January Transfer Window

[Gloucester Saint]

3 hours ago, East Kent Saint said:

OXO to Celtic then , have Saints missed another old boy or is the Scot Prem a bit second rate as they say in Naval terms ( ex princes excluded )

Had horrendous injuries and not what we need.

[Baird of the land]

22 minutes ago, Saint Pete said:

I can see what you are saying about being longshots for the play-offs and how that may have played into SR's thinking in selling Armstrong and placing more reliance/risk on Stewart keeping fit, you may well be right. But for me this attitude typefies the malaise that we are in as a club and the half-arsed approach SR take to decision making. It's how we have ended up with a 32 year old manager with little or no experience. "He'll do because he is in the club already, cheap and the players seem to like him. He might be a star in the making so why get an established manager with a track record?"

And now with our strikers: "Well, we're probably not gonna go up anyway so let's bank some cash for our top scorer and rely on a guy who hasn't scored all season and another who has been injured for most of the last 3 seasons". It essentially translates to "We're giving up" doesn't it? And if the proper permanent replacement for Armstrong is not coming until summer, surely we could have kept Armstrong on until then? If he could have continued scoring at same kind of rate and ended season with say 18-20 goals, I don't personally think it would have impacted his price tag much as more clubs are likely to be in the market is summer window than January. 

I don't really see it as half arsed. It's pretty cold and calculated. We're well off the playoffs, even if we go on a run and sneak into the playoffs that's no guarantee of winning them. Armstrong was likely a very high earner, who had dropped to the bench. There's no guarantee another club would come in and spend 7m in the summer or be able to take on his wages. That wage budget and funds can immediately be targeted elsewhere in the summer.

[Chez]

36 minutes ago, Saint Pete said:

I can see what you are saying about being longshots for the play-offs and how that may have played into SR's thinking in selling Armstrong and placing more reliance/risk on Stewart keeping fit, you may well be right. But for me this attitude typefies the malaise that we are in as a club and the half-arsed approach SR take to decision making. It's how we have ended up with a 32 year old manager with little or no experience. "He'll do because he is in the club already, cheap and the players seem to like him. He might be a star in the making so why get an established manager with a track record?"

And now with our strikers: "Well, we're probably not gonna go up anyway so let's bank some cash for our top scorer and rely on a guy who hasn't scored all season and another who has been injured for most of the last 3 seasons". It essentially translates to "We're giving up" doesn't it? And if the proper permanent replacement for Armstrong is not coming until summer, surely we could have kept Armstrong on until then? If he could have continued scoring at same kind of rate and ended season with say 18-20 goals, I don't personally think it would have impacted his price tag much as more clubs are likely to be in the market is summer window than January. 

Fair points. SR did seem to take the cheap option with Tonda, but equally they did rate him/trust him enough to bring him here in the first place. Personally I like a big name because it helps create the excitement and momentum that you need to get promoted. It's not the only route though.

Perhaps relying on an injury prone striker having sold your leading scorer does say "we are giving up", but I am not sure they have. They have allowed a guy to leave who wanted out and brought in a guy as backup for Stewart that fits the number 9 profile we really need. They could have sold AA and stuck with Stewart, Archer and the youngster who's name I find impossible to remember. The same goes for bringing in Peretz. Why do that if you had given up?

I also wondered how much his value would go down in the summer from the pretty average £7m+£2m. Perhaps if Wrexham and Boro offers were peanuts, then maybe the Wolves offer looked attractive as the club knows (after three windows where he was available) there are not many that can spend nearly £10m in the championship.

It's worth pointing out that Armstrong's current rate of scoring would mean 6 more goals. So, 17 in total. I keep reading he is a 20 goals a season man, but that's not where he was headed this year. 

[East Kent Saint]

31 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Had horrendous injuries and not what we need.

Quite , but may do ok in Scotland 😄

[Chez]

21 minutes ago, Baird of the land said:

I don't really see it as half arsed. It's pretty cold and calculated. We're well off the playoffs, even if we go on a run and sneak into the playoffs that's no guarantee of winning them. Armstrong was likely a very high earner, who had dropped to the bench. There's no guarantee another club would come in and spend 7m in the summer or be able to take on his wages. That wage budget and funds can immediately be targeted elsewhere in the summer.

Armstrong was available to buy last January. We only managed to loan him out. I would imagine Armstrong was available all summer. No one met our valuation. And obviously Armstrong was available again in this window. After three windows, I think the club may have had a good idea of the demand for him and the fee they could get.

[Give it to Ron]

58 minutes ago, Chez said:

Armstrong was available to buy last January. We only managed to loan him out. I would imagine Armstrong was available all summer. No one met our valuation. And obviously Armstrong was available again in this window. After three windows, I think the club may have had a good idea of the demand for him and the fee they could get.

Exactly and his loan at WBA went so well too. He has been out of sorts since that Norwich penalty miss and no goals since December 9th or so . 
Saturday will be telling if our new number 9 can do a job to replace him.

[Saint Pete]

4 hours ago, Chez said:

Armstrong was available to buy last January. We only managed to loan him out. I would imagine Armstrong was available all summer. No one met our valuation. And obviously Armstrong was available again in this window. After three windows, I think the club may have had a good idea of the demand for him and the fee they could get.

He was loaned out last January as it was clear he couldn't do a job in the Prem for us (no argument from me on that). But once we were back in the Championship, I don't see why we would have been trying to sell him then as it's pretty clear he is quite well suited to this level, isn't it? He's far from a perfect striker which is why he hasn't succeeded yet in the Prem. But he has a very decent record at this level no matter how people try to dress it up. So, no idea if your assumption that he was for sale all summer is correct but if it was its yet more evidence that those in charge of the club don't know what they are doing. Maybe Damion Downs was meant to be the SR replacement for Armstrong, but they didn't manage to achieve a sale in the summer! 🤣 Wouldn't surprise me at this point.

[Turkish]

7 hours ago, Saint Pete said:

He was loaned out last January as it was clear he couldn't do a job in the Prem for us (no argument from me on that). But once we were back in the Championship, I don't see why we would have been trying to sell him then as it's pretty clear he is quite well suited to this level, isn't it? He's far from a perfect striker which is why he hasn't succeeded yet in the Prem. But he has a very decent record at this level no matter how people try to dress it up. So, no idea if your assumption that he was for sale all summer is correct but if it was its yet more evidence that those in charge of the club don't know what they are doing. Maybe Damion Downs was meant to be the SR replacement for Armstrong, but they didn't manage to achieve a sale in the summer! 🤣 Wouldn't surprise me at this point.

We’d be trying to sell him as this club is obsessed with resale value. At 29 next week and 18 months left on his contract this window was the last chance we were going to get to get a bigger fee. Although there are other issues about playing style the simple fact is it was about how much he could be sold for, which it all it ever is about with this club.