The World Cup Thread

[Turkish]

2 minutes ago, The Cat said:

The expert on talking shit!

If the ref hadn’t given a penalty he’d have found a way to say it wasn’t a foul

[badgerx16]

3 minutes ago, The Cat said:

I agree with the pundits about the penalty, the keeper comes out, narrows the angle to try and stop the ball and then the player runs into him.

What's he meant to do, stand there and let him score?

Walton is talking utter shit.

Indeed.

Look at the second goal - as Alvarez puts the ball past the GK they collide. If the ball had gone wide, following Walton's logic, that would also have been a penalty.

Is the GK supposed to allow the striker a frree shot ?

[tdmickey3]

Some people think that's not a pen

🤣

 

[adrian lord]

Interesting how finally, the studio pundits have clearly given up being polite to Walton, and are openly dissenting and showing contempt for his absurd backing of referees decisions, however contrary. 

Edited 13 December, 2022 by adrian lord

[badgerx16]

3 minutes ago, tdmickey3 said:

Some people think that's not a pen

🤣

 

Of the 5 'pundits', 3 think it wasn't.

[East Kent Saint]

So 45 +10 mins of Argie time wasting , falling over , shouting at the ref and trying to wind up Croatia into retaliation 😐

[The Cat]

I actually think Lee Dixon has a Messi toe fetish now.

[whelk]

Cannot believe anyone goes for Ronaldo over Messi

[hackedoff]

8 minutes ago, The Cat said:

I actually think Lee Dixon has a Messi toe fetish now.

An old bird of mine had a fetish about cucumbers,personally I found them utterly tasteless.

[skintsaint]

14 hours ago, whelk said:

Cannot believe anyone goes for Ronaldo over Messi

Not these days that's for sure. 

[FarehamSaintJames]

14 hours ago, whelk said:

Cannot believe anyone goes for Ronaldo over Messi

I did right up until the tantrums he started having at Man United and the storming out. The Piers Morgan interview was the final straw. 🤮

[AlexLaw76]

1 hour ago, FarehamSaintJames said:

I did right up until the tantrums he started having at Man United and the storming out. The Piers Morgan interview was the final straw. 🤮

With you on that. More so as Ronaldo did ‘it’ in a few of the top leagues.

However, not now. Messi is the very best, probably ever!

 

[whelk]

This evening could have had a very different feel

[Fabrice Fernandes no.1 fan]

I would suggest Lavia’s homework be to watch Amrabaat for Morocco across this tournament. The way he’s receiving the ball on the turn and passing through the lines is excellent 

[Jonnyboy]

Morocco seem to have lost momentum since subbing Boufal off. 

[adrian lord]

France has lethal, ruthless striking prowess. Almost at will.

[Jonnyboy]

1 minute ago, adrian lord said:

France has lethal, ruthless striking prowess. Almost at will.

Two lucky deflections falling nicely to unmarked players 🤷‍♂️

[Turkish]

What looked like a foul on Boufal in the Penalty area ended up with him being booked 🤔

still Qatar Sport Investment has Messi v Mbappe final…

[saintant]

England need to bone up on the dark arts. We are far too sporting and lack the ruthless streak that you see in France and Argentina. It doesn't come as naturally to us but we need to learn from the masters. Often, that ruthless, win-at-all costs attitude tips the balance. We hardly picked up any yellow cards which is great but is a pointer to not being willing to make the cynical fouls.

[sadoldgit]

It’s been an absolute joy watching Morocco and that was a cracking semi final. I hope they go on to beat Croatia as they fully deserve a third place in this competition.

[saintant]

Boufal was excellent tonight, shouldn't have been taken off.

[cloggy saint]

1 hour ago, saintant said:

England need to bone up on the dark arts. We are far too sporting and lack the ruthless streak that you see in France and Argentina. It doesn't come as naturally to us but we need to learn from the masters. Often, that ruthless, win-at-all costs attitude tips the balance. We hardly picked up any yellow cards which is great but is a pointer to not being willing to make the cynical fouls.

Are you suggesting we should also fall over and roll around in agony too? I'd rather lose.

[Dark Munster]

1 hour ago, saintant said:

Boufal was excellent tonight, shouldn't have been taken off.

Knackered perhaps.

[East Kent Saint]

7 hours ago, saintant said:

England need to bone up on the dark arts. We are far too sporting and lack the ruthless streak that you see in France and Argentina. It doesn't come as naturally to us but we need to learn from the masters. Often, that ruthless, win-at-all costs attitude tips the balance. We hardly picked up any yellow cards which is great but is a pointer to not being willing to make the cynical fouls.

The successful teams in this WC seem to have players who are prepared to be physical as well as skillful . Perhaps spme of the England players are a bit lightweight by comparison . A lot seems to depend on the Ref , last night he wasn't dishing out yellow cards , some tackles on replay looked bad and intended to make contact as well . In the prem I would expect more cards to be given for those tackles.

Morocco didn't cave last night as I expected and kept going to the end , pretty impressive . Final will be interesting .

[Turkish]

2 hours ago, East Kent Saint said:

The successful teams in this WC seem to have players who are prepared to be physical as well as skillful . Perhaps spme of the England players are a bit lightweight by comparison . A lot seems to depend on the Ref , last night he wasn't dishing out yellow cards , some tackles on replay looked bad and intended to make contact as well . In the prem I would expect more cards to be given for those tackles.

Morocco didn't cave last night as I expected and kept going to the end , pretty impressive . Final will be interesting .

Apart from a couple of games, like the Argentina v Netherlands quarter final refs have generally let quite a lot go and not given out too many cards. It's good to see as generally it's been quite a good world cup. A few game changing decisions haven't been given though, notably the two against England but in the Argentina v NL game the lad who took out a player then booted the ball into the bench where the NL players were should have got two yellows and been sent off, that was blatant, in a game where the ref dished out over a dozen cards not sure how that wasn't picked up. I'm sure there are others but they are the two that stood out to me as that could have impacted who made the final. Despite the myth there have still been some very poor ref performances and VAR controversy despite the myth everyone else has got it so much better. 

[S-Clarke]

12 hours ago, sadoldgit said:

It’s been an absolute joy watching Morocco and that was a cracking semi final. I hope they go on to beat Croatia as they fully deserve a third place in this competition.

Agreed, they have been refreshing to watch in the Semi Final.  They seem like a really inteligent team as they know when to sink back, but then they can attack and pen teams in if they want.

They've kind of come out of nowhere, but if you look at their 11 they do have a group of some top level/CL level players in their makeup. Amrabat, Ziech, Hakimi, Mazraoui, En-Nesyri

[saintant]

19 hours ago, cloggy saint said:

Are you suggesting we should also fall over and roll around in agony too? I'd rather lose.

You usually get your wish in games where it counts. 🙂

[Dark Munster]

Looking ahead to the 48 team 2026 World Cup, I think we are all in agreement that the 16 three team group format proposed by FIFA is a load of wank. Apparently FIFA are meeting soon to discuss the format. 

That got me thinking, how could it be done properly given the ridiculous numbers of teams (that isn't a power of 2) has been decided. I came up with the following, that avoids collusion, gives each team a minimum of 3 matches, and gives a huge incentive to win the group matches. What do you lot think? Another crap idea, or maybe it could work?

 

• 16 groups of 3 teams, A, B, … , P as originally proposed by FIFA.
• Each team in group A plays against the three teams in group B, and likewise of course each team in group B plays against the three teams in group A. Similarly C and D are paired, and so on. Note at this stage no team yet plays teams from their own group. That comes next.
• After the 3 matches for each team, the top two teams in each group advance to the next round, with the third placed team eliminated. Positions are determined by points gained, followed by number of wins, then goal difference, then goals scored, then fair play, then by drawing of lots.
• The top two from each group meet in the next round for a 90 minute elimination match. Whoever wins advances, regardless of whether they were first or second in their group or how many points they have. However, if the match is a draw after 90 minutes the first placed team advances (no extra time or penalties.)
• These winners of the 16 groups now advance to a regular knockout, with extra time and penalties used in the usual manner if matches are tied after 90 minutes. The winners of groups A, C, E, G, I, K, M, O go to the top half of the bracket, and the others to the lower half, so that no two teams can play each other twice (except in the final).

The part in bold is what I like. It gives a huge incentive to try to finish first in the group, and the elimination 1st v 2nd match itself would typically be open, with the second placed team desperate to win in the 90 minutes. The only boring matches are those where both teams are happy to settle for a draw.

[Kenilworthy]

6 hours ago, Dark Munster said:

Looking ahead to the 48 team 2026 World Cup, I think we are all in agreement that the 16 three team group format proposed by FIFA is a load of wank. Apparently FIFA are meeting soon to discuss the format. 

That got me thinking, how could it be done properly given the ridiculous numbers of teams (that isn't a power of 2) has been decided. I came up with the following, that avoids collusion, gives each team a minimum of 3 matches, and gives a huge incentive to win the group matches. What do you lot think? Another crap idea, or maybe it could work?

 

• 16 groups of 3 teams, A, B, … , P as originally proposed by FIFA.
• Each team in group A plays against the three teams in group B, and likewise of course each team in group B plays against the three teams in group A. Similarly C and D are paired, and so on. Note at this stage no team yet plays teams from their own group. That comes next.
• After the 3 matches for each team, the top two teams in each group advance to the next round, with the third placed team eliminated. Positions are determined by points gained, followed by number of wins, then goal difference, then goals scored, then fair play, then by drawing of lots.
• The top two from each group meet in the next round for a 90 minute elimination match. Whoever wins advances, regardless of whether they were first or second in their group or how many points they have. However, if the match is a draw after 90 minutes the first placed team advances (no extra time or penalties.)
• These winners of the 16 groups now advance to a regular knockout, with extra time and penalties used in the usual manner if matches are tied after 90 minutes. The winners of groups A, C, E, G, I, K, M, O go to the top half of the bracket, and the others to the lower half, so that no two teams can play each other twice (except in the final).

The part in bold is what I like. It gives a huge incentive to try to finish first in the group, and the elimination 1st v 2nd match itself would typically be open, with the second placed team desperate to win in the 90 minutes. The only boring matches are those where both teams are happy to settle for a draw.

It is a reasonable solution to the madness of having 48 teams at a finals. I certainly don't think you should have a World Cup where some teams only get two games.

What I would prefer is a return to a 16 team tournament every 4 years. But in between  tournaments there should be a sort of FIFA FA cup where all the 200 plus associations in FIFA are drawn against each other in a straight knockout.

[egg]

21 minutes ago, Kenilworthy said:

It is a reasonable solution to the madness of having 48 teams at a finals. I certainly don't think you should have a World Cup where some teams only get two games.

What I would prefer is a return to a 16 team tournament every 4 years. But in between  tournaments there should be a sort of FIFA FA cup where all the 200 plus associations in FIFA are drawn against each other in a straight knockout.

I'd go the other way and have 8 groups of 6, the top 4 going through, then a round of 32. Have a quick turnaround of games. Groups of 3 would be rubbish imo, and I don't like the idea of 2 of teams from those group playing each other twice at the group stage. 

[Piran]

Why change it? Infantino himself called it "The best WC ever" this year, and I'm inclined to agree with him, even as someone who has followed it since 1958, and was opposed to Qatar and all the shenanigans beforehand.

There is plenty of room for as many teams as you want in the preliminary and qualifying rounds, but keep the finals as they have been this year. Anything that allows the possibility of Germany going home early, anyway!

[Dark Munster]

6 hours ago, egg said:

I'd go the other way and have 8 groups of 6, the top 4 going through, then a round of 32. Have a quick turnaround of games. Groups of 3 would be rubbish imo, and I don't like the idea of 2 of teams from those group playing each other twice at the group stage. 

The current FIFA proposal has groups of 3 with teams playing the other 2 in their group, just like the WC in Spain where one team has to sit out while the other 2 meet in the final match of the group. Collusion central. My proposal has teams playing 3 matches against another paired group, and then the top 2 from their own group play a knockout match. No teams play each other twice (unless they meet again in the final). 
 

8 groups of 6 would I think lead to too many group matches and dead rubbers near the end. 5 matches each, just to get rid of the minnows. Plus an extra knockout round with 32 teams. 

[egg]

12 minutes ago, Dark Munster said:

The current FIFA proposal has groups of 3 with teams playing the other 2 in their group, just like the WC in Spain where one team has to sit out while the other 2 meet in the final match of the group. Collusion central. My proposal has teams playing 3 matches against another paired group, and then the top 2 from their own group play a knockout match. No teams play each other twice (unless they meet again in the final). 
 

8 groups of 6 would I think lead to too many group matches and dead rubbers near the end. 5 matches each, just to get rid of the minnows. Plus an extra knockout round with 32 teams. 

There's different options for sure. My thoughts on 4 to go through from groups of 6 is that more teams have more to play for, less prospect of collusion (ie the FIFA proposal - apologies for misunderstanding yours) and more minnows have a chance of making it through. Different perspectives I think. 

[The Kraken]

Fairly sure FIFA will go for something similar to the euros. 12 groups of 4, top 2 go through plus the 8 best 3rd place sides. Which IMO takes away the drama of qualifying that was one of the bright spots of this WC.

[egg]

1 minute ago, The Kraken said:

Fairly sure FIFA will go for something similar to the euros. 12 groups of 4, top 2 go through plus the 8 best 3rd place sides. Which IMO takes away the drama of qualifying that was one of the bright spots of this WC.

That's preferable to the 3 idea though, and some 3rd place teams having a chance of going through keeps them honest. 

[The Kraken]

1 minute ago, egg said:

That's preferable to the 3 idea though, and some 3rd place teams having a chance of going through keeps them honest. 

Yeah it’s probably the least shit option. Just makes qualifying a bit too easy; this World Cup had some great round 3 games, my picks being Uruguay out, Korea in, and the whole group E Germany/Costa Rica/Spain/Japan roller coaster.

[egg]

18 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

Yeah it’s probably the least shit option. Just makes qualifying a bit too easy; this World Cup had some great round 3 games, my picks being Uruguay out, Korea in, and the whole group E Germany/Costa Rica/Spain/Japan roller coaster.

Yep, there's been some interesting results this year and hopefully a round of 32 next time throw up some surprises. Putting the politics etc to one side, it's been a decent world cup.  

[The Kraken]

2 minutes ago, egg said:

Yep, there's been some interesting results this year and hopefully a round of 32 next time throw up some surprises. Putting the politics etc to one side, it's been a decent world cup.  

The actual games have been great. In that respect, Infantino has a point when says best ever, best on field action I can remember. Refs have mostly been ok and for the most part VAR has eliminated large errors. The crowds have been shit though, not enough genuine fans in the stadium and too many empty seats. Outside of the games the Qataris have highlighted exactly what they’re all about, not sure if it’s been the positive sportswash they’d have hoped 200 billion would bring them.

[Kingsland Codger]

As an added extra, I would abolish the penalty shoot-out. If the scores are still level after extra-time, the team with the fewer yellow/red cards go through to the next round. This puts pressure not just on the teams but also on the officials.

[Dark Munster]

1 hour ago, Kingsland Codger said:

As an added extra, I would abolish the penalty shoot-out. If the scores are still level after extra-time, the team with the fewer yellow/red cards go through to the next round. This puts pressure not just on the teams but also on the officials.

I like this idea of one team having the slight edge to avoid penalties. But instead of yellow/reds (which is at the mercy of a good or bad prior ref), how about in the first round the higher seed (i.e. team who finished first in their group) goes through after extra time if a draw? In subsequent rounds some sort of priority based on previous results.

[Dark Munster]

2 hours ago, The Kraken said:

Fairly sure FIFA will go for something similar to the euros. 12 groups of 4, top 2 go through plus the 8 best 3rd place sides. Which IMO takes away the drama of qualifying that was one of the bright spots of this WC.

Yeah I think that's a good possibility. Although there has been talk of keeping the groups of 3, but not having draws (penalty shootouts if matches finish level).

I still think my proposal is the best! 😉

[Dark Munster]

6 hours ago, Piran said:

Why change it? Infantino himself called it "The best WC ever" this year, and I'm inclined to agree with him, even as someone who has followed it since 1958, and was opposed to Qatar and all the shenanigans beforehand.

There is plenty of room for as many teams as you want in the preliminary and qualifying rounds, but keep the finals as they have been this year. Anything that allows the possibility of Germany going home early, anyway!

I think we all agree about that, but unfortunately FIFA have decided on 48 teams and that's not going to change (at least for the next WC).

[LuckyNumber7]

The World Cup format is perfect as it is as has been shown by this tournament, I really wish they would stop meddling.

But if we do have to have 48 teams then I like Egg's idea of groups of 6 and just a big festival of football. Groups of 3 is crap for so many reasons but thankfully even Infantino seems to be realising that. I suspect they'll go with the 12 groups of 4 which is better, I just don't like the grey area of some 3rd place teams qualifying and others not. Same principle for the Euros. There's also likely to be some utter dross qualifying for the finals now which will probably make for some very dull, one sided games.

Edited 17 December, 2022 by LuckyNumber7

[jawillwill]

8 hours ago, Dark Munster said:

I like this idea of one team having the slight edge to avoid penalties. But instead of yellow/reds (which is at the mercy of a good or bad prior ref), how about in the first round the higher seed (i.e. team who finished first in their group) goes through after extra time if a draw? In subsequent rounds some sort of priority based on previous results.

Glad it's not you guys making the decisions. Both terrible ideas.

[niceandfriendly]

11 hours ago, Kingsland Codger said:

As an added extra, I would abolish the penalty shoot-out. If the scores are still level after extra-time, the team with the fewer yellow/red cards go through to the next round. This puts pressure not just on the teams but also on the officials.

My god man, no. Referees are horrendous as it is, especially with giving frivolous and absurd yellow cards. Effectively giving them the power to eliminate teams based on their incompetencies is a terrible idea. This also incentivises diving and feigning injury. Worst idea I’ve heard but I concede the possibility that I just had a whoosh moment and you’re trolling. 

[Holmes_and_Watson]

5 hours ago, jawillwill said:

Glad it's not you guys making the decisions. Both terrible ideas.

Surely we all want the spirit of knock out competition to be captured by It's a Knockout elimination? The players dress up in country mascot outfits and multiple giant inflatable balls are used. A fun filled goal fest!

[Kingsland Codger]

4 hours ago, niceandfriendly said:

My god man, no. Referees are horrendous as it is, especially with giving frivolous and absurd yellow cards. Effectively giving them the power to eliminate teams based on their incompetencies is a terrible idea. This also incentivises diving and feigning injury. Worst idea I’ve heard but I concede the possibility that I just had a whoosh moment and you’re trolling. 

Trolling? Far from it. I am merely considering a way to avoid the curse of knock-out football tournaments - the drawn game and subsequent penalty shoot-out. Too many sides play for the shoot-out rather than risk a counter-attack should their own attempt at positive play backfire.  I take your point about disciplinary cards encouraging yet more fake fouls but this cuts both ways - I was also thinking of the effect such a move might have on the cynical foul - Chiellini grabbing Saka's shirt collar at the Euro final is but one recent example.

Other alternative suggestions to abolish the shoot-out are welcome. Most corners? 

[Turkish]

The World Cup is fine as it is, wish they’d stop dicking about with it

 

supposedly a new club World Cup coming in as well. Hopefully a step closer to the big clubs creating their own league 

[HarvSFC]

30 minutes ago, Turkish said:

The World Cup is fine as it is, wish they’d stop dicking about with it

 

supposedly a new club World Cup coming in as well. Hopefully a step closer to the big clubs creating their own league 

The Champions League changes from 2024 as well, no more group stages, but a 36 team league. Some say it's similar to a "super league".

[egg]

33 minutes ago, Turkish said:

The World Cup is fine as it is, wish they’d stop dicking about with it

 

supposedly a new club World Cup coming in as well. Hopefully a step closer to the big clubs creating their own league 

It is, but I think there's a case for more countries to be involved, although the 3 teams per group is a daft idea. 

The new club world cup is a strange one and not sure how that can work alongside the champions league, domestic leagues, and international football. I don't think it'll be long before the big boys all feck off and do their own thing 🤞🙏🤞