Mallagroth Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I give him credit for making two good manager appointments and also made some good signings. He also made a reckless manager sacking, signed players for £20m who have made little impact, alienated the press, oversaw the complete shambles that is hospitality / catering / box office, lost numerous staff who couldn't work with him and got the club sued by suppliers. Overall, about average. True this is a very good list of his shortcomings, and is very relevant to the idea being thrown around that the Liebherrs want to reign him somewhat. But still can't see how he hasn't had more influence on Saints current state than Adkins and definitely more than Pardew when he employed them both to contribute to our success in greater and lesser amounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 My concern is how NC's departure would affect the team. Both MP and many of the players have bought into NC's vision - a vision which may now not come to fruition. I wouldn't blame MP or the palyers who signed recent long term deals if they feel shafted if the direction of the club changes significantly from what was promised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shirleysfc Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I think everything will turn out fine Good to hear Nicola Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.comsaint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Really? What a quaint old world you live in. Even twenty-five years ago I knew of guys who received new company cars the day they were made redundant. People like Cortese have no sentiment in their bodies but I can live with that as long as he's the best at what he does and he is probably. Nothing to do with living within a "quaint old world". Everything to do with decency... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Billy Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I wonder if the purchase of Ramirez for very big bucks and his subsequent failure to impress has caused any disharmony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I wonder if the purchase of Ramirez for very big bucks and his subsequent failure to impress has caused any disharmony. There would be issues at every club in the country if that were true (relatively speaking) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 (edited) It would take a love for the Club and a passion for football, to take the "twist" option and I don't think there is a single poster who has a clue where the family or trustees affections lie. In the cold light of day, the options for the trust could be as simple swap the club for 100 million in its coffers or keep the club and handover 50 million. Of course it isn't that black and white, but you get the gist. Don't have a clue? I think it's a fair guess that they don't have a love for the club don't you? Edited 14 May, 2013 by Sour Mash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 (edited) We ignoring the money he has put into infrastructure ? Into the scouting network and medics/sport science department ? The work I KNOW is going on behind the scenes to improve the way we operate as a club in a footballing sense ? All of those are more meaningful to me as a football supporter first and foremost, youget that bit right then we can look upon other areas of the club. Of tgat 20m on players the only one I personally see as afailure is Mayuka aswell. You can rewrite history but we are not f*cking HMV, I dont look at Utd and say wow, look at their anazing hospitallity and free parking. I look st their success as a club. We all laughed at Lowes branded dreams of the saint radio station and world class catering, the man could not achieve success on the field and that was his downfall. I really do get bemused at times to what is more important to the fans, I assume the football club as a sporting entity is just a secondary distraction to you then tim ? As you seem to have a higher affiliation to the intricate runnings of the behind the scenes and mundane. Odd post. Cortese is the subject of this thread, the one you have also commented on, and Cortese's job is managing the organisation behind the scenes. Go on on the football threads and you'll find my and other people's comments are more about football. Yours too probably. Yes of course the Staplewood development is important and welcome - but its a no brainer. Lowe saw we needed a top academy in order to produce talent we couldn't afford on the open market, that really was visionary at the time. Upgrading facilities to current mid prem standards again after their decline during admin using money gifted by the owner, not so much. I think you are making the mistake of confusing genuine ability to add value (rare and difficult) with the kudos extracted from spending lots of other peoples money (easier and more common). On a lot of the important performance metrics for his job - running the organisation well - he has performed poorly. Edited 14 May, 2013 by buctootim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint86 Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Lol@u saint86. It doesn't say Nicola paid for the club. He bought the club on behalf of Markus. He used Markus' money to buy it but he bought it. Hypo, it clearly states the opposite in the quote given. I know who bought the club. I am commenting that this (original version) well written, checked and reliable article has a massive error in it. Read my post before being an egit would you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Don't have a clue? I think it's a fair guess that they guess that they don't have a love for the club don't you? how do you know no one even mentioned a 'trust' until this story broke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Well one thing's for sure. If NC does go - I'm hopeful that he'd have some say/input/advice to the Liebherrs as regards who to sell to? Personally I think its more likely that Cortese is not planning to leave. He seems to be trying to engineer s situation where he remains in charge but with a different backer. Its clear to me that the Liebherr family are not interested in SFC as Markus was, and NC is finding it difficult to work with a disinterested owner backing him. He has said before that there are other major investors ready if needed, methinks this is a way of forcing the Liebherr's hands to get out with the least possible disruption and let someone in who genuinely is interested in moving forward. Choice between Cortese and Liebherr family, I will take the former every single day of the week, and there is no slight on Markus by saying that. That empty seat nexy to NC needs to be filled with someone with their heart (and pocket) in the project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Hypo, it clearly states the opposite in the quote given. I know who bought the club. I am commenting that this (original version) well written, checked and reliable article has a massive error in it. Read my post before being an egit would you. I think you need to read/understand it again. It's clearly not an error in the article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 how do you know no one even mentioned a 'trust' until this story broke Who has suggested they know? Do you know what "clue" means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Who has suggested they know? Do you know what "clue" means? you suggested they dont Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Odd post. Cortese is the subject of this thread, you know the one you have commented on - and Cortese's job is managing the organisation behind the scenes. Go on on the football threads and you'll find my comments are more about football. Yes of course the Staplewood development is important and welcome - but its a no brainer. Lowe saw we needed a top academy in order to produce talent we couldn't afford on the open market, that really was visionary. Upgrading facilities to current mid prem standards again after their decline during admin using money gifted by the owner, not so much. I think you are making the mistake of confusing genuine ability (rare and difficult) with the kudos extracted from spending lots of other peoples money (easier and more common). On a lot of the important performance metrics for his job - running the organisation well - he has performed poorly. You're either very stupid or on a wind up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 You're either very stupid or on a wind up. its an incredible opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Havent we got a game this wekend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 you suggested they dont Don't what? Any chance of using full sentences? It would be a bit easier to understand your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjwills Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 The bigger concern is that if Cortese leave, another club will take him on as a Chairman (probably in Italy), and he will come back trying to cherry pick the backbone of our team, especially if his replacement is under orders to maximise profit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Don't what? Any chance of using full sentences? It would be a bit easier to understand your point. you said, no one has a clue. Then said, it is fair to say they dont have the love for us. which is it? sorry, on phone hence short replies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint86 Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 It's behind a paywall, and at the bottom of this article, http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/sport/football/article3763094.ece It reads: Southampton should be feeling optimistic. Yesterday’s point away to Sunderland effectively removed the threat of relegation and performances since the appointment of Mauricio Pochettino as manager in January have pointed to good days ahead. However, there are issues in the boardroom. Nicola Cortese, the executive chairman, and the trust that owns the club have been unable to reach an agreement to secure the 44-year-old’s future at the club for next season. Cortese has driven Southampton’s revival from League One to the Premier League since he bought the club for Markus Liebherr, the late Swiss industrialist, four years ago. Cortese remade the club in his own image, making a few enemies but winning admiration from other top-flight owners. If he goes this summer, it would leave a gaping hole that Southampton would find hard to fill. Wtf, that did not happen - post 5 for reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 its an incredible opinion. It was an average job Cortese has done in his post before. Been downgraded to poor now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 you said, no one has a clue. Then said, it is fair to say they dont have the love for us. which is it? sorry, on phone hence short replies I think you need to read the thread again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Odd post. Cortese is the subject of this thread, you know the one you have commented on - and Cortese's job is managing the organisation behind the scenes. Go on on the football threads and you'll find my comments are more about football. Yes of course the Staplewood development is important and welcome - but its a no brainer. Lowe saw we needed a top academy in order to produce talent we couldn't afford on the open market, that really was visionary. Upgrading facilities to current mid prem standards again after their decline during admin using money gifted by the owner, not so much. I think you are making the mistake of confusing genuine ability (rare and difficult) with the kudos extracted from spending lots of other peoples money (easier and more common). On a lot of the important performance metrics for his job - running the organisation well - he has performed poorly. I agree FWIW that I would like Saints Fc to be a more family oriented and welcoming all round entity, however I would much rather have a successful football club, playing decent football in the PL. We have that, I can get a match ticket at around average prices, food is available (never really eaten in the stadium) everything else is much of a muchness. The fact is he may be using anothers cash but he still had to deliver and has done that under the target date that he put down, as has been said before, many clubs have tried to spend a lot and failed. He has appointed 3 good managers, overseen many agood player, young, hungry and fitting the system, he hasnt suffered fools (pardew). I find any critiscm from a sporting sense hard to swallow TBH without some sort of agenda pushing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 (edited) On a lot of the important performance metrics for his job - running the organisation well - he has performed poorly. What "important performance metrics" are you using? How about... - 68th in England in August 2009 to 14th in England in May 2013 (possibly could be as high as 10th come Sunday evening) - Significantly increased the value of the business - Staplewood development soon to be completed - Category 1 academy status - Key players tied down to long contracts - Premier League football secured for the 2013/14 season in time for a bumper TV deal Yes, we've had some bad PR over the past 4 years. But overall Cortese has done a superb job, lots of men in charge of clubs with large money behind them screw up, Cortese has achieved a lot! Edited 14 May, 2013 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 You're either very stupid or on a wind up. Or both... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 What "important performance metrics" are you using? How about... - 68th in England in August 2009 to 14th in England in May 2013 (possibly could be as high as 10th come Sunday evening) - Significantly increased the value of the business - Staplewood development soon to be completed - Category 1 academy status - Premier League football secured for the 2013/14 season in time for a bumper TV deal the back bone of the team have been here for years. He was part of the process that either bought these players and/or ensured they signed long term contracts he may be far from perfect away from football but as a leader of a football club, he has been incredible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 What "important performance metrics" are you using? How about... - 68th in England in August 2009 to 14th in England in May 2013 (possibly could be as high as 10th come Sunday evening) - Significantly increased the value of the business - Staplewood development soon to be completed - Category 1 academy status - Premier League football secured for the 2013/14 season in time for a bumper TV deal None of that means anything without a couple of hangers on in the hospitality suites Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 he may be far from perfect away from football but as a leader of a football club, he has been incredible Completely. Dealing in Hard Values we have excelled. The softer values are another matter and for a few they are seen to be very important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Yes, it may be a public vote, but it could still be interpreted as an act of mailcious mobbing to re-print the votes in such an obvious manner. Its clear the message was "Look, here are the tw*ts" No, that wasn't the intention. The intention was to highlight the level of support for Cortese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I bet Le Tiss is loving this as he cant wait to see the back of Cortese...same goes for Franny and Lawrie Mac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I bet Le Tiss is loving this as he cant wait to see the back of Cortese...same goes for Franny and Lawrie Mac if they wanted best for SFC and not their own personal gain, then I hope they dont Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 the back bone of the team have been here for years. He was part of the process that either bought these players and/or ensured they signed long term contracts he may be far from perfect away from football but as a leader of a football club, he has been incredible Pretty much this Bats, as I said before and as Colin has said, the other values are important but for a fan of a football club not nearly as important as those values he has shown to achieve what he has. He has, from a footballing sense brought a renaisance to the club. When all that upheaval is sorted I think he will focus on the other side of the business but for me that business is useless if it lies in league 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Perhaps he has to simply understand that it's not "his" club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 You're either very stupid or on a wind up. its an incredible opinion. It was an average job Cortese has done in his post before. Been downgraded to poor now! Not coping too well with idea that someone can have performed well at some aspects of his job and poorly at other others thereby performing averagely overall I see. Keep at it. They aren't difficult concepts to grasp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gingeletiss Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 how do you know no one even mentioned a 'trust' until this story broke Wrong, it was said my a few on here, myself included, that there was a provision in ML's will, a trust fund of sorts, and that was not long after his demise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Wrong, it was said my a few on here, myself included, that there was a provision in ML's will, a trust fund of sorts, and that was not long after his demise. who are this trust. how often do they come to games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Perhaps he has to simply understand that it's not "his" club? That's basically it imo. ML and he went into it as a joint fun project and with ML now dead Cortese has seen it as his own personal project. Not surprisingly the people now writing the cheques don't agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Not coping too well with idea that someone can have performed well at some aspects of his job and poorly at other others thereby performing averagely overall I see. Keep at it. They aren't difficult concepts to grasp I know its not a hard concept to grasp. Where have I said that it was just think you are incredibly wrong, and the poll results of the few that have posted agree by an absolute land slide, I would suggest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Not coping too well with idea that someone can have performed well at some aspects of his job and poorly at other others thereby performing averagely overall I see. Keep at it. They aren't difficult concepts to grasp I know a few cable jointers that excel at cable jointing and fault locating, they arent very good with customers or putting ribbish away. It doesnt make them average cable jointers, as that is their primary role. They could be even better though. Not difficult to understand is it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Not coping too well with idea that someone can have performed well at some aspects of his job and poorly at other others thereby performing averagely overall I see. Keep at it. They aren't difficult concepts to grasp And I see that you're struggling to grasp that whilst there are some things which could improve, these are low in the list of priorities for a football club where onfield success and massive increase in revenue are the ultimate benchmarks of success. You can't compare successive promotions back to prem, staying in the prem and a little trophy along the way with issues with the hospitality and conclude that performance has been "poor". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 No, that wasn't the intention. The intention was to highlight the level of support for Cortese. I would argue that the numbers and percentages do that adequately. Would love to know what Misselbrook's problem with NC is. After all, NC has put tens of millions on the value of the club, would have thought Jonny would want his babies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 And I see that you're struggling to grasp that whilst there are some things which could improve, these are low in the list of priorities for a football club where onfield success and massive increase in revenue are the ultimate benchmarks of success. You can't compare successive promotions back to prem, staying in the prem and a little trophy along the way with issues with the hospitality and conclude that performance has been "poor". Have to agree. There is no point tying a ribbon on a lump of s**t. Yes, the ribbon is nice but it's not the priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmel Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I may have missed something but there seem to be two different stories; BBC & The Times NC wants to continue to run the club in the way he has, whilst the family / trust want other people to join him and change the structure of how the club is run. Independent / Echo and Associated Press NC wants the Trust / Family to match his ambitions and invest accordingly, so more of a financial issue as to how much they are prepared to invest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Jazzbo Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I bet Le Tiss is loving this as he cant wait to see the back of Cortese...same goes for Franny and Lawrie Mac He's hoping that Micky Fialka will emerge a a contender for Chief Exective, as clearly he would have delivered in excess of what Cortese has so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webby Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Micky Fialka waits patiently in the wings* *assuming his mum's house has wings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I would argue that the numbers and percentages do that adequately. Fair dos. I just thought the screen shot of all the people listed had more visual impact, but hey ho, no harm intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Why has Cortese gone to the press? I assume it was him that leaked the story. But what does he hope to achieve by doing so? The only answer I can come up with is that he has already been told that he won't have his contract renewed, so he has gone to the press to portray himself in the best light to help attract a new employer. Anyone got a better conclusion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Why has Cortese gone to the press? I assume it was him that leaked the story. But what does he hope to achieve by doing so? The only answer I can come up with is that he has already been told that he won't have his contract renewed, so he has gone to the press to portray himself in the best light to help attract a new employer. Anyone got a better conclusion? A part of what has been leaked to the press is that Cortese has many people within football who would be interested in him. I'd assume those in football would know if that were true so to me it seems like a tactic which put's pressure on the Liebherrs rather than alerting other clubs to his potential availability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Why has Cortese gone to the press? I assume it was him that leaked the story. But what does he hope to achieve by doing so? The only answer I can come up with is that he has already been told that he won't have his contract renewed, so he has gone to the press to portray himself in the best light to help attract a new employer. Anyone got a better conclusion? Perhaps the Liebherrs have been waiting to see which division we'll be in and/or mulling how they want to structure the next contract, taking into the account Nik Nak's successes and failures over the past four years- and Nik Nak is getting twitchy and wants clarity and a resolution -and obviously one that protects the status quo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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