NC's top 4 dream...

[Unbelievable Jeff]

I keep on seeing that this 'dream' is being blamed as a reason that the players want to leave.

 

Personally I think it's ridiculous that

 

(a) Anyone believed that top 4 was a realistic ambition based on the fact that we were being financed by KL and not ML as previously.

(b) That the players believed Cortese. If this was the case should they not have negotiated release clauses into their contracts if we didn't get European football?

 

Personally I think it is a convenient excuse for the fans to beat the new board with, as they don't feel they can invest as much as Cortese wanted to. The real enemy here is Cortese who has misled the players and got them to believe in an unrelaistic dream. He was well aware of the money KL wanted to invest last Summer, yet sold this dream to Osvaldo, Lovren et al.

 

I feel really sorry for this board. Never have I known a football board have to deal with such a difficult climate (Cortese's influence, Pochettino's influence, pathetically selfish players, kit **** up from NC etc). Fingers crossed they can get through this and bring in adequate replacements.

[LGTL]

Football players are, on the whole, thick retards. It's little wonder they believed his crap.

[View From The Top]

Football players and fans are, on the whole, thick retards. It's little wonder they believed his crap.

 

Just added a bit for you.

[eesti matty]

What actually happened with the kit situation? What did Cortese do?

[melmacian_saint]

I blame the airport. Flying into London and then getting down here puts players off.

[doddisalegend]

Sadly I don't think it was just some of the players that bought into the "Dream" clearly some of our more fantasist fan base did to. Those fans are suffering badly and struggling to come to terms with what's happening at the club right now. I'd have some sympathy with them..........except most of them are acting like spoilt kids, who didn't get the christmas present they wanted, at the moment.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

With the exception of the great MLT we are always better off with a striker who scores 15 goals a season than somebody who scores 20. You have a chance of keeping the 15 goal a season player.

[mini_me]

I 100% agree with the OP.

[badgerx16]

Life doesn't mirror Football Manager.

[DuncanRG]

The problem is that we'll never know if it was unrealistic.

 

The club's stated ambition is still European football, though the top four bit's probably gone.

[Lord Duckhunter]

I keep on seeing that this 'dream' is being blamed as a reason that the players want to leave.

 

Personally I think it's ridiculous that

 

(a) Anyone believed that top 4 was a realistic ambition based on the fact that we were being financed by KL and not ML as previously.

(b) That the players believed Cortese. If this was the case should they not have negotiated release clauses into their contracts if we didn't get European football?

 

Personally I think it is a convenient excuse for the fans to beat the new board with, as they don't feel they can invest as much as Cortese wanted to. The real enemy here is Cortese who has misled the players and got them to believe in an unrelaistic dream. He was well aware of the money KL wanted to invest last Summer, yet sold this dream to Osvaldo, Lovren et al.

 

I feel really sorry for this board. Never have I known a football board have to deal with such a difficult climate (Cortese's influence, Pochettino's influence, pathetically selfish players, kit **** up from NC etc). Fingers crossed they can get through this and bring in adequate replacements.

 

This nonsense about being funded by kl and not Marcus really gets to me. Do people seriously believe that had Marcus not passed on we'd make the top 4? Its ****ing nonsense, don't get me wrong I'm grateful for what the guy did, but he did the easy bit. We were the biggest side in league one and one of the biggest in the championship. To make top 4 in the modern game is akin to someone like yeovil or boscombe making the premiership. A club of our size may make it, but it'll need a freak set of circumstances that come round once a century. I will bet anyone that by the time my youngest , who is 13 , reaches 60, not one club of our stature will play in the champions league.

 

If you look at last season. Man utd were shocking, Chelsea never had a centre forward, even man c were up and down. We had our best team for a generation and never got anywhere near it. **** me, even in those circumstances, Everton and spurs who have been around the top 4 for a decade , couldn't do it. If any players say that they believed the " project" would result in top 4, they are either the biggest ****wits in ****witvillie deluded by ****wittery or are liars.

[Bucks Saint]

If any players say that they believed the " project" would result in top 4, they are either the biggest ****wits in ****witvillie deluded by ****wittery or are liars.

 

Stop sitting on the fence please

[Frank's cousin]

I keep on seeing that this 'dream' is being blamed as a reason that the players want to leave.

 

Personally I think it's ridiculous that

 

(a) Anyone believed that top 4 was a realistic ambition based on the fact that we were being financed by KL and not ML as previously.

(b) That the players believed Cortese. If this was the case should they not have negotiated release clauses into their contracts if we didn't get European football?

 

Personally I think it is a convenient excuse for the fans to beat the new board with, as they don't feel they can invest as much as Cortese wanted to. The real enemy here is Cortese who has misled the players and got them to believe in an unrelaistic dream. He was well aware of the money KL wanted to invest last Summer, yet sold this dream to Osvaldo, Lovren et al.

 

I feel really sorry for this board. Never have I known a football board have to deal with such a difficult climate (Cortese's influence, Pochettino's influence, pathetically selfish players, kit **** up from NC etc). Fingers crossed they can get through this and bring in adequate replacements.

 

sorry but you are missing a huge chunk of what all this was about - whoosh over the head of those who have become so obsessed with the 'realities' of the modern game, they have lost all sense of what it means to have aspiration....

 

First up, do YOU really think players could be sold a scam? That Cortese sat them down and they all of a sudden believed he would take them to the promised land? Seriously do you think they have not seen what the premier league is all about these last 20 years?

 

Secondly, is there some new rule made up by the zealots of realism, that states fans can no longer have hope, have dreams and that in doing so they need to be laughedat ? Football used to always be about dreams, supporting about a collective spirit and and a unity that together more was achievable than individually...

 

Sure the odds of everything coming together in such a way so that top four was possible without huge capital investment are minuscule.... But so what? The fact that there was a collective belief amongst the side that we were NOT yet at our full potential yet finished 8th, is a huge positive. The fact that this belief and unity, drive, promoting youth, good coaching etc was seeing results showed a lot of folks what was possible if we we put our mind to it. Cortese was not some innovative guru, no NEW ideas, why even Lowe had the same approach to save money, - he was about obsessive details , small advances, and advantages that collectively gave us a improved chance of more consistent performances.. It was ALL about an attitude to be better than we were - improve and progress and not be limited by the rather limited imagination and negativity that the media, others in football and by the looks of things plenty of fans seem he'll bent on spouting. A positive attitude, spirit and belief that we can be better.... Tell me that is such a bad thing?

 

the current board are not getting flack because of KLs investment choices - I have always stated since Lowe's day that we should never rely on owners gifting huge wedges of cash to the club... And she is entitled to her own management of the finances. However, I would suggest that it was NOT some pipe dream of CL that was shattered, but that we lost that driving force when we lost Cortese, then MO, Shaw, Lallana, and our talisman in Lambert.. Plus who ever else will go.

 

No the grief they board get is not about money, but because when took 5 years to build and and delivered 5 years of progress, has taken 5 minutes to dismantle - and whilst players agents and even Cortese and MP are partly to blame, as with Lowe, the buck stops with those in control... Or are they only responsible for the the good things like stripes?

 

Now,we may see a new start, a new era of progress under KL and RK.. Great if we do, but why the need to start again from scratch? One thing is clear to anyone who knows their football. That side of held together would have been even better this year with maybe only another decent CB to add and some LB cover... And that is the biggest shame in all this. Our board gets flack because for whatever reason, we won't ever see how good we could have been... Because it was under their watch this all happened... Where it might have taken us is not the point, others around us will also improve, but it would have been nice to see.... Given that for a club of our size, getting a crop of talent together like that is not going to happen that often....

[badgerx16]

 

No the grief they board get is not about money, but because when took 5 years to build and and delivered 5 years of progress, has taken 5 minutes to dismantle - and whilst players agents and even Cortese and MP are partly to blame, as with Lowe, the buck stops with those in control.

 

So what exactly should they have done to stop MoPo going to Spuds, or AL & LS wanting away ? Surely receiving a World record fee for a teenager shows the possession of some degree of intestinal fortitude ?

[St Marco]

Also to add to that didn't KL say our goal is to get to Europe? Didn't Reed say it too only a few weeks ago when Koeman took over?

 

Just a Cortese bashing thread, nothing more.

[saintadjg]

The Don was doing a great job of washing away the small club mentality. Sadly it appears the minute he left it was straight back to that old small club mentality. Sure Koeman looks like a very good signing, but we did seem to roll over regards to players wanting out. We're they even made to hand in transfer requests?

[Foxstone]

Also to add to that didn't KL say our goal is to get to Europe? Didn't Reed say it too only a few weeks ago when Koeman took over?

 

Just a Cortese bashing thread, nothing more.

 

Agree completely.

Cortese misled nobody - He had a vision which we fulfilled, but to think that Osvaldo (who quite honestly never wanted to come anyway, but was rather pushed our way because Roma needed the money), and Lovren who was starting to rot at Lyon (who are not the powerhouse of France they used to be a few years back) were mis-sold a pipe dream is quite frankly laughable!

[CB Fry]

The problem is that we'll never know if it was unrealistic.

 

But we do know it was unrealistic.

[Ohio Saint]

Life doesn't mirror Football Manager.

 

So, when I was fired as Saints manager during the CL competition, I didn't really get the sack? I'm still actually the Saints manager in real life? ..........Now I'm just confused.

[Bearsy]

NC's Top 4 Dreams:

 

1) The One Where He Is Tall Enough To Ride Nemesis At Thorpe Park

2) The One Where He Is Mr.Spoon And He Goes To Button Moon. Button Moon. Be Back Soon.

3) The One Where He Breaks Into Benali's House And Does A Shit In His Swimming Pool

4) The One Where MLG Comes To Him Crying To Beg Forgiveness & They Have Homosex & It Is So Wrong But Also Sooo Right

[View From The Top]

The Don was doing a great job of washing away the small club mentality. Sadly it appears the minute he left it was straight back to that old small club mentality. Sure Koeman looks like a very good signing, but we did seem to roll over regards to players wanting out. We're they even made to hand in transfer requests?

 

£30m+ for Shaw is rolling over is it. A world record fee for a kid? A player who was going to go whether NC was here or not.

 

£25m for Lallana who whilst being a good player has had 1 decent top flight season and can't last 90mins and who threatened to strike is weak is it?

 

I always thought the skates were deluded but many of our lot seem even worse.

Edited 4 July, 2014 by View From The Top

[SaintRichmond]

Of course it was a dream

 

There are 20 Teams in the Prem

 

Discount the Top 4, as they have Qualified for the CL

 

Of the rest, ALL have players with Ambition, ambition to play in the CL if possible

 

Out of those, Saints are unique,

 

We not only have Players that want to play in the CL, OURS are making damn sure they will play in the CL. THEY ARE LEAVING

 

To date, I cannot see any other of the other Prem Teams whose Players are queing up to leave their Club, I wonder why that is ??

 

Perhaps they are not interested in the CL

 

Yet we have FIVE Players out of last seasons First Team who will be departing

 

Doesn't anyone else not think that that Ratio, compared to other Prem Teams, is somewhat excessive.??

 

Perhaps they all thought that Saints were being guided towards CL Qualification ?? Surely not ?? No, it must be some other reason for the Exodus

[Goatboy]

Of course it was a dream

 

There are 20 Teams in the Prem

 

Discount the Top 4, as they have Qualified for the CL

 

Of the rest, ALL have players with Ambition, ambition to play in the CL if possible

 

Out of those, Saints are unique,

 

We not only have Players that want to play in the CL, OURS are making damn sure they will play in the CL. THEY ARE LEAVING

 

To date, I cannot see any other of the other Prem Teams whose Players are queing up to leave their Club, I wonder why that is ??

 

Perhaps they are not interested in the CL

 

Yet we have FIVE Players out of last seasons First Team who will be departing

 

Doesn't anyone else not think that that Ratio, compared to other Prem Teams, is somewhat excessive.??

 

Perhaps they all thought that Saints were being guided towards CL Qualification ?? Surely not ?? No, it must be some other reason for the Exodus

 

Maybe they have had enough of hearing from moronic fans?

[CB Fry]

Of course it was a dream

 

There are 20 Teams in the Prem

 

Discount the Top 4, as they have Qualified for the CL

 

Of the rest, ALL have players with Ambition, ambition to play in the CL if possible

 

Out of those, Saints are unique,

 

We not only have Players that want to play in the CL, OURS are making damn sure they will play in the CL. THEY ARE LEAVING

 

To date, I cannot see any other of the other Prem Teams whose Players are queing up to leave their Club, I wonder why that is ??

 

Perhaps they are not interested in the CL

 

Yet we have FIVE Players out of last seasons First Team who will be departing

 

Doesn't anyone else not think that that Ratio, compared to other Prem Teams, is somewhat excessive.??

 

Perhaps they all thought that Saints were being guided towards CL Qualification ?? Surely not ?? No, it must be some other reason for the Exodus

Can you tell us the names of all these CL level players that have attracted £20m plus bids this summer that their parent clubs have turned down?

 

Obviously, there's loads ain't there?

[Goatboy]

Can you tell us the names of all these CL level players that have attracted £20m plus bids this summer that their parent clubs have turned down?

 

Obviously, there's loads ain't there?

 

I have come to the conclusion that you are correct. He is truly a swivel-eyed loon.

[View From The Top]

I have come to the conclusion that you are correct. He is truly a swivel-eyed loon.

 

He's an utterly deluded k**b.

[VectisSaint]

If you look at last season. Man utd were shocking, Chelsea never had a centre forward, even man c were up and down. We had our best team for a generation and never got anywhere near it..

Nope, you're right we got nowhere near it, at the first attempt. We weren't really 2nd in PL before we Played Arse and Boruc broke his hand, and we then had a major injury crisis. What happened was that we were fund out for not having enough strength indepth. I don't believe for one minute we would have finished 2nd, but with more depth, including a decent backup keeper, we could probably have made 5th or 6th. Our first choice XI was good enough, but 11 players do not a European qualification make. But were we really so far off as you would have us believe. No. Remember where Man City were in 1999. Remember when Chelsea were no-hopers? Money can make a difference and if NC had had his way and either persuaded KL to invest more or sold to another nacker, the dream was not so far off. The reason it has all gone tits up is because KL did not have the ambition of her father. I hold no grudge against her for that, but clearly a different way forward was to sell and that is what NC had as a master plan if she would not up the stakes. Clearly he misjudged her, and we are now where we are.

[View From The Top]

Nope, you're right we got nowhere near it, at the first attempt. We weren't really 2nd in PL before we Played Arse and Boruc broke his hand, and we then had a major injury crisis. What happened was that we were fund out for not having enough strength indepth. I don't believe for one minute we would have finished 2nd, but with more depth, including a decent backup keeper, we could probably have made 5th or 6th. Our first choice XI was good enough, but 11 players do not a European qualification make. But were we really so far off as you would have us believe. No. Remember where Man City were in 1999. Remember when Chelsea were no-hopers? Money can make a difference and if NC had had his way and either persuaded KL to invest more or sold to another nacker, the dream was not so far off. The reason it has all gone tits up is because KL did not have the ambition of her father. I hold no grudge against her for that, but clearly a different way forward was to sell and that is what NC had as a master plan if she would not up the stakes. Clearly he misjudged her, and we are now where we are.

 

I'd be delighted if you could find me a quote, any quote, from ML saying his ambition for Saints is UCL football.

[CB Fry]

Nope, you're right we got nowhere near it, at the first attempt. We weren't really 2nd in PL before we Played Arse and Boruc broke his hand, and we then had a major injury crisis. What happened was that we were fund out for not having enough strength indepth. I don't believe for one minute we would have finished 2nd, but with more depth, including a decent backup keeper, we could probably have made 5th or 6th. Our first choice XI was good enough, but 11 players do not a European qualification make. But were we really so far off as you would have us believe. No. Remember where Man City were in 1999. Remember when Chelsea were no-hopers? Money can make a difference and if NC had had his way and either persuaded KL to invest more or sold to another nacker, the dream was not so far off. The reason it has all gone tits up is because KL did not have the ambition of her father. I hold no grudge against her for that, but clearly a different way forward was to sell and that is what NC had as a master plan if she would not up the stakes. Clearly he misjudged her, and we are now where we are.

We were nowhere near it. We finished eighth, miles behind seventh let alone anything higher.

 

It was never, ever going to happen. Cortese's vision was so utterly sight sighted that he couldn't even foresee a need to align his key stakeholder.

 

Pie in the sky.

[ART]

The one thing that will have p i ss ed off the players, just as it did to us, the supporters, is Pochettino deliberately throwing away our chance in the FA CUP. We were 2 games within the final and winning the Cup, and furthermore, qualifying for Europe. Whether this was Pochettino's doing or a remnant from Cortese's plan for the season, remains to be seen. Never since 1976 have we been so close to winning that Cup. (Forget 2003 against Arsenal, we were far from succeeding) For me it showed the ambitions, or rather lack of ambitions of the club for the future. I strongly believe this is what really created the exodus from Saints along with a failure to augment the wages of senior players after reaching 8th position

[St Marco]

We were nowhere near it. We finished eighth, miles behind seventh let alone anything higher.

 

It was never, ever going to happen. Cortese's vision was so utterly sight sighted that he couldn't even foresee a need to align his key stakeholder.

 

Pie in the sky.

 

Are you saying the squad we had could not have improved?

[CB Fry]

Are you saying the squad we had could not have improved?

I'm saying the resources required to turn us into a CL team was not there and never there.

[Saint Fan CaM]

sorry but you are missing a huge chunk of what all this was about - whoosh over the head of those who have become so obsessed with the 'realities' of the modern game, they have lost all sense of what it means to have aspiration....

 

First up, do YOU really think players could be sold a scam? That Cortese sat them down and they all of a sudden believed he would take them to the promised land? Seriously do you think they have not seen what the premier league is all about these last 20 years?

 

Secondly, is there some new rule made up by the zealots of realism, that states fans can no longer have hope, have dreams and that in doing so they need to be laughedat ? Football used to always be about dreams, supporting about a collective spirit and and a unity that together more was achievable than individually...

 

Sure the odds of everything coming together in such a way so that top four was possible without huge capital investment are minuscule.... But so what? The fact that there was a collective belief amongst the side that we were NOT yet at our full potential yet finished 8th, is a huge positive. The fact that this belief and unity, drive, promoting youth, good coaching etc was seeing results showed a lot of folks what was possible if we we put our mind to it. Cortese was not some innovative guru, no NEW ideas, why even Lowe had the same approach to save money, - he was about obsessive details , small advances, and advantages that collectively gave us a improved chance of more consistent performances.. It was ALL about an attitude to be better than we were - improve and progress and not be limited by the rather limited imagination and negativity that the media, others in football and by the looks of things plenty of fans seem he'll bent on spouting. A positive attitude, spirit and belief that we can be better.... Tell me that is such a bad thing?

 

the current board are not getting flack because of KLs investment choices - I have always stated since Lowe's day that we should never rely on owners gifting huge wedges of cash to the club... And she is entitled to her own management of the finances. However, I would suggest that it was NOT some pipe dream of CL that was shattered, but that we lost that driving force when we lost Cortese, then MO, Shaw, Lallana, and our talisman in Lambert.. Plus who ever else will go.

 

No the grief they board get is not about money, but because when took 5 years to build and and delivered 5 years of progress, has taken 5 minutes to dismantle - and whilst players agents and even Cortese and MP are partly to blame, as with Lowe, the buck stops with those in control... Or are they only responsible for the the good things like stripes?

 

Now,we may see a new start, a new era of progress under KL and RK.. Great if we do, but why the need to start again from scratch? One thing is clear to anyone who knows their football. That side of held together would have been even better this year with maybe only another decent CB to add and some LB cover... And that is the biggest shame in all this. Our board gets flack because for whatever reason, we won't ever see how good we could have been... Because it was under their watch this all happened... Where it might have taken us is not the point, others around us will also improve, but it would have been nice to see.... Given that for a club of our size, getting a crop of talent together like that is not going to happen that often....

 

A truly magnificent post. Unfortunately the intellect of many on here will mean they will just not get it. In fact they probably will not even be able to read it, let alone understand what it means.

[St Marco]

I'm saying the resources required to turn us into a CL team was not there and never there.

 

Why not? If Osvaldo and Ramirez turned out okay that would of improved our team greatly. It didn't work out. That in itself is what £30m we wasted? If that money had gone on another Lovren CB, a proven striker (say Lukaku before he went to Everton) and a wide man I am sure we could of made up some wins somewhere. Maybe have finished 6th.

 

We would of then been in a far better position to continue to add to the team where it is needed to improve. It is far easier to bring in quality players when you are near the top then you are if you are near the bottom. To get to the CL in a year or two was always never going to happen. But it would be more likely to happen if we kept improving. Right now we are on the decline, I am sure even you can agree with that?

[Saint Fan CaM]

I'm saying the resources required to turn us into a CL team was not there and never there.

 

When we were in relegated to league 1, did you think we would never see the Prem again in your lifetime? Serious question.

[CB Fry]

sorry but you are missing a huge chunk of what all this was about - whoosh over the head of those who have become so obsessed with the 'realities' of the modern game, they have lost all sense of what it means to have aspiration....

 

First up, do YOU really think players could be sold a scam? That Cortese sat them down and they all of a sudden believed he would take them to the promised land? Seriously do you think they have not seen what the premier league is all about these last 20 years?

 

Secondly, is there some new rule made up by the zealots of realism, that states fans can no longer have hope, have dreams and that in doing so they need to be laughedat ? Football used to always be about dreams, supporting about a collective spirit and and a unity that together more was achievable than individually...

 

Sure the odds of everything coming together in such a way so that top four was possible without huge capital investment are minuscule.... But so what? The fact that there was a collective belief amongst the side that we were NOT yet at our full potential yet finished 8th, is a huge positive. The fact that this belief and unity, drive, promoting youth, good coaching etc was seeing results showed a lot of folks what was possible if we we put our mind to it. Cortese was not some innovative guru, no NEW ideas, why even Lowe had the same approach to save money, - he was about obsessive details , small advances, and advantages that collectively gave us a improved chance of more consistent performances.. It was ALL about an attitude to be better than we were - improve and progress and not be limited by the rather limited imagination and negativity that the media, others in football and by the looks of things plenty of fans seem he'll bent on spouting. A positive attitude, spirit and belief that we can be better.... Tell me that is such a bad thing?

 

the current board are not getting flack because of KLs investment choices - I have always stated since Lowe's day that we should never rely on owners gifting huge wedges of cash to the club... And she is entitled to her own management of the finances. However, I would suggest that it was NOT some pipe dream of CL that was shattered, but that we lost that driving force when we lost Cortese, then MO, Shaw, Lallana, and our talisman in Lambert.. Plus who ever else will go.

 

No the grief they board get is not about money, but because when took 5 years to build and and delivered 5 years of progress, has taken 5 minutes to dismantle - and whilst players agents and even Cortese and MP are partly to blame, as with Lowe, the buck stops with those in control... Or are they only responsible for the the good things like stripes?

 

Now,we may see a new start, a new era of progress under KL and RK.. Great if we do, but why the need to start again from scratch? One thing is clear to anyone who knows their football. That side of held together would have been even better this year with maybe only another decent CB to add and some LB cover... And that is the biggest shame in all this. Our board gets flack because for whatever reason, we won't ever see how good we could have been... Because it was under their watch this all happened... Where it might have taken us is not the point, others around us will also improve, but it would have been nice to see.... Given that for a club of our size, getting a crop of talent together like that is not going to happen that often....

 

The usual rambling rag bag of half thought through ideas and desperate yoking together of completely unconnected points. Typical Drunko drivel.

 

Not sure anyone, anywhere, at any point is stopping football fans having aspirations or dreams. No one is saying that having a positive attitude, spirit and belief is a bad thing. No one has ever said this. So who is any of that aimed at?

 

And if having "a positive, spirit and belief that we can better" is so jolly important then why don't you put that into practice right now instead of grizzling about everything you tedious moaning c×+t?

[Saint Fan CaM]

The usual rambling rag bag of half thought through ideas and desperate yoking together of completely unconnected points. Typical Drunko drivel.

 

Not sure anyone, anywhere, at any point is stopping football fans having aspirations or dreams. No one is saying that having a positive attitude, spirit and belief is a bad thing. No one has ever said this. So who is any of that aimed at?

 

And if having "a positive, spirit and belief that we can better" is so jolly important then why don't you put that into practice right now instead of grizzling about everything you tedious moaning c×+t?

 

[buctootim]

In one of our best ever finishes to a season we were 23 points off a CL place. Not 3 or 4, not one or two signings away from the final push and the promised land but 23 points - nearer relegation than the CL.

[St Marco]

In one of our best ever finishes to a season we were 23 points off a CL place. Not 3 or 4, not one or two signings away from the final push and the promised land but 23 points - nearer relegation than the CL.

 

Point is we were that far away this season. That is fact. What isn't fact is to imply we wouldn't have been closer the following season, then closer the following season and so on. The gap probably would of decreased as more quality was added to the team. Now it looks as though the gap will get bigger as the quality has been removed from the team.

[doddisalegend]

In one of our best ever finishes to a season we were 23 points off a CL place. Not 3 or 4, not one or two signings away from the final push and the promised land but 23 points - nearer relegation than the CL.

 

Stop with the facts already..............this is about dreams:lol:

[norwaysaint]

Why not? If Osvaldo and Ramirez turned out okay that would of improved our team greatly. It didn't work out. That in itself is what £30m we wasted? If that money had gone on another Lovren CB, a proven striker (say Lukaku before he went to Everton) and a wide man I am sure we could of made up some wins somewhere. Maybe have finished 6th.

 

We would of then been in a far better position to continue to add to the team where it is needed to improve. It is far easier to bring in quality players when you are near the top then you are if you are near the bottom. To get to the CL in a year or two was always never going to happen. But it would be more likely to happen if we kept improving. Right now we are on the decline, I am sure even you can agree with that?

 

But the teams that qualify for the CL waste 30m in transfer fees on a regular basis, they have the same hit and miss rate on transfers as we do. If you suggest we would do better if all of our transfers were as good as we'd hoped, you have to do the same for every club, which would still leave the top clubs with far better squads than us.

 

We weren't especially unlucky in the transfer market, we just discovered that the higher the transfer fees you're working with, the higher the chance that the player turns out to be over-priced. Think how many united and Liverpool players over the years have turned out to not be worth the fee they commanded.

[buctootim]

Point is we were that far away this season. That is fact. What isn't fact is to imply we wouldn't have been closer the following season, then closer the following season and so on. The gap probably would of decreased as more quality was added to the team. Now it looks as though the gap will get bigger as the quality has been removed from the team.

 

Could still be done. Just get the Sultan of Brunei or one of the Maktoums interested. They'll need to spunk near a billion though. Even poor old Ambramovich is feeling the financial strain. Spend enough you could even get Scarborough into the CL.

 

Or did you mean build organically? - gradually increase in strength from the proceeds of a not full 32,000 stadium and a tiny commercial income? In which case

[doddisalegend]

Point is we were that far away this season. That is fact. What isn't fact is to imply we wouldn't have been closer the following season, then closer the following season and so on. The gap probably would of decreased as more quality was added to the team. Now it looks as though the gap will get bigger as the quality has been removed from the team.

 

That would relay on the teams above us not getting any better. Do you really think the teams above us wouldn't strengthen, with better players than we could afford or attract, in the following seasons? The gap with the teams above wouldn't close unless we really spent massive amounts of money and could somehow attract real quality players that would normally go to CL clubs.

[CB Fry]

Why not? If Osvaldo and Ramirez turned out okay that would of improved our team greatly. It didn't work out. That in itself is what £30m we wasted? If that money had gone on another Lovren CB, a proven striker (say Lukaku before he went to Everton) and a wide man I am sure we could of made up some wins somewhere. Maybe have finished 6th.

 

We would of then been in a far better position to continue to add to the team where it is needed to improve. It is far easier to bring in quality players when you are near the top then you are if you are near the bottom. To get to the CL in a year or two was always never going to happen. But it would be more likely to happen if we kept improving. Right now we are on the decline, I am sure even you can agree with that?

Fine. Only ever buy players who will definitely be good. It's a great policy, I grant you.

[St Marco]

But the teams that qualify for the CL waste 30m in transfer fees on a regular basis, they have the same hit and miss rate on transfers as we do. If you suggest we would do better if all of our transfers were as good as we'd hoped, you have to do the same for every club, which would still leave the top clubs with far better squads than us.

 

We weren't especially unlucky in the transfer market, we just discovered that the higher the transfer fees you're working with, the higher the chance that the player turns out to be over-priced. Think how many united and Liverpool players over the years have turned out to not be worth the fee they commanded.

 

I completely agree with you. That is what it takes to get those top players. But like I said it is easier to get them the nearer you are to the top then if you are near the bottom.

 

And without quality players in this league you won't get anywhere.

[John B]

When we were in relegated to league 1, did you think we would never see the Prem again in your lifetime? Serious question.

 

When we were in the Championship in about 2008 I never thought we would get to the PL

 

But once we we came out of Administration I thought we would as we had no debts and money behind something we never had before

[charliemiller]

You know we dropped over 30 points from winning positions last season and we slumped when VW was injured and Boruc ...factor that in we were very close to achieving his target .

 

Certainly not as far off as many would have you believe on here .

[norwaysaint]

You know we dropped over 30 points from winning positions last season and we slumped when VW was injured and Boruc ...factor that in we were very close to achieving his target .

 

Certainly not as far off as many would have you believe on here .

Those are ridiculous comments. We dropped 30 points from winning positions because we weren't good enough to win those matches. Teams that finish in the CL places don't drop that many points from winning positions, that's why they're good enough and we're not. We slumped when certain players were injured because we didn't have a good enough squad. The CL teams get just as many injuries to their top players.

 

You make it sound like we would've come close if we weren't so unlucky, but we were no more unlucky than anyone else. If all of our best players never got injured and no teams were good enough to beat or draw with us when we scored first, then I agree we would've come close, but hadn't we better put those conditions on every other club, which would leave us back in the same place?

[CB Fry]

You know we dropped over 30 points from winning positions last season and we slumped when VW was injured and Boruc ...factor that in we were very close to achieving his target .

 

Certainly not as far off as many would have you believe on here .

Isn't dropping all those points absolute proof of the opposite?

[*Halo*]

The usual rambling rag bag of half thought through ideas and desperate yoking together of completely unconnected points. Typical Drunko drivel.

 

Not sure anyone, anywhere, at any point is stopping football fans having aspirations or dreams. No one is saying that having a positive attitude, spirit and belief is a bad thing. No one has ever said this. So who is any of that aimed at?

 

And if having "a positive, spirit and belief that we can better" is so jolly important then why don't you put that into practice right now instead of grizzling about everything you tedious moaning c×+t?

 

 

You really are a most obnoxious man.

 

You are of course perfectly entitled to your opinion - as is Frank's Cousin - and if you had just been able to exhibit the maturity to have left it at the middle line, that would have been perfectly reasonable.

 

Why you feel the need to spoil your otherwise valid points with such personal, childish, goading ridicule and utterly unnecessary spiteful invective, is completely beyond me. It reflects so badly upon you, and is very sad to see.

 

 

I enjoyed your post Frank's Cousin. It is unfortunate that we have a small minority here - whose immaturity and inflated sense of self-importance seem to render them incapable of sharing an opinion without resorting to personal abuse. Don't let it get to you mate.