OldNick Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 I notice that the word 'from' is there, perhaps it is like the 'Sale 70% off' and then in very small letters 'up to' we see in shop windows. Good idea, and the slogan is on the same grounds as 'Saints is for life not just the Premiership' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andysstuff Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 Not from one of us. @ReadingFC__News: #Pompey I hope you're watching #WAFC lift a FA Cup they EARNED rather than CHEATED with players they DIDNT pay for! Thats a real achievement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 Not from one of us. @ReadingFC__News: #Pompey I hope you're watching #WAFC lift a FA Cup they EARNED rather than CHEATED with players they DIDNT pay for! Thats a real achievement #applause Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dingbattigger Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 Not from one of us. @ReadingFC__News: #Pompey I hope you're watching #WAFC lift a FA Cup they EARNED rather than CHEATED with players they DIDNT pay for! Thats a real achievement *like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 Not from one of us. @ReadingFC__News: #Pompey I hope you're watching #WAFC lift a FA Cup they EARNED rather than CHEATED with players they DIDNT pay for! Thats a real achievement They would still be in division 4 if Dave whelan didnt subsidise their rise through the leagues. Wigan aren't an example of a club living within their means . They're an example of a club that overspent to reach the premiership gambling that once there the tv money could help them balance the books. I'm sure if boscombe take that approach next year , they'll be called the new skates on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Diamond Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 They would still be in division 4 if Dave whelan didnt subsidise their rise through the leagues. Wigan aren't an example of a club living within their means . They're an example of a club that overspent to reach the premiership gambling that once there the tv money could help them balance the books. I'm sure if boscombe take that approach next year , they'll be called the new skates on here. A point completely overlooked by 99% of football fans. All we hear is about his leg breaking, the way he carries on it's a shame it wasn't his bloody neck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andysstuff Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 See nothing wronng with anyone spunking their own money on a pet project what they choose to do with THEIR OWN cash is up to them - Man City and Chelski are no different. What I do object to is when they fund the club by not paying hard working local businesses, charities and the taxman. Totally different scenarios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 A point completely overlooked by 99% of football fans. All we hear is about his leg breaking, the way he carries on it's a shame it wasn't his bloody neck. The thing about Whelan is he's a grade a hypercrit . He was on Alan sugars programme about football finance bemoaning teams that gambled, that over spent, said wages and debt should be capped and linked to turnover, completely ignoring the fact that had football followed his advise Wigan couldn't have risen through the leagues. Its like he wants to pull the ladder up behind him denying Rochdale, Walsall , brenford and the like the chance to emulate what wihan have done. Then there was him moaning about Sven being appointed " its hindering english managers " he cried " they need a chance" before appointing that well known Englishman Roberto Martinez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 See nothing wronng with anyone spunking their own money on a pet project what they choose to do with THEIR OWN cash is up to them - Man City and Chelski are no different. What I do object to is when they fund the club by not paying hard working local businesses, charities and the taxman. Totally different scenarios. Correct me if im wrong but didn't defrauding the taxman and business happen after the skates cup win. Wasn't gaydamak doing exactly what Whelan is when they won it. I don't understand how one is cheating and one is ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 (edited) Correct me if im wrong but didn't defrauding the taxman and business happen after the skates cup win. Wasn't gaydamak doing exactly what Whelan is when they won it. I don't understand how one is cheating and one is ok. No. They'd loaned around £50+ million just from a SA bank to pay for it and when the bank called it in it all started to unravel. Chasing the dream fu.cked them for a generation. DW, like him or loathe his, has used his own money. SD had none to use but other peoples. Edited 11 May, 2013 by View From The Top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 No. They'd loaned around £50+ million just from a SA bank to pay for it and when the bank called it in it all started to unravel. Chasing the dream fu.cked them for a generation. DW, like him or loathe his, has used his own money. SD had none to use but other peoples. Lets wait and see where Wigan are in 5 years time, if they're skint, in administration and back where a club of their size should be, can we backdate our "cheating " claims to todays win? I've no particulary wish to defend the skates, but I dont see much difference between the skates of 2008 and Wigan today. As for using others money, did man Utd cheat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 The thing about Whelan is he's a grade a hypercrit . He was on Alan sugars programme about football finance bemoaning teams that gambled, that over spent, said wages and debt should be capped and linked to turnover, completely ignoring the fact that had football followed his advise Wigan couldn't have risen through the leagues. Its like he wants to pull the ladder up behind him denying Rochdale, Walsall , brenford and the like the chance to emulate what wihan have done. Then there was him moaning about Sven being appointed " its hindering english managers " he cried " they need a chance" before appointing that well known Englishman Roberto Martinez. Why wouldn't he want smaller clubs to emulate Wigan? How much debt has he run up at Wigan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 Why wouldn't he want smaller clubs to emulate Wigan? How much debt has he run up at Wigan? They couldn't emulate Wigan because he wanted wages capped at a % of turnover. Going up through the leagues he financed the club enabling them to pay higher wages than the cap he is calling for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 (edited) Lets wait and see where Wigan are in 5 years time, if they're skint, in administration and back where a club of their size should be, can we backdate our "cheating " claims to todays win? I've no particulary wish to defend the skates, but I dont see much difference between the skates of 2008 and Wigan today. As for using others money, did man Utd cheat? 'Back to where a club their size should be' - what a horrible, anti-football attitude. Edited 11 May, 2013 by Sour Mash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 They couldn't emulate Wigan because he wanted wages capped at a % of turnover. Going up through the leagues he financed the club enabling them to pay higher wages than the cap he is calling for. You haven't answered my question though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 They would still be in division 4 if Dave whelan didnt subsidise their rise through the leagues. Wigan aren't an example of a club living within their means . They're an example of a club that overspent to reach the premiership gambling that once there the tv money could help them balance the books. I'm sure if boscombe take that approach next year , they'll be called the new skates on here. Those DFCWBs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 Fancy supporting a team whose rise through the lower divisions to the Premier League was subsidised by a rich benefactor. I couldn't possibly begin to imagine how terrible and wrong that would feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 11 May, 2013 Share Posted 11 May, 2013 Fancy supporting a team whose rise through the lower divisions to the Premier League was subsidised by a rich benefactor. I couldn't possibly begin to imagine how terrible and wrong that would feel. There's nothing wrong with that whatsoever, but surely its wrong for the said benefactor to want rules brought in to prevent others following suit. I couldn't give a shiny shiete how Wigan finance themselves, whether they get a loan , whether they over spend or how they run their business, provided its an equal playing field and other clubs are allowed to emulate them. My original point was in answer to the quote that it was great to see them win it fairly and not cheat as the skates did. I merely pointed out that in 2008 the skates were run on a similar basis. In my opinion neither cheated, but saying the skates cheated but Wigan somehow won it in some sort of fairy tale honourable way is nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torres Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 . In my opinion neither cheated, but saying the skates cheated but Wigan somehow won it in some sort of fairy tale honourable way is nonsense. But as has already been pointed out to you, the difference is that DW has spunked his own self made fortune into Wigan whereas Pompey were almost entirely built on borrowed money, much of which they have not, nor will they ever, repay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Lets wait and see where Wigan are in 5 years time, if they're skint, in administration and back where a club of their size should be, can we backdate our "cheating " claims to todays win? I've no particulary wish to defend the skates, but I dont see much difference between the skates of 2008 and Wigan today. As for using others money, did man Utd cheat? You can't see much difference ??? Look through Wigans history over the last 15 years and see if you can find ANY mention of them going into Administration TWICE, owing circa £150M and £60M. failing to pay a penny back on either occasion. And also see if you can find ANY mention of Wigan renaging on debts owed to local businesses and Charities. Whelan has put his own money into Wigan over the years, not money laundered or gun running type money Apart from those few things, yes, there is quite a similarity between how the two clubs have been run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gingeletiss Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Is the debate about PTS, nope, didn't think so, start a new thread if you want to go off subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Did I bang my head last night? I appear to have woken up on a Pompey message board where they justify writing off their c.£150m debt by uttering: "well, Man Utd is run on debt - we only did what they are doing, innit?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 You can't see much difference ??? Look through Wigans history over the last 15 years and see if you can find ANY mention of them going into Administration TWICE, owing circa £150M and £60M. failing to pay a penny back on either occasion. And also see if you can find ANY mention of Wigan renaging on debts owed to local businesses and Charities. Whelan has put his own money into Wigan over the years, not money laundered or gun running type money Apart from those few things, yes, there is quite a similarity between how the two clubs have been run. Quite, and considering the way that we managed to get back into the Premier League it would be a little bit hypocritical on our part to have a go at Wigan. Wigan is a well run entity now it is in the Premier League and have actually invested in infrastructure and sensible squad management (advertise themselves as a stepping stone for up and coming talent rather then a final pay day), the Skates on the other hand..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 You can't see much difference ??? Look through Wigans history over the last 15 years and see if you can find ANY mention of them going into Administration TWICE, owing circa £150M and £60M. failing to pay a penny back on either occasion. And also see if you can find ANY mention of Wigan renaging on debts owed to local businesses and Charities. Neither did the Skates in 2008. If Wigan go into administration in 2 years time, will they have cheated to win this seasons FA Cup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Neither did the Skates in 2008. If Wigan go into administration in 2 years time, will they have cheated to win this seasons FA Cup? A good question. If they have debts on the same or even half scale, then yes. Looking at the money used to assemble the team, only 11 million in transfer fees and a wage budget which is widely regarded as on the lower end of the Premier League scale, I would consider it highly unlikely. Dave Whelan is a true benefactor, just like our own Markus Leibherr. The Skates were simply a front for shady process, but of course their fans were so deluded as the 'bestest' in world football that they could see nothing wrong with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 A good question. If they have debts on the same or even half scale, then yes. Looking at the money used to assemble the team, only 11 million in transfer fees and a wage budget which is widely regarded as on the lower end of the Premier League scale, I would consider it highly unlikely. . But going up through the leagues they had a wage bill way above what they could afford. They would never have won the cup if they hadn't gone through the leagues like that. Same with Fulham, they had KK as manager in Division 3 FFS, did they cheat to get into the Premiership? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 But going up through the leagues they had a wage bill way above what they could afford. They would never have won the cup if they hadn't gone through the leagues like that. Same with Fulham, they had KK as manager in Division 3 FFS, did they cheat to get into the Premiership? If it was debt their owners couldn't afford to pay, then yes. The Skates didn't cheat to get into the Premier League. Neither did we, or Fulham or Wigan, or even Blackburn back in the early 90's. Mandaric, Leibherr, Al-Fayed, Whelan and Sir Jack Haywood took on the clubs and paid the way. The cheating for the Skates came when their wages/transfer fees went stratospheric under the leadership of Gaydamak/Storrie/Redknapp. A spend money we don't have sod all the consequences approach, that was cheating. Their two cup finals were a byproduct of that approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 If it was debt their owners couldn't afford to pay, then yes. The Skates didn't cheat to get into the Premier League. Neither did we, or Fulham or Wigan, or even Blackburn back in the early 90's. Mandaric, Leibherr, Al-Fayed, Whelan and Sir Jack Haywood took on the clubs and paid the way. The cheating for the Skates came when their wages/transfer fees went stratospheric under the leadership of Gaydamak/Storrie/Redknapp. A spend money we don't have sod all the consequences approach, that was cheating. Their two cup finals were a byproduct of that approach. There was talk in the papers that under Mandaric. The club was in massive debt I think it was 50+m then. MM jumped ship while he could. Imo you should not be under the illusion the overspend was after him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 There was talk in the papers that under Mandaric. The club was in massive debt I think it was 50+m then. MM jumped ship while he could. Imo you should not be under the illusion the overspend was after him Ken Bates did the same at Chelsea, there was rumours they were days away from admin when he sold up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 There was talk in the papers that under Mandaric. The club was in massive debt I think it was 50+m then. MM jumped ship while he could. Imo you should not be under the illusion the overspend was after him There may well have been overspend, but the real damage was done down the road when Gaydamak came to town. I would not have expected the implosion down to League 2 on the back of a spell of Mandaric ownership. He does have a reasonable record of taking on Football Clubs and taking them forward. (Leicester to King Power's millions/Sheffield Wednesday work in progress) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALWAYS_SFC Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Are we all still jealous of Pompey....just wanted to check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyboy Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 yep, I 4-1 am. I'm especially jealous of the gobby ones who tried to distract from their own club's appalling season and assured me that Redknapp would turn QPR around and relegate us. Wonder how that little plan worked out. At least the great pompey hero learned from his previous mistakes, bought sensibly, and didn't do special deals with agent friends that would saddle his club with overpaid deadwood and lead directly to Insolvency Central. Summary of the season - pompey sink into the bottom tier, we stay up, Redknapp relegated, and when you analyse the reality of it, between the minor peaks his managerial CV looks like a car crash... I also enjoyed Ben Haim failing miserably, and Jamie O'Hara leading Wolves out of the championship. Nice little touch to see Nugent do so well today as well. We just need to see the great hero Rocha price himself out of bargain basement football and that will tick another box. You have to make the most of it when football's great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalek2003 Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 yep, I 4-1 am. I'm especially jealous of the gobby ones who tried to distract from their own club's appalling season and assured me that Redknapp would turn QPR around and relegate us. Wonder how that little plan worked out. At least the great pompey hero learned from his previous mistakes, bought sensibly, and didn't do special deals with agent friends that would saddle his club with overpaid deadwood and lead directly to Insolvency Central. Summary of the season - pompey sink into the bottom tier, we stay up, Redknapp relegated, and when you analyse the reality of it, between the minor peaks his managerial CV looks like a car crash... I also enjoyed Ben Haim failing miserably, and Jamie O'Hara leading Wolves out of the championship. Nice little touch to see Nugent do so well today as well. We just need to see the great hero Rocha price himself out of bargain basement football and that will tick another box. You have to make the most of it when football's great. Karma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latter day saint Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latter day saint Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 exclusive 1st pic of the proposed developement next to fratton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Massive ROFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 @pn_neil_allen: Going to be another busy week on the signing front for #Pompey by sound of it. New faces and familiar faces! All rather exciting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 @pn_neil_allen: Going to be another busy week on the signing front for #Pompey by sound of it. New faces and familiar faces! All rather exciting. Are they learning? The early signs are no.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Are they learning? The early signs are no.... Free signings only and a limited budget that they cannot go over and everything having to be ratified by the FL. No dramas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Free signings only and a limited budget that they cannot go over and everything having to be ratified by the FL. No dramas. I guess we'll see, but I am absolutely sure they will overspend again. Obviously, we won't find out until the sh1t starts splattering the fan again... which it will IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 Are they learning? The early signs are no.... Not sure about that, I just find it mildly amusing that a professional local journalist tweets that he's all excited about a recent premier league team scraping the bottom of the football league barrel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 I guess we'll see, but I am absolutely sure they will overspend again. Obviously, we won't find out until the sh1t starts splattering the fan again... which it will IMO. Not sure people really understand the restrictions they are now under. If they over step the mark, they're gone and those running the club know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eurosaint Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 @pn_neil_allen: Going to be another busy week on the signing front for #Pompey by sound of it. New faces and familiar faces! All rather exciting. I'm sure it's just a coincidence but Rooney has just put in a transfer request Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 12 May, 2013 Share Posted 12 May, 2013 (edited) Neither did the Skates in 2008. If Wigan go into administration in 2 years time, will they have cheated to win this seasons FA Cup? The Skates in 2008 had... ONE example... Sulley Muntari in their squad. They bought him from in 2007 Udinese, for £7.1million. They sold him to Inter Milan a year later, right after the Cup Final, for £12.7m, making over a £5m profit. Yet despite actually making a vast sum of money on him, the first administration listed Udinese as creditors, with Portsmouth having missed scores of repayments for the player, and Udinese had to take them to arbitration to get money back http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/jan/21/udinese-to-take-portsmouth-to-court. The first Creditor document lists €930k per month repayments to Udinese, and by 2010 they were already meant to be paying Udinese €290k in "late payment interest". This was their Cup Final team... GK 1 David James RB 5 Glen Johnson CB 23 Sol Campbell © CB 15 Sylvain Distin LB 7 Hermann Hreiðarsson 45+1' DM 6 Lassana Diarra 90+3' RM 17 John Utaka 69' CM 30 Pedro Mendes 78' CM 19 Niko Kranjčar 54' LM 11 Sulley Muntari CF 27 Kanu Do we think they kept up all the payments on all of those players ? Actually paid the transfer fees in full, on time ? According to the link above, not until the Premier League paid all their football debts off (£5m of them) by advancing the money due in their first parachute payment when they were already in admin. Had the Premier League not taken this action, they'd have been booted out of football even in 2010, so let's not pretend they were paying their players and could afford to do so, or they wouldn't have been missing payments over players who left them as much as 2 years previously. Edited 12 May, 2013 by The9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 (edited) http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-plan-fratton-park-improvements-1-5085516 On gates, Portsmouth should be a championship club. It's too big for League One but probably not big enough for the Premiership unless a rich sugar daddy comes in. The five year plan is stablity http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/catlin-pinpoints-realistic-financial-future-for-pompey-1-5084685 Edited 13 May, 2013 by trousers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Pompey plan Fratton Park improvements ‘It’s what we call essential maintenance work,’ Mr Catlin said. ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andysstuff Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Wasn't the 'essential maintenance' budget £10,000 a tar. Sounds like they AR going to have to blow a few years all in one go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-plan-fratton-park-improvements-1-5085516 http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/catlin-pinpoints-realistic-financial-future-for-pompey-1-5084685 I would agree with that. A lower championship team. It appears they have finally accepted their place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I suppose it's sad that their season has ended. They won't get the chance to sing WTFILN after our NC thread today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mack rill Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I would agree with that. A lower championship team. It appears they have finally accepted their place. Have we f**k, er could be two takeover threads soon then,,,,appy days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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