Guided Missile Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 ....we are in a better position than many think, to survive. The pain we have gone through will be ten times worse for the "bigger" clubs over the coming months. It will happen soon and the pigs who have been at the Sky Sports trough will find that it will soon be empty. The balance sheets of these mercenary armies(or their banks) will soon be found to be nothing more than a mirage of creative accounting, that the Premier League have ignored for too long. Ashley has lost over £300M on HBOS shares, allegedly. A firesale of Newcastle is on the cards and relegation is not out of the question. If we found it hard, how will they cope? Even Man U, Liverpool and Arsenal are not immune to the firestorm engulfing the world's economy. Massive debts built on the assumption that there is an inifinite apetite for overpaid foreigners kicking a ball around at a strange time on the weekend (ie not 3:00pm on a Saturday) are going to be unsustainable and with many of the property assets (£10M for Fratton Park, anyone???) underpinning the balance sheets, a slight nudge that propelled some of the biggest financial institutions into oblivion, will be all it takes. Live with the pain at Southampton Football Club, turn up to as many of the games as possible, because soon, our model of sustainable football covered by income from the pockets of the real fans will be the daily diet of many of the clubs in the Premiership. As they sink, we will rise again, on the back of a vision of the economic reality that so many people are having to face in the financial community, but few inside football can see. Just be glad we are facing up to it now. Those in denial, not a few miles down the M27 will soon be jolted into a world of pain, along with a few others and their journey will go downhill far more rapidly than ours..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1976_Child Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 very well said. The football-is-a-gold-mine bubble is soon to burst. Did anyone else see MOTD this weekend? Can't remember which game it was but the stadium - a premiership stadium - was only half full. Clubs up and down the country are feeling the pinch. On that note, I am now off for a 450 mile round trip to Rotherham. And they had better entertain me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakovnetski Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 It could very well turn out this way GM. It'll be interesting to see whether or not some of the mega-rich owners will stay on board if Platini has his way and curbs the excessive spending of the few based on ridiculous and unsustainable levels of debt that they have. Cheats he called them. If these guys cant win with their playthings then they could jump ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 very well said. The football-is-a-gold-mine bubble is soon to burst. Did anyone else see MOTD this weekend? Can't remember which game it was but the stadium - a premiership stadium - was only half full. Clubs up and down the country are feeling the pinch. On that note, I am now off for a 450 mile round trip to Rotherham. And they had better entertain me! I saw Sunderland-Boro, there were a lot of empty seats,far too many for the crowd figure of 38000 and change to be accurate,why ?I've no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Bolton at home to Arsenal only 22 k !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 ....we are in a better position than many think, to survive. The pain we have gone through will be ten times worse for the "bigger" clubs over the coming months. It will happen soon and the pigs who have been at the Sky Sports trough will find that it will soon be empty. The balance sheets of these mercenary armies(or their banks) will soon be found to be nothing more than a mirage of creative accounting, that the Premier League have ignored for too long. Ashley has lost over £300M on HBOS shares, allegedly. A firesale of Newcastle is on the cards and relegation is not out of the question. If we found it hard, how will they cope? Even Man U, Liverpool and Arsenal are not immune to the firestorm engulfing the world's economy. Massive debts built on the assumption that there is an inifinite apetite for overpaid foreigners kicking a ball around at a strange time on the weekend (ie not 3:00pm on a Saturday) are going to be unsustainable and with many of the property assets (£10M for Fratton Park, anyone???) underpinning the balance sheets, a slight nudge that propelled some of the biggest financial institutions into oblivion, will be all it takes. Live with the pain at Southampton Football Club, turn up to as many of the games as possible, because soon, our model of sustainable football covered by income from the pockets of the real fans will be the daily diet of many of the clubs in the Premiership. As they sink, we will rise again, on the back of a vision of the economic reality that so many people are having to face in the financial community, but few inside football can see. Just be glad we are facing up to it now. Those in denial, not a few miles down the M27 will soon be jolted into a world of pain, along with a few others and their journey will go downhill far more rapidly than ours..... Great. So the big 4 (Manyoo, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arse) become the big 2 (Man City and Chelsea), with a few clubs goig bust long before us. It's still not a very pleasant future, whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slickmick Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 If your prediction comes true ( which I believe it will) then surely the smaller feeder clubs like ourselves will also be affected. Players like Lallana would fetch a much smaller fee, than the £5m quoted figure that is floating around at the moment. Without the profits from player sales, then surely we are doomed also ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I have felt that football will become like American football just a few regional teams and the big four with no relegation.We lost the opportunity for investment when the PA thing died a death due to the infighting and peoples inability to let go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SP Saint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Great. So the big 4 (Manyoo, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arse) become the big 2 (Man City and Chelsea), with a few clubs goig bust long before us. It's still not a very pleasant future, whatever. Go on - doom, gloom with a bit of disaster thrown in. You know you love it alpine. (Or was GM too positive about the outlook for Saints for your taste?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Whilst it is plausible that some Prem teams could face severe financial difficulties, the notion that this is good news for Saints is pure guff IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 The leveraged debt used to buy Man Utd is apparently attracting an interest rate approaching (or according to the Telegraph ABOVE) 10%. The ever increasing trough of Sky money depends on only TWO critical factors - 1) Competition to Sky for the rights and 2) Income generated from subscriptions and from sale of advertising slots around the games. We are seeing an across the board cutting back by people on what they spend, value is important but they are now starting to spend what they can AFFORD, not what they can get away with borrowing. Pay TV subscription or the Electricity Bill? Anyone in business will know that amongst the first budget to go is the Advertising budget. Value for money, identifiable results and ROI become the watch words instead of "building brand awareness". A double whammy for Sky Setanta have a business model that is highly leveraged and long term, their debt levels may not allow them to increase their bids next time around. How many people have signed up with them? The terrestials aren't going to afford to compete with Sky, leaving probably the Disney owned ESPN as the only competitor. That would be ironic, the PL ends up being funded by Mickey Mouse. If the leveraged buyers of PL clubs don't go down first I think that the concept of not seeing the tv rights value increase by 50% could be the final nail in the "spend and worry later" world that most of the UK population used to live in and the PL still does. The only real issues I diasgree with GM on are 1) whether we actually can get through this season. January becomes critical, with the stark choice being a sale of a Lallana type or admin. 2) whether "regional clubs" will be able to survive outside the large population centres. You don't find the bars in Hong Kong, Dubai, LA, Bangkok exactly full when you only have Bolton v Wigan on the tv, so again, for how long would the "foreign rights" keep going up in value 3) The CL global tv audiences don't like the midweek matches, the games are often on at poor times for the global viewers so the concept of CL at the weekend in order to increse THEIR tv revenue may be the final straw that drags the top four away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Great. So the big 4 (Manyoo, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arse) become the big 2 (Man City and Chelsea), with a few clubs goig bust long before us. It's still not a very pleasant future, whatever. Wrong! It will be the big THREE of course. you forgot the richest club in England QPR... :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guided Missile Posted 23 September, 2008 Author Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Whilst it is plausible that some Prem teams could face severe financial difficulties, the notion that this is good news for Saints is pure guff IMO. Pompey ending up a league below us and we then get a couple thousand of their glory hunters returning to spend money at St Marys would be good news to me.... ....pure guff that will sustain me through our dark days.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Pompey ending up a league below us and we then get a couple thousand of their glory hunters returning to spend money at St Marys would be good news to me.... ....pure guff that will sustain me through our dark days.... Obvioulsy the demise of Pompey would be very entertaining! [-o I just can't see any effect of "big" clubs facing financial hardship other than increasingly desperate, anti-competitive and financially non-distributative measures being put in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoswellSaint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I have felt that football will become like American football just a few regional teams and the big four with no relegation.We lost the opportunity for investment when the PA thing died a death due to the infighting and peoples inability to let go Actually, Nick, the American football model has a lot going for it - apart from the lack of relegation. It is a very socialistic model. Most revenue is shared, there is a strict salary cap and the worst teams each year get the first choice of the best young players. It means that at the start of the season most teams have a good chance of reaching the play-offs. Rarely does a team come to dominate and certainly not through money. Green Bay, a small city, can compete with Dallas, New York, etc. There is no big 4 that dominate every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Actually, Nick, the American football model has a lot going for it - apart from the lack of relegation. It is a very socialistic model. Most revenue is shared, there is a strict salary cap and the worst teams each year get the first choice of the best young players. It means that at the start of the season most teams have a good chance of reaching the play-offs. Rarely does a team come to dominate and certainly not through money. Green Bay, a small city, can compete with Dallas, New York, etc. There is no big 4 that dominate every year.thats all well and good but it is set up for the few not my heritage where there are 92 clubs competing.If it was always a few we'd know no different but I recall the days when it was more even (still had inequalities but not like it is now) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 thats all well and good but it is set up for the few not my heritage where there are 92 clubs competing.If it was always a few we'd know no different but I recall the days when it was more even (still had inequalities but not like it is now) Blame Liverpool, Everton and ManYoo (and probably a few others as well, to be fair) for threatening the Football League back in the late 70s with a breakaway league if they didn't change the rules to ensure the home club kept all of the gate receipts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Blame Liverpool, Everton and ManYoo (and probably a few others as well, to be fair) for threatening the Football League back in the late 70s with a breakaway league if they didn't change the rules to ensure the home club kept all of the gate receipts.I do Steve. I advocated then to cut them adrift, if it had happened they would have come back cap in hand as they needed both competitions but the chairman of the other clubs caved in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoswellSaint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 thats all well and good but it is set up for the few not my heritage where there are 92 clubs competing.If it was always a few we'd know no different but I recall the days when it was more even (still had inequalities but not like it is now) The few are 32 in number. I agree the model is not perfect - as I said it lacks the threat of relegation. At least those involved compete on a level playing field. I long for the days when small clubs could challenge the big city clubs but I doubt will see them again my lifetime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronCitySaint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Whereas the wages and transfers being paid are totally ridiculous, I don't see any of the biggies having to cut back anytime soon. In fact things will proabably get more crazy before getting better. Initially it was only Sky bidding for the rights but now there is competition from Setanta domestically whilst overseas there is competition from Fox and ESPN in North America. The TV rights market in Asia has hardly even started to be tapped. In the massive Chinese market Premier League football is only available on the Internet to a tiny number of subscribers at the moment. The TV income money is certainly going to get bigger over the coming years until people start getting fed up with it. There may be lots of empty seats in some of the Premier League stadiums but others are still packed to the rafters with thousands not able to get in. Anyway, the income from bums on seats is nowhere near as important in the PL as the TV income. If Man Utd suddenly had all their debts called in they wouldn't go bankrupt. Rather some other nutter would jump in and buy it for a billion quid. Football needs a reality check, but it isn't going to happen anytime soon for the top flight clubs, IMO. The gap will continue to widen and in hard times that is even worse for clubs like SFC, not better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Shearer Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I've been hoping for awhile that the bubble bursts. Either that or its going to go down the way it does in the US in terms of television. People paying on a PPV basis for nearly everything. Its frightening to what lenghts Americans are willing to pay for sports events. $50/£25 on big matches? Then you have all the other sports of basketball, baseball, UFC, racing. Its crazy. I was glad Sky ditched their Prem Plus matches when if you didnt have the season ticket you could order games individually. You had to be a mug to buy a game for £12 a pop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I was glad Sky ditched their Prem Plus matches when if you didnt have the season ticket you could order games individually. You had to be a mug to buy a game for £12 a pop. They didn't intentionally ditch it, it was because the Competition Commission at the EU and the Monopolies Commission in the UK decided that Sky couldn't have exclusive rights over ALL of the live Premier League games. So, in the interests of "increased competition and a better deal for the consumer", fans now get to pay £129.90 for 10 months' worth of Setanta Sports instead of the £50 Prem Plus season ticket. What fantastic value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guided Missile Posted 23 September, 2008 Author Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Actually, Nick, the American football model has a lot going for it - apart from the lack of relegation. It is a very socialistic model. Most revenue is shared, there is a strict salary cap and the worst teams each year get the first choice of the best young players. It means that at the start of the season most teams have a good chance of reaching the play-offs. Rarely does a team come to dominate and certainly not through money. Green Bay, a small city, can compete with Dallas, New York, etc. There is no big 4 that dominate every year. American Football, teaches us exactly why everything in the US is driven by money and success. Failure on the field is not a part of the franchise system that infects US team sports. Relegation battles are not part of the equation. The only way that the fans suffer "relegation" is when the owner decides to move the franchise to a city where he can make more money. Franchises that are fed players by a college system that produces millions in revenue to support their football programs and crowds of 70,000 plus to watch college football. A college system that encourages the belief that being big, dumb and good at bullying others equates to success in life. Little wonder that this produces a country that is big, dumb and good at bullying others... Mind you, I can already see the effects of the Premiership, populated by players who never went to college and are encouraged in the belief that being small, dumb and good at whining at the ref., equates to success in life. Little wonder this produces a country that is small, dumb and good at whining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoswellSaint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I've been hoping for awhile that the bubble bursts. Either that or its going to go down the way it does in the US in terms of television. People paying on a PPV basis for nearly everything. Its frightening to what lenghts Americans are willing to pay for sports events. $50/£25 on big matches? Then you have all the other sports of basketball, baseball, UFC, racing. Its crazy. I was glad Sky ditched their Prem Plus matches when if you didnt have the season ticket you could order games individually. You had to be a mug to buy a game for £12 a pop. Truly frightening - Super Bowl, World Series, Stanley Cup, NBA finals, 4 NFL games every weekend, countless baseball, basketball games available FREE if you have a television and an old-fashioned aerial, oh, and the Olympics. The only sport I pay for by PPV (and usually regret) are England games. It is true that most boxing and a lot of wrestling is available on PPV. I do pay monthly subscriptions to get Fox Soccer Channel and Setanta USA but not at a rate of $25 per match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 It is true that most boxing and a lot of wrestling is available on PPV. and of course most of that is on PPV in this country as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Shearer Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 (edited) They didn't intentionally ditch it, it was because the Competition Commission at the EU and the Monopolies Commission in the UK decided that Sky couldn't have exclusive rights over ALL of the live Premier League games. So, in the interests of "increased competition and a better deal for the consumer", fans now get to pay £129.90 for 10 months' worth of Setanta Sports instead of the £50 Prem Plus season ticket. What fantastic value. Yes it was £50 for a Prem Plus ticket but that was in addition to already having a Sky Sports package. To be fair with Setanta that £129.90 isnt just for football though as you get other sports too including boxing and UFC. Edited 23 September, 2008 by Johnny Shearer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoswellSaint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 American Football, teaches us exactly why everything in the US is driven by money and success. Failure on the field is not a part of the franchise system that infects US team sports. Relegation battles are not part of the equation. The only way that the fans suffer "relegation" is when the owner decides to move the franchise to a city where he can make more money. Franchises that are fed players by a college system that produces millions in revenue to support their football programs and crowds of 70,000 plus to watch college football. A college system that encourages the belief that being big, dumb and good at bullying others equates to success in life. Little wonder that this produces a country that is big, dumb and good at bullying others... Mind you, I can already see the effects of the Premiership, populated by players who never went to college and are encouraged in the belief that being small, dumb and good at whining at the ref., equates to success in life. Little wonder this produces a country that is small, dumb and good at whining... Interesting perspective! But then Britain used to be good at bullying people. Again, I didn't say the system was perfect. College football is an interesting beast. The players who generate the millions of dollars are not allowed to benefit bar a free education. There are half-hearted attempts to improve graduation rates so the vast majority that won't make millions in the NFL can embark on a career. But there are many who are only at college because they can play football not because they are smart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Shearer Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Truly frightening - Super Bowl, World Series, Stanley Cup, NBA finals, 4 NFL games every weekend, countless baseball, basketball games available FREE if you have a television and an old-fashioned aerial, oh, and the Olympics. The only sport I pay for by PPV (and usually regret) are England games. It is true that most boxing and a lot of wrestling is available on PPV. I do pay monthly subscriptions to get Fox Soccer Channel and Setanta USA but not at a rate of $25 per match. Ah ok, may have jumped the gun there then but am sure I have seen those numbers bandied around before. I'll have another look into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostBoys Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 ....we are in a better position than many think, to survive. The pain we have gone through will be ten times worse for the "bigger" clubs over the coming months. It will happen soon and the pigs who have been at the Sky Sports trough will find that it will soon be empty. The balance sheets of these mercenary armies(or their banks) will soon be found to be nothing more than a mirage of creative accounting, that the Premier League have ignored for too long. Ashley has lost over £300M on HBOS shares, allegedly. A firesale of Newcastle is on the cards and relegation is not out of the question. If we found it hard, how will they cope? Even Man U, Liverpool and Arsenal are not immune to the firestorm engulfing the world's economy. Massive debts built on the assumption that there is an inifinite apetite for overpaid foreigners kicking a ball around at a strange time on the weekend (ie not 3:00pm on a Saturday) are going to be unsustainable and with many of the property assets (£10M for Fratton Park, anyone???) underpinning the balance sheets, a slight nudge that propelled some of the biggest financial institutions into oblivion, will be all it takes. Live with the pain at Southampton Football Club, turn up to as many of the games as possible, because soon, our model of sustainable football covered by income from the pockets of the real fans will be the daily diet of many of the clubs in the Premiership. As they sink, we will rise again, on the back of a vision of the economic reality that so many people are having to face in the financial community, but few inside football can see. Just be glad we are facing up to it now. Those in denial, not a few miles down the M27 will soon be jolted into a world of pain, along with a few others and their journey will go downhill far more rapidly than ours..... An interesting series of points but not valid to SFC sat at the foot of the Championship through total not just financial poor management. While I agree that the football balloon cannot continue to fill up with water your predicted collapse of the Premiership will not occur while the games are broadcast live around the world on pay TV with increasing numbers of viewers. Again I agree that PFC will implode if their owner (whichever Gaydamak) has some nasty financial and penal measures imposed on him, i am not sure how their demise will benefit us one iota. They are not in denial just in the Premiership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 As soon as the Sky money goes down, so does the hush money paid by the PL to the football league clubs. Maybe then there will be some revolt but to what extent? The big clubs will get stronger regardless, they are the ones with the large fan base and at the top of the food chain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 With the Prem League arguing about their '39th game' I'd be very happy to see the foreign-owned clubs playing all their games overseas. Fixture list of Lagos Toon v Stateside Scousers; USAMU v Arabic Arsenal; Ukrain Chelsea v Dubai ManCity, and only a handful of home country players, doesn't really have a place in the UK now, let alone in the future, so it would be great to see them pack their bags and we could get back to having an English Football League, with a few overseas or European players for sure, but a core of players qualified to play for England. It won't happen, but its nice to have a vision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weston Super Saint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I think the biggest shock will come to the over hyped / valued / paid players, who will inevitably see wages come tumbling down and instead of earning £millions every year, will earn just a few £100k.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
once_bitterne Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I've been hoping for awhile that the bubble bursts. Either that or its going to go down the way it does in the US in terms of television. People paying on a PPV basis for nearly everything. Its frightening to what lenghts Americans are willing to pay for sports events. $50/£25 on big matches? Then you have all the other sports of basketball, baseball, UFC, racing. Its crazy. I was glad Sky ditched their Prem Plus matches when if you didnt have the season ticket you could order games individually. You had to be a mug to buy a game for £12 a pop. What you have posted above is completely and utterly incorrect. What we in the UK have done with regard to paying for sports on tv is far far far above and beyond what has happened in the US. The major sports in the US - MLB, NFL and the NBA, ALL have almost all of their televised games show on the four main terrestial stations (NBC, CBS, ABC and Fox) and these can all still be received by anyone in the US who can stick a coat hanger in the back of their TVs... The small amount of games that aren't on terrestial tv are on cable channels such as ESPN which are part of the 'basic cable' package of channels that anyone getting cable tv will be provided with. There are no NFL, NBA, or MLB games on any of their 'premium' cable channels like HBO (which are the equivilant of Sky Sports) As for everything being on ppv, well apart from boxing, WWE and UFC there is very little sport on ppv and certainly none of their big 3 sports. I would like to see the reaction from the American population if the NFL did try and sign a deal to only show the NFL on a premium cable channel. I really can't see it happening.... ever. The amount paid for the tv rights for the NFL is comparable with what the FA get for the Prem League but there is a difference in where this money comes from. In the US it is from the tv companies who get their revenue from tv advertising (think how much a Super Bowl commerical costs) opposed to Sky who get their money from all of us paying £50+ a month for their service. "Its frightening to what lengths Americans are willing to pay for sports events" is it? Well all they actually have to pay is the cost of a tv (and not even a license to go with it!) Also, Sky did not 'ditch' Prem Plus they were forced to give up that portion of the tv deal by the EU. The replacement is what is shown on Setanta.... Other that that, your post was bang on............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Shearer Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 (edited) And if you see my later post I replied, saying that I jumped the gun - implying what I stated was not all correct which was point out by Roswell. And as a result am looking into it a bit more before posting more on the subject that isnt all drivel! Edited 23 September, 2008 by Johnny Shearer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsdinho Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 All conjecture... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowllyd Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Those in denial, not a few miles down the M27 will soon be jolted into a world of pain, along with a few others and their journey will go downhill far more rapidly than ours..... Let's hope so - and, to make things a little more interesting for them, there's this: http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/sep/23/portsmouth.premierleague No doubt the Premier League will do their usual load of bugger all, but it made me laugh nonetheless... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cambsaint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I agree with the diagnosis, but not the prognosis. IMO a European Super League cannot be far away, and it will probably grow to include Asian clubs in time. I now hope for this with perhaps eight UK clubs-Arsenal, Chelsea, Glasgow Celtic and Rangers, Liverpool, Man City and United, and possibly Newcastle and a Birmingham club. Possibly with a minimum of five or six nationals in each team. We would then return to the sane and sensible model of the pre Prem divisions, and would see sensibly financed and reasonably paid predominantly home talent feeding the super-clubs. I used to see this as a threat, frankly now it can't come soon enough for me. Cambsaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itchen Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 (edited) I think the next few months are going to be interesting for satellite broadcasters as people feel the economic pinch. I remember reading about publicans also scrapping Sky because the huge hike in fees was not being covered by increased bar sales. Couple that with people at home facing increased fuel and food bills as well as, in some cases, uncertain employment prospects and you could see Sky and Setanta's subscriber base falling (as well as even fewer people going to pubs). While it is unlikely (impossible?) that current deals with the Premier League can be downsized I doubt that the next deal will be anything like as big as this one unless there is a sudden global economic upturn. That's when the chickens will come home to roost for heavily leveraged clubs like Man U. Those with billionaire individual owners like Man C or QPR will probably be OK though. I just hope that we have survived long enough for our business model of living within our means (once we have removed the immediate debts) to see us through. Edited 23 September, 2008 by itchen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Actually, Nick, the American football model has a lot going for it - apart from the lack of relegation. It is a very socialistic model. Most revenue is shared, there is a strict salary cap and the worst teams each year get the first choice of the best young players. It means that at the start of the season most teams have a good chance of reaching the play-offs. Rarely does a team come to dominate and certainly not through money. Green Bay, a small city, can compete with Dallas, New York, etc. There is no big 4 that dominate every year. The UK is a completely different Mind Set to our friends in the USA The Clubs run Football ... the Sweet FA don't ........ a good illustration is the Punishments handed out by the mighty FA to some Lower League Teams ( who do not possess the financial "Clout" to fight back. ........ But the FA could NEVER impose such penalty's on ANY Team in the Prem ......... they would be told to go forth and multiply in no uncertain terms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloridaMarlin Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 I agree with the diagnosis, but not the prognosis. IMO a European Super League cannot be far away, and it will probably grow to include Asian clubs in time. I now hope for this with perhaps eight UK clubs-Arsenal, Chelsea, Glasgow Celtic and Rangers, Liverpool, Man City and United, and possibly Newcastle and a Birmingham club. Possibly with a minimum of five or six nationals in each team. We would then return to the sane and sensible model of the pre Prem divisions, and would see sensibly financed and reasonably paid predominantly home talent feeding the super-clubs. I used to see this as a threat, frankly now it can't come soon enough for me. Cambsaint With a world league not far behind that. The Premier League know they are in competition for the hearts, minds, souls and wallets of global audiences with sports like Baseball (which now opens its season in Japan) and NFL, which plays in the Prem's own backyard. I've waffled on about this before but I can see a day not far enough when two or more major major satellite tv providers join forces to try and crack the Chinese and Far Eastern markets. As others have stated, this audience is not interested in Bolton v Wigan, or even Newcastle v Sunderland. They want Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea, and while a European League appears to be the next step, it's not exactly a quantum leap from that, to the point where you take the top European sides, four from South America, two from Australasia, two ffrom the Middle East/Africa and you can flog it all over the world. Fifa and Uefa will be told to get lost if they try and interfere, in the same way the cricket authorities were by Kerry Packer, whose attitude was: "Try and outlaw and blackball us if you want, but I've got the best players and people will watch my tournaments." A world league would spell the death fo the World Cup, something Murdoch would certainly not mourn as he hates organisations like Fifa who refuse to sell the rights of the World Cup finals to satellite/cable TV in preference for taking their game to the masses via terrestiral tv. Murdoch would love to stuff Fifa out of sight. Pie in the sky? Not really. Whispers about a world league have already been circulating enough to get execs at the Beeb concerned about the prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Call the big 4's bluff and let them form a breakaway league with the 'elite'. No doubt the collapse of international football will follow, but f*ck them, the greedy bastards. I don't think the appetite is there to sustain this folly. The days of the big clubs holding everyone else to ransom has to stop. I like Platini and what he says. Clubs are effectively cheating by operating under huge debts. Smaller clubs in this country would benefit from a limit on foreigners in squads, more money would filter down to smaller clubs. Personally, I think the competition was better in the 70's. Teams were more evenly matched, were more home-grown and promoted teams had more of a fighting chance of staying up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 (edited) ... Edited 23 September, 2008 by Wade Garrett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Hopefully Setanta will go bust, not being allowed to watch even the highlights of your national team of terrestrial TV is just out of order. Apparantly the England fans were siging "we hate Setanta" at one of the games - there is only so much you can hold people to ransom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole1 Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Hopefully Setanta will go bust, not being allowed to watch even the highlights of your national team of terrestrial TV is just out of order. Apparantly the England fans were siging "we hate Setanta" at one of the games - there is only so much you can hold people to ransom. I read somewhere only 200,000 people watched the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 23 September, 2008 Share Posted 23 September, 2008 Clubs up and down the country are feeling the pinch. On that note, I am now off for a 450 mile round trip to Rotherham. And they had better entertain me! I do hope that someone told 1976 to go to Sheffield not Rotherham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guided Missile Posted 5 August, 2009 Author Share Posted 5 August, 2009 Nostradamus lives..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James_O_Mac Posted 5 August, 2009 Share Posted 5 August, 2009 Nostradamus lives..... Do like to blow your own bubble don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenridge Posted 5 August, 2009 Share Posted 5 August, 2009 Do like to blow your own bubble don't you? Has John got a monkey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustMike Posted 5 August, 2009 Share Posted 5 August, 2009 people have been saying this for years...and it still hasnt happened. Average gates still increase, stadiums improve and the football is still quality to watch. maybe it will burst but imo it will be due to a euro league rather than sky and money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW11_Saint Posted 5 August, 2009 Share Posted 5 August, 2009 Nostradamus lives..... Strange that you're patting yourself on the back for lauding a "strategy" that went catastrophically t*ts-up! The only reason we're out the other end is because ML came in and saved us after L*** experimental disaster hit ground, as we all anticipated. You are right though that other clubs might have to go through what we have been through, possibly in the Prem, possibly not too far from us... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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