Tonda Eckert

[revolution saint]

23 minutes ago, EssEffCee said:

I don't see why anyone gives a shit whether we're liked by other clubs or not?

I literally couldn't care less. Leave that noddyness to the skates.

Yeah, there's loads to be annoyed about over this whole thing but the opinion of other fans or a vapid media circus made up of opinions for hire journalists and bad YouTube muppets is the least of my concerns.  

[Saint Marky]

That’s enough for me now, I’m done with this fucking shambles of a club. Anyone know when the season tickets go on sale?

[saintant]

2 hours ago, Sheaf Saint said:

As anyone who has ever worked in management will know, you can't just give someone their marching orders on the spot. The usual process would be to suspend them, pending a disciplinary hearing where they have a right to be accompanied (by a union rep, for example).

Having said that, wasn't he only on a short term contract until the end of this season anyway?

I'm pretty sure you can sack someone on the spot for gross misconduct. Of course they'll have a right to appeal.

[woodsaint1]

40 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

How can you say that? Sadly I think this is the view the people at the club are taking too, and it's wrong.

The club are bound by all EFL rules at the start of every season, it's part of the clubs 'share' when they come into the league. They should be aware of all the rules as part of the agreement with the league, so not knowing the rules is the weakest defence they could have actually presented. And the fact this is what they presented is one of the most embarrassing elements.

I say that because we dont know all the facts. I agree it is a very weak defence, and yes the manager should be aware of all rules - but as you say it is shared at the start of the season i.e. when Will Still was in charge. I'm sure whatever internal investigation the club is running will find out. 

It will likely not matter when the FA bans Tonda for 3/6/9/12 months and maybe another reason why the club will wait for the outcome of that

Edited 12 hours ago by woodsaint1

[ally_uk]

Meh I've slept on it, if the players want to continue with Tonda so be it, few wins next season and this whole saga will be old news..... 

Everyone will soon pipe down if we are chasing the playoffs 🤣

[sockeye]

So he’s done it his whole career then, and flew too close to the sun then. I’d think he’s learnt his lesson and won’t be pulling this again. Club statement today?

[Lord Duckhunter]

I do feel a bit sorry for the bloke, you have to remember he’s a young man himself given a massive opportunity very early in his career. I’ve no doubt he knew it was illegal in England, but I imagine he thought the consequences would be worth the risk, and won’t have dreamed it would blow up in his face. 
 

He was clearly good for this group of players & if it was him who decided to ditch Baz & AA, get some strong personalities through the door, then that’s a massive tick.

However, the job someone faces this summer isn’t the same job, and I’m not sure asking the arsonist in to clear up the fire can really work. It will be a new group of players, with new leadership needed & a kind drawn under the whole sorry affair. Personally I don’t thin it will help anyone if there’s a media circus for the first month of the season, every press conference, every after match interview, he’ll be asked or called a cheat. Every away game, bile will pour down at him & his players. His position is untenable, it’s as simple as that. 

[saintant]

1 hour ago, trousers said:

Totally... Solak should have been in a radio studio ASAP yesterday... Yes, I get that he had to speak to players / staff first... But there's enough f***ing hours in the day to have a meeting and an interview....

Sport Republic have previous when it comes to 'going to ground' in moments of adversity (ref: Spors ducking out of planned interviews during the Will Still debacle) so it's hardly surprising they're cowering away in their bunkers right now...

Agree and he's a mate of Jim White so why isn't he on Talk Sport facing up to what's gone on and giving his opinions?

[Ken Tone]

If the FA ban Eckert, does that apply just to England, or to Europe, or worldwide football? Could he get a job straight away in Germany for example? 

[Paul_B]

3 hours ago, Midfield_General said:

Being thrown out of the play-offs, potentially losing £200m, getting a 4 point deduction, being found unanimously guilty by an independent panel, being found unanimously guilty by an appeal panel, having individuals investigated and almost certainly charged by the FA, being vilified in the world's media and it probably leading to the decimation of our management, coaching and playing staff would suggest that ‘but it’s not cheating!!!11!’ isn’t a view that’s widely shared. 

And ‘thorough and conscientious’ aren’t the words that spring to mind when I read the facts of how he and his crack team went about their brilliant plan, personally. Putting the rights and wrongs of it aside, the whole thing was staggeringly amateurish and inept from start to finish. He's a fucking moron, and so is everyone who enabled him. 

I normally agree with a lot of what you say MG, but I guess this is the beauty of people seeing things in different ways. 

This whole saga smacks to me of a sappy gen Z intern with zero character who has been told to go and do some homework on the oppo teams. Tonda has probably given his words of wisdom from his, seemingly, years of experience, the intern doesn't like it so feels like he's being "bullied" so gets himself "caught" and the whole thing blows up. I could well be wrong but that's my take on it.

[redandwhitey]

 Just a thought, wtf has the assistant coach we pulled in around January been doing ? Wasn’t his experience and knowledge of the English game crucial to Tondas education? Surely he should have been advising against spying ??

[Sarnia Cherie]

The report in my newspaper this morning makes for depressing reading. At the inquiry it came out that Eckert instigated spying on other teams when he became our manager. Despite him originally lying to the panel it was proved that he had used that information to find out formations, set pieces and the squad available. He put pressure on Salt to spy on teams and when he refused to go to Ipswich, another intern was sent. The report said that interns felt they had little choice but follow Eckert's orders. I hope the FA throw the book at him and SR boot him out of our club without a penny piece. 

Edited 11 hours ago by Sarnia Cherie
Add words

[LegalEagle]

4 minutes ago, Ken Tone said:

If the FA ban Eckert, does that apply just to England, or to Europe, or worldwide football? Could he get a job straight away in Germany for example? 

I believe that the FA’s jurisdiction is only England and Wales. So he could go to Scotland I believe. We could do a swap with Rangers.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 minute ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

The report in my newspaper this morning makes for depressing reading. At the inquiry it came out that Eckert instigated spying on other teams when he became our manager. Despite him originally lying to the panel it was proved that he had used that information to find out formations, set pieces and the squad available. He put pressure on Salt to spy on teams and when he refused to go to Ipswich, another intern was sent. The report said that interns felt they had little choice to follow Eckert's orders. I hope the FA throw the book at him and SR boot him out of our club without a penny piece. 

Ipswich were training at Eastleigh's ground. He could have walked there.

[LegalEagle]

1 minute ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

The report in my newspaper this morning makes for depressing reading. At the inquiry it came out that Eckert instigated spying on other teams when he became our manager. Despite him originally lying to the panel it was proved that he had used that information to find out formations, set pieces and the squad available. He put pressure on Salt to spy on teams and when he refused to go to Ipswich, another intern was sent. The report said that interns felt they had little choice to follow Eckert's orders. I hope the FA throw the book at him and SR boot him out of our club without a penny piece. 

My fear here is that the club are going to wait doing anything to Tonda until the FA enquiry is over and they ban him. They will then use that as an excuse to sack him with no more monies being paid. If they sack him now they might feel they have to pay him off. If that is the case it could delay things by weeks. The club might also be thinking that the FA won’t ban him and we keep him on. Either way I suspect this won’t happen quickly.

[EssEffCee]

8 minutes ago, Ken Tone said:

If the FA ban Eckert, does that apply just to England, or to Europe, or worldwide football? Could he get a job straight away in Germany for example? 

England only (well anything in FA's jurisdiction so would include the Welsh clubs).

I think they could ask FIFA to extend it worldwide though.

[tdmickey3]

1 minute ago, LegalEagle said:

My fear here is that the club are going to wait doing anything to Tonda until the FA enquiry is over and they ban him. They will then use that as an excuse to sack him with no more monies being paid. If they sack him now they might feel they have to pay him off. If that is the case it could delay things by weeks. The club might also be thinking that the FA won’t ban him and we keep him on. Either way I suspect this won’t happen quickly.

Gardening leave

[Paul_B]

3 hours ago, Hawkswood said:

I agree with most of what youre saying but Im not sure what on earth wokism has to do with it.

Just seen this. Probably the wrong word to be fair. What I'm trying to say is I feel like the young intern lad could be one of these delicate gen Z'ers with no character and is claiming "bullying" against Tonda et al as he maybe he didn't like what he was being asked to do. I could be doing him a disservice but just a theory based on what I've read/heard.

[Viking Saint]

3 hours ago, LegalEagle said:

Fair point. Just one thought on that though. Southampton have always been seen as a family friendly, nice, provincial club that looks after its people. We often get bracketed with clubs like Norwich and Ipswich. And that’s all good and other clubs and their fans like us and respect us save for that lot down the road. But now being 57 years old and having supported Saints for well over 50 years and my Dad, Grandad and Great Grandad before, it would be bloody nice to win something. If that means having to sacrifice even to a small degree some of that niceness then I’d take it. Just one trophy. It’s the hope that kills but also keeps you coming back for more.

This has crossed my mind quite a lot as well. How often have we, on this forum, described our own team as too nice and a 'team of son-in-laws'? I don't mind having some edge and aggro to us and for coming to SMS to stop being such a pleasant experience for away teams and fans.

[Wade Garrett]

13 minutes ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

The report in my newspaper this morning makes for depressing reading. At the inquiry it came out that Eckert instigated spying on other teams when he became our manager. Despite him originally lying to the panel it was proved that he had used that information to find out formations, set pieces and the squad available. He put pressure on Salt to spy on teams and when he refused to go to Ipswich, another intern was sent. The report said that interns felt they had little choice but follow Eckert's orders. I hope the FA throw the book at him and SR boot him out of our club without a penny piece. 

He really is a piece of work.  

[sockeye]

2 minutes ago, Paul_B said:

Just seen this. Probably the wrong word to be fair. What I'm trying to say is I feel like the young intern lad could be one of these delicate gen Z'ers with no character and is claiming "bullying" against Tonda et al as he maybe he didn't like what he was being asked to do. I could be doing him a disservice but just a theory based on what I've read/heard.

Not really fair on him. He’s a young lad, just starting his career, being pressured into acts that could result in an FA sanction against him and have already made him a joke in the media. Unlike Eckert, the players and Parsons he can’t just fall sideways into a new job.

[Wade Garrett]

10 minutes ago, LegalEagle said:

My fear here is that the club are going to wait doing anything to Tonda until the FA enquiry is over and they ban him. They will then use that as an excuse to sack him with no more monies being paid. If they sack him now they might feel they have to pay him off. If that is the case it could delay things by weeks. The club might also be thinking that the FA won’t ban him and we keep him on. Either way I suspect this won’t happen quickly.

Judging by his actions and how he handled the enquiry it’s too much to hope that he does the honourable thing and resigns.

[Viking Saint]

If he was managing anywhere other than in the Championship, L1 or L2, and been getting these results, he'd be getting hailed as an absolute fucking genius.

[Willo of Whiteley]

19 minutes ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

The report in my newspaper this morning makes for depressing reading. At the inquiry it came out that Eckert instigated spying on other teams when he became our manager. Despite him originally lying to the panel it was proved that he had used that information to find out formations, set pieces and the squad available. He put pressure on Salt to spy on teams and when he refused to go to Ipswich, another intern was sent. The report said that interns felt they had little choice but follow Eckert's orders. I hope the FA throw the book at him and SR boot him out of our club without a penny piece. 

I imagine the club are waiting for the FA to finish their investigation before announcing he is sacked.

He is done either way.

[trousers]

1 hour ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I do feel a bit sorry for the bloke, you have to remember he’s a young man himself given a massive opportunity very early in his career. I’ve no doubt he knew it was illegal in England, but I imagine he thought the consequences would be worth the risk, and won’t have dreamed it would blow up in his face. 
 

He was clearly good for this group of players & if it was him who decided to ditch Baz & AA, get some strong personalities through the door, then that’s a massive tick.

However, the job someone faces this summer isn’t the same job, and I’m not sure asking the arsonist in to clear up the fire can really work. It will be a new group of players, with new leadership needed & a kind drawn under the whole sorry affair. Personally I don’t thin it will help anyone if there’s a media circus for the first month of the season, every press conference, every after match interview, he’ll be asked or called a cheat. Every away game, bile will pour down at him & his players. His position is untenable, it’s as simple as that. 

F*** my old boots... I agree with the nobel Lord!

[Midfield_General]

27 minutes ago, Paul_B said:

I normally agree with a lot of what you say MG, but I guess this is the beauty of people seeing things in different ways. 

This whole saga smacks to me of a sappy gen Z intern with zero character who has been told to go and do some homework on the oppo teams. Tonda has probably given his words of wisdom from his, seemingly, years of experience, the intern doesn't like it so feels like he's being "bullied" so gets himself "caught" and the whole thing blows up. I could well be wrong but that's my take on it.

Fair enough. We probably have very different views on it, but as you say, that's the point of a forum and life would be boring if we all agreed on everything...

Personally I just want to see some sort of action from the club. Either come out swinging, back people, adopt a siege mentality and try and use it to our advantage somehow, or go scorched earth, start cleaning house and try to turn the page. This current radio silence and limbo is the worst of both worlds and isn't getting anyone anywhere. 

Get your act together Dragan

(Although I do also suspect Dragan's probably waiting for the result of the FA investigation to see if he can sack Tonda/ the rest of those responsible without pay.)

Edited 11 hours ago by Midfield_General

[trousers]

4 minutes ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

I imagine the club are waiting for the FA to finish their investigation before announcing he is sacked.

He is done either way.

As has already been pointed out, what is stopping the club announcing that he's been suspended "pending investigation"... surely that would send out the right message (to both fans and the media) at this moment in time....? 

Edited 11 hours ago by trousers

[Pamplemousse]

The longer the club takes to act, the harder it will be to show 'contrition'

 

Even something like 'suspended pending a full internal investigation' would be better than nothing 

[Midfield_General]

1 hour ago, trousers said:

As has already been pointed out, what is stopping the club announcing that he's been suspended "pending investigation"... surely that would send out the right message (to both fans and the media) at this moment in time....? 

I think it's pretty obvious by now that the club have absolutely no idea how to handle the media

Fuck knows what Sibley's doing, it's literally his job.

He's another one who should be feeling very nervous. As 'Group Head of Communications and PR' he has spectacularly failed to provide any sort of counter narrative in this whole sorry affair. Our PR has been as utterly appalling as every other aspect of how this has been handled. 

Edited 9 hours ago by Midfield_General

[Sheaf Saint]

21 minutes ago, tdmickey3 said:

Gardening leave

The problem with that is that we can't recruit a permanent replacement while he is still in post but suspended. Our only option would be to appoint a caretaker from within, and that would most likely be Lallana. 

How on earth are we supposed to attract new signings in the summer if that's all rumbling along in the background? The situation needs resolving immediately.

[Sheaf Saint]

2 minutes ago, Midfield_General said:

I think it's pretty obvious by now that the club have absolutely no idea how to handle the media

Fuck knows what Sibley's doing, it's literally his job

This is what happens when you promote the dry cleaning delivery boy above his station.

[Patrick Bateman]

7 minutes ago, Midfield_General said:

I think it's pretty obvious by now that the club have absolutely no idea how to handle the media

Fuck knows what Sibley's doing, it's literally his job.

To coin a phrase ... "show some respect" 🌚

[trousers]

13 minutes ago, Midfield_General said:

Fuck knows what Sibley's doing, it's literally his job.

Fabrice has been fairly quiet on here recently, to be fair....

 

[tdmickey3]

1 minute ago, trousers said:

Fabrice has been fairly quiet on here recently, to be fair....

 

Dont wake him up ffs 

[kitch]

1 hour ago, saintant said:

Agree and he's a mate of Jim White so why isn't he on Talk Sport facing up to what's gone on and giving his opinions?

Agreed, but I reckon Jim White probably counts people he's messaged on WhatsApp once as 'mates'. They probably see him as that annoying bloke off the telly/radio who thinks you owe him something.

[trousers]

4 minutes ago, tdmickey3 said:

Dont wake him up ffs 

Fabrice? Bite on one of my tongue-in-cheek posts? Nah... can't see it myself...

[Cuddles]

Wonder if we'll see some compliance roles advertised soon...

[kitch]

45 minutes ago, LegalEagle said:

My fear here is that the club are going to wait doing anything to Tonda until the FA enquiry is over and they ban him. They will then use that as an excuse to sack him with no more monies being paid. If they sack him now they might feel they have to pay him off. If that is the case it could delay things by weeks. The club might also be thinking that the FA won’t ban him and we keep him on. Either way I suspect this won’t happen quickly.

Surely it's grounds for gross misconduct?

[Willo of Whiteley]

28 minutes ago, trousers said:

As has already been pointed out, what is stopping the club announcing that he's been suspended "pending investigation"... surely that would send out the right message (to both fans and the media) at this moment in time....? 

Totally agree.

Sport Republic haven’t used much common sense in five years. Why bother starting now?

[VectisSaint]

56 minutes ago, redandwhitey said:

 Just a thought, wtf has the assistant coach we pulled in around January been doing ? Wasn’t his experience and knowledge of the English game crucial to Tondas education? Surely he should have been advising against spying ??

How about Lallana? Was part of Still's staff and took over the 21s, clearly experienced in the English game, and would presumably have been part of the briefing at season start. Did Eckart do spying when he was in charge of the 21s? 

In my view this all goes higher than Tonda, if Spoors and Parsons did know they should go, if they didn't know that's incompetence and they should go. 

[Sheaf Saint]

3 minutes ago, VectisSaint said:

In my view this all goes higher than Tonda, if Spoors and Parsons did know they should go, if they didn't know that's incompetence and they should go. 

Yep. They are either complicit, incompetent, or both (most likely).

In either case, they need to go.

[Stud mark of doom]

Could Tonda have agreed to “take the bullet” to prevent much wider involvement coming out?

Might explain reluctance to hang him out to dry. 

[Lord Duckhunter]

I wonder if this would have happened if Trollope was still the Asst, or even Les Read as DoF. Seems to me that this inexperienced talented bloke, had the run of the place as was able to run roughshod over established practices. As long as I can remember young inexperienced managers have had experienced mentors to lean on, even in an unofficial capacity. I’ve been reading about Ferguson’s Aberdeen days & he’d frequently discuss things with Jock Stein who took him under his wing. Lawrie obviously had Ted around the place. They don’t seem to now, and that’s a massive gap in mangers locker. They all think they know it all. 
 

Without opening a new can of worms, what about the senior players. Did they not at least suspect something with the information he was bringing to the table. Different era I know, but I’m sure a player of two would have had a quiet word with Lawrie had they thought he was crossing a line. And that line would cost them and the club a massive amount. 
 

It seems it was so widespread that somebody somewhere should have known, and ultimately somebody should pay for that regardless of whether they knew or not. 

Edited 10 hours ago by Lord Duckhunter

[Sheaf Saint]

3 minutes ago, Stud mark of doom said:

Could Tonda have agreed to “take the bullet” to prevent much wider involvement coming out?

Might explain reluctance to hang him out to dry. 

I don't think that's how 'taking the bullet' works. Unless our management are so mind-bogglingly inept that they can't even do that right. 

[Mr_Red]

I'm sure someone has already said it in the many posts I haven't read, but wouldn't it make sense to hold off from sacking him until the FA investigation concludes? Then if Tonda is suspended for a year, he's probably broken some part of his contract and there's no / less payment due? (Or am I being dull, does his contract run out soon anyway?)

It was a clusterfuck. But I'm of the view that if the players are behind him, then he we should keep him. People make mistakes, it was quite a big one, but others do the same and get away with it or take the punishment and are often forgiven. Toney is in the England squad for example. 

The whole thing has been blown out of proportion. If (quite a big if) there was genuine bullying/intimidation going on, then my mind would probably be swayed the other way. I'm not ok with that.

 

 

[benjii]

I reckon he'll float around the group for a bit and then come back down the line.

[Cuddles]

8 minutes ago, benjii said:

I reckon he'll float around the group for a bit and then come back down the line.

What, like August, when we've all had a few beers, calmed down and are excited at the prospect of giving Lincoln a damn good spanking?

[31cc]

55 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

The problem with that is that we can't recruit a permanent replacement while he is still in post but suspended. Our only option would be to appoint a caretaker from within, and that would most likely be Lallana. 

How on earth are we supposed to attract new signings in the summer if that's all rumbling along in the background? The situation needs resolving immediately.

Isn't that what we did with Dave Jones and Hoddle? 

[John Boy Saint]

1 hour ago, sockeye said:

Not really fair on him. He’s a young lad, just starting his career, being pressured into acts that could result in an FA sanction against him and have already made him a joke in the media. Unlike Eckert, the players and Parsons he can’t just fall sideways into a new job.

Hope spying wasn't the next wheeze after having him go down to the stores for a Glass Hammer, Left Handed Screwdriver, and of course - A Long Weight. 

Ah the good old days 

[Football Special]

2 minutes ago, John Boy Saint said:

Hope spying wasn't the next wheeze after having him go down to the stores for a Glass Hammer, Left Handed Screwdriver, and of course - A Long Weight. 

Ah the good old days 

Dont forget the tartan paint