James Ward-Prowse's list of indisputable, unimprovable weaknesses

[mrfahaji]

For someone so adept (although I know some debate it) at free kicks, it still puzzles me how poor his passing is at times. I know it's easy to pick out one instant, but it's certainly not the first time I've noticed - his pass to Mane today was absolutely atrocious, not even close to being the required ball! I also didn't like his attempt to get to the high cross with about 10 minutes (I think) to go, half jumped towards it reminiscent of Fabrice Fernandes... He did seem to be playing with a bit more confidence though which is encouraging, hopefully that's come through his goals last week.

[Faz]

Oh, another assist for James Ward-Prowse. And he was solid today.

[Saint Charlie]

Oh, another assist for James Ward-Prowse. And he was solid today.

Played well today. Still feel he needs to do more in an attacking sense if playing the most advanced of a CM 3 but he is doing ok.

[Saint_clark]

He has looked so much better the last month or two, a much more influential and accomplished player. This is the level of contribution we anticipated he would reach when he first broke onto the scene. Long may it continue.

[austsaint]

Oh, another assist for James Ward-Prowse. And he was solid today.

 

Lovely cross for the goal but otherwise he wasn't really in the game.

[Saints Fan Dan]

He's finally arrived. He made his arrival against WBA and hasn't looked back. I've slagged him off a lot over the years but now I'm disappointed if he isn't starting. Great work.

[Saint Without a Halo]

A bit like Matt Oakley and Steve Williams you only notice their difference when they are not there

For his age I think he is improving a lot stronger now and I hope there is more to come

[Saint Charlie]

He still wouldn't be in my first choice team even with Wanyama out.

 

Shows how much competition there is in that area.

 

Also crazy Harrison Reed isnt out on loan playing regular football.

[Faz]

Lovely cross for the goal but otherwise he wasn't really in the game.

 

Not quite sure which game you were watching.

[St Marco]

Have to give the lad some credit he has done well recently.

However today he was very much a mixed bag like a lot where. Some of his passes especially in the second half were pretty poor. He also got done a few more times than I would have liked. He needs to create more to justify his starting place. An assist is great but needs to be more consistent with his decision making. Maybe a bit more brave with passes forward.

[Faz]

The impressive James Ward-Prowse found Long with a precise cross from the right wing' date=' and the unmarked Republic of Ireland forward nodded in despite a sprawling attempted save from Fabianski.[/quote']

 

...

[Shance]

He was good today. He has a very good work rate and his cross was excellent. I did say in another thread that he's underrated as he's constantly getting slated. Needlessly as well. He's a young player maturing well into a top half Premier League side.

[eelpie]

"The impressive James Ward-Prowse found Long with a precise cross from the right wing, and the unmarked Republic of Ireland forward nodded in despite a sprawling attempted save from Fabianski." from todays online BBC report.

[Panda]

Lovely cross for the goal but otherwise he wasn't really in the game.

 

Funny that, BBC have him as man of the match so the other 21 (+ subs) must have been really poor I guess

[simo]

What's his stats atm?

[austsaint]

Not quite sure which game you were watching.

 

I watched every minute (on Sky), a lot of running around, shadowing Swansea players in defensive positions without tackling or intercepting and a lot of time spent in the AM role without a lot of contribution. He really does get around the ground well - and his free kicks and corners were good; the cross for Long's goal was perfect - but for the BBC correspondent to make him Mom in front of VVD is quite bizarre.

[adrian lord]

^ agree all those positives, and I noticed today and in a few recent games he's popped up with some crucial tackles at key moments. Along with Forster's return, his leap forward in performance this last 6-8 weeks has been a major factor in the Saints' ascendancy

[sammysaint]

8th and 7th place finishes in the last two years have caused us to have expectations to maintain this and may hinder why JWP has some doubters, JWP would walk into any team in the bottom 5/6 of the premier league and he is only 21, he has some great qualities like work rate,crossing,set pieces and very rarely gives the ball away, he lacks a killing pace down the middle and shooting however I am not bothered about him scoring goals we have plenty of players that can in Pelle Long Austin Jay Rod Mane and Tadic.

[david in sweden]

He has looked so much better the last month or two, a much more influential and accomplished player.

 

This is the level of contribution we anticipated he would reach when he first broke onto the scene. Long may it continue.

 

 

I thought the same. I think the change of formation (3-5-2) has benefited him ...and a number of others - without the need to buy in more talent.

[david in sweden]

8th and 7th place finishes in the last two years have caused us to have expectations to maintain this and may hinder why JWP has some doubters, JWP would walk into any team in the bottom 5/6 of the premier league and he is only 21, he has some great qualities like work rate,crossing,set pieces and very rarely gives the ball away, he lacks a killing pace down the middle and shooting however I am not bothered about him scoring goals we have plenty of players that can in Pelle Long Austin Jay Rod Mane and Tadic.

 

Agree with this.

I think the last month or so has really illustrated his ability from crosses / dead ball situations, but he's not a natural goalscorer (as those you mentioned above).

Of course he does lack that bit of extra pace, and many of the chances I've seen him miss have been a "snap shot " where the ball has come to him, and he hasn't had time to tee-up the ball, or even less run with it, and has shot narrowly wide many times. He rarely hits Row Z....which can't always be said of some strikers.

[beatlesaint]

A bit like Matt Oakley and Steve Williams you only notice their difference when they are not there

For his age I think he is improving a lot stronger now and I hope there is more to come

 

Not sure you can compare Steve Williams and Matt Oakley in the same sentence, as players Williams was head and shoulders better than Oakley.

[david in sweden]

OK it's Prowsie's thread really.....

 

.....but the mere mention of Steve Williams always comes to me when I see the developing Jake Hesketh in full flow....a sort of " skilful arrogance....".

 

Matt Oakley was a good player, and DAJFU..(and never should have been allowed to leave), but he was..... a "road sweeper " .......in Lawrie Mac's terminology....

 

Steve Williams had audacious courage, plus vision...and was supremely confident (for one so young). The ageing Alan Ball (R.I.P) once said .."Steve was my legs "

 

I saw his debut game (at Fratton Park in 1976) he was still only 17, but seemed totally without nerves, despite the hammering he got from some of the Pompey players.

Edited 16 February, 2016 by david in sweden

[tajjuk]

Considering Khazri's getting raved about for corners at Sunderland and after watching such a highly accomplished player like Ozil take some pretty poor ones against Leicester, JWP should be lauded for his crossing/dead ball technique alone. Set pieces are like something like 30% of all goals in the league IIRC, considering we have some pretty tall players who are good at headers he probably is worth putting in the team for that.

 

2 goals and 4 assists from 13 starts isn't too bad at all either.

[Chez]

whatever becomes of JWP it's always good to know that the skates won't benefit.

[Dellman]

Why does the OP believe JWP has weaknesses which are unimprovable? The lad is only 21. Surely there is plenty of time to improve and with good coaching he could improve a helluva lot. In fact most fans would say he has improved a lot this season. What sort of 'fan' is it thast wants to crush our own youngsters. Must have been born down the road.

[cobbysouth]

Nearly at 100 premier league caps, at 21 that's impressive.

[Jonnyboy]

8th and 7th place finishes in the last two years have caused us to have expectations to maintain this and may hinder why JWP has some doubters, JWP would walk into any team in the bottom 5/6 of the premier league and he is only 21, he has some great qualities like work rate,crossing,set pieces and very rarely gives the ball away, he lacks a killing pace down the middle and shooting however I am not bothered about him scoring goals we have plenty of players that can in Pelle Long Austin Jay Rod Mane and Tadic.

 

The problem is its all the midfielders who don't chip in with goals - Clasie, Romeu, Wanyama, Davis, Tadic, JWP etc gave about 5 between them.

[ScepticalStan]

Why does the OP believe JWP has weaknesses which are unimprovable? The lad is only 21. Surely there is plenty of time to improve...

 

Perhaps, but given that most of his weaknesses are physical, rather than technical (you're not going to see him become a faster sprinter, grow taller, or toughen up any more than Lallana has between the ages of 20-27) its hard to imagine much change in that department.

 

What sort of 'fan' is it thast wants to crush our own youngsters. Must have been born down the road.

 

One that wants to see the team wearing Southampton's badge do well, and if that means crushing the frankly ridiculous levels of chauvinism and double-standards when it comes to English vs foreign players then so be it.

 

I'll never forget the fans behind me calling for Dean Hammond or Richard Chaplow to start ahead of Morgan Schneiderlin away to West Ham in 2012 because the former 'can put a bloody tackle in'. Four years down the line Morgan Schneiderlin commands a transfer fee of £25Mn and Dean Hammond plays in League 1. That more-or-less tells the story.

 

Having said all that, JWP could potentially become a useful player for us, but he's going to have to be technically masterful enough to offset all of the physical weaknesses he has. Not impossible, but unlikely, and we should be realistic about him.

[The9]

Perhaps, but given that most of his weaknesses are physical, rather than technical (you're not going to see him become a faster sprinter, grow taller, or toughen up any more than Lallana has between the ages of 20-27) its hard to imagine much change in that department.

 

 

 

One that wants to see the team wearing Southampton's badge do well, and if that means crushing the frankly ridiculous levels of chauvinism and double-standards when it comes to English vs foreign players then so be it.

 

I'll never forget the fans behind me calling for Dean Hammond or Richard Chaplow to start ahead of Morgan Schneiderlin away to West Ham in 2012 because the former 'can put a bloody tackle in'. Four years down the line Morgan Schneiderlin commands a transfer fee of £25Mn and Dean Hammond plays in League 1. That more-or-less tells the story.

 

Having said all that, JWP could potentially become a useful player for us, but he's going to have to be technically masterful enough to offset all of the physical weaknesses he has. Not impossible, but unlikely, and we should be realistic about him.

 

I think you'll find that Dean Hammond is under contract to the Premier League leaders...

[austsaint]

Considering Khazri's getting raved about for corners at Sunderland and after watching such a highly accomplished player like Ozil take some pretty poor ones against Leicester, JWP should be lauded for his crossing/dead ball technique alone. Set pieces are like something like 30% of all goals in the league IIRC, considering we have some pretty tall players who are good at headers he probably is worth putting in the team for that.

 

2 goals and 4 assists from 13 starts isn't too bad at all either.

 

I think the point with players like Khazri, Ozil etc is that their crossing and dead ball techniques are just part of the tools they have in their kitbag. Not that JWP has to measure up to their standards but the question remains is a very good crossing and dead ball technique alone enough to justify a regular place in the team?

[Saint_Ashley]

'Unimprovable'. The lad is 21, how many footballers do you lot know were the complete package - footballing wise - at such a young age? He's only going to get better.

[nta786]

Perhaps, but given that most of his weaknesses are physical, rather than technical (you're not going to see him become a faster sprinter, grow taller, or toughen up any more than Lallana has between the ages of 20-27) its hard to imagine much change in that department.

 

 

 

One that wants to see the team wearing Southampton's badge do well, and if that means crushing the frankly ridiculous levels of chauvinism and double-standards when it comes to English vs foreign players then so be it.

 

I'll never forget the fans behind me calling for Dean Hammond or Richard Chaplow to start ahead of Morgan Schneiderlin away to West Ham in 2012 because the former 'can put a bloody tackle in'. Four years down the line Morgan Schneiderlin commands a transfer fee of £25Mn and Dean Hammond plays in League 1. That more-or-less tells the story.

 

Having said all that, JWP could potentially become a useful player for us, but he's going to have to be technically masterful enough to offset all of the physical weaknesses he has. Not impossible, but unlikely, and we should be realistic about him.

 

He could hit the gym, can't he?

[Lazlo78]

He could hit the gym, can't he?

 

Bale certainly went from scrawny to brawny, didn't he?

[Chez]

Bale certainly went from scrawny to brawny, didn't he?

 

Always had pace though.

[Andy Durman]

ScepticalStan is the epitome of what is wrong in the world today and in football.

 

Nothing and nobody seems to be given time.

 

Successful has to be immediate.

 

JWP will never be blessed with electric pace, but that's not his job. He isn't an out an out goal scorer, but will need to contribute in a season. He is getting stronger.

 

What JWP brings is awareness and game intelligence. Some players go invisible in a game. They are players who do there job. They are the players who do the bread and butter. Being in the right position, tracking back, shadowing, blocking, delaying, denying, pressing, the simple pass that keeps the ball moving.

 

JWP is not yet the finished articled, but when he is we will have another big player that all the big clubs will be desperate to pay loads of money for.

Edited 18 February, 2016 by Andy Durman

[austsaint]

ScepticalStan is the epitome of what is wrong in the world today and in football.

 

Nothing and nobody seems to be given time.

 

Successful has to be immediate.

 

JWP will never be blessed with electric pace, but that's not his job. He isn't an out an out goal scorer, but will need to contribute in a season. He is getting stronger.

 

What JWP brings is awareness and game intelligence. Some players go invisible in a game. They are players who do there job. They are the players who do the bread and butter. Being in the right position, tracking back, shadowing, blocking, delaying, denying, pressing, the simple pass that keeps the ball moving.

 

JWP is not yet the finished articled, but when he is we will have another big player that all the big clubs will be desperate to pay loads of money for.

 

I'm going to hold you to that last sentence Andy. Big call!

[hughieslastminutegoal]

OK it's Prowsie's thread really.....

 

.....but the mere mention of Steve Williams always comes to me when I see the developing Jake Hesketh in full flow....a sort of " skilful arrogance....".

 

Matt Oakley was a good player, and DAJFU..(and never should have been allowed to leave), but he was..... a "road sweeper " .......in Lawrie Mac's terminology....

 

Steve Williams had audacious courage, plus vision...and was supremely confident (for one so young). The ageing Alan Ball (R.I.P) once said .."Steve was my legs "

 

I saw his debut game (at Fratton Park in 1976) he was still only 17, but seemed totally without nerves, despite the hammering he got from some of the Pompey players.

 

You actually saw that game? I was there too, and it was like watching a match by candlelight. Pompey were so skint there was only about 2 bulbs in each corner floodlight.

[ScepticalStan]

ScepticalStan is the epitome of what is wrong in the world today and in football.

 

Nothing and nobody seems to be given time.

 

James Ward-Prowse. 119 appearances for Southampton.

 

Gaston Ramirez. 48 appearances for Southampton.

 

Regardless of whether Ramirez is, isn't, could have been or could-never-have-been good enough, the one thing absolutely no-one argued was that he hadn't been given time.

 

JWP is not yet the finished articled, but when he is we will have another big player that all the big clubs will be desperate to pay loads of money for.

 

[ScepticalStan]

Bale certainly went from scrawny to brawny, didn't he?

 

Always had pace though.

 

Funnily enough, I used to know a Portuguese chap who was a Sporting Lisbon STH and thought Ronaldo would never make it as he was so skinny and scrawny.

 

He thought the lad (as he was always relatively tall) 'looked out of proportion' and just figured his centre of gravity was always going to be too high for him to really have the necessary athleticism to make it at the top level regardless of his pace and fast feet. We had a good chuckle about it looking back but he insists that as a teenager he'd go flying into a sequence of step-overs and simply be bounced to the ground (and perfectly fairly I might add) by strong, stocky full-backs who'd simply nail him shoulder-to-shoulder.

 

So, who knows? Maybe I'll be proved wrong on JWP. Its all a game of opinions.

[eddie]

Funnily enough, I used to know a Portuguese chap who was a Sporting Lisbon STH and thought Ronaldo would never make it as he was so skinny and scrawny.

 

He thought the lad (as he was always relatively tall) 'looked out of proportion' and just figured his centre of gravity was always going to be too high for him to really have the necessary athleticism to make it at the top level regardless of his pace and fast feet. We had a good chuckle about it looking back but he insists that as a teenager he'd go flying into a sequence of step-overs and simply be bounced to the ground (and perfectly fairly I might add) by strong, stocky full-backs who'd simply nail him shoulder-to-shoulder.

 

So, who knows? Maybe I'll be proved wrong on JWP. Its all a game of opinions.

 

JWP. 2011-2019 saints, 2019-2021 man utd, 2021-2024 real madrid.

[Bobbyboy]

JWP. 2011-2019 saints, 2019-2021 man utd, 2021-2024 real madrid.

2024-2025 Burnley

2025-2026 Eastleigh

2027 - Sky Sports Soccer Special Analyst

[a1ex2001]

Funnily enough, I used to know a Portuguese chap who was a Sporting Lisbon STH and thought Ronaldo would never make it as he was so skinny and scrawny.

 

He thought the lad (as he was always relatively tall) 'looked out of proportion' and just figured his centre of gravity was always going to be too high for him to really have the necessary athleticism to make it at the top level regardless of his pace and fast feet. We had a good chuckle about it looking back but he insists that as a teenager he'd go flying into a sequence of step-overs and simply be bounced to the ground (and perfectly fairly I might add) by strong, stocky full-backs who'd simply nail him shoulder-to-shoulder.

 

So, who knows? Maybe I'll be proved wrong on JWP. Its all a game of opinions.

 

Plenty of observers in this country would have agreed when Rolando arrived at Man Utd hence the 'Show Pony' nickname! He has always pulling step overs and tricks and then getting dumped on his backside by the likes of Le Saux. Now I don't for a minute think that JWP will ever be in the Ronaldo/Messi/Bale bracket but he will at the very minimum be a solid premiership player for most of his career with every possibility that he will play for one of the big clubs and represent his country along the way. I can't stand this modern thing where unless a player is Messi/Maldini on debut they are garbage it is sadly pathetic like the fact we have to have a player to hate on every season even if it is just a journey man doing a job for us in a lower league!

[The9]

I'm on the fence with JWP, but I'd say Romeu and Clasie have both overtaken him in the pecking order this season despite his improvement in overall effectiveness and seeming to find a position that works for him.