Sants 0 - Everton 3: Post match rage thread

[CB Fry]

You're destined to be disappointed I'm afraid. The club have made it crystal clear in recent times that we will never look to 'buy success'. Our strategy is to get as many academy players involved in the 1st team squad as possible, supplemented with young players with potential, or a career that needs reigniting, from elsewhere. Our strategy is fixed. Some seasons we'll finish 7th, some seasons lower than that and sometimes maybe, just maybe, higher. But the one constant is our player and management recruitment strategy. Southampton isn't the club to support if you want a club to chase success with a blank chequebook in one hand. It ain't gonna happen.

I've almost given up posting posts like this, as some people are frankly never, ever going to be able to process the information.

 

Cheers for continuing to try, Lord Trousers.

[Sour Mash]

You're destined to be disappointed I'm afraid. The club have made it crystal clear in recent times that we will never look to 'buy success'. Our strategy is to get as many academy players involved in the 1st team squad as possible, supplemented with young players with potential, or a career that needs reigniting, from elsewhere. Our strategy is fixed. Some seasons we'll finish 7th, some seasons lower than that and sometimes maybe, just maybe, higher. But the one constant is our player and management recruitment strategy. Southampton isn't the club to support if you want a club to chase success with a blank chequebook in one hand. It ain't gonna happen.

He's not suggesting a blank cheque book approach though.

 

It's not an argument I necessarily agree with, but the question of our replacements being cheap options is a fair one.

 

It's a fine line for the club to walk and get quite right.

[Saint Matty 76]

When Clasie's fit again I'd love to see us move to 4-3-3, something like...

 

Clasie - Wanyama - Romeu

Mane - Pelle - Rodriguez

 

I'm starting to lose interest in Tadic and with Clasie/Romeu it seems like we'd actually be able to control the game in the midfield a little bit. Only problem would be can Mane do it on the wing.

[tajjuk]

When Clasie's fit again I'd love to see us move to 4-3-3, something like...

 

Clasie - Wanyama - Romeu

Mane - Pelle - Rodriguez

 

I'm starting to lose interest in Tadic and with Clasie/Romeu it seems like we'd actually be able to control the game in the midfield a little bit. Only problem would be can Mane do it on the wing.

 

I think that would at least be a sensible option away, Clasie as playmaker. I think at home we'd more nous in the form of Tadic or Juanmi I reckon

[Saints4everChris]

Two Premier League games in and already the pants-wetting pussies are coming out of the woodwork. Why complain about players and tactics already after the most successful season since the early eighties? Some people need to look up the word 'perspective' in the dictionary.

[Genk]

When Clasie's fit again I'd love to see us move to 4-3-3, something like...

 

Clasie - Wanyama - Romeu

Mane - Pelle - Rodriguez

 

I'm starting to lose interest in Tadic and with Clasie/Romeu it seems like we'd actually be able to control the game in the midfield a little bit. Only problem would be can Mane do it on the wing.

 

But can he do it on a cold rainy night in Stoke

[jamesfp1]

Great start. Level on points with the champions! COYR!

[Saint_clark]

You simply can't value Jayrod as high as prior to his injury. There are more players who have never really recovered than returned to full fitness, let alone regain the same level.

 

Ok so we can't value him at £20million, but it would be fair to value him at £7million as that is what we paid. So that's £31million already. Then Stekelenberg is around £5million at least, so £36million, and Caulker went to QPR for £8million I believe so that puts the total at £44million with Koeman confirming at least one more signing to come.

Tommog, you're full of it.

[Kingsbridge Saint]

Gareth Barry was old and past it at the World Cup - in South Africa. Getting stuffed 3-0 at home by a side with him in it is like losing to 10 men. Seriously looking for a response at Watford on Sunday, and in Europe on Thursday. Two wins please and let's leave this all behind.

[shurlock]

Ok so we can't value him at £20million, but it would be fair to value him at £7million as that is what we paid. So that's £31million already. Then Stekelenberg is around £5million at least, so £36million, and Caulker went to QPR for £8million I believe so that puts the total at £44million with Koeman confirming at least one more signing to come.

Tommog, you're full of it.

 

So we own Caulker and Steklenberg? That played out fantastically well with Toby, didn't it?

[CB Fry]

So we own Caulker and Steklenberg? That played out fantastically well with Toby, didn't it?

I think the point was Tommug included Toby in his multi million pound "outs" column but conveniently ignored Caulker and Steklenberg in his heavily doctored "ins" list.

 

Kinda fair to included either all, or none of them, ain't it?

[Dalek2003]

17th in the table on the 17th August. Lol.

[OldNick]

You're destined to be disappointed I'm afraid. The club have made it crystal clear in recent times that we will never look to 'buy success'. Our strategy is to get as many academy players involved in the 1st team squad as possible, supplemented with young players with potential, or a career that needs reigniting, from elsewhere. Our strategy is fixed. Some seasons we'll finish 7th, some seasons lower than that and sometimes maybe, just maybe, higher. But the one constant is our player and management recruitment strategy. Southampton isn't the club to support if you want a club to chase success with a blank chequebook in one hand. It ain't gonna happen.

Well as we are just a cultivation club, and basically the reserve team of others the owners should reduce the prices to watch them. 37 quid to watch a team of developing players and hopefuls. Some might put up with it but somebody like Koeman won't

[CB Fry]

I've almost given up posting posts like this, as some people are frankly never, ever going to be able to process the information.

 

Cheers for continuing to try, Lord Trousers.

And here's a great example of my point.

Well as we are just a cultivation club, and basically the reserve team of others the owners should reduce the prices to watch them. 37 quid to watch a team of developing players and hopefuls. Some might put up with it but somebody like Koeman won't

[Cascadia Saint]

17th in the table on the 17th August. Lol.

 

It's like having your birthday on christmas day!

[shurlock]

I think the point was Tommug included Toby in his multi million pound "outs" column but conveniently ignored Caulker and Steklenberg in his heavily doctored "ins" list.

 

Kinda fair to included either all, or none of them, ain't it?

 

Depends. If it's an argument about how much the club has spent, then it's perfectly fair to leave them out. They're not our players, full stop. If it's an argument about the short-term strength of the squad, then count them in, though, by the same token, take out Forster and Gardos.

 

My guess is the poster is referring to the first point as some kind of proxy of the club's ambition; and by that I don't think he means Trousers utter strawman horses**t about 'blank chequebooks' and 'buying success', though you'd have to ask him.

Edited 17 August, 2015 by shurlock

[trousers]

Depends. If it's an argument about how much the club has spent, then it's perfectly fair to leave them out. They're not our players, full stop. If it's an argument about the short-term strength of the squad, then count them in, though, by the same token, take out Forster and Gardos.

 

My guess is the poster is referring to the first point as some kind of proxy of the club's ambition; and by that I don't think he means Trousers strawman horses**t about 'buying success', though you'd have to ask him.

Badger. Not horse.

[shurlock]

Badger. Not horse.

 

Deffo. A finer grain of sophistry

[trousers]

Deffo. A finer grain of sophistry

My deceptive ingenuity knows no bounds. Thank you kindly for taking the time and effort to notice

Edited 17 August, 2015 by trousers

[John B]

I think there should be some realism on this Forum just because we finished higher than Everton last season it does not mean we are automatically going to beat them this season especially with the team we put out on Saturday which in no way will be the best one we eventually field.

 

Players like Fonte and Wanyama played really well last season but they might not do so this year and other teams may also perform better than they did last season that is just football.

 

I am pretty sure we will do OK this season but I doubt we will be successful as we were last season as the loss of our better players is going to catch up with us eventually

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

I think there should be some realism on this Forum just because we finished higher than Everton last season it does not mean we are automatically going to beat them this season especially with the team we put out on Saturday which in no way will be the best one we eventually field.

 

Players like Fonte and Wanyama played really well last season but they might not do so this year and other teams may also perform better than they did last season that is just football.

 

I am pretty sure we will do OK this season but I doubt we will be successful as we were last season as the loss of our better players is going to catch up with us eventually

 

Losing your first home game to Everton 3-0 is pretty poor I think however you choose to dress it up. But yes, you cannot keep selling off your best players every summer and expect to 'get away with it' like we did last season.

 

It is still of course far too early to sensibly predict where we will finish this season - however I don't see why another top ten finish should not be the target.

[Whitey Grandad]

I think there should be some realism on this Forum just because we finished higher than Everton last season it does not mean we are automatically going to beat them this season especially with the team we put out on Saturday which in no way will be the best one we eventually field.

 

The difference is that Everton didn't score any goals for us this year.

[Weston Saint]

Koeman said: “Everybody knows we are working at one more defender, and then I think we have a very good squad for this season, and we know that. A little bit unlucky in our options what we don’t have at the moment.

 

“One defender on the bench and Matthew Targett played 90 minutes and he was ill, he wasn’t 100 per cent and we have to accept that and we can’t change that situation.”

[doddisalegend]

I think there should be some realism on this Forum just because we finished higher than Everton last season it does not mean we are automatically going to beat them this season especially with the team we put out on Saturday which in no way will be the best one we eventually field.

 

Players like Fonte and Wanyama played really well last season but they might not do so this year and other teams may also perform better than they did last season that is just football.

 

I am pretty sure we will do OK this season but I doubt we will be successful as we were last season as the loss of our better players is going to catch up with us eventually

 

 

TBF even if we had kept Morgan and Clyne finishing 7th for a second season in the row would be a big ask.

[Joensuu]

I haven't read any of this thread so do forgive me if I'm repeating old ground.

 

My take is that Yoshida is likely to have become the nominated scapegoat; although I feel he played to his ability, but that his adequacies were highlighted by a failure elsewhere in the balance of the team. I observed two larger issues with our squad: the right flank; and upfront.

 

 

Right Flank

 

Our right flank was completely ineffective. Tadic offered nothing, either going forwards, or backwards. He didn't seem interested in the game, didn't track back, didn't cover Cedric - his removal at half time helped to stabilise the team significantly. I'm not sure what has gone wrong with Tadic. He hasn't really offered anything beyond the odd flash of quality since, what, November, or December last year. Has he been 'found out'? Or is he struggling for some other reason?

 

Perhaps Tadic was largely covered by Clyne last year. With a weak right back behind him, Tadic looked totally exposed and wasn't worth including in the squad. Which brings me to Soares; I was not impressed at all. Cedric didn't seem to offer anything. Fonte was dragged out wide to cover him defensively (exposing Yoshida and Targett), and going forwards Cedric seemed to be incapable of finding a cross, normally relying on Mane, Long or at one stage even Fonte to actually put the cross in. Unless he has more to offer I think we need a better replacement for Clyne before this window closes.

 

Feel that this right-sided issue caused both Wanyama and Fonte to be dragged wide, putting large gaps on the centre and left for Everton's counter attacks to channel into. After half time, Romeu's introduction (and more importantly Tadic's removal) brought us shape and stabilised our game.

 

 

Up front

 

All four of our forward players failed to consistently track back. I noticed a number of occasions when our already stretched midfield and defence were simply not supported by the four players all wanting to play centre forward. Mane, Pelle, Long and Tadic all seemed to be walking or jogging back, and leaving our back 6 heavily out numbered. The wide players especially need to be taught to track back and support the defence. I feel even that isn't enough, we can't afford to leave both Pelle and Mane up the pitch, one of them should be instructed to sprint back to support the rest of the team.

 

Pelle was woeful on Saturday, but I feel this was mostly because of the lack of supply, but even so he looked off the pace, and even when presented with a largely free header, he put the ball over the bar instead of aiming low (isn't this 101 basic stuff for any tall striker to learn?). We lack any form of replacement for Pelle in the squad, and right now he doesn't strike me as someone on top of his game.

 

I'd suggest that a lot of the above issues can easily be coached out of the squad, however, we do lack depth and options in a number of positions. It it brutally obvious that we need:

 

• A first choice left-sided centre back
  
• A first choice right back/wing back
  
• A 'Pelle' alternative
  

 

I'd also suggest that we could do with selling Tadic now. We could probably raise 10M for him this summer, and I can honestly only see his price dropping from this point onwards. Do we have any need for him in the squad?

[SaintMB]

Good job you're not overreacting or anything.

[S-Clarke]

Some of the points you make Joensuu are fair, but it's the ''sell Tadic now'' and the ''We need a better replacement for Clyne'' comments make it hard to take it all too seriously. Slight overreaction methinks.

[The9]

Koeman said: “Everybody knows we are working at one more defender, and then I think we have a very good squad for this season, and we know that. A little bit unlucky in our options what we don’t have at the moment.

 

“One defender on the bench and Matthew Targett played 90 minutes and he was ill, he wasn’t 100 per cent and we have to accept that and we can’t change that situation.”

 

This is the reality of sustainability, and we're adopting the most rational method of getting the most points we can within those parameters.

 

I can moan all I like about Yoshida not being good enough but Koeman already knows it.

 

We went for a more attacking team in the last two matches precisely because we weren't strong enough at the back to stop the other team scoring, I think we have to accept that having seen Romeu shore things up a lot on Saturday that we should just stick to defending like hell and picking up goals when we can, because we don't have the players to unlock sides going forward AND defend. Having said that, we're also not strong enough to do that defending (as the second half still showed), but hopefully that new CB will plug that gap.

 

It doesn't help when we're left with Yoshida against Lukaku and we can remember what happened with that in 2012/13, before Koeman was here.

 

Second half (which I know we lost 1-0) was much better and the 2 DM shield needs to remain our focus, as the 1 DM and 2 floating midfielders hasn't provided enough defensive capability either out wide or in front of the back 4.

[The9]

Cedric is absolutely good enough.

[Tommog]

Depends. If it's an argument about how much the club has spent, then it's perfectly fair to leave them out. They're not our players, full stop. If it's an argument about the short-term strength of the squad, then count them in, though, by the same token, take out Forster and Gardos.

 

My guess is the poster is referring to the first point as some kind of proxy of the club's ambition; and by that I don't think he means Trousers utter strawman horses**t about 'blank chequebooks' and 'buying success', though you'd have to ask him.

 

This.

 

Don't know why I am getting grief. Are we not allowed to suggest that maybe... just maybe Saints won't be able to pull off the recruitment feat we did last summer? Being a fan isn't just about banging your tambourine that the grand high leaders have got it right. To me debating and questioning things is what makes football fun.

 

My point is just that Saints spent 50 odd million last summer and that translated into 7th finish. So far this summer we have spent mid 20 million on transfers and (net spend of about -20 million) and look very frail in the positions we sold.

 

Regarding whether we leave JayRod in or out in the transfer balance sheet, I can accept he should be left in... but whether he will be anything like the player he was who knows, fingers crossed and also it wasnt the attack where we were weakened from last season.

 

All i am saying is to compete on the level we did last year I think we are lacking investment. One new CB still leaves us pretty off the pace form last years defence.

[John B]

TBF even if we had kept Morgan and Clyne finishing 7th for a second season in the row would be a big ask.

 

Yes quite right I totally agree

[The9]

Two Premier League games in and already the pants-wetting pussies are coming out of the woodwork. Why complain about players and tactics already after the most successful season since the early eighties? Some people need to look up the word 'perspective' in the dictionary.

 

If they're complaining about players who are worse than the ones that made the tactics work then it's valid. It's completely pointless because we're dealing with the parameters of success driven by our sustainability and a set of generally longer term successful processes rather than any kind of short-termist (eg single result) performance measure, but it's still valid.

 

The long view of what Saints have done and will continue to do is that we will sell players to make money to buy cheaper replacements, we'll use a defensive system which focuses on preventing conceding because it's cheaper to get players good at that, and we'll prioritise Europe because it gives us the ability to recruit better players. Sometimes in and around that process we get blips like not being able to sign our number one defensive target, and being left with a less strong team now and then, and that will affect the results - but it's all part of a calculated risk. Don't think the club hasn't already made decisions about what we're doing with playing loads of top 6 sides immediately after Europa League Group dates for instance...

 

We'll be alright with that model barring an outlying number of critically-timed injuries or suspensions, there's really no point in stressing about it.

[S-Clarke]

This.

 

Don't know why I am getting grief. Are we not allowed to suggest that maybe... just maybe Saints won't be able to pull off the recruitment feat we did last summer? Being a fan isn't just about banging your tambourine that the grand high leaders have got it right. To me debating and questioning things is what makes football fun.

 

My point is just that Saints spent 50 odd million last summer and that translated into 7th finish. So far this summer we have spent mid 20 million on transfers and (net spend of about -20 million) and look very frail in the positions we sold.

 

Regarding whether we leave JayRod in or out in the transfer balance sheet, I can accept he should be left in... but whether he will be anything like the player he was who knows, fingers crossed and also it wasnt the attack where we were weakened from last season.

 

All i am saying is to compete on the level we did last year I think we are lacking investment. One new CB still leaves us pretty off the pace form last years defence.

 

Last summer we lost Shaw - £32m, Lallana - £25m, Chambers - £16m, Lambert - £4m, Lovren - £20m. That's near on £90-100m coming into the club. The wage bill would have been significantly lowered as well, so we had a lot to play with.

 

This summer we lost Clyne, and in theory we'd only have seen £7-8m of that due to the sell on. And we lost Morgan for around £25m. That's a hell of a lot less than the £90m we pocketed last year, and anyone expecting levels of spending close to that again are slightly disconnected from reality.

 

People also have to take into account FFP. One area we need to work on is the commercial side, sponsorship's etc. And until we are higher up the rankings in those area's, then we're kind of restricted in what we can do. It's also worth noting that we'll still be paying the transfer fee's for some of the deals we did last summer, that sort of spending for a club of our size was insane and only allowed through what we sold.

[broncoboy]

Two Premier League games in and already the pants-wetting pussies are coming out of the woodwork. Why complain about players and tactics already after the most successful season since the early eighties? Some people need to look up the word 'perspective' in the dictionary.

 

Proud to be s pants wetting pussy

I worry when we are two goals up with ten minutes to go

Tadic is disappointing, Davis is inconsistent, Yoshida is okay but really not good enough to start every week, Long is just an average premiership player and Pelle needs a lot of chances to score

 

Lots of premiership teams have signed well over th summer.

[shurlock]

Last summer we lost Shaw - £32m, Lallana - £25m, Chambers - £16m, Lambert - £4m, Lovren - £20m. That's near on £90-100m coming into the club. The wage bill would have been significantly lowered as well, so we had a lot to play with.

 

This summer we lost Clyne, and in theory we'd only have seen £7-8m of that due to the sell on. And we lost Morgan for around £25m. That's a hell of a lot less than the £90m we pocketed last year, and anyone expecting levels of spending close to that again are slightly disconnected from reality.

 

People also have to take into account FFP. One area we need to work on is the commercial side, sponsorship's etc. And until we are higher up the rankings in those area's, then we're kind of restricted in what we can do. It's also worth noting that we'll still be paying the transfer fee's for some of the deals we did last summer, that sort of spending for a club of our size was insane and only allowed through what we sold.

 

FFP is a complete red herring - we weren't anywhere near its limits last summer; I suspect we'll be even further away from them this summer. We have one of the lowest player wage bills in the division. And please never mention paying for deals we did last summer without also mentioning the money we're still receiving for the players we sold. It's moronic.

Edited 17 August, 2015 by shurlock

[JonnyOldBoy]

I don't think its "hysteria" to point out that the first goal we conceded was pub league stuff... or that we clearly need a striker who can modestly put away 1-in-3 chances.... last season our run-in was dire attacking wise [ with the obvious single exception ] , and we had a defence that made that issue less of an issue. Now we have a serious problem to fix. Its not hysteria to point this out and discuss it. And its not "getting at the manager",, because to be honest he looked as surprised as anyone else who knows anything about football as to how the hell we allowed Everton almost the entire left 1/3 to themselves to counter attack in. Pelle and Mane were luxuries last season in the run-in. We can not afford luxuries now we have dismantled our defence. We need goal scorers.

[melmacian_saint]

We need patience, of course, and this season with more competitions it's not going to be incredibly easy.

 

I think it will be an excellent season if we manage to get into the top 10, and avoid the bottom 6.

 

The extent to which this is positive depends on our cup success.

Priority is the Europa League, where I think we should aim to be as close as possible to the Quarter Final draw. I also hope we can keep our travels small, to avoid a lot of tired legs. So far the draw has been very generous to us, but of course looking at the team list going forward there are a lot of awkward journeys.

 

Domestic Cups are nice but depends on the draws we get, as long as we avoid disappointing defeats like Sheffield United last year then we hopefully won't be at fault.

 

Main target is to avoid league troubles, but the magic is elsewhere this season.

[Sour Mash]

FFP is a complete red herring - we weren't anywhere near its limits last summer; I suspect we'll be even further away from them this summer. We have one of the lowest player wage bills in the division. And please never mention paying for deals we did last summer without also mentioning the money we're still receiving for the players we sold. It's moronic.

Agreed. There are fair questions to ask about our recruitment strategy this summer, no need to close off discussion by shouting "FFP" or "No Blank cheque books".

[Super_Uwe]

Terrible scoreline, and a bad day at the office all round it sounds. General fan reaction on social media was quite depressing really, some people completely over the top.

 

Will be interesting to see how the team reacts over the next few games. I still have every confidence we are going to do well this year and hopefully exceed what we achieved last year in terms of PL finish, but time will tell.

[hypochondriac]

Just listened to the post match interview from Ron. Have to say I'm very impressed how he always seems to nail exactly what went wrong. With previous managers it was as if I was watching a completely different game but Ron always says what the fans are thinking. I'm confident he will put it right.

[Sour Mash]

Second half (which I know we lost 1-0) was much better and the 2 DM shield needs to remain our focus, as the 1 DM and 2 floating midfielders hasn't provided enough defensive capability either out wide or in front of the back 4.

Its an interesting point - should we need two DM shields? Most teams should be able to survive with one good DM and one more forward looking CM?

[shurlock]

Its an interesting point - should we need two DM shields? Most teams should be able to survive with one good DM and one more forward looking CM?

 

Interesting that Neville and others have been slating Fabregas (who's hardly a gung-ho CM) for not doing enough defensively, even though Chelsea probably have the best DM in the league.

[ART]

Anyone making these financial claims mind telling me what they think happened to the 25 million we've had to write off the books on Osvaldo and Ramirez plus one or two other cancelled contracts.

 

This amount has been huge and we could never have done so without the money we've made selling players. Things are not so rosy as the current transfer purchases show. We really need a touch of reality on expectations for the season ahead. The only alternative will be doing a QPR, Hull City or Burnley with Koeman and Co doing a runner.

[Whitey Grandad]

I don't think its "hysteria" to point out that the first goal we conceded was pub league stuff... or that we clearly need a striker who can modestly put away 1-in-3 chances.... last season our run-in was dire attacking wise [ with the obvious single exception ] , and we had a defence that made that issue less of an issue. Now we have a serious problem to fix. Its not hysteria to point this out and discuss it. And its not "getting at the manager",, because to be honest he looked as surprised as anyone else who knows anything about football as to how the hell we allowed Everton almost the entire left 1/3 to themselves to counter attack in. Pelle and Mane were luxuries last season in the run-in. We can not afford luxuries now we have dismantled our defence. We need goal scorers.

 

Quite right. I have played in defence in enough pub leagues to recognise defending like that first goal. I am not normally very vocal but I was shouting 'to him' 'to him' 'to him' 'oh FFS'.Even the commentator on MOTD said that Kone 'might have been closed down a bit sooner'. There may well have been mitigating circumstances due to illnesses but our basic positioning and shape was wrong.

 

Still, it's only two games in and I'm sure Ron knows where the problems are.

[Sour Mash]

Interesting that Neville and others have been slating Fabregas (who's hardly a gung-ho CM) for not doing enough defensively, even though Chelsea probably have the best DM in the league.

True and the same criticism is made of Yaya Toure very often, but there is a difference between expecting a CM to be more defensively minded and actually setting up with two DMs who both have the primary role of being a shield for the back 4.

[Dangermouth]

For Everton's first goal Mane was back in the area and he got back quicker and deeper than VW so I think it's unfair of some to say he didn't track back or work hard.

 

Everton were competent, we were awful in the first half. It's not so much a case of lacking in physical presence as getting in the right positions to prevent the opposition doing anything with the ball. Everton did this better than we did, but I don't expect to see them tearing up trees this season even though a lot of teams look very poor defensively. As other people have said we do play very predictably at times in looking to use the wings and not playing an early ball through the lines and mixing it up (i.e. let Pelle just take players out of position and bypass him).

 

It seems that while Tadic is a good player he needs to learn to just 'get on with it' a bit as well as to cross with his right foot.

[The9]

Its an interesting point - should we need two DM shields? Most teams should be able to survive with one good DM and one more forward looking CM?

 

We need 2 DMs when we have a weaker back 4, in order to protect them. When we have a full strength back 4 (I mean 2014 full strength as opposed to Cedric/Clyne, Targett/Bertrand and Yoshida/PleaseSomeone) we can usually get away with the 1 DM at home to bottom half sides. At the moment we don't have that luxury.

Edited 17 August, 2015 by The9

[The9]

Quite right. I have played in defence in enough pub leagues to recognise defending like that first goal. I am not normally very vocal but I was shouting 'to him' 'to him' 'to him' 'oh FFS'.Even the commentator on MOTD said that Kone 'might have been closed down a bit sooner'. There may well have been mitigating circumstances due to illnesses but our basic positioning and shape was wrong.

 

Still, it's only two games in and I'm sure Ron knows where the problems are.

 

For most of last season that ball wouldn't have got within 10 yards of the area to begin with.

[Wade Garrett]

I don't think its "hysteria" to point out that the first goal we conceded was pub league stuff... or that we clearly need a striker who can modestly put away 1-in-3 chances.... last season our run-in was dire attacking wise [ with the obvious single exception ] , and we had a defence that made that issue less of an issue. Now we have a serious problem to fix. Its not hysteria to point this out and discuss it. And its not "getting at the manager",, because to be honest he looked as surprised as anyone else who knows anything about football as to how the hell we allowed Everton almost the entire left 1/3 to themselves to counter attack in. Pelle and Mane were luxuries last season in the run-in. We can not afford luxuries now we have dismantled our defence. We need goal scorers.

 

Spot on about the attack. Pelle wastes loads of decent chances. Which is why I keep banging on about Charlie Austin. Works harder and is a better finisher, and he's available.

[SaintZamboni]

Spot on about the attack. Pelle wastes loads of decent chances. Which is why I keep banging on about Charlie Austin. Works harder and is a better finisher, and he's available.

 

For 15m, which evidently isn't our priority at the moment