Saint_John Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 A "10 min rule" is being proposed for Tuesday 13th at the House of Commons Tuesday 13 March 2012 Ten minute Rule Motion 1 FOOTBALL (FINANCIAL TRANSPARENCY) Damian Collins That leave be given to bring in a Bill to require a football club playing in the top four tiers of English and Scottish professional football to disclose the identity of its owner, the identity of the owner of its home playing ground, training ground, any intellectual property associated with the club or a third party stake in its players and the identities of outstanding creditors; to require all creditors of a football club to be compensated equally should the club go into administration; and for connected purposes. http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmfbusi/e01.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatch Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Fair point. Have to wonder how clubs do it. Massive TV money, quite good attendances and expensive tickets. Guess they've been overpaying players. I hope we're more sensible if we go up, although there will be the usual summer panic from posters when we don't buy an entire new team. Villa spent £24m on Bent for a start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 (edited) With the express permission of the webmasters and the contributors of this thread (of whom I am yet to officially ask), I am going to attempt to a PTS bible and a snapshot (for those of us who just want the basic facts). I will begin next week, providing I have the authority to do so. Of course, this is something that continues to roll on relentlessly every day, so I would need to maintain it. I'll have to see how it goes but it's going to take some serious work. However, needs must and it'd be nice to have something that we can just revisit easily without having to trawl through hundreds of pages first. I could really use some extra fingers for this so any of the phew that want to help, please do let me know Six tumbleweeds roll along the streets each representing a failed owner. Change these back again to what they were, thou powerful enchanter, Time, and they shall be seen to be the carriages of absolute crooks and lunatics, the equipages of feudal nobles, the toilettes full of fat of flaring Jezebels, the churches that are not my father's football club honestly, but dens of thieves, the huts of millions of starving peasants in Lithuania! No; the great magician who majestically works out the appointed order of the Creator FF, never reverses his transformations. "If thou be changed into this shape by the will of God," say the seers to the enchanted, backed by the wiseman from the Arabian shores, "then remain so! But, if thou oh Crabby cannot edit this form through mere passing conjuration, then resume thy former aspect and stick to the photoshop Dude!" Changeless and hopeless, the tumbleweeds roll along. Of the riders in the thread, some observe these things, and all things on their last roadside, with an impassive stare; others, with a lingering interest in the ways of life and men. Some, seated with drooping heads, are sunk in silent despair ankle deep in urine; again, there are some so heedful of their looks that they cast upon the multitude such glances as they have seen in rumamafia, and in pictures. Several close their eyes, and think, or try to get their straying thoughts together. Only one, and he a miserable creature, of a crazed aspect, is so shattered and made drunk by horror, that he sings, and tries to dance, and he tries to make sense of the chaos before him within the 1129 pages..... Not one of the whole number appeals by look or gesture, or to be stupid enough to offer up their Editing Skills, to the pity of the people........... "I see Rallyboy, and Ho, The Defraud, The Vengeance, the HMRC, the Judge, long ranks of the new oppressors who have risen on the destruction of the old, helping to expose this poopey by this retributive instrument of the PTS, before it shall cease out of its present use. I see a beautiful creation and a brilliant people rising from this abyss, and, in their struggles to be truly free, in their triumphs and defeats, through long long to come, I see the end of the evil of this time down the M27, and of the previous time of which this is the natural birth, gradually making expiation for itself and wearing out on Southsea Common.... "I see the lives for which I lay down my life, peaceful, useful, prosperous and happy, in that England which I shall see no more while I am engaged in this noble quest. I see Her in the caravan with a child upon her bosom, who bears the name Britney. I see her father, her brother and uncle as one, aged and bent from the weight of the Big Issue, but otherwise I see football restored, and faithful to all men in his healing office, and at peace. I see the good old man Sacha, so long their friend, in ten years' time enriching them with all he has in his car park, and passing tranquilly to his reward at 24% interest to chinny. "It is a far, far better thing that you, Crabby, do, than I have ever done; it is a far, far better test that you go to than I have ever known." With an awful lot of apologies to Charles Dickens Edited 28 February, 2012 by dubai_phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 With an awful lot of apologies to Charles Dickens That was sublime. It's a big test. A big, big test. In fact, it may even have an ending by the time I've finished but I'm going to give it a shot. This thread is deserving of preservation in first and foremost it's most raw are pure form, that goes without saying. Encapsulating all 1129 pages is a toughie. I'm confident I can do it. More confident than Birch is of saving Pompey, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Just received a tax rebate notification of £380 from the year 03-04... COYHRMC! You should write to them issuing them a penalty charge of 100% of the tax, plus interest, for late payment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyboy Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 good luck with that Crab, could be your great legacy, the project that fills the rest of your days...get Phil to edit, he has a way of saying things succinctly. To the point. Without dragging it out. Or over-engineering it. I'd be aware though that you just need another managerial visit to a brothel, or Ho reappearing to tell us about great new minted investors and you'll never keep up with the new pages rolling in. The train wreck is ploughing on - as is the social commentary of it. And as you skip through the 1129 pages, do feel free to pick out the bit where we guesstimated their running losses and came up with the same figure that Birch has mentioned. I recall that we were pretty accurate on that £8M a year figure? Seem to remember being called a nutjob for saying it at the time, but it sounds like 'at least £500K a month' was a good guess. Makes you wonder though, if we could accurately identify the club ownership and debt issues on here just by googling, studying and guessing, how could directors at pompey stand by and watch it all happen? And how could those few on pompey boards who Ho assures us have ALWAYS been several weeks ahead of us investigating, not highlight those issues, and address them? Two mysteries for the price of one! - buy one, get the second one paid for by West Brom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 @pn_neil_allen: RT @SOSPompey: Villa announce losses of over £50m, I wonder if ppl will start calling them cheats! Especially those w@*#$+ on Talksport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 If that is the case - how long is it until Birch starts looking at liquidation? Very shortly I think, if the parachute payments aren't forwarded. Until the end of the season if they are forwarded. As has been mentioned a few times before, the only thing keeping the rotten corpse on life support up until now are the remaining parachute payments. Once they've been snatched by Chinney et al, it's hasta la vista you DFCSBs. I love it when it goes quiet..... It means there is a new twist and an iceberg round the corner... PS... where are our pet skates... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 It does genuinely amaze me that even journalists can't see the fundamental difference between the situation at Pompey and the situation at Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 You should write to them issuing them a penalty charge of 100% of the tax, plus interest, for late payment I know nothing of tax rules and regs but if this is at all possible, I'd do it. And sort you out... at WorldNet 12. good luck with that Crab, could be your great legacy, the project that fills the rest of your days...get Phil to edit, he has a way of saying things succinctly. To the point. Without dragging it out. Or over-engineering it. Thank you rallyboy, I hope that the bible does this thread justice. I hope to maintain most of it in it's most purest form whilst also making it more, well... easier to navigate in a flick-of-the-page kinda way. If it's a success, I'll ask Baj if he's interested in making a Corp Ho app for Android and iPhone, one which upon a single prompt, lavishes a daily pearl of mockney wisdom direct to your mobile device. @pn_neil_allen: RT @SOSPompey: Villa announce losses of over £50m, I wonder if ppl will start calling them cheats! Especially those w@*#$+ on Talksport. There are so many reasons as to why that comment is stupid I'm not even going to begin. OK, just a couple. Villa's debt is serviceable. They get more than 10,000 fans each home match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 It does genuinely amaze me that even journalists can't see the fundamental difference between the situation at Pompey and the situation at Steve, have a word mate.... That was Neil Allen. Don't confuse him with the word "Journalist" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckasaurus Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 listening to "death in vegas" with tears running down my face,laughing so much. please keep it up, (oh er) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgiesaint Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 @pn_neil_allen: RT @SOSPompey: Villa announce losses of over £50m, I wonder if ppl will start calling them cheats! Especially those w@*#$+ on Talksport. Please, someone who is on Twitter, forward that on or re-tweet it to Adrian Durham. Being called a w@*#$+ will guarantee he'll mention it!! But anyway, don't let a headline loss of £53.9m - where they accounted for the payment for Bent but didn't include the payments in for Young or Downing (both undisclosed but Villa were saying they wouldn't let either go for under £20m) and reduced their bank borrowing by £8.3m. Admittedly they did take £25m from Randy Lerner so whilst it isn't the greatest set of results seen, it's nowhere near as bleak as the headline figure. Mind you, they will need to be careful. Lerner won't keep putting that level of funds in - but on the plus side, at least they look after their ground & last I heard they did still own their training facilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 With the express permission of the webmasters and the contributors of this thread (of whom I am yet to officially ask), I am going to attempt to a PTS bible and a snapshot (for those of us who just want the basic facts). I will begin next week, providing I have the authority to do so. Aren't bibles typically written 400 years after the event....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Aren't bibles typically written 400 years after the event....? Well, this thread has been going a long time now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint si Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 With the express permission of the webmasters and the contributors of this thread (of whom I am yet to officially ask), I am going to attempt to a PTS bible and a snapshot (for those of us who just want the basic facts). I will begin next week, providing I have the authority to do so. Of course, this is something that continues to roll on relentlessly every day, so I would need to maintain it. I'll have to see how it goes but it's going to take some serious work. However, needs must and it'd be nice to have something that we can just revisit easily without having to trawl through hundreds of pages first. I could really use some extra fingers for this so any of the phew that want to help, please do let me know Great idea! I think along with this we need a concise summary, with just the facts, free from any of SFC-PFC rivalry, to help spread the Good Word to fans of other clubs. Something we can all post on messageboards, comments boxes, facebook etc etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rooney Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 With an awful lot of apologies to Charles Dickens Now that really was a clever piece of literature and above all-it made me laugh. I would love to see a picture of a skates face trying to understand it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Now that really was a clever piece of literature and above all-it made me laugh. I would love to see a picture of a skates face trying to understand it all. Luckily Britney left her web cam on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Well, this thread has been going a long time now This thread is bigger than Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gingeletiss Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 If you had any morals you'd donate that straight towards the survival of poor little Pompey. They've done nothing wrong and need help from those being better treated by HMRC. Ferk that! my letter said I owe them £700, so I start next year with a 203 tax code, so donate it to me!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Not pompey I know, but Farnborough docked points for financial irregularities. I don't beleive for one minute there won't also be some irregularities down the road! http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17196052 Farnborough docked five points for financial irregularities Blue Square Bet South side Farnborough FC have been deducted five points and given a £5,000 suspended fine by the Football Conference after being found guilty of financial irregularities. The club were found guilty of submitting misleading information on quarterly financial returns. The Hampshire club intend to appeal against the decision. "I am extremely disappointed to hear of the Conference's verdict and penalty on Monday," said manager Spencer Day. "However the opportunity to make our defence and mitigation is at an appeal to the FA which we will be lodging as soon as possible. "The club has been found guilty of an offence dating back to a document due in June last year and a dishonoured cheque way before I took charge, but I accept that it is a club responsibility." Day continued: "Due to a series of events the club has yet to file any sort of defence to the charge and we look forward to the appeal where we can give the Conference and Football Association our position and let procedure run its course. "Naturally, as the first-team manager, this is potentially a massive blow to our survival chances, however we are still in a vastly better position in the league table than when we started in late November and I am very confident." Just for the record, "Spencer Day"/Spencer Trethewy, who took Aldershot down the river in 1992 was then imprisoned for running up bills when his company was suspended for trading in 1994, so it's hardly a shocker that he's managed to breach football's financial rules with that kind of history. I'm fairly sure the "30ft statue of himself in dead iguanas" is just Wikipedia being Wikipedia though. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spencer_Trethewy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Well, this thread has been going a long time now Fair point! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 If I won £100M on the Euros I wouldn't give that lot the hole from a Polo Mint. So rare that even though they actually sold them in 2003 I can't find a single picture of them on the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 With an awful lot of apologies to Charles Dickens Who is a Skate, so why ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Great idea! I think along with this we need a concise summary, with just the facts, free from any of SFC-PFC rivalry, to help spread the Good Word to fans of other clubs. Something we can all post on messageboards, comments boxes, facebook etc etc... Lung does not do "concise". With the admirable exception of Ask Adkins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningtonCrescent Posted 28 February, 2012 Share Posted 28 February, 2012 Please, someone who is on Twitter, forward that on or re-tweet it to Adrian Durham. Being called a w@*#$+ will guarantee he'll mention it!! But anyway, don't let a headline loss of £53.9m - where they accounted for the payment for Bent but didn't include the payments in for Young or Downing (both undisclosed but Villa were saying they wouldn't let either go for under £20m) and reduced their bank borrowing by £8.3m. Admittedly they did take £25m from Randy Lerner so whilst it isn't the greatest set of results seen, it's nowhere near as bleak as the headline figure. Mind you, they will need to be careful. Lerner won't keep putting that level of funds in - but on the plus side, at least they look after their ground & last I heard they did still own their training facilities. and presumably they pay their tax bill every month?! That's a key difference! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Halo* Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 So rare that even though they actually sold them in 2003 I can't find a single picture of them on the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suewhistle Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Just had my morning chortle before pootling off to do a 4 hour! English class. This thread never fails to get me laughing. Thanks guys. A timeline sounds like a good idea.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Just had my morning chortle before pootling off to do a 4 hour! English class. This thread never fails to get me laughing. Thanks guys. A timeline sounds like a good idea.. Facebookers may not agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Villa spent £24m on Bent for a start Ah, but that is the crux of the matter .... they didn't actually PAY £24M Villa, like all other Clubs in the Prem and FL, did the deal with "Never Never" money, £50 down, and £10 per week for the next 100 years THAT is the scenario. It's called HP. I'm sure we have all used HP to pay for something at one time or another. Mainly controlable at family level, but absolutely ridiculous in the manner in which Football Clubs are allowed to operate. All Football Clubs should be solvent, and live within their means. If any team wants a player, fine, but PAY for him with REAL money, or don't buy, Simple Until such times that Football comes to its senses in the way it does Business, very shortly, many many more Clubs are going to fail, and very soon, IMHO, many well known names ARE going to fail, and Liquidation will become commonplace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dronskisaint Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 It does genuinely amaze me that even journalists can't see the fundamental difference between the situation at Pompey and the situation at I don't think Neil Allen qualifies as a journalist any more....he's so desperate to prove his skate credentials that he can no longer (or ever could?) write anything close to objective! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Apparently their brightest young starlet is off to Liverpool & they can't replace him as he is not considered to be a first-teamer. Doh! If only they'd put him on the bench a couple of times instead of leaving it empty they could have another of WBA's reserve team on the way in. http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/starlet_set_to_go_from_blues_to_reds_this_week_1_3569960 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Just had my morning chortle before pootling off to do a 4 hour! English class. This thread never fails to get me laughing. Thanks guys. A timeline sounds like a good idea.. Haha, that's EXACTLY what I was planning on doing with a search feature with all the main protagnists and contributors! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skintsaint Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Apparently their brightest young starlet is off to Liverpool & they can't replace him as he is not considered to be a first-teamer. Doh! If only they'd put him on the bench a couple of times instead of leaving it empty they could have another of WBA's reserve team on the way in. http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/starlet_set_to_go_from_blues_to_reds_this_week_1_3569960 lol at the Pompey fans thinking they'll get a decent sum of cash for him...150k max I reckon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALWAYS_SFC Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 pop over to the snooze site....some interesting(lol) funny things on there today....brian howe..roman dubov..etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevvy Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Crabby, you may have to put pictures and stick diagrams in it for our fishy friends to understand whats has been going on over the last few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Thomas Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Apparently their brightest young starlet is off to Liverpool & they can't replace him as he is not considered to be a first-teamer. Doh! If only they'd put him on the bench a couple of times instead of leaving it empty they could have another of WBA's reserve team on the way in. http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/starlet_set_to_go_from_blues_to_reds_this_week_1_3569960 Got to love comment 4 there - not sure a sell-on clause will do them much good if they don't make it to next season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
positivepete Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 pop over to the snooze site....some interesting(lol) funny things on there today....brian howe..roman dubov..etc The take on it from the Grauniad.... http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/feb/29/transfer-rumours-walter-samuel-tottenham The Star reports that Brian Howe, once the singer with the band Bad Company, is back in the running to buy Portsmouth from the club's administrators after failing to go through with a bid in 1997 when Martin Gregory and Terry Venables owned Pompey. Bad Company … Portsmouth … fish … barrel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 The take on it from the Grauniad.... http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/feb/29/transfer-rumours-walter-samuel-tottenham The Star reports that Brian Howe, once the singer with the band Bad Company, is back in the running to buy Portsmouth from the club's administrators after failing to go through with a bid in 1997 when Martin Gregory and Terry Venables owned Pompey. Bad Company … Portsmouth … fish … barrel. And yet in the snooze article he admits - he does not have the money to buy the club. But he's looking for people who do. Now, where have we heard THAT one before? Out of the 200,000 who packed Southsea Common, only ONE of them "may know some people with enough money?" As it stands at the moment, the only differences beteen him & Mickey Fialka appear to be a hairstyle & the fact that Brian doesn't live with his Mum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Now then, where was that clip from The Life of Brian. How did it go? I am not the Messiah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony13579 Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 (edited) Ah, but that is the crux of the matter .... they didn't actually PAY £24M Villa, like all other Clubs in the Prem and FL, did the deal with "Never Never" money, £50 down, and £10 per week for the next 100 years THAT is the scenario. It's called HP. I'm sure we have all used HP to pay for something at one time or another. Mainly controlable at family level, but absolutely ridiculous in the manner in which Football Clubs are allowed to operate. All Football Clubs should be solvent, and live within their means. If any team wants a player, fine, but PAY for him with REAL money, or don't buy, Simple Until such times that Football comes to its senses in the way it does Business, very shortly, many many more Clubs are going to fail, and very soon, IMHO, many well known names ARE going to fail, and Liquidation will become commonplace If the football creditors rule falls and a load of clubsgo into admin and get a CVA, then a club that has a good acadamy will be left without thier expected income. They will still be expected to pay for the players they bought (unless they were bought from a club that have folded or gone into administration. I can see the feckless clubs sheding thier debt and the clubs that have budgeted being hit hard. The debt does not just disapear, It moves from the cheats to the hard working clubs. Edited 29 February, 2012 by tony13579 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 If the FCR is binned, I'd like to see HMRC at least make a concession that all transfers which took place before the ruling are still subject to the old terms of the FCR, but anything from, say, this summer onwards is outside of that remit. Otherwise I can see a load of clubs going into admin in pre-pack administrations where the current owner buys them back from the administrator for a knock-down price with 80%+ of the debt wiped away. West Ham are probably the most obvious example, their debts are staggering, and Gold and Sullivan would love to just wipe most of them away, but they know that they can't do that at the moment because the vast majority of their debt is to football creditors. Many clubs sold players to the likes of West Ham, Pompey, Bournemouth, etc, safe in the knowledge that even if the club went tits-up, they'd still get their money through the FCR. If the goalposts are suddenly changed, that's a lot of clubs that could end up getting completely shafted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 And yet in the snooze article he admits - he does not have the money to buy the club. But he's looking for people who do. Now, where have we heard THAT one before? Out of the 200,000 who packed Southsea Common, only ONE of them "may know some people with enough money?" As it stands at the moment, the only differences beteen him & Mickey Fialka appear to be a hairstyle & the fact that Brian doesn't live with his Mumif you listen to his interview saturday that was put on here, he says that he knows people with money in the states and he is going to try and encourage them to invest. he is staying in England this week to talk to TB. With mates like him who needs enemies!!! i wouldnt like a friend to give me an 'opportunity' like Pompey thanks very much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 If the FCR is binned, I'd like to see HMRC at least make a concession that all transfers which took place before the ruling are still subject to the old terms of the FCR, but anything from, say, this summer onwards is outside of that remit. Otherwise I can see a load of clubs going into admin in pre-pack administrations where the current owner buys them back from the administrator for a knock-down price with 80%+ of the debt wiped away. West Ham are probably the most obvious example, their debts are staggering, and Gold and Sullivan would love to just wipe most of them away, but they know that they can't do that at the moment because the vast majority of their debt is to football creditors. Many clubs sold players to the likes of West Ham, Pompey, Bournemouth, etc, safe in the knowledge that even if the club went tits-up, they'd still get their money through the FCR. If the goalposts are suddenly changed, that's a lot of clubs that could end up getting completely shafted. That is why Gold was so keen for the FCR to go when he was on Sky sports the other night. They will be happy to take the minus 10 points if they go up this season as they would yet again get the extended parachute payments , spent 1 more year in the Championship as they rebuild for promotion again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 That is why Gold was so keen for the FCR to go when he was on Sky sports the other night. They will be happy to take the minus 10 points if they go up this season as they would yet again get the extended parachute payments , spent 1 more year in the Championship as they rebuild for promotion again. Yep. I'm all in favour of ditching the FCR, but it's got to be a gradual process, I think, otherwise it'll cause absolute carnage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torres Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Would the PL/FL be able to redirect commercial income normally due to those clubs directly to the football creditors instead? The PL did something similar with Pompey and the PPs, didn't they? If they can't, I can see that being 1 way to get around any removal of the FCR in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holepuncture Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 @pn_neil_allen: RT @SOSPompey: Villa announce losses of over £50m, I wonder if ppl will start calling them cheats! Especially those w@*#$+ on Talksport. That is why Gold was so keen for the FCR to go when he was on Sky sports the other night. They will be happy to take the minus 10 points if they go up this season as they would yet again get the extended parachute payments , spent 1 more year in the Championship as they rebuild for promotion again. The moron skate 'journo' needs to appreciate the fact that Villa own an impressive, famous large stadium, strong support and have a good youth set up. Yes they are accruing losses, but at £50m of debt the assets will still massively outweigh the liabilities... Pompey on the other hand have no assets at all other than ACWAB, and even that stinks and looks funny. All other aspects of the business are purely liabilities... massive ones at that. As for West Ham, they are walking a tight rope without a safety net of epic proportions... if they dont get back up, or if Barry Hearn blocks them from taking over the Olympic white elephant stadium, theyre finished. Gold and Sullivan have dumped tons of their own fortunes in to keep them going so far, that wont happen forever. They will not crash like the DCFSBs though as once again they ahev an impressive, famous large stadium strong support and a good youth academy. And by strong support I dont mean a few gobby skates self proclaiming to be the bestestz, I mean real, tangible support - measured in numbers not myths. Anywho, before this turns into a general footy finance thread, let me introduce you all to - The Love Toast Community http://www.facebook.com/lovetoastcommunity For all lovers of toast, we should take over when the great day finally comes. Science behind the toast: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyboy Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 not enough of pompey's debt is 'football' so a change won't help them too much. In general terms, if HMRC win their case it will just mean Fifa and UK football authorities will have to introduce further sporting sanctions. As we've seen with pompey, they don't have to pay the football debt if they don't want to - it just means they wouldn't get the golden share, so the FL etc always have some sort of hold beyond UK law - remember our inability to appeal deductions. A new rule might be that failure to pay football debts in full = two division relegation? Failure to pay a European club would mean a ban from European competition next time they qualify, etc. That would make clubs look at what would cost them more. If West Ham knew they could write off a shedload but would start life in League Two next season it might look less attractive. Despite the FL and FA looking toothless of late I can't see them permitting consequence-free administrations - and Fifa won't let them. Say what you want about Mr Cortese but his forward planning re the academy status and his declared aim for the club to be self-funding is a blueprint for all to follow. And when Ho starts quoting pub myths about us missing tax payments and our spending being out of control - we could have broken the bank to secure Hooper in Jan but we didn't. It was obvious he had his price even if Celtic didn't, rightly so IMO, we didn't go there. While we did pay to get out of League One, our business model looks to me to be sound, at the moment. Unfortunately for other clubs, they needed to start this type of business plan a year or two back - that ship has sailed, and anyone who took on stupid longterm wages and ignored debt is likely to sink. And that brings us back to the good ship pompey, sailing into a Cala casino near you sometime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 29 February, 2012 Share Posted 29 February, 2012 Haha, that's EXACTLY what I was planning on doing with a search feature with all the main protagnists and contributors! Something like this would be cool..... http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/interactive/timelines/british/index_embed.shtml No pressure.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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