The Death of the Tory Party and the Rebirth of the UK As We Know It (General Election 2024 Thread)

[badgerx16]

19 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

Tory MP Natalie Elphicke defects to Labour. FFS she's a proper twat. First mistake Starmer has made.

"The elected Prime Minister was ousted in a coup led by the unelected Rishi Sunak", she seems to have forgotten Truss completely.

[aintforever]

It's getting to the point where the longer he delays calling a GE the worse it looks for the government. The electorate clearly want change and he is dragging it out for obvious selfish reasons. The fact that not even his party members, let alone the British people voted for hm to be PM makes it look even worse.

[badgerx16]

6 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

 

(Why didn’t she defect to Reform?)

Because she still views herself as a serious politician.

[badgerx16]

1 minute ago, aintforever said:

It's getting to the point where the longer he delays calling a GE the worse it looks for the government. The electorate clearly want change and he is dragging it out for obvious selfish reasons. The fact that not even his party members, let alone the British people voted for hm to be PM makes it look even worse.

If it goes on much longer Labour will have a majority in the HoC.

[Whitey Grandad]

22 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

I agree with this 100%. As much as I detest the Tories the people of Dover voted for a Tory MP and if she feels that she can no longer support the party she was elected for she should stand down and force a by-election. It is beyond bizarre that a very right wing Tory now sits on the Labour benches though and the embarrassment it has cause Sunak is priceless!

For God’s sake Richi, put yourself and us out of our collective misery and call a July election.

(Why didn’t she defect to Reform?)

I agree with you except that we all know a General Election is only a matter of weeks away so why now? Forcing a by election now would be selfish.

[Lord Duckhunter]

44 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

Tory MP Natalie Elphicke defects to Labour. FFS she's a proper twat. First mistake Starmer has made.

She’s the first Labour member of the ERG 😂

[Fan The Flames]

32 minutes ago, ecuk268 said:

He's not going to say "no" is he?

The embarrassment to Sunak outweighs the fact that she's useless. It's only until the Autumn anyway, then they can select their own candidate.

Personally, although I'm happy to see the Tories humiliated, I do think that there should be a by-election when this happens. 

I think he could, could have said something like their values don't align, a Johnson cultist plunging the knife into Sunak at the last knockings isn't the embarrassment to Sunak that you might think it is.

I see it as more desperate for Starmer to want to associate with the nutter, it's a bit of a slap for the local labour party. A dignified 'no thanks' would have worked far better.

[Jeremy Corbyn]

1 minute ago, Fan The Flames said:

I think he could, could have said something like their values don't align, a Johnson cultist plunging the knife into Sunak at the last knockings isn't the embarrassment to Sunak that you might think it is.

I see it as more desperate for Starmer to want to associate with the nutter, it's a bit of a slap for the local labour party. A dignified 'no thanks' would have worked far better.

Whilst I'm disappointed he let her join, Keir is all about calculated risks and personally I think this is a massive blow to the Tories.  One of their biggest "anti-immigration" MPs thinks they're incompetent, will seriously weaken their claim they're the best to handle it.

[Fan The Flames]

14 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

She’s the first Labour member of the ERG 😂

Not quite, that award goes Kate Hoey.

Edited May 8 by Fan The Flames
Although she is a bit of a Joey

[badgerx16]

1 minute ago, Fan The Flames said:

it's a bit of a slap for the local labour party.

Why ? They already have their candidate for the GE, at which point Elphicke is standing down.

[Fan The Flames]

1 minute ago, badgerx16 said:

Why ? They already have their candidate for the GE, at which point Elphicke is standing down.

Because they have been working hard up and down the front doors of Dover saying they are against NE and what she stands for. Then suddenly she's in, I think that will take the wind out their sails. I would be fucked off putting in those free hours only to she her brought in.

[Fan The Flames]

41 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

"The elected Prime Minister was ousted in a coup led by the unelected Rishi Sunak", she seems to have forgotten Truss completely.

Yes because it's all about getting at Johnson's traitor.

[sadoldgit]

23 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

I agree with you except that we all know a General Election is only a matter of weeks away so why now? Forcing a by election now would be selfish.

We had one in Blackpool South just a few days ago. Technically the election could be called in January 2025. It is all about the principe though, not the timing.

[Holmes_and_Watson]

1 hour ago, badgerx16 said:

If it goes on much longer Labour will have a majority in the HoC.

Steady stream of defectors > Labour majority > Labour torpedoed by all it's new members doing horrible things and destabilising party > Electorate upset by dysfunctional Labour > election announced > Conservatives squeak majority with it's new less weird group of MPs.

A plan so cunning, your candidate should be Mr Fox... although possibly not Lawrence... 🙂

[Sheaf Saint]

1 hour ago, Fan The Flames said:

I think he could, could have said something like their values don't align, a Johnson cultist plunging the knife into Sunak at the last knockings isn't the embarrassment to Sunak that you might think it is.

I see it as more desperate for Starmer to want to associate with the nutter, it's a bit of a slap for the local labour party. A dignified 'no thanks' would have worked far better.

1 hour ago, Jeremy Corbyn said:

Whilst I'm disappointed he let her join, Keir is all about calculated risks and personally I think this is a massive blow to the Tories.  One of their biggest "anti-immigration" MPs thinks they're incompetent, will seriously weaken their claim they're the best to handle it.

Imagine if he's accepted her in order to cause massive damage to Sunak and the Tories, and then after she's announced it all and stuck the knife in to the government, he U-turns and removes the whip, based on her views and values "not being aligned with the party" or something.

That would be hilarious.

[Lord Duckhunter]

4 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

We had one in Blackpool South just a few days ago. Technically the election could be called in January 2025. It is all about the principe though, not the timing.

Are you saying Labours newest MP is  unprincipled? 

[rallyboy]

She's not a great signing but when you weigh up the PR positives of the Tory MP for Dover slagging off the government's immigration policy you have to hold your nose and welcome her in, especially as she's standing down.

 

[Gloucester Saint]

7 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

Not quite, that award goes Kate Hoey.

Indeed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66405229 and was an effective Sport minister despite being very at odds with the New Labour pro-ish EU orthodoxy at the time.

Dan Poulter was a far more obvious defector, but interesting article about some of the background drivers here https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68979548

Housing is a common interest and move away from recent Tory policies, plus she seemed to prefer trying to rebuild relationships with the French to the very costly Rwanda scheme. Not sure the ERG helped with that objective much though! Be interesting to know her position on the hard right’s current obsession of leaving the ECHR as that’s quite tricky if she was in favour of that. 

Dover is strategically important on the boats debate so I can see why Starmer did it for that reason. Not one I saw coming even so. It would have been hard for her to stand for election again with the social media interviews being dragged up but as she’s standing down and gets as advisory role on housing as a favoured subject I can see it works both ways on a practical level. 

The unease of some on the left will probably relate also to comments she made after Charlie Elphicke was jailed https://www.politico.eu/article/tory-natalie-elphicke-defection-sparks-backlash-labour-women/ plus the Rashford comments.

Risky move, some pros rubbing Sunak’s nose further in it and pissing Momentum off is always worth votes, but some of the unease is real. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

6 hours ago, Sheaf Saint said:

Imagine if he's accepted her in order to cause massive damage to Sunak and the Tories, and then after she's announced it all and stuck the knife in to the government, he U-turns and removes the whip, based on her views and values "not being aligned with the party" or something.

That would be hilarious.

Don’t worry, once some of her What’s app messages get leaked it’ll happen. 

[rallyboy]

Funny how this morning she was a fantastic Tory MP but by lunchtime she was a liability and no great loss.

Just desperate claims emerging from a sunk ship.

Rishi, and that's your future too mate, the people loyally defending you today will shit on you tomorrow without hesitation, so brace yourself....you'll need a big boy umbrella.

[Fan The Flames]

The backlash against Elphick hasn't been great for Labour. That could have easily been predicted. A calculated decision yes, but I still think it's the wrong one.

[aintforever]

46 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

The backlash against Elphick hasn't been great for Labour. That could have easily been predicted. A calculated decision yes, but I still think it's the wrong one.

I dunno, it has pissed some people off in the party, especially those on the left, but 99% of the electorate won't know anything about Elphicke or even care. To the vast majority it's just going to be another Tory who thinks Sunak is shit and Labour offer a better alternative.

[Fan The Flames]

1 hour ago, aintforever said:

I dunno, it has pissed some people off in the party, especially those on the left, but 99% of the electorate won't know anything about Elphicke or even care. To the vast majority it's just going to be another Tory who thinks Sunak is shit and Labour offer a better alternative.

You are probably right.

[Gloucester Saint]

Great quip by Mordaunt in the HoC - ‘I am not about to defect to the opposition benches. They wouldn’t be interested in me, I’m too left wing’.

Quality response drawing further laughter from Lucy Powell ‘Our reach into previously undiscovered support is much broader and deeper than I ever imagined’.

Meanwhile Houchen, the sole consolation in the local election and Mayoral races, becomes ‘Ouchen’ for Rishi https://www.hexham-courant.co.uk/news/national/24308000.sunak-ultimately-blame-tory-chaos-says-tees-valley-mayor-houchen/

[ecuk268]

6 hours ago, aintforever said:

I dunno, it has pissed some people off in the party, especially those on the left, but 99% of the electorate won't know anything about Elphicke or even care. To the vast majority it's just going to be another Tory who thinks Sunak is shit and Labour offer a better alternative.

Water under the bridge by the time the election comes.

[Holmes_and_Watson]

7 hours ago, aintforever said:

I dunno, it has pissed some people off in the party, especially those on the left, but 99% of the electorate won't know anything about Elphicke or even care. To the vast majority it's just going to be another Tory who thinks Sunak is shit and Labour offer a better alternative.

Probably true enough. I caught the Beeb news cycle on it this morning. Their representative sounded really weak trying to defend a lot of what Elphike had said in the past.

One question, picked up on from an early answer, was how did Elphicke saying sorry allow her in, while Dianne Abbott is apparently still waiting for a decision, a year after her apology. The answer was't connected to the question. The rest of the interview was like that, which isn't a good look.

It came across as them not having any stances on anything, that would prevent anyone coming in, if it suited them.

But in a while, she'll just be listed out as a name when the next detection occurs.

[The Kraken]

Well, we’re out of recession so the plan is clearly working, Labour don’t have a plan. Definitely heading for that hung parliament now. Rishi, you clever little wonder you.

[egg]

6 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

Well, we’re out of recession so the plan is clearly working, Labour don’t have a plan. Definitely heading for that hung parliament now. Rishi, you clever little wonder you.

You jest, and as much as I won't ever vote Tory, I've still got no idea what labours plan is. The sad thing is, there'll be plenty of dinlo's who look at this, and reducing inflation, and not stop to think who fecked it up initially. 

[whelk]

1 hour ago, egg said:

You jest, and as much as I won't ever vote Tory, I've still got no idea what labours plan is. The sad thing is, there'll be plenty of dinlo's who look at this, and reducing inflation, and not stop to think who fecked it up initially. 

Which has clearly been seen in the recent elections? 0.6 GDP growth for a quarter isn’t going resonate with anyone as only probably 1% of voters know what it actually means

[sadoldgit]

It looks like Starmer has played a blinder over the Natalie Elphicke transfer. The Tories are now falling over themselves to blacken her name without stopping to think about the consequences. This all happened when she was a Tory MP and not one of them raised an eyebrow. Now, because she has crossed the floor, it becomes an issue for them.

Every week Starmer has been chipping away at various Tory PMs, laying traps which they constantly walk in to. They have just walked into another one. Sunak would have us believe that he is the man to lead us in dangerous times. Really Rishi? When you are consistently bamboozled by the leader of the opposition, how do you expect us to believe you can handle the likes of Putin, Netanyahu, and, God forbid, Trump (if he gets elected)?

I have just seen this too. Whoops!

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/four-tory-mps-who-made-32793408.amp

Do the right thing. Call the election now and disappear into the Californian sunset. 

 

Edited May 13 by sadoldgit
Added text

[Fan The Flames]

A little man with a size 24 waist and a squeaky voice can't be a war time leader. 

[Golactico]

 

 

[badgerx16]

3 minutes ago, Golactico said:

 

 

I don't know why these people bother with social media. It always comes back to trip them up.

[The Kraken]

So after Esther McVey, minister for common sense, goes on national television and says that rainbow lanyards will be banned in the whole civil service……..her own cabinet bats it back and confirms that she’s fucking mental.

 

[Fan The Flames]

1 hour ago, The Kraken said:

So after Esther McVey, minister for common sense, goes on national television and says that rainbow lanyards will be banned in the whole civil service……..her own cabinet bats it back and confirms that she’s fucking mental.

 

Pathetic nonsense, definition of the nanny state gone mad. This is real, unlike when the Daily Mail tried to claim that the GLC was banning blackboards because the word was racist, which was total bollocks.

[whelk]

Union Jack lanyards for true British workers.

[Sheaf Saint]

18 minutes ago, Fan The Flames said:

Pathetic nonsense, definition of the nanny state gone mad. This is real, unlike when the Daily Mail tried to claim that the GLC was banning blackboards because the word was racist, which was total bollocks.

What power would Goldie Looking Chain have to ban blackboards? 🤔

In all seriousness, I work in the public sector and although the specific organisation I work in is not technically part of the civil service, it pretty much is in all but name.

We have a large LGBTQ+ network, and there are plenty of people wearing rainbow lanyards in our offices. And you know what? NOBODY cares! And if they tried to ban it, everyone would just ignore the ban anyway because the colour of someone's lanyard is completely irrelevant and has no bearing on anyone's ability to do their jobs.

This is just another load of culture war bullshit. And you would think the minister for common sense (as if that's a real fucking thing!) would know that better than anyone.

[Holmes_and_Watson]

Rainbow lanyards are very handy for finding your pass in your bag. Or for not forgetting it, if you've left it out.

[Gloucester Saint]

Good grief https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13415849/Tory-woke-wars-Grants-Shapps-dismisses-Common-Sense-minister-Esther-McVeys-ban-LGBT-lanyards-Whitehall-saying-not-bothered-staff-expressing-views.html

Her stupidity in full: https://www.civilserviceworld.com/professions/article/government-to-scrap-equality-and-diversity-roles-minister-says

Talk about prioritisation! Let’s ban non-jobs for thick people in the cabinet. Good response from Andrew Boff there and you can tell Schapps was thinking ‘oh FFS, not this crap’.

She was quite happy to take RDA funds to get her business, based on equalities issues itself just to underline hypocrisy, going before Steve Hilton apparently advised Cameron to abolish them. Within 18 months, LEPs had to be set up as it was obvious RDAs did vital work and er, it’s a bit hard to do place-based innovation and devolution without a similar structure. Hilton used to have a decent brain apart from that brain fart, but now part of Donnie’s Orange single digit IQ army.

Edited Tuesday at 17:54 by Gloucester Saint

[badgerx16]

Are they going to stop people wearing the various coloured ribbons that are used to publicise charitable causes ?

 

[badgerx16]

1 hour ago, Holmes_and_Watson said:

Rainbow lanyards are very handy for finding your pass in your bag. Or for not forgetting it, if you've left it out.

They come in handy for throttling fucking stupid non-entity Ministers as well.

[Holmes_and_Watson]

3 hours ago, badgerx16 said:

They come in handy for throttling fucking stupid non-entity Ministers as well.

I can't see me avoiding that coming up at the next team meeting.

[pingpong]

400 out of 500,710 employees working in edi is hardly that concerning. I did find it interesting that she considers lgbt support to be a purely political cause.  Is she implying that conservatives can't support lgbt rights? 

[sadoldgit]

I read the nonsense about rainbow lanyards just after seeing a report about the problems with maternity care in this country and the trauma many women face because of the poor treatment they receive. Perhaps the Minister for Common Sense would like to consider whether the focus should be on improving maternity care before worrying about the colour of lanyards?

Meanwhile this government continues to show how out of touch and clueless they are.

https://amp.theguardian.com/society/article/2024/may/15/jeremy-hunt-mel-stride-warn-benefits-lifestyle-choice-unemployment

And Rees-Mogg continues to display the reason why this country is now where it is.

https://www.ft.com/content/0f85a767-e007-449f-950f-9b61674ccf50

Edited Wednesday at 09:35 by sadoldgit
Added text

[badgerx16]

Farage's response to the Honourable member for the 19th century;

''......it's just not going to happen because Rishi is not bold, he has no leadership whatsoever and the truth is that the vast majoirity of Conservative MPs are social democrat One Nation careerists, they have no courage, they have no vision.''

[Tamesaint]

1 hour ago, badgerx16 said:

Farage's response to the Honourable member for the 19th century;

''......it's just not going to happen because Rishi is not bold, he has no leadership whatsoever and the truth is that the vast majoirity of Conservative MPs are social democrat One Nation careerists, they have no courage, they have no vision.''

I think that Duckie wrote that for him. 😂😂

[Fan The Flames]

19 hours ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Good grief https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13415849/Tory-woke-wars-Grants-Shapps-dismisses-Common-Sense-minister-Esther-McVeys-ban-LGBT-lanyards-Whitehall-saying-not-bothered-staff-expressing-views.html

Her stupidity in full: https://www.civilserviceworld.com/professions/article/government-to-scrap-equality-and-diversity-roles-minister-says

Talk about prioritisation! Let’s ban non-jobs for thick people in the cabinet. Good response from Andrew Boff there and you can tell Schapps was thinking ‘oh FFS, not this crap’.

She was quite happy to take RDA funds to get her business, based on equalities issues itself just to underline hypocrisy, going before Steve Hilton apparently advised Cameron to abolish them. Within 18 months, LEPs had to be set up as it was obvious RDAs did vital work and er, it’s a bit hard to do place-based innovation and devolution without a similar structure. Hilton used to have a decent brain apart from that brain fart, but now part of Donnie’s Orange single digit IQ army.

"People want their public servants to be getting on with the job of making their lives better, not engaging in endless internal discussions about ideology,” McVey added.

I love the irony.

[Fan The Flames]

I see the Ministry for Solving Non-Existent Problems has now turned it's attention to sex education.

[Sheaf Saint]

1 minute ago, Fan The Flames said:

"People want their public servants to be getting on with the job of making their lives better, not engaging in endless internal discussions about ideology,” McVey added.

I love the irony.

WTF is she on about?

Some of us wear rainbow lanyards, and nobody ever wastes any work time debating the rights or wrongs of that, in the same way no time is ever lost discussing the colour of employee's socks.

At least until now. No doubt there will be some internal comms sent round shortly as a result of McVey's comments, which will ironically lead to some wasted work time about something that it otherwise wouldn't have.

Superb example of the Streisand effect there. Well done Esther, you fucking cretin.

[aintforever]

They are just desperately try to start up some culture wars prior to the GE, hopefully all but the brain dead will see it for what it is. Lanyards FFS.