton doesn’t currently have a striker who combines all of those qualities in one.

---

🔚 Summary: Why Downs Adds a Unique Dimension

• Armstrong is a poacher.

• Stewart is a classic big man.

• Archer is a mobile finisher.

• Brereton Díaz is a wide forward with power.

🆕 Downs offers something different:

A tall, tactically smart, press-capable striker who can grow into a complete No. 9—a profile Will Still hasn’t had yet.

Is he a superior aerial presence? Most analysis I have read suggests he is tall but a bit lightweight at present and loses more of his aerial duels than he should. 

Edited 5 hours ago by hypochondriac

[hypochondriac]

16 minutes ago, austsaint said:

You’re right.  I see the argument for only one of Archer or Armstrong, although I’d be happy to keep both.   If it’s one or the other, I choose Archer; with the right supply ( not the likes of Will Smallbone) he can have an outstanding season.   Stewart may be handy if he stays fit, but that can’t be relied upon.   Despite BBD’s record in the Championship he’s got an awful record with us and I’d be happy to see him go.   That leaves the possibility of Downs  as the up and coming central striker and the need for one other…..and it has to be a “star quality” signing at Championship level.      We need a star factor strike force to achieve what’s needed and wanted.  Automatic return to PL.

This. Not sure how anyone could argue tbh. 

[AlexLaw76]

With Downs, with the new CB, more of the same with Sports Republic

 

[Nolan]

12 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

Is he a superior aerial presence? Most analysis I have read suggests he is tall but a bit lightweight at present and loses more of his aerial duels than he should. 

its worth noting that Downs has more Aerial duels per game than your average striker.

but going back to ChatGPT to analyse the details (and again I'll enter the Data in /  Data out AI caveat)

1. Aerial Duel Win % Doesn’t Tell the Whole Story

• The win percentage is a ratio of duels won versus duels contested, but it doesn’t measure how often a player positions himself to influence the game in the air without necessarily winning the duel outright.

• Downs may choose his aerial battles smartly—sometimes not contesting a 50/50 header if a teammate is better placed, which lowers his personal duel count but benefits the team overall.

2. Quality Over Quantity

• Even if he wins “only” 46% of his aerial duels, the timing and impact of those wins matter more.

• For example, winning a critical flick-on or a clearance in a dangerous area has far more value than simply winning a random aerial duel in midfield.

3. Role and Tactical Usage

• Downs is not just contesting every aerial ball blindly; his role as a target man and pressing striker means he uses aerial skills strategically.

• His ability to link up play with headers or create space by attracting defenders doesn’t necessarily show up in duel stats but still makes him valuable in the air.

4. Physicality and Mobility Enhance Impact

• His size and mobility allow him to dominate key moments even if his duel win rate isn’t elite.

• He might lose some duels in congested situations but still shape the game by disrupting marking schemes and creating second chances.

5. Development Curve

• At only 20, Downs is still growing physically and tactically.

• His aerial duel win percentage is likely to improve as he gains experience, refines timing, and gets stronger.

---

Bottom line:

The 46% aerial duel win rate is decent, but the true measure of Downs’ aerial presence lies in how he uses his physicality, timing, and positioning to influence the game beyond just raw stats.

So no, his aerial duel stats don’t counter his reputation — they complement a broader picture of a smart, effective, and evolving aerial threat.

[goodymatt]

23 minutes ago, austsaint said:

You’re right.  I see the argument for only one of Archer or Armstrong, although I’d be happy to keep both.   If it’s one or the other, I choose Archer; with the right supply ( not the likes of Will Smallbone) he can have an outstanding season.   Stewart may be handy if he stays fit, but that can’t be relied upon.   Despite BBD’s record in the Championship he’s got an awful record with us and I’d be happy to see him go.   That leaves the possibility of Downs  as the up and coming central striker and the need for one other…..and it has to be a “star quality” signing at Championship level.      We need a star factor strike force to achieve what’s needed and wanted.  Automatic return to PL.

So how are we defining star quality then? Is it goal contributions? If so Armstrong had the most in Europe last time out in the championship. I’m all for improving the forward line, especially given how blunt it was at PL level, but what is the criteria for doing so? We have 3 players, 4 including Stewart’s small sample size (but has fitness concerns) that have very good numbers at this level. What we are missing is the attributes that Downs seemingly has. The trouble we have is to get a Downs that also has a record in the championship scoring goals like Armstrong, is a player we couldn’t attract or likely afford. Some posters have suggested if we were signing a striker that has Armstrong’s record, we would be saying that’s the right type of move to get us promoted. 

It’s hard to improve our striking options at this level without gambling and hoping it turns out well. With that in mind I would like to keep Armstrong and Archer around and compliment with Downs and Stewart. If we play 5-3-2 for example, the striker pairing will need a hold up, strong link player and  finisher. With those 4 I think it’s a good balance of 2 players per position. If we sell any, we will replace but I doubt we get a player with a better championship record.

The ‘star quality’ forward (productive at PL level) will likely have to wait until we are promoted. I think that is the reality. You’re not signing a proven player like Mitrovic in the championship, you’d have to get relegated with him and keep hold of him as Fulham did.

[hypochondriac]

That Chatgpt output is weird. Losing more aerial duels than he wins at his height isn't decent and it seems it has speculated what Downs may do rather than what he has actually done so I'd question it. The main thing is that he is young and still growing so may develop strength and increase his aerial presence. My hope is that he can do that this year though as we really don't have time for him to ease into things if we want to be successful this season.

[hypochondriac]

14 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

With Downs, with the new CB, more of the same with Sports Republic

 

That could well be true but I'm hoping Spors knows what he is doing. We will soon find out. 

[saintant]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

It doesn't have to be but my preference would be for an attacking signing with a track record of performance in the championship. We didn't buy anyone last season with much success in the prem in our system. 

Maybe that guy Adam Armstrong is available - he seems to score plenty of goals in the Championship.

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, saintant said:

Maybe that guy Adam Armstrong is available - he seems to score plenty of goals in the Championship.

I'm not sure if he will have the correct level of motivation for us given he's failed for us so many times in the prem now and we are playing a new system. It may be time to get some money for him and look to refresh our attacking lineup. If we do keep Armstrong and Archer though then maybe alongside Stewart and Downs that will be sufficient.

[saintant]

Just now, hypochondriac said:

I'm not sure if he will have the correct level of motivation for us given he's failed for us so many times in the prem now and we are playing a new system. It may be time to get some money for him and look to refresh our attacking lineup. If we do keep Armstrong and Archer though then maybe alongside Stewart and Downs that will be sufficient.

We are not playing in the Premier league so his failings there are not really relevant. If AA is honest with himself he knows without being told that his ceiling is the Championship. Not sure what motivation he needs as surely he wants to be the best he can be at the highest level attainable for his skill set ie the Championship. He should be in the squad for this season because, if we sell him, it will likely be to a rival in the division which would be slightly bonkers. How many strikers have a better goal-scoring record than AA in the Championship?

[gio1saints]

We have lost two forwards- KS and TP.
 

And three of the current forwards we have were playing elsewhere last season ( SE, BBD and AA).

And RS, RF and CA may as well have been on loan for all the minutes they played. 

DD, for all his critics above, does seem to have characteristics missing or that we could benefit from in this squad. Height speed and strength basically. Breakthrough USA Full International. It’s a no brainier buy for me if it’s £8m. Plenty upside. Moderate downside. 
 

NB : caveat : I do not expect all of AA, BBD, SE and CA to be with us for start of season. So, If one or two go I’d want a proven goals scoring  (as they were/are) replacement - not a project. There’s no guarantee they will go because of their high wages relative to our league - so assuming they do not get shifted adding DD to the mix makes sense and is not a bad idea either way. 

Edited 4 hours ago by gio1saints

[hypochondriac]

12 minutes ago, saintant said:

We are not playing in the Premier league so his failings there are not really relevant. If AA is honest with himself he knows without being told that his ceiling is the Championship. Not sure what motivation he needs as surely he wants to be the best he can be at the highest level attainable for his skill set ie the Championship. He should be in the squad for this season because, if we sell him, it will likely be to a rival in the division which would be slightly bonkers. How many strikers have a better goal-scoring record than AA in the Championship?

I'd probably keep him but I can absolutely see the reasoning if we decide not to. 

[Nolan]

39 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

That Chatgpt output is weird. Losing more aerial duels than he wins at his height isn't decent and it seems it has speculated what Downs may do rather than what he has actually done so I'd question it. The main thing is that he is young and still growing so may develop strength and increase his aerial presence. My hope is that he can do that this year though as we really don't have time for him to ease into things if we want to be successful this season.

say a tall striker has 46% aerial duels won and that a shorter striker has 50% aerial duels won.

the 50% choice looks better, right?

but what if the tall strike had 100 aerial chances in 10 matches

and the shorter striker had 80 aerial chances in 10 matches.

apply the percentages tall striker has won 46 aerial wins in 10 matches and shorter striker has 40 aerial wins in 10 matches.

 

Edited 4 hours ago by Nolan

[austsaint]

27 minutes ago, goodymatt said:

So how are we defining star quality then? Is it goal contributions? If so Armstrong had the most in Europe last time out in the championship. I’m all for improving the forward line, especially given how blunt it was at PL level, but what is the criteria for doing so? We have 3 players, 4 including Stewart’s small sample size (but has fitness concerns) that have very good numbers at this level. What we are missing is the attributes that Downs seemingly has. The trouble we have is to get a Downs that also has a record in the championship scoring goals like Armstrong, is a player we couldn’t attract or likely afford. Some posters have suggested if we were signing a striker that has Armstrong’s record, we would be saying that’s the right type of move to get us promoted. 

It’s hard to improve our striking options at this level without gambling and hoping it turns out well. With that in mind I would like to keep Armstrong and Archer around and compliment with Downs and Stewart. If we play 5-3-2 for example, the striker pairing will need a hold up, strong link player and  finisher. With those 4 I think it’s a good balance of 2 players per position. If we sell any, we will replace but I doubt we get a player with a better championship record.

The ‘star quality’ forward (productive at PL level) will likely have to wait until we are promoted. I think that is the reality. You’re not signing a proven player like Mitrovic in the championship, you’d have to get relegated with him and keep hold of him as Fulham did.

You make many good points.  I’d be very happy to see both Armstrong and Archer stay.   I see a big risk though in going in to the new season with a strike force of AA, CA, Downs and Stewart.   What if Downs doesn’t make the grade or takes time to adapt and Stewart succumbs to another injury?  I think we need another striker…..sure a Mitrovic or a Toney is unlikely but hopefully Spors has knowledge of a gettable target who is likely to both complement and improve what we already have.   

[Miltonaggro]

43 minutes ago, goodymatt said:

So how are we defining star quality then? Is it goal contributions? If so Armstrong had the most in Europe last time out in the championship. I’m all for improving the forward line, especially given how blunt it was at PL level, but what is the criteria for doing so? We have 3 players, 4 including Stewart’s small sample size (but has fitness concerns) that have very good numbers at this level. What we are missing is the attributes that Downs seemingly has. The trouble we have is to get a Downs that also has a record in the championship scoring goals like Armstrong, is a player we couldn’t attract or likely afford. Some posters have suggested if we were signing a striker that has Armstrong’s record, we would be saying that’s the right type of move to get us promoted. 

It’s hard to improve our striking options at this level without gambling and hoping it turns out well. With that in mind I would like to keep Armstrong and Archer around and compliment with Downs and Stewart. If we play 5-3-2 for example, the striker pairing will need a hold up, strong link player and  finisher. With those 4 I think it’s a good balance of 2 players per position. If we sell any, we will replace but I doubt we get a player with a better championship record.

The ‘star quality’ forward (productive at PL level) will likely have to wait until we are promoted. I think that is the reality. You’re not signing a proven player like Mitrovic in the championship, you’d have to get relegated with him and keep hold of him as Fulham did.

Good reflective post.

[Turkish]

15 minutes ago, Nolan said:

say a tall striker has 46% aerial duels won and that a shorter striker has 50% aerial duels won.

the 50% choice looks better, right?

but what if the tall strike had 100 aerial chances in 10 matches

and the shorter striker had 80 aerial chances in 10 matches.

apply the percentages tall striker has won 46 aerial wins in 10 matches and shorter striker has 40 aerial wins in 10 matches.

 

Aerial Duals FFS

 

[saintant]

17 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I'd probably keep him but I can absolutely see the reasoning if we decide not to. 

Danger is, if we sell him, it will likely be to a Championship rival. If he scores a hatful of goals for them we'll be left with plenty of egg on our chops.

[Fabrice29]

1 hour ago, hypochondriac said:

I didn't say experience, I said a track record of performance. Ramsdale did and he was decent. The likes of THB and Downes both had recent records in the championship of performing well and were two of our best players last time out. I'd like to see us supplement those players - assuming we don't sell them - with players of similar recent championship performance in attacking areas in order to refresh some of the lineup we currently have (and my feeling is that Archer will move on alongside maybe bbd and Armstrong). You are free to disagree but it doesn't make my opinion wrong. 

Not wrong but a) you did say experienced (I cba to quote it but your final post on the previous page) and B) an experienced, championship player with a track record in this league is going to be someone like Armstrong who has failed at a higher level or someone who isn’t wanted by a PL side if we’re signing him. I’m not sure that’s progressive and we’ll be in exactly the same situation next season as we were last season in that instance. Signing players with potential is not a bad thing, you’re aiming for them to progress with you if we go up. If you could name some names with the Championship proven record that would sign for us and won’t leave us in a position of needing to strengthen if we go up then I’d be happy to listen. I think I recall you name dropping a league one striker last week. 

Edited 4 hours ago by Fabrice29

[trousers]

Repeating myself but keep it simple folks...

By the end of the window, is our strike force: 

(a) as strong as, or stronger than, our promotion rivals?

(b) weaker than our promotion rivals?

 

Successful window = (a)

Unsuccessful window = (b)

 

 

Edited 4 hours ago by trousers

[hypochondriac]

24 minutes ago, Nolan said:

say a tall striker has 46% aerial duels won and that a shorter striker has 50% aerial duels won.

the 50% choice looks better, right?

but what if the tall strike had 100 aerial chances in 10 matches

and the shorter striker had 80 aerial chances in 10 matches.

apply the percentages tall striker has won 46 aerial wins in 10 matches and shorter striker has 40 aerial wins in 10 matches.

 

I was mostly going on the koln fan forum and an article I read that he was a bit lightweight and lost a surprising amount of aerial battles for his height. That's probably a bit more accurate than chatgpt even though it's an interesting thing to read. 

[danjosaint]

8 minutes ago, saintant said:

Danger is, if we sell him, it will likely be to a Championship rival. If he scores a hatful of goals for them we'll be left with plenty of egg on our chops.

Like he did for west brom

 

[hypochondriac]

9 minutes ago, saintant said:

Danger is, if we sell him, it will likely be to a Championship rival. If he scores a hatful of goals for them we'll be left with plenty of egg on our chops.

If we sell him it will probably be because he wants to leave or we don't think he fits our new style of play. Given that Still will likely play with proper wingers, I'm not sure where he fits in personally even though I'd probably keep him but he isn't a guaranteed starter. 

[revolution saint]

9 minutes ago, trousers said:

Repeating myself but keep it simple folks...

By the end of the window, is our strike force: 

(a) as strong as, or stronger than, our promotion rivals?

(b) weaker than our promotion rivals?

 

Successful window = (a)

Unsuccessful window = (b)

 

 

And you won't know any of that until the end of the season.

[Doctoroncall]

11 minutes ago, revolution saint said:

And you won't know any of that until the end of the season.

All part of a jigsaw puzzle putting together the team, just hope the club commits rather than compromises on targets. 
 

Also hoping that we can keep the decent talent if the focus is YHPWP this window. Big expectations on Still to create a promotion chasing squad as well if this is the direction the club are taking. 

[goodymatt]

Richard Kone is an interesting one. PL clubs have shown interest and the price is looking like double the Downs fee. No guarantee he steps up from league one either, but the expectation is he would. I’m sure Bundesliga 2 is a stronger league than our league one. Not everyone will do a Rickie Lambert, so although signing Kone would most likely be better received, it would absolutely still be a risk. 

[revolution saint]

14 minutes ago, goodymatt said:

Richard Kone is an interesting one. PL clubs have shown interest and the price is looking like double the Downs fee. No guarantee he steps up from league one either, but the expectation is he would. I’m sure Bundesliga 2 is a stronger league than our league one. Not everyone will do a Rickie Lambert, so although signing Kone would most likely be better received, it would absolutely still be a risk. 

Yep, just goes to show how difficult it is to judge players and also how expensive strikers with those kind of attributes are.  I watched the two play off games against Charlton and specifically paid attention to Kone and wasn't that impressed.  Both games were god awful with very little quality from either side so I won't say he's bad, just that on those showings he didn't catch the eye much.

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, Doctoroncall said:

All part of a jigsaw puzzle putting together the team,

Somehow, we always manage to lose the corner pieces.

[trousers]

1 hour ago, revolution saint said:

And you won't know any of that until the end of the season.

Yep, fair point.... I agree that any judgement before then would have an element of subjectivity about it. 

[Saint Fan CaM]

I reckon the chances are that Stewart will start and Downs will come on for the last 15 minutes to run at tired legs. What do you think? 😉

[gio1saints]

1 minute ago, Saint Fan CaM said:

I reckon the chances are that Stewart will start and Downs will come on for the last 15 minutes to run at tired legs. What do you think? 😉

I think Tired Legs got sold by Wrexham so he won’t be there on opening day. Bit of a shame if you ask me as the tussle Armstrong v Tired Legs has got tabloid back page news written all over it..

[gecko]

2 hours ago, revolution saint said:

And you won't know any of that until the end of the season.

I'd just written out the exact same thing, but longer, without checking the replies.

I like the simplicity of the original suggestion, but there's no way to know how these guys will perform until they actually start playing. So it's all just a guess for me

Would be nice to see someone close to a dead certainty for goals coming in - like we've not really had since Lambert joined - but I don't see that happening, and since we're apparently shopping in the unknown section for now, I suspect "on paper" most of us will end up thinking we look worse than our rivals.

[hypochondriac]

2 hours ago, revolution saint said:

And you won't know any of that until the end of the season.

Not sure that's true if we end up where Luton were after 20 games! 

[Saint86]

3 hours ago, trousers said:

Repeating myself but keep it simple folks...

By the end of the window, is our strike force: 

(a) as strong as, or stronger than, our promotion rivals?

(b) weaker than our promotion rivals?

 

Successful window = (a)

Unsuccessful window = (b)

 

 

You won't know how good new signings are by the end of the window 🙃... Remember when people were happy with BBD and Sugawara 😄

[Saint86]

15 hours ago, Gloucester Saint said:

There’s logic in what you are saying but what I’m trying to get my head around is why the player would give up the German top flight to be a squad player in the English second. 

Reading about him and thinking about it the context of how we're likely to play, I think we're signing him with the hope he'll be the starting CF for the team by the 2nd half of the season - which ties in with why he may be tempted to move here.

[suewhistle]

I don't know why I come on this forum sometimes! There are the perpetual optimists, the people who are never happy, and then there's Trousers. 🙂

We could pay a lot for someone who doesn't produce, not much for someone who does, or vice-versa, which is my bon mot for the day.. But were the Mbeumos and Toneys of this world the finished article before they stepped up? Even Lambert, who seemed to benefit by being in a more professional environment and started taking himself and his fitness more seriously?

 

Some of our failures you could see why we took a gamble: Boufal and Mara for instance, as they had some basic attributes that could be developed. Carillo, TP and Brereton-Diaz there really wasn't. Stewart another category where you can see he's a footballer (unlike TP) but the risk in signing him was really misjudged.

I'm now going to get my padded cycling shorts and go and join Trousers on the fence until the window is closed..

 

[revolution saint]

40 minutes ago, gecko said:

I'd just written out the exact same thing, but longer, without checking the replies.

I like the simplicity of the original suggestion, but there's no way to know how these guys will perform until they actually start playing. So it's all just a guess for me

Would be nice to see someone close to a dead certainty for goals coming in - like we've not really had since Lambert joined - but I don't see that happening, and since we're apparently shopping in the unknown section for now, I suspect "on paper" most of us will end up thinking we look worse than our rivals.

Yeah, and you can actually make a case that another striker isn't a particular priority and we can make do with what we already have.  Archer, Armstrong, Stewart and BBD have all had decent spells in the championship to some extent.  Personally I'd like someone tall, rangy, decent pace and good mobility but I don't think we'll go mental on a big money signing so someone like Downs fits the bill.  No idea if he'll be a success or not but the idea is decent and we'll judge the reality if he signs.  A more established player would still come with an element of uncertainty but for different reasons.

[Chez]

1 hour ago, revolution saint said:

Yep, just goes to show how difficult it is to judge players and also how expensive strikers with those kind of attributes are.  I watched the two play off games against Charlton and specifically paid attention to Kone and wasn't that impressed.  Both games were god awful with very little quality from either side so I won't say he's bad, just that on those showings he didn't catch the eye much.

I also watched the first game and he was in Gillesphey and Jones' pocket. He did have a very good season though. I wonder how hard our scouts have been in focusing on league 1 though.

[S-Clarke]

This one is clearly a Spors driven signing, him and Quarshie have both been targeted and moved on pretty quickly by Spors and the new Chief Scout. Our new Chief Scout has obviously got some knowledge of both of these, especially Quarshie as he was at Hoffenheim 

Yep, they're young, somewhat unknown and we've all been here before so I get the apprehension. I think we'll still target some more proven players though, we'd be nuts not to. The problem comes when your strategy is based on just young and up and coming, as we've all seen.