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16 minutes ago, East Kent Saint said:

Today Fergie time  with knobs on ! Totally undeserved asusual !

Fine by me, we’re going to need a couple of teams like Brighton to get spanked every week. Sadly it does mean we’ve lost our record of scoring the earliest and latest goals in Premier League history.

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55 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Fine by me, we’re going to need a couple of teams like Brighton to get spanked every week. Sadly it does mean we’ve lost our record of scoring the earliest and latest goals in Premier League history.

Did we have the latest? Who/when was that? 

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Just watching MOTD - handball decision given against Palace on VAR an absolute joke and totally agree with Hodgson’s reaction. It’s becoming just random luck whether as a defender you get penalised for the ball just hitting your hand accidentally, apparently due to adjustment of handball rule again this season. Needs to be clarified once and for all - is accidental handball no longer a thing to be taken in consideration?

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11 hours ago, Saint Pete said:

Needs to be clarified once and for all - is accidental handball no longer a thing to be taken in consideration?

No, it isn’t. Accidental is no longer in the rules. 
 

It has been clarified, but the TV pundits, players and managers seem unable to grasp it. Did the ball hit the hand/arm  was the hand/arm in an unnatural position? If the answer to both was yes, it’s a pen. Whether it deflected off another player (as in ours against spurs), whether it came off your knee, or whether it was deliberate, is irrelevant. I’m not saying it’s a good definition, but it’s clear and simple, certainly simpler than trying to work out if a player meant to handle it. 

Edited by Lord Duckhunter
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4 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

No, it isn’t. Accidental is no longer in the rules. 
 

It has been clarified, but the TV pundits, players and managers seem unable to grasp it. Did the ball hit the hand/arm  was the hand/arm in an unnatural position? If the answer to both was yes, it’s a pen. Whether it deflected off another player (as in ours against spurs), whether it came off your knee, or whether it was deliberate, is irrelevant. I’m not saying it’s a good definition, but it’s clear and simple, certainly simpler than trying to work out if a player meant to handle it. 

It's simpler for VAR, which in my opinion should not be what should is driving the rules of football. Surely VAR should be being used to help implement the rules as they always have been, not being used as a driver to change the rules just to suit VAR? It's a case of tail wagging dog.

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2 minutes ago, Saint Pete said:

It's simpler for VAR, which in my opinion should not be what should is driving the rules of football. Surely VAR should be being used to help implement the rules as they always have been, not being used as a driver to change the rules just to suit VAR? It's a case of tail wagging dog.

It’s exactly what it is. They’re taking subjectivity out of the game and refereeing by facts. However, it’s the Jose’s of the world plus pundits & press that have taken us down this path. If people just accepted that referees referee as they see it then,  and that the only real consistency you can have is between decisions on that day, it’s not going away.  They’ve made handball decisions consistent....

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It doesn’t help when pundits don’t know the rules. Richards saying it’s not a pen because he’s close to the header. Souness hit the nail on the head. Under the rules it’s a penalty. What’s  the ref supposed to do, uphold the laws of the game or make his own up? 

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4 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

It doesn’t help when pundits don’t know the rules. Richards saying it’s not a pen because he’s close to the header. Souness hit the nail on the head. Under the rules it’s a penalty. What’s  the ref supposed to do, uphold the laws of the game or make his own up? 

Like this one - VAR officials or the Ref would still be the same outcome :

image.png.7dd225b353c13daa9d1faa3fd955ba94.png

Edited by skintsaint
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3 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

It doesn’t help when pundits don’t know the rules. Richards saying it’s not a pen because he’s close to the header. Souness hit the nail on the head. Under the rules it’s a penalty. What’s  the ref supposed to do, uphold the laws of the game or make his own up? 

Yes agree it's not fair to blame the officials who are implementing the rule as it's been written. But questions need to be answered about how these rules are being agreed. Seems there is not enough consultation going on as most in the game seem to agree they've got it badly wrong with this one. 

I agree with your other point that media and managers should be more accepting that some decisions like handball need subjective interpretation from refs rather than expecting 100% consistency. They can't have it both ways.

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47 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

The ref did make the decision, what’s the chump on about? Did he miss the bit where the ref ran over and checked the screen 

One of the worst pundits about, I thought he was just a Sky favourite, didn’t realise he was on the bloody radio as well where his inability to string a whole sentence together must be even more exposed.

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46 minutes ago, beatlesaint said:

One of the worst pundits about, I thought he was just a Sky favourite, didn’t realise he was on the bloody radio as well where his inability to string a whole sentence together must be even more exposed.

They’ve moved Sunday supplement to podcast only, but I thought I’d have a listen. Looks like he’s  now a regular on there now, he’s been on every week. Fucking awful. It used to be journos talking about football, now it’s journos plus that incoherent plank.  
 

 

Edited by Lord Duckhunter
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1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

It’s exactly what it is. They’re taking subjectivity out of the game and refereeing by facts. However, it’s the Jose’s of the world plus pundits & press that have taken us down this path. If people just accepted that referees referee as they see it then,  and that the only real consistency you can have is between decisions on that day, it’s not going away.  They’ve made handball decisions consistent....

No they havent it's a total lottery , as pointed out in slow motion it looks bad but real time impossible to avoid arm contact. As for giving pen after "final" whistle FFS . Plus rediculous no flagging rule until it's all over WTF . In most cases no appeal has been made by the players about a handball . Getting to the point where fans will give up watching

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1 minute ago, East Kent Saint said:

In most cases no appeal has been made by the players about a handball .

Players are cottoning onto it now though and appealing everything. Carroll was even appealing the first one against Dier ffs.

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5 minutes ago, East Kent Saint said:

Had to laugh at City , pity Vardy got 3 ......

BTW Bruce thought handball nonsense a joke even though it gave them a draw . ( laugh at Mourinio saying spurs should be shown some respect over same incident )

Could've been worse,  could've got 4, city 5 - 2 down now..... another pen....

Edited by Micky
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8 minutes ago, East Kent Saint said:

No they havent it's a total lottery , as pointed out in slow motion it looks bad but real time impossible to avoid arm contact. 

It’s not a lottery. A lottery implies that sometime they’re given & sometimes they’re not, that’ll be a pen every single time this season, unless the referee makes an error. Not an error of judgement, but the error of not following the rules. The way the rule is written, it doesn’t make a blind bit of difference whether it was impossible to avoid. 

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Didn't watch that game, 3 penalties to one team doesn't happen very often. Were they all nailed on? 

Agree about Mendy as well. Was great in that Monaco team, since then and the injury he's looked a bit of a liability. 

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Just now, The Cat said:

Didn't watch that game, 3 penalties to one team doesn't happen very often. Were they all nailed on? 

Agree about Mendy as well. Was great in that Monaco team, since then and the injury he's looked a bit of a liability. 

They were all the result of dreadful defending, tbh. Clumsy tackles, Mendy giving away the last one. He was turned on the edge of the box, lost his player, and just tripped him from behind.

Dumb. Not sure about that Eric Garcia either, he is equally as slow and clumsy.

Edited by S-Clarke
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Results are all over the place, this no pre-season thing has effed clubs up, don't think you can read much into form of any teams over these first 5 or so games.

Even Bayern Munich lost 4-1 today, to an average team, Dortmund 2-0 as well, Man City losing 5-2 and Man Utd deserved to get spanked yesterday but lost.

And yeh this handball rule is stupid. Do it like Roy said, if its deliberate its a foul, if its not its not. Much simpler. 

City also showing how important Laporte is to them. All 3 were pens, first maybe a little soft and the 2nd unlucky but all were clumsy. 

Edited by tajjuk
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