verlaine1979 Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 My understanding is that KL has never drawn money out of SFC. In fact she has bankrolled the training centre and paid back the (un-sanctioned) Vibrac loan. I thought not. The only instance where I could remember direct involvement from her with our finances was the conversion of another round of debt into equity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 Fonte's not going anywhere next year IMHO. He'll turn into a Kelvin Davis type character and stay on at the club. I can't say that I've seen much of Fonte being in demand by a top 4 club to be honest. Pelle will stay at the club while Koeman is here, i.e. the end of the 2016/17 season by then it's likely that we'd be happy to let him go. It's obvious that the Liverpool move was wrong for Lambert so why would Pelle want to do the same thing. I agree with the opinion that Wanyama and Mane will be next seasons departures, in the same way it was obvious that Schneiderlein, Clyne and Alderweireld were going to this year. Well, Schneiderlin and Clyne... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 Sounds pretty accurate to me If you mean what's accurate is that it's idiocy, I agree with you. Other than that, read the accounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suhari Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 Another thread where posters think that the owner is seeking to extract cash from the business..... The general concensus on Markus Liebherr's wealth was that he was worth circa €2.5bn - I have it on decent authority that our secretive Swiss based saviour was worth significantly MORE than that figure, but that matters not as we don't know how his estate was distributed and what share, KL, the benefactor of SFC got. My understanding is that KL has never drawn money out of SFC. In fact she has bankrolled the training centre and paid back the (un-sanctioned) Vibrac loan. There is a huge difference between running a sustainable business and asset stripping, you would have thought that last summer would have taught that lesson. If we sell players it is because it is good business, not because we have to. Top post. Where's the "Like" button? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 (edited) And to be fair, it's the only way a club like ourselves can compete. We have to be clever and buy potential or take a gamble on a 'big name' who hasn't quite made it, we can't buy the finished product. Although we can make the finished product for other clubs it seems. But I still surprises me how people don't understand this. They seem to assume that because our billionaire's family are rich, that we can keep all our players and buy lots of expensive players. That's never going to be the case. The policy we deploy will have peaks and troughs, but it's what gives us the best chance to compete, whilst not totally screwing ourselves financially. I'll await the ''Well, Nicola didn't have that thought!!'' - well no, he didn't. He also assumed that because our billionaire's family are rich, that he can go out their and splash stupid money around. I know you know this, but even if we did want to do it, we couldn't under FFP without finding a load of ways to self-fund via sponsorships anyway. Cortese's biggest mistake was assuming that he'd be able to carry on his interpretation of Markus' legacy when the process of executing the will was complete and there was an heir with the nous to take control for herself. And presumably another error in telling all the players he could guarantee them things he couldn't, giving them ambition without any way for the club to match it. He also failed to even give us a squad capable of challenging for what he wanted to achieve. I have no problem at all with us being sustainable, nor in identifying that all the money is going into the players' pockets and nowhere else. I was annoyed when an academy kid's parents told me they'd had Shaw's agent around for dinner and that he'd said the club was seen as a stepping stone by everyone in football and the club was fine with developing players to sell on. This was summer 2014, when it looked like we were so close to cracking it. It soon became evident what the impact of that was - more in the Chambers transfer than any of the others. We plan on being the best of the rest - which will get more difficult when others in the 6-11th group have more money to make up for their inefficiencies from next season. Edited 22 August, 2015 by The9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 Yes but not enough for some deluded fans who seem to think she should be pouring every penny she owns into marquee signings for regular CL football (despite FFP)................ Don't forget they also choose to ignore that those marquee players (even the free transfers) also get paid massive wages, I think they assume wages come from some magic money tree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainchris Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 Trouble is, for all this stuff about 'we don't want players to leave' and 'we should force them to stay' and whatnot, we actually...erm...shouldn't want to do that. You want to be a good stepping-stone option for up-and-coming players. If we sell Mane for £25Mn for instance, we'll have essentially been paid £15Mn to have him play for us for a season. Whilst it might hurt your pride when they leave you don't want to stop that from happening. You seem to think that 100m in the bank no decent players is a good position to be in!!!!! We let me tell you that it's about the players we have in that team that wins games... Money on the bank or sub standard replacements mean Jack S- - t... We need to sing players on 7 year deals and bonus based wages... Put Wanyama in the reserves and forget him - let everyone know we are serious about not letting any player go on their terms... This whole thing is now farcical.... We need to draw a line in the sand now - no one leaves and if you say anything about wanting to leave you lose your bonuses which equal half your wages... We are not here to service Individuals selfish ambitions we are here for the Southampton fans who now deserve and expect loyalty.... Clubs like ours have to wrestle control back from greedy disloyal players.... Football is becoming a circus full of sickening greed and self obsessed morons. I am surely not alone in losing interest in this money polluted charade... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 Getting abit worrying ain't it guys, dreading tomorrow more n more by the min Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint-Armstrong Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 Noah Liebherr rearing his head again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 This story really isn't anything which we didn't ready know. Of course Wanyama would like to move to a bigger club and get more money if the opportunity arises and he's never going to re-sign. No point people getting upset about it just because it's written down. No surprises here at all. Just hope he gets his head down and plays well this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 22 August, 2015 Share Posted 22 August, 2015 This story really isn't anything which we didn't ready know. Of course Wanyama would like to move to a bigger club and get more money if the opportunity arises and he's never going to re-sign. No point people getting upset about it just because it's written down. No surprises here at all. Just hope he gets his head down and plays well this season. If he can repeat Morgan's form from last year then we should be in a reasonable position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 If he can repeat Morgan's form from last year then we should be in a reasonable position. He's a different player to Morgan but if he has another good season then we could be. If we get 3 years out of a player like Wanyama and make a bit of money then job done. It's the constant need to replace many players from many positions which is the big challange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cambsaint Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Saints would have to have a death wish to sell anybody this transfer window. I wouldn't be surprised to see Mane go to Man U next year if still wanted, and it all to be quietly agreed. Only a fool would sell this transfer window as no time to make replacements, and we cannot cope with any more upset this window. It is a moot point whether Wanyama will look as good without Schneiderlin at his side, but we'll see next window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 You seem to think that 100m in the bank no decent players is a good position to be in!!!!! We let me tell you that it's about the players we have in that team that wins games... Money on the bank or sub standard replacements mean Jack S- - t... We need to sing players on 7 year deals and bonus based wages... Put Wanyama in the reserves and forget him - let everyone know we are serious about not letting any player go on their terms... This whole thing is now farcical.... We need to draw a line in the sand now - no one leaves and if you say anything about wanting to leave you lose your bonuses which equal half your wages... We are not here to service Individuals selfish ambitions we are here for the Southampton fans who now deserve and expect loyalty.... Clubs like ours have to wrestle control back from greedy disloyal players.... Football is becoming a circus full of sickening greed and self obsessed morons. I am surely not alone in losing interest in this money polluted charade... You are an idiot. This is not Football Manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutch fan Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 After losing the three best players (Clyne, Schneiderlin and Toby) I think it would even be dangerous to sell Wanyama and/or Mané as well. With the huge tv deals the BPL is getting more and more competitive, and it's a thin line now between a top ten finish and fighting for relegation. I think Saints should follow Everton's example, and hold on to players more firmly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Les and Ronald have said NO ONE from the 1st team will be sold this window good enough for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 I hope she has taken money out, whether as a loan repayment or as a dividend. ..which would be a perfectly reasonable action and quite legal, but then again some fans would call it ..." asset-stripping " wouldn't they ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 When will it end eh. Not aimed at you the9, Is our grand scheme to continue on this path making big money off our players and hoping to replace this and repeat while maintaining a 6 to 10 ish league position And after X amount of years accumulated enough resource to become an elite club? We're not going to become an elite club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Tony Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Until we decide to take a massive gamble and splash the cash like Man City (which is unlikely) to buy our way into the top 4 then this is how it's going to be. Their summer business has been ridiculous, they don't even seem concerned by transfer fees. I think some of us expect it. Just because the Liebherr estate is worth millions or billions, Kat is not obliged to pump it all into the club. It seems to be getting to a point where things go quiet so the media decide to pick on us. It will be interesting to see how Wanyama and Mane play should they be picked. The transfer window deadline really does need to be moved. Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 What are our running costs if we have to sell so much so often given the TV money and all that We don't "have to sell" for running costs. Which bit of Victor Wanyama saying he wants to leave have you not understood? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 lets be honest, for saints to even consider selling him now, with 2 years left on his contract, it would have to be at the very very least £20m..at least. Spurs would not pay that for Vic. He is very important for us but right now, do not think he is quite good enough for Spurs at that price. also, saying no, what will vic do? play shyte? when he is shyte he really is shyte. Having a poor/average season, he can kiss goodbye to a move to spurs or anyone else above them Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 At what stage does transfer media conduct become tapping up/subject to libel law? I'm not saying Saints are innocent of it, but I'm absolutely fed up with clubs making up any old story to unsettle a player. If this happened in many industries, there'd be fines/legal challenges. This is irrespective of whether Wanyama wants to go or not The man who has so many taps to his name they call him Ronald "The Plumber" Koeman would be in a world of pain if they started clamping down on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 The man who has so many taps to his name they call him Ronald "The Plumber" Koeman would be in a world of pain if they started clamping down on it. koeman has no issue talking about other players we want to the press. OK when we do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 We need to sing players on 7 year deals and bonus based wages.... ........unless we start to employ opera singers - probably not, but at current rates say - £40 K a week - a 7 year deal would cost us £14 million per player + taxes the maths is easy after that ......anyone on 80K would cost the club £28 million ...now consider an " average fee " at MU is already around 100K /week. How many of those would you expect to have?.....History shows that buying "super stars" for huge fees, and then having to pay them enormous salaries is ridiculous. Fernanado Torres move to Chelsea and Andy's Carroll's move Liverpool were a total catastrophe for both players and their new clubs. Deals like that can bankrupt a club - look at Leeds and Pompey's history .....Saints are wise to look for developing talent, if they want to stay - fine, otherwise the "selling on" of good players has always been part of football, and clubs do it all the time. Shaw and Mata to Man U.... and Sterling to Man City. are typical examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 (edited) At what stage does transfer media conduct become tapping up/subject to libel law? I'm not saying Saints are innocent of it, but I'm absolutely fed up with clubs making up any old story to unsettle a player. If this happened in many industries, there'd be fines/legal challenges. agree totally. It's part of the background to the work of agents to get the best deal for their clients, but much of this is just plain "disinformation" to the Press and for players with a two digit IQ, (I'm not putting Wanyama in this category, btw ).. an unscrupulous agent may dangle the prospect of a bigger salary to the player who won't consider that a new clubs formation may not suit his playing style, and his career prospects worsen). Plenty of examples in the "Big Four" clubs. Very few of last summer's departing Saints' had a good season at their new clubs... merely a bigger bank balance. I'm sure many would prefer to play every week. Rumour storylines like these only go to upset the harmony in the dressing rooms and the Boardrooms of many clubs. Edited 23 August, 2015 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 You seem to think that 100m in the bank no decent players is a good position to be in!!!!! We let me tell you that it's about the players we have in that team that wins games... Money on the bank or sub standard replacements mean Jack S- - t... We need to sing players on 7 year deals and bonus based wages... Put Wanyama in the reserves and forget him - let everyone know we are serious about not letting any player go on their terms... This whole thing is now farcical.... We need to draw a line in the sand now - no one leaves and if you say anything about wanting to leave you lose your bonuses which equal half your wages... We are not here to service Individuals selfish ambitions we are here for the Southampton fans who now deserve and expect loyalty.... Clubs like ours have to wrestle control back from greedy disloyal players.... Football is becoming a circus full of sickening greed and self obsessed morons. I am surely not alone in losing interest in this money polluted charade... Bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasoneuelllfanclub Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Not sure why Wanyama would want to go to Spurs given Poch actually suffocated his progression at Saints. He couldnt pass water in his first season. Much better player since Koeman took charge imo. Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Not sure why Wanyama would want to go to Spurs given Poch actually suffocated his progression at Saints. He couldnt pass water in his first season. Much better player since Koeman took charge imo. Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk Well he's regressed to that first-season Wanyama so far this term. Suggests to me his head is somewhere else ala Lovren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodgey Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 That does swing both ways - yes you can get a bit more money from transfer fees, but it won't stop players going. It will however make it impossible to get rid of high salary poor performers. Imagine how much more we would have had to pay off Osvaldo and Mayuka - and have another 3 years of finding loan deals for Ramirez etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manji Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Les and Ronald have said NO ONE from the 1st team will be sold this window good enough for me Totally agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilchards Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 I suppose one way to keep most players at our club happy is pay them what they can earn elsewhere. I'm afraid that will never happen, the greedy ones will continue to leave by saying the usual dribble like 'I want to win trophies blah blah.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 I suppose one way to keep most players at our club happy is pay them what they can earn elsewhere. I'm afraid that will never happen, the greedy ones will continue to leave by saying the usual dribble like 'I want to win trophies blah blah.' just say no. you may lose 1 or 2 but not 8 or 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 just say no. you may lose 1 or 2 but not 8 or 9 Cats out the bag on that one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whelk Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Just too many clubs with too much money. Even Utd are struggling to identify players to sign. Never liked Wanyama's character after his Swansea celebration. It's my coping mechanism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whelk Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 And the only positive if he did go ( he won't) is that stupid Mignolet/Benteke copied song will go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 I suppose one way to keep most players at our club happy is pay them what they can earn elsewhere. Brilliant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilchards Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Brilliant. And I'm afraid that's not going to happen (why don't you read all of it) Cyber Bully Fry with his usual cowards act again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Durman Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Wanyama is very happy at Southampton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whelk Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Obviously we are all cynical about media but Darren Lewis is the most openly Spurs stooge. He must be on a retainer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Billy Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Another thread where posters think that the owner is seeking to extract cash from the business..... The general concensus on Markus Liebherr's wealth was that he was worth circa €2.5bn - I have it on decent authority that our secretive Swiss based saviour was worth significantly MORE than that figure, but that matters not as we don't know how his estate was distributed and what share, KL, the benefactor of SFC got. My understanding is that KL has never drawn money out of SFC. In fact she has bankrolled the training centre and paid back the (un-sanctioned) Vibrac loan. There is a huge difference between running a sustainable business and asset stripping, you would have thought that last summer would have taught that lesson. If we sell players it is because it is good business, not because we have to. Is it good business to sell your better players and replace them with lesser quality saving a few quid? For me that is playing with fire and putting us at risk of dropping out of the most lucrative of leagues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Bateman Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Wanyama is very happy at Southampton. How do you know? You seem to know what a few of the players think, are you close? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Wanyama is very happy at Southampton. Source? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 This story really isn't anything which we didn't ready know. Of course Wanyama would like to move to a bigger club and get more money if the opportunity arises and he's never going to re-sign. No point people getting upset about it just because it's written down. No surprises here at all. Just hope he gets his head down and plays well this season. Exactly he was dropping massive come and get me hints to Arsenal even when we were doing well last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 And I'm afraid that's not going to happen (why don't you read all of it) Cyber Bully Fry with his usual cowards act again. The fact that you are "afraid" we are not going to start paying wages on a par with Manchester United is what I think is particularly brilliant. Well done on saying it not once but twice within two posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrensup Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 We don't "have to sell" for running costs. Which bit of Victor Wanyama saying he wants to leave have you not understood? Who the duck do you think you are? Do you talk like this to people in real life too? Some how I very much doubt it. You're the one misunderstood, where did I mention the sale of Wanyama? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Is it good business to sell your better players and replace them with lesser quality saving a few quid? For me that is playing with fire and putting us at risk of dropping out of the most lucrative of leagues. What? so you think we should sell a player like Morgan or Clyne and buy someone better than that costs more or do you think the club can afford to hold all players to their contracts and then let them walk on frees? How many players do you think would sign for us if they thought we would force them to see out a 4-5 year contract? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 What? so you think we should sell a player like Morgan or Clyne and buy someone better than that costs more or do you think the club can afford to hold all players to their contracts and then let them walk on frees? How many players do you think would sign for us if they thought we would force them to see out a 4-5 year contract? i think the obvious point is not to sell so many over a very short period of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 Who the duck do you think you are? Do you talk like this to people in real life too? Some how I very much doubt it. You're the one misunderstood, where did I mention the sale of Wanyama? This is a thread about the sale of Victor Wanyama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 i think the obvious point is not to sell so many over a very short period of time. Do you think you could everton giverton us some goodison suggestivertons of clubs that haverton followed this policy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 23 August, 2015 Share Posted 23 August, 2015 (edited) i think the obvious point is not to sell so many over a very short period of time. We've sold two this summer and bought in something like five so what's the problem? If you want to count last summer keeping four players, who basically had threatened to strike, would have killed our teams morale and done more harm than good plus as we actually had our best finish ever I'm not sure how last summer can be used for an excuse for anything happening now. In fact if anything it proves it's not how many players you sell but who. Selling Morgan this summer will have more impact than all the players we lost last summer. Edited 23 August, 2015 by doddisalegend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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