The Spygate Saga

[Lord Duckhunter]

You’d hope they’ve had a steer from the FA, or have sound legal advice that he’s not getting a ban. 
 

The alternative is, it’s ST renewal time and they now seem to have pretty much everyone back onboard the bus. “ We wanted to keep him, but it was out of our hands, thanks for renewing”. 

[beatlesaint]

1 hour ago, coalman said:

Or they could decide to make an example of him since he's not at one of the bigger clubs and it's currently fashionable to put the boot into Southampton.

We also thought the EFL panel were going to be less brutal but they took every opportunity to look at every part of the case in the worst possible light.

They could but as Solak has pointed out the double jeopardy law will be a big defence from the clubs lawyers should they need to appeal.

The whole club has been fucked over by the actions taken already ffs.

[trousers]

F*** me... The tinpot local 'journos' up there have still got us on their radar... They're beginning to make Portsmouth News employees look half intelligent...

[Patrick Bateman]

22 minutes ago, trousers said:

F*** me... The tinpot local 'journos' up there have still got us on their radar... They're beginning to make Portsmouth News employees look half intelligent...

Dear god, it's more than a little sad, they need to let it go! What a drip. 

[hypochondriac]

5 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

You’d hope they’ve had a steer from the FA, or have sound legal advice that he’s not getting a ban. 
 

The alternative is, it’s ST renewal time and they now seem to have pretty much everyone back onboard the bus. “ We wanted to keep him, but it was out of our hands, thanks for renewing”. 

You'd imagine with the team they now have that any legal advice they are getting will be sound. Plus if we have any sense we will have spoken to the FA and made it very clear about our intentions to be as difficult as possible if Tonda is subject to any sort of significant ban. Maybe I'm wrong but I hope not!

[saintant]

5 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

You'd imagine with the team they now have that any legal advice they are getting will be sound. Plus if we have any sense we will have spoken to the FA and made it very clear about our intentions to be as difficult as possible if Tonda is subject to any sort of significant ban. Maybe I'm wrong but I hope not!

Would such veiled threats work for or against us in the eyes of the FA?

[hypochondriac]

2 minutes ago, saintant said:

Would such veiled threats work for or against us in the eyes of the FA?

I hardly think they would be harsher if they were aware of our intention to make us much of a problem for them as possible. Given we've already had a significant punishment they may be minded to leave it there. Maybe the appointment of Man City's firm will provide enough of a deterrent.

[saintant]

5 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I hardly think they would be harsher if they were aware of our intention to make us much of a problem for them as possible. Given we've already had a significant punishment they may be minded to leave it there. Maybe the appointment of Man City's firm will provide enough of a deterrent.

Whatever the outcome I wish they'd just get on with it so we at least know where we stand.

[Badger]

Couple of random thoughts today speaking about it:

Would a ban on Tonda by the FA be recognised and transferred to UEFA ? Think its unlikely to be upheld there if 'spying' isn't an offence in Serie A or Bundesliga. (the effect of an FA ban could be Tonda getting a better paid job elsewhere - not a great punishment then on the individual)

Is spying against any specific rule under the FA? Seems unlikely if it isn't with EPL, so would the FA be restricted to how the actions stack up against their own code of conduct ? 

What might the outcome have been if before an FA Cup tie ? Which of course it wasn't.

[hypochondriac]

2 minutes ago, saintant said:

Whatever the outcome I wish they'd just get on with it so we at least know where we stand.

Hopefully they are behind the scenes.

[hypochondriac]

2 minutes ago, Badger said:

Couple of random thoughts today speaking about it:

Would a ban on Tonda by the FA be recognised and transferred to UEFA ? Think its unlikely to be upheld there if 'spying' isn't an offence in Serie A or Bundesliga. (the effect of an FA ban could be Tonda getting a better paid job elsewhere - not a great punishment then on the individual)

Is spying against any specific rule under the FA? Seems unlikely if it isn't with EPL, so would the FA be restricted to how the actions stack up against their own code of conduct ? 

What might the outcome have been if before an FA Cup tie ? Which of course it wasn't.

Wouldn't he be disciplined for breaking rules — and maybe the 'bullying' rather than for spying itself? 

[Window Cleaner]

33 minutes ago, Badger said:

Couple of random thoughts today speaking about it:

Would a ban on Tonda by the FA be recognised and transferred to UEFA ? Think its unlikely to be upheld there if 'spying' isn't an offence in Serie A or Bundesliga. (the effect of an FA ban could be Tonda getting a better paid job elsewhere - not a great punishment then on the individual)

Is spying against any specific rule under the FA? Seems unlikely if it isn't with EPL, so would the FA be restricted to how the actions stack up against their own code of conduct ? 

What might the outcome have been if before an FA Cup tie ? Which of course it wasn't.

The FA could ask UEFA and FIFA to recognise the ban and impose it in their juridictions.

Doubt if the enquiry would be for spying, that's established anyway. Un professional conduct and their usual favourite, Bringing the game into disrepute.

[badgerx16]

6 minutes ago, Window Cleaner said:

The FA could ask UEFA and FIFA to recognise the ban and impose it in their juridictions.

Doubt if the enquiry would be for spying, that's established anyway. Un professional conduct and their usual favourite, Bringing the game into disrepute.

The idea that FIFA might support charges of "bringing the game into disrepute" after awarding a "Peace Prize" to Trump is lsughable.

[Badger]

4 minutes ago, Window Cleaner said:

The FA could ask UEFA and FIFA to recognise the ban and impose it in their juridictions.

Doubt if the enquiry would be for spying, that's established anyway. Un professional conduct and their usual favourite, Bringing the game into disrepute.

Interesting thought, thanks.

 

To me it seems questionable how a ban for something which isn't considered a breach of rules elsewhere could be expected to uphold a ban for spying, and questionable if FIFA, UEFA would be interested in lesser charges of ungentlemanly or unprofessional  conduct, or disrepute. But they're also dubious outfits riddled with self-serving hypocrisy so who knows?

Hoping for the best, but am expecting the FA to try and make a high profile example here. 

[Roo1976]

2 hours ago, trousers said:

F*** me... The tinpot local 'journos' up there have still got us on their radar... They're beginning to make Portsmouth News employees look half intelligent...

This weeks Southampton developments.............are they now spying on us?............uuummmm

[Badger]

3 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

The idea that FIFA might support charges of "bringing the game into disrepute" after awarding a "Peace Prize" to Trump is lsughable.

The last two World Cups are testimony also.

There will be plenty more examples over the next month.

Edited Sunday at 17:54 by Badger

[Badger]

2 hours ago, trousers said:

F*** me... The tinpot local 'journos' up there have still got us on their radar... They're beginning to make Portsmouth News employees look half intelligent...

Has anyone listened to this ?

Not sure how audio will work, you often need sub-titles for them surely.

[Roo1976]

50 minutes ago, Badger said:

Couple of random thoughts today speaking about it:

Would a ban on Tonda by the FA be recognised and transferred to UEFA ? Think its unlikely to be upheld there if 'spying' isn't an offence in Serie A or Bundesliga. (the effect of an FA ban could be Tonda getting a better paid job elsewhere - not a great punishment then on the individual)

Is spying against any specific rule under the FA? Seems unlikely if it isn't with EPL, so would the FA be restricted to how the actions stack up against their own code of conduct ? 

What might the outcome have been if before an FA Cup tie ? Which of course it wasn't.

I think i heard a very well versed sports solicitor saying that the play offs were a one off cup competition and therefore according to FA cup rules we got expelled for this ..........i could be wrong or miss heard it wrong, but i think they binned us off on that technicality.  Time to move on get it sorted and bloody stop dragging it out,after all were not City......

[Window Cleaner]

19 minutes ago, Roo1976 said:

I think i heard a very well versed sports solicitor saying that the play offs were a one off cup competition and therefore according to FA cup rules we got expelled for this ..........i could be wrong or miss heard it wrong, but i think they binned us off on that technicality.  Time to move on get it sorted and bloody stop dragging it out,after all were not City......

Right, we are not City and this case is far less complicated..Their case is about finance and it's sources which are as opaque as it gets.

Misconduct, they give out bans for that every week in every level of football.

If Eckert only gets that it would be a couple of matches at worst and a fine more likely than not.

[Lord Duckhunter]

I would have thought we’ve got a legitimate argument to say you either punish the club or the individual, not both. If a club plays an ineligible player, they get chucked out the cup competition, the manager who picked him, or the bod who didn’t register him don’t get a ban. Equally, if a player commits a doping offence, he gets banned, but the club don’t receive a sporting sanction as well. You never know with the FA, but I suspect we wouldn’t have gone balls out on backing Tonda if we thought there was a chance he’ll receive a lengthy ban. 

Edited Sunday at 19:05 by Lord Duckhunter

[saintant]

7 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I would have thought we’ve got a legitimate argument to say you either punish the club or the individual, not both. If a club plays an ineligible player, they get chucked out the cup competition, the manager who picked him, or the bod who didn’t register him don’t get a ban. Equally, if a player commits a doping offence, he gets banned, but the club don’t receive a sporting sanction as well. You never know with the FA, but I suspect we wouldn’t have gone balls out on backing Tonda if we thought there was a chance he’ll receive a lengthy ban. 

As others have said the FA could be investigating the allegations of bullying rather than the spying. It's certainly a possibility but who knows.

[Window Cleaner]

8 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I would have thought we’ve got a legitimate argument to say you either punish the club or the individual, not both. If a club plays an ineligible player, they get chucked out the cup competition, the manager who picked him, or the bod who didn’t register him don’t get a ban. Equally, if a player commits a doping offence, he gets banned, but the club don’t receive a sporting sanction as well. You never know with the FA, but I suspect we wouldn’t have gone balls out on backing Tonda if we thought there was a chance he’ll receive a lengthy ban. 

Not at all the same thing. This is misconduct at best, Eckert will get some sort of FA sanction.

[Football Special]

31 minutes ago, Window Cleaner said:

Not at all the same thing. This is misconduct at best, Eckert will get some sort of FA sanction.

You are guessing 

[Window Cleaner]

Just now, Football Special said:

You are guessing 

Predicting 

[trousers]

I've been searching for the FA's statement (not the EFL's) following their investigation into Bielsa and Leeds in 2019, and this is all I can find (as reported by the Guardian at the time)...

Bit of a wishy-washy second paragraph when they refer to any future occurrences of this nature...

 

Edited Sunday at 20:07 by trousers

[trousers]

AI's view of why Eckert might be treated differently to Bielsa by the FA... 

 

 

[Barry the Badger]

AI doesn't have a 'view". It literally just searches and then summarises what it finds on the internet. 

[trousers]

27 minutes ago, Barry the Badger said:

AI doesn't have a 'view". It literally just searches and then summarises what it finds on the internet. 

Yeah, poor choice of word on part... I have been gardening all day, so delirium starting to kick in (more so than usual, and it's a pretty high bar...) 

Edited Sunday at 21:40 by trousers