Can we catch city ?

They'll scrape a few results together now. Horrible, but them winning today would have given us a sniff. United have handled their big run of fixtures brilliantly.

Any result today for either Manchester club could be promising for Saints.

United win left City only 5 points ahead of us.

City win left United only 6 points ahead with a much worse GD than City and more difficult fixtures.

The draw moved both of them a point further clear, but meant only 2 points were added to our CL rivals not 3.

As it is, City have nothing to play for, tangibly do not care less, and Pellegrini is doomed. If we can stay close enough to only need a result there on the last day we'll give it a hell of a go.

Wasn't accurate? I think you were a little more wrong than "wasn't accurate".

If you're on about his big reveal about the meltdown, everything he mentioned that had happened in the past (basically before July 26th) ties in with various other sources and circumstantial evidence - it was the assumptions about what was going to happen after Chambers was sold, which were guesswork because obviously the source from the Cortese era had left by then, that were mistaken - and even those were based on reasonable assumptions as of the end of July.

His opinion of Forster is laughable though.

And there were some (myself included) at the start of the season thinking we may need a result versus City to stay up...

And there were some (myself included) at the start of the season thinking we may need a result versus City to stay up...

Why did you think that? The likes of Fonte, Wanyama, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Schneiderlin, S.Davis are levels above the quality of a relegation team. Teams don't spent £60m+ on further international players and get relegated. The predictions of relegation last summer were bizarre, Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he couldn't get high quality players in.

Why did you think that? The likes of Fonte, Wanyama, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Schneiderlin, S.Davis are levels above the quality of a relegation team. Teams don't spent £60m+ on further international players and get relegated. The predictions of relegation last summer were bizarre, Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he couldn't get high quality players in.

Hand on heart, can you honestly say that you didn't even consider relegation as an option when we lost the players we did, before the purchases, I mean.

Pants so we do

 

( why the hell did I think they had to come to us )

maybe next time think a bit before you type?

Hand on heart, can you honestly say that you didn't even consider relegation as an option when we lost the players we did, before the purchases, I mean.

We didn't sell all the players and then make all the new signings, the arrivals and departures were intermixed.

The last 5 years have given us a clear idea of Katharina Liebherr's good intentions for the club as she has invested heavily. Its the press that keep running daft stories, despite the evidence of Liebherr's continued investment. Even then if you still had doubts, the appointment of Ronald Koeman as manager in mid June should have been a sign of intent to anyone worried. Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he wasn't going to be able to strengthen the squad last summer.

The five that left, did so to join more glamorous clubs and have large wage rises. We replaced them with lots of established internationals to add to a lot of talented players who stayed who were clearly above the quality of a relegation team. I didn't consider the possibility of relegation at all, I'm surprised so many did.

We didn't sell all the players and then make all the new signings, the arrivals and departures were intermixed.

 

The last 5 years have given us a clear idea of Katharina Liebherr's good intentions for the club as she has invested heavily. Its the press that keep running daft stories, despite the evidence of Liebherr's continued investment. Even then if you still had doubts, the appointment of Ronald Koeman as manager in mid June should have been a sign of intent to anyone worried. Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he wasn't going to be able to strengthen the squad last summer.

 

The five that left, did so to join more glamorous clubs and have large wage rises. We replaced them with lots of established internationals to add to a lot of talented players who stayed who were clearly above the quality of a relegation team. I didn't consider the possibility of relegation at all, I'm surprised so many did.

The benefit of 20/20 vision hindsight

Hand on heart, can you honestly say that you didn't even consider relegation as an option when we lost the players we did, before the purchases, I mean.

We were never going to get relegated, that wasn't ever in my head. I was just disappointed to see a decent team split up and envisaged a bit of a lower season, bottom half of the table but always comfortable. The pundits and the likes who were predicting us to finish 20th etc were just jumping on a bandwagon.

At the end of the day we got in a very good manager with a huge reputation in the game, at that point I knew we weren't going to be messing about and he believed in the plan. He wouldn't have come here otherwise.

The benefit of 20/20 vision hindsight

Nope, not at all. It was a case of knowing already last summer how good all the players we kept were and how bad the player quality is to be relegated.

We've got a squad of roughly 20 current/recent internationals or notable youth internationals of a good level. No team has ever been relegated with so many. We lost 4 first choice players last summer and spent £70m both replacing them and strengthening squad depth. No team has spent anywhere near that and been relegated in that season. We were light years above being relegation material.

Why did you think that? The likes of Fonte, Wanyama, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Schneiderlin, S.Davis are levels above the quality of a relegation team. Teams don't spent £60m+ on further international players and get relegated. The predictions of relegation last summer were bizarre, Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he couldn't get high quality players in.

It's a result of following Saints for a couple of decades. These are uncharted waters for most of us, we are more used to expecting the worst.

Beat Stoke on Saturday

Leicester beat Swansea

 

Fa cup

Arsenal beat Reading

Liverpool beat Villa

 

Pretty much in Europe next season.....

Why did you think that? The likes of Fonte, Wanyama, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Schneiderlin, S.Davis are levels above the quality of a relegation team. Teams don't spent £60m+ on further international players and get relegated. The predictions of relegation last summer were bizarre, Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he couldn't get high quality players in.

It really wasnt bizarre was it ? I never thought we would be relegated but I had this season down as being a real struggle. Add to this the amount of pundits and general footballing commenatators in various facets of the media that had us as potential relegation fodder shows that the situation was very much against us.

If I was asked the potential future of any other team in our position in the summer Id still say they would struggle. New board, new manager and massive change of footballing personel late into pre-season ? Its an incredible... INCREDIBLE effort to get us to where we are.

To say it is bizarre to say we could get relegated at the time is short sighted over optimistic ********.

Villa (even at home), and visits to Spurs and Swansea could all take points off them. We only need to win one more than them over the next 5 matches to go there with the chance to beat them to come 4th (assuming Liverpool and Spurs finish below us).

 

If we can win TWO more than them we might even go there only needing a draw.

I think its pie-in-the-sky to suggest that anything less than 5 out of 5 would be enough to see us going there with a chance on the final day.

We aren't realistically going to catch them on GD so we need them to drop three points. So, we need them to either draw against both Spurs and Swansea or lose one of them.

I think it'd be nothing short of miraculous if they dropped points at home to the other three.

Still, every win keeps the show on the road in the chase for fourth. Win our next four matches and (provided Liverpool don't win their next three matches and then beat Chelsea away) all the talk of the battle for fourth place, even if it ends with City comprehensively destroying Swansea at the Liberty, will be about us (as Liverpool and Spurs will both be mathematically out of it).

That would be a delight, regardless of what happens then.

Well can we?

5 points behind 6 games to go and they have to come here !!!

Of course, we can still do it. It is not likely but it it is possible. Certainly, it would be great to go to City on the last day of the season playing for fourth place.

Genuine question, but where would we gain the most prize money; a) getting spanked in the Champions League play off or, b) going straight into the Europa League group phase?

 

I know we might get through the qualifying round, but there are some bloody strong teams that have to go through that.

Obviously, losing in the Champions League playoff is worth more money if only because you get 3 million Euros for playing in the playoff round even if you lose. Also, some fans might buy tickets for the home game.

If you are really optimistic then why not ask if we can catch United? After this victory vs City, they will be 9 points ahead. Their remaining fixtures...

 

Chelsea (A)

Everton (A)

WBA (H)

Palace (A)

Arsenal (H)

Hull (A)

 

Would need us to go on a run, and them to lose against Chelsea and Arsenal (very possible), Palace (not unrealistic), Everton (who knows which team is going to turn up) as I doubt they would lose against Hull or WBA. Overly optimistic but funnier things have happened

 

Right, time for a lie down!

 

But City have

 

WHU (H)

Villa (H)

Spuds (A)

QPR (H)

Swansea (A)

us (H)

 

In reality, who is going to give them problems? Spuds might but depends who turns up on the day. Swansea can hold their own, Villa are resurgent (maybe!), QPR fighting for their lives. Us? I don't think so. But you never know.

I would assume any chance we have of finishing ahead of City would include beating them.

So you feel that Spurs (below us in the league) could trouble them; Swansea (below us in the league) could cause them trouble; Villa (below us in the league) could cause them trouble; QPR (below us in the league) could turn them over but Not us? surely we are the most likely of all the aforementioned teams.

Stop being logical.

I will eat my hat if we finish above City. It ain't going to happen. We've been brilliant this season but 5th at the absolute best is where we will finish. If I am wrong I do not possess a hat anyway so happy days.

I am sure someone will be happy to buy you a nice big hat should the need arise.

Beat Stoke on Saturday

Leicester beat Swansea

 

Fa cup

Arsenal beat Reading

Liverpool beat Villa

 

Pretty much in Europe next season.... Anything more come the last day will be a bonus.

I would really like not to have to start the season at the end of July, if possible.

Does that mean we get to live this season over and over again until we get it exactly right? Cool.

Villa (even at home), and visits to Spurs and Swansea could all take points off them. We only need to win one more than them over the next 5 matches to go there with the chance to beat them to come 4th (assuming Liverpool and Spurs finish below us).

 

If we can win TWO more than them we might even go there only needing a draw.

That's the spirit.

Hand on heart, can you honestly say that you didn't even consider relegation as an option when we lost the players we did, before the purchases, I mean.

I assumed that at the very worst Liebherr would want to get the extra money she would get for selling a Premier League club.

We didn't sell all the players and then make all the new signings, the arrivals and departures were intermixed.

 

The last 5 years have given us a clear idea of Katharina Liebherr's good intentions for the club as she has invested heavily. Its the press that keep running daft stories, despite the evidence of Liebherr's continued investment. Even then if you still had doubts, the appointment of Ronald Koeman as manager in mid June should have been a sign of intent to anyone worried. Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he wasn't going to be able to strengthen the squad last summer.

 

The five that left, did so to join more glamorous clubs and have large wage rises. We replaced them with lots of established internationals to add to a lot of talented players who stayed who were clearly above the quality of a relegation team. I didn't consider the possibility of relegation at all, I'm surprised so many did.

Also, This.

It really wasnt bizarre was it ? I never thought we would be relegated but I had this season down as being a real struggle. Add to this the amount of pundits and general footballing commenatators in various facets of the media that had us as potential relegation fodder shows that the situation was very much against us.

 

If I was asked the potential future of any other team in our position in the summer Id still say they would struggle. New board, new manager and massive change of footballing personel late into pre-season ? Its an incredible... INCREDIBLE effort to get us to where we are.

 

To say it is bizarre to say we could get relegated at the time is short sighted over optimistic ********.

I think the lesson is that many pundits are idiots. I tend to listen to Gab Marcotti and Dan Henry.

I think the lesson is that many pundits are idiots.

Succinctly put.

Why did you think that? The likes of Fonte, Wanyama, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Schneiderlin, S.Davis are levels above the quality of a relegation team. Teams don't spent £60m+ on further international players and get relegated. The predictions of relegation last summer were bizarre, Koeman wouldn't be here if he knew he couldn't get high quality players in.

You could argue it around the end of July, new manager, core of the side having left, Tadic and Pelle pretty much unknown quantities the only signings and worries even more were going, but by the start of the season it was clear we could put 11 people on a pitch without it being likely we'd be one of the worst 3 in the league. And then Schneiderlin was named for the Liverpool match and that removed more of that concern. But at some points during the close season you could argue that there was

No guarantee the players you mentioned would still be there

Some of them (Ward-Prowse) might not be up to standard

We hadn't spent £60m anyway

International players are no particular indication of quality (Forren, Gardos)

Teams may well have spent £60m and been relegated - especially if they've sold more.

Add to that that Koeman may have been misled to the scale of the sales and MIGHT have been considering his position, and also that there was no guarantee he would be successful either based on his experiences at Valencia, and you have all the elements for concern about a relegation season.

Just for the record though, no-one had the foggiest that we were going to get relegated in 2004/5 until we stepped on the pitch on the opening day and were awful at Villa, so it's not like there have to be major areas of concern. All you need is your signings not working out to change the atmosphere and a winning mentality is easily lost.

 

No guarantee the players you mentioned would still be there

Some of them (Ward-Prowse) might not be up to standard

We hadn't spent £60m anyway

International players are no particular indication of quality (Forren, Gardos)

Teams may well have spent £60m and been relegated - especially if they've sold more.

Add to that that Koeman may have been misled to the scale of the sales and MIGHT have been considering his position, and also that there was no guarantee he would be successful either based on his experiences at Valencia, and you have all the elements for concern about a relegation season.

.

I think his Tweeted photo of an empty training pitch with just cones on at the start of his tenure knocks that one out of the park

smilie face winky thingymabob.

I've been listening to talkSport this morning. Liverpool have a chance if they win tonight, but we don't. So there.

I think his Tweeted photo of an empty training pitch with just cones on at the start of his tenure knocks that one out of the park

smilie face winky thingymabob.

That's what I mean though, by then things had settled down a lot, but it's daft to suggest there was no reason to think we might get relegated. Even with the squad we've got it only takes a bad run of injuries in key positions to cause a load of defeats, the margins are tight.

I've been listening to talkSport this morning. Liverpool have a chance if they win tonight, but we don't. So there.

Yep, that potential one additional point could make all the difference with 6 games to go!

FWIW as it stands, us and Liverpool can still mathematically win the League, but Spurs can't.

For the City arguement, of course we can cause them trouble, all three of the teams below them can. Realistically though I think Spurs have shot their bolt. They just dont seem to be dangerous whenever Ive watched them recently and are currently pretty poor at the back (that said watch them roll us over)

Liverpool are the most likely, thats just obvious. They have more quality to their squad then we do in reality, they need the win tonight to get them back on to winning ways however.

City themselves are in a bit of a mess right now. Ive kept saying to myself that they'll regroup at some point but it just hasnt happened. Its as though they've given up, and thats dangerous at this stage in the league. I can genuinely see them falling out of the top four to be replaced by us or liverpool tbh

Rather than debating about what happened or may have happened in the summer, how about we just bring up the league table and bask in it's glory for a bit? We're 5th. Going into the last month, we're 5th!! We're talking about catching Man City. We already have the same points that we finished on last season. We have a goal difference which is better by about +14, we have the best defence in the league. This situation may not happen again, so I'm just going to set that league table as my wallpaper and enjoy it.

Rather than debating about what happened or may have happened in the summer, how about we just bring up the league table and bask in it's glory for a bit? We're 5th. Going into the last month, we're 5th!! We're talking about catching Man City. We already have the same points that we finished on last season. We have a goal difference which is better by about +14, we have the best defence in the league. This situation may not happen again, so I'm just going to set that league table as my wallpaper and enjoy it.

All good points, but you forgot to mention that we are also above both Liverpool and Tottenham and if it finishes like that then you know you've had a good season.

All good points, but you forgot to mention that we are also above both Liverpool and Tottenham and if it finishes like that then you know you've had a good season.

It would be the first time in our 130 year history we've finished above Liverpool.

Rather than debating about what happened or may have happened in the summer, how about we just bring up the league table and bask in it's glory for a bit? We're 5th. Going into the last month, we're 5th!! We're talking about catching Man City. We already have the same points that we finished on last season. We have a goal difference which is better by about +14, we have the best defence in the league. This situation may not happen again, so I'm just going to set that league table as my wallpaper and enjoy it.

Whoa!! Steady on there Fella!! The Too positive police will be along in a minute!!

Anyway you can't talk of such success it's pure heresy because the all knowing God called Sky, the inventors of Football, and their disciples in the rest of the sports media can't bring themselves to utter our name in the same sentence ahead of Liverpool and Tottingham Hotspurs, you are well set for a burning on the stake Clarkey: Mark my words!!

It would be the first time in our 130 year history we've finished above Liverpool.

I'm genuinely surprised at that

Please, please, pretty please...

BBC website is all about how the Scousers can do it. We are invisible.

Rather than debating about what happened or may have happened in the summer, how about we just bring up the league table and bask in it's glory for a bit? We're 5th. Going into the last month, we're 5th!! We're talking about catching Man City. We already have the same points that we finished on last season. We have a goal difference which is better by about +14, we have the best defence in the league. This situation may not happen again, so I'm just going to set that league table as my wallpaper and enjoy it.

...

While it's still mathematically possible I for one will still hope and dream that we can do it, that's what being a supporter is all about surely! If we were 3rd from bottom and 5 points off safety everyone would be saying yes we can do it up until the point we mathematically couldn't anymore! So let's all hope and pray city slip somewhere and we do not! COME ON YOU REDS

We are just fortunate to be where are at the start of the season according to many we where relegation fodder enjoy best season for many years no matter what happens in the league we have done well and exceeded most people's forecast just enjoy

Whoa!! Steady on there Fella!! The Too positive police will be along in a minute!!

 

Anyway you can't talk of such success it's pure heresy because the all knowing God called Sky, the inventors of Football, and their disciples in the rest of the sports media can't bring themselves to utter our name in the same sentence ahead of Liverpool and Tottingham Hotspurs, you are well set for a burning on the stake Clarkey: Mark my words!!

Oh it's guaranteed that if Liverpool win tonight, they will be lapping it up saying how they can get 4th. And how City are in real trouble etc. No mention what so ever of us being their nearest challengers during the weekend, even though we're the team behind them

I'd give anything for a Newcastle win tonight.

Come on even the most pessimistic Saints must admit there is a chance, we are starting to find a little bit of form, especially with a goal for Pelle, that will be huge for him.

Plus City look fightless and disjointed at the moment, they can't defend. Yes you can look at their fixtures and you should say those are all fixtures they should win, but then they should have beaten Burnley and they were in better form when they played them. So it's not far fetched to see them drop 4-5 points between now and when we play them. It's whether we can go on a good run.

I'd say it's less about whether we can catch City, I totally think we can it's whether we can catch City AND keep ahead of Liverpool who will most probably beat the toon tonight.

But hey lets enjoy the ride, best premier league total ever, potential to finish in our highest position for what 25 years?, pretty close to at least Europa League, and an outside chance of 4th and Champions League. it's at least going to be a fun run in with something to actually play for.

Come on, it would be one of the greatest achievements in the history of football if we finished 4th. So dust off your old Diana Ross records " Dream the impossible dream". Just 1 more win than City and Liverpool in the next 5 games and we go to Manchester with a stab at history. It's on...at least until Saturday!

Oh it's guaranteed that if Liverpool win tonight, they will be lapping it up saying how they can get 4th. And how City are in real trouble etc. No mention what so ever of us being their nearest challengers during the weekend, even though we're the team behind them

 

I'd give anything for a Newcastle win tonight.

100% this. You know it, we all know it.

Come on, it would be one of the greatest achievements in the history of football if we finished 4th. So dust off your old Diana Ross records " Dream the impossible dream". Just 1 more win than City and Liverpool in the next 5 games and we go to Manchester with a stab at history. It's on...at least until Saturday!

Diana Ross do what, doesn't that song come from a musical comedy about Don Quixote ??

Like You'll Never Walk Alone I suppose, most think that it's a G+Pm original although it's way older than that, Carousel, mid 50s I think.

Man of La Mancha....

If Liverpool finish fourth and we finish within three points of them then Kevin Friend will have a lot to answer for.

Diana Ross do what, doesn't that song come from a musical comedy about Don Quixote ??

Like You'll Never Walk Alone I suppose, most think that it's a G+Pm original although it's way older than that, Carousel, mid 50s I think.

Indeed it was, 1945 musical, 1956 film, we went to see it as a family. I can't see that Diana Ross has ever covered it although many others have. G+Pm was only 7 years later in 1963 and is my wife's least favouirite song. Ever.

Man of La Mancha was 1965 and seems to have even more covers although Diana Ross isn't amongst these either.

Rather than debating about what happened or may have happened in the summer, how about we just bring up the league table and bask in it's glory for a bit? We're 5th. Going into the last month, we're 5th!! We're talking about catching Man City. We already have the same points that we finished on last season. We have a goal difference which is better by about +14, we have the best defence in the league. This situation may not happen again, so I'm just going to set that league table as my wallpaper and enjoy it.

BBC website is all about how the Scousers can do it. We are invisible.

Every time they suddenly feel they are close or have a chance they cock it up.

Also worth noting that they have Lolvren at the heart of their defence for a bit now, what with Sahko out for a month.

Indeed it was, 1945 musical, 1956 film, we went to see it as a family. I can't see that Diana Ross has ever covered it although many others have. G+Pm was only 7 years later in 1963 and is my wife's least favouirite song. Ever.

Man of La Mancha was 1965 and seems to have even more covers although Diana Ross isn't amongst these either.

I've dusted it off now. It was on the Diana Ross and the Supremes join the Temptations album. Any how thanks for the info and whatever version play it load and proud

We still have a great chance of 5th. Obviously Liverpool will win tonight, but we're just about hanging in there. I'd be happy with 3 more wins, which is what I think we will get. What a season that would be.

F*CK ME WE'RE SO HIGH IN THE TABLE I'VE GOT A NOSEBLEED I DON'T CARE WHERE WE FINISH BUT IT HAS BEEN A LOT OF FUN TAKING THE MICKEY OUT OF ALL THE PLASTIC BINDIPPERS I KNOW IN SURREY THIS SEASON.

WHO DO I PRAY TO FOR US TO FINISH ABOVE THEM THIS SEASON FOR ADDED COMEDY VALUE?

Oh look I'm shouting

Whatever happens it's been a brilliant season but if we could hang on in there and take it to a Champs League sh*t or bust encounter with Citeh then it would have to go down as one of our best ever.

The fixtures aren't too bad TBH...

Stoke (a) - mid table team going nowhere, hopefully already thinking about their holidays

Spurs (h) - hopefully they do their usual end of season fade + we owe them one anyway

Sunderland (a) - really nothing special, if we go there with the right attitude we should be better then them

Leicester (a) - same as Sunderland - bottom of the table for a reason, bang average side

Villa (h) - hopefully comfortable by the time we play them, 3 points.

Come on Graziano, get your shooting boots on and lets make history.

Stranger things have happened but I can't see us catching them, not with 4 out of 6 away and City's run in not being too hard.

One thing that could be in our favour is the fact we have nothing to lose. We can just go for it and enjoy the last 6 games knowing anything we get is just a bonus. Would be fantastic to go into the last game within 3 points of City and CL qualification in our own hands.

Leicester (a) - same as Sunderland - bottom of the table for a reason, bang average side

If they were average for the Premier League, they'd be in mid table.

We'll lose to Stoke and City. We'll finish 7th and celebrate a great season.

Shame we don't have any decent fit strikers - or I genuinely think we'd be in the top 4 still.

Here's a horrible thought that occurred to me as I listened to Newcastle capitulate against the bindippers tonight.......

We might end up above Spurs, last game of the season, based on our result City or Liverpool will get Champions League.

Would you be happy beating City knowing that that smug arse Rogers would benefit next season?

Shut up Glasgow