Spin Master Reed

[Wade Garrett]

So if we lose every game 5-4 playing exciting football and then get relegated you two will have it down as a good season because it was exciting and you were entertained. I always have a nagging doubt that when people say exciting football they mean winning football.

 

Personally I'll admit I want to see saints win I couldn't give a flying **** how we do it or the style of football I just want us to win. I like to be able to look smug as I walk past the opposition fans after the game and a saints win sets me up for the week. If we lose even if we played like Pep's Barca I still feel ****.

 

Decent footballers don't concede 5 goals every game. If the team have the right tactics and the players give 100% we would be ok. At the moment we have neither. I hate losing as much as the next man, but as long as we're giving it our all I can accept it.

[broncoboy]

More because this is a "predictable" season than anything else. All the massive clubs are performing. They're 9 points clear for christ's sake. That didn't happen last season, it was all up in the air.

 

Reed says in his interview that the aim to to consistently be the "best of the rest" and to give Puel time as he's a manager for the future. Why are we so impatient?

 

The only trouble is the football is turgid and we see very few goals. Apart from that it's all going well

[doddisalegend]

Unfortunately we're not doing much of any of those three with any regularity right now.

 

Yes but no one ever complains about entertaining football when we are winning it only ever seems to become and issue when we lose. I was very entertained by Bournemouth away, Inter at home or Burnely at home. I found both Chelsea, Spurs and Westbrom at home very un-entertaining go figure

[hypochondriac]

So if we lose every game 5-4 playing exciting football and then get relegated you two will have it down as a good season because it was exciting and you were entertained. I always have a nagging doubt that when people say exciting football they mean winning football.

 

Personally I'll admit I want to see saints win I couldn't give a flying **** how we do it or the style of football I just want us to win. I like to be able to look smug as I walk past the opposition fans after the game and a saints win sets me up for the week. If we lose even if we played like Pep's Barca I still feel ****.

 

No that isn't what I said at all, that's a ludicrous point to make. I said it isn't SOLELY about league position, not that league position is not a factor. People are much much more likely to accept mid table or below if they see signs of improvement and exciting, attacking football where we make chances and score goals. Turgid, lifeless football where we have one (or less) shots on target and play to draw or hang on to a 1-0 is why people are discontented. For many, league position is less important than that.

[hypochondriac]

Yes but no one ever complains about entertaining football when we are winning it only ever seems to become and issue when we lose. I was very entertained by Bournemouth away, Inter at home or Burnely at home. I found both Chelsea, Spurs and Westbrom at home very un-entertaining go figure

 

No one is denying that there have not been some entertaining games this year, but on the whole they have been few and far between. We got a point against Liverpool for example and many people I spoke to after the match were not happy with our level of performance despite being happy with a point. The much vaunted "Southampton Way" has been evident over the past few years where we have played exciting football and taken the game to the opposition most weeks. It felt like we could beat any team in the league on our day (I believe we did just that last season) but this year for myself (and many others) we have lost that. What signs have we had that Puel looks like turning things around so radically? That is why people are losing or have lost patience with Puel and it is why most were prepared to give Koeman a lot more leeway to improve last season.

[doddisalegend]

Decent footballers don't concede 5 goals every game. If the team have the right tactics and the players give 100% we would be ok. At the moment we have neither. I hate losing as much as the next man, but as long as we're giving it our all I can accept it.

 

Ok I haven't seen players not giving their all this season. I have seen players who are decent (but not great) play well and play **** poorly but I can't say I ever thought any of them were giving less the 100% (even want away Fonte). What I have seen is we have a number of players (especially in midfield) who are limited in their abilities and some forwards who not very clinical never thought any of them are giving less than 100% but some times they cant perform beyond their obvious limits.

[doddisalegend]

No one is denying that there have not been some entertaining games this year, but on the whole they have been few and far between. We got a point against Liverpool for example and many people I spoke to after the match were not happy with our level of performance despite being happy with a point. The much vaunted "Southampton Way" has been evident over the past few years where we have played exciting football and taken the game to the opposition most weeks. It felt like we could beat any team in the league on our day (I believe we did just that last season) but this year for myself (and many others) we have lost that. What signs have we had that Puel looks like turning things around so radically? That is why people are losing or have lost patience with Puel and it is why most were prepared to give Koeman a lot more leeway to improve last season.

 

LOL this is a quote from you last December

 

I don't think it's much to do with koeman, it's a lot to do with the personnel we have left. Morgan is a huge loss that we haven't recovered from and we don't have enough pace to scare any teams. We've tried a few things now and most of the games recently have been depressingly similar and boring.

 

And wanyama likely off. I know he hasn't been great recently but I still think we will miss him when he goes. We are going to be left with a team full of cloggers and ineffective players.

 

http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?55635-Has-Koeman-lost-it&highlight=koeman+lost

 

I figure if you thought the team was poor last season you'd give Puel a bit more time seeing as he has team of cloggers and ineffective players...

[hypochondriac]

Ok I haven't seen players not giving their all this season. I have seen players who are decent (but not great) play well and play **** poorly but I can't say I ever thought any of them were giving less the 100% (even want away Fonte). What I have seen is we have a number of players (especially in midfield) who are limited in their abilities and some forwards who not very clinical never thought any of them are giving less than 100% but some times they cant perform beyond their obvious limits.

 

There was no need to change the system so radically at the start of the season. I disagree with the tactics of the manager which has seen us bomb out of Europe and has seen us play dull, uninspiring football that contrasts hugely with what we have become accustomed to over the past few seasons and really since Markus took us over. I think we obviously fecked up in the summer by not getting another attacking option but had Koeman stayed with this exact squad, there is no doubt in my mind that we would have created and scored more thus far (and I'm not even a huge fan of Ronald.)

[hypochondriac]

LOL this is a quote from you last December

 

I don't think it's much to do with koeman, it's a lot to do with the personnel we have left. Morgan is a huge loss that we haven't recovered from and we don't have enough pace to scare any teams. We've tried a few things now and most of the games recently have been depressingly similar and boring.

 

And wanyama likely off. I know he hasn't been great recently but I still think we will miss him when he goes. We are going to be left with a team full of cloggers and ineffective players.

 

http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?55635-Has-Koeman-lost-it&highlight=koeman+lost

 

I figure if you thought the team was poor last season you'd give Puel a bit more time seeing as he has team of cloggers and ineffective players...

 

Seems that my prediction has been largely correct. The recruitment team must take their share of the blame for the summer but they are not responsible for this new system that we introduced that has resulted in so many terribly boring games, so few chances created, so few shots on target and such a lack of entertainment. Despite having poorer personnel than the last few years, the players we have are capable of better. I not also that I pointed out that Koeman had tried a few things that weren't working. I see no sign that Puel is prepared to try any radical changes to find some form (like the 3-5-2.) Unless Claude has something similar up his sleeve (which has not looked likely at any point this season.) Then I will continue to feel he is not the right fit for the club.

Edited 6 January, 2017 by hypochondriac

[Wade Garrett]

Ok I haven't seen players not giving their all this season. I have seen players who are decent (but not great) play well and play **** poorly but I can't say I ever thought any of them were giving less the 100% (even want away Fonte). What I have seen is we have a number of players (especially in midfield) who are limited in their abilities and some forwards who not very clinical never thought any of them are giving less than 100% but some times they cant perform beyond their obvious limits.

 

Watch a bit closer. Plenty not giving it their all.

[OttawaSaint]

LOL this is a quote from you last December

 

I don't think it's much to do with koeman, it's a lot to do with the personnel we have left. Morgan is a huge loss that we haven't recovered from and we don't have enough pace to scare any teams. We've tried a few things now and most of the games recently have been depressingly similar and boring.

 

And wanyama likely off. I know he hasn't been great recently but I still think we will miss him when he goes. We are going to be left with a team full of cloggers and ineffective players.

 

http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?55635-Has-Koeman-lost-it&highlight=koeman+lost

 

I figure if you thought the team was poor last season you'd give Puel a bit more time seeing as he has team of cloggers and ineffective players...

 

BOOOOM!

 

Hypo pwned AGAIN!!

 

[Hamilton Saint]

Dont ake it personally. He needs someone to target and since I don't post so often nowdays he seems to have chosen you now. As I said before, he is like herpes and is impossible to shake off.

 

As for the OP. Poor old Batman is clearly missing Pelle so has now turned his guns onto Reed and Puel. He is another one who is only happy if he has someone to have a pop at.

 

I have been a Saints fan for 50 years and in all that time this is the most sustained period of relative success that I can remember. The last seven years have been fantastic in terms of growth and the people who run the club have done a great job. You only have to look at the likes of Leeds to see that we have been very fortunate. Even more so when you look at what SISU have done to Coventry City. And to think that there were many here desparate for SISU to take us over! At the start of the season many were saying they would be happy with mid table and a good cup run. Guess what, we are having a good cup run and are mid table. Yet still the knives come out. I recall many people calling for Koeman's head at the mid stage last season. Fortunately they didn't get their way. We are not Real Madrid, Barcelona, Chelsea or Man City. We are a medium sized club who have found a good operating model that looks to sustain rather than go for broke. Prudent and pragmatic doesn't seem to fit some posters agenda but it is better than what we have had and it has worked so far. If you want the club to throw money at success then you are supporting the wrong club and your blood pressure will be better served if you went elsewhere. Personally I prefer Reed's "spin" to much of the wrist slitting crap on here. There is clearly an element here who seem to get some kind of perverted pleasure out of finding things to moan about. Many short memories I suspect!

 

Amen!

[SOTONS EAST SIDE]

Aaah yes Les. He has become a better player! NOT! (Reeds words in the Echo )

 

He feels excited about the potential of not just our academy players, and look at what he’s done for Sam McQueen, Josh Sims, and Prowsey (James Ward-Prowse) has become a better player this season.

[Lord Duckhunter]

I'm not a glory-hunter, I can assure you of that. I am happy watching decent football with players giving it 100%. Where we finish is where we finish.

 

We we are getting neither at the moment. I haven't been this p*ssed off with a manager since Ian Branfoot.

 

Nice cop out. Can't state a league position that's too high as everybody will say it's impossible even with Pep as manager, but you can't state a mid table position just in case Puel achieves it.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dronskisaint]

Not sure where you sit, but if you fancied standing in the Northam then you would get a very different impression. Some of the cavemen who froth at the mouth, turning purple and screaming expletives from the start of the match would open your eyes. Thankfully I sit in the Itchen North for most games so I avoid it.

 

Block 39...right alongside the Northam - mostly because I can stand and sing and am very much part of the atmosphere. There are the moaners, of course, but can you imagine how anyone who spouted as much anti-Saints cr*p as they type on here would be treated?!

[dronskisaint]

Perhaps you and your friends could hold up banners saying REED OUT

 

Why?

[sadoldgit]

There was no need to change the system so radically at the start of the season. I disagree with the tactics of the manager which has seen us bomb out of Europe and has seen us play dull, uninspiring football that contrasts hugely with what we have become accustomed to over the past few seasons and really since Markus took us over. I think we obviously fecked up in the summer by not getting another attacking option but had Koeman stayed with this exact squad, there is no doubt in my mind that we would have created and scored more thus far (and I'm not even a huge fan of Ronald.)

 

"Bomb out of Europe?" Wasn't that the season before? This season I remember us being a whisker away from a last second goal that would have seen us through to the knock out stages in the last match. If we had bombed out surely we would have been out well before?

[hypochondriac]

BOOOOM!

 

Hypo pwned AGAIN!!

 

[emoji38]

Err how? What I predicted has happened. Our squad is weaker than last year, coupled with a manager who has thus far displayed poor tactics overall and who has dished up a turgid style of football. It has little relevance to last season.

Edited 6 January, 2017 by hypochondriac

[sadoldgit]

How many games do you go to each season? I am asking because I contend if you spent time, effort and finance actually physically following the team then you would be less blasé about what is going on. It's easy to call those you don't agree with "bed wetters" from the warmth and comfort of an arm chair.

 

Duncan, you don't have to go to every match to see that the people currently running the club have done an excellent job over several years. You go to many more matches than I do. You will know that every season we have played brilliantly at time and poorly at times. This has happened under every manager and not just Puel. Under Reed's time here we have been a much better and well run club than for many years before. Again, it is not difficult to see and understand that from the warmth of my arm chair. The simple fact is that we are still a mid table team in the midst of a good cup run, something many were happy with before the season started. If this is meltdown material then I would be happy with it season after season. From your posts here I would say that you and many others seem to judge the state of the club on the last few games (we haven't been crap all season). Perhaps it is just that others see a bigger picture and understand that we do not have the means to operate and play like a top four club every week. In my 50 years we have only finished in the top 4 once. To be honest it was easier for clubs like us to finish well back then. Money didn't play such a big part in those days as I am sure you will recall. Kat Liebherr and Les Reed have come in for some ridiculous stick over the last few years yet we are clearly doing so much better as a club (big picture - not individual matches) and are working hard at sustaining our position. Even from the warmth and comfort of my arm chair I can see what they are working to achieve and appreciate it. Given a choice I would prefer that Les Reed and his team continue to do what they are doing and support them than back up those who seem to think that we in some kind of meltdown position. It would appear that many who go to as many matches as you do have a similar viewpoint so let's not diss an opinion based on an arm chair eh?

[Saint-Fred]

"Bomb out of Europe?" Wasn't that the season before? This season I remember us being a whisker away from a last second goal that would have seen us through to the knock out stages in the last match. If we had bombed out surely we would have been out well before?

 

You make it sound quite exciting and like we were a kick away from progressing. I suppose technically you might be right but we didn't look like scoring and you could easily say that was the same situation the year before.

Actually in a very poor group -where both teams that went through have absolutely no chance of getting anywhere in the competition - we only won twice, without winning a game away.

If we take each team as a two leg knock out match we lost on away goals to both beer Sheeva and Milan. (Which is what they do in the event of a tie on points and why, despite a superior goal difference, we went out) The only team we would have beaten was Sparta due to a good first game. So not much different to the year before where we beat one team over two legs then lost to a pretty poor side in the next one.

 

I would say that qualifies as bombing out as it was a pretty poor campaign really. Going to Milan and playing them at home was great but with the exception of Sparta at home it was all very disappointing performance wise.

[Pamplemousse]

You make it sound quite exciting and like we were a kick away from progressing. I suppose technically you might be right but we didn't look like scoring and you could easily say that was the same situation the year before.

Actually in a very poor group -where both teams that went through have absolutely no chance of getting anywhere in the competition - we only won twice, without winning a game away.

If we take each team as a two leg knock out match we lost on away goals to both beer Sheeva and Milan. (Which is what they do in the event of a tie on points and why, despite a superior goal difference, we went out) The only team we would have beaten was Sparta due to a good first game. So not much different to the year before where we beat one team over two legs then lost to a pretty poor side in the next one.

 

I would say that qualifies as bombing out as it was a pretty poor campaign really. Going to Milan and playing them at home was great but with the exception of Sparta at home it was all very disappointing performance wise.

 

Behave. We did not "bomb out" at all.

 

We were one goal away from going through. Fine margins and probably overall we didn't play well enough to qualify, but "bomb out"? Nope.

[nta786]

No that isn't what I said at all, that's a ludicrous point to make. I said it isn't SOLELY about league position, not that league position is not a factor. People are much much more likely to accept mid table or below if they see signs of improvement and exciting, attacking football where we make chances and score goals. Turgid, lifeless football where we have one (or less) shots on target and play to draw or hang on to a 1-0 is why people are discontented. For many, league position is less important than that.

 

I've always been in the 'I couldn't care less how we play, even if our tactic was parking the bus, with a long ball and we win 1-0', I would take those every day of the week.

 

If we win then I have been entertained. If we win and completely dominate then that is a major bonus, one I would like, but any win always does for me.

Plus I don't think there is anything worse than losing against the run of play.

For me, the win is the entertainment, not the way it is won.

Results first, style of play second.

Edited 6 January, 2017 by nta786

[Hamilton Saint]

Duncan, you don't have to go to every match to see that the people currently running the club have done an excellent job over several years. You go to many more matches than I do. You will know that every season we have played brilliantly at time and poorly at times. This has happened under every manager and not just Puel. Under Reed's time here we have been a much better and well run club than for many years before. Again, it is not difficult to see and understand that from the warmth of my arm chair. The simple fact is that we are still a mid table team in the midst of a good cup run, something many were happy with before the season started. If this is meltdown material then I would be happy with it season after season. From your posts here I would say that you and many others seem to judge the state of the club on the last few games (we haven't been crap all season). Perhaps it is just that others see a bigger picture and understand that we do not have the means to operate and play like a top four club every week. In my 50 years we have only finished in the top 4 once. To be honest it was easier for clubs like us to finish well back then. Money didn't play such a big part in those days as I am sure you will recall. Kat Liebherr and Les Reed have come in for some ridiculous stick over the last few years yet we are clearly doing so much better as a club (big picture - not individual matches) and are working hard at sustaining our position. Even from the warmth and comfort of my arm chair I can see what they are working to achieve and appreciate it. Given a choice I would prefer that Les Reed and his team continue to do what they are doing and support them than back up those who seem to think that we in some kind of meltdown position. It would appear that many who go to as many matches as you do have a similar viewpoint so let's not diss an opinion based on an arm chair eh?

 

Amen, again! It's all about the big picture.

[hypochondriac]

You make it sound quite exciting and like we were a kick away from progressing. I suppose technically you might be right but we didn't look like scoring and you could easily say that was the same situation the year before.

Actually in a very poor group -where both teams that went through have absolutely no chance of getting anywhere in the competition - we only won twice, without winning a game away.

If we take each team as a two leg knock out match we lost on away goals to both beer Sheeva and Milan. (Which is what they do in the event of a tie on points and why, despite a superior goal difference, we went out) The only team we would have beaten was Sparta due to a good first game. So not much different to the year before where we beat one team over two legs then lost to a pretty poor side in the next one.

 

I would say that qualifies as bombing out as it was a pretty poor campaign really. Going to Milan and playing them at home was great but with the exception of Sparta at home it was all very disappointing performance wise.

Yep agree with that totally. Quibbling over the use of the word bomb is just semantics.

[hypochondriac]

I've always been in the 'I couldn't care less how we play, even if our tactic was parking the bus, with a long ball and we win 1-0', I would take those every day of the week.

 

If we win then I have been entertained. If we win and completely dominate then that is a major bonus, one I would like, but any win always does for me.

Plus I don't think there is anything worse than losing against the run of play.

For me, the win is the entertainment, not the way it is won.

Results first, style of play second.

Fine but please realise that for many this is not the case. Even if I were to accept that a win = entertainment then we aren't doing much of that recently either so puel's management would be questioned on that criteria alone.

[alpine_saint]

Fine with Fonte line.

 

The rest was b*llocks.

 

Just needed him to mention catering and a radio station.

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Duncan, you don't have to go to every match to see that the people currently running the club have done an excellent job over several years. You go to many more matches than I do. You will know that every season we have played brilliantly at time and poorly at times. This has happened under every manager and not just Puel. Under Reed's time here we have been a much better and well run club than for many years before. Again, it is not difficult to see and understand that from the warmth of my arm chair. The simple fact is that we are still a mid table team in the midst of a good cup run, something many were happy with before the season started. If this is meltdown material then I would be happy with it season after season. From your posts here I would say that you and many others seem to judge the state of the club on the last few games (we haven't been crap all season). Perhaps it is just that others see a bigger picture and understand that we do not have the means to operate and play like a top four club every week. In my 50 years we have only finished in the top 4 once. To be honest it was easier for clubs like us to finish well back then. Money didn't play such a big part in those days as I am sure you will recall. Kat Liebherr and Les Reed have come in for some ridiculous stick over the last few years yet we are clearly doing so much better as a club (big picture - not individual matches) and are working hard at sustaining our position. Even from the warmth and comfort of my arm chair I can see what they are working to achieve and appreciate it. Given a choice I would prefer that Les Reed and his team continue to do what they are doing and support them than back up those who seem to think that we in some kind of meltdown position. It would appear that many who go to as many matches as you do have a similar viewpoint so let's not diss an opinion based on an arm chair eh?

 

 

No you are quite entitled to an opinion as much as anyone but what I was trying to say was those that take a more "active" role in supporting them are bound to be a bit more emotionally involved and you should at least refrain from calling them wrist slitters or whatever. You are a senior fan roughly my age, you post sane thoughts but I get a little irked when you resort to belittling fans as bed wetters or whatever without considering their "support" might be a little more taxing than yours. You know what I am saying.

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Behave. We did not "bomb out" at all.

 

We were one goal away from going through. Fine margins and probably overall we didn't play well enough to qualify, but "bomb out"? Nope.

 

 

Sorry disagree - over a six match mini league it should not have come down to fine margins especially with a manager so "experienced" in Europe.

[doddisalegend]

Err how? What I predicted has happened. Our squad is weaker than last year, coupled with a manager who has thus far displayed poor tactics overall and who has dished up a turgid style of football. It has little relevance to last season.

 

That's the point. The current manager has got us further in the league cup this season than last, had to cope with proper Europa league group stages (unlike Koeman), and got us to roughly the same position and points in the league that we had this time last season, as well as blooding several youth players and all with a squad you think is weaker than last season and the season before that.

 

The turgid football only seems to exist when we lose and you say we played exciting attacking football before Puel yet are quoted saying it was boring last season when Koeman was struggling.

 

Seems to me you are expecting a lot from a new manger with, in your opinion, a worse squad than previous managers while remembering a glorious time when we played exciting attacking football which in reality was a six game run at the end of last season.

 

The truth is, which no doubt you will deny, is that you and a section of saints supporters didn't want Puel and are desperate for him to fail. For me there is room for improvement from Puel and in the squads player quality but writing him off after half a season when he has done no worse than last seasons manager is ridiculous and typical of modern day knee jerk football fans.

[nta786]

Fine but please realise that for many this is not the case. Even if I were to accept that a win = entertainment then we aren't doing much of that recently either so puel's management would be questioned on that criteria alone.

 

Yeah of course I value that many want attacking football (because usually that does result in a win anyway and my analogt of parking the bus with 1-0 wins can never be sustained over a season anywyays!!)

Think most of us are questioning Puel too- results have beeen very inconsistent unfortunately

[CB Fry]

That's the point. The current manager has got us further in the league cup this season than last, had to cope with proper Europa league group stages (unlike Koeman), and got us to roughly the same position and points in the league that we had this time last season, as well as blooding several youth players and all with a squad you think is weaker than last season and the season before that.

 

The turgid football only seems to exist when we lose and you say we played exciting attacking football before Puel yet are quoted saying it was boring last season when Koeman was struggling.

 

Seems to me you are expecting a lot from a new manger with, in your opinion, a worse squad than previous managers while remembering a glorious time when we played exciting attacking football which in reality was a six game run at the end of last season.

 

The truth is, which no doubt you will deny, is that you and a section of saints supporters didn't want Puel and are desperate for him to fail. For me there is room for improvement from Puel and in the squads player quality but writing him off after half a season when he has done no worse than last seasons manager is ridiculous and typical of modern day knee jerk football fans.

Thanks for writing that. Good stuff.

 

This season reminds me most of the Hoddle season, which was for a while was quite the high water mark for my time supporting Saints. But in reality not really that great.

 

Lots of low scoring games, lots of drab possession football, when we won it was only ever 1-0. And, crucially, we were pretty dismal until the second half of the season, Feb/March time.

 

I think he's done enough to get this window and his own shot at a strong run in the spring. This team, with maybe one addition and a Fonte replacement, has a 8th place finish in them.

 

And Redmond in the England squad come June.

[hypochondriac]

That's the point. The current manager has got us further in the league cup this season than last, had to cope with proper Europa league group stages (unlike Koeman), and got us to roughly the same position and points in the league that we had this time last season, as well as blooding several youth players and all with a squad you think is weaker than last season and the season before that.

 

The turgid football only seems to exist when we lose and you say we played exciting attacking football before Puel yet are quoted saying it was boring last season when Koeman was struggling.

 

Seems to me you are expecting a lot from a new manger with, in your opinion, a worse squad than previous managers while remembering a glorious time when we played exciting attacking football which in reality was a six game run at the end of last season.

 

The truth is, which no doubt you will deny, is that you and a section of saints supporters didn't want Puel and are desperate for him to fail. For me there is room for improvement from Puel and in the squads player quality but writing him off after half a season when he has done no worse than last seasons manager is ridiculous and typical of modern day knee jerk football fans.

 

Nonsense. I haven't been thrilled with our style of play for the majority of the season, principally the lack of chances and the lack of goals we score (which are shown in the stats.) so it's simply untrue to say the turgid football only exists when we lose. Parts of last season were dull but it was also markedly better in style than this on the whole, particularly when koeman tried a number of different things and hit upon a good tactical way to play things. Perhaps I would be more willing to cut puel some slack if he even recognised that we had an issue, let alone trying anything new.

 

It's complete rubbish to say that I didn't want puel and am desperate for him to be fail and to be honest does your side of this discussion no favours. I was fairly pleased when he came in from reports about him but unfortunately we got off to a poor start and the standard of football has largely been similar for much of the season. I simply have a difference of opinion from you and I have arrived at that opinion by going to the majority of games and being rather bored on an increasing number of occasions. It would be great if you could accept a difference of opinion without pretending that I or others like me do not want puel to do well. I'm not making up silly things about you just because I disagree with you.

Edited 6 January, 2017 by hypochondriac

[Harry_SFC]

Well after listening to that interview from Reed I can't say I'm overly optimistic about the remainder of the season..

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Thanks for writing that. Good stuff.

 

This season reminds me most of the Hoddle season, which was for a while was quite the high water mark for my time supporting Saints. But in reality not really that great.

 

Lots of low scoring games, lots of drab possession football, when we won it was only ever 1-0. And, crucially, we were pretty dismal until the second half of the season, Feb/March time.

 

I think he's done enough to get this window and his own shot at a strong run in the spring. This team, with maybe one addition and a Fonte replacement, has a 8th place finish in them.

 

And Redmond in the England squad come June.

 

You are not wrong but expectations have risen since Hoddle's time. I remember those 1-0s and at the time thinking well at least we won't be relegated. Now thanks partly to the PR from the Club we have illusions of grandeur. Are we wrong to have them? I assume me from your posts you think we are?

[saintroyt]

That's the point. The current manager has got us further in the league cup this season than last, had to cope with proper Europa league group stages (unlike Koeman), and got us to roughly the same position and points in the league that we had this time last season, as well as blooding several youth players and all with a squad you think is weaker than last season and the season before that.

 

The turgid football only seems to exist when we lose and you say we played exciting attacking football before Puel yet are quoted saying it was boring last season when Koeman was struggling.

 

Seems to me you are expecting a lot from a new manger with, in your opinion, a worse squad than previous managers while remembering a glorious time when we played exciting attacking football which in reality was a six game run at the end of last season.

 

The truth is, which no doubt you will deny, is that you and a section of saints supporters didn't want Puel and are desperate for him to fail. For me there is room for improvement from Puel and in the squads player quality but writing him off after half a season when he has done no worse than last seasons manager is ridiculous and typical of modern day knee jerk footbat all fans.

At least under past managers they knew the players had to shoot on target on the rare occasion we get a chance now days Hardly rocket science Great coach

[Roger]

For what it's worth, I think he is having his best season with us and has made big improvements to his game

 

No chsnce he's been rubbish as usual.

[austsaint]

Watch a bit closer. Plenty not giving it their all.

 

Trouble is the "all" of players like Martina, Long, Rodriguez, JWP, Redmond isn't very good and lacks quality.

[jasoneuelllfanclub]

More guff from Les

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/15005597.Reed_asks_for_fan_s_trust_in_Southampton_way/?ref=rss

 

Essentially he placing blame on players rather than the rigid and negative tactics for lack of goal mouth action.

 

Basically confirms the tactic is to get early goal then sit back and counter. This was evident against spurs and that worked out really well lol

 

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk

[Fan The Flames]

More guff from Les

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/15005597.Reed_asks_for_fan_s_trust_in_Southampton_way/?ref=rss

 

Essentially he placing blame on players rather than the rigid and negative tactics for lack of goal mouth action.

 

Basically confirms the tactic is to get early goal then sit back and counter. This was evident against spurs and that worked out really well lol

 

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk

 

But it's not guff is it, if we had put a few of the chances away that we have had then things would be different. Where does it say that we want the score early and sit back?

[John B]

You are not wrong but expectations have risen since Hoddle's time. I remember those 1-0s and at the time thinking well at least we won't be relegated. Now thanks partly to the PR from the Club we have illusions of grandeur. Are we wrong to have them? I assume me from your posts you think we are?

 

Obviously as you realise having an ambition to succeed at the football club does not mean that the ambition will result in unqualified success especially as our ambition is similar to other clubs in the PL no doubt who are putting together better teams.

 

Success happens on the field and today we dont have any excellent and outstanding attacking and midfield players that we have had in the past they are all of a muchness.

 

The team would obviously much better if it had a Paine MLT Channon Chivers Lambert Mane Stevie Williams Lallana Ball Wallace etc playing but it does not as these type of players are recruited by the top 6.

 

We have been lucky we have seen great players in the Saints teams of the past but I feel the club is doing pretty well has a good plan and is well respected in the outside football world but not every season is going to be a complete success but there is a chance that some of the current young players can develop into top class players that we have seen in the past.

 

Ten years ago when we were in the Championship things were absolutely awful and I never thought we would be where we are now

[Heisenberg]

More guff from Les

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/15005597.Reed_asks_for_fan_s_trust_in_Southampton_way/?ref=rss

 

Essentially he placing blame on players rather than the rigid and negative tactics for lack of goal mouth action.

 

Basically confirms the tactic is to get early goal then sit back and counter. This was evident against spurs and that worked out really well lol

 

 

He basically can't sack Puel or he will need to sack himself.... Puel is simply the front man for Reeds "showcase" club and is playing out Reeds system and style AND Reeds rotation policy

 

He can't critise Puel for ANYTHING as its ALL Reeds idea.

 

Puel was essentially hired as he was the most submissive candidate - Reed is calling all the shots he says that himself..... " I’m basically responsible for everything to do with football at the club from the top to the bottom."

 

Thats why he always plays down the "manager" talk. They are just coaches.... Just here to coach

 

Puel is just the puppet and is simply here to coach players - the style, the rotation policies, the transfers, the "vision", thats all Reed.

[danjosaint]

And Reed has such a good track record as manager

[CB Fry]

More guff from Les

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/15005597.Reed_asks_for_fan_s_trust_in_Southampton_way/?ref=rss

 

Essentially he placing blame on players rather than the rigid and negative tactics for lack of goal mouth action.

 

Basically confirms the tactic is to get early goal then sit back and counter. This was evident against spurs and that worked out really well lol

 

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk

I've read it and it doesn't basically say that at all. Try reading it again.

[wild-saint]

He basically can't sack Puel or he will need to sack himself.... Puel is simply the front man for Reeds "showcase" club and is playing out Reeds system and style AND Reeds rotation policy

 

He can't critise Puel for ANYTHING as its ALL Reeds idea.

 

Puel was essentially hired as he was the most submissive candidate - Reed is calling all the shots he says that himself..... " I’m basically responsible for everything to do with football at the club from the top to the bottom."

 

Thats why he always plays down the "manager" talk. They are just coaches.... Just here to coach

 

Puel is just the puppet and is simply here to coach players - the style, the rotation policies, the transfers, the "vision", thats all Reed.

 

Wow just Wow

[CB Fry]

He did, however, say this, directly quoted:

 

"It’s really important that we think long term so that we are still competing at sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth in the league for the long term and we are not going up and down like some of the other clubs around us."

 

There you go ladies, suck it up, drink it in.

 

No more grizzling about howwible old lying Les promising us the Champions League.

 

Read it.

Digest it.

Read it again.

 

What a beautiful day.

[doddisalegend]

He did, however, say this, directly quoted:

 

"It’s really important that we think long term so that we are still competing at sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth in the league for the long term and we are not going up and down like some of the other clubs around us."

 

There you go ladies, suck it up, drink it in.

 

No more grizzling about howwible old lying Les promising us the Champions League.

 

Read it.

Digest it.

Read it again.

 

What a beautiful day.

 

Ah so the club has no ambition and Dell sized mentality....

[doddisalegend]

Nonsense. I haven't been thrilled with our style of play for the majority of the season, principally the lack of chances and the lack of goals we score (which are shown in the stats.) so it's simply untrue to say the turgid football only exists when we lose. Parts of last season were dull but it was also markedly better in style than this on the whole, particularly when koeman tried a number of different things and hit upon a good tactical way to play things. Perhaps I would be more willing to cut puel some slack if he even recognised that we had an issue, let alone trying anything new.

 

It's complete rubbish to say that I didn't want puel and am desperate for him to be fail and to be honest does your side of this discussion no favours. I was fairly pleased when he came in from reports about him but unfortunately we got off to a poor start and the standard of football has largely been similar for much of the season. I simply have a difference of opinion from you and I have arrived at that opinion by going to the majority of games and being rather bored on an increasing number of occasions. It would be great if you could accept a difference of opinion without pretending that I or others like me do not want puel to do well. I'm not making up silly things about you just because I disagree with you.

 

Yeah you still haven't explained to me how you expect the current manager to deliver exciting attacking football with a squad you said wasn't good enough last season and would be a team of cloggers this season if we lost Mane and Victor.......

[Nordic Saint]

In my opinion (and it is just my opinion), Les Reed comes out with too much PR spin. He has a team working for him, making PR videos and feeding the media. This is all well and good when it is positive but I don't like the negative spin about every player and manager just before he is sold. It really isn't necessary, it creates a bad atmosphere and ultimately is going to get our club a bad reputation with people in the football world, even if it does seem to have convinced some of our more naive fans that Les Reed can do no wrong and that just about every player and manager the club has ever had, apart from Reed himself, is selfish, greedy and throws tantrums if he doesn't get his way and that Kat and Les don't really want to sell anyone as they are selfless individuals to whom money means nothing.

[doddisalegend]

In my opinion (and it is just my opinion), Les Reed comes out with too much PR spin. He has a team working for him, making PR videos and feeding the media. This is all well and good when it is positive but I don't like the negative spin about every player and manager just before he is sold. It really isn't necessary, it creates a bad atmosphere and ultimately is going to get our club a bad reputation with people in the football world, even if it does seem to have convinced some of our more naive fans that Les Reed can do no wrong and that just about every player and manager the club has ever had, apart from Reed himself, is selfish, greedy and throws tantrums if he doesn't get his way and that Kat and Les don't really want to sell anyone as they are selfless individuals to whom money means nothing.

 

So are you saying you don't think the likes of Victor, Lallana, Morgan and Lovern agitated for a move?

[CB Fry]

In my opinion (and it is just my opinion), Les Reed comes out with too much PR spin. He has a team working for him, making PR videos and feeding the media. This is all well and good when it is positive but I don't like the negative spin about every player and manager just before he is sold. It really isn't necessary, it creates a bad atmosphere and ultimately is going to get our club a bad reputation with people in the football world, even if it does seem to have convinced some of our more naive fans that Les Reed can do no wrong and that just about every player and manager the club has ever had, apart from Reed himself, is selfish, greedy and throws tantrums if he doesn't get his way and that Kat and Les don't really want to sell anyone as they are selfless individuals to whom money means nothing.

Or, you're a paranoid delusional conspiracy theorist who babbles on about how other football clubs conspire together to pretend they want to sign particular players to trick Les into signing them for Saints.

 

My recommendation to you is to avoid talking about PR spin until you have actually mastered the reality of actual real life rather than the chaos of fantasy you've constructed in your own head.