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Europe next season (via fairplay)

simo

By simo,
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Village Saint

Village Saint

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Would be quality. Good competitive pre-season games, club can be marketed and sold to new signings as competing in Europe. Didn't do Fulham too much harm and they didn't exactly have an exceptional squad.

 

Indeed if you look at the stats it's never actually been proven to do anyone any harm. As many teams have seemed to have benefitted as have seemed to have been harmed. In essence clubs do well or clubs do badly in a range of competitions in any one year according to how good their squads and their management are. What it does do is create an excuse for managers whose teams are underperforming. The Tottenham manager (what was his name?) did that last year. Unfortunately for him his Chairman saw through that ruse.

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VectisSaint

VectisSaint

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Indeed if you look at the stats it's never actually been proven to do anyone any harm. As many teams have seemed to have benefitted as have seemed to have been harmed. In essence clubs do well or clubs do badly in a range of competitions in any one year according to how good their squads and their management are. What it does do is create an excuse for managers whose teams are underperforming. The Tottenham manager (what was his name?) did that last year. Unfortunately for him his Chairman saw through that ruse.

How many teams from England have qualified via the Fair Play route? I guess Fulham did. The Fair Play route is the problem, it means 4 extra qualifying games in July (England teams do not otherwise join until 3rd qualifying round). These are not good, competitive games instead of pre-season, they are more then likely to be against teams from such strong associations as San Marino, Andorra or even Liechtenstein. Qualify by any other route, fair enough, but by this back door route, no thanks, too disruptive during vital part of the season. Who will still think its a good idea when one or more of our important players are crocked before the season starts. UEFA really need to look at the way the Noddy League is organised.

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SaintBobby

SaintBobby

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How many teams from England have qualified via the Fair Play route? I guess Fulham did. The Fair Play route is the problem, it means 4 extra qualifying games in July (England teams do not otherwise join until 3rd qualifying round). These are not good, competitive games instead of pre-season, they are more then likely to be against teams from such strong associations as San Marino, Andorra or even Liechtenstein. Qualify by any other route, fair enough, but by this back door route, no thanks, too disruptive during vital part of the season. Who will still think its a good idea when one or more of our important players are crocked before the season starts. UEFA really need to look at the way the Noddy League is organised.

 

I'm in two minds about this.

 

Couldn't Saints just treat the 4 qualifying games as pre-season friendlies? It's up to us how "competitive" we seek to be in theses matches.

 

Instead of playing Evian, Etoile Carouge etc (as we did last Summer), why not just play other small-ish European clubs with the "bonus" of qualifying for Europe if we win?

 

My worry is that European football does increase tiredness, risk of injury etc. And lots of Saturdays with no league game, of course.

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ART

ART

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Let us learn to walk before trying to run. The only way I would agree for us to p;ay in the Europa league is if Cortesé surprises us all and brings in José Mourinho and allows him 150 million to build the squad.

 

Otherwise just forget it!!!

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SaintBobby

SaintBobby

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I heard yesterday during the commentary that Liverpool wouldn't take up the option of qualifying if they were offered it. And its not just on red and yellow cards, if it were we would be top.

 

Sure, red and yellows seem to account for a good chunk of it - but that's why I referenced the Suarez chomp. That will surely hit Liverpool's points total hard. (agree that Liverpool may not take up the place as well)

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stevy777_x

stevy777_x

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The real question is : Are we ahead of Norway, Finland and Sweden? Since the end of last year, clubs from these countries have hardly played in european competition as they were all in majority knocked out.

Have England improved on their 4th position? Not likely, with Nani's red card and Vertonghen red card this could have put a dent into our chances.

Then again, its not all based on cards.

 

http://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/uefaorg/Respect/01/91/16/53/1911653_DOWNLOAD.pdf

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saints_is_the_south

saints_is_the_south

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UEFA's fair play ranking runs until 30 April before it starts again for next season, so we should know fairly soon whether or not England have secured a top 3 spot.

 

If we did get in, then the draw for the first round of qualifying is made on 24 June, and is played on 4th and 11th July. Don't know why some are so concerned about this. The qualifying games can be treated as pre-season, with the bonus that they are actually competitive matches. There are 3 qualifying rounds and then the play off round to get into the group stage. The play off round commences after the Premier League has started, so you have 6 games before the season starts. Last summer, we played 6 pre season games plus the Markus Liebherr trophy.

 

The only issue I see is it makes it more difficult to arrange pre-season, do you arrange no friendlies on the assumption you make it through the 3 qualifying rounds, or go ahead and plan friendly matches and then either have to cancel them, or play them as well. Guess you could always play the u21 and u18s in those.

 

In 2005/2006 Middlesbrough managed a 14th place finish in the League, an FA Cup semi final and League Cup quarter final in addition to reaching the final of the UEFA Cup. In 2009/2010 Fulham finished 12th in the Premier League and reached the quarter finals of the FA Cup plus the final of the Europa League. And this season, Newcastle will probably finish somewhere between 13th-16th whilst making it to the quarter finals of the Europa League. So it can be done, without having too much of an effect on league performance and you can certainly survive in the Prem whilst having a Europa run.

 

So if it does come to it and we do make it in there, as long as we suitably strengthen our squad in the summer I'm sure we could manage it just fine. Anybody who says they'd rather not qualify is mad IMO. Qualifying for Europe regardless of how it is achieved would raise the profile of the club, and potentially allow us to attract better players in the transfer market too. I'm all for it.

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

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The real question is : Are we ahead of Norway, Finland and Sweden? Since the end of last year, clubs from these countries have hardly played in european competition as they were all in majority knocked out.

Have England improved on their 4th position? Not likely, with Nani's red card and Vertonghen red card this could have put a dent into our chances.

Then again, its not all based on cards.

 

http://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/uefaorg/Respect/01/91/16/53/1911653_DOWNLOAD.pdf

 

Well I don't know if it will help us but but there's a bit of a to-do in Norway over a Senegalese player being suspended for accusing a ref of being a racist. As far as our domestic situation is concerned Carragher's continual harranging of the ref and Mad-Dog biting people won't help Liverpool.

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MOSaint

MOSaint

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When asked about it last week Brendan Rodgers didn't sound enthusiastic about getting in via fair play here is what he said:

 

“Maybe we should get a couple of sendings-off or bookings!” said Rodgers. “I’ve never really thought about the Fair Play route.

 

“We want to get into it with our performance level and in any case it’s highly unlikely we’d get that Fair Play route.

 

“It’s the top three countries and England are fourth.

 

“It is not something I would be keen on. I want to get there through the right means.

 

“If we have to have a year where we are not in it, it’s going to give us an opportunity to push on.”

 

Rodgers, whose team are at rock-bottom Reading this afternoon, added: “There’s a pride thing. You want to get in it by performing and through the positions.

 

“It was a long journey in it this year and don’t get me wrong we enjoyed it and we were disappointed when we came out of it, but I think down the Fair Play route the qualifying rounds start even earlier.

 

“I’d prefer to be in it by qualifying through the league or winning a trophy.

 

“If it’s not that way then we as a club are better suited to re-aligning our focus to domestic cups and the league.”

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

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Posted (edited)

 

Doesn't work that way, Barton played in the Europa League but not in domestic competition. 2 different disciplinary systems.

If Liverpool were in the initial rounds of the EL Suarez could play, that's the whole point of Barton's loan, EL kept him in competitve trim for when he eventually finished his domestic ban.

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

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See an updated table has been released...

 

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/matchday/fair-play.html

 

 

 

So since then we will have made up 3 points on cards,and if you read the rules the delegates report would not have ignored the biting incident so Liverpool can effectively kiss any chances of Fair play qualification goodbye cos they'll get a zero on respect of opponents whereas we've been pretty exemplary of late.

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VectisSaint

VectisSaint

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So since then we will have made up 3 points on cards,and if you read the rules the delegates report would not have ignored the biting incident so Liverpool can effectively kiss any chances of Fair play qualification goodbye cos they'll get a zero on respect of opponents whereas we've been pretty exemplary of late.

But the Suarez incident will also impact the English League fair play standing won't it? England was already in 4th so would not qualify, doubt the Swedes or Norwegians had too many biting incidents in their last few league games.

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

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Dont think there was one card last week vs Swansea was there?!

 

no we've scored 10,8 and 10 on cards in the last 3, Liverpool 6,9 and 10.

The Suarez incident will cost them though on several counts, he might not have got a card but they'll get docked massive points everywhere else. If England should make the top 3 our chances are excellent. However Suarez will count against England as well so maybe he's cost us our chance as well.

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

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To be honest the whole thing is a joke, we've had no red cards and little trouble during our games and yet we are not top. How the **** is Liverpool up there when they are in the news for the wrong reason most of the time.

 

the difference between ourselves and Liverpool is minute, could easily be a result of more positive play or less time wasting

or even less hostile crowds. You've only to sing "Get your tits out for the lads" to a lady assistant ref to get a zero pointer on respect of officials.

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Badger

Badger

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Well that's that f*cked then.

 

Perhaps one good thing to come out of today.

 

Hope?

 

After watching Newcastle falling apart with a thin squad out of gas, my only hope is that we don't get anywhere near Europe next year.

 

But tell that to the deluded hordes on here...

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dubai_phil

dubai_phil

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Thats that one dead then. Guess we don't want the hindrance next season and want to qualify for the Champs League through league position.

 

Or....

 

The very early Qualification matches would play havoc with our multi-million dollar World pre-season tour designed to give all our global fans the chance to see us play with all our new signings, Messi, Ronaldo et al

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The9

The9

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As posted in the other thread, on Sky Sports News just now :

 

Rodgers said the original question was a joke but got reported.

 

Rodgers also said "I think that as a football club you have to... I don't think it's something that you can turn down if you get an opportunity to go into European football. The journey that we had this year in Europa League, all the players thoroughly enjoyed it, it was a great exercise for us, we were bitterly disappointed to go out, and if we got the chance to do it again then for sure we will".

 

Also reporting Pochettino's comments via interpreter from the Press Conference today - REITERATED SAINTS WOULDN'T TAKE A PLACE IF OFFERED ! :

"No we wouldn't accept it either... spoken with the Chairman... we decided not to take the offer, because we think that what you earn in football needs to be decided ON the pitch. And that's basically our decision, to only accept possibilities when we've earned them already on the pitch"

 

So that's that then.

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Cascadia Saint

Cascadia Saint

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http://www.football365.com/news/21554/8687375/Nobody-Wants-The-Fair-Play-Europa-League-Place

 

Saints are in the running via UEFA's Fair Play League, but Pochettino has confirmed that they will not accept the offer of a place.

 

The Argentine revealed though that the reason would not be fixture congestion - but because he believes all clubs who play in the competition should qualify by finishing high up their league.

 

"We would not accept it either if we were awarded that possibility," Pochettino said.

 

"We have spoken with the chairman and decided not to take that offer because I think in football what you are awarded in football needs to be earned on the pitch.

 

"We will only accept possibilities when we've earned them on the pitch and not just by fair play, but actually earning it with points and results."

 

Liverpool boss Brendan Rodgers says the Reds - who are also in the Fair Play running - would reject the chance to play in the competition for the same reason.

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The9

The9

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http://www.football365.com/news/21554/8687375/Nobody-Wants-The-Fair-Play-Europa-League-Place

 

Saints are in the running via UEFA's Fair Play League, but Pochettino has confirmed that they will not accept the offer of a place.

 

The Argentine revealed though that the reason would not be fixture congestion - but because he believes all clubs who play in the competition should qualify by finishing high up their league.

 

"We would not accept it either if we were awarded that possibility," Pochettino said.

 

"We have spoken with the chairman and decided not to take that offer because I think in football what you are awarded in football needs to be earned on the pitch.

 

"We will only accept possibilities when we've earned them on the pitch and not just by fair play, but actually earning it with points and results."

 

Liverpool boss Brendan Rodgers says the Reds - who are also in the Fair Play running - would reject the chance to play in the competition for the same reason.

 

I'm so glad football365 also decided to transcribe the Press Conference comments I already typed in the post immediately above it, apart from completely failing to bother to listen to Brendan Rodgers' comments today which said the exact opposite of what 365 have reported. :rolleyes:

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  • 2 weeks later...
kwsaint

kwsaint

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Posted

 

I'm almost glad really. It gives us the opportunity to focus on improving the club steadily rather than risking Europa League football. You just have to look at Newcastle to see what it did to them. Although I think our starting 11 is better than them, there is no denying they have more depth to their squad atm.

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The9

The9

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I'm almost glad really. It gives us the opportunity to focus on improving the club steadily rather than risking Europa League football. You just have to look at Newcastle to see what it did to them. Although I think our starting 11 is better than them, there is no denying they have more depth to their squad atm.

 

That and the fact the club explicitly stated they wouldn't take a place not earned via results.

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