How many more are big enough to apologise?

[corsacar saint]

I am big enough to apologise for two things, firstly passing on the rumour that the club was for sale and secondly maligning Les Read in a couple of posts.

Katarina Liebherr, has been true to her word and deserves a massive ammount of praise for that.One or two morons on here, have been nothing short of disgraceful, in some of their posts towards her, Perhaps they are not Saints fans,but they know who they are. Why did the mods not delete those posts?

[70's Mike]

whilst i understand where you are coming from, it is healthy that some ask questions and doubt the Directors and Owners. If a few more had done that at Fratton , who knows what might of happened.

[Andy Durman]

I'm proud of myself! At Brighton I shook Les Reeds hand and told him what a great job he was doing under such incredible pressure and that his shoulders must be broad.

 

Turns out my faith in him has been rewarded with expectation.

 

Well done Les Reed

[corsacar saint]

Mike, some were very personal in their condemnation of KL that is my main point.

[Andy Durman]

I am big enough to apologise for two things, firstly passing on the rumour that the club was for sale and secondly maligning Les Read in a couple of posts.

Katarina Liebherr, has been true to her word and deserves a massive ammount of praise for that.One or two morons on here, have been nothing short of disgraceful, in some of their posts towards her, Perhaps they are not Saints fans,but they know who they are. Why did the mods not delete those posts?

 

You can also apologise for spelling Les Reeds name wrong!

[corsacar saint]

Spot on Andy

[pap]

Mike, some were very personal in their condemnation of KL that is my main point.

 

Some are very personal when condemning fellow posters. Is it your contention that KL is a special case on account of her being the owner, or will you fight against the injustice of personal attacks on here from now on?

[NorthamSteve]

I agree with the sentiment of the op but I don't think a) you'd get an apology from, what seem to be, overly opinionated people that base there opinions on what they hear not what they can find out for themselves. Or b) you should really be poking this particular wasp's nest.

 

i think people react rather strangely when change happens, especially when you don't have control over it. Also, SFC is a thing that everyone here loves, has invested in and, to that end, people do react in unusual ways when something they love looks under threat. Put the two together and you have people acting in quite bizarre ways. But it's all for good reason and nothing that we haven't all done for the sake of what we feel is right for the club.

 

Probably best just to let it go. Now, we look in a really strong position once more. No one can say that we're losers in the summer, the only thing that is stopping us now is ourselves. I for one am quite excited about this change. Lets just crack on, shall we?

[Fitzhugh Fella]

I am big enough to apologise for two things, firstly passing on the rumour that the club was for sale and secondly maligning Les Read in a couple of posts.

Katarina Liebherr, has been true to her word and deserves a massive ammount of praise for that.One or two morons on here, have been nothing short of disgraceful, in some of their posts towards her, Perhaps they are not Saints fans,but they know who they are. Why did the mods not delete those posts?

 

Andy as someone else has commented elsewhere don't beat yourself about passing on the fact the club is for sale. I think you will find most clubs are "available" if the right price could be found but some owners are in no particular rush. I am just about to move into a new house so selling it is the last thing on my mind, but if someone rang me up and offered me a £1m for it, I would bite their hand off. Ever since Cortese arrived I have heard we are up for sale so the rumour you heard was just another regurgitation probably. The positive news for me is that KL seems to have found a genuine affection for the club, judging by the nos of away matches she attends and the fact that her director box enthusiasm is there for all to see.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Some are very personal when condemning fellow posters. Is it your contention that KL is a special case on account of her being the owner, or will you fight against the injustice of personal attacks on here from now on?

 

I think it's a different thing though, the vitriolic nature of the insults to Kat were different to those against Alpine which generally aren't as 'hate' induced.

 

Couple that with her being a woman'n'all...

[KelvinsRightGlove]

Andy as someone else has commented elsewhere don't beat yourself about passing on the fact the club is for sale. I think you will find most clubs are "available" if the right price could be found but some owners are in no particular rush. I am just about to move into a new house so selling it is the last thing on my mind, but if someone rang me up and offered me a £1m for it, I would bite their hand off. Ever since Cortese arrived I have heard we are up for sale so the rumour you heard was just another regurgitation probably. The positive news for me is that KL seems to have found a genuine affection for the club, judging by the nos of away matches she attends and the fact that her director box enthusiasm is there for all to see.

 

Do you mean left? Or have you been hearing this for 5 years?

[pap]

I think it's a different thing though, the vitriolic nature of the insults to Kat were different to those against Alpine which generally aren't as 'hate' induced.

 

Couple that with her being a woman'n'all...

 

It's pretty much the same, imo.

 

The only difference is that KL is rich and owns the football club.

 

My POV is that if you chuck personal insults at other posters, you've no right to complain about others having a pop at KL. If you do, you look like a doff-capping deferent hypocrite pr!ck.

[NorthamSteve]

It's pretty much the same, imo.

 

If you do, you look like a doff-capping deferent hypocrite pr!ck.

 

Hehe. Quite.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

It's pretty much the same, imo.

 

The only difference is that KL is rich and owns the football club.

 

My POV is that if you chuck personal insults at other posters, you've no right to complain about others having a pop at KL. If you do, you look like a doff-capping deferent hypocrite pr!ck.

 

Yeah, I can see that, especially if you take it back to its literal roots, but instill believe in a bit of chivalry, and that to an extent in certain situations (insults etc) women should be afforded a little more respect.

[Fan The Flames]

whilst i understand where you are coming from' date=' it is healthy that some ask questions and doubt the Directors and Owners. If a few more had done that at Fratton , who knows what might of happened.[/quote']

 

So if people in Pompey moaned more about not spending enough cash on wages or transfer fees they wouldn't have gone bust.

 

The last defence of the moaners is that somehow they changed things, I think not.

[Redslo]

Some are very personal when condemning fellow posters. Is it your contention that KL is a special case on account of her being the owner, or will you fight against the injustice of personal attacks on here from now on?

 

I think the point is that insulting KL's competence was fair game, albeit something that looks misguided right now. However, insulting her appearance, weight, gender, morality, or suggesting she was betraying her father's legacy was not. Asking for an apology for such insults is pointless, however, since the appropriateness of the attacks was not reduced by recent events. They were inappropriate when made.

 

This reminds me a little of a letter to the editor of Sports Illustrated written by a Penn State Football fan in the aftermath of the child molestation scandal. He stated that Penn State Football would come back stronger than ever thereby proving its critics wrong. Not the point since the critics were complaining about the molestation and cover up, not the quality of the football.

[Dellman]

You can also apologise for spelling Les Reeds name wrong!

 

It is Les Reed's name not Les Reeds name, if you must be correct

[whelk]

So if people in Pompey moaned more about not spending enough cash on wages or transfer fees they wouldn't have gone bust.

 

The last defence of the moaners is that somehow they changed things, I think not.

 

Exactly Piers Morgan the ultimate cvnt fan slags off Wenger everytime they lose calling for his head. Similarly derides decision to give Ramsey a new contract. When proven wrong over time claims it was he who inspired improvement. Allowing a little tongue in cheek and out of control narcissism but same principles of the weak minded chumps who stuck their 'head above the parapet' and now claim it were them that done it.

So amusing that they probably believe it.

Edited 3 September, 2014 by whelk

[70's Mike]

So if people in Pompey moaned more about not spending enough cash on wages or transfer fees they wouldn't have gone bust.

 

The last defence of the moaners is that somehow they changed things, I think not.

 

"not spending enough" ?

[Jonnyboy]

Every club is for sale for the right price.

[oldskoolsi]

I can understand people thinking the club was going to be sold. I rarely, if ever, believe anything said in interviews as history has shown everyone has a price and it always should be taken with a pinch of salt. A lot dpends on how media savvy a player/manager/owner is rather than what they actually want to say. I much prefer to look at actions, and ours, at the time, was one the biggest selling sprees ever and little said by those in charge reassured me. Over time players were replaced and all was good, nothing to do with what was said in press though.

 

However I still refused to accept Morgan would stay until 23.00 on Monday, despite all the assurances that he would.

 

Just call me as glass half emty person.

[dronskisaint]

Exactly Piers Morgan the ultimate cvnt fan slags off Wenger everytime they lose calling for his head. Similarly derides decision to give Ramsey a new contract. When proven wrong over time claims it was he who inspired improvement. Allowing a little tongue in cheek and out of control narcissism but same principles of the weak minded chumps who stuck their 'head above the parapet' and now claim it were them that done it.

So amusing that they probably believe it.

 

A point well analogised!

[Dalek2003]

Fat chance, many have still not apologised for their part in the 2004 debacle !

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Do you mean left? Or have you been hearing this for 5 years?

No I meant arrived

[Professor]

Will corsacarsaint apologise for starting another divisive thread aimed at creating argument amongst Saints' fans. Give it a rest.

[Fan The Flames]

"not spending enough" ?

 

Pompey went pop because they overspent on wages and fees; do you really think fans are going to be the 'critical friend' when someone else is bankrolling their dream. Fans only bleat when the purse strings are pulled tight, just like our fans did this summer. They euphemistically claim 'we lost our ambition' when they really meant was 'spend more of your money for us', then demanded 'do something so I can trust you again'. No balls.

[musesaint]

My bed has remained dry throughout the summer. Look at my avatar!

 

We owe a huge amount to KL ... With a father like hers why did people seriously believe she'd fall short of his dreams for SFC? It's the greedy players who jumped ship to chase more money who tarnish his memory

 

Rant over haha

[Kingsland Red]

After this board has been through getting relegated from the Championship, losing 10 points and searching for a new owner 5 years ago, the meltdown this summer was a bit surprising. All the club did was sold a few players for top prices to top clubs, before they got replacements.

Let's hope that the doom mongers have learnt that the transfer window works with the top clubs having first dibs on players , then the rest get a look in. As Koeman says, that's football !

Next summer we should have a nice calm approach on here …....

[Roger]

After this board has been through getting relegated from the Championship, losing 10 points and searching for a new owner 5 years ago, the meltdown this summer was a bit surprising. All the club did was sold a few players for top prices to top clubs, before they got replacements.

Let's hope that the doom mongers have learnt that the transfer window works with the top clubs having first dibs on players , then the rest get a look in. As Koeman says, that's football !

Next summer we should have a nice calm approach on here …....

 

Don't agree with you. It was understandable to be negative with all the players leaving. Also, with season ticket prices going up again it was a natural reaction to be down about things. It's because people care about the club that they were down. If people want to keep completely positive all the time then fair enough but don't think you can criticise people for moaning at the time.

[Roger]

whilst i understand where you are coming from' date=' it is healthy that some ask questions and doubt the Directors and Owners. If a few more had done that at Fratton , who knows what might of happened.[/quote']

 

Andy as someone else has commented elsewhere don't beat yourself about passing on the fact the club is for sale. I think you will find most clubs are "available" if the right price could be found but some owners are in no particular rush. I am just about to move into a new house so selling it is the last thing on my mind, but if someone rang me up and offered me a £1m for it, I would bite their hand off. Ever since Cortese arrived I have heard we are up for sale so the rumour you heard was just another regurgitation probably. The positive news for me is that KL seems to have found a genuine affection for the club, judging by the nos of away matches she attends and the fact that her director box enthusiasm is there for all to see.

 

After this board has been through getting relegated from the Championship, losing 10 points and searching for a new owner 5 years ago, the meltdown this summer was a bit surprising. All the club did was sold a few players for top prices to top clubs, before they got replacements.

Let's hope that the doom mongers have learnt that the transfer window works with the top clubs having first dibs on players , then the rest get a look in. As Koeman says, that's football !

Next summer we should have a nice calm approach on here …....

 

I agree we have done some good business but still wouldn't say 4 million for lambert was a good deal tbh. I know there was the sentiment issue but I still think we should have asked for more than that as there's no sentiment in football anymore apparantly.

[SarniaSaint]

So apologize for what? The communication from the club was disastrous in fact non-existant.

[SarniaSaint]

I agree we have done some good business but still wouldn't say 4 million for lambert was a good deal tbh. I know there was the sentiment issue but I still think we should have asked for more than that as there's no sentiment in football anymore apparantly.

 

Probably the only true valuation we received LOL

[SW5 SAINT]

I wonder how much tonights England debut by Chambers cost Arsenal?

[SaintBobby]

When the cost of fretting and complaining is basically zero, you can expect many people to fret and complain.

 

This is why internet fora are so intense and shouty. Lots of noise and no signal.

 

In their more reflective moments, people like Alpine know that they don't have the slightest clue about how to close deals quickly in a transfer window. None. He has no experience or insight whatsoever in his area and no one has ever decided to pay any money at all for his views or advice. Not a single person and not a single penny. Anywhere. Ever. In the history of humanity.

 

This is, however, no barrier at all to him commenting on the transfer window. Nor should it be. But we can just blank out such views.

 

If they had merit, they would be paid for them.

[georgeweahscousin]

I like to think I kept a balanced view of things.

 

The only thing that really annoyed me was some people's blind faith in now ex-players words over that of the board. All this 'the club has lost it's ambition' crap was hilarious yet it sucked so many in.

 

If anyone seriously believes Lovren, Lallana, Shaw and Chambers wouldn't have wanted their moves in any other situation then it is either serious naivety or hero worship gone mad.

[Professor]

When the cost of fretting and complaining is basically zero, you can expect many people to fret and complain.

 

This is why internet fora are so intense and shouty. Lots of noise and no signal.

 

In their more reflective moments, people like Alpine know that they don't have the slightest clue about how to close deals quickly in a transfer window. None. He has no experience or insight whatsoever in his area and no one has ever decided to pay any money at all for his views or advice. Not a single person and not a single penny. Anywhere. Ever. In the history of humanity.

 

This is, however, no barrier at all to him commenting on the transfer window. Nor should it be. But we can just blank out such views.

 

 

How much are you paid for your opinions or are they as worthless as mine? Never mind, lets all continue to give them for free, which is why an anonymous forum is entertaining. If you did actually blank out views you dislike they wouldn't upset you but isn't that part of the fun?

[Professor]

I wonder how much tonights England debut by Chambers cost Arsenal?

 

It does mean that we have sold 4 full England internationals. That must surely be unprecedented. We still have two more in the squad (Forster and JRod) as well as a potential England call-up for Clyne. Was it really unrealistic to think that this team could have reached the Champions' League when it was supplying so many players for England without taking account of quality players such as Schneiderlin, Wanyama and Lovren filling the non-English gaps.

[Saint86]

Can I be clear, you want people who doubted the direction of the club at this point to apologise? Or you want people who used personal insults against the board and in particular Kat to apologise?

 

Don't think you should be expecting the former (vast majority of the fan base) to apologise, very legitimate concerns were held at that time and it was the destruction of the past 5 years of the clubs history, and looked for all the while like the first team was being dismantled whilst the board sat there and lied through their teeth.

 

I wonder, if we had been demoted to a couple of leagues how much flack the "trust the board blindly brigade" would have kopped for dream walking the club into the abyss. Much like the flack we gave pompey for being oblivious to their financial ruin. The club's fans are its soul, heart and conscience, and they have a duty to question and observe everything imho, they are then able to ride both the ups and downs. If you can't do that, and you don't withstand and understand the downs then you won't enjoy the ups. And regardless what people say, this summer was a very shaky period for the club, first team being dismantled why the board lied through their teeth.

 

That said, they have turned it around now, and credit is due for that. I don't particularity think that any side owes anyone apology for the above, simply a case of the board and fans having to trust and understand each other to build a better club... after this summer I would expect the club to be stronger as a whole.

 

As for the people who hurled personal insults and Kat, the family and the board. On the one hand I can accept their passion got the best of them, but they do look foolish and premature now, and apologies should be offered.

 

Doubt you will see them either.

 

Still waiting for Saint Richmond to resign from the forum, since Morgan and Jayrod are still at the club.... and he got baited into making that bet with another poster on deadline day.... That won't happen either.

[Halo Stickman]

I like to think I kept a balanced view of things.

 

The only thing that really annoyed me was some people's blind faith in now ex-players words over that of the board. All this 'the club has lost it's ambition' crap was hilarious yet it sucked so many in.

 

If anyone seriously believes Lovren, Lallana, Shaw and Chambers wouldn't have wanted their moves in any other situation then it is either serious naivety or hero worship gone mad.

 

Agree with every word of that.

 

It appears that some people still fail to grasp the reality that very few players have the same emotional attachment to their club as do the supporters. Those same people also fail to grasp the reality that very few players will do what Gaston Ramirez allegedly did when he joined us, namely, say that we’d made him a financial offer he couldn’t refuse.

 

Money, money, money. If each of us was paid, say, £30,000 each week to support Saints, then offered 2 or 3 times that amount to support some other f*cking team, how many of us would decline that offer? Quite a few I suspect, but when push comes to shove? Unfortunately – or perhaps fortunately – none of us will ever find out.

[CB Fry]

It does mean that we have sold 4 full England internationals. That must surely be unprecedented. We still have two more in the squad (Forster and JRod) as well as a potential England call-up for Clyne. Was it really unrealistic to think that this team could have reached the Champions' League when it was supplying so many players for England without taking account of quality players such as Schneiderlin, Wanyama and Lovren filling the non-English gaps.

He wasn't an England International when we sold him so it means no such thing.

[CB Fry]

I like to think I kept a balanced view of things.

 

The only thing that really annoyed me was some people's blind faith in now ex-players words over that of the board. All this 'the club has lost it's ambition' crap was hilarious yet it sucked so many in.

 

If anyone seriously believes Lovren, Lallana, Shaw and Chambers wouldn't have wanted their moves in any other situation then it is either serious naivety or hero worship gone mad.

 

Agree with every word of that.

 

It appears that some people still fail to grasp the reality that very few players have the same emotional attachment to their club as do the supporters. Those same people also fail to grasp the reality that very few players will do what Gaston Ramirez allegedly did when he joined us, namely, say that we’d made him a financial offer he couldn’t refuse.

 

Money, money, money. If each of us was paid, say, £30,000 each week to support Saints, then offered 2 or 3 times that amount to support some other f*cking team, how many of us would decline that offer? Quite a few I suspect, but when push comes to shove? Unfortunately – or perhaps fortunately – none of us will ever find out.

Correct.

 

The most laughable issue throughout the summer was the constant accusations that Reed, Ralph and Co were lying to us ("Abusing us" according to one forum genius) while the white lies and double talk from the players was swallowed whole.

 

Far too many dim fans happy to swallow the "I would have stayed but the ambition changed" tripe while at the same time calling out Reed for lying and thinking how jolly clever they are.

 

The departing players played the gullible fans like a dream and strolled off to their six figure weekly wages no problem.

[Sour Mash]

Correct.

 

The most laughable issue throughout the summer was the constant accusations that Reed, Ralph and Co were lying to us ("Abusing us" according to one forum genius) while the white lies and double talk from the players was swallowed whole.

 

Far too many dim fans happy to swallow the "I would have stayed but the ambition changed" tripe while at the same time calling out Reed for lying and thinking how jolly clever they are.

 

The departing players played the gullible fans like a dream and strolled off to their six figure weekly wages no problem.

Agreed, but it wasn't just one or two loons, but regular posters filling up these pages, day in, day out with their "expert theories", how they get by in life I'll never know.

[monkadill]

Its the state of the nation i'm afraid, most people will cling to disparity than rather look for a the positives and have some faith. Just look at the news media that thrives of doom. Aggression and anger is the easies emotion to express especially behind the protection of a keyboard and computer.

[Danger Mouse]

So there were people who thought, due to a series of events including our ambitious chairman mysteriously stepping down, a new chairman being appointed with no experience in the sport, promises that there wouldn't be a fire sale, the subsequent sale of a number of our best players who appeared to be jumping ship; that our club was heading for tough times. We can all see though hindsight that they were wrong.

 

Fair enough (although it remains to be seen whether the board would be willing to spend the money required to maintain our Premier League status when we don't have 4-5 players who we can sell for a combined ~£90m).

 

What I find to be utterly repugnant and embarrassingly childish though is the pathetic gloating context of the subject of this thread and others like it.

 

"We were right, you were wrong HAA HAA! Go on, admit it... you were wrong!"

 

Seriously?

 

****ing grow up.

[eelpie]

Isn't this being covered eloquently and in more detail on the Judgement Day thread? Reconciliation following this summer's painful and worrying crisis that affected everyone in different ways would be better than righteously demanding apologies.

 

Anyone who publicly abused individual members of the board including Katherina was out of order, and they could apologise directly privately or publicly. It is a matter of their own conscience imo.

[The9]

It's pretty much the same, imo.

 

The only difference is that KL is rich and owns the football club.

 

My POV is that if you chuck personal insults at other posters, you've no right to complain about others having a pop at KL. If you do, you look like a doff-capping deferent hypocrite pr!ck.

 

The little matter of her not being able to respond as well - I suspect a lot of the insulters wouldn't have said it if she had an account, never mind to her face.

[The9]

So there were people who thought, due to a series of events including our ambitious chairman mysteriously stepping down, a new chairman being appointed with no experience in the sport, promises that there wouldn't be a fire sale, the subsequent sale of a number of our best players who appeared to be jumping ship; that our club was heading for tough times. We can all see though hindsight that they were wrong.

 

Fair enough (although it remains to be seen whether the board would be willing to spend the money required to maintain our Premier League status when we don't have 4-5 players who we can sell for a combined ~£90m).

 

What I find to be utterly repugnant and embarrassingly childish though is the pathetic gloating context of the subject of this thread and others like it.

 

"We were right, you were wrong HAA HAA! Go on, admit it... you were wrong!"

 

Seriously?

 

****ing grow up.

 

Nothing mysterious about Cortese stepping down. Also, the thread was started by someone who was admitting they were wrong.

 

FWIW I think a fair amount of stick for the knee-jerkism and conclusion-jumping that was required to adopt that position in the first place is fair, not that it'll make those kind of posters think about it more next time anyway.

 

The closest I got was considering the FFP regulations as a possible motive for the sales and wavering for a couple of days in my (continuing) belief that the club might be sold at some point but the owner isn't doing anything in particular to market it. In fact my response to Crab Lungs' revelations within 24 hours of the Lovren and Chambers sales was "so basically we'll see if we sign 6 players in the next 35 days or so". We signed 7 (and released 7).

[The9]

I agree we have done some good business but still wouldn't say 4 million for lambert was a good deal tbh. I know there was the sentiment issue but I still think we should have asked for more than that as there's no sentiment in football anymore apparantly.

 

The most pertinent quote about that I heard was "name another player over the age of 31 that's been transferred for more". The closest I got was Emile Heskey!

[Killers Knee]

I would apologise if I wasn't so big

[Wes Tender]

Anyone who publicly abused individual members of the board including Katherina was out of order, and they could apologise directly privately or publicly. It is a matter of their own conscience imo.

 

You credit those who hurled their puerile insults at Katherina or the board with far too much integrity and honour if you believe that they might be capable of having a conscience, let alone a guilty one.

 

The least we can expect of them is that in the near future they will be a bit sheepish about having been made to look foolish, but I don't hold out much hope that they will have learned any lessons in humility when any similar situation arises in the future, unless they mature and grow up in the meantime.