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Saints Expelled from Playoffs

St Chalet

By St Chalet
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AlexLaw76

AlexLaw76

Posted
Posted
Just now, LeBizzier69 said:

Fair enough. Personally i think we've got a very well intentioned owner who's backed us financially to the hilt but who's surrounded himself with the wrong people who've frittered away his ££ on dross...largely.

 

Backed us financially..dont we have significant loans hanging over us?

Barry the Badger

Barry the Badger

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, skintsaint said:

After sleeping on it, Saints royally fecked up by not taking this seriously I feel. Tonda smirking away when being asked about it, just saying he will talk about what happened once its over. Alongside what happened supposedly in the boardroom at the Riverside. Think we were a bit blaise about the whole thing from the start admitting everything, until we were booted from the final and then it was too late. Massive cockup.

Absolutely. Got people saying "the fans deserved it" too because people were doing the binoculars etc, but I think that all came from the club seeming as though they weren't worried and it all seemed a bit of a storm in a teacup which the club would prove to be wrong.

  • Like 1
trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Pamplemousse said:

In the scheme of things, 4 points isn't that much really. We dropped the same amount against the skates, beat them home and away next season and we get that back.

As I've said before, it's much less than the 'points penalty' we inflicted upon ourselves this season (or should that be "last season" now...?!)

  • Like 1
MB

MB

Posted
Posted

Tonda meeting the players at 11am.

Imaging he will be saying his farewells with announcement later.

What a fucking mess.

CSA96

CSA96

Posted
Posted
Just now, Miltonaggro said:

Should have been 8am.

I am assuming both the players and Eckert are likely to have had other meetings going on earlier in the morning...

sadoldgit

sadoldgit

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, manji said:

I have no agenda with this but getting rid of Tonda , Sports Republic etc at this time would be insane. Can no one remember the trouble we had before ? Years of chaos ,wasted opportunity we were blessed by Markus Leiber. 
im aware of previous transfer windows but the last one turned out alright. Promotion season was a fuck up at the start we should have pissed automatics. The same as this season chaos at the beginning again we could have pissed the automatics. 
This is my club frankly I don’t give a fuck about the morality. Draw a line under this and reboot as quickly as possible.

Whatever happens going forward, the club as a whole needs to take a breath and not make any knee jerk reactions/decisions. 
The important thing is not to let what is effectively an earthquake crush the life out of the club.

  • Like 3
trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Mr Brightside said:

Full Wembley ticket refunds to be issued within 10-14 days. 

Who gets to pocket the interest payments on the c.£2.5m revenue from our ticket sales...?

  • Like 4
Dell McDellFace

Dell McDellFace

Posted
Posted

If Tonda was genuinely unaware of the rule, then I have some sympathy for him and I hope he isn't too severely punished. There are so many rules and regulations around transfers, player registration etc that there must be someone within the club who has COMPLIANCE in their job description. Ultimately it's that person who should take the wrap / fall on their sword / whatever. Possibly the club secretary if that role still exists.

CylonKing

CylonKing

Posted
Posted
Just now, Dell McDellFace said:

If Tonda was genuinely unaware of the rule, then I have some sympathy for him 

If not aware of the rule, why send someone in disguise?

  • Like 6
TheSoundman

TheSoundman

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, trousers said:

Whilst acknowledging there are "careful what you wish for" / "frying pan into the fire" arguments against this, my gut feeling is that a total reset (i.e. "Sport Republic Out!") is probably the best way forward in the long run, on balance.

At least if we do a total reset we should get 'Chelsea' protection.

Ah, yes we did spy on another 10 teams and put piss in their halftime tea, but it was under the last ownerships watch so you have to let us off with a slap on the wrist.

TheSoundman

TheSoundman

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Miltonaggro said:

Should have been 8am.

They're footballers, they only get in at 10.30am and need to be fed breakfast and check their mobiles first 😉

  • Haha 3
Lighthouse

Lighthouse

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

But that's not really true is it. Leicester did.

They got a points deduction and are now in League 1, as did Sheff Weds.

 

42 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

And yet we saw the FA Cup played out between to two clubs who are being investigated for cheating, one of which gets to keep its winnings.

Your statement would be fine if it applied to every episode of cheating, yet we see, week in, week out, that cheats in football prosper.

You don't think that's maybe quite an important difference?

Sergei Gotsmanov

Sergei Gotsmanov

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, LegalEagle said:

Are we suing the EFL?

I think those shadowy figures should be made accountable for why the semi final legs were played when an offence had already been made. This caused a considerable amount of upheaval to the supporters. The same people that keep their league going.

  • Like 3
TheSoundman

TheSoundman

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Dell McDellFace said:

If Tonda was genuinely unaware of the rule, then I have some sympathy for him and I hope he isn't too severely punished. There are so many rules and regulations around transfers, player registration etc that there must be someone within the club who has COMPLIANCE in their job description. Ultimately it's that person who should take the wrap / fall on their sword / whatever. Possibly the club secretary if that role still exists.

If TE was genuinely unaware of the rule, then a doubt WS would have hid behind a tree and then runaway when challenged.

lumuah

lumuah

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Dell McDellFace said:

If Tonda was genuinely unaware of the rule, then I have some sympathy for him and I hope he isn't too severely punished. There are so many rules and regulations around transfers, player registration etc that there must be someone within the club who has COMPLIANCE in their job description. Ultimately it's that person who should take the wrap / fall on their sword / whatever. Possibly the club secretary if that role still exists.

I'm sure I read on here that we have not had a compliance officer since last year. No idea why the last one left - maybe they didn't think hiding behind trees was particularly compliant!

  • Like 1
trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, CylonKing said:

If not aware of the rule, why send someone in disguise?

Because he didn't want the opposition to know we were there?

Not being aware of the '72 hour' rule and not wanting the opposition to know you're observation them aren't mutually exclusive positions...

Edited by trousers
  • Like 5
bangkoksaint

bangkoksaint

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, trousers said:

Who gets to pocket the interest payments on the c.£2.5m revenue from our ticket sales...?

Probably around £4K......so probably covers the KC's travelling and refreshment expenses!

sadoldgit

sadoldgit

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, TheSoundman said:

If TE was genuinely unaware of the rule, then a doubt WS would have hid behind a tree and then runaway when challenged.

I expect that it was more that he thought that the rule was no big deal as it doesn’t apply elsewhere and “everyone” is supposed to be at it.

  • Like 1
Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

But that's not really true is it. Leicester did.

As have Middlesbrough.  This Taylor fellow is the key to this affair.  Joins us from Middlesbrough and leaves two months later. Then produces the evidence that scuppers our case. Doesn't attention the hearing in person, only submits 'written evidence'.

Stinks like a Teesside kipper.

  • Like 8
Hopper

Hopper

Posted
Posted (edited)

Tonda spent 2 years at Barnsley, I don't buy that he 'wasn't aware of the rule'.

Regardless, the players aren't going to wan to play for him are they.

Edited by Hopper
  • Like 1
lumuah

lumuah

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, lumuah said:

I'm sure I read on here that we have not had a compliance officer since last year. No idea why the last one left - maybe they didn't think hiding behind trees was particularly compliant!

Search for Jobs - Logo

No current job vacancies for a compliance officer though... maybe we thought we didn't need one!

Sheaf Saint

Sheaf Saint

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, TheSoundman said:

If TE was genuinely unaware of the rule, then a doubt WS would have hid behind a tree and then runaway when challenged.

The very fact he had a change of clothes ready strongly suggests that he knew damn well he wasn't supposed to be there.

  • Like 1
TheSoundman

TheSoundman

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

As have Middlesbrough.  This Taylor fellow is the key to this affair.  Joins us from Middlesbrough and leaves two months later. Then produces the evidence that scuppers our case. Doesn't attention the hearing in person, only submits 'written evidence'.

Stinks like a Teesside kipper.

Being contrarian (not like me at all normally), maybe he left Middlesbrough to move to a larger more progressive club and further his career, but then couldn't believe what he was being asked to do and so left swiftly.

Maybe he actually has integrity?........

 

 

Naaaaaa.

  • Haha 2
offsidetrap

offsidetrap

Posted
Posted
59 minutes ago, SaintsLoyal said:

Did anyone see meridian news ? there was talk from a fan taking legal advice on season ticket recompensation.

I’d write a letter to “how” and see what Fred says. 

Saint Fan CaM

Saint Fan CaM

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, sadoldgit said:

He has proved himself to be an excellent coach, that much is certain. He broke a stupid rule, so what? It doesn’t mean he isn’t any good. Despite everything, it is what happens on the pitch that is important and he proved himself up to it no matter what.

i don’t know if it has been mentioned, but Thierry Henry has written a brilliant piece about this on X.

I have to be honest, this is a difficult one. Spying on another team’s training is wrong. Full stop. It crosses a line, it undermines the trust that should exist between clubs, and I understand why Middlesbrough are furious and why the EFL felt they had to act strongly. Integrity matters in this game.

At the same time, I find myself questioning whether expulsion from the play-offs is the right punishment. It feels… heavy. Almost like using a sledgehammer when a precise scalpel was needed.

Let’s be clear: this wasn’t match-fixing or doping. It was analysts pushing boundaries for tactical information, something that, sadly, has happened in different forms across the game for years. 

Marcelo Bielsa did it openly at Derby and Leeds, admitted it, and people called him a genius, not a criminal. Drones, analysts in trees, whatever, in the modern game with data and marginal gains everywhere, clubs push boundaries. 

Southampton admitted it, yes, and they deserve punishment. A heavy fine, points deduction, maybe even a ban for the staff involved. But kicking the entire club out after they earned their place on the pitch? That punishes players, coaches, and fans who had nothing to do with one or two analysts doing something stupid. 

What troubles me most is the collateral damage. The players who battled through a tough Championship season after relegation, who went to extra time and scored that late goal to beat Middlesbrough on the pitch, they earned their place in the final through merit. 

Now that achievement is being erased because of actions taken by a small number of staff members. That feels disproportionate to me. A significant fine, a points deduction for next season, and sanctions against the individuals responsible, those would be strong, meaningful punishments that address the breach without nullifying an entire season’s competitive work.

Sport has to balance two things: protecting fairness and recognising that human error and ambition sometimes lead people astray. If every rules breach in high-stakes moments leads to rewriting results, we risk turning the disciplinary process into something more powerful than the football itself. I’ve sat in dressing rooms where we prepared meticulously for opponents. Everyone does. The difference is getting caught.

I hope Southampton appeal and that the final decision finds a better equilibrium. Middlesbrough deserve respect, they were wronged but the players of Southampton also deserve not to have their legitimate efforts wiped away. Football is emotional, passionate, and imperfect. 

The response to this should reflect wisdom as much as outrage. We need clearer rules going forward so incidents like this become rare, but we must be careful not to let one mistake destroy what was built legitimately on the grass.

This is an excellent reflection of the realities of the situation - very well said SOG. 

The more I reflect on what’s happened the more I thoroughly believe the club needs to act quickly and decisively to dress the wound. To not do so risks the entire club structure collapsing in on itself in a spiral of self-harm. That will likely mean the sacking of one or more scapegoats, but that should be it…the club (Dragan) protects and nurtures all other assets including playing staff (who should get their % salary cut re-instated). Despite Boro’s antics. Despite the EFL, its sham board and the obvious cheating that exists at all levels of the game. 

All this talk about sacking everyone is like throwing the baby out with the bath water. Circle the wagons…take a deep breath and let’s fucking show ‘em we’re worthy of promotion the hard way. The alternative is further capitulation to an unjust punishment and the potential demise of our wonderful club.

  • Like 5
vectraman

vectraman

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, trousers said:

Because he didn't want the opposition to know we were there?

Not being aware of the rule and not wanting the opposition to know you're observation them aren't mutually exclusive positions...

I cannot for a moment believe that nobody on the playing/coaching staff would have not known that you can’t spy on the opposition team 72 hours before you play them.
If anybody genuinely thinks the manager ‘didn’t know’ and that nobody at the club had said “we shouldn’t be doing this” to him then that is naivety of the highest order.

Tonda must have known, coaching staff must have known, they chose to keep doing it because they didn’t think they would get caught.

Quite honestly it was so amateurish and obvious that it beggars belief we hadn’t been caught before. Surely they could have given the lad camera glasses which would not be obvious at all.  The whole sorry episode sums up the pathetic mess we now find ourselves in.

Embarrassing, amateur, tin pot, naive, pathetic, disappointing, unprofessional.

Take your pick I’d say all the above cover it.

  • Like 4
RedArmy

RedArmy

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, Mr Brightside said:

Full Wembley ticket refunds to be issued within 10-14 days. 

What a load of shite from the club. 
 

I had to cancel and rebook some tickets on Tuesday and I got the money back today for the cancellation. 
 

So they can do it quickly, they’re choosing not to. 

  • Like 1
Eire Saint

Eire Saint

Posted
Posted

Boro stitched us up properly here. The whistleblower told them we'd be sending someone, it's obvious by how orchestrated this was. They had their info that we'd been doing this for a while. The angle of the photo they got of Salt was from a different direction than their training facility, so a photographer in situ. Got their photo before anyone approached him. 

The staff would've got a heads up, so zero chance any information or advantage would've been got. They then had the victim card ready to play. Media outrage, manager tears. A second chance card if they didn't beat us. They set a trap and their plan worked perfectly. 

In saying that what we have been doing was wrong and we've been so unbelievably stupid and naive. Punishment was disproportinate, but we did this to ourselves. 

If expulsion was to be our punishment, then either Boro should've faced Milwall for a shot at wembley, or Hull given promotion. Boro getting rewarded here is ridiculous. 

The thing that is so gutting is that it feels like such a sliding doors moment, a win on Saturday, we keep most of the players who got us there and despite this I still think Tonda is a manager who could've kept us in the prem. It's just a sickening feeling. We're staring into abyss again as a club. 

  • Like 12
skintsaint

skintsaint

Posted
Posted
Just now, RedArmy said:

So they can do it quickly, they’re choosing not to. 

Bit different refunding a few dozen tickets to 37000 odd in one go.

  • Like 2
sadoldgit

sadoldgit

Posted
Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, Hopper said:

Tonda spent 2 years at Barnsley, I don't buy that he 'wasn't aware of the rule'.

Regardless, the players aren't going to wan to play for him are they.

It depends on how much they are invested in him as a boss. Sometimes things like this make people bond tighter. Mind you, it could be moot if the FA go after him as strongly as the EFL have gone after us or Tonda falls on his sword or is sacked.

Edited by sadoldgit
Added text
  • Like 2
Winnersaint

Winnersaint

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, saintant said:

There's some sanctimonious twats all across the media mouthing off about how we're a bunch of cheats. Come on. It's pretty much accepted that every club does this. We just happened to do it at Boro and they decided to make a song and dance about it in the lead up to the play-off semi-final because they saw it as a way to make mischief. Nearly every ex pro has come out and said the gains from doing this are absolutely miniscule. FFS we spied and lost to Oxford, we didn't spy and we beat Arsenal and Fulham.

The press and pundits have acted like a lynch mob in all this which drove the EFL and original hearing panel to a position where they felt they had to impose the maximum punishment. Never mind what the big clubs have got away with and continue to do so. No, let's hammer little old Southampton because that's what everyone wants, we can give the world their pound of flesh, make ourselves look the good guys and they won't fight back.

The whole thing is a joke and I do get that we have brought this on ourselves through stupidity but our football club has been given one of the biggest sanctions in world football for doing something which brought us extremely minimal gains. Sledgehammer to crack a nut x 1 million.

Big enough club for people to take notice, small enough for most to not give a shit.

  • Like 3
AlexLaw76

AlexLaw76

Posted
Posted

Borson and Jordan...

Basically, Boro did everything they could for the cub/company as Southampton own stupidity left the door wide open

Both agree that the sporting advantage must have been pretty small, regardless of people stamping their feet, and that how strange that opinion changed from Bielsa being sort of accepted when he did it to every club (and a much bigger sporting advantage) to crucifying SFC and Eckert. 

Ultimately, our own stupidity gave an 'in' for this to happen and there we are.

  • Like 3
Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, trousers said:

Screenshot_20260521-112141.X.png

This player is the ONE player Saints should make sure is here next season for a new challenge - his dressing room influence and organisation of a defence were huge for us, not to mention ability to stop goals.

Okay 2 players, Larin. I think Real Mallorca are probably in more financial peril than most other clubs, so get it done Saints, make it up to us ... 

 

  • Like 6

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