Saints 1-4 Leicester - Match Thread

[Pamplemousse]

I have to be honest, I'm already questioning the manager. The tactics are disastrous. It's great he has principles but we're not good enough to play like this, everyone can see it, and in particular the opposition.

A defeat against Ipswich and personally I'd sack him. Knee jerk maybe but there should be a long list of managers who could come in.

[Exeter Saint]

Just now, AlexLaw76 said:

Think you did. He was miles better than any of our players operating in the same area

Were Harwood-Bellis and Charles better than Bednarek and Stephens? I’m not so sure.

[saintant]

The problem with RM insisting on this playing out from the back is that opponents are very aware of this. From the first minute today Leicester pressed us hard and their reward was two early goals as we played right into their hands - other teams will do the same. This will erode any confidence of the players and lead to even more mistakes. There is no way you can learn this system on the job because of all the goals you'll give away - it is self perpetuating. RM must abandon it because if he doesn't he's going to be sacked before too long.

[hypochondriac]

14 minutes ago, Dman said:

You're joking? He's been absolutely fucking terrible all season. 

But we know he's not terrible at all. It's obviously these tactics and the way it's played. Both him and Manning look like two of our worst players. It's not a coincidence. 

[woodsaint1]

2 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Think you did. He was miles better than any of our players operating in the same area

Smallbone and Downes is very high bar

[The Curse of St Mary's]

9 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Martin.....post match

• Everyones responsibility tonight
• we made it difficult, 3rd goal was the killer
• we were on top in the 2nd half, they were clinical, we were not
• people will talk about the score, but if we were more clinical, it would be different
• we cannot concede 2 early goals
• we went toe to toe, and you have to accept they will get through us at times
• I am proud of the players, as this is different to Sunderland, they did what we asked them
• Leicester lost the ball more than we did, but no one will criticise their manager
• we will continue to work on what we do
• if anyone expects to not experience pain now, they are naive
• This was much better than sunderland, and not a huge amount in it tonight
• the first goal was ridiculous, 2nd goal we know why as players were out of position, 3rd goal was about poor transition
• we will make more mistakes and we will see more bumps in the road
• how people react is up to them
• If we play like we did tonight, move the ball like that, we will be more than OK
• All will want a reaction on Tuesday. If we play like we did tonight, sure it will come
• James Justin said it was not a red card, I do not believe it was a red card, we will see.

Leicester were far from clinical the missed 3/4 huge chances. Fraser chance aside I can't recall much else we created. Adams and Downes getting in each others way in first half I suppose but still slim pickings. He's deluded. 

[Dman]

1 minute ago, Exeter Saint said:

Were Harwood-Bellis and Charles better than Bednarek and Stephens? I’m not so sure.

Can we please stop blaming the CB's FFS. There's little they can do when they're being exposed time and time again. 

The problem is with the tactics leaving the midfield non-exisitant and full backs pushing up too high. 

We need to fuck off this 'inverted full back' bollox - he only does it because pep does - it's leaving us way too exposed and results are showing that. 

[obelisk]

Just as well that Saints managed to fluke some wins before other teams worked out how to play against our shambles of a set up.

[woodsaint1]

35 minutes ago, Golac's Cunning Stunts said:

Makes absolutely no difference, We were shit and deserved what we got - infact lucky it was only 4

Well duh, just making an observation on a poor decision

[madge]

On sports republic.. SFC are a business, a business that’s failing year on year with bad decisions one after another both on and off the pitch.. 

Surely the owner can’t accept this.. he’s either being badly advised or he’s simply out of his depth to. We need a couple of hard nosed bastards who won’t take any of this crap.. starting with recruitment and management of the team. 
 

on the pitch we’ve been pretty average all season and quite easily had only 4-5 points 

Edited 15 September, 2023 by madge

[Crab Lungs]

13 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Martin.....post match

• Everyones responsibility tonight
• we made it difficult, 3rd goal was the killer
• we were on top in the 2nd half, they were clinical, we were not
• people will talk about the score, but if we were more clinical, it would be different
• we cannot concede 2 early goals
• we went toe to toe, and you have to accept they will get through us at times
• I am proud of the players, as this is different to Sunderland, they did what we asked them
• Leicester lost the ball more than we did, but no one will criticise their manager
• we will continue to work on what we do
• if anyone expects to not experience pain now, they are naive
• This was much better than sunderland, and not a huge amount in it tonight
• the first goal was ridiculous, 2nd goal we know why as players were out of position, 3rd goal was about poor transition
• we will make more mistakes and we will see more bumps in the road
• how people react is up to them
• If we play like we did tonight, move the ball like that, we will be more than OK
• All will want a reaction on Tuesday. If we play like we did tonight, sure it will come
• James Justin said it was not a red card, I do not believe it was a red card, we will see.

Almost all of that is insane. Nathan Jones levels of insanity.

[woodsaint1]

1 minute ago, Dman said:

Can we please stop blaming the CB's FFS. There's little they can do when they're being exposed time and time again. 

The problem is with the tactics leaving the midfield non-exisitant and full backs pushing up too high. 

We need to fuck off this 'inverted full back' bollox - he only does it because pep does - it's leaving us way too exposed and results are showing that. 

THB got sat down by a defensive midfielder, pretty sure you can blame him for that protection or no protection

[Kermitzasaint]

If only there was a way SR could have known that Russell Martin was a very poor coach. Especially considering our obsession with statistics. 

[BranfootsLoveChild]

It's all well and good people saying 5 more games and if it's still shit then sack Martin. SR havn't exactly set the league alight with their knowledge of managers have they. Will another manager turn this shit show around? I'm not sure with the players we have but if we are relying on Rasmasson to appoint the management I think we are fucked!

 

 

 

[macca155]

If and it is a massive if, Saints had avoided the early calamities, then I could see that game being much closer.

Martin was right once the third goal went in, they could sit back and avoid any risky moves. Saints have shown a complete inability to break down teams in those situations for years.

That's football, once you have a lead the balance of the game changes.

However he set that team up. All managers have to deal with injuries. It was obvious Charles needed to be in midfield. Play Holgate (or a youngster) but make sure he is protected.

With so many games losses like this can be quickly negated, if the manager and team set their mind to it.

If working hard again there.

Bazunu, Edozie, and Charles did OK today. The rest looked lost. These tactics really don't look to be effective.

[AlexLaw76]

1 minute ago, Crab Lungs said:

Almost all of that is insane. Nathan Jones levels of insanity.

He is a clown 

[Golac's Cunning Stunts]

2 minutes ago, woodsaint1 said:

Well duh, just making an observation on a poor decision

Well duh for you making such an obvious statement - not even worth a consideration

[harvey]

15 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Martin.....post match

• Everyones responsibility tonight
• we made it difficult, 3rd goal was the killer
• we were on top in the 2nd half, they were clinical, we were not
• people will talk about the score, but if we were more clinical, it would be different
• we cannot concede 2 early goals
• we went toe to toe, and you have to accept they will get through us at times
• I am proud of the players, as this is different to Sunderland, they did what we asked them
• Leicester lost the ball more than we did, but no one will criticise their manager
• we will continue to work on what we do
• if anyone expects to not experience pain now, they are naive
• This was much better than sunderland, and not a huge amount in it tonight
• the first goal was ridiculous, 2nd goal we know why as players were out of position, 3rd goal was about poor transition
• we will make more mistakes and we will see more bumps in the road
• how people react is up to them
• If we play like we did tonight, move the ball like that, we will be more than OK
• All will want a reaction on Tuesday. If we play like we did tonight, sure it will come
• James Justin said it was not a red card, I do not believe it was a red card, we will see.

Deluded on so many levels.

[Paul.Studio]

Just heard his post match thoughts (RM) - i dont think he was at the same game!  If anything the score should have been 1-8

[The Kraken]

9 minutes ago, Dman said:

Can we please stop blaming the CB's FFS. There's little they can do when they're being exposed time and time again. 

The problem is with the tactics leaving the midfield non-exisitant and full backs pushing up too high. 

We need to fuck off this 'inverted full back' bollox - he only does it because pep does - it's leaving us way too exposed and results are showing that. 

The CBs were far from the worst players tonight. THB had a bit of a blunder playing out from the back early in but otherwise he looked alright. Charles looked decent and showed a drive unlike others when he pressed forward and got his shirt pulled for a free kick in the edge of their box. Most of the game the two young lads did ok, some minor errors but otherwise ok.

We got undone by Smallbone and Downes being utterly shit, our full backs just being lost, Edozie being unable to defend, and our manager’s “pass pass pass at all costs” being woefully shown up as naive idiocy. Fuck me,so much to work on, but as you say it’s rare you look at a 1-4 home defeat and think that the CBs didn’t do all that much wrong.

Edited 15 September, 2023 by The Kraken

[davefizzy14]

Absolute shambles tonight. We've conceded once again in the first minute. All the goals we conceded were gifted to the opposition. How can we be so wide and open time and time again. Going back to basics is a must. RM has to address this and quickly. Edozie for me was our best player and got a goal. 

Edited 15 September, 2023 by davefizzy14

[Saint_Jonny]

1 minute ago, Paul.Studio said:

Just heard his post match thoughts (RM) - i dont think he was at the same game!  If anything the score should have been 1-8

Yep. He said he was proud of the players. Fucking mental. Fine don't go hard on them, but don't pretend that wasn't fucking awful either. 

[Simon3737]

34 minutes ago, Suhari said:

I wonder what Dragan is thinking now?

Whoop! I’m a billionaire! 🤪

[FarehamSaintJames]

I’m concerned that he’s going to be stubborn like Ralph.

No Plan B. 

He already talked in his interview with the Echo this week that if one day Jason comes to him and says “times up”, then he has no issue because he’s stuck to his principles etc.

Maybe he should adjust his thinking.

[Mr X]

I think we can safely say sports Republic are not remotely clued up on appointing the right manager that's tactics suit our players third time lucky anybody?, I don't think it's too early to say that this is going to take an almighty turn around from Martin to get some positivity back 

[Dman]

Just now, The Kraken said:

The CBs were far from the worst players tonight. THB had a bit of a blunder playing out from the back early in but otherwise he looked alright. Charles looked decent and showed a drive unlike others when he pressed forward and got his shirt pulled for a free kick in the edge of their box. Most of the game the two hound lads did ok.

We got undone by Smallbone and Downes being utterly shit, our full backs just being list, Edozie being unable to defend, and our manager’s “pass pass pass at all costs” being woefully shown up as naive idiocy. Fuck me,so much to work on, but as you say it’s rare you look at a 1-4 home defeat and think that the CBs didn’t do all that much wrong.

Downes is a good player. I watched with a keen eye tonight, we marked Man for Man and it left a huge hole in the midfild (obviously leciester were smart enough to pull wide) allowing an easy pass into Vardy, dragging Charles out and then players running into that space. 

Really simple basic stuff we should be able to defend against / counter, yet we played right into their hands. 

This result is on the manager and noone else. imo. 

[AlexLaw76]

After reading Martin’s post match comments again, I think he might need a hug from Holly Willoughby 

[Winnersaint]

We lack shape particularly when we lose possession and there are no fucking leaders out there. Last promotion we had SRL, Dean Hammond, Jose Fonte, Frazer Richardson and Adam Lallana who were either out and out leaders or led by example. You might want to add GDP to that as well. Great though JWP was for us we were devoid of  a leader last year and look where that got us, until we address that there will be more disappointments like Sunderland and this evening. As The Duckhunter would have it. Too many sons in law on the pitch this evening.

 

 

 

 

Edited 15 September, 2023 by Winnersaint

[Saint NL]

4 minutes ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

I’m concerned that he’s going to be stubborn like Ralph.

No Plan B. 

Based on that, there wasn't even a plan A 😳

[Wiggles31]

The defensive tactics are non-existent. The 4th goal from the corner, what in the fuck?! After that goal last week. The full backs are invisible on the transition. No one tracks runs in behind. It’s dreadful. 

[The Kraken]

5 minutes ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

I’m concerned that he’s going to be stubborn like Ralph.

No Plan B. 

He already talked in his interview with the Echo this week that if one day Jason comes to him and says “times up”, then he has no issue because he’s stuck to his principles etc.

Maybe he should adjust his thinking.

Of this there should be no surprise. Martin has already stated a few times ‘you don’t need a plan B when plan A is the right thing to do’, and ‘If it doesn’t work and I get sacked, at least I get sacked doing something I believe in. I don’t get sacked regretting that I have bowed on my principles.’ We’re stuck with this. Those quotes were before Saints, he’s clearly learnt nothing.

 

 

Edited 15 September, 2023 by The Kraken

[saint michael]

I would like to know what he thinks needs to change for Ipswich game. I fear it’s nothing. I think he believes that keep playing this way will get better on its own and it’s the lack of familiarity with playing this way that’s the issue. 
 

I really can’t decide which players have skills and which do not. They are so far off playing what I think football is that I’m struggling to see any clear firm positives to build on. 

[CB Fry]

29 minutes ago, Sunglasses Ron said:

I’m not sure about this at all. We’re a well established club and have had a shocking run of comical situations in recent years:

> The nine nils

> Nathan Jones

> Grimsby defeat

> Relegation

> Pathetic home record

> Pathetic defensive record

I agree Everton and Reading are above us in the laughing stock league but being a Saints fan has been bloody embarrassing in recent times.

 

 

No one else gives a toss. Arsenal and West Brom and Middlesbrough and Cardiff and Blackpool and Port Vale and Wycombe fans are not thinking about us, at all.

Edited 15 September, 2023 by CB Fry

[AlexLaw76]

Just now, saint michael said:

I would like to know what he thinks needs to change for Ipswich game. I fear it’s nothing. I think he believes that keep playing this way will get better on its own and it’s the lack of familiarity with playing this way that’s the issue. 
 

I really can’t decide which players have skills and which do not. They are so far off playing what I think football is that I’m struggling to see any clear firm positives to build on. 

If we keep playing this way, we will still games, we have better players than about 20 teams in the league, so it is bound to happen. I am sure we will comfortably beat Rotherham for example. 

no chance we will get promoted though.

 

[6ft8saint]

Well that was terrible. I felt pretty confident pre match watching Adams, smallbone, Fraser, Armstrong and downs taking shots in and around the box that we might have tackled the lack of shots on goal but we get into the game and nothing. They keep waiting for it to be perfect. And if not the ball ends up being passed back to are week defence. 

 

As for them shea Charles was way off par tonight. There's a reason he was 2nd team man City and I think he is over his head along with most of the defence. 

 

As for playing out from the back I thought we kicked alot tonight we were just to slow and sloppy with the passes.

 

Russell Martin needs to get firmer with them but tell them to have fun too. 

 

My 6yr olds team have fun every week. And shot for fun.

 

Let's hope Tuesday is better

[hypochondriac]

4 minutes ago, Dman said:

Downes is a good player. I watched with a keen eye tonight, we marked Man for Man and it left a huge hole in the midfild (obviously leciester were smart enough to pull wide) allowing an easy pass into Vardy, dragging Charles out and then players running into that space. 

Really simple basic stuff we should be able to defend against / counter, yet we played right into their hands. 

This result is on the manager and noone else. imo. 

There were moments in the first half where Leicester wide players were just stood on their own with no full backs anywhere near them. I don't think the full backs have any idea what they are supposed to be doing. We've seen it with the amount of crosses that come into our box and with the lack of closing down. Similarly we had Edozie doing defensive work again, in front of the defense for one of the goals. I don't think a number of players know where they should be when we are defending which is what us causing all these problems. KWP is an excellent player yet he looks appaling. It has to be the coaching. 

[Dusic]

Biggest two issues for me of the recent games have been:

1. The midfield setup. Against Sheff Weds Smallbone was clearly holding and then JWP and Alcaraz more advanced. Downes IMO has been playing too high and is pressing when we need him to be in front of the back four. Part of the issue recently has been the shoehorning of Arma and vs Sunderland Stu into the midfield three when its not their position and then they don't do the job thats needed in a solid 433 shape. Now that Downes is injured hopefully Charles gets a run as the deep midfield and is instructed not to press the ball upfield.

2. The role of KWP. This guy is our best player and an excellent attacking outlet but the weird inverted position just means he is never available to receive the ball in those dangerous advanced positions. Plus when the ball is lost he is often out of position. Nothing against him moving inside sometimes but it needs to be dialled down.

[Exeter Saint]

The players look like strangers. They need to play together more. Maybe the international break didn’t help. Lots of games will be good I think.

[Osvaldorama]

27 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Martin.....post match

• Everyones responsibility tonight
• we made it difficult, 3rd goal was the killer
• we were on top in the 2nd half, they were clinical, we were not
• people will talk about the score, but if we were more clinical, it would be different
• we cannot concede 2 early goals
• we went toe to toe, and you have to accept they will get through us at times
• I am proud of the players, as this is different to Sunderland, they did what we asked them
• Leicester lost the ball more than we did, but no one will criticise their manager
• we will continue to work on what we do
• if anyone expects to not experience pain now, they are naive
• This was much better than sunderland, and not a huge amount in it tonight
• the first goal was ridiculous, 2nd goal we know why as players were out of position, 3rd goal was about poor transition
• we will make more mistakes and we will see more bumps in the road
• how people react is up to them
• If we play like we did tonight, move the ball like that, we will be more than OK
• All will want a reaction on Tuesday. If we play like we did tonight, sure it will come
• James Justin said it was not a red card, I do not believe it was a red card, we will see.

Yeah I’ve been very vocal in defending him but this is absolutely horrendous delusion. 
 

It’s like he’s watching a different game. We were completely shit. Schooled by Leicester and credit to them. 

Tonight was as bad as it gets really 

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, AlexLaw76 said:

If we keep playing this way, we will still games, we have better players than about 20 teams in the league, so it is bound to happen. I am sure we will comfortably beat Rotherham for example. 

no chance we will get promoted though.

 

Yep. Could sneak playoffs if we get Stephens back and Stewart recovers and gets into some form. No chance of anything else playing this way though. 

[hypochondriac]

Who is meant to be shielding the back four? I feel as if that's probably our most important position to make this system work and it isn't. 

[The Curse of St Mary's]

2 minutes ago, saint michael said:

I would like to know what he thinks needs to change for Ipswich game. I fear it’s nothing. I think he believes that keep playing this way will get better on its own and it’s the lack of familiarity with playing this way that’s the issue. 
 

I really can’t decide which players have skills and which do not. They are so far off playing what I think football is that I’m struggling to see any clear firm positives to build on. 

Downes won't be fit it seems which is not necessarily a bad thing as he's been pretty crap. Move Charles to CDM. Janny B and TBH the obvious pairing but both are slow so this inverted full back bollocks will expose them. Get a feeling we have picked up a few knocks out there tonight so could be a few changes. Sullemana will be suspended unless we win an appeal but he looked rubbish tbf.

[BotleySaint]

Still.. Nice to see Edozie showing some end product and hitting the target. Hopefully he can start scoring 4-5 a  game to compensate. 

[Chewy]

Sunderland was concerning.

Seeing that live tonight- seeing that we clearly hadn’t learned a thing - was really concerning.

Reading his opinion on the game is just next level. If that is genuinely how he feels and not a  public comment hiding his private feelings, we are f*cked. 
30000 people in Southampton and god knows how many on tv could all see an utter shambles, suicidal tactics and a very average team gifted 8 or 9 glorious chances by our utter sh1tness. 

If he’s the only person who saw that any differently, and he’s in charge, we’re screwed.

[Dusic]

Just now, BotleySaint said:

Still.. Nice to see Edozie showing some end product and hitting the target. Hopefully he can start scoring 4-5 a  game to compensate. 

Good argument he has been our best player this season. Hopefully his knock isnt too bad and he can start on Tuesday.

[OttawaSaint]

Where do we dig up these specimens from. Loony managers trying to be Pep and the smartest man in the room.

Mental from SR, they must be pompey shills!

It was so fucking simple. Get in someone to solidify that back 4, instill a bit of confidence and belief and instead we've got another loony trying to be clever.

Newsflash hipster, it's a simple fucking game! Concede less and score more. Why fanny around with it. Does an average boxer fight with his guard down? 

Edited 15 September, 2023 by OttawaSaint

[6ft8saint]

Also could st marys turn up thr singing. We were so quiet tonight. It doesn't inspire them to play better. Kameldeen tried to spur us back on after hr came on but nothing. If anything it is slightly embarrassing. Wheres the noise from the Dell gone????

[Wade Garrett]

Was Edozie injured?  He was easily our best player in the first half.

[Winnersaint]

5 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

No one else gives a toss. Arsenal and West Brom and Middlesbrough and Cardiff and Blackpool and Port Vale and Wycombe fans are not thinking about us, at all.

Spot on here. Also I’ve never really understood the whole embarrassment thing. I’ve had a new kitchen fitted over the last couple of weeks, both the fitter and the electrician are regulars at SLC/Mad Stad, and we think we’ve got problems. 

[Wiggles31]

11 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

Who is meant to be shielding the back four? I feel as if that's probably our most important position to make this system work and it isn't. 

Half the time it’s a back 2.