Pompey Takeover Saga

[washsaint]

Can't believe the fishy few are getting so excited by the rumours circulated by the crook Storieteller and his cronies. Jacob stated today that 2 or 3 interested parties have come forward in the last few days and are in 'preliminary' discussions.

 

So, unless some idiot does no due diligence and just burns his money there is not a cat in hells chance of Pompey being bought by Wednesday. They seem to be pinning all their hopes in persuading HMRC to postpone the WUO (unlikely) or overturning the original judgement (unlikely).

 

Any new owner will be buying a club with no assets and no team......they would have to spend 100s millions to clear the debt and put in place infrastructure. Somehow, I can't see even wealthy Arabs p*******g their money up against the wall like that.

[Kingsland Red]

With regard to the 9 point deduction does this come into effect this season ?

Or is it carried to next season if Pompey dont get sufficient points to stay up( excl -9 points) ?

[aintforever]

If some idiot was going to **** their money up the wall and buy pompey they wouldn't wait until just after the transfer window shuts. Bill Gates could buy them now and it wouldn't stop them getting relegated.

[dune]

Ha Ha Ha, just found out that this Saudi Prince is married to his cousin.

 

The Pompey Family Der Der Der Der Der Der Der.

 

You couldn't make it up.

[Gorgiesaint]

I still think this was simply a lesson-leanring exercise for Chanrai to assess whether there was any point in making another loan. If no one looks like completing a deal tomorrow (lol), he will call the administrators on Tuesday I expect.

 

Think you're spot on Benjii.

 

I think this was the first of the options being crossed off of Chainrai's list. The options being: 2)now find someone stupid enough to plough £35m into Pompey to get them up to the end of the season & until they can get the parachute payments and option 3)administration. If that fails then it is all of their hands on Wednesday.

 

Incidently, can they call in the administrators without the courts approval given the windiing up petition is in place for Wednesday?

[aintforever]

Incidently, can they call in the administrators without the courts approval given the windiing up petition is in place for Wednesday?

 

Think Palace did it the day before their court date.

[Crab Lungs]

Saudi Prince in talks to buy Portsmuff

 

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/newshome/Saudi-Prince-39in-talks-over.6050292.jp

 

Big LOL at all the Skates frothing at the mouth at the prospect of having a billionaire owner.

 

 

Seriously... do they believe this? It's Storrie-teller on a windup again, pretending to be darting round the world meeting billionaires and become their 'saviour' - that said, its also convenient for these stories to exist so that they can use this in court to substantiate their ongoing existence.

 

I hope the courts ignore this bull**** and look at the facts.

 

They couldn't afford 2k for a website.

They couldn't afford 2k for the caterers.

They couldn't afford to pay the stadium announcer.

 

That to me, says they are ****ed.

 

However.. still find the cash to fly to Manchester though?

 

That to me says they are immoral.

 

 

I just hope they hang on until Saturday, we thump the last nail in their coffin and then they implode.

 

Nasty club ruined by nasty, selfish, greedy businessmen.

[Gorgiesaint]

Seriously... do they believe this? It's Storrie-teller on a windup again, pretending to be darting round the world meeting billionaires and become their 'saviour' - that said, its also convenient for these stories to exist so that they can use this in court to substantiate their ongoing existence.

 

LOL at the headline on the Portsmouth page on the BBC sport website

 

Groups 'express Pompey interest'

 

er, no they haven't, there hasn't been a single person who has come out & said they are interested in buying Pompey.

[Faz]

I have to say it's extremely unlikely that any proper Saudi Billionaire (as opposed to Al-Fahim and Al-Mirage) will just stump up tens of millions without going through proper due dilligence - they are not known for just throwing money at investments.

 

Pompey are going down. It's all very well saying they'll get the parachure payments, but they will need every penny of that to survive next season with their cost base - or to pay players off their huge contracts, plus bonuses etc.

 

You would want to look, in depth at every players contract. You would want to understand the nature of all their football, and general debts. You would want to know how much you need to invest to make any kind of return.

 

There is no way the sales of the keeper and the other chap to Spurs will have covered January's salaries, the debts due to Chelsea and Watford, the majority of the funds owed to Chainrai, and left them with enough to meet their obligations to the end of the season. Then there's Lens, HMRC and Sol - thats another £15m.

 

So it'll cost someone in the region of £60/£70m to buy what is effectively a Championship club. Is Newcastle still for sale?

 

If Chairai wants to keep them going he will need to make a significant payment to HMRC and convince them that the Club can meet any payment schedule - they have no means of even meeting February's salaries.

 

No Administrator will take them on with their lack of funds and saleable assets to the end of the season, so a CVA is the only alternative to Winding UP. If they go the CVA route, then Chainrai, as a secured creditor will probably stay outside any CVA. A CVA has to be agreed by 70% of the participating Creditors (if memory serves) - probably requiring both HMRC and Gheydamack Jnrs Trust fund to agree to the CVA.

 

So whoever buys the club will still have whatever debts are left under the CVA, plus the £25m football debts, plus whatever is needed to pay back Chainrai as a bare minimum. Your still talking around £40m for a Championship club with no infrastructure. The debts would need to be cleared as they cannot fund them form cashflow on crowds of 12k max in the Championship.

 

I don't want them to fold - look at the excitement being generated this week - but I just can't see a way out for them.

Edited 7 February, 2010 by Faz

[dronskisaint]

much cheaper to buy palace. And probably a better long term bet.

 

He's probably already got a palace in fairness....

[redkeith]

Jacobs' says there are "2 or 3 interested parties". You might expect him to know precisely how many people are enquiring about buying the club, as it is of some importance to it's future.

 

Of course the buyers may not really exists, hence the vagueness in his numbers, and Pompey are just trying to blow smoke up HRMC's bottom.

[washsaint]

Not to mention the extreme dodginess that the Grosvenor WUO relates to the football club acting as guarantor for a business that had absolutely nothing to do with the football club...other than it had the FD also backing it. Would have thought this would be investigated?

[Faz]

Not to mention the extreme dodginess that the Grosvenor WUO relates to the football club acting as guarantor for a business that had absolutely nothing to do with the football club...other than it had the FD also backing it. Would have thought this would be investigated?

 

For the Guarantee to be effective, there has to be some form of "Commercial Consideration", such as parent and subsidairy. It could apply if there was a trading relationship -I fully expect Grosvenor's lawyers to have checked this before accepting the guarantee.

[dune]

I don't want them to fold - look at the excitement being generated this week - but I just can't see a way out for them.

 

I do. I want them expelled from the football league and forced to reform in non league obscurity.

[benjii]

For the Guarantee to be effective, there has to be some form of "Commercial Consideration", such as parent and subsidairy. It could apply if there was a trading relationship -I fully expect Grosvenor's lawyers to have checked this before accepting the guarantee.

 

This is not true.

 

Guarantees are commonly executed as deeds precisely to get around any arguments about them being lacking for want of consideration.

 

There may be issues around corporate capacity and authority but, as you say, no doubt Grosvenor will have done all the necessary legals before accepting the guarantee. I'm sure it's valid even if the commercial benefit to PFC is somewhat unclear.

[benjii]

In other interesting news, Wolves tried a flick-up-and-volley freekick in the style of MLT v Wdon today.

 

Interesting!

[Clapham Saint]

He's probably already got a palace in fairness....

 

Boom tish!

[ringwood]

if Chanrai has really recouped the majority of his loan already then he is quids in and the ground will do him nicely, the only thing keeping them afloat is his need to protect his loan.

The administrator could then be selling a championship club on minus 15pts, with no ground, and financial irregularities pending - which as Storyteller was saying would be a bargain.....

Then again he insists they got a draw at Old Trafford, and luckily the rest of the results went for them too.

 

 

 

If Chainrai had recouped that amount then its unlikely the club defaulted on the loan? think about it, how would he claim the shares if he'd already had a big chunk back?

[benjii]

In other interesting news, Wolves tried a flick-up-and-volley freekick in the style of MLT v Wdon today.

 

Interesting!

 

And now they're winning.

[ringwood]

Heard this morning that Poopey will have a new owner next week -----------------------

 

Nick Girdler on Solent this morning proclaimed he was buying them for 50p!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Gingeletiss]

...that said, its also convenient for these stories to exist so that they can use this in court to substantiate their ongoing existence.

 

I hope the courts ignore this bull**** and look at the facts.

 

They couldn't afford 2k for a website.

They couldn't afford 2k for the caterers.

They couldn't afford to pay the stadium announcer.

 

 

 

Add to this, their ten year history!!!!. They have pulled this stunt before, wiping out all their debt. I hope that HMRC know of this fact, and pass said info onto the 'Saints supporting' Judge.

[dronskisaint]

Boom tish!

 

Ay theng yow:)

[ART]

HMRC have nothing to lose which ever way it goes. If they do go into Administration the taxes will still have to be paid before they'd be able to play football again. All these new buy(gg)ers/incestors turning up on the Skates doorstep at the 11th hour all has the Paul Allan spiel that Crouchie played with Saints. I just can't believe in this day and age, like the French media says, that the powers that be in English football are allowing Pimpley to get away with making English football, the game etc., the laughing stock throughout the world. Amazed that FIFA and his sodsship Sepp Blatter haven't come along and stuck their oar in.

[bridge too far]

Add to this, their ten year history!!!!. They have pulled this stunt before, wiping out all their debt. I hope that HMRC know of this fact, and pass said info onto the 'Saints supporting' Judge.

 

Aren't there additional points deductions if a club has been in administration before?

 

Or is that wishful thinking on my part

[aintforever]

Aren't there additional points deductions if a club has been in administration before?

 

Or is that wishful thinking on my part

 

It should be an extra -2, Bournemouth had -15 because they failed to get a CVA and the fact that they have been in admin before made it -17.

 

The Premier League might have different rules though.

[mcjwills]

If they are insolvent then the court will wind them up.

 

HMRC's case that they aren't able to pay them will be enough unless Poopey can demonstrate otherwise.

 

A case of guilty unless able to prove otherwise.

 

You can imagine it at the Court, Chanrai is faced with a Judge about to wind the club up, when he says OK I'LL pay, Will you take a post dated check or can I pay on the Barclaycard.

[Channon's Sideburns]

You can imagine it at the Court, Chanrai is faced with a Judge about to wind the club up, when he says OK I'LL pay, Will you take a post dated check or can I pay on the Barclaycard.

 

He'll probably pull out a card from 'Portsmouth Financial Services'....then broadcast it on 'Quay Radio'...

 

BTW South Coast Investments was a sub of PFC.

 

So,all in all, Poopey hate us so much they copied all of Rupey Baby's ideas...what's their catering like?

 

Errrrrrr...ok. At least we fookin paid for ours.

 

Hope the Taxman brings up their flights to Manchester...'so Mr Owner, you can't pay your stadium announcer 60 quid, but you fly your squad to Manchester. Hardly cost effective business sense..'

[bridge too far]

He'll probably pull out a card from 'Portsmouth Financial Services'....then broadcast it on 'Quay Radio'...

 

BTW South Coast Investments was a sub of PFC.

 

So,all in all, Poopey hate us so much they copied all of Rupey Baby's ideas...what's their catering like?

 

Errrrrrr...ok. At least we fookin paid for ours.

 

Hope the Taxman brings up their flights to Manchester...'so Mr Owner, you can't pay your stadium announcer 60 quid, but you fly your squad to Manchester. Hardly cost effective business sense..'

 

Much as I'd like the world to know how wrong their priorities are, I think the judge will only give his judgement on the tax matters. He's not there to judge on how they spend 'their' money in general.

 

Unfortunately

[Channon's Sideburns]

Much as I'd like the world to know how wrong their priorities are, I think the judge will only give his judgement on the tax matters. He's not there to judge on how they spend 'their' money in general.

 

Unfortunately

 

True, I think to be honest the press smell blood at the moment...therefore it will probably be questioned in the press before long.

[St Marco]

Much as I'd like the world to know how wrong their priorities are, I think the judge will only give his judgement on the tax matters. He's not there to judge on how they spend 'their' money in general.

 

Unfortunately

 

He is actually there to determine if the company/club should continue to trade or not.

The Taxman has not been paid and thus asked for the club to be wound up.

They are not there to claim their money, they are there to argue the company has no intention of paying its debts and due to mismanagement now cannot pay its debts. Which pretty much means they are acting in a criminal way.

The judge will hear both sides of the argument and then decide on if the company has the potential to get better but more importantly pay its creditors on the petition. If those on the petition are found to be wrong and not owed what they claim then that obviously makes the situation look far better for the company.

But he/she will see all the detailed financial decisions that have happened in the recent past and will see the long history of missed payments, new owners, player sales etc and will naturally come to the conclusion their income is less then their outcome. They have no assets to sell to raise funds and have had a longtime to find a new owner with actual money to put in etc etc.

 

The harsh fact is that the club will be wound up on the basis of a small group of people who ran the club into the ground and left it in its current situation. It is not the fans fault and they will be the ones punished. But history has shown the HMRC will not be lenient in these types of cases. If the facts and figures proove they are insolvent which it obviously will then they have a duty to pull the plug.

 

These stories of princes and what not as others have mentioned are to raise awarness in the media and push other potential buyers into action.

But it won't make any difference. If the prince takes over and does not pay before weds, then they are gone. You could have the richest person in the world as your owner, but if he doesnt intend to pay then the same thing will happen. They need someone who is prepared to pay from his own pocket the tax bill and the other debts, without any gurantee that the club will make the money back. Finding someone to basically donate £15m is a hard thing to do.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

Heard this morning that Poopey will have a new owner next week -----------------------

 

Nick Girdler on Solent this morning proclaimed he was buying them for 50p!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Did he not also state that we'd all get to own them for 15 minutes each? A little Andy Wharholesque maybe but my 15 minutes would be put to good use.

[Saint_clark]

It should be an extra -2, Bournemouth had -15 because they failed to get a CVA and the fact that they have been in admin before made it -17.

 

The Premier League might have different rules though.

 

Of course they do. West Hams parent company was in administration for nearly two years before it got bought out, but they never even got a whisper of a points deduction.

[Goalie66]

He is actually there to determine if the company/club should continue to trade or not.

The Taxman has not been paid and thus asked for the club to be wound up.

They are not there to claim their money, they are there to argue the company has no intention of paying its debts and due to mismanagement now cannot pay its debts. Which pretty much means they are acting in a criminal way.

The judge will hear both sides of the argument and then decide on if the company has the potential to get better but more importantly pay its creditors on the petition. If those on the petition are found to be wrong and not owed what they claim then that obviously makes the situation look far better for the company.

But he/she will see all the detailed financial decisions that have happened in the recent past and will see the long history of missed payments, new owners, player sales etc and will naturally come to the conclusion their income is less then their outcome. They have no assets to sell to raise funds and have had a longtime to find a new owner with actual money to put in etc etc.

 

The harsh fact is that the club will be wound up on the basis of a small group of people who ran the club into the ground and left it in its current situation. It is not the fans fault and they will be the ones punished. But history has shown the HMRC will not be lenient in these types of cases. If the facts and figures proove they are insolvent which it obviously will then they have a duty to pull the plug.

 

These stories of princes and what not as others have mentioned are to raise awarness in the media and push other potential buyers into action.

But it won't make any difference. If the prince takes over and does not pay before weds, then they are gone. You could have the richest person in the world as your owner, but if he doesnt intend to pay then the same thing will happen. They need someone who is prepared to pay from his own pocket the tax bill and the other debts, without any gurantee that the club will make the money back. Finding someone to basically donate £15m is a hard thing to do.

 

Excellent piece I think many people do not realise that LIKELY outcome is that PCFC will be wound up..That is why I have not bought a ticket for the game on Saturday as I do not think it will happen

[JackFrost]

The situation at the club has become so farcical now, that any day I'm expecting for Radio Solent to report that PFC have been taken over by the banker of Deal or no Deal.

[St Chalet]

The situation at the club has become so farcical now, that any day I'm expecting for Radio Solent to report that PFC have been taken over by the banker of Deal or no Deal.

 

The Banker, a mythical figure who nobody has even seen and does his business via a weasley little man? - sorry that was owner #3 Ali Al Mirage.

Edited 7 February, 2010 by St Chalet

[miserableoldgit]

The Banker, a mythical figure who nobody has even seen and does his business via a weasley little man? - sorry that was owner #3 Ali Al Mirage.

Jacobs was asked if Al Mirage actually existed this morning on Radio 5live. He said that of course he existed because he had spoken to him on the phone!! A bit like George Weah calling Souness I expect!

[sidthesquid]

Oh when will the fun end?

 

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11674_5919604,00.html

[hamster]

Of course they do. West Hams parent company was in administration for nearly two years before it got bought out, but they never even got a whisper of a points deduction.

 

 

Hmm....

 

Two words come to mind...

 

'Trevor'

 

and

 

'Brooking'

[bridge too far]

Oh when will the fun end?

 

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11674_5919604,00.html

 

Another £3m they've got to find then

[tommi]

There is no way in the world Pompey will be wound up on Wednesday. Things like that just do not happen to clubs in the premier league. The case on Wednesday will either be thrown out due to a technicality or they will be given 28 days to pay... and somehow by the skin of their teeth something will materialise and they will pay it.

 

Just my opinion - I hope I'm wrong!

[Matthew Le God]

There is no way in the world Pompey will be wound up on Wednesday. Things like that just do not happen to clubs in the premier league. The case on Wednesday will either be thrown out due to a technicality or they will be given 28 days to pay... and somehow by the skin of their teeth something will materialise and they will pay it.

 

Just my opinion - I hope I'm wrong!

 

It is irrelevant if they are in the Premiership or not.

 

This is not a sporting decision, we are dealing with the High Court and Taxman here. They wouldn't give a ****.

[Thedelldays]

It is irrelevant if they are in the Premiership or not.

 

This is not a sporting decision, we are dealing with the High Court and Taxman here. They wouldn't give a ****.

of course they do...

 

if they dont, then there will be no game on sat

[bridge too far]

of course they do...

 

if they dont, then there will be no game on sat

 

I think he means the High Court doesn't give a flying **** about the fact that its a football team.

[Matthew Le God]

if they dont, then there will be no game on sat

 

I think there is a high chance there won't be.

 

Notts County were only given extra time because they showed they had a potential buyer lined up. Pompey haven't got this. Plus they have defaulted in the past and their debts dwarf Notts County £300k taxman bill.

[krissyboy31]

of course they do...

 

if they dont, then there will be no game on sat

 

I still think they will go into Administration on Tuesday and the High Court hearing won't go ahead. If it does, I can't see anything other than them being wound-up, although they may get a stay of execution (a certain amount of days to pay the plaintiffs in full).

[Matthew Le God]

I think he means the High Court doesn't give a flying **** about the fact that its a football team.

 

Exactly.

 

The already wound up King's Lynn earlier this year.

 

Premiership or non league makes no difference to the Courts or Taxman.

[Eddie Lizzard]

There is a real chance of a winding up doing ahead. Administration would be unlikely to provide Chainrai with a full repayment of his debt and I can't imagine he would want to make any payment to HMRC.

[Matthew Le God]

although they may get a stay of execution (a certain amount of days to pay the plaintiffs in full).

 

Notts County only got an extension because they showed the court they had investment lined up. If Pompey can't do this then the High Court/Taxman won't want to delay the inevitable if they know that in 28, 42 or 1000 days time it still won't be paid.

Edited 7 February, 2010 by Matthew Le God

[70's Mike]

There is no way in the world Pompey will be wound up on Wednesday. Things like that just do not happen to clubs in the premier league. The case on Wednesday will either be thrown out due to a technicality or they will be given 28 days to pay... and somehow by the skin of their teeth something will materialise and they will pay it.

 

Just my opinion - I hope I'm wrong!

 

tend to agree, the revenue will accept a payment on account tuesday afternoon.

if the club is wound up they get nothing

[krissyboy31]

tend to agree, the revenue will accept a payment on account tuesday afternoon.

if the club is wound up they get nothing

 

But if they do this, they set a dangerous precedent for other companies who default on their tax liabilities and could even spark off a plethora of court cases from ex directors of companies that have been wound-up in similar circumstances.