Russell Martin

[CB Fry]

13 minutes ago, Dusic said:

You have misunderstood - my point is that Russell Martin came in and said that he wants his team to dominate possession and play in the the style that he coaches. He managed to do that quickly, even inheriting a team that for the last 3 or 4 years were almost entirely focused on an out of possession style.

That was evident from the first game against Sheffield Wednesday and pretty much every game since. Even vs Liverpool at Anfield you could see it was a team playing the way he wants and has coached.

Many managers talk the talk about how their team plays and then performances don't match with what they say.

The one thing RM has consistently showed at all his teams is that he can quickly and effectively get a team playing the way he wants them to.

That skillset is quite valuable when it comes to recruiting a manager as any prospective club knows what they are going to get vs say a Nathan Jones where for all the chat he couldnt show any specific style of play on the pitch.

You may not like the style, but he is very good at getting his teams to play it.

....which is why we conceded loads and loads of goals, just like Swansea. Which is why we have completely fluffed automatic promotion.

[Patches O Houlihan]

1 hour ago, StrangelyBrown said:

... You mentioned the unbeaten run, but how many games did we needlessly draw that we should have won during that period if we'd taken a few more risks with the ball? The unbeaten run was a bit of a red herring... If rather than drawing 2 games we'd one one and lost one we would be better off. Do you think this risk adverse approach actually works?

I've just finished watching the pre-Coventry press conference (both parts). One aspect of the Blackburn game that seemed to particularly frustrate RM was that the players weren't putting in the last 5% effort to make last minute low percentage runs into the box for each other - the kind that create just enough uncertainly amongst defenders that the attack results in a goal. 

He was also critical that at certain moments a safer ball was 'played to feet' rather than a more aggressive through ball for someone to run on to.

I think what I'm saying is that many here are critical of RM based on 'exactly' what they see on the pitch (which is not unreasonable) however it may be that the players during various matches are playing a more risk averse style than he has coached them or wants them to play.

[stevy777_x]

10 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

....which is why we conceded loads and loads of goals, just like Swansea. Which is why we have completely fluffed automatic promotion.

I prefer a manager that gives his teams style and identity as opposed to not knowing what the hell we are doing like with Jones and Selles

[AlexLaw76]

3 minutes ago, stevy777_x said:

I prefer a manager that gives his teams style and identity as opposed to not knowing what the hell we are doing like with Jones and Selles

I do wonder what style and identity we would have got had Martin took over a team destined for relegation, trying to turn it around mid season against the worlds best sides...

It is far easier to do in a summer, when you are insanely rich compared to 21 of you competitors

Edited April 9 by AlexLaw76

[malcolm waldron]

1 minute ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

I've just finished watching the pre-Coventry press conference (both parts). One aspect of the Blackburn game that seemed to particularly frustrate RM was that the players weren't putting in the last 5% effort to make last minute low percentage runs into the box for each other - the kind that create just enough uncertainly amongst defenders that the attack results in a goal. 

He was also critical that at certain moments a safer ball was 'played to feet' rather than a more aggressive through ball for someone to run on to.

I think what I'm saying is that many here are critical of RM based on 'exactly' what they see on the pitch (which is not unreasonable) however it may be that the players during various matches are playing a more risk averse style than he has coached them or wants them to play.

And that's a really good point.  I've been wondering since QPR home (?) or maybe even before that - Plymouth away, when I seem to recall in both games RM saying he was unhappy with the way players were trying to play.  I think that's been a feature this season particularly with some games where we've come out looking a very different (and worse) side than in the first half.  Surely though this is entirely under the managers control as he then has 45 mins, standing yards away from the action, to change things that in his admission aren't working.  This is a very different issue than, for example, Che missing two sitters in two mins at the last home game.

[Turkish]

5 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

If you're just going to judge managers based on numbers and tables, save money and dont bother watching the football. Most of my opinions come from what I see at St Mary's (or on TV). Taking such a simplistic view on things means that Puel (8th and a cup final) must be better than Poch (8th and no final). That isn't true.

If I had to choose a Saints manager since the ML takeover, based on my own opinion of what I've seen on the pitch it'd be:

1. Poch
2. Koeman
3. Ralph
4. Adkins
5. Pardew
6. Martin
7. Puel
8. Hughes
9. MoPe
10. Jones

It’s arguable that Poch had a much better squad than Puel as well. He had Lallana, Lovern, Lambert, Shaw, Clyne, Wanyama a fit Rodriguez and a motivated Fonte for a full season. All of which walk into Puels team. Puel overachieved in the circumstances just because the “I demand entertainment” brigade don’t like doesn’t mean it isn’t true 

Edited April 9 by Turkish

[StrangelyBrown]

19 minutes ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

I've just finished watching the pre-Coventry press conference (both parts). One aspect of the Blackburn game that seemed to particularly frustrate RM was that the players weren't putting in the last 5% effort to make last minute low percentage runs into the box for each other - the kind that create just enough uncertainly amongst defenders that the attack results in a goal. 

He was also critical that at certain moments a safer ball was 'played to feet' rather than a more aggressive through ball for someone to run on to.

I think what I'm saying is that many here are critical of RM based on 'exactly' what they see on the pitch (which is not unreasonable) however it may be that the players during various matches are playing a more risk averse style than he has coached them or wants them to play.

If that's the case, which doesn't seem unrealistic, it's been going on a long time - so whose responsibility is it to fix the issue?

[Patches O Houlihan]

3 minutes ago, StrangelyBrown said:

If that's the case, which doesn't seem unrealistic, it's been going on a long time - so whose responsibility is it to fix the issue?

Maybe that's where all the 'bravery' chat comes from?

He's hoping that if he describes them as brave in public, they'll act braver on the pitch and play the aggressive exciting effective football that we want as fans (and maybe he also wants as the manager)

To be fair we saw 65 mins worth of that against Ipswich

Edited April 9 by Patches O Houlihan

[StrangelyBrown]

1 hour ago, woodsaint1 said:

25 games unbeaten was a red herring? 😂

Poor turn of phrase... What's your perspective woodsaint?

[Patches O Houlihan]

21 minutes ago, Turkish said:

It’s arguable that Poch had a much better squad than Puel as well. He had Lallana, Lovern, Lambert, Shaw, Clyne, a fit Rodriguez and a motivated Fonte for a full season. All of which walk into Puels team. Puel overachieved in the circumstances just because the “I demand entertainment” brigade don’t like doesn’t mean it isn’t true 

Even if I had been excited by Puel's league play and results (which I wasn't following the previous three seasons) the ridiculous team selections and capitulations that we saw at the end of our European run would have still made me anti Puel. 

Bearing in mind our recent (20 year) history, that we didn't make the most of national and European cup games in the Poch/Koeman/Puel years is galling. And yes I know we were a sensible ref's decision away from a cup win under Puel but those away games in Europe. 😠

[egg]

1 hour ago, Lighthouse said:

We'll never know what RM could achieve with the likes of Tadic and Gabbiadini. Even someone like Austin would have been far better suited to RM's patient build up than Ralph's energetic press. He might even have finished off a bunch of the chances Adams spoons into the car park. I'm well aware of which managers were in which leagues and how they played with the players they had available. If I was offered a straight, 50:50 choice of who I'd want in charge next season, it'd be RM.

Red herrings. RM's brand of walking football, with suicidal tactics, would have is slaughtered in the PL. Look at what Bristol City, Sunderland away, Hull and Liverpool's children did to us then ask yourself of the bloke responsible for that could manage on the PL. He'd be a disaster whatever players he had at his disposal. 

[Lighthouse]

46 minutes ago, Turkish said:

It’s arguable that Poch had a much better squad than Puel as well. He had Lallana, Lovern, Lambert, Shaw, Clyne, a fit Rodriguez and a motivated Fonte for a full season. All of which walk into Puels team. Puel overachieved in the circumstances just because the “I demand entertainment” brigade don’t like doesn’t mean it isn’t true 

Yep, guilty, I'm a fully signed up member. I'm afraid I don't pay £30 a go to sit and admire the architecture and catering at St Mary's. I don't know if you genuinely loved watching us play for a 0-0 at home to the likes of Hull, B'mth, Stoke, Be'er Sheva and countless others, or if you thought that's all that squad was capable of, but I'd prefer so-called Russball any day.

[Toussaint]

12 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Yep, guilty, I'm a fully signed up member. I'm afraid I don't pay £30 a go to sit and admire the architecture and catering at St Mary's. I don't know if you genuinely loved watching us play for a 0-0 at home to the likes of Hull, B'mth, Stoke, Be'er Sheva and countless others, or if you thought that's all that squad was capable of, but I'd prefer so-called Russball any day.

I don’t like either of them, HTH

Edited April 9 by Toussaint

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

Even if I had been excited by Puel's league play and results (which I wasn't following the previous three seasons) the ridiculous team selections and capitulations that we saw at the end of our European run would have still made me anti Puel. 

Bearing in mind our recent (20 year) history, that we didn't make the most of national and European cup games in the Poch/Koeman/Puel years is galling. And yes I know we were a sensible ref's decision away from a cup win under Puel but those away games in Europe. 😠

Are you also anti Koeman because he picked weakened teams in our Europa league campaign not even making the group stages?

[badgerx16]

It is all well and good RM saying the players aren't doing this and that but he is stood watching on the sidelines shouting instructions and giving tactical advice during breaks in play, at half time, and when subs are made. Are the players not listening to him or don't they understand what he is saying ?

[Bad Wolf]

36 minutes ago, Turkish said:

Are you also anti Koeman because he picked weakened teams in our Europa league campaign not even making the group stages?

People forget the bad parts of the Koeman reign and they absolutely existed. Koeman did a great job but not as amazing as people make out. Our performances in the league cup for example were dire.

[Lee On Solent Saint]

I wonder if there will be any chants of you can fuck off to Brighton tonight?

[Lighthouse]

5 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I wonder if there will be any chants of you can fuck off to Brighton tonight?

I doubt anyone is taking a random Twitter account that seriously.

[beatlesaint]

3 hours ago, SW5 SAINT said:

I like his new haircut…..

Never mind the haircut, do we know if him and Capt. Jack have got matching tatoos yet ? 😚

[notnowcato]

8 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I wonder if there will be any chants of you can fuck off to Brighton tonight?

Embarrassing if it does. 

[Turkish]

48 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

People forget the bad parts of the Koeman reign and they absolutely existed. Koeman did a great job but not as amazing as people make out. Our performances in the league cup for example were dire.

Just like how they forget all the good bits of Puels reign and just remember that the last few homes games were dull (when he had to play the worst centre back pairing in the league) 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

36 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

I doubt anyone is taking a random Twitter account that seriously.

Probably not. But still be amusing to hear 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

33 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

Embarrassing if it does. 

For who?

[Lord Duckhunter]

Our unbeaten run reminds of the glorious 12 hours when we were top of the league. In the context of the season, it  means absolutely fuck all, but it got our Noddy element excited & the adolescent muppets who run or social media department made twats of themselves. 
 

File it under “who gives a fuck”, alongside a mid table side’s 148 pass goal a couple of years ago. 
 

The only unbeaten run that matters now is 3 games at the end of May. 
 

 

[CB Fry]

4 hours ago, stevy777_x said:

I prefer a manager that gives his teams style and identity as opposed to not knowing what the hell we are doing like with Jones and Selles

Comparing Martin to Selles is a particularly snidey comparison.

He was a glorified caretaker for a club that was doomed by the time he had to step up.

Martin was specifically appointed to get us promoted this season.

He wasn't recruited to be a bit better than Ruben Selles.

Edited April 9 by CB Fry

[Patches O Houlihan]

4 hours ago, Turkish said:

Are you also anti Koeman because he picked weakened teams in our Europa league campaign not even making the group stages?

That pissed me off too - as I commented on in that post that you selectively edited! Come on, you're better than that

[david in sweden]

7 hours ago, StrangelyBrown said:

David I'm genuinely interested in a balanced debate and I'm trying to get my head around your post... If I read this correctly you are saying that RM has done ok because we were shit last year and we're in the top half which makes a nice change and that it's not RMs fault because we haven't got enough firepower up front?

You mentioned the unbeaten run, but how many games did we needlessly draw that we should have won during that period if we'd taken a few more risks with the ball? The unbeaten run was a bit of a red herring... If rather than drawing 2 games we'd one one and lost one we would be better off. Do you think this risk adverse approach actually works?

It is easy to focus on the lack of a Striker and blame the recruitment for all our woes, but that ignores the bizarre team selections, the lack of tactical adaptability, the inability to consistently get the side playing with the tempo needed for Russball to work, ... We have plenty of goals in the side, as we have demonstrated from time to time (as you rightly highlighted) but it seems to me that our tactics (that insist on ball retention over risk) lead to us creating fewer good chances than we should. Do you think our approach is ok?

Our expectations as a club were to get promoted this year. If RM fails to do that now via the playoffs he has failed to meet expectations. Our current form doesn't suggest we're the team to beat going into the playoffs. Do you think RM should be given a pass for looking like he is heading for failure?

Strangely brown - thanks for your "polite" response, (not something that is always commonplace on this site).  I am in my sixth decade as a Saints fan, and despite

my overseas address I am just as keen as when I watched my first game when in junior school.  Every generation has had its highs-and lows and so I tend to be a  little more pragmatic than most in my view of our football.  Now onto your questions. Has RM done well?  he came at a time that we          had a very poor squad, who were clearly the worst Prem. side  last season.  We then sold off almost every player of value with JWP and Tella having gone by game 4 with no obvious players

to replace them, and then we had yet another change of system (Russball) for the players to adapt to which  took time, but I think it has worked even  if the monotonous  possession is overplayed sometimes, but all things considered  I still think it has become a successful strategy at this time and the long unbeaten run is to RM's credit.

HIs " bizarre " selections maybe a question, but as he says it's how someone impresses him in training THIS WEEK, and not how well they may have played last month.

Although unbeaten for the first four games we had a traumatic September with; Holgate, Charles, Fraser and Downes all new to the dressing room, and taking  time to settle into a squad that had introduced  6  new names in the space of 4 weeks.  Losses against Leicester and Ipswich were a prelude to those two  fruitless trips to the North East and were fundamental to our poor start and a 15th place in the league,  and only the victory        over Leeds showed that there was life in the body. The following 20-plus undefeated games seem to have been unimpressive to those fans who continued to criticise the team (and RM)

even after hard fought victories.  Clearly there were a few drawn games (against Rotherham and Huddersfield (a) were unforgiveable), despite our superior

possession and many goal chances.  Here I claim my argument to the lack of firepower.  No Ings, or Pelle (or Lambert) to take half-chances upfront and I'm  sorry to lay the blame at Che Adams' door, but as lone striker he's missed chances galore, whilst Adam Armstrong came in from his isolation on the left wing and thankfully showed  that he is capable of getting goals.   Sadly, two seasons in,  I am still unimpressed by Mara and Edozie as potential starters up front. 

I'd place the responsibility for the signing of Ross Stewart on others in the club hierarchy and although he was " fit enough"  to play (and scored) for the U21 side in November, but it's another injury that has sidelined RS until the summer, which put us back to square with an over-reliance on            just two men.

 

It's impossible to predict the future with the play-offs, it really is football's version of Russian Roulette, but if we fail to get the third spot, there will    be  a major re-think and some changes, ( primarily in the key role of D.O.F... if the rumours are to be believed).. but I don't believe either that replacing  RM will be a priority.

We still have a very young squad, but RM seems to have a good rapport with our younger players and that can only be a good omen for their future development.

( IF .. I haven't satisfied all your questions.. comeback and argue them again - if you'd like to ) . 

Edited April 9 by david in sweden

[Master Bates]

8 hours ago, StrangelyBrown said:

David I'm genuinely interested in a balanced debate and I'm trying to get my head around your post...

I prefer mass debates, sorry.

[Turkish]

44 minutes ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

That pissed me off too - as I commented on in that post that you selectively edited! Come on, you're better than that

i edited it as i forgot a couple of names from Pochs squad that was all.

[Tommy Mulgrew]

David: “I am in my sixth decade as a Saints fan…”.

A mere stripling, then.

I’ll now pretend to be Strangely Brown: the unbeaten run was not unimpressive, it was undeniably impressive but some posters questioned the slow, laborious and sideways and backwards nature of almost all of our play, wanting a more-than-once-in-a-blue-moon quick and incisive way to the opposition’s goal, especially in injury time when we were chasing a winner or an equaliser, and the tendency of our usual left-back (and, less often, right-back) to play invariably in the middle of the pitch, thus gifting acres of space for the opposition winger/full-back to run uninterrupted into our penalty area; simply put, saw things that could easily be done to make us more difficult to play against, but RM was not to be moved from what seemed his preferred way of playing.

It now seems he, too, is fed-up with a lack of pace going forward and with too many timid backward passes in stead of through/over the top balls for attackers to run on to.  Here’s hoping for a positive response from the team tonight and thereafter.  I am forever an optimist, despite following Saints for longer than DavidinSweden’s lifespan.

[Turkish]

7 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Yep, guilty, I'm a fully signed up member. I'm afraid I don't pay £30 a go to sit and admire the architecture and catering at St Mary's. I don't know if you genuinely loved watching us play for a 0-0 at home to the likes of Hull, B'mth, Stoke, Be'er Sheva and countless others, or if you thought that's all that squad was capable of, but I'd prefer so-called Russball any day.

of course i dont, who does? But also i appreciate that over that season we were at times very entertaining. I also appreciate it's difficult to play attacking football when you've got two centre backs who would struggle to get into a midtable championship team. 

[CB Fry]

7 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

Yep, guilty, I'm a fully signed up member. I'm afraid I don't pay £30 a go to sit and admire the architecture and catering at St Mary's. I don't know if you genuinely loved watching us play for a 0-0 at home to the likes of Hull, B'mth, Stoke, Be'er Sheva and countless others, or if you thought that's all that squad was capable of, but I'd prefer so-called Russball any day.

If today's Russell Martin had taken over from Koeman with those defensive options and his defensive managerial ability we wouldn't be finishing eighth and getting to a cup final. 

We'd be bottom three all day long. But yeah, we'd have been like so much more "entertaining".

Edited April 9 by CB Fry

[Lighthouse]

20 minutes ago, Turkish said:

of course i dont, who does? But also i appreciate that over that season we were at times very entertaining. I also appreciate it's difficult to play attacking football when you've got two centre backs who would struggle to get into a midtable championship team. 

Martin’s teams have also been very entertaining at times this season and everyone is convinced he’s got the worst goalkeeper ever to play football, not to mention two strikers who can’t hit a barn door in Adams and Mara. We’re talking about two managers whose worlds have never overlapped, playing in different leagues with different players. Given the choice, I’d just about prefer Martin, who isn’t without his faults, over Puel, who isn’t without his attributes.

[Master Bates]

I wonder what his answer will be when he gets asked after the game about the Brighton link. 

[Turkish]

9 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

Martin’s teams have also been very entertaining at times this season and everyone is convinced he’s got the worst goalkeeper ever to play football, not to mention two strikers who can’t hit a barn door in Adams and Mara. We’re talking about two managers whose worlds have never overlapped, playing in different leagues with different players. Given the choice, I’d just about prefer Martin, who isn’t without his faults, over Puel, who isn’t without his attributes.

Fair enough, IMO Puel overachieved given his circumstances and Martin has underachieved given his.

I remember a stick used against Puel was that in his 8th placed finish it was only because it was low points total for finishing 8th in a usual season, a classic comment that it "wasn't a good 8th" yet the defence for Martin is that this season is a high points total for top 2, i guess his 4th place is a good 4th on that basis? people cant have it both ways.

Edited April 9 by Turkish

[Dark Munster]

5 minutes ago, Master Bates said:

I wonder what his answer will be when he gets asked after the game about the Brighton link. 

I'd be gobsmacked if Brighton have any interest in Russell. Unlike us, they are currently well run, with consistently very good managerial and player recruitments. Why would they have the slightest interest in a rigid, stubborn, mid-table Championship nobody who is incapable of getting his teams to defend properly, and seriously underachieving with one of the strongest squads in the division?

[gio1saints]

8 hours ago, Patches O Houlihan said:

Maybe that's where all the 'bravery' chat comes from?

He's hoping that if he describes them as brave in public, they'll act braver on the pitch and play the aggressive exciting effective football that we want as fans (and maybe he also wants as the manager)

To be fair we saw 65 mins worth of that against Ipswich

That’s exactly what he is and has been doing. Anyone with a sports pyschology diploma would recognise that talk instantly.
To criticise him for trying to get the best out of his players by speaking in tgat way when he is being interviewed is somewhat one dimensional frankly. Or plain ignorant is another way of seeing it. He is NOT going to say they yet again have proved themselves faint hearts is he?  You know you’ve lost the dressing room when that comes out. So why posters berate his language in interview is beyond me. Just showing themselves up basically. Interviews and private convo/ thoughts are two different things. Didn’t think I’d have to spell that out. 

[notnowcato]

5 hours ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

Our unbeaten run reminds of the glorious 12 hours when we were top of the league. In the context of the season, it  means absolutely fuck all, but it got our Noddy element excited & the adolescent muppets who run or social media department made twats of themselves. 
 

File it under “who gives a fuck”, alongside a mid table side’s 148 pass goal a couple of years ago. 
 

The only unbeaten run that matters now is 3 games at the end of May. 
 

 

You seem to bang on about the unbeaten run more than anyone else. Get over it. 

[Master Bates]

4 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

You seem to bang on about the unbeaten run more than anyone else. Get over it. 

We're aiming for a new unbeaten run, an unbeaten run of draws.

[bangkoksaint]

I think the players have settled on the play offs and are ‘on the beach’ so to speak.

[woodsaint1]

10 hours ago, trousers said:

Red herring isn't perhaps the best choice of phrase, but I get the gist of what he's trying to say... It did become a bit of a 'poisoned chalice', or at least a distraction, in that we became content with a draw (when we could/should have won) because, "hallelujah", it protected our unbeaten run.... In other words, if we'd had a few more "WWL"s, rather than "DWD"s, during that unbeaten run we'd be in a better position than we are now...

Red herring definitely isnt the right choice of phrase. A unbeaten run of 5/6 games maybe, but not over 25. I seem to recall that most of our draws during the run came as a result of late equalisers, either for us or against us. Definitely a hallelujah for our late equalisers as it helped us to avoid defeat. Definitely dont recall any hallelujahs on here for ones we conceded late on. 

Its also very easy to say that if we had more WWLs then we would be in a better position than we are now. However once the team suffers the disappointment of defeat, theres no guarantee its followed up by another run of wins. Our unbeaten run was a massive contributor to the position we find ourselves in. To say otherwise or its a red herring is nonsense

[bugenhagen]

1 hour ago, Turkish said:

Fair enough, IMO Puel overachieved given his circumstances and Martin has underachieved given his.

I remember a stick used against Puel was that in his 8th placed finish it was only because it was low points total for finishing 8th in a usual season, a classic comment that it "wasn't a good 8th" yet the defence for Martin is that this season is a high points total for top 2, i guess his 4th place is a good 4th on that basis? people cant have it both ways.

It's not both ways, it is the same. Total points say something about the number of wins, draws and losses that the position does not.

Anyways, I don't care if youl like Puel over Martin or the other way around. I want us to be better than we are now under Martin, and I wanted us to be better than we were under Puel.

Just the same people banging on this drum again and again... and now I am doing it too... fuck me 😄

[Farmer Saint]

[Patches O Houlihan]

5 hours ago, Turkish said:

i edited it as i forgot a couple of names from Pochs squad that was all.

My original post that you quoted but edited stated that Poch & Koeman were also frustrating in cup games

[notnowcato]

3 hours ago, Master Bates said:

We're aiming for a new unbeaten run, an unbeaten run of draws.

FFS fell at the first hurdle… Saintsy

[david in sweden]

4 hours ago, Tommy Mulgrew said:

David: “I am in my sixth decade as a Saints fan…”.

A mere stripling, then.

I’ll now pretend to be Strangely Brown: the unbeaten run was not unimpressive, it was undeniably impressive but some posters questioned the slow, laborious and sideways and backwards nature of almost all of our play, wanting a more-than-once-in-a-blue-moon quick and incisive way to the opposition’s goal, especially in injury time when we were chasing a winner or an equaliser, and the tendency of our usual left-back (and, less often, right-back) to play invariably in the middle of the pitch, thus gifting acres of space for the opposition winger/full-back to run uninterrupted into our penalty area; simply put, saw things that could easily be done to make us more difficult to play against, but RM was not to be moved from what seemed his preferred way of playing.

It now seems he, too, is fed-up with a lack of pace going forward and with too many timid backward passes in stead of through/over the top balls for attackers to run on to.  Here’s hoping for a positive response from the team tonight and thereafter.  I am forever an optimist, despite following Saints for longer than David in Sweden’s lifespan.

Tommy Mulgrew.. yes I know I am not the oldest on this site, and there are several older than I am.   I wished only to let Strangely Brown understand that my views 

are often coloured by decades of alternating joy and disappointment, and an occasional reality check is not a bad thing to endure.  I'm a tad disappointed that we are 

not one of the top two, but a third place promotion would still be something to celebrate.

If we do eventually go up, it will be a just reward for the good things they have achieved  this season, and well-deserved considering that both Leeds and Leicester

have more or less the same squads as last year, whereas we had to start from scratch with a group of relatively young lads who are still on a learning curve.

[david in sweden]

6 hours ago, Master Bates said:

I prefer mass debates, sorry.

I also like to read a mix of views, but my post was primarily directed to  Strangely Brown, who asked for clarification on some of my comments. 

Everyone is welcome to comment on other's posts, but perhaps you have views other than mine .....agree or disagree ? .    

 

6 hours ago, Master Bates said:

 

 

[trousers]

3 hours ago, woodsaint1 said:

Our unbeaten run was a massive contributor to the position we find ourselves in

We find ourselves adrift of 3 teams that haven't had a similar unbeaten run so, yep, I totally agree with you... it was indeed a massive contributor to the position we find ourselves in... 

[Master Bates]

8 hours ago, david in sweden said:

I also like to read a mix of views, but my post was primarily directed to  Strangely Brown, who asked for clarification on some of my comments. 

Everyone is welcome to comment on other's posts, but perhaps you have views other than mine .....agree or disagree ? .    

 

 

A I know is, I had the chance to say Mass Debates and I took it.

[Farmer Saint]

I'd be very interested to see a poll of fans on here, on whether we should sack Russell Martin - I don't think we should, personally I think he's doing a good job - but there is a very vocal number of supporters on here that seem to think he should. @Lighthousecan we make it happen?