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#Spygate

St Chalet

By St Chalet
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Posted by Miltonaggro,

Apologies for the war and peace post chaps – bear with or scroll past.  For the last week I have been trying to provide a steer on here as to why I think this silly episode will be concluded with a fine (in the region of £200k) and / or a possible future points deduction (though if I were advising Saints I would appeal this).  Simply that talk of forfeit and bans opens a legal can of worms that is well beyond the remit and scope of both the EFL and / or Middlesbrough FC. The best way to get

What a well thought out post. Thank you

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Dman

Dman

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Saint Garrett said:

Simply cannot see us getting a points deduction in the prem next season. It's already hard enough to stay up, why would the PL want to make it even less competitive ? No players would come to us, and it would just be a depressing season of losing every week, much like last season...

its also not a breach of their rules. So they'd be applying a punishment for a rule that doesn't exist. 

  • Like 2
S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted
Just now, Saint Garrett said:

Simply cannot see us getting a points deduction in the prem next season. It's already hard enough to stay up, why would the PL want to make it even less competitive ? No players would come to us, and it would just be a depressing season of losing every week, much like last season...

There's no real past examples of that, there are no spying rules in this context in the PL.

We'd almost certainly appeal that and probably win if it was applied to the EPL. IMO The points deduction can only truly apply in the EFL and it must be suspended for if we're caught doing it again, nothing else works.

Boro won't like that, which is why a summer of courts ensues.

obelisk

obelisk

Posted
Posted

Too much fannying around. It's like waiting for a Russell team to get the ball forward. Is it possible to charge the EFL with acting in bad faith by making everyone wait so long?

  • Like 1
Doctoroncall

Doctoroncall

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

I think it is incredibly safe to assume it has started.

This isn’t a 17 year old panic writing an A level essay on a few cans of Relentless.

Writing and proofing the bloody judgement will take half a day in itself. I did genuinely think they were under promising and would get it done by Monday evening.

They may have the summary and result ready but the actual report of the meeting later. 

If it’s anything like regulatory inspections or company audits, documented reports are finalised after the meeting and the summary and result given on the last day. 

badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, SotonianWill said:

Looks like our plan is to aim putting the ball between those two stick things

That's where Boro went wrong.

  • Haha 1
Jack

Jack

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Saint Garrett said:

Simply cannot see us getting a points deduction in the prem next season. It's already hard enough to stay up, why would the PL want to make it even less competitive ? No players would come to us, and it would just be a depressing season of losing every week, much like last season...

Doesn’t matter a fuck what the PL want. Besides, I’m sure the PL doesn’t care if there’s relegation fodder as long as the established top teams come out at the top 

Zorba

Zorba

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, obelisk said:

Too much fannying around. It's like waiting for a Russell team to get the ball forward. Is it possible to charge the EFL with acting in bad faith by making everyone wait so long?

They’ve come close to a decision… then knocked it back and started all over again.

  • Haha 3
64saint

64saint

Posted
Posted (edited)

Whatever the outcome I'm sure going to miss the comments that have been on here. Although its one of the most serious threads we've probably ever had ref the outcome..., the humour of some of the comments has been brilliant. 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Edited by 64saint
  • Like 6
Jimmy_D

Jimmy_D

Posted
Posted
Just now, Toadhall Saint said:

That’s not really a deterrent for other EFL teams tho.

Is a yellow card a deterrent for a cynical foul?

  • Like 1
kwsaint

kwsaint

Posted
Posted

Tonda exiled to Saint Helena à la Napolean.

Gibson given the next FIFA Peace Prize.

Southampton start next season in Southern League Division One South alongside Winchester City.

  • Haha 2
Tommy Mulgrew

Tommy Mulgrew

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

250-500K for breaching the good faith rule, and then a bigger amount for breaching the new spying rule

Nah!  After seeing Saints’ disingenuous claim (see thread 105 or 106 from yesterday) that Downes was still so fit after 115 minutes that he could sprint back and make a tackle whereas he was subbed on in the 66th minute, we face a fine of £49million and a 49 points deduction at the very least, brought down from £115million and 115 points on appeal.   😉

Jack

Jack

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, badgerx16 said:

£500k fine, 3 points suspended, and Boro can do one.

£600k fine for Boro for attempting to interfere with the process of the independent hearing, leaking nonsense to the press and generally being a bunch of fannies 

  • Like 5
Jimmy_D

Jimmy_D

Posted
Posted

It’s quite funny that Boro seem to have got it into their heads that this is apparently the worst offence that has ever occurred in football and so needs to be punished with the most severe sanction in the history of the Football League to make sure it can never happen again.

  • Like 8
Toadhall Saint

Toadhall Saint

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

Exactly this. There is no deterrent, only punishment.

They are setting a precedent. That precedent needs to ensure that other EFL teams think twice before being caught observing within 72 hours.

Mattio

Mattio

Posted
Posted

Just took a glance on OneBoro, I see they're back to thinking they're going to make a compensation claim for £200m if we're allowed to play in the final. I want a toke on whatever they're smoking.

  • Haha 2
USaintA

USaintA

Posted
Posted

Will Salt has today released a statement on his Myspace.

 

“Dear all,

This has, as you can guess, been a very unsavoury situation for me and my family. Us Salts are feeling pretty shaken up about it all and I personally feel as if I’ve been put through the grinder. I am hoping the EFlL sea sense and that this doesn’t negatively impact our season…Ings was a good player wasn’t he?”

  • Haha 2
saintant

saintant

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Mattio said:

Just took a glance on OneBoro, I see they're back to thinking they're going to make a compensation claim for £200m if we're allowed to play in the final. I want a toke on whatever they're smoking.

That's cos they think big bad Gibbo is the king of litigation who always gets what he wants. Dragan will be well lawyered up ready to meet him head on.

CSA96

CSA96

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, saintant said:

That's cos they think big bad Gibbo is the king of litigation who always gets what he wants. Dragan will be well lawyered up ready to meet him head on.

Crazy really. He sued Derby for £40m-£45m in 2019 and settled three years later in 2022 for £3m but you'd think he'd won them some sort of king's ransom by the way they bleat on about it

Edited by CSA96
  • Like 2
sadoldgit

sadoldgit

Posted
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Toadhall Saint said:

They are setting a precedent. That precedent needs to ensure that other EFL teams think twice before being caught observing within 72 hours.

There are plenty of precedents set that haven’t prevented clubs from breaking the rules. The FA Cup Final was contested by two of them. 
The penalty has to be proportionate to the offence. The days of people being hung for stealing handkerchiefs are long gone.

Edited by sadoldgit
Saint NL

Saint NL

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, 64saint said:

Whatever the outcome I'm sure going to miss the comments that have been on here. Although its one of the most serious threads we've probably ever had ref the outcome..., the humour of some of the comments has been brilliant. 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Helped in part by the absolutely deluded Boro fans 

Screenshot_2026-05-18-16-52-13-025_com.vivaldi.browser-edit.thumb.jpg.007b0b3da6a15fa54e8f22e950a89389.jpg

  • Haha 4
hypochondriac

hypochondriac

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Mattio said:

Just took a glance on OneBoro, I see they're back to thinking they're going to make a compensation claim for £200m if we're allowed to play in the final. I want a toke on whatever they're smoking.

They're now talking about using our own words against us in a civil suit in order to get tens of millions. That's despite not knowing what our words are and relying on a couple of sentences from Alfie House in an Echo article... 

  • Like 1
CanadaSaint

CanadaSaint

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Mattio said:

Just took a glance on OneBoro, I see they're back to thinking they're going to make a compensation claim for £200m if we're allowed to play in the final. I want a toke on whatever they're smoking.

Mental. That presupposes that they would have beaten Hull. The most they could claim is their share of the gate receipts and TV money from the playoff final, less their expenses for getting there - which they didn't and won't.

They have less chance of winning that case than I do of being the next Pope, and I'm not Catholic.

#Delusiononsteroids

  • Like 2
Toadhall Saint

Toadhall Saint

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, sadoldgit said:

There are plenty of precedents set that haven’t prevented clubs from breaking the rules. The FA Cup Final was contested by two of them. 

Even more reason to set a harsh one no? 300k is a slap in the wrist from Barry humphries.

SaintBobby

SaintBobby

Posted
Posted

Can I ask about what people mean by a "suspended" points deduction?

Does it mean "suspended" until we play again in the Championship (maybe next season, maybe a long way in the future) or does it mean "suspended" in the same way as a prison sentence can be suspended (not served at all if there are no further offences in the future...but added to your sentence if you're found guilty of a similar crime at a later date)?

TheAlehouseBrawlers

TheAlehouseBrawlers

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, saintant said:

That's cos they think big bad Gibbo is the king of litigation who always gets what he wants. Dragan will be well lawyered up ready to meet him head on.

Well, their band of supporters at St Mary's last week were singing "You'll do as you're told" so it must be true.

£200m for some young mush with an iPhone that had absolutely no bearing on the first leg that it was all over seems absolutely fair to me tbh.......... 

Saint_clark

Saint_clark

Posted
Posted
Just now, SaintBobby said:

Can I ask about what people mean by a "suspended" points deduction?

Does it mean "suspended" until we play again in the Championship (maybe next season, maybe a long way in the future) or does it mean "suspended" in the same way as a prison sentence can be suspended (not served at all if there are no further offences in the future...but added to your sentence if you're found guilty of a similar crime at a later date)?

Till our next championship season, whenever that is.

sadoldgit

sadoldgit

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Toadhall Saint said:

Even more reason to set a harsh one no? 300k is a slap in the wrist from Barry humphries.

It has to be proportionate to the offence. 

Willo of Whiteley

Willo of Whiteley

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, Mattio said:

Just took a glance on OneBoro, I see they're back to thinking they're going to make a compensation claim for £200m if we're allowed to play in the final. I want a toke on whatever they're smoking.

They’re a special breed

sadoldgit

sadoldgit

Posted
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Toadhall Saint said:

So what’s your guess then Solomon?

I really don’t know Sheba, but if they go for something crazy they face an appeal which they will probably lose given the circumstances (not only was he only equipped with an iPhone, it seems as though he was a good 200m to 400m from any action, so probably the most inept and ineffectual recon mission ever).

Also, if it is true that they are all at it, the EFL won’t want to stir up a hornets nest by imposing some massive, disproportionate penalty.

What penalties do the EPL and EFL currently have that are so punitive that the have stopped clubs from transgressing?

Edited by sadoldgit
Added text
saintant

saintant

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

They’re a special breed

Indeed, a chilling reminder of what happens when brothers marry their sisters.

  • Haha 4
beatlesaint

beatlesaint

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, Jimmy_D said:

It’s quite funny that Boro seem to have got it into their heads that this is apparently the worst offence that has ever occurred in football and so needs to be punished with the most severe sanction in the history of the Football League to make sure it can never happen again.

The worst offence was caused by their so called strikers in the first half of the first leg, they don’t need to look beyond that tbh.

  • Like 1
saintant

saintant

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

They’re a special breed

One of them had the audacity to start a post with the words, 'I'm not stupid'

  • Haha 1
Toadhall Saint

Toadhall Saint

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, sadoldgit said:

I really don’t know Sheba, but if they go for something crazy they face an appeal which they will probably lose given the circumstances (not only was he only equipped with an iPhone, it seems as though he was a good 200m to 400m from any action, so probably the most inept and ineffectual recon mission ever).

Also, if it is true that they are all at it, the EFL won’t want to stir up a hornets nest by imposing some massive penalty.

So given your mitigating comments (all not relevant to the rule btw) what’s your best guess if it needs to be proportionate but is also setting a precedent? 300k,400k,500k? Plus points deduction? 
 

im not holding my breath because as is always with you you just Mather on and not really have an opinion.

badgerx16

badgerx16

Posted
Posted
45 minutes ago, Toadhall Saint said:

That’s not really a deterrent for other EFL teams tho.

I think the deterrent will come in the form of tightening up and clarifying rule 127 with an explicit penalty clause added.

  • Like 1

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