shurlock Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Still too much tinkering by Koeman. Two DMs have been the backbone of our success; the combination of Vic+Davis+JWP has worked largely in particular circumstances and/or against powderpuff outfits. As soon as we went 2up and our midfield showed itself neither capable of controlling possession nor of screening the defense, we should have switched to two DMs. Not only did we not do that; we threw on Clasie who at the moment resembles a lighter weight version of JWP and Davis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainchris Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 I hope it was just S. Davis was just knackered for the international break, because the tide turned when he went out. Terrible strategic move. And the JRod substitution for Tadic made absolutely NO sense. Romeu was the choice there for JWP. What JRod has to offer was not what we were needing. Very good points .... Koeman does struggle tactically when things are not going well. Also struggles with the right subs to correct the areas that need changing....Both areas are linked in as much as RK does not read the issues all that well on days when we are not in control. Same mistakes today as per the Man U game too deep and stopped pressing - very simple but RK doesn't pick up on the game's specifics and doesn't get the messages on the pitch to change the way we play when required ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint86 Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Kelvin awful. Should have been Romou not Clasie, who doesn't impress me Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk And there you have it ladies and gentlemen of saintsweb... It took 30minutes of premier league football for a player who has been out for months and half of pre season to be deemed not good enough. The forum has spoken. I do however agree that romeu should have come on as we needed to tighten up. The ref was a 12th man for them today as well. Utter disgrace in terms of bias. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donatello Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Davis is 3rd choice This was being toted around pre kick-off, and I didn't comment at the time. Technically, he's third choice (he should be 'forth' behind Gazza, imo), yes, but in the context of the argument it's somewhat remiss. The context being that Forster is unavailable for the season. No, the club went into the season knowing that it's Stek-Davis-Gazza. And I'm fine with that, because we're in the unusual position of having our long-term no.1 GK injured, and I wouldn't expect the club to have 5 senior keepers on the books. However, next season, I'd like to seem some progression there, i.e. Stek (or similar) staying in conjuction with Forster returning, and Davis retiring from playing duties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toomer Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 In the grand scheme of things 4 points in one home and away game is not a bad result, we got 3 at Chelsea that we didn't expect and 1 at home today. We were poor for 75% of the game IMO Tadic was at fault for their first for a half hearted challenge but being 2 up at half time we should have gone on to win the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Poor allround but both goals, if you go back 30 seconds, come from awful kicks from Davis and from the first minute he made the defence nervous and basically couldn't kick the ball beyond the halfway line all game. With Stekelenburg in goal we would win that game. Still utterly amazes me that in four years we havent sorted the 2nd keeper issue and have probably the worst backup in the whole league. If Gazzaniga isn't a better keeper than a 39 yo Davis then he shouldn't have been given a new contract. Cruel to watch a great servant being asked to play at a level he doesn't have within him but its been a weak area for ages. Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Sat at the train station we were the better side first half totally in control. Second half we were a fecking shambles. Lots of people will complain about Davis being in goal but it was our midfield were we where let down today. JWP was shocking lost the ball so many times, Victor couldn't string two passes together, not the game to chuck on Jordy looked lost. Mane looked out of sorts, pelle's hold up play was non existent and Tadic disappeared in the second half. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Still too much tinkering by Koeman. Two DMs have been the backbone of our success; the combination of Vic+Davis+JWP has worked largely in particular circumstances and/or against powderpuff outfits. As soon as we went 2up and our midfield showed itself neither capable of controlling possession nor of screening the defense, we should have switched to two DMs. Not only did we not do that; we threw on Clasie who at the moment resembles a lighter weight version of JWP and Davis. Agree. JWP good at the coached closing down of a player but just doesn't win the ball when its crucially needed. With Wanyama one foul away from a red the other two needed to put themselves about and couldn't do it. Will be interesting to see how we use Clasie, obviously good technique, but the PL requires a certain physicality which is why JWP struggles to influence a game. Not sure he and Clasie can play together and certainly need to watch that Wanyama and Romeu aren't suspended at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Sat at the train station we were the better side first half totally in control. Second half we were a fecking shambles. Lots of people will complain about Davis being in goal but it was our midfield were we where let down today. JWP was shocking lost the ball so many times, Victor couldn't string two passes together, not the game to chuck on Jordy looked lost. Mane looked out of sorts, pelle's hold up play was non existent and Tadic disappeared in the second half. . Your third paragraph is mostly down to the second. Plus the goal kicks to Pelle were just awful (if they reached that far). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGTL Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 It was a poor kick from Davis for their second but nether centre half went with Vardy. Both attracted to the ball and left him to get in behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Agree. JWP good at the coached closing down of a player but just doesn't win the ball when its crucially needed. With Wanyama one foul away from a red the other two needed to put themselves about and couldn't do it. Will be interesting to see how we use Clasie, obviously good technique, but the PL requires a certain physicality which is why JWP struggles to influence a game. Not sure he and Clasie can play together and certainly need to watch that Wanyama and Romeu aren't suspended at the same time. Clasie did manage a couple of really good passes that opened up (an all to rare attacking opportunity) if we can get him doing that on a regularly basis with the likes of Mane and Jrod he could be very effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 It was a poor kick from Davis for their second but nether centre half went with Vardy. Both attracted to the ball and left him to get in behind. Plus Yoshi played him onside. It was poor all round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Your third paragraph is mostly down to the second. Plus the goal kicks to Pelle were just awful (if they reached that far). But the midfield players should have adjusted to the free kicks to compete for the ball the foxes midfield was allowed the freedom of sms to bring the ball down and play it in the second half Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancouver Saint Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 We all watched the same game then. Credit to Leicester - best team performance in the second half I've watched against us by far. Substitutions changed the game...Mahrez (why not on from the start?) and Dyer for them, Clasie (wrong game to start him) Yoshida (out of position out of form) and Rodriguez (didn't need shoot on sight needed hold-up outlet)...5-0 on subs to them. We were as bad second half as we were good second half against Chelsea. Game was screaming for Romeu. Bit of grit to break their forward momentum up and some defensive solidity and good distribution. We can all see it - why couldn't RK? I don't get it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSaint Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 It's ironic that many of the comments on here are exactly what we used to read on other teams' forums after we'd out-worked them under Pochettino - "we were dire, subs were dreadful, x, y and z should never play again, the ref was biased" and so on. And that used to p*ss us off because we were never given any credit. So my first thought is to give Leicester the credit they deserve for a tremendous second half performance. They truly were excellent all across the pitch, and they will do this to many more teams this season. My second thought is that we might be worryingly short on the fitness front - we couldn't track their runners, we couldn't match their off-ball movement, and we spent most of the second half chasing shadows and losing ground to them. Sure, there were some individual errors but that wasn't the reason we ended up being lucky to get a point. We won't come up against a Leicester every week, but I think that we might need to improve our fitness levels if we're to reach this team's undoubted potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Give it to Ron Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Can someone explain why we gave Gazza a 4 year contract then play a 39 year old that hasn't played in months? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Leicester fully deserved a win on that second half performance we were a shambles 100% agree! We were battered and if it had been a boxing match, we would have taken a count of 8, several times. Leicester were very impressive after the break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Christ, anyone would think we had lost! We weren't world beaters when we ripped Chelsea apart and we arent the worst team in the league now we have drawn with Leicester. They are not a bad side and we are still climbing up the table. Man up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Tony Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Bit disappointing in the end, but Leicester are a decent side. It's quite obvious we are going to be a mid-table side this season so I'm not going to get too disheartened by the result. We will win pleny enough league games, but all our focus has to be in the cups. Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cat Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Weird game and a number of reasons we didn't win. There was Davis awful performance Koeman's weird subs and Mane not scoring after he's rounded the keeper at 2-0 or squaring it to Rodriguez at 2-1 to leave him a tap in. Annoying to give up a 2 goal lead, especially at home and after such a good win in the last game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingsland Red Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 One disaster waiting to happen on the pitch is poor team selection, two is poor management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 One disaster waiting to happen on the pitch is poor team selection, two is poor management. Koeman cannot do much about the GK, but someone at the Club has decided KD and Gazza are PL quality when everyone can see both are liabilities and have consistently demonstrated that for 3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Christ, anyone would think we had lost! We weren't world beaters when we ripped Chelsea apart and we arent the worst team in the league now we have drawn with Leicester. They are not a bad side and we are still climbing up the table. Man up! Nobody's saying that. Next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Nobody's saying that. Next. Would love to know what he thinks he is reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 To have a Goalkeeper like Davis anywhere near our team when we are supposed to be a top half side is embarrassing. Been an issue for ages, having him in goal made the crowd and defence nervous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Would love to know what he thinks he is reading. I am reading a load of tosh from the same old people who post tosh when we don't win a football match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Nobody's saying that. Next. Did I say anyone said that? If you bothered to engage your brain for a minute you might understand the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Weird game and a number of reasons we didn't win. There was Davis awful performance Koeman's weird subs and Mane not scoring after he's rounded the keeper at 2-0 or squaring it to Rodriguez at 2-1 to leave him a tap in. Annoying to give up a 2 goal lead, especially at home and after such a good win in the last game. That for me was the turning point Leicester came out and bossed us second half but if Mane puts that ball in an open goal I think it would have taken the wind out of them and we would have won comfortably instead after that we just deflated as a team and just let them come at us time and again until the pressure told. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 It's all been said by everybody above. Kelvin the class an should only ever be a desperation choice. Thanks, but now it's time to move on. The substitution s changed the game, I can't imagine the thinking behind them. Clasie is going to take time to get up to the pace, not his fault but not the time to play him. J-Rod is some way behind the player he used to be. Mané made the wrong decision every time he could. He was behind their defence twice and either dithered or tried the spectacular from the half way line. Why couldn't we just close the game out? Leicester just wanted it more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwsaint Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Stek has a back injury. Hope he is back next week. All of the starting outfield players have been on international duty this week. Mane was knackered by 60 mins. KD has been fantastic for us, but I really don't want to see him again. His distribution was terrible and has cost us 2 points. Must get backup in January Leicesters team spirit was excellent. Vardy is not the most gifted of players, but he just never gives up. 2-2 was just about right on the performance, even though it feels like a loss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWD Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Leicester were brilliant in the second half so fair play, they deserved something out of the game. Probably deserved to win considering our second was offside. The game would have been completely different if Mané scores to make it 3-0. Very tight margins in this league though, so overall a decent point against a form team. Kelvin, however, is passed it. I love him, and he's a legend, but he was woeful today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 When was the last time we were as dominated in a 2nd half as that? People may blame Davis, but the fact we couldn't string two passes together in midfield for 45mins is surely more of a concern? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncanRG Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 It was a poor kick from Davis for their second but nether centre half went with Vardy. Both attracted to the ball and left him to get in behind. Yup. We were mentally weak today - what struck me when Mane missed the attempted lob was that our heads dropped. 2-0 up at home and our heads dropped! We let Leicester come at us, let them build up the head of steam they've shown in every game this season and didn't show any authority on the ball. Plus point for me was Ward-Prowse standing up to players who would have brushed him aside in previous seasons. He's clearly been working on his physical strength because he was getting stuck in - at least in our better periods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Love how people are trying to lay the whole thing a Kelvins door he did alright made a couple of saves. Yes his kicking was **** but he trains with the team every week the outfield players should be ready for that and adjust their game accordingly. This game was ****ed up (almost wrote lost there ) in midfield not by our back up keeper but our midfield who were out muscled, second to every ball second half and just seem to sit off the Leicester players inviting them to attack. Actually I should mention Bertrand to. Poor game from him today. I have got used to him being very good week in week out but he was slow, ponderous getting forward and poor defending today the yellow card he picked us was just stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simo Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Im not overly bothered by our second half performance most of our team have given a lot during the internationals I fully expect us to beat Liverpool next week ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Did I say anyone said that? If you bothered to engage your brain for a minute you might understand the point. Likewise, pal. If you read the posts in the immediate context of surrendering a 2-0 lead, conceding in injury time and a goalkeeper situation that, almost everyone universally agrees, has been an issue for too long, you might understand the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 When was the last time we were as dominated in a 2nd half as that? People may blame Davis, but the fact we couldn't string two passes together in midfield for 45mins is surely more of a concern? Probably Man Utd home game this season. They absolutely bossed us for at least 30mins of the second half. We were struggling to play out well from the back and when Davis went long it wasn't reaching past halfway, or at a height/trajectory that gave Pelle a chance so it kept coming back. Wanyama couldnt make another foul, Clasie was off the pace, JWP we know is useless at ball-winning (how did he stay on for the full 90?!) and Leicester built up a lot of momentum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 That for me was the turning point Leicester came out and bossed us second half but if Mane puts that ball in an open goal I think it would have taken the wind out of them and we would have won comfortably instead after that we just deflated as a team and just let them come at us time and again until the pressure told. Which open goal did he miss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 (edited) When was the last time we were as dominated in a 2nd half as that? People may blame Davis, but the fact we couldn't string two passes together in midfield for 45mins is surely more of a concern? yep though it is easier to focus on the back up keeper. Kelvin was in goal the first half and were in total control second half was down to our outfield players. Edited 17 October, 2015 by doddisalegend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Which open goal did he miss? From were I was sitting (admittedly in the Itchen North) he had gone around their keeper in the second half and the goal was wide open all he to do was shoot. Might change my mind if I see it from some different angles later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancouver Saint Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Agree - we lost it in the midfield second half. Always nervous with KD in (and Yoshida frankly)...but it was certainly not all KD's fault we were so bad second half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Interesting from the BBC write up Southampton should have had the game out of sight, with Sadio Mane delaying after rounding goalkeeper Kasper Schmeichel when 2-0 up, but the hosts tired as the match wore on with all 10 of their starting outfield players involved in international duty in the past week. Not looking for excuses, because the second half was poor, but that last line is certainly interesting (though no doubt Leicester had plenty of players on international duty to) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 From were I was sitting (admittedly in the Itchen North) he had gone around their keeper in the second half and the goal was wide open all he to do was shoot. Might change my mind if I see it from some different angles later. That's how I saw it, I'd be interested to see it later. Instead of just lobbing the ball towards goal he tried one touch too many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 4 points from Chelsea away and Leicester at home Take that any day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Interesting from the BBC write up Southampton should have had the game out of sight, with Sadio Mane delaying after rounding goalkeeper Kasper Schmeichel when 2-0 up, but the hosts tired as the match wore on with all 10 of their starting outfield players involved in international duty in the past week. Not looking for excuses, because the second half was poor, but that last line is certainly interesting (though no doubt Leicester had plenty of players on international duty to) That seemed to be the case. We just weren't getting to the ball quickly enough and kept giving away silly fouls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colehillsaint Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 That's how I saw it, I'd be interested to see it later. Instead of just lobbing the ball towards goal he tried one touch too many. From the chapel it just looked as though he needed time to re-adjust his balance before he could have got anything on it at all. Just one of those things. Would like to see it again properly though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corky morris Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Interesting from the BBC write up Southampton should have had the game out of sight, with Sadio Mane delaying after rounding goalkeeper Kasper Schmeichel when 2-0 up, but the hosts tired as the match wore on with all 10 of their starting outfield players involved in international duty in the past week. Not looking for excuses, because the second half was poor, but that last line is certainly interesting (though no doubt Leicester had plenty of players on international duty to) God forbid anyone criticise Mane. He scores that & makes it 3-0, we don't lose or draw the game. Same old scapegoats............... Koeman has to take some responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 (edited) Given a two goal start we shouldn't have lost that. Leicester might have pressed us pressured our midfield but we contributed royally to our loss. Leicester pushed up and compressed us in the middle. What did we do, spent the whole game dropping the ball in short and being outmuscled and losing the ball almost immediately. Van Dyjk's sloppy pass leading to the first goal was just one of many. Huth and Morgan are pedestrian bruisers, Davis spent most of the game hitting his goal kicks at them. Pelle as he did against Swansea should have pulled off towards the touchlines and Davis should have tried to put the ball beyond him. We have to change the way we play to counter the likes of Leicester. Time and time again we played short and sloppy and ran up against a brick wall. I don't like it but for this team the way we played should have been to turn them and put the ball into the space behind their full backs not play short but force them to run back. Our defenders should have gone route one instead we played into their hands. Kelvin Davis was like a rabbit in the headlights looking to play short for him is a nonsense and invariably caused us problems. He should have been looking to miss out Morgan and Huth not drop it into Pelle in the centre of the field. A self inflicted result. It's all very well being a great guy but it's a goalkeeper we need. He hasn't been good enough for years. Edited 17 October, 2015 by derry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 (edited) Davis isnt capable of kicking to those instructions, but good ideas. From reading some of the comments here it would seem Mane missed an open goal. It was nowhere near as clear cut as many think, they defended the situation fairly well I think and crowded him out. The ahot would have been from 25 yards at least so he needed to regain balance. Schmeichel did well by coming out as quickly as he did. Edited 17 October, 2015 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redder freak Posted 17 October, 2015 Share Posted 17 October, 2015 Thankfully Leicester's finishing was as bad as ours otherwise they would have won the match. Up to 8th ahead of Everton! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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