Coronavirus

[whelk]

It is bs when people say everyone wants it over. There are people who hate risk and this is their time. Enjoying their introverted lifestyle. Follow the data not the dates but this is becoming inconvenient for the lockdown addicts.

Edited 1 June, 2021 by whelk

[Jimmy_D]

15 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

What you say is true, but should what is happening in other countries be reason enough to keep killing our own economy and peoples livelihoods? I don't think so.

We're on top of it through vaccinations and treatment in our hospitals. The death figures today of 0 should send a sigh of relief to everyone and for me should be even more strength to June 21st still happening. Death figures haven't been in double figures for weeks now, they've been dropping and dropping. That shows that vaccinations are working, and so far the perceived panic over this Indian variant isn't translating into the figures that really do matter and what any decisions should be based on.

I don't see any reason to panic anymore and come June 21st we should be free to live our lives as we wish and use our own common sense as we see fit. I'm fed up of living in a world full of people who require a rule book before they step across a road.

The current level of restrictions and vaccination aren’t enough to stop COVID cases spreading and increasing exponentially here, probably due to what’s now known as the Delta variant, previously known as the Indian variant.

I absolutely hate that that’s the case, but here we are.

Right now is the best time to put a stop to that. The speed of the vaccine rollout will help, but there isn’t enough data yet whether that alone will keep hospitalisations and deaths down to ‘acceptable’ levels.

The trouble with leaving it to individuals is that the risk to every individual is genuinely low. No one would choose to keep restricting themselves, and that leads to a massive problem overall with more deaths than anyone would want.

Cases and deaths were incredibly low last summer for a long time until a variant meant that the restrictions in place weren’t enough to stop exponential spread. Then no-one was too worried as numbers were still low, even though they were increasing, then before we knew it there were more cases than it was possible to track, and it was too late to do anything about it. It’s no surprise that people are wary about the possibility of that happening again.

There is a difference this time of course, in that our most vulnerable have been vaccinated, and that will help massively, but considering there seems to be evidence that a single vaccination isn’t enough against the Delta variant, unfortunately we’re nowhere near a position where we can just ignore the threat yet.

Needless to say, it’s an extremely tough call as to which way to go. I certainly wouldn’t want to be the one having to make it.

[whelk]

20 minutes ago, Jimmy_D said:

The current level of restrictions and vaccination aren’t enough to stop COVID cases spreading and increasing exponentially here, probably due to what’s now known as the Delta variant, previously known as the Indian variant.

I absolutely hate that that’s the case, but here we are.

Right now is the best time to put a stop to that. The speed of the vaccine rollout will help, but there isn’t enough data yet whether that alone will keep hospitalisations and deaths down to ‘acceptable’ levels.

The trouble with leaving it to individuals is that the risk to every individual is genuinely low. No one would choose to keep restricting themselves, and that leads to a massive problem overall with more deaths than anyone would want.

Cases and deaths were incredibly low last summer for a long time until a variant meant that the restrictions in place weren’t enough to stop exponential spread. Then no-one was too worried as numbers were still low, even though they were increasing, then before we knew it there were more cases than it was possible to track, and it was too late to do anything about it. It’s no surprise that people are wary about the possibility of that happening again.

There is a difference this time of course, in that our most vulnerable have been vaccinated, and that will help massively, but considering there seems to be evidence that a single vaccination isn’t enough against the Delta variant, unfortunately we’re nowhere near a position where we can just ignore the threat yet.

Needless to say, it’s an extremely tough call as to which way to go. I certainly wouldn’t want to be the one having to make it.

I bet your job is safe to spout this not enough known line?  

[Jimmy_D]

1 minute ago, whelk said:

I bet your job is safe to spout this not enough known line?  

Unfortunately I lost my job last week, so I’m part of the COVID related job loss numbers now. I’ve been saving in case something like this happened, so I’m ok for a while, and I’m hopeful it won’t take too long to find a new one, but obviously it’s not ideal.

[S-Clarke]

30 minutes ago, Jimmy_D said:

The current level of restrictions and vaccination aren’t enough to stop COVID cases spreading and increasing exponentially here, probably due to what’s now known as the Delta variant, previously known as the Indian variant.

I absolutely hate that that’s the case, but here we are.

Right now is the best time to put a stop to that. The speed of the vaccine rollout will help, but there isn’t enough data yet whether that alone will keep hospitalisations and deaths down to ‘acceptable’ levels.

The trouble with leaving it to individuals is that the risk to every individual is genuinely low. No one would choose to keep restricting themselves, and that leads to a massive problem overall with more deaths than anyone would want.

Cases and deaths were incredibly low last summer for a long time until a variant meant that the restrictions in place weren’t enough to stop exponential spread. Then no-one was too worried as numbers were still low, even though they were increasing, then before we knew it there were more cases than it was possible to track, and it was too late to do anything about it. It’s no surprise that people are wary about the possibility of that happening again.

There is a difference this time of course, in that our most vulnerable have been vaccinated, and that will help massively, but considering there seems to be evidence that a single vaccination isn’t enough against the Delta variant, unfortunately we’re nowhere near a position where we can just ignore the threat yet.

Needless to say, it’s an extremely tough call as to which way to go. I certainly wouldn’t want to be the one having to make it.

But what people are trying to say is that there will always be variants, that will never stop. It won't magically stop evolving after 1 year, it will always be there.

So, for that reason alone, do we continue this one foot out....one foot in...approach to life for the rest of our lives?

I don't really fancy that if I'm honest. The Indian variant, in my opinion, is being blown out of all proportion. What we are seeing are increased cases because of increased testing, including self-administered testing, thus many more false positives than usual. If you test on the scale we test then you will always pickup infection rates and you will forever pickup new variants and new spikes of infection as it progresses around, it's how viruses have worked and how they have evolved throughout man kind.

I'll go back to what I said before - the only stats worth listening to are deaths and hospital admissions, if they continue at the very, very, very low rates they currently are at then there is absolutely no need to restrict anything anymore and there shouldn't be any consideration about it. All this 'not enough data' line is a bit odd, how long is long enough to gather that data? It's been weeks and weeks now of this 'Indian' variant and as yet there are no spikes in the stats that matter.

At the end of the day It's been almost 18 months of one foot in, one foot out, toes dipped in and dipped out, it feels like it's created a frightened culture scared to look at their own shadows. We need to live our lives and accept that every day comes with a new risk, none of us are infallible and none of us ever were. You don't catch people not driving their cars in case they hit someone or have an accident. People still eat processed foods and lots of processed meats, even due to the increased links with cancer etc. People still smoke, even though they know the risks. Every day is a risk, everything we do is a risk...but we live with it and we evolve around it.

All we're doing is stopping a generation from evolving, we're stopping businesses in their traps, we're creating a generation of people who are scared to cross a road. I've lost people I know through the fear of lockdowns, being isolated and being made to stay away form friends and family and it's not nice. And on the flip side I know people have died from COVID as well, but there comes a point where the risk factors are negligible and for me it then becomes a case of the cure becoming worse than the effect.

Edited 1 June, 2021 by S-Clarke

[whelk]

49 minutes ago, Jimmy_D said:

Unfortunately I lost my job last week, so I’m part of the COVID related job loss numbers now. I’ve been saving in case something like this happened, so I’m ok for a while, and I’m hopeful it won’t take too long to find a new one, but obviously it’s not ideal.

Sorry to hear that and for being presumptive. 

[Jimmy_D]

2 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

But what people are trying to say is that there will always be variants, that will never stop. It won't magically stop evolving after 1 year, it will always be there.

So, for that reason alone, do we continue this one foot out....one foot in...approach to life for the rest of our lives?

I don't really fancy that if I'm honest. The Indian variant, in my opinion, is being blown out of all proportion. What we are seeing are increased cases because of increased testing, including self-administered testing, thus many more false positives than usual. If you test on the scale we test then you will always pickup infection rates and you will forever pickup new variants and new spikes of infection as it progresses around, it's how viruses have worked and how they have evolved throughout man kind.

I'll go back to what I said before - the only stats worth listening to are deaths and hospital admissions, if they continue at the very, very, very low rates they currently are at then there is absolutely no need to restrict anything anymore and there shouldn't be any consideration about it. All this 'not enough data' line is a bit odd, how long is long enough to gather that data? It's been weeks and weeks now of this 'Indian' variant and as yet there are no spikes in the stats that matter.

At the end of the day It's been almost 18 months of one foot in, one foot out, toes dipped in and dipped out, it feels like it's created a frightened culture scared to look at their own shadows. We need to live our lives and accept that every day comes with a new risk, none of us are infallible and none of us ever were. You don't catch people not driving their cars in case they hit someone or have an accident. People still eat processed foods and lots of processed meats, even due to the increased links with cancer etc. People still smoke, even though they know the risks. Every day is a risk, everything we do is a risk...but we live with it and we evolve around it.

All we're doing is stopping a generation from evolving, we're stopping businesses in their traps, we're creating a generation of people who are scared to cross a road. I've lost people I know through the fear of lockdowns, being isolated and being made to stay away form friends and family and it's not nice. And on the flip side I know people have died from COVID as well, but there comes a point where the risk factors are negligible and for me it then becomes a case of the cure becoming worse than the effect.

I’ve said all along that the cost of further lockdowns needs to be considered.

In making that comparison though, it’s important not to underestimate the threat that the Delta variant poses. You only need to look to what’s happened in India to see what can happen if it becomes widespread, and you only need to look to here at the end of last year to see how a combination of a new variant and easing restrictions can lead from “it feels like we’re on top of this” to “how did it end up even worse than last time”.

It’s important not to underestimate the cost of lockdowns too, but it’s difficult to estimate both. The potential risk of the Delta variant is a bigger unknown though. By not enough data, I mean that the increase in cases hasn’t been going long enough yet for that data to be available. Every time we’ve seen an increase in cases before, it has led to exponential growth in cases, and then further increases in hospitalisations and deaths, with that only being combatted by further restrictions. Back then, though, we weren’t this far into a very effective vaccination programme, with more people being vaccinated every day. It’s literally an unknown how badly a third wave of the Delta variant becoming widespread would hit us.

No-one is suggesting reverting any easing of lockdown, not least down to Boris Johnson’s promise of it being irreversible, but it wouldn’t surprise me to see the final easing of lockdown back to normal levels delayed if we see the case figures start to get even worse and then the hospitalisation figures start to follow that.

[Weston Super Saint]

On 29/05/2021 at 15:29, rallyboy said:

With the latest news on Patel and PPE contracts, the sleaze and greed around this pandemic is now so obvious it's insulting the intelligence of every taxpayer.

So putting aside all other party political arguments and distractions for a moment and looking at this very simple issue -

is there anybody out there who still honestly believes that this cabinet is not steeped in corruption?

Bloody companies 'profiteering' from the pandemic.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57336030

Quote

Petrol prices have climbed to their highest level in two years, according to the RAC.

Retailers may be charging more to make up for lower fuel sales during the pandemic, it said.

 

[RedArmy]

‘Just a few more months’ 

[LGTL]

Maybe Tiss was right after all. This is becoming an absolute farce. 

[whelk]

Honestly the smoke out of all the gammon ears if this was a Labour chancellor chucking money to anyone who wants it. Funny how they are all ok with the magic money orchard.

[Weston Super Saint]

23 minutes ago, whelk said:

Honestly the smoke out of all the gammon ears if this was a Labour chancellor chucking money to anyone who wants it. Funny how they are all ok with the magic money orchard.

No need to worry.  No more countries added to the green list and Portugal taken off it so no other choice but to holiday in the UK, which means all the money spent will go back to the treasury. 

[whelk]

Gutted Afghanistan and Sudan added to red list today. Soon going to be nowhere left to take the missus on holiday.

 

[rallyboy]

4 hours ago, whelk said:

Honestly the smoke out of all the gammon ears if this was a Labour chancellor chucking money to anyone who wants it. Funny how they are all ok with the magic money orchard.

With the staggering amount of money recently given to friends and relatives of MPs, or just pissed down the drain on mad shit, it's pretty clear there has been funding available all the time for mental health services, libraries, policing, care, prisons, schools etc etc - it just wasn't spent.

 

 

[CollinsDic]

18 hours ago, LGTL said:

Maybe Tiss was right after all. This is becoming an absolute farce. 

Maybe? There is no maybe about it. It will be seen by millions more as each day goes by.

[Lighthouse]

18 hours ago, LGTL said:

Maybe Tiss was right after all. This is becoming an absolute farce. 

He wasn’t right, he’s part of the reason we’re still in this position. People have been acting as if it’s all over for a couple of months, just because the elderly had all been offered a jab. We’ve just this week reached the point of half of UK adults being fully vaccinated, nowhere near enough to be complacent.

[Fan The Flames]

Israel didn't open up until 70% of the adult population was vaccinated.

Not closing the border to India early enough was another Boris blunder. Being allowed to go to amber list countries and then being trusted to isolate, is another fuck up. The list get's longer every week.

[Dark Munster]

21 hours ago, whelk said:

Gutted Afghanistan and Sudan added to red list today. Soon going to be nowhere left to take the missus on holiday.

 

How about Iraq?

[badgerx16]

22 hours ago, whelk said:

Gutted Afghanistan and Sudan added to red list today. Soon going to be nowhere left to take the missus on holiday.

 

 

16 minutes ago, Dark Munster said:

How about Iraq?

Or Saudi Arabia

[Whitey Grandad]

10 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

He wasn’t right, he’s part of the reason we’re still in this position. People have been acting as if it’s all over for a couple of months, just because the elderly had all been offered a jab. We’ve just this week reached the point of half of UK adults being fully vaccinated, nowhere near enough to be complacent.

What position? Hospitalisations are way down and deaths are down to normal. Everything else is overreaction.

[Lighthouse]

45 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

What position? Hospitalisations are way down and deaths are down to normal. Everything else is overreaction.

Where the 21st June ‘freedom’ date may end up being postponed if cases continue to rise and hospital admissions follow suit. 

[RedArmy]

29 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Where the 21st June ‘freedom’ date may end up being postponed if cases continue to rise and hospital admissions follow suit. 

Why? That’s not what the 4 tests say. The NHS is not at risk of being overwhelmed. 

[Lighthouse]

4 minutes ago, RedArmy said:

The NHS is not at risk of being overwhelmed

Let's all hope it stays that way. Overwhelmed this time, doesn't mean every ward flat out dealing with COVID patients. We have to keep admissions to a negligible enough number to allow all the postponed treatments to be brought forward AND still allow staff to take breaks, holidays and work acceptable hours.

[Weston Super Saint]

9 hours ago, RedArmy said:

Why? That’s not what the 4 tests say. The NHS is not at risk of being overwhelmed. 

I've said it before, but it's worth repeating.  This war of words and increased rhetoric has nothing to do with the NHS being overwhelmed this time around.  The 20 - 30 year old age group is the biggest in terms of anti vaxxers.  The closer we get to that group being vaccinated, the louder the calls for extending lockdown have become - and let's face it the only parts still left to open fully are night clubs, music venues and social distancing in pubs / no masks.

The blackmail has been pretty obvious for a number of months now, if the 'youth' want to go and enjoy themselves, they must have their vaccine first.  I don't think the lockdown will be extended but I'm assuming the rhtetoric will 'encourage' more of that age group to have their jab....

[Whitey Grandad]

10 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Let's all hope it stays that way. Overwhelmed this time, doesn't mean every ward flat out dealing with COVID patients. We have to keep admissions to a negligible enough number to allow all the postponed treatments to be brought forward AND still allow staff to take breaks, holidays and work acceptable hours.

There were 801 patient in hospital in England  yesterday. Out of a population of 55,000,000.

The vulnerable have mostly been vaccinated and the unvaccinated are much less vulnerable.  We have reached the point where the lockdown is doing more damage than the virus. 

[egg]

24 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

There were 801 patient in hospital in England  yesterday. Out of a population of 55,000,000.

The vulnerable have mostly been vaccinated and the unvaccinated are much less vulnerable.  We have reached the point where the lockdown is doing more damage than the virus. 

Whitey, there is no lockdown. Shops are open, schools, businesses, pubs, restaurants, people are meeting friends and family. Unless you're desperate to boost the economy of a foreign country or go nightclubbing, there ain't a lot different. 

If anyone says that they're lives are being impacted in any significant way but the limited restrictions we still have, they need to give their head a wobble. 

[S-Clarke]

25 minutes ago, egg said:

Whitey, there is no lockdown. Shops are open, schools, businesses, pubs, restaurants, people are meeting friends and family. Unless you're desperate to boost the economy of a foreign country or go nightclubbing, there ain't a lot different. 

If anyone says that they're lives are being impacted in any significant way but the limited restrictions we still have, they need to give their head a wobble. 

Sadly, there are people being impacted - still.  It's fortunate if you are able to continue in a job, have family/friends close etc - but not everyone has that.

I know people who have lost jobs and even recently a couple of friends in hospitality have lost their job because they're unable to re-open fully, due to the uncertainty over the 21st - and when the 21st doesn't happen you'll end up with more staff being let go. They can't have full attendances, so they can't make their expected profits so they can't keep all their staff.

Jobs are changing to home working on a permanent basis for a lot of companies. For some people that's great, for other's it's terrible because they've lost what was their only method of social interaction if they live alone.

Some people have friends who have been fear-driven and still won't even step out of their houses to cross the road whilst the government continue this one foot in one foot out approach.

So I don't buy that lives aren't being impacted, they still are and in a big way. Life is not back to normal for a lot of people.

[egg]

12 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Sadly, there are people being impacted - still.  It's fortunate if you are able to continue in a job, have family/friends close etc - but not everyone has that.

I know people who have lost jobs and even recently a couple of friends in hospitality have lost their job because they're unable to re-open fully, due to the uncertainty over the 21st - and when the 21st doesn't happen you'll end up with more staff being let go. They can't have full attendances, so they can't make their expected profits so they can't keep all their staff.

Jobs are changing to home working on a permanent basis for a lot of companies. For some people that's great, for other's it's terrible because they've lost what was their only method of social interaction if they live alone.

Some people have friends who have been fear-driven and still won't even step out of their houses to cross the road whilst the government continue this one foot in one foot out approach.

So I don't buy that lives aren't being impacted, they still are and in a big way. Life is not back to normal for a lot of people.

Good post and I get that, but save for those in hospitality who are still affected (although many pubs, hotels and restaurants are desperate for staff), what you're describing is the impact of covid on people's lives, not the impact of the limited restrictions we still have. Those are not restrictive. 

Edited 5 June, 2021 by egg

[Whitey Grandad]

44 minutes ago, egg said:

Good post and I get that, but save for those in hospitality who are still affected (although many pubs, hotels and restaurants are desperate for staff), what you're describing is the impact of covid on people's lives, not the impact of the limited restrictions we still have. Those are not restrictive. 

There is a whole range of economic activity that obviously doesn’t exist in your world. Theatres, horse racing, weddings, even football matches. Basically, anywhere that lots of people gather. The present restrictions are strangling these businesses which are running up debts and are only being kept on life support by the Furlough scheme. There will be a host of redundancies in the next couple of months and any extension of lockdown will precipitate these.

And why do you think that people only want to go abroad for a holiday and a spot of nightclub activity? That is a tiny fraction of normal international travel. What chance does anybody have of getting any business from abroad?

[egg]

9 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

There is a whole range of economic activity that obviously doesn’t exist in your world. Theatres, horse racing, weddings, even football matches. Basically, anywhere that lots of people gather. The present restrictions are strangling these businesses which are running up debts and are only being kept on life support by the Furlough scheme. There will be a host of redundancies in the next couple of months and any extension of lockdown will precipitate these.

And why do you think that people only want to go abroad for a holiday and a spot of nightclub activity? That is a tiny fraction of normal international travel. What chance does anybody have of getting any business from abroad?

Whitey, theatres can reopen, sporting venues are open, horse racing and weddings are happening. Sure, numbers are limited, but don't kid yourself that life isn't going on normally for the masses. 

I mean no disrespect, but I'm fed up with whingers focusing on the little bits that they can't do, or can only do in a limited way. Life's what you make it, and I'd rather do and enjoy what I can. 

 

[RedArmy]

Stop being so ungrateful and accept the new normal. Who cares about profits. 

[egg]

8 minutes ago, RedArmy said:

Stop being so ungrateful and accept the new normal. Who cares about profits. 

All we can do is be grateful for what we have, and accept that we can't do shit about the situation. I don't see what we have as the new normal. It's the here and now. We will get back to the normal proper, and we can enjoy life in the mean time. 

I'll have a bbq later with mates, there'll be no masks or flapping, just people enjoying themselves. Sure I had to pop a mask on for the 5 minutes I was in the butchers earlier but that's no hardship. 

Life goes on, unless you're preoccupied by what you can't do at the moment. I wouldn't want to be in that headspace. 

[Fan The Flames]

Generally people's position on this is based on how it's affecting them financially. 

I'm happy for this level of restrictions to continue whilst there is a need for it; I'm earning, can play football, go for a pint or a meal. Life isn't massively different from normal, just behind a mask and s bit of planning. I appreciate that it's not the same for anyone and I would be fucked off if my job was affected, but I don't know anyone who isn't working because of the lockdown.

With all the sacrifices people have made the tories should have acted to ensure that the opening up was not put at risk, they should have closed the border with India earlier. This is on them.

[Lord Duckhunter]

If you had to sit in the ale house on a table with my snap dragon the whole night, you wouldn’t claim  there wasn’t a lockdown. I can’t stand at the bar with my cronies, disappear to the next door pub when she’s waffling to the other witches in the coven, or generally lose her for most of the evening. We’re sat there like it’s a fucking restaurant. The life is being sucked out of pubs. 

[egg]

12 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

If you had to sit in the ale house on a table with my snap dragon the whole night, you wouldn’t claim  there wasn’t a lockdown. I can’t stand at the bar with my cronies, disappear to the next door pub when she’s waffling to the other witches in the coven, or generally lose her for most of the evening. We’re sat there like it’s a fucking restaurant. The life is being sucked out of pubs. 

My pub quiz this week was brilliant. Old fashioned banter, etc. 

The people who usually stood at the bar together sat at a table together. That issue is a doddle. Can't help with your missus though.

[Weston Super Saint]

4 hours ago, egg said:

Good post and I get that, but save for those in hospitality who are still affected (although many pubs, hotels and restaurants are desperate for staff), what you're describing is the impact of covid on people's lives, not the impact of the limited restrictions we still have. Those are not restrictive. 

Hospitality

Outside Catering

Pilots

Airline staff

Airport staff

Cruise ship workers

Travel Agents

Wedding venues

Hotels

Night Clubs

Night Club security

Breweries

Distribution networks - for food, catering, alcohol

Nightlife ancillaries - e.g takeaways, taxis and associated distribution networks / suppliers

Farmers

Farm workers

Farm distribution networks

I could go on but hopefully this indicates that it is not just a few people in hospitality that are being affected by the current restrictions limiting the business opportunities, income and job opportunities.  All those listed above are currently having their livelihoods affected in some way.  Whilst you personally may not be affected at the moment (similarly, nor am I or my family), it's disingenous to dismiss out of hand that a lot of people are still genuinely being affected by the lockdown restrictions still in place.

[The Cat]

The live music industry is still on it's knees. For people like me who spend a lot of time going to gigs the impact is still ongoing. Sure I can go to the odd socially distanced show but the venues are having to cap numbers at a ridiculous level to enable that and lots of bands and artists won't play these sort of events. 

People go on about the ease in which they can get around the current restrictions and that's fine for them but some people and businesses are still hugely impacted.

[Fan The Flames]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

If you had to sit in the ale house on a table with my snap dragon the whole night, you wouldn’t claim  there wasn’t a lockdown. I can’t stand at the bar with my cronies, disappear to the next door pub when she’s waffling to the other witches in the coven, or generally lose her for most of the evening. We’re sat there like it’s a fucking restaurant. The life is being sucked out of pubs. 

If you ask nicely she might let you go out with your mates by yourself.

[egg]

18 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Hospitality

Outside Catering

Pilots

Airline staff

Airport staff

Cruise ship workers

Travel Agents

Wedding venues

Hotels

Night Clubs

Night Club security

Breweries

Distribution networks - for food, catering, alcohol

Nightlife ancillaries - e.g takeaways, taxis and associated distribution networks / suppliers

Farmers

Farm workers

Farm distribution networks

I could go on but hopefully this indicates that it is not just a few people in hospitality that are being affected by the current restrictions limiting the business opportunities, income and job opportunities.  All those listed above are currently having their livelihoods affected in some way.  Whilst you personally may not be affected at the moment (similarly, nor am I or my family), it's disingenous to dismiss out of hand that a lot of people are still genuinely being affected by the lockdown restrictions still in place.

So overseas travel and the late night time industry? 

Nightlife and music venues have it hard still, that I agree with. That said, places around here are pleading for staff and some have closed as they can't get enough workers. 

We could end all regs tomorrow re travel but our rising numbers will mean some countries won't want us. 

I have clients who supply food on a large scale. They've diversified and done well. Elsewhere, Harvest Fine Foods have pleaded for staff as demand is huge. They are not suffering because of restrictions. 

Ditto farming. The issue as I understand it is staffing, but if I've missed something regulation based, what have I missed? 

Back to my point on this, the "lockdown" we have is not a lockdown. The lives of most people is relatively normal. Sure, a couple of industries and related businesses are impacted, but it's the minority. 

 

 

[Fan The Flames]

52 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Hospitality

Outside Catering

Pilots

Airline staff

Airport staff

Cruise ship workers

Travel Agents

Wedding venues

Hotels

Night Clubs

Night Club security

Breweries

Distribution networks - for food, catering, alcohol

Nightlife ancillaries - e.g takeaways, taxis and associated distribution networks / suppliers

Farmers

Farm workers

Farm distribution networks

I could go on but hopefully this indicates that it is not just a few people in hospitality that are being affected by the current restrictions limiting the business opportunities, income and job opportunities.  All those listed above are currently having their livelihoods affected in some way.  Whilst you personally may not be affected at the moment (similarly, nor am I or my family), it's disingenous to dismiss out of hand that a lot of people are still genuinely being affected by the lockdown restrictions still in place.

The government could pay them for a couple of years.

[Weston Super Saint]

5 hours ago, egg said:

I mean no disrespect, but I'm fed up with whingers focusing on the little bits that they can't do, or can only do in a limited way. Life's what you make it, and I'd rather do and enjoy what I can. 

 

Make your mind up!

You've gone from the 'little bits' that people can't do, to (I think) recognising that WHOLE INDUSTRIES are still shut down / severely impacted by the lockdown regulations!

1 hour ago, egg said:

Back to my point on this, the "lockdown" we have is not a lockdown. The lives of most people is relatively normal. Sure, a couple of industries and related businesses are impacted, but it's the minority. 

 

 

The point is, which I think you understand, that whilst you and I and many others aren't really inconvenienced by the current regulations, hundreds of thousands of people are still massively impacted - over 750,00 in the "night time industry" alone.  

[Whitey Grandad]

1 hour ago, egg said:

 

Back to my point on this, the "lockdown" we have is not a lockdown. The lives of most people is relatively normal. Sure, a couple of industries and related businesses are impacted, but it's the minority. 

 

 

If this lockdown  is so minimal then what’s the problem with getting rid of it altogether?

[Whitey Grandad]

5 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

Generally people's position on this is based on how it's affecting them financially. 

I'm happy for this level of restrictions to continue whilst there is a need for it; I'm earning, can play football, go for a pint or a meal. Life isn't massively different from normal, just behind a mask and s bit of planning. I appreciate that it's not the same for anyone and I would be fucked off if my job was affected, but I don't know anyone who isn't working because of the lockdown.

With all the sacrifices people have made the tories should have acted to ensure that the opening up was not put at risk, they should have closed the border with India earlier. This is on them.

So you think that means that nobody is out of work as a result of it?

[Whitey Grandad]

5 hours ago, egg said:

Whitey, theatres can reopen, sporting venues are open, horse racing and weddings are happening. Sure, numbers are limited, but don't kid yourself that life isn't going on normally for the masses. 

I mean no disrespect, but I'm fed up with whingers focusing on the little bits that they can't do, or can only do in a limited way. Life's what you make it, and I'd rather do and enjoy what I can. 

 

They are so limited as to make continued existence uneconomic.

If you’re not affected by it in any way then bully for you. But at least have some understanding of those whose lives have been ruined and are continuing to run up debts.

[egg]

39 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

They are so limited as to make continued existence uneconomic.

If you’re not affected by it in any way then bully for you. But at least have some understanding of those whose lives have been ruined and are continuing to run up debts.

I fully appreciate where this still impacts. My initial post today was in response to yet another whinge from you. If your life was severely impacted I'd get why you constantly bang the same drum, but from your various posts, it seems that you just can't accept that you're a wee big impacted and just get on with it. 

[RedArmy]

50 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

If this lockdown  is so minimal then what’s the problem with getting rid of it altogether?

Fantastic question. 

[egg]

50 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

If this lockdown  is so minimal then what’s the problem with getting rid of it altogether?

If you need to ask why limited restrictions are still in place its a pointless debate mate. 

[egg]

58 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Make your mind up!

You've gone from the 'little bits' that people can't do, to (I think) recognising that WHOLE INDUSTRIES are still shut down / severely impacted by the lockdown regulations!

The point is, which I think you understand, that whilst you and I and many others aren't really inconvenienced by the current regulations, hundreds of thousands of people are still massively impacted - over 750,00 in the "night time industry" alone.  

You're fusing issues Weston. My initial point was to Whitey and his constant whingeing. If he was a pilot or nightclub owner I'd have sympathy for him. 

The overseas travel industry is a bit fucked, for now, but the personal impact on the masses is that they have to holiday in margate to majorca. Boo fucking boo, get some perspective and be grateful for any holiday. 

The night time industry is very fucked which is a tragedy for the owners, but for the masses they can and have adjusted. My youngest had to make do with spoons last night but she'd rather have gone clubbing. Guess what, she had a cracking night. 

Don't conflate the impact on business owners and some staff with the lives of the masses. I can criticise Whitey for whingeing whilst having sympathy for the owners of music venues. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

Table service in the ale house  just ain’t British. 

[badgerx16]

4 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

If you ask nicely she might let you go out with your mates by yourself.

If he did that he would have nothing to complain about.